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#31 of 39 Old 03-16-2008, 04:21 PM
 
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I'm not sure I see it, because there is no way one child can switch our family beliefs. I'm secure enough in our faith to know that family values prevail, and I can't be upset at it if school itself allows children of a different faith. I can certainly try to shelter my kid from the world by carefully selecting the school where majority of families are like us, but how strong are our family values if it takes one kid to sway my child?.. I am not scared of discussing opposing views with my kids, and asking their questions as to why another child views the world differently.

I think if a school policy is tolerance towards tv viewing families, then you can't speak badly of the families that do it, simply because they are accepted by the school that you chose, and that means you chose that environment where "one faith is favored, but all accepted", you accept the risks that come with it: your kid hearing about "the other faith".

If your school policy dictates what has to happen at home (i.e. no tv allowed), then I'll agree with you, those people signed a contract, that they will follow the rules in agreement with school policy, and they are not honoring that agreement.

Aside from that, it sounds very bad to me to be hear everyone complaining how about parents who never promised to anyone to keep their homes tv-free.

P.S. I love many many things about Waldorf, except for this need to control, and I don't mean the school.

Well, I guess I didn't illustrate properly just what I"m trying to say b/c it was not about another child changing our family values. Good luck to you.
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#32 of 39 Old 03-16-2008, 04:23 PM
 
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But this is it. Whether or not a particular Waldorf school has a contract the parents sign, it IS the position of ALL Waldorf schools that media must be restricted in young children. Sometimes schools don't take as hard of a line with particular families and then there is this confusion. There may be no contract, but the educators involved with the school really do view it as a "soft" promise. So then it does fall to the community to uphold this aspect.

Waldorf schools are developmentally based. It is understood within Waldorf/Steiner circles that media consumption and the actual act of television watching/screen time is detrimental to developing brains.
When we as a family join a Waldorf school we are seeking out a community of like minded families that hold certain beliefs in the schooling and raising of our children. I see it as profoundly different than other schooling environments.

Waldorf is "countercultural" in the truest sense.
It is really not fundamentally about whether or not a child knows the Disney princess or who Dora is...it is the deeper implications of these things.
Thank you for explaining it in a way that I just could not, but really wanted to!
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#33 of 39 Old 03-17-2008, 12:31 PM
 
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I am not a Waldorf parent, but I am curious about Waldorf education... Is it correct to assume that you don't want my kids in your school if I were to allow them watching tv?
If the children's TV watching was kept "in the home" so to speak it wouldn't be an issue on anybody else's radar. But TV comes into the school, through the children who watch but also through the atmosphere we breathe practically. It's everywhere, and TV is very devious. Its power over us and power in the culture is no accident--its programs are very carefully engineered to get us hooked against our will.

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if parents at the school are making the kinds of comments people are making here, then I doubt I will find a welcoming community in a Waldorf school.
The comments made here seem pretty typical to what you'd hear in our school, and I don't find them that judgmental overall. Most here admit trying to come to some healthy way to balance it because total avoidance isn't workable. But the TV is considered much more of an issue than simply a "personal decision to be respected" in Waldorf education. The TV is considered a negative influence on young children, on their imaginations, on their natural rhythms, on their sleep cycles, on their play, on their learning. There are many parents in the schools that just don't buy into the idea that the TV has these effects. But the subject will come up many, many times before the 4th grade or so. And the "no-TV" advocates don't feel the need to tip-toe around the subject of the TV, though they don't really go after each other for watching it. It's important to emphasize that it isn't just the children who do watch it who "infect" other children with TV-lust--and not all children who do watch bring it to the school either. But children who don't watch can absorb the media-lust from billboards, from the lobby at the doctor's office, from stores..anywhere. The multi-million dollar media campaigns pump these images into everything; it's practically part of the air we breathe nowadays.

The teachers and school lay down rules about what comes to the school that they expect parents to respect. No Disney, Nickelodeon, etc on the clothing, lunch boxes, etc., leave the toys at home, and in kindergarten, the children were told not to Play TV on the playground.
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#34 of 39 Old 03-19-2008, 10:52 PM
 
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I JUST posted about this on my blog and would LOVE some readers and comments! The most recent post is about natural toys, and the one below it is about TV. These are VERY important topics to me as a mom of a 2 1/2 year old, and I really struggle with what my dd will be exposed to just by playing with other kids. I KNOW that sounds snobby, but there is SO much junk out there, and especially so many horrible messages about what it means to be a girl in this society. I cringe to think of her being exposed to it all, but obviously I can't shelter her from everything, just try to create a safe and positive home environment for her. Anyway, sorry for the shameless blog plug, but you can check it out here! Thanks, and thanks too for a good conversation.
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#35 of 39 Old 03-20-2008, 02:59 PM
 
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I JUST posted about this on my blog and would LOVE some readers and comments! The most recent post is about natural toys, and the one below it is about TV. These are VERY important topics to me as a mom of a 2 1/2 year old, and I really struggle with what my dd will be exposed to just by playing with other kids. I KNOW that sounds snobby, but there is SO much junk out there, and especially so many horrible messages about what it means to be a girl in this society. I cringe to think of her being exposed to it all, but obviously I can't shelter her from everything, just try to create a safe and positive home environment for her. Anyway, sorry for the shameless blog plug, but you can check it out here! Thanks, and thanks too for a good conversation.
Your blog looks great Mama! I only skimmed over it, because the kids are running around but I look forward to reading it more later tonight
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#36 of 39 Old 03-20-2008, 07:09 PM
 
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Whoa! You mamas are inspiring. :

We don't have a TV but DS watches DVDs (Signing Time, Elmo Peter and the Wolf, & Baby Einstein Numbers Nursery. Just videos that were given to us). I meant to be way more intentional, but DH works so much and I don't have any family or close friends around. He does know all the signs and we use them, so that's pretty fun.

Anyway, he's not EVEN 2. He's 21 months . . .

We watch the same ones over and over, if that helps?

I'm going to follow the links to learn more about this. We really should spend way more time outside. :double sigh:



We don't watch any TV, just Netflix occassionally, and honestly, he watches them with us. His dad usually picks documentaries . . .

I think the only way I could really avoid it is if we didn't have a screen in the home.
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#37 of 39 Old 03-20-2008, 08:22 PM
 
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Originally Posted by CarenSwan View Post
I JUST posted about this on my blog and would LOVE some readers and comments! The most recent post is about natural toys, and the one below it is about TV. These are VERY important topics to me as a mom of a 2 1/2 year old, and I really struggle with what my dd will be exposed to just by playing with other kids. I KNOW that sounds snobby, but there is SO much junk out there, and especially so many horrible messages about what it means to be a girl in this society. I cringe to think of her being exposed to it all, but obviously I can't shelter her from everything, just try to create a safe and positive home environment for her. Anyway, sorry for the shameless blog plug, but you can check it out here! Thanks, and thanks too for a good conversation.
ETA: I LOVE your blog CarenSwan! :
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#38 of 39 Old 03-20-2008, 10:13 PM
 
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LindaCL and Melaniee very well said. Thank you.

I make an effort daily to encourage imaginative play instead of turning on the TV to occupy them. They have never watched it so they don't know what they are missing. They know it is for adults only.

My DS is in preschool where there are a few other children who are allowed to watch shows (Power Rangers, Spider Man). I believe you can tell which child watches TV and which shows by the way the he/she plays. Last week I caught my DS copy finger shooting from the other boys in school, which makes me cringe. Fortunately, I have been told he will only occasionally play with them but most of the time he spends play time with those who do not watch TV, which I am glad to hear.

I have a very hard time with this. Issues (hitting, biting, name calling) that have come up at my sons school I believe can be traced back to aggression learned by children who watch certain shows on TV. I wish our school had contracts that parents would be asked to sign to keep their young children from watching TV. Presently, we just have a recommendation that children do not watch TV before school. I feel this is not adequate.

To answer the original question 'At what age is TV ok', I would respond with the question At what age do you want to let marketing teams, violence and other junk influence your child?

Thank you for such thoughtful discussion.
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#39 of 39 Old 03-20-2008, 10:15 PM
 
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Thanks mamas! You are all so inspiring and its encouraging to know that I'm not the only crazy mama out there!
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