Desperately in need of guidance, loss mentioned - Mothering Forums
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#1 of 22 Old 05-15-2010, 12:40 PM - Thread Starter
 
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I was not sure where to start, I have been a lurker on here for years, and have always appreciated the kindness and insight from you amazing ladies.

I am in a very difficult situation. I found out a week ago that our baby has grown wings. I am 22 weeks pregnant. We had planned an UC for this baby, despite the adamant pressure form our families not to. We had been seeing an OB during the first trimester who supported our decision to switch to a midwife, but did not support the concept of UC. We led him to believe that we would be switching to a midwife's care after 20 weeks. Due to me having Factor V (blood clotting disorder), we felt this was a safe point in the pregnancy to transfer care.

I noticed that our little one wasn't moving as much last week. I would prefer not to go into details, because that horrible day is still all too fresh in my mind. But an ultrasound confirmed our worst fears.

I was in the process of switching to a midwife in the middle of all of this. My OB is pressuring me to be admitted for an induction. I cannot bear the thought of it. My last, and only induction was also with a loss, and I don't think I can handle going through that again. The hospital staff was so cold, we were treated as if our loss had occurred because of our "ideas about childbirth", as a nurse put it.

My husband and I are desperate to do this unassisted as planned. If anything, knowing that our LO is gone, makes me only that much more desperate to do this in the privacy and comfort of my own home.
My OB is adamant that I am risking my life by waiting on things to start on their own. I have tried everything possible to kick start labor, walking, black and blue cohosh, goldenseal, red raspberry leaf tea, evening primrose oil, even sex (which was awkward and heartbreaking, I don't think I can put myself through that again)

I have been stuck at around 4cm dilated for 4 days now. (According to my husband) He said he can reach enough to feel the very edge of the baby's bag, but I am very posterior due to the fact that our angel is obviously not engaged like a normal full term baby.

I am starting to lose it. I am trying to be patient and trust that my body will accept our child's fate, but I am scared. I once carried a missed miscarriage for 5 weeks past the time of loss, and it was torture. This is even more unbearable, as I am obviously showing and cannot leave the house due to fear of innocent "congratulations" breaking my heart.

My OB is trying to convince me to consent to a hospital induction with cytotec. I am normally adamantly against it's use, but I am so desperate at this point that I am actually considering it. I have heard the contrax are brutal, and am aware of the risk of rupture, but at this point I just want to hold my baby and grieve his loss. I know this may sound morbid, but every day I wonder if he is deteoriating to the point of being unrecognizable.

I've begged my OB to just insert the cytotec and let me do this at home, but he refuses. I find this odd, as I know many women who have gone through losses with cytotec at home.

What should I do???? I have called two local midwives to see if they could help, but because I was under the care of an ob until this point, no one is willing to take on my case.

Does anyone have any suggestions? My husband and I are so desperate, that I even looked into ordering cytotec and administering it myself. But everywhere I can find it is overseas and will take 2 weeks to arrive. I don't think I can handle another two weeks of this.

I am desperate to do this with my husband without the prying hands and eyes of the hospital staff. ANY ideas, suggestions, ANYTHING is appreciated.

Momma to 11 in heaven, 2 on earth.
Diagnosed with Factor V in 2007
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#2 of 22 Old 05-15-2010, 01:17 PM
 
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I'm so sorry for your loss. And I'm sorry that you can't find a midwife locally that would be willing to assist you. Have you looked into any herbal preparations besides the black/blue cohosh? Lobelia comes to mind, but I'd look at some of Susun Weed's stuff to see what she recommends. Maybe some EFT too, to let your body know that it is okay to let go? I hope that you are able to find a way to handle your loss in the privacy of your own home.
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#3 of 22 Old 05-15-2010, 01:18 PM
 
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I'm so, sorry that you're going through this. I don't have any real advice for you, though I think it would probably be dangerous to try to Cytotec at home by yourself. I hope you're able to find a path that isn't too horrible. I'm so sorry for your loss.

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#4 of 22 Old 05-15-2010, 04:19 PM
 
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Oh, mama, I am so sorry you are on this most difficult journey.

I noticed you are a new member, and I wanted to let you know there is also a Pregnancy and Birth Loss section in this forum. If you were to post your question there, I think you might get some responses and support also.

Wishing you peace and healing.

SAHM to Abraham (9) Gillian (5) Adrienne (3) and baby boy coming in October! 

Always missing our Gianna, lost during fullterm labor (8/23/04)
Sticking together through the good and the bad with dh of 10 yrs!

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#5 of 22 Old 05-15-2010, 07:18 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Thank you all so much. I wasn't sure which board was a better fit for this, but I will definitely try to ask on the loss boards.
I am not as familiar with Lobelia, could you clarify how this would be used? I will also definitely check out Susan Weed.
What does EFT stand for? (please don't laugh, I am new to this whole induction thing)
I can honestly say that I am a little flustered that no one will help me here locally. My husband has even offered to pay them the average amount that a normal mom would owe for a birth, I think they are viewing me as a liability because of my desire to do this unassisted.

Momma to 11 in heaven, 2 on earth.
Diagnosed with Factor V in 2007
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#6 of 22 Old 05-15-2010, 08:34 PM
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i am sorry for your loss, and i support you in your desire to have a UC with this baby.

EFT is Emotional Freedom Technique, and it's also called "tapping."

Susun Weed does have some great information about those things. They would be under abortificants. Her web site has information about it, if you wanted to start there.

You might also search midwifery today for natural inductions. There is a lot of information out there.

Good luck with it, and blessings to you.
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#7 of 22 Old 05-15-2010, 08:52 PM
 
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I am so so sorry for your loss, I have lost several of my own at 17/18 weeks, so I know the pain. Obviously you must make your own choices, I would encourage you to resolve this quickly.

After a week, there will probably be some...issues with the baby that will make it very hard to birth. I won't go into detail on the board, but my SIL who attempted a UC with her 40 stillborn faced them and it was even more heartbreaking than you can imagine. For me, it was a few days, my Abi and my Asher were fine, but Matthew had some breakdown of tissue already.

I will pray for you, for peace and for strength. Since you have gone through this before, I know that it is hard to face it again. I fully believe that UC can be good, but I also believe that there are times in which a medical staff can be helpful.

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#8 of 22 Old 05-15-2010, 08:55 PM
 
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I wanted to add, that you can still have a birth plan, and ask that your OB provide an intimate and caring place in the hospital to birth. ICAN has a good set of birth plans, for those who might need to plan medical care rather than a completely natural birth. You can request things like voices be kept low, that it be treated as the birth of a child, not the management of a stillbirth, that lights are low and that you have time with your baby. Most drs and esp nurses are so very understanding of this pain and will work with you.


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#9 of 22 Old 05-15-2010, 10:37 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Sadly, I am familiar with the breakdown of tissue that occurs. That is one reason that I am so desperate to get this over with. I have been doing some reading on Susan's website. I will update if we make any progress tonight. Send thoughts and prayers my way please!

Momma to 11 in heaven, 2 on earth.
Diagnosed with Factor V in 2007
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#10 of 22 Old 05-15-2010, 11:00 PM
 
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I hope you can have a peaceful birth this weekend. Barring that, may you and your husband come to a place of discernment and peace. Again, I am so sorry. If you want to talk privately, PM me...if not, I totally understand. My SIL's son was born two months ago, and she still has a hard time talking about it. Mine were born years ago, and it took me two years to get to a point to discuss it.

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#11 of 22 Old 05-16-2010, 12:44 AM
 
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I do not have any advice, but you and yours are in my thoughts and prayers.

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#12 of 22 Old 05-16-2010, 01:01 AM
 
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I am so sorry you're suffering this. Is there someone who can come to the birth with you to protect your privacy? Some doulas provide this service, and can stand guard while you give birth and grieve your loss. You need to do whatever makes sense to you and your husband, but I agree with the others that cytotec may be too dangerous for at home. I know of some midwives who will use it at a home birth, but this is skirting trouble.
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#13 of 22 Old 05-16-2010, 02:24 AM
 
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I'm glad to see that you found Ms. Weed's work. She really is the foremost expert on herbal preps in the U.S. I second the idea of having a doula or some one else along those lines at the birth. Not necessarily for the delivery, but possibly a loved one that was strong enough to be able to support you afterwards. Your husband will be dealing with grief of his own and probably could use that support as well.
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#14 of 22 Old 05-16-2010, 02:59 AM
 
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I am so sorry for your loss.
Two things to add:
1. You'll need to file for a death certificate in most states since it's after 20 weeks. When a baby is born at home, and this process goes poorly, someone ends up calling the police and there is a mandatory autopsy b/c of the investigation and it can be heartbreaking drama. When it goes well, there are documents from the doctors about the previously diagnosed death of the baby, that doc signs the certificate, a funeral home is called, and it's all handled by the parents and people who care.
2. At 22 weeks, the body is usually just not prepared to birth. In the first trimester, the mother's body is adapted to miscarriage, as sad as that is. In the third trimester, the mother's body is ready for labor. In the second, the placenta isn't ready to let go in the way it is late in pregnancy. Bleeding can be a much greater issue.

In most hospitals, women with stillborn babies often choose to have lots of pain medication. Hospital personnel can feel it's more appropriate to birth where this is available. And the staff is there to deal with the death certificate issues. Many hospitals have good programs for mothers of stillborn babies. Special nurses that agree to work the shifts, special room accomidations so you don't hear crying babies, special noticies to make sure no one asks you where your baby is. Can you travel to another area?

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#15 of 22 Old 05-16-2010, 04:24 AM
 
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There are not words that I can come up with to account for your loss.

I've done a little searching online, and haven't turned up a whole lot yet but I will keep looking. The best resource I've found is here, but it only goes into miscarrying up to 12 weeks. The other resource that might be helpful for you is a book available online by the Sage-femme Collective, entitled Natural Liberty: Rediscovering Self-Induced Abortion Methods although the abortion language may be unsavory it is one of the few well written and researched texts on the topic of non-live births. My only other thoughts were using Menstrual Extraction (it relatively unheard of but effective) but I don't believe this is safe after 9 weeks.

What I have noticed is in comparing 10-12 women who've posted their experiences of unassisted later term miscarriages/stillbirths is a significant amount of bleeding. Many of them describing what I would consider a significant hemorrhage, so I would have your Hubby pick up an iron supplement to start taking now to pre-treat yourself for anemia. I recommend Floridex, it is in a glass bottle can be found at whole foods, twice daily. I did find two women who were told by their medical advisers that it could take 4 to 6 weeks for the body to realize it wasn't growing a baby anymore. I know you don't want to wait that long to have your baby in your arms so you can say hello and in the same breath goodbye.

Look for warning signs, a temperature above 100 (F) temperature and/or a foul smell from your vulva are usually the body is signaling infection. You may want to consult with a health care professional at this point.

I will keep reading and see if I can find more for you. Do check out the herbs section in the self induced abortion book I linked above.

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#16 of 22 Old 05-16-2010, 08:53 AM
 
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With the others, I offer my condolences on your heartbreaking loss.

Others have given good advice, just one other thing to offer: I helped my daughter at her stillbirth of her 23-wk angel, and all went perfectly well. No excessive bleeding, totally straightforward and normal. Yes, the risks are higher for more bleeding in the 2nd trimester, but you certainly have reasons to trust that all may go just fine. If it were me, I'd wait a bit longer and give birth at home--and I would have a good list on hand of what problems to watch for, some remedies (such as blue cohosh for excessive bleeding) onhand to use if needed, and a medical backup plan for call upon in case the birth/postpartum is complicated.

Sending positive birthing vibes your way--along with prayers for the healing of hearts and renewed joy in time.
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#17 of 22 Old 05-16-2010, 09:01 AM - Thread Starter
 
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I am willing to overlook the abortion language in the resources, most of my research has pointed me in that direction.
I was hoping things would get started last night, I kept having the "beginnings" of contractions, but despite my best efforts they fizzled out. I am so emotionally and physically exhausted at this point. I am not sure how I would go about traveling to a differetn area at this point. I know it may seem almost silly for me to want to still attempt an UC at this point, it's just hard to let go of our vision of this baby's birth.
The only thing that has really succesfully helped with getting contrations going is the nipple stimulation. But at this point, even that's not productive. I am so sore from trying that route that I think that may possibly be contributing to it being ineffective.
I am continuously crampy, and I'm not sure if that's from the cohoshes and EPO, or if it's a coincidence. I keep hoping that the crampiness is a sign that maybe my cervix is changing.

Momma to 11 in heaven, 2 on earth.
Diagnosed with Factor V in 2007
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#18 of 22 Old 05-17-2010, 09:05 AM
 
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Any news yet?

Yes, the crampiness most likely indicates that your cervix is changing.
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#19 of 22 Old 05-17-2010, 05:31 PM
 
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I hope things get going for you today and you're able to have a peaceful birth. It took about 6 weeks for me to go into labor naturally after our 2nd tri loss. They were born in the caul with no complications. I wish we had stayed home and UCd but they ended up being born in the hospital with only DH and I in attendance. If I had to do it over I would have stayed home and not even filed the death cert. or messed with hiring a funeral home (which they led me to believe was the law but it wasn't).

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#20 of 22 Old 05-17-2010, 06:20 PM
 
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I'm so sorry for your loss.
One suggestion I have is you could see if the OB would just break your water and let you go home.

If you do end up going to the hospital, you could request that no body be in the room for the birth and they could just come in right afterwards. Usually in the hospital with losses (except for term) there is just the nurse there anyways ( the Ob usually does not come until afterwards to deliver the placenta). But I do not see any objections to requesting that they allow you to birth by yourself.

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#21 of 22 Old 05-17-2010, 07:29 PM
 
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I lost my last baby at about 20 weeks gestation. Or rather, I was 20 weeks gestation when I realized that the pregnancy was not viable. I had been planning a UC as well.

I did go to the ER for an ultrasound, which confirmed my suspicions. At that point, the baby had been dead for some time, and tissue loss had occured. It was a super difficult decision for me, but I did decide to finish it all at the hospital. Because of the amount of decay at that point, I was put under general anestesia and had a D&E. It was not at all what I had wanted, but in the end I just wanted it all over with. The baby had died, and regardless of how she left my body, I knew I had done everything I could for her up to that point. I did feel uncertain about my decision for a few months, and questioned the decision I made when I was wracked with grief.

But I can tell you, 4 years later, I think I did the right thing. It wasn't what I wanted, but it kept me safe.

I'm not telling you my story to try and change your mind about what to do. I just wanted to let you know that I was in a similar situation, I made the decision to go to the hospital, and had a good outcome- both physically and emotionally. Much love and support to you.

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#22 of 22 Old 05-18-2010, 02:38 PM
 
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I hope you are doing OK. I am praying for you.

Christian helpmeet, homeschooling, homebirthing, homesteading wife, happily raising our family completely naturally. Mother to 5 children, 1 angel and new baby due in August!
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