At what point do you "call it?" - Mothering Forums

Forum Jump: 
 
Thread Tools
#1 of 23 Old 02-10-2013, 06:53 PM - Thread Starter
 
zapzipzee's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Oregon
Posts: 150
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)

My mom is my back up hypnobabies partner (DH think's hypnosis is bogus), and I'll be calling her if the contractions are bad.  I told her tonight that we're getting rid of the midwife, and she wants to know before 36 weeks, at what point we will go to the hospital.  

 

I told her I thought 48hrs of labor was plenty, or if someone was going to die.  She said she wants to know a point before it gets to "someone is going to die."

 

I guess I hadn't really thought about what she was asking, because to me, the only reason to go to the hospital is if something is truely wrong, not just a variation of normal.  Obviously, I'm not ok with being in labor for 5 days...  She thinks we should "call it" and calmly get in the car and go to the hospital if it goes past the 20hrs I was in labor with DD, just to reassure us that everything IS ok.

 

I'm making a cheat sheet, with warning signs, what to do, when to transfer ect... but she's asking for a time limit, for when "enough is enough."

 

Do you have one?  What would you tell her?

 

 

ETA:  She thinks we should keep the midwife, so the midwife can tell us, "everything is fine, no need to go to the hospital."  She doesn't want a repeat of DD...  DH's "limit" was 10hrs of debilitating back labor.  He had had enough at that point.


selectivevax.gifcd.gifbfinfant.gif & Part-Time EC
zapzipzee is offline  
#2 of 23 Old 02-10-2013, 07:19 PM
 
tiqa's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Posts: 503
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)

It would be really hard to put a time limit on that sort of thing before labor began.  What were the days leading up to labor like?  Did you get rest, did you eat, or were you already worn out?  How painful is the labor?  How is your energy level?  A short, intense labor might be more exhausting than a longer, more mellow one, especially if you went into it well rested.  It seems impossible to me to answer that question in advance.  It's not like labor begins with a ding to announce that this is real labor, start counting down the hours now.  It seems to me that's quite the OPPOSITE of what a homebirth would be like - as opposed to a hospital birth where, if you check in at 4 pm, they start the countdown at that point (I guess?  Or do they go by when you reported your contrax started?).

 

Anyway my transfer options would be... hmm.  Obviously if there are nonreassuring fetal tones if you're checking those, maternal exhaustion (whatever that may be, ,there's no way to define that ahead of time), a lack of progress (and I don't mean via constant cervical checks, but if there's just no progress being made at all with the contractions getting more effective)...  But I don't know if I could put a time limit on it.  Though, if I did, for me it would be about 6 hours.  My own labors were 5 hours, 1.5 hours, and 4 hours.  For your labor history, I would probably say something like 24 as long as everything else was going fine.  But I would also be more inclined to check fetal heart tones etc in a longer labor as well...

tiqa is offline  
#3 of 23 Old 02-11-2013, 01:50 PM
 
BlessedJess's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 217
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by zapzipzee View Post

My mom is my back up hypnobabies partner (DH think's hypnosis is bogus), and I'll be calling her if the contractions are bad.  I told her tonight that we're getting rid of the midwife, and she wants to know before 36 weeks, at what point we will go to the hospital.  

 

I told her I thought 48hrs of labor was plenty, or if someone was going to die.  She said she wants to know a point before it gets to "someone is going to die."

 

I guess I hadn't really thought about what she was asking, because to me, the only reason to go to the hospital is if something is truely wrong, not just a variation of normal.  Obviously, I'm not ok with being in labor for 5 days...  She thinks we should "call it" and calmly get in the car and go to the hospital if it goes past the 20hrs I was in labor with DD, just to reassure us that everything IS ok.

 

I'm making a cheat sheet, with warning signs, what to do, when to transfer ect... but she's asking for a time limit, for when "enough is enough."

 

Do you have one?  What would you tell her?

 

 

ETA:  She thinks we should keep the midwife, so the midwife can tell us, "everything is fine, no need to go to the hospital."  She doesn't want a repeat of DD...  DH's "limit" was 10hrs of debilitating back labor.  He had had enough at that point.


I think it's weird that she's insisting that you describe an exact "call it" moment. People like that I'd just as soon keep out of the discussion but that doesn't sound reasonable in your case. (considering she's a support person you don't want to do without - or do you?)

 

I'd say enough is enough when I FEEL it's enough. A birthing woman doesn't lose her mind or give it to someone else for babysitting. She's got to understand the importance of your intuiton. I would also say that anything before the onset of active labor doesn't count. People need to understand that. Early labor might not even open the cervix. I wouldn't try getting help with early labor if at all possible and reasonable.

 

I even knew someone (very out of the ordinary, probably won't happen to you) who had really distracting and annoying contractions with one late baby that were happening every 5-10 minutes for weeks. It was a hard time for her and she couldn't sleep, also having an issue spiritually at one point, really wrestling with herself and God while just feeling very strongly like home was where she needed to be. (And she'd had a c-section already - she knew she could do that again if she wanted to or needed to.)

zapzipzee likes this.
BlessedJess is offline  
#4 of 23 Old 02-11-2013, 01:56 PM
 
MichelleZB's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Ontario, Canada
Posts: 1,007
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 21 Post(s)

Tell her either 12 days of labour or when you feel like going to the hospital, whichever comes first.

zapzipzee and BlessedJess like this.
MichelleZB is offline  
#5 of 23 Old 02-11-2013, 10:37 PM
 
phathui5's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Oregon
Posts: 17,474
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)

Are you sure she's comfortable with attending an unassisted birth?

BlessedJess likes this.

Midwife (CPM, LDM) and homeschooling mama to:
13yo ds   10yo dd  8yo ds and 6yo ds and 1yo ds  
phathui5 is offline  
#6 of 23 Old 02-12-2013, 07:07 AM
 
JamieCatheryn's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: SW Pa
Posts: 5,103
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 12 Post(s)

I think it's a good plan to know what situations you would transfer for. Bleeding like in a placental abruption (not just heavy bloody show from fast dilation), signs of cord prolapse, maybe elevated temperature like you have an infection, if pushing doesn't make progress for a very long time after it starts, your blood pressure or heartrate going wrong, baby's heartrate having trouble not fixed by a position change, meconium in waters plus any other mildly bad signs. Slow progress alone isn't reason but if you aren't doing well due to it and can't get rested or recharged at home or if things don't seem right, sure. Honestly I transferred from a UC because I did not have a midwife at home to say "this is ok, you're varying from normal but all is well" when I labored for over 30 hours and got pressure feeling like pushing stuff after water broke but I wasn't nearly dilated enough, though looking at my other births patterns I might have been like 7cm at home. I transferred and that upset sent me back to 4cm (sphincter theory?). In the end all was fine and the hospital was just a bunch of annoying rules and interruptions and delayed the birthing. You'll hit a time of uncertainty most likely, it makes you let go so you can birth. Some guidelines for real transfer reasons will keep that from pushing you where you don't want to go. Follow intuition but not fear.

 

Also, I explained hypnobabies to people as a full relaxation technique to help me birth easier and more comfortably, they accepted that instead of focusing on changing mental state being able to create painless birthing, the hypnosis concept sounds out there to many people. This last birth when I'd studied hypnobabies though, except during a bath early on my "waves" (at the time I said "birthing waves...**** it these are contractions!") hit so fast and furious (3min apart from the start and pretty strong right off) I couldn't use the off switch, listen to scripts etc during waves only between, so I just sat up, rocked, hung on and chanted peace and open while things went really quick, reassuring myself I'd done this before and could do it again one way or another, just need to wait through it.

 

Also, get that baby LOA or OA before baby engages, it'll be way easier if you can! Use good posture, don't put your feet up, do exercises to give baby room and relax things in your back and belly, and gentle pushes on baby's bottom to turn him or her. spinningbabies.com

zapzipzee likes this.
JamieCatheryn is offline  
#7 of 23 Old 02-12-2013, 08:20 PM - Thread Starter
 
zapzipzee's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Oregon
Posts: 150
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by phathui5 View Post

Are you sure she's comfortable with attending an unassisted birth?

She is.  After seeing what happened at the hospital with DD, she's fine with it being no "medical" people.  She just thinks calling the midwife after 20 hrs for reassurance that everything is ok would keep us at home instead of the hospital...  DH doesn't want to pay for the midwife if I have no intention of calling her when labor starts (or using her for the birth - My compromise for him wanting to keep her was that I wasn't calling her and if he did, I didn't want to know she was there, she could stay in her car or in the living room.  He then decided there was no point in paying her to do nothing but sit around).


selectivevax.gifcd.gifbfinfant.gif & Part-Time EC
zapzipzee is offline  
#8 of 23 Old 02-12-2013, 08:26 PM - Thread Starter
 
zapzipzee's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Oregon
Posts: 150
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by JamieCatheryn View Post

I think it's a good plan to know what situations you would transfer for. Bleeding like in a placental abruption (not just heavy bloody show from fast dilation), signs of cord prolapse, maybe elevated temperature like you have an infection, if pushing doesn't make progress for a very long time after it starts, your blood pressure or heartrate going wrong, baby's heartrate having trouble not fixed by a position change, meconium in waters plus any other mildly bad signs. Slow progress alone isn't reason but if you aren't doing well due to it and can't get rested or recharged at home or if things don't seem right, sure. Honestly I transferred from a UC because I did not have a midwife at home to say "this is ok, you're varying from normal but all is well" when I labored for over 30 hours and got pressure feeling like pushing stuff after water broke but I wasn't nearly dilated enough, though looking at my other births patterns I might have been like 7cm at home. I transferred and that upset sent me back to 4cm (sphincter theory?). In the end all was fine and the hospital was just a bunch of annoying rules and interruptions and delayed the birthing. You'll hit a time of uncertainty most likely, it makes you let go so you can birth. Some guidelines for real transfer reasons will keep that from pushing you where you don't want to go. Follow intuition but not fear.

 

Also, I explained hypnobabies to people as a full relaxation technique to help me birth easier and more comfortably, they accepted that instead of focusing on changing mental state being able to create painless birthing, the hypnosis concept sounds out there to many people. This last birth when I'd studied hypnobabies though, except during a bath early on my "waves" (at the time I said "birthing waves...**** it these are contractions!") hit so fast and furious (3min apart from the start and pretty strong right off) I couldn't use the off switch, listen to scripts etc during waves only between, so I just sat up, rocked, hung on and chanted peace and open while things went really quick, reassuring myself I'd done this before and could do it again one way or another, just need to wait through it.

 

Also, get that baby LOA or OA before baby engages, it'll be way easier if you can! Use good posture, don't put your feet up, do exercises to give baby room and relax things in your back and belly, and gentle pushes on baby's bottom to turn him or her. spinningbabies.com

 

I'm in the process of making a very detailed birth plan and transfer plan.  I sent her what I have so far, and a ton of links on "variation of normal" that doesn't require transferring.

 

She'll only be called if the contractions are bad like with DD, because DH cant handle it.  So I think what she was really asking was how long will I tolerate contractions like I had with DD.  I'm not sure that hypnobabies will work if they're like that.  I think I'd need them to gradually get more intense, not start off with a bang!  I might be able to do it with help, I dont know....


selectivevax.gifcd.gifbfinfant.gif & Part-Time EC
zapzipzee is offline  
#9 of 23 Old 02-13-2013, 09:08 AM
 
BlessedJess's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 217
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by zapzipzee View Post

 

I'm in the process of making a very detailed birth plan and transfer plan.  I sent her what I have so far, and a ton of links on "variation of normal" that doesn't require transferring.

 

She'll only be called if the contractions are bad like with DD, because DH cant handle it.  So I think what she was really asking was how long will I tolerate contractions like I had with DD.  I'm not sure that hypnobabies will work if they're like that.  I think I'd need them to gradually get more intense, not start off with a bang!  I might be able to do it with help, I dont know....


I absolutely think you can do it. Practice shock induction once you get into the trance state a few times. You don't need more than a minute to get into a deep trance, so deep not even tender skin lacerations can be felt. You can have someone test your depth of trance by having someone press on your nail bed. If it makes you yelp and shake them off you need to go deeper. You can't even feel pain stimuli.

 

Some people can hit the deepest form of trance, the Esdaile state in just a few seconds. (also known as the hypnotic coma, used for abdominal and open heart surgeries, etc). In that state you cannot respond to commands (speaking or moving yourself) unless you come up a level but you can hear everything, protect yourself and come out of it or return any time you wish.

 

Since you have plenty of time to practice, try practicing daily on your own. Give yourself trigger words or actions to dive down and get deep as fast as possible. Get your mom involved in it if you really plan to use her. She needs to participate in this ahead of time. Study everything you can get your hands on about the Esdaile state. Become the expert and teach your team what not to say and program yourself to dismiss false alarm in people.

 

Don't get hard on yourself, either, if you don't get the Esdaile state right away. It will happen the deeper you go.

 

Also, practice applying anesthesia with your touch. Put the anesthesia on your arm. Then, once you can't feel anything, transfer it to your leg. (it transfers anywhere you want it to, once you implant the feeling) Then somewhere else again. Test it by pinching or poking to see if you feel anything in that spot. Play games with your hypnosis partner to see if you can guess where he/she touched your numb spot. It's funny to see how wrong you are when you are really numb. Remember that each suggestion builds on the first one. So start by getting in a trance, inducing a small amount of numbness or tingling and then tell yourself that the more you touch the spot the number it gets. Keep going until you can't feel anything and do a session everyday. You will only get better at numbing it and quicker at achieving it that way.

 

The reason to practice that form of anesthesia is that you don't have to be in the Esdaile state to block pain. You can be looking around and talking that way. Just be sure to practice and build your skill.

BlessedJess is offline  
#10 of 23 Old 02-13-2013, 01:17 PM - Thread Starter
 
zapzipzee's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Oregon
Posts: 150
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by BlessedJess View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by zapzipzee View Post

 

I'm in the process of making a very detailed birth plan and transfer plan.  I sent her what I have so far, and a ton of links on "variation of normal" that doesn't require transferring.

 

She'll only be called if the contractions are bad like with DD, because DH cant handle it.  So I think what she was really asking was how long will I tolerate contractions like I had with DD.  I'm not sure that hypnobabies will work if they're like that.  I think I'd need them to gradually get more intense, not start off with a bang!  I might be able to do it with help, I dont know....


I absolutely think you can do it. Practice shock induction once you get into the trance state a few times. You don't need more than a minute to get into a deep trance, so deep not even tender skin lacerations can be felt. You can have someone test your depth of trance by having someone press on your nail bed. If it makes you yelp and shake them off you need to go deeper. You can't even feel pain stimuli.

 

Some people can hit the deepest form of trance, the Esdaile state in just a few seconds. (also known as the hypnotic coma, used for abdominal and open heart surgeries, etc). In that state you cannot respond to commands (speaking or moving yourself) unless you come up a level but you can hear everything, protect yourself and come out of it or return any time you wish.

 

Since you have plenty of time to practice, try practicing daily on your own. Give yourself trigger words or actions to dive down and get deep as fast as possible. Get your mom involved in it if you really plan to use her. She needs to participate in this ahead of time. Study everything you can get your hands on about the Esdaile state. Become the expert and teach your team what not to say and program yourself to dismiss false alarm in people.

 

Don't get hard on yourself, either, if you don't get the Esdaile state right away. It will happen the deeper you go.

 

Also, practice applying anesthesia with your touch. Put the anesthesia on your arm. Then, once you can't feel anything, transfer it to your leg. (it transfers anywhere you want it to, once you implant the feeling) Then somewhere else again. Test it by pinching or poking to see if you feel anything in that spot. Play games with your hypnosis partner to see if you can guess where he/she touched your numb spot. It's funny to see how wrong you are when you are really numb. Remember that each suggestion builds on the first one. So start by getting in a trance, inducing a small amount of numbness or tingling and then tell yourself that the more you touch the spot the number it gets. Keep going until you can't feel anything and do a session everyday. You will only get better at numbing it and quicker at achieving it that way.

 

The reason to practice that form of anesthesia is that you don't have to be in the Esdaile state to block pain. You can be looking around and talking that way. Just be sure to practice and build your skill.

Does hypnobabies teach me this?  I'm only on week 3, and just learned self hypnosis and deepening...  I dont feel anything at all when I practice the finger drop thing on my own.... when I listen to the track, I do feel really relaxed and heavy like.   I started early, because I'm unable to do it every day... I dont have alone time and just fall asleep when listening to the affirmations at night....  I think the next week is creating anesthesia, and I'm really looking forward to that!

 

Thanks!


selectivevax.gifcd.gifbfinfant.gif & Part-Time EC
zapzipzee is offline  
#11 of 23 Old 02-14-2013, 01:44 AM
 
sunshinelove's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 462
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
To me, using the phrase "when to call it" is demeaning and a sign that she doesnt take your desire to UC very seriously. I say that because it sounds like she sees what you're planning as just an attempt or a trial run. If she didnt see it this way then she wouldnt be concerning herself with such needless details since she would have faith that you would know if a transfer is needed--going by some arbitrary time schedule is rude and not taking into account many factors that only YOU will be able to assess when the time comes. If i were you, i wouldnt give her the nice, neat, clean answer shes looking for--i would say something vague like "i will know if i need to transfer if or when the time comes." If shes not comfortable with that then let her decide what she wants to do with that. After all, its your birth, not hers.
BlessedJess likes this.

Mama to I (3/11) and pregnant again (3/20/13) love.gif

The richness of life cannot be sold nor bought. --me
sunshinelove is offline  
#12 of 23 Old 02-14-2013, 08:15 AM
 
BlessedJess's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 217
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by zapzipzee View Post

Does hypnobabies teach me this?  I'm only on week 3, and just learned self hypnosis and deepening...  I dont feel anything at all when I practice the finger drop thing on my own.... when I listen to the track, I do feel really relaxed and heavy like.   I started early, because I'm unable to do it every day... I dont have alone time and just fall asleep when listening to the affirmations at night....  I think the next week is creating anesthesia, and I'm really looking forward to that!

 

Thanks!


I am reading a different book with my husband who's audience appears to be doctors and dentists. It's called Hypnotherapy by David Elman. The man worked with obstetricians and has a whole chapter just on that. I like that he reveals the working innards behind hypnosis so you can tell what stage of relaxation you are reaching and how to reach the hypnotic coma, the depth where no suggestion for anesthesia is needed because it comes automatically with that form of trance. And in reality if you know what you are doing you can often reach deep states in just minutes not days.

 

4 days ago I used the trance technique with my husband and set goals to help myself. One of the goals is to make more milk. I use a phrase like "I'm making more abundant milk" and it helps me make more! Mike's weight was starting to stall and in three days since he's put on 4 ounces of weight! More than he did the previous week and a half. He just tripled his birth weight. I also gave myself a light hypnosis or waking suggestion that when I touched my breasts while feeding him or he touched me I would make more milk.

 

Similarly, you can give yourself suggestions to build on during your sessions. I think you've been focusing on building the depth of the trance, which is a good start. I'm sure the listening is helpful if not a complete education. I've never used hypnobabies. But I can say that you sound like you are in a trance when listening. In fact, you may have slipped into the coma state at night prior to sleep, which would be fabulous and very promising. Problem is, if you didn't autosuggest that you would remember everything in the trance you could easily forget what happened. Somewhere inside you are still learning and remember, though. And if you are being observed in that state you can be tested for your depth. That's what I love about the book so far (I'm not done but loving each chapter). You get to learn the ins and outs not just go through canned sessions for one type of effect. There are about as many ways to achieve a trance as there are people.

zapzipzee likes this.
BlessedJess is offline  
#13 of 23 Old 02-14-2013, 08:59 AM
 
phathui5's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Oregon
Posts: 17,474
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
Quote:
DH doesn't want to pay for the midwife if I have no intention of calling her when labor starts (or using her for the birth - My compromise for him wanting to keep her was that I wasn't calling her and if he did, I didn't want to know she was there, she could stay in her car or in the living room.  He then decided there was no point in paying her to do nothing but sit around).

 

I might have missed it in another thread, but have you already told the midwife that you won't be using her? 


Midwife (CPM, LDM) and homeschooling mama to:
13yo ds   10yo dd  8yo ds and 6yo ds and 1yo ds  
phathui5 is offline  
#14 of 23 Old 02-18-2013, 09:45 PM - Thread Starter
 
zapzipzee's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Oregon
Posts: 150
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by phathui5 View Post

Quote:
DH doesn't want to pay for the midwife if I have no intention of calling her when labor starts (or using her for the birth - My compromise for him wanting to keep her was that I wasn't calling her and if he did, I didn't want to know she was there, she could stay in her car or in the living room.  He then decided there was no point in paying her to do nothing but sit around).

 

I might have missed it in another thread, but have you already told the midwife that you won't be using her? 

No.... he keeps changing his mind....  I had terrible contractions with DD (more research I do, the more it sounds like my spine was out of alignment, causing excruciating pain in my lower back/hips during each contraction), and he's afraid it will be like that with this baby and thinks the midwife will be able to stop it from being like that.  So he wants to pay her to be available to come if I have bad contractions again....  That's his latest decision anyway....

 

Sunday on the way home from church, I started having sharp pain on the left side of my lower back/hip...  I tried using the hypnobabies stuff and it took a while but I could get it to stop hurting.  When we got home, my back/sacrum? popped a whole bunch, and I realized I was having braxton hicks or contractions (DH insists it was just BH, I'm not so sure)....  about 45 seconds long and 2.5 minute apart.  Never got closer together or longer (I started timing them after I realized they were really close together).  Now, I think the pains were coming from the contractions, and they were just ending when I thought I was getting the hypnobabies to work....  I ended up taking 1000mg of magnesium and a hot shower (I do not fit in our bath tub....), and they stopped.  BUT, after my back popped a whole bunch, nothing was painful at all... so, my thinking is if I can keep my spine in good shape, I should be good...

 

See the Chiropractor in town next week (they're only open MWF), and am hoping he'll be willing to adjust me while in labor if I have them like with DD....  We'll see!  Wednesday is another MW appt... and I'm going to ask her what she would do for contractions like I had with DD....  I had previously talked about back labor with her, and she just said she does the water postules, which I researched, and sound like they'd work for "typical" back labor, but not for spinal issues....  HOPEFULLY, that will help DH realize there is nothing she can do for what I experienced with DD....  


selectivevax.gifcd.gifbfinfant.gif & Part-Time EC
zapzipzee is offline  
#15 of 23 Old 02-19-2013, 10:40 AM
 
BlessedJess's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 217
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)

I wouldn't discount the hypnobabies work you did just yet, though, because pre-labor is often responsive to a changing physical or mental state. By calming yourself you reduced your catacholamins (or however that's spelled) which in turn stopped the contracting. It's weird but known that pain can cause labor or at least contractions as well as the other way around. So by stopping your pain and calming your mind you could have stopped them. (I learned about the effect of pain last time I was pregnant, I think I learned it from the multiples book I was reading)

 

If you experience other types of pain like the incidental kitchen burn or whatever, use hypnosis on that. Practice on whatever rail pain you encounter and master your reaction/interpretation of the experience. Even banish itches like the typical mosquito bite.

 

Also, I agree about your back. And I feel sympathetic for both of you right now. He just wants a happy birth for you and everybody, it seems to me. Remind him and yourself that all births are different. I'm glad you will be seeing a chiro. I wonder if a back board that you could hang upside down on would help? My fifth birth was painful and hard work for half an hour (posterior) after a breezy simple 4th birth, which shocked my husband and made him feel like birth was a hard experience. But the last one was such a thrill he's really experienced a changed perspective on the process. Sometimes it's hard, sometimes it's easy. I never used a swopper in pregnancy before, maybe that made a big difference. It wasn't pain free but really easy, nothing to make me curse or him to pull his hair out - and quick.

 

 

I had back trouble a lot for years. So bad some days I could barely stand to put one foot in front of another or even roll over in my bed. I got rid of the problem several ways. One, I started keeping my back hyrdaulic systems more hydrated with sodium citrate, two, I started grounding my bed (massive difference instantly) - research the power of grounding, it's real and reduces inflammation, and three I got rid of the last of my pains with a swopper chair. The swopper is so great! Its' perfect for strengthening the core, which you need to keep your back aligned. My husband has had lower back pain for a long time. After sitting on my swopper he had to get one of his own and hasn't had any more pain since. So now I might sometimes feel a little leg/back pain for a few minutes at a time once every couple of weeks - generally due to bad posture combined with dehydration but that's about it. (actually I also started taking pregnenolone supplements which cut down on inflammation and a few other useful natural nutrients that keep up the metabolism.) All those things happened between those two babies that made such a huge impact on my back pain and general quality of life.

 

I've been sharing your situation with my husband and my husband really wants you to read book Your Body's Many Cries for Water F. Batmanghelidj, M.D. because it made such a huge impact for him and others he has shared it with. It covers the causes of back pain relating to dehydration among other things.

BlessedJess is offline  
#16 of 23 Old 02-19-2013, 10:53 AM - Thread Starter
 
zapzipzee's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Oregon
Posts: 150
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by BlessedJess View Post

I wouldn't discount the hypnobabies work you did just yet, though, because pre-labor is often responsive to a changing physical or mental state. By calming yourself you reduced your catacholamins (or however that's spelled) which in turn stopped the contracting. It's weird but known that pain can cause labor or at least contractions as well as the other way around. So by stopping your pain and calming your mind you could have stopped them. (I learned about the effect of pain last time I was pregnant, I think I learned it from the multiples book I was reading)

 

If you experience other types of pain like the incidental kitchen burn or whatever, use hypnosis on that. Practice on whatever rail pain you encounter and master your reaction/interpretation of the experience. Even banish itches like the typical mosquito bite.

 

Also, I agree about your back. And I feel sympathetic for both of you right now. He just wants a happy birth for you and everybody, it seems to me. Remind him and yourself that all births are different. I'm glad you will be seeing a chiro. I wonder if a back board that you could hang upside down on would help? My fifth birth was painful and hard work for half an hour (posterior) after a breezy simple 4th birth, which shocked my husband and made him feel like birth was a hard experience. But the last one was such a thrill he's really experienced a changed perspective on the process. Sometimes it's hard, sometimes it's easy. I never used a swopper in pregnancy before, maybe that made a big difference. It wasn't pain free but really easy, nothing to make me curse or him to pull his hair out - and quick.

 

 

I had back trouble a lot for years. So bad some days I could barely stand to put one foot in front of another or even roll over in my bed. I got rid of the problem several ways. One, I started keeping my back hyrdaulic systems more hydrated with sodium citrate, two, I started grounding my bed (massive difference instantly) - research the power of grounding, it's real and reduces inflammation, and three I got rid of the last of my pains with a swopper chair. The swopper is so great! Its' perfect for strengthening the core, which you need to keep your back aligned. My husband has had lower back pain for a long time. After sitting on my swopper he had to get one of his own and hasn't had any more pain since. So now I might sometimes feel a little leg/back pain for a few minutes at a time once every couple of weeks - generally due to bad posture combined with dehydration but that's about it. (actually I also started taking pregnenolone supplements which cut down on inflammation and a few other useful natural nutrients that keep up the metabolism.) All those things happened between those two babies that made such a huge impact on my back pain and general quality of life.

 

I've been sharing your situation with my husband and my husband really wants you to read book Your Body's Many Cries for Water F. Batmanghelidj, M.D. because it made such a huge impact for him and others he has shared it with. It covers the causes of back pain relating to dehydration among other things.

I will definitely read the book!  I have two aunts with back pain... one takes pain meds, the other finally got off all the pain meds and her back is doing much better.  The one that takes the pain meds, had a failed back surgery... she has shots into her spinal column for it now and walks with a cane, but prior to the surgery, she started with hypnosis...  When I'm done reading I'll pass it on to them!

 

I'm going to look up the "swooper" and get my parents to bring the inversion table up when they come get DD for the weekend....  ;)


selectivevax.gifcd.gifbfinfant.gif & Part-Time EC
zapzipzee is offline  
#17 of 23 Old 02-19-2013, 08:42 PM
 
BlessedJess's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 217
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by zapzipzee View Post

I will definitely read the book!  I have two aunts with back pain... one takes pain meds, the other finally got off all the pain meds and her back is doing much better.  The one that takes the pain meds, had a failed back surgery... she has shots into her spinal column for it now and walks with a cane, but prior to the surgery, she started with hypnosis...  When I'm done reading I'll pass it on to them!

 

I'm going to look up the "swooper" and get my parents to bring the inversion table up when they come get DD for the weekend....  ;)


I'll be glad to tell him that you're getting it. :)

 

 

 

I hope the inversion table can help. Keep us updated on how it works!

BlessedJess is offline  
#18 of 23 Old 02-19-2013, 10:55 PM
 
bannanachild's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 118
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Your DH sounds like mine! He wants nothing to do with hypnobirthing, he wants a midwife, but also wants a happy wife and I won't be happy with a midwife. I'm so glad your mom is stepping up to be your partner. Maybe you could give her some reading suggestions? Birthing From Within might help her to shift a bit in attitude. I thinks it's good to establish limits, but the point of an unassisted home birth is that your are birthing free!

Anyway, sending hugs and support.

Happy mama to two homebirth.jpgwaterbirth.jpg DD's
bannanachild is offline  
#19 of 23 Old 02-20-2013, 04:18 PM - Thread Starter
 
zapzipzee's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Oregon
Posts: 150
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by BlessedJess View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by zapzipzee View Post

I will definitely read the book!  I have two aunts with back pain... one takes pain meds, the other finally got off all the pain meds and her back is doing much better.  The one that takes the pain meds, had a failed back surgery... she has shots into her spinal column for it now and walks with a cane, but prior to the surgery, she started with hypnosis...  When I'm done reading I'll pass it on to them!

 

I'm going to look up the "swooper" and get my parents to bring the inversion table up when they come get DD for the weekend....  ;)


I'll be glad to tell him that you're getting it. :)

 

 

 

I hope the inversion table can help. Keep us updated on how it works!

I dont have back pain now, so I wont know if any of this works until labor....  :(  Does that chair do essentially the same thing as an exercise ball?


selectivevax.gifcd.gifbfinfant.gif & Part-Time EC
zapzipzee is offline  
#20 of 23 Old 02-20-2013, 04:19 PM - Thread Starter
 
zapzipzee's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Oregon
Posts: 150
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by bannanachild View Post

Your DH sounds like mine! He wants nothing to do with hypnobirthing, he wants a midwife, but also wants a happy wife and I won't be happy with a midwife. I'm so glad your mom is stepping up to be your partner. Maybe you could give her some reading suggestions? Birthing From Within might help her to shift a bit in attitude. I thinks it's good to establish limits, but the point of an unassisted home birth is that your are birthing free!

Anyway, sending hugs and support.

Well, we paid the $600 non-refundable fee for the midwife today...  I kept looking at him, hoping he would say something, but he never did.  I just pray he doesn't call her when I'm in labor!

 

 

We discussed back labor and how she deals with it in detail.  Seems like she would handle the labor I had with DD the same way I did, and that didn't work, so my plan for him seeing that there's nothing "special" she can do that we cant, didn't help.  :(  Ugh.


selectivevax.gifcd.gifbfinfant.gif & Part-Time EC
zapzipzee is offline  
#21 of 23 Old 02-21-2013, 05:37 PM
 
BlessedJess's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 217
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by zapzipzee View Post

I dont have back pain now, so I wont know if any of this works until labor....  :(  Does that chair do essentially the same thing as an exercise ball?

I can't remember what the advantage is over the ball, except that you can adjust the height and the firmness of the spring. It also feels less awkward and takes less room. your legs aren't forced away from you, you can perch them under the seat for better control. Oh, and the ball can't swivel side to side the same way so you can do more dynamic postures to work out your core.

 

You need a firmer core I would think, to support your spine and abs under the strain of contractions.

 

I'm thinking there has to be an angle or pose to keep the spine aligned - or a set of muscles that needs reinforcement.

 

... Pain itself causes tension. Tension that can be nullified mentally. I think it's entirely possible that you at least partially counteracted the problems that pain caused last time - you handled the situation with discipline and fearlessness. It takes mental discipline to get into a proper mental state to not fight pain that can't be helped.

 

You have to overcome more than I did in labor. I avoided pain in my 4th labor because all was aligned properly and I entered a birthing trance where I could coach myself to release and relax myself into the peaks of each contraction with water helping to further dull any aches - my spine certainly wasn't getting pulled out of alignment. If it had been I would have needed a deeper trance or very well built up numbing suggestions like the kind needed for deep surgery to get total pain elimination. But even without total pain elimination, just good relaxation will take you farther and make you birth faster.

 

The good thing is that you are experienced. You will go farther because you will remember what soothed, what didn't and won't waste time trying what doesn't work. Plus you will birth faster regardless. Your body is better at it the second time around.

 

"I dont have back pain now, so I wont know if any of this works until labor..."

 

I just wanted to go over that point one more time to see if there's anything we missed.

 

Are you practicing making numbed out spots (on your arm, for example) with your mind and testing that spot? If you are, keep reinforcing that lesson. Make the anesthesia more powerful, deeper and move it around your body. Come up with personal trigger words for implanting numbness into your spine and abdomen. Maybe try using a plain alcohol rub, pretend that it's got a powerful anesthetic in it and have it applied via cotton ball to your skin as a numbing agent. Then test it with a pinprick. Compare it to an area that is not numb. Feeling pain is not failure, by the way, it just is feedback to show you if you need to work on your technique, because you will get it right as you think on it and continue your research. I believe that it can work for you or anybody else who is receptive to the idea.

 

Take advantage of every episode of pain or itching you experience. You also have the excuse to go lie down and rest when in pain anyway even if it's just a finger that's burned because you need to keep your stress hormones under control, so just go lie down and meditate if you can. Or do a waking suggestion you built up during hypnosis. You don't have to be lying down in a trance to trigger old suggestions to work. Whatever seems right to you in the moment.

 

The point is, you can know and you need to know beforehand. By testing with other types of pain. You don't need doubt if you want a powerful effect. And be good to yourself no matter what result you get. You deserve to be happy with your efforts whatever your results are, you are doing the best you can do!

BlessedJess is offline  
#22 of 23 Old 03-14-2013, 08:59 AM
 
A2JC4life's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Posts: 58
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)

To answer the literal original question, I would not set an arbitrary time limit on it. There are concrete things we would consider warning signs of problems - such as those someone mentioned earlier re: cord prolapse, excessive bleeding, etc. - but I wouldn't say that "I will labor at home for x hours at which point I would give up and go to the hospital."

 

With DD, did your water break before or after?  With my first baby, my water breaking was the first sign of labor, and those contractions were pretty severe.  With my next two, my water didn't break 'til transition, and the contractions were much gentler.  I just mention that because maybe it was a factor for you?
 

A2JC4life is offline  
#23 of 23 Old 03-15-2013, 11:12 AM - Thread Starter
 
zapzipzee's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Oregon
Posts: 150
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by A2JC4life View Post

To answer the literal original question, I would not set an arbitrary time limit on it. There are concrete things we would consider warning signs of problems - such as those someone mentioned earlier re: cord prolapse, excessive bleeding, etc. - but I wouldn't say that "I will labor at home for x hours at which point I would give up and go to the hospital."

 

With DD, did your water break before or after?  With my first baby, my water breaking was the first sign of labor, and those contractions were pretty severe.  With my next two, my water didn't break 'til transition, and the contractions were much gentler.  I just mention that because maybe it was a factor for you?
 

My water was broke in the hospital because they started telling me I had to have a c-section.... and I kept saying no to everything.  In hind sight, I shouldn't have allowed it.


selectivevax.gifcd.gifbfinfant.gif & Part-Time EC
zapzipzee is offline  
Reply

Quick Reply
Message:
Drag and Drop File Upload
Drag files here to attach!
Upload Progress: 0
Options

Register Now

In order to be able to post messages on the Mothering Forums forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.
User Name:
If you do not want to register, fill this field only and the name will be used as user name for your post.
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.
Password:
Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.
Email Address:

Log-in

Human Verification

In order to verify that you are a human and not a spam bot, please enter the answer into the following box below based on the instructions contained in the graphic.



User Tag List

Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page


Forum Jump: 

Posting Rules  
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are Off