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#31 of 58 Old 02-25-2005, 06:56 PM
 
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My baby was not interested in nursing right away -- he was too interested in his surroundings. I'm sure that had a lot to do with me retaining the placenta for 2 hours. After that, we *asked* Finn if it was okay to cut the cord and we got the message that it was okay. He didn't seemed bothered by it at all. After we cut the cord, I squatted over a bowl, pinched my nipple very hard... and whoosh! It came right out in one fell swoop! It was quite amazing!!!
SP -- I ate part of the placenta that night. About 10 small bites, thinking "it's just like eating oysters, it's just like eating oysters," :LOL I froze the rest and have been eating a couple of bites every day. For what it's worth, I haven't had any after pains and my bleeding has tapered off quite a bit (after only just a week).

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#32 of 58 Old 02-25-2005, 07:24 PM
 
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wow, cool! you did such an amazing job!! i'm sooo impressed!

Waldorf homeschooling homesteading homebirthing mama to my 2 boys '05 & '10 joy.gif & most amazing wife to my most amazing dh
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#33 of 58 Old 02-25-2005, 08:14 PM - Thread Starter
 
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I have been a vegetarian for almost 20 years and cannot imagine eating the placenta unless of course it is to stop heavy bleeding. I know that all mammals, except we humans, instinctually do consume the placenta. And this makes sense for all sorts of nutritional and "completing the circle of life" reasons. However, the smell of beef and the texture of oysters, in combination is not for me. Are there other options???
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#34 of 58 Old 02-25-2005, 08:32 PM
 
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ah, but as a vegetarian, it may interest you to know that the placenta is the one meat that doesn't involve killing anything to receive it. oftentimes, this is the main reason why some vegetarians DO eat it.
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#35 of 58 Old 02-25-2005, 09:32 PM
 
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juts to clarify..
doulas are often trained in childbirth, anyone can be a doula, but there certainly are training courses with varrying amounts of info..
I work as a doula.. i trained for almost 10 years, taking several doula courses to start -as well as more than one course in midwifery, and being a midwives' apprentice.. and worked as a parcticum assisting midwives in deliveries....
I opt not to be a midwife as where I live midwifery care is legislated by the govt and i simply can not legally practice, and the education here is very medicallized, and I find attending births as a support person is where i am serving mothers and families best....
it is true not all doulas are trained in childbirth.. but many are...
i know not the topic.. but i did just want to say that..
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#36 of 58 Old 02-25-2005, 11:27 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jenna_brownson
I was advised by a doula that if the placenta is not out within five minutes that the cord should be pulled on gently to detach it from the uterus. She said that if this is not done then the cervix closes up and the retained placenta needs to be removed surgically. My thought about this is the "pulling" is an intervention that leads to the subsequent intervention of "surgery". Additionally, the thought of going to the hospital after a successful UC to have a retained placenta removed is terrible to me. Jenna
my advice is to stop talking to this doula, she does not know enough about normal birth. This sounds like a hospital protocol-- I don't know a homebirth midwife that would do this even the most aggressive usually wait for 3 contractions- 15 minutes and a separation gush-- now if a placenta is on the heels of a baby then it is out in less than 5 minutes no tugging, thats just how it goes, but most are not like this they take longer. I haven't looked at the thread Pam mentioned but I am sure she will have some excellent advice there on this subject.
I have had some placentas that were not detached and they stayed in a long very long time if there is no bleeding and the top of the uterus is not enlarging leave it alone don't pull on it- because you are well and stable and not bleeding inside or out.
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#37 of 58 Old 02-25-2005, 11:27 PM
 
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Now having read the wisdom contained in the discussion, I am wondering about our cord options. I'd figured that once the baby was born, we would wait until the cord stopped pulsating and then clamp at 1.5 to 2.0 inches from the baby's body, as recommended by the pediatrician. I also had assumed that the placenta would come out within a short time, i.e. a couple of minutes to up to, maybe, 10 minutes. Clearly, from the experience of some who have posted on this thread, the placenta does, and can, remain in utero for a while.
My shortest wait for the placenta to come out naturally was 1/2 hour, and my longest was 1.25 hours, but I've heard of the placenta not coming out for many hours with no ill effects. As for the cord -- I generally advise waiting until after the placenta comes out to cut, and also for a good long while after it becomes cold and limp. But with my two UCs I decided to cut before the placenta was out -- although I was sure that it had already detached (which is another interesting subject) -- and it was fine.

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I was advised by a doula that if the placenta is not out within five minutes that the cord should be pulled on gently to detach it from the uterus. She said that if this is not done then the cervix closes up and the retained placenta needs to be removed surgically.
Ack ack ack! Nooooo! No no no. (Did I put that strongly enough? :LOL ) There is such a thing as retained placenta, but it's not going to happen because cord traction wasn't done five minutes after the birth, in fact it's more likely to happen with cord traction because if the placenta is not ready to detach fully, it won't, only part of it will pull off and part of it will be retained. This doesn't nocessarily mean that it will then have to be removed surgically, but it certainly makes problems like hemorrhaging more likely. Also, the cervix is not going to close up five minutes after the birth. The body knows that the placenta is still in there and just like it takes time to get the baby out, it takes time to get the placenta out, and it is not going to take the same amount of time for everybody, just like birth does not take the same amount of time for everybody.
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#38 of 58 Old 02-25-2005, 11:43 PM
 
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"However, the smell of beef and the texture of oysters, in combination is not for me. Are there other options???"

Yes. You can dry the placenta, grind it, and encapsulate it. I have a recipe for doing this that I would like to post, but it will take me some time to find it as I am in the midst of switching computer systems and everything is kind of chaotic. But we've discussed it so many times at MDC, I'm sure if you do a search you'll be able to find something.

Also, if you want to take advantage of the placenta right after the birth but can't stand the thought of ingesting it, you can cut off a sliver and put it under your tongue. Also, you don't have to chew it. You could just swallow a piece with some sort of fluid, like you would a pill.

FWIW, I haven't actually tasted placenta myself so I can't vouch for the texture and taste, but I can say that it smelled nothing like beef to me. In fact I don't really remember it having a smell at all, except for the faint smell of blood. I dislike handling dead animal flesh, but didn't have a problem with my placenta at all, in fact I thought it was lovely. It's just a completely different thing.
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#39 of 58 Old 02-26-2005, 12:21 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hawkfeather
juts to clarify..
doulas are often trained in childbirth, anyone can be a doula, but there certainly are training courses with varrying amounts of info..
I work as a doula.. i trained for almost 10 years, taking several doula courses to start -as well as more than one course in midwifery, and being a midwives' apprentice.. and worked as a parcticum assisting midwives in deliveries....
I opt not to be a midwife as where I live midwifery care is legislated by the govt and i simply can not legally practice, and the education here is very medicallized, and I find attending births as a support person is where i am serving mothers and families best....
it is true not all doulas are trained in childbirth.. but many are...
i know not the topic.. but i did just want to say that..
So you're saying that you are a doula with childbirth training. But training as a doula does not generally include childbirth instruction. Isn't a doula a support person for the laboring mother and not a trained childbirth attendant? Maybe I should ask the Penny Simkin office. heh. I called them today by mistake when looking for a post partum doula.
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#40 of 58 Old 02-26-2005, 12:33 AM
 
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Kate--Girl that rawks. Now tell me honestly how the placenta really tastes and all

Jenna--There is anothe roption aside from th eones posted above and thats to make a tincture from it. badically you soak a chunk of the placenta in vodka and water and take a few drops under your tongue (similar to bachs rescue remedy). Let me go hunt up the link on exactly how to do this since this si what i have been considering myself. I just haven;t gotten to the point where I think I could honestly consume my placenta.
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#41 of 58 Old 02-26-2005, 12:38 AM
 
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Ok i think I am going to cry my link has gone missing on how to prepare the placenta tincture and a google search is coming up with nothing
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#42 of 58 Old 02-26-2005, 02:24 AM
 
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i would like to have info about a placenta tincture too...i doubt i could eat it., more than a small bite in case of bleeding or something..but i am not too sure if i could staomch a meal of placenta.. i assume with the tincture you can make it as said just putting the placenta in some vodka and letting it sit (fridge i guess)..also drying and encapsulating it is probably my personal fave option so far...i am just honestly not to sure how i would do with it raw and cooking it would leech out some of the goodness..but i am very into hearing more ideas!!

..and on the doula thing.. i don't know if i would say a doula dosen't have childbirth training.. they generally don't have medical training.. and perhaps it is just my own belief on birth in general.. but to me the mother is the one doing the work, birthing, delivering, aside from emergant situations.. so i guess in my opinion a good birth attendant is a support person first and fore most no matter what they choose to call themselves, and birth is not automatically a medical situation...but learning the emotional, mental and phsycial aspects of birth which most pro doula training includes would be to be childbirth training...not sure where the line gets drawn about how much you need to know to be a trained in childbirth as some of the best midwives I have worked with learned by attending births without formal training...it is an interesting subject though..the difference between childbirth knowledge and medical knowledge..
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#43 of 58 Old 02-28-2005, 12:56 AM
 
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Great thread! I was concerned about cord problems as they preformed an emergency C-section on my mom because the cord was around my neck. (I always wondered if I was far enough down that they could feel the cord, why was it more beneficial to go through the process of a C-section rather than to just let my come out on my own?) Glad to here I can just leave it alone and problems are rare.

What about massaging your stomach to get the placenta out and to contract the uterus? The doctor that I had with my hospital birth did this really hard, skin-pulling massage that was almost as bad as the contractions. I told him that it was pulling on my stretch marks and he said he needed it to be hard to get the uterus to expel the placenta and to contract down. It just seemed unecessary to me and it hurt!

Mom to two boys, ages 8 and 11, and one blessing due May 8th.

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#44 of 58 Old 02-28-2005, 02:41 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by heldt123
Great thread! I was concerned about cord problems as they preformed an emergency C-section on my mom because the cord was around my neck. (I always wondered if I was far enough down that they could feel the cord, why was it more beneficial to go through the process of a C-section rather than to just let my come out on my own?) Glad to here I can just leave it alone and problems are rare.
While there are a rare few babies that have cord wraps that interfere with baby descending, this is pretty rare. Some docs just say that and leave it at that, and women carry around the story about the scary cord around the neck. Do you know the story of your birth? Was there a problem with you descending? Bad heart tones? Was her labor drugged in any way?

Quote:
What about massaging your stomach to get the placenta out and to contract the uterus? The doctor that I had with my hospital birth did this really hard, skin-pulling massage that was almost as bad as the contractions. I told him that it was pulling on my stretch marks and he said he needed it to be hard to get the uterus to expel the placenta and to contract down. It just seemed unecessary to me and it hurt!
By massaging the uterus before the placenta detaches, you run the risk of it partially separating, which is really risky and dangerous (except, of course, when you have a surgeon between your legs! :LOL). Women naturally hold the baby to their breast in such a way that their arm and /or the baby sits on the top of the uterus. This pressure is all the body needs - nothing more, no pushing on the placenta, etc.
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#45 of 58 Old 02-28-2005, 05:48 AM
 
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The wisdom you ladies contains really overwhelms me -- I really get a high reading all your opinions, experiences, and feelings.

As a DONA-certified birth doula, I can tell you I would no more offer advice to a couple planning a UC birth than try to tell a monkey how to fly a plane. Not that I am comparing the two (monkeys to UCers ), but they are both out of my realm of knowledge.

As a doula who holds a great interest in the actual birthing process, I find I am usually up at the woman's head, offering love and support, and not so often seeing the fabulous arrival of her baby . Oh well, that's the price! But, my point in mentioning that is for all the videos, actual births, books, etc., I have collected in my brain, and the accumulation of information I have gotten through training to be a doula and even as a birthing mother myself, I would never feel qualified offering this kind of information to UCers.

For all intents and purposes, doulas are not trained in medical techniques or delivery assistance or practices. For me to offer that information would be to go against the code of ethics and standards of practice I have committed to uphold.

This is also the reason I would not ever attend a UC birth -- I don't want to be the one in the room who knows the most about the birth process!

While I support a family's right to choose an informed UC, sadly, I would never find myself there unless it were truly unintentional.

I realize there are other doula programs out there, but to offer delivery assistance/birthing information -- that is not within the realm of a doula's role. Please, seek out more credible sources before hanging your hat on a doula's opinion (unless she happens to also be a midwife!).

I will be excited to hear how these births go! Good luck, Mamas!
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#46 of 58 Old 02-28-2005, 06:41 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pamamidwife
While there are a rare few babies that have cord wraps that interfere with baby descending, this is pretty rare. Some docs just say that and leave it at that, and women carry around the story about the scary cord around the neck. Do you know the story of your birth? Was there a problem with you descending? Bad heart tones? Was her labor drugged in any way?
Honestly, I don't know all the specifics as I wasn't raised by my mom (she told me some about it not too long ago, but I don't remeber if she had an epidural or any other meds). There has always been that story that the cord was around my neck and that's all I can remember. I think the fetal monitor showed a decreased heart rate as well. I think she was in labor for like 12 hours or something, so I'm not sure if there was difficulties in my descending or not. My mom was quite young at the time and probably just let the doctors do their thing. It does put a bit of fear in my mind that something "could" happen.

Pam, I wish you lived up here and could attend my birth! You are soo nice and really seem to know what you are doing.

Mom to two boys, ages 8 and 11, and one blessing due May 8th.

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#47 of 58 Old 02-28-2005, 06:49 PM
 
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Jumping in, haven't read all the posts, but concerning the placenta tincture.... I read a mwife who said that a small small piece of placenta in the blender with tomato juice will stop hemorrage in it's tracks. It's also supposed to be virtually untastable. Just my 2c worth!!
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#48 of 58 Old 02-28-2005, 07:21 PM
 
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Aha! I found the link last night for the placenta tincture :-)

http://www.unhinderedliving.com/placentaessence.html
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#49 of 58 Old 02-28-2005, 08:45 PM
 
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Originally Posted by heldt123
There has always been that story that the cord was around my neck and that's all I can remember. I think the fetal monitor showed a decreased heart rate as well. I think she was in labor for like 12 hours or something, so I'm not sure if there was difficulties in my descending or not. My mom was quite young at the time and probably just let the doctors do their thing. It does put a bit of fear in my mind that something "could" happen..
So cords are around alot of baby's necks , shoulders arms, heads. they are fine but I have heard so many scary cord stories, it is like some sort of urban/medical myth. i think that doctors just tell people something about the "cord" so that it won't be their fault it is some innate flaw of the baby's -- the blame the victim situation. If a doctor was honest with you -- ok I am due to go on vacation or I am being sued by 5 people and my malpractice has gone up and I am not going to take a chance on my judgment anymore or the nurse's assessment so we will just do the maximum thing and you will not be able to sue me and everybody gets paid more ta boot-- now would you really consent to a surgery after that?
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#50 of 58 Old 02-28-2005, 09:38 PM - Thread Starter
 
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From Post #45: "This is also the reason I would not ever attend a UC birth -- I don't want to be the one in the room who knows the most about the birth process!"

I too am trained as a doula (DONA) and feel as though my own research into homebirth and the information I have personally sought out since making the decision to have an unassisted homebirth far, far outweighs any formalized training to become a doula.

I have to admit that I think your statement about being the most knowledgeable person in the room is a bit pretentious. I think that the birthing mother, with her gestational experience, biological link to the baby, and natural instict is the most knowledgeable person in the room.

Part of my experience in coming to the conclusion to have an unassisted homebirth is based upon the feedback that the Yahoo doula group I belong to provided when I asked the members of the group if anyone knew of doulas who attend homebirths. The majority of responses ranged from fear to outright harsh judgment of the family's choice to homebirth in this way. Only a handful of doulas were compassionate in honoring the choice. But even this small, small group put in their CYA policy-line that they would provide no medical treatment or clinical intervention. Hello...that's exactly why family's that choose to have unassisted homebirths: to avoid treatments and interventions. After the issue had been fully and overly discussed, I came away from it feeling less supported by a group that touts itself as being "professional labor support specialists". In fact, the disclaimers of responsibility sounded much like what the medical community might say in response to the unassisted homebirth choice, e.g. discouraging at best.

I would never assume that I know more about birth than the person actually birthing and wonder how others feel that this is a fair conclusion.
Regards,
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#51 of 58 Old 02-28-2005, 10:14 PM
 
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i dunno why the doula thing is even being discussed.. i guess becasue a doula gave out some bad advice??..oh well I loose track easy..
to me a doula may not be trained in medicl birthing.. but more importantly I don't think birth is a medical event....i think if anything medical traingin can hinder certain experinces.. when it comes to taking advice.. I woudn't say I would be *more* likley to be taking it from someone with meical experince about childbirth...even those with medical training in birth ar generallly sharing theri opinion.. i don't personally think it matter who has what training or what the means or where they got it.. most adive will very sometimes wildly, i think what is most important is allowing mothers to trust theselves...
we all seek out advice, nothing wrong with that.. but most answers are within i find.
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#52 of 58 Old 03-01-2005, 12:22 AM
 
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Jenna, I was not trying to be pretentious in any manner. My point was to say I barely know anything about actually assisting a birth, you know? But legally, if something went wrong, unless the parents were doctors, paramedics, RNs, etc., who would be the one most easily held liable? The one most easily charged with practicing medicine without a license? That was my point.

Believe me, all the UCers I have known have been nothing but heavily educated (most of the time self-educated) about birth. I am just saying, I would never be present as a doula at a UC birth because of the possible legal situations one might find herself in if anything went wrong.

I am not saying at all that I have this vast, working knowledge of the inner-workings of a birth. But as a trained and certified doula, it could very easily fall to me as the only one with legitimate documented training in any area regarding birth -- that's all I meant.

*humbly*
Stacie
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#53 of 58 Old 03-01-2005, 01:07 AM
 
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Originally Posted by heldt123
Pam, I wish you lived up here and could attend my birth! You are soo nice and really seem to know what you are doing.
You already know what you need to do for your birth!

I wish I could see more MDC mamas in real life!
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#54 of 58 Old 03-01-2005, 03:20 AM
 
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My oldest daughter's cord had to be cut immediately at the moment of her birth but that was because she had the cord tightly wrapped around her nech FOUR times - talk about frightening for a first time mom! I am so grateful to my Dr. for not giving up on my vaginab birth and rusing to C/S when her heart tones decelled when I rolled off of my left side. I was something of an "urban legend" during my stay at the hospital as they had not had a "Nuchal Cord x 4" in dozens of years! I was just glad to have a beautiful healthu baby and didn't give a care to anything else!
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#55 of 58 Old 03-02-2005, 06:22 PM
 
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as for placenta recipes...i read one on mdc that sounds good for vegetarians who question their ability to consume what they associate with "killed" meat. it's a simple smoothie of strawberries (then the red is from the fruit, not the placenta, at least mentally), banana, and apple juice. the woman that posted making this said she froze more in paper cups and at it over the days following the birth.

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#56 of 58 Old 03-02-2005, 10:14 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Stacie, (post #52) I apoligize.

My emotions were a little bit wacky.

Our son was born today, in our bedroom, into the hands of his father.

It was great.

However, I have a question for the group:
Hello-
We tried to make placenta essence.
Here is what we did: We took several large pieces of the placenta and placed it into a 50% vodka and 50% distilled H2O solution. (It was supposed to be only distilled H2O. This mixture has just finished sitting in bright light (sunlight and then lamp light) for four hours as the recipre indicated.

Of course, now I have just reread the recipe and realized that we did not follow the directions properly.

Does anyone know if we "killed" the good properties of the placenta by soaking it in the vodka or is it still viable?
I'll store it anyhow.
Regards,
Jenna
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#57 of 58 Old 03-02-2005, 10:23 PM
 
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Greetings,
All 5 of my children had their cords around their necks.. DD #1 worse then the others and ended with the c/s.. he had it 3X and around his arm also.. anyway.. The cord was clamped and cut before birth of body with # 2 & 3.. with both DD (HBAC) the cord was not clamped or cut until after birth.. my last birth the cord was around her neck and when taken from around her neck it was about 5 inches outside of the canal.. my midwife told me. "HER CORD IS ALREADY OUT CASEY, I NEED THIS BABY OUT NOW TOO" I will never forget them words.. I had done so much research on prolapsed cords and the feeling I got from her words made me push as hard as I could.. DD was perfect and breathing well... so I say, be causious.. do what you feel is safe..
best of luck
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#58 of 58 Old 03-06-2005, 05:18 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jenna_brownson
Stacie, (post #52) I apoligize.

My emotions were a little bit wacky.

Our son was born today, in our bedroom, into the hands of his father.

It was great.

However, I have a question for the group:
Hello-
We tried to make placenta essence.
Here is what we did: We took several large pieces of the placenta and placed it into a 50% vodka and 50% distilled H2O solution. (It was supposed to be only distilled H2O. This mixture has just finished sitting in bright light (sunlight and then lamp light) for four hours as the recipre indicated.

Of course, now I have just reread the recipe and realized that we did not follow the directions properly.

Does anyone know if we "killed" the good properties of the placenta by soaking it in the vodka or is it still viable?
I'll store it anyhow.
Regards,
Jenna

OOOH, Congratulations! Enjoy your baby moon! I look forward to reading the story if one is written!

The tincture will still work.. it takes the "essence" from the placenta.. the energy patterns, if you will. The more you shake it, the more refined it will become, and some say, more potent. So store it and use it as needed.

Mum to DS (8yrs), DD (6yrs), and DS(3.5yrs). kid.gif

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