So at what point would you "give up"? - Mothering Forums

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#1 of 64 Old 07-05-2009, 06:34 AM - Thread Starter
 
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I have a WWYD question here. I know I'm responsible for my own pregnancy and birth...I just wonder sometimes, you know?

I'm 42 weeks and 1 day. I am positive about my date of last period, but my date of conception could be off...I was nursing still and my cycle ranged from about 25 to 35 days long. So, obviously my date of conception could have been much later than "normal". I wasn't charting at the time, so I just don't know.

I've had LOTS of prodromal labor. I thought I was having this baby RIGHT NOW many, many times already, only to have the ctx fizzle out to nothing. And the more "overdue" I get, the more frustrating that is!

Baby is moving in there like a champ. When I'm nursing dd, baby moves so strongly that my dd actually bounces around! So, I'm pretty sure that baby is doing fine still. And while I'm big and uncomfortable, I'm doing fine as well...my bp is low, and no other complications, except for my prior c/s. Baby is head down, though, and way back at 24 wks when I did get an u/s, baby was measuring pretty much on target with my dates...for whatever that's worth.

I'm planning a UBAC, but I've had backup care with a family practice doctor. She is, at this point, waaaay past her comfort zone. If she had her way, I would've been induced last Wednesday at 41 and 4. I've pretty much had to walk away from the backup care because I've gone so far past their recommendations. We left it with her that I would like to be able to call on her if I needed help, but we were taking responsibility for this birth and at this point, we would be proceeding on our own.

So...when would you finally decide that you were "too late" and consent to some sort of induction? What is just too late in your book? Is there such a thing? I'm just starting to feel very unsure of myself, I guess. Passing the magic 42 week mark has had a big effect on me. Am I putting me and babe at risk unnecessarily? I'm starting to wonder if I won't give birth to some news-worthy, record-breaking gigantic baby! That is, if I ever give birth!

Help!

Mama to ds12, dd9, dd3.5, and ds20mo, plus 15 cows, 2 dogs, 2 cats, chickens, ducks, turkeys, and bees!
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#2 of 64 Old 07-05-2009, 08:07 AM
 
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Only you can decide but fwiw a friend of mine had her little girl (now 2) at 44+3 and my midwife attended a 45 week HBA2C (mw admits she was out of her comfort zone and says she'll never do it again but still, babe is about 9 months now & perfectly healthy)

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#3 of 64 Old 07-05-2009, 10:06 AM
 
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I would never 'give up'....not to split hairs or anything....but I would probably seek some sort of professional advice or even birth care at whatever point that EITHER the baby started showing any questionable signs, OR I started to have a persistent feeling that something was wrong. Or both, of course.

Sounds like you have a healthy baby in there, and you've reported no other adverse or suspicious signs for yourself. Also, a 24wk u/s does not have a high degree of reliability for dates--can be off by a week or more in either direction, so you may not be as pregnant as you think.

There is really nothing magic about 42wks. It is a number with statistical significance, yes--there is a small but statistically significant rise in problems for babies beyond 42 wks. But it's not as if pregnancy in general has an expiration date! Just to remind you of something you probably know.

Anyway-yeah, only you can know what to do and people here generally support each woman's good use of her own intuition on these matters What I would do is try to be patient and just keep an eye out for any troubling signs, and any hunches about the situation.

Watch out though....with all those labor installments you're having, I'll just bet your actual birthing day will be fast and intense!
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#4 of 64 Old 07-05-2009, 11:58 AM
 
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I would check the spinningbabies site and see if there is any way to help your babe get in a better position. Then I might look into herbal stuff like blue and black cohosh. I don't THINK I would give up... but I'm only 36 1/2 weeks right now. If I went over 42 I might have a different feeling. .... I am sorry! That is so frustrating!

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#5 of 64 Old 07-05-2009, 12:12 PM
 
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I'm not a UCer, but, what about trying some chiropractic care to get babe in a good position, then going to accupuncture?

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#6 of 64 Old 07-05-2009, 12:16 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Wow...45 weeks? I cannot even imagine myself by then!! That is some extraordinary patience.

Thank you...I do know that pregnancy doesn't have an expiration date, but it's nice to be reminded. It's that silly 42 week mark that doctors make such a big deal about, like I'll explode and the baby is in there slowly decomposing or something. I will continue to try to be patient, as long as I feel good and baby seems strong and healthy.

Thanks again! It's good to get reassurance that I'm not doing something "wrong".

Mama to ds12, dd9, dd3.5, and ds20mo, plus 15 cows, 2 dogs, 2 cats, chickens, ducks, turkeys, and bees!
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#7 of 64 Old 07-05-2009, 12:24 PM - Thread Starter
 
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I'm not a UCer, but, what about trying some chiropractic care to get babe in a good position, then going to accupuncture?
I was thinking that might need to be something I try this week. I don't want to do something to artificially start labor, but if something is hanging baby up, I sure wouldn't mind getting that fixed. I'll have to see if I can get a recommendation for a chiro around here.

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#8 of 64 Old 07-05-2009, 01:02 PM
 
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I am not a UCer but I read here for inspiration about home birth and self-reliance. I did, however, have a long pregnancy with questionable dates resulting in care providers recommending an induction.

We induced with accupuncture. I went into hard labor 8 hours after the session. She was born 35 hours later.

I wasn't going into labor because she hadn't fully engaged due to the cord twice around her neck. I worked and worked for a full day and then transferred after we weren't getting good variability on her heart rate.

Turns out we really did need interventions to prevent an emergency and a C section. Great outcome, but the pitocin stressed her and we couldn't use them. It was a doozy of an epidural that somehow did it (it had worn off by the time I was ready to push). Not what I wanted but I am so happy we made the decisions we did.

Trust your intuition is all I can say. Trusting my mw helped too. I would not induce in any way (accupuncture or drugs) without being under care in case there is a medical reason that my LO is reluctant. Sometimes interventions ARE necessary and that is when they are fabulous!

Happy labor with no interventions necessary dust blowing your way!

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#9 of 64 Old 07-05-2009, 01:46 PM
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i think that, for me, as soon as i felt i was not comfortable with the situation, i would seek help.
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#10 of 64 Old 07-05-2009, 03:16 PM - Thread Starter
 
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I wasn't going into labor because she hadn't fully engaged due to the cord twice around her neck. I worked and worked for a full day and then transferred after we weren't getting good variability on her heart rate.

Turns out we really did need interventions to prevent an emergency and a C section. Great outcome, but the pitocin stressed her and we couldn't use them. It was a doozy of an epidural that somehow did it (it had worn off by the time I was ready to push). Not what I wanted but I am so happy we made the decisions we did.
On my last one, we got impatient (it was 2 days before Thanksgiving and I was 10 days overdue & I just knew everyone's holiday would be ruined!). I had a midwife and she broke my water...turned out baby wasn't coming because she wasn't lined up well. By the time I was 10 cm, she had turned shoulder first and by the time we reached the hospital, she was spine first. Hence, the VBAC now.

So, I know that I need to let baby do it's thing in there...but at the same time, it's so hard not to get worried or antsy, especially with everyone knowing my due date and looking at me in fear. But, yes, I do feel like things are fine at this point. I haven't even really looked at accupuncture, but thank you for the warning. I'm thinking chiropractic care would be less like induction and more like just making sure mama is lined up right, no? I need to do more research on both, I guess.

Thanks!

Mama to ds12, dd9, dd3.5, and ds20mo, plus 15 cows, 2 dogs, 2 cats, chickens, ducks, turkeys, and bees!
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#11 of 64 Old 07-05-2009, 04:54 PM
 
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given your last baby's position I would say do some belly binding- to help the baby position it's self - that you got to 10 cm with the baby in shoulder presentation speaks says alot about your body's ability to do this - personally I would wait for and have an HBAC as well
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#12 of 64 Old 07-05-2009, 05:38 PM
 
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I've had a 42+ weeks baby and it makes professionals nervous, no doubt. My daughter was perfectly fine. Midwife was sure she was going to see mec in the waters, but it was clear. I would stay far away from anyone who wants to induce you chemically or otherwise. You don't want to mess with your uterus as it has been scarred once already. Normally a previous c-sec means you are not a a good candidate for an induction. Same with epidural as if the scar ruptures you won't be able to feel it.
Trust the process, this is your first vaginal birth so your body needs more time to work up to it. Prodromal labor is a very good thing.
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#13 of 64 Old 07-05-2009, 05:51 PM
 
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I've had a 42+ weeks baby and it makes professionals nervous, no doubt. My daughter was perfectly fine. Midwife was sure she was going to see mec in the waters, but it was clear. I would stay far away from anyone who wants to induce you chemically or otherwise. You don't want to mess with your uterus as it has been scarred once already. Normally a previous c-sec means you are not a a good candidate for an induction. Same with epidural as if the scar ruptures you won't be able to feel it.
Trust the process, this is your first vaginal birth so your body needs more time to work up to it. Prodromal labor is a very good thing.
Yeah, the whole vbac thing makes any kind of induction dangerous.

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#14 of 64 Old 07-05-2009, 09:50 PM
 
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I would seek help when I felt I needed to. it would depend. I just had my son at 42.5 weeks. (after WEEKS of prodromal labouring) finally I had my husand srip my membranes and my water started to leak (as it had a couple of times) and then my contracitons REALLY started (like 8 on a 0-10 scale) about 10 mins later.

I dont recommend stripping membranes. but I felt it was right for me for this pregnancy in this situation. I had this innr peace about it, I can't explain. otherwise I wouldn't have done it. to me my body was telling me to give it a little nudge. so I did. but i wouldn't have if it didn't.

another friends has had kids from 41-44 weeks. it happens. some babies go late for a number of reasons.


that said... how do YOU feel?

just some thoughts either way: if you're taking any form of fish oil/cod liver oil back off for a little bit. it can really make the bag of water VERY strong (too strong lol). Drink plenty of water, but don't overhydrate and get depleted on electrolytes. cry some spinning babies moves if you think the baby is in a funny posotion (but don't obsess on it!) and take some belly pictures so you can remember this time.

transtichel.gifMom of three - (2.5 yrs, 7yrs, and 11yrs). Birthing Doula, editor, and wife to my soulmate. I've had a c/s, hospital VBAC, UC and not yet decided what I'll do about this next little one

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#15 of 64 Old 07-05-2009, 09:54 PM
 
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#16 of 64 Old 07-05-2009, 10:38 PM
 
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I won't give up! I will be 42 weeks tomorrow and I am feeling aggitated as well. Not for being "overdue", as I have been with my other three pregnancies as well, but all of the unneeded stress brought on by others questioning and my husband being out of work for two weeks now waiting on me UGH!
Atleast you are having prodromal labor, I have a few contractions on and off but nothing I would call prodromal labor.
I would start trying natural induction methods if I went to 44 weeks.

I did try blue & black cohosh with my second pregnancy which I was supposedly 44 weeks and my son was born with a heart deffect. Which now I have read can be a side effect of the blue cohosh, so I will not take it again or recommend it.
Nipple stimulation from using my breast pump caused my water to break that time and labor started right away.
He also had no signs of being too "ripe" lol.

Hang in there, baby won't stay in there forever!
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#17 of 64 Old 07-05-2009, 11:20 PM
 
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42 weeks would be my personal limit, and if I'd had a prior C I'd want to try a foley induction as opposed to using any of the labor inducing drugs. For me, going past that would be too much like playing russian roulette with a healthy, term baby. I'm very anti-induction for healthy non-complicated pregnancies in general, but at some point you have to consider just what you are risking for your ideal birth experience.

Good luck in your decision making process and I hope its all for not and you go into labor on your own soon!!

Nicole - Mom to FOUR healthy, happy, wild boys.
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#18 of 64 Old 07-05-2009, 11:56 PM - Thread Starter
 
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I had my husband strip my membranes
I've been tossing this idea around too lately...

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that said... how do YOU feel?
Generally great, just impatient. I feel like everything is just fine. I haven't gotten any bad "vibes".

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and take some belly pictures so you can remember this time.
You know, I haven't even done that yet!!! You can tell this is a 4th baby! Thanks for the reminder to get that done before it's too late!!

Mama to ds12, dd9, dd3.5, and ds20mo, plus 15 cows, 2 dogs, 2 cats, chickens, ducks, turkeys, and bees!
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#19 of 64 Old 07-06-2009, 12:00 AM - Thread Starter
 
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I did try blue & black cohosh with my second pregnancy which I was supposedly 44 weeks and my son was born with a heart deffect. Which now I have read can be a side effect of the blue cohosh, so I will not take it again or recommend it.
Nipple stimulation from using my breast pump caused my water to break that time and labor started right away.
He also had no signs of being too "ripe" lol.
I've been wary of blue & black cohosh, mainly because I keep hearing things like this! I know some people swear by it, but stories like these keep me from using it.

I do still nurse my dd twice a day and have great contractions during, but they always stop shortly after. I've tried letting her just hang out there, but she ends up falling asleep and stopping anyway! I guess I could try to keep it going with the pump, though.

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#20 of 64 Old 07-06-2009, 12:28 AM - Thread Starter
 
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42 weeks would be my personal limit, and if I'd had a prior C I'd want to try a foley induction as opposed to using any of the labor inducing drugs. For me, going past that would be too much like playing russian roulette with a healthy, term baby. I'm very anti-induction for healthy non-complicated pregnancies in general, but at some point you have to consider just what you are risking for your ideal birth experience.
I've actually read that foley induction can cause cervical incompetence in subsequent pregnancies, so I wasn't feeling right about that one either. My backup doc had suggested it.

I don't feel like my goal is an ideal birth experience...it is a matter of weighing the risks. Is it riskier to wait for my body or to induce? Given, especially, that my dates could be off, and given what happened last time I induced through breaking my water, I'm inclined to believe the risk is greater in inducing at this point. If I start to feel otherwise, like if babe is slowing down, obviously, the risks would shift wildly to the other side. I'd always rather a c-section than an unhealthy (or worse) baby. But at this point, I'm not feeling like those are my options.

So many decisions, huh? It sure would be easier to just go "on time"! Sure would be less to think about!!

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#21 of 64 Old 07-06-2009, 01:23 AM
 
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Actually, a heart defect would have developed LONG before the end of pregnancy. Normally in the first or early second trimester. I am sure you should stay away from the cohoshes until the very end of pregnancy, but I am not against them at the end if they are necessary for some reason. And I certainly think they are safer than pitocin.

Do whatever your heart is telling you! I think that is what all of us should do. Whether that is hospital induction, some kind of backup, herbal induction, or just waiting. You are the mom and you instinctively "know" I believe!

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#22 of 64 Old 07-06-2009, 04:52 AM
 
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I don't feel like my goal is an ideal birth experience...it is a matter of weighing the risks. Is it riskier to wait for my body or to induce? Given, especially, that my dates could be off, and given what happened last time I induced through breaking my water, I'm inclined to believe the risk is greater in inducing at this point. If I start to feel otherwise, like if babe is slowing down, obviously, the risks would shift wildly to the other side. I'd always rather a c-section than an unhealthy (or worse) baby. But at this point, I'm not feeling like those are my options.
This is a fourth baby? How were #1 and #2 born?

In your shoes I'd go back to the back-up doc again, tell them that you're trying to decide whether to induce or not and ask for a BPP and monitoring. I personally feel better with closer vigilance after 42 weeks.
If you want to use the cohoshes, cimicifuga and caulophyllum are the homeopathic forms. I've got contractions out of them, but no baby: but then, my body works the other way round to yours. If baby isn't lined up right, I get contractions but no dilation at all.

Helen mum to five and mistress of mess and mayhem, making merry and mischief til the sun goes down.
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#23 of 64 Old 07-06-2009, 01:14 PM - Thread Starter
 
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This is a fourth baby? How were #1 and #2 born?
#1 was 10 years ago...My water started leaking a week early and, not knowing any better, I ran into the hospital and they induced. I had been 0cm, 0% effaced...obviously baby was not ready to come! Vaginal, though.

#2 was 8 years ago...They did an ultrasound at 38 weeks and decided she was too big. Induced. She was 9 lb, 6 oz, yes, but I wish I would've waited. They had me scared, though. Wish I knew there was an option of saying no to the doctors!

I've learned a whole lot since then!!!

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#24 of 64 Old 07-06-2009, 02:46 PM
 
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#1 was 10 years ago...My water started leaking a week early and, not knowing any better, I ran into the hospital and they induced. I had been 0cm, 0% effaced...obviously baby was not ready to come! Vaginal, though.

#2 was 8 years ago...They did an ultrasound at 38 weeks and decided she was too big. Induced. She was 9 lb, 6 oz, yes, but I wish I would've waited. They had me scared, though. Wish I knew there was an option of saying no to the doctors!

I've learned a whole lot since then!!!

I am crashing here to say that my first two, 10 and 8 years ago were EXACTLY the same way.

#1-water started leaking, got "threats" from the medical practice and ended up with induction

#2-I had polyhydramenos, extra fluid, and was told my uterus was so stretched I'd never go into labor on my own so I was induced from "nothing". He was 9# 14oz!

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#25 of 64 Old 07-06-2009, 03:22 PM
 
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This is my first UC, and my first was born at 37 weeks, so I have no idea what I'm talking about here from a personal standpoint. Lol! Just a disclaimer.

But, being a vbac myself... I don't think I'd ever "give up" and allow them to do an induction. No cervadil or pitocin for me, thanks very much! Now herbal things, on the other hand, I might do... Or bust out that pump!

ESPECIALLY because your dates could be off by a bit. You may not even be at 42 weeks yet. But as the others have said, I think the very most important thing is listening to your intuition, although I know it's sorta hard to differentiate between inner voice and fear/frustration. Good luck mama! KUP!

Tristian, vegetarian wife to Matt, intactivist, UC supporting mama to my little earth-child-in-training, Ginny (4), and my sweet boy, Finnian (2).  Due mid-July with our third little one!

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#26 of 64 Old 07-06-2009, 03:53 PM
 
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Okay, I haven't read all the pages, but I wanted to give you some encouragement. My first VBAC, we were totally against induction, although at the time, we only knew about the medicated type. They did all the non stress tests, baby was fine. We also had a FP, and the drs tried to give me all the dead baby scary cr*p. The baby was fine. I had nursed my oldest until I was 6 mos along, and comes to find out, from my first, to my 7th, I ovulate 10 days later than the "normal" woman. Hence, my longer pregnancies. I went to 43wks2days, and she was perfectly FINE! The VBAC went great with the FP that I hadn't seen recently in that practice. HE was a great MW really, because he wasn't like a dr/OB.

My next children were 10 days late (dated at an early U/S), my 4th was on her due date because we "naturally" induced (no cohoshes). BAD IDEA. Evening Primrose Oil internally and orally is good to ripen things up. RRL tea is good to get ctx strong enought, but with all the BH you have had, you WILL have your baby soon. Maybe today, maybe tomorrow.

My first complete UC was 43wks5 days. Biggest baby ever. I had been nursing my 4th throughout the whole pregnancy and was constipated, which probably delayed things. He was PERFECT, the birth went PERFECT, and I was sooo glad that we fired the CNM MW at 32 wks because she would have driven me mad. No transfer with that one.

The next was 43wks2days as well, but we transferred to the hospital for meconium staining. SHe was fine, and all went well with the VBAC. It was out of our comfort zone though. They said we could go back home, since she was fine, but preferred us to stay. No aspiration.

The next baby had a lost twin, and he was only 15 days late. He was born just fine. I did transfer after because I didn't know for sure that it was a twin birth, as I knew there was only one baby. I expect I won't go so far over this time either, since we lost another twin.

Many first time vag births are late. That is just way it is. Some babies like to gestate longer. IT sounds like your baby is fine for now. Just do daily kick counts, and keep an eye on things. Yes, your risk is a little increased, but many babies over the millinea didn't have "due dates", and did just fine. Did your mother have a habit of going overdue? That makes a difference too. Kymberli
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#27 of 64 Old 07-07-2009, 07:54 AM - Thread Starter
 
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You know, I had no idea that going over 42 weeks was actually not such a crazy, strange thing! It's very comforting to hear that people do it and everything is fine.

That is interesting about nursing and being overdue. That certainly could be contributing too...and, I've been fairly constipated lately too. In fact, I had just been toying with trying to get things moving better, wondering if it wasn't holding up the show!

And, yes, in fact, my mom DID go over with me...20 days! She is not alive now to verify that, but I remember her telling me that once. What goes around, comes around, eh?

Thanks so much for all the help and encouragement!!

Mama to ds12, dd9, dd3.5, and ds20mo, plus 15 cows, 2 dogs, 2 cats, chickens, ducks, turkeys, and bees!
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#28 of 64 Old 07-07-2009, 11:21 AM
 
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#29 of 64 Old 07-07-2009, 11:47 AM
 
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here are 2 good/ researched articles on blue cohosh -
Paul's is mainly historic but also clear about not dosing with capsules -

http://medherb.com/Materia_Medica/Ca...on_a_fetus.htm


---------------
and this is one published in the Canadian Journal of Clinical Pharmacology- they have free full text available to read

http://www.cjcp.ca/hm/

the blue cohosh safety in pregnancy is this article specifically-
they also have several other articles on the safety of herbs in pregnancy and breastfeeding-
2008 Winter;15(1):e66-73. Epub 2008 Jan 18.
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#30 of 64 Old 07-07-2009, 12:12 PM
 
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Thx for posting this. I am another 10-month mama. My cycles are kind of wonky and I do bf through pregnancy, so I never know exactly but my only "on time" baby was my oldest at 40.5 and then my girls were all between 1 and 3 weeks later than that.

With my last one, it was so crazy because both the ultrasound, at close to 44 weeks, and one of my midwives, just after birth, estimated her to be 39 weeks gestationally. She was covered with a thick coating of vernix. But I absolutely know from when I had my first appointment, which was at least a week after I tested positive, that she was at a minimum of 41 weeks.
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