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Choosing not to get a birth certificate at all...

56K views 218 replies 75 participants last post by  merefnq 
#1 ·
A SUPPORT ONLY THREAD FOR THOSE INTERESTED IN THE TOPIC HAS BEEN CREATED IN FINDING YOUR TRIBE. IT IS TITLED LIVING DOCUMENT FREE.

Reading through posts here I've seen a lot of women asking questions about what is needed to get a birth certificate for their baby after having a home birth or unassisted birth. I'm a pretty alternative minded creature... I'd hazard to guess that many on the board are... I have many personal beliefs that have led me down the path of not getting a birth certificate for this child at all. I wasn't as "informed" after the birth of my son, but this time around I definitely feel like it's the right thing to do. I'm curious if any other families here have done the same thing, or have thought about the option. Is there anything that you needed to do(I know these things can vary widely from place to place) in lieu of having a birth certificate?

I know that it is not "illegal" to not have one, but if there is anyone out there that could share their experiences, I'd love to hear! How did it effect your lives? Did it make finding health care(I'm one to stick to "alternative health care" anyway) hard? Has there been times that not having a BC for your child has impeded anything serious?

I'm open to anyone's insight and opinions here. Thanks.
 
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#178 ·
Regarding land and taxes- OT- in Canada, you have to register purchased land, so there's no disappearing that way, but just as a side note, if you don't want to pay taxes and don't mind the gov't knowing where you live, then there are grant programs for any land that is the natural habitat or roaming territory of any endangered species- plant or animal and especially if a portion of the land is wetland. There is a limit to how many buildings can be placed on it, but if you are willing to comply with some small-ish regulations, then there is a way to not have to pay those nasty taxes and then live as you wish, if you don't want to have to live on fiat money.

In that way, you really could live by bartering, working your own land, being otherwise self-sufficient, and not have to 'get a job'.

Of course, you'd have to have a BC to do that, at least one person in the family, in Canada anyway. There might be programs that are similar in the United States as well, but I've never looked into that.

Ooooo, a 'benefit' to registration...

My perspective has changed now to be that since I have no inherent rights in Canada, I will use every 'benefit' that I can to make the life we want and not accept any critisism for doing so. I will be abreast of the legislations, acts and gov't activities and completely take the most advantage I possibly can of those, within the scope of not causing myself or family 'trouble'.

My hands are tied, so I guess I'm released of responsibility to decide much- it's already been done and if I don't want to be dragged to jail or worse, lose my children, then this is what I have to do. In a way, I am defeated, but in a way, I actually feel completely free to do as I please without having to abide any loyalty. It's sort of an attitude of "Okay, since you have me, an actual slave compelled to act by your 'law', this is what I'm taking in return, and however completely inadequate that is, I'll make it to my best advantage and *&%$ you."

I can live with that I suppose. I would, however, the second it was possible, free myself and children, but until and unless that becomes possible, we will live peacefully as it is.
 
#179 ·
"Regarding land and taxes- OT- in Canada, you have to register purchased land, so there's no disappearing that way, but just as a side note, if you don't want to pay taxes and don't mind the gov't knowing where you live, then there are grant programs for any land that is the natural habitat or roaming territory of any endangered species- plant or animal and especially if a portion of the land is wetland. There is a limit to how many buildings can be placed on it, but if you are willing to comply with some small-ish regulations, then there is a way to not have to pay those nasty taxes and then live as you wish, if you don't want to have to live on fiat money"

One problem w/this is that regulations can change drastically from year to year. They may eventually outlaw private gardens(too much water needed to sustain), private wells(cannot meter and charge for the water accurately), your home(changing code or discovering a new type of endangered animal).
 
#180 ·
Still


Quote:

Originally Posted by Usually Curious View Post
One problem w/this is that regulations can change drastically from year to year. They may eventually outlaw private gardens(too much water needed to sustain), private wells(cannot meter and charge for the water accurately), your home(changing code or discovering a new type of endangered animal).
This is likely true in many regions, but where I live, it is possible to just disappear in the woods. The only thing the gov't does here is waterbomb fires and ticket Americans who catch more fish than they're allowed. I wasn't clear that to do this, you have be in a very remote area- many who do live up here don't drill wells because we have an enormous amount of water everywhere, running and still, but all alive and teeming with fish to the point that it is possible to pull them out by hand (at many times during the warmer seasons). Yeah, you'd have to be fine with living very far away from amenities- NOBODY is going to want to have to run lines up here for anything, even the gov't- they could never recover the true cost if they did, so I doubt it would happen.

Nobody pays for well-water in Ontario... are you from Canada? Also, nobody regulates private collection of water for personal use in the north of Ontario. I don't think it would be possible to make any impact lasting more than a millisecond on the water supply up here. Have a look at northern Ontario on a map- there's almost the same amount of blue as green, if not more. Most of Canada has much more water than we could ever consume or use, which is why our gov't exports it for profit- there's just so much!

Also, to do this, you would likely have to live in an 'unorganised territory,' so there are no building codes. If the territory became organised for some reason (hoards of people decided to suddenly come and live up here- not likely), then there would be codes, but if it's not prime cottage land (so choose carefully), they grandfather for those who've already built.

You'd have private roads that you would have to build yourself, water either from a drilled well or running water (which is potable here without boiling), solar or wind generated energy, and there is no shortage of endangered species to keep the tax grant coming. The list increases every year, even with a few animals dropping off from successful captive-bred releases.

I think if I am going to consider buying land, and I want to be remote and I don't want to have to use fiat money, this is the best option to explore. If I want a house on a lot in the city, this is not possible since the point is that the land is protected by the 'owner' from undue or excessive use or impediment to those creatures who rely upon it.

In any case, if things change and make it so that I'd have to reinstate my participation in fiat-land, then I'll adjust. I doubt I'd have to for a few decades at least, though.

By the way, I am not doing this currently, just looking into it. And enjoying it too
 
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#182 ·
In other words...

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I can respect off the grid living. I can even respect people who choose to live completely and utterly outside of mainstream culture, who don't register their kids for birth certificates or school, who never take a penny of government assistance and who live completely under the tax radar through barter/homesteading (though it's illegal). If it's part of a greater, all-encompassing philosophy to revert to what is essentially a mid-19th century life, then good for them.

But don't claim to live that life and then get a cell phone . Or have cable modems and post on the Internet while explaining your empassioned reasons why not registering your child with the state is worthwhile. Don't NOT pay taxes--but then use roads, emergency services for the moment when your husband cuts his arm off with the chainsaw, or call the cops when your car (car? why would you own a car if you're living a mid-19th century life?) is stolen.

If you choose to live completely outside of the government structure, then don't cherry pick and try to defend your choices as if you're an absolutist. Because you're not.
 
#183 ·
Quote:
No, but where I see the lack of one having an impact in that aspect is that my child will be completely free of government interference during their formative years. That means that they can learn and go in whatever direction they desire... No need to follow anyone's guidelines as to what they "ought to know". I think this will more likely lead to my child knowing what they REALLY want to do, versus finding what pays the most for doing the least or taking the first thing that comes along because they are desperate, whatever. Yeah I'm homeschooling
I think what you actually mean is "my child will be completely free of anyone's influence but mine during their formative years. That means that they can learn and go in whatever direction I deem appropriate... No need to follow anyone's guidelines aand teach them things I don't want them to know."

You're just trying to control your kid's lives to the nth degree and hoping that that will make them turn out the way you want them. Well, I have news for you - whether your daughter brings her new black girlfriend home for Thanksgiving and asks for a floritarian meal, or your son arrives home in a pin-striped suit with a soccer mom on his arm and proceeds to Ezzo-ify their child in your lounge whilst discussing the latest stock trends, they're still you're kids, and you can't control them forever. Sooner or later you have to let go, whether it's allowing them to get a driver's licence or standing back to let them go down the slide on their own.

Quote:
Originally Posted by StrongBeliever
Instead of getting a job the way everyone else does, couldn't it my unregistered un-numbered child waltz into any place of employment that they desire and make a concerted effort to blow the socks off of the boss with their knowledge and additude? And when the big man at top is drooling all over himself to have such a capable and interesting person coming to them for work, wanting them to be a part of their business, couldn't my child say "Well, heres the thing..." and they could work something out? Some info for all of you... It is not a required to have a SSN to work! Yeah, it's true that most places won't hire you without one, but it isn't necessary. Identification, on the other hand is needed, but there are alternative ways to settle that as well.
In a word, no. Have you got any idea of the penalties THEY face for having an undocumented worker?

It's not required to have an SSN to work, but you do need an ITIN, and proof that you are authorised to work (ever read SS cards that say "not evidence of authority to work"?)

And, FTR, I'd say being eligible to work in any place would make you much more likely to find an enjoyable and satisfying job than havign to settle for only the places that will hire illegal immigrants.

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Since 1987, employers have been required by law to verify that every employee they hire is entitled to work in the United States. Compliance requires that an I-9 Employment Eligibility Verification form be completed for each and every new hire. Significant fines and penalties can be imposed on those who knowingly hire illegal immigrants or permit them to work after discovering that they are not legal. What's more, the failure to document compliance, even if all your employees are legal, can result in penalties being assessed.

[the I-9] also requires the employee to attest to being: a citizen; a permanent resident (a/k/a "green card" holder) or an alien authorized to work through a certain date, which must be signed and dated by the employee.

In the second section, the Employer is required to review and verify documentation which establishes both the identity of the employee and their entitlement to work in the United States. This can be accomplished by viewing a single document such as a U.S. passport or a green card, or through a combination of documents, the most common being a driver's license (to establish identity) and an unrestricted social security card (to establish employment eligibility).
Apologies, Strongbeliever, but you've obviously never had to actually notice how often you flash your ID, or what that ID actually says. Yes, you can have an ITIN instead of an SSN, but your SS card is evidence you're eligible to work. Without that you must provide evidence of eligibility to work - for your child with only an ITIN that will be evidence of citizenship. Well, except you can't get an ITIN if you're eligible for an SSN.

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Now, what if you register a birth and the state decides to mandate vaccinations? What if a military draft is reinstituted? What if the state requires that we subject our children to its educational standards?
Ever heard of moving? If you're hating where you live, go somewhere with less government. I hear Sierra leone is pretty much in Anarchy. No big brother looking over your shoulder there.

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Um... you do know that you're not exactly invisible to THE MAN when you're posting on the internet, perhaps on your own computer, with your unique ISP, right?
Noooo, surely they're smart enough to know to sit outside a house with an unsecured wireless connection to log for this sort of seditious discussion.
 
#184 ·
We actually are a very short way from requiring a SS # to work, it's in the immigration bill that they are trying to shove down our throats right now.

And no, your child will not blow the socks off of a corporate anybody when you consider the consequences they'd pay for hiring an undocumented worker. That is just the real world.
 
#185 ·
Quote:

Originally Posted by Usually Curious View Post
We actually are a very short way from requiring a SS # to work, it's in the immigration bill that they are trying to shove down our throats right now...
Like I said before I-9 and 1099. Many employers tired of their legal and financial obligations to their employees, "hire" them as independent contractors. Lots of computer programmers and outside salespeople are independent contractors. I assume if you've used the phone book to called a plumber to fix your sink you've didn't ask him to see his SS card or green card. This is because he's an independent contractor, not your temporary employee. The obligation to pay income and soc sec taxes are all on him, not on you.

Change of topic:
The reason I came back to this thread was because I saw this article that made me chuckle.

84-year-old man drove 67 years without license
Wed Jun 20, 2007 11:19AM EDT

AMSTERDAM (Reuters) - An 84-year-old Dutch driver astonished police this week when he admitted during a random check that not only was his car uninsured but he had been driving without a license for 67 years.

Dutch media said Wednesday the man had escaped detection because he had never got a speeding ticket or been involved in a crash.

The man promised police he would ditch his car, which had also never been put through a vehicle safety test, reports added.
 
#186 ·
*chuckles* Tani... Have you READ this thread?

Wannabe...
So, let me get this straight... Any parent who trusts themselves over others to teach their OWN children is trying to warp and control them? Get a grip. While I do have things I'd like to impress upon my children, mostly things I know they have a snowball's chance in hell of learning if I left it up to someone else, I have no intention of "controlling" every aspect of their learning process nor do I want to limit them. If you would READ what I write and UNDERSTAND it, you would see that clearly. Since you haven't seemed to notice yet, I'll fill you in... FREEDOM IS MY TOP PRIORITY. My child's ability to make their own choices is paramount in my desires for them. Whatever they want to be, who ever they grow into, I will always love them and respect them. Shitty of you to imply otherwise. Shame on you.

Again, a bazillion and one technicalities to show that it cannot be done. *sigh* Have fun with that. If you can't get out of the mode that things can ONLY work the way the government says they will, then I don't know what more to say to you.

While I would like to stick around and show you all that freedom can be had, if only you are willing to FIGHT for it, I've got better things to do than expend my energy here slitting hairs over rather insignificant bits and pieces. Hopefully you all will be willing to see and hear the truth should it ever cross your path.
 
#187 ·
Throughout this thread there have been what seems like diametrically opposed views about registering one's children.

A Summary

Those who oppose have, in general, expressed a desire for the realisation of the innate freedom of every human being; these are the ladies who are open to their children making ultimate choices whenever dc are ready, but not before, and view what others consider 'inconvenience' or 'hardship' from the perspective that no convenience is worth the sacrifice of choice. Also, that no individual should be subject to enforcement of the choices of a mass or government in their private affairs (the scope of which is a personal choice as well). Many of these ladies uphold concepts and the innate recognition recorded in documents such as the Declaration of Independence and the Universal Declaration of Human Rights. Many of these ladies believe that the gov't has overstepped appropriate bondaries of governing a country by regulating aspects of their private lives in a way that hinders their overall choice, peace and enjoyment in some way. Many also believe in the innate competence and goodness of the individual human being as well as it's capacity to make choices that incidentally and/or consciously benefit others.

Those who advocate for registration have, in general, expressed a desire for organisation, order and fitting in for the sake of ease of living; these are the ladies who have opposed delayed or non-registration because they view this as potentially harmful, that it might or would cause what they view as undue stress and difficulty in their dc's lives, and "exclusion from society, favour or common priviledges (OED, ostracise, 2.)", so they make the choice for them. Many of these ladies uphold legislation that they believe supports the overall goals of the members of society which they presume to include such ideals as contentment, security of person, property and country as well as entitlement to benefits that they believe contribute to the 'greater good.' Many of these ladies believe that it is appropriate for the government to enforce any 'reasonable' measure necessary to protect and defend them and their country, that the decisions the gov't makes concerning the individual are generally in good faith, despite some oddities and mistakes as well as all-out fiascoes- these have minimal impact on a 'wholistic' view of the gov't and it's role.

Both 'sides' have expressed strong opinions on the issues, and while I do have a strong opinion of my own, I can see clearly that those who have put effort into their responses have done so from a position of having considered what they think is relevant to their lives and those of their dc.
That said, I have no reason to believe that anyone here has the intention to control another human being.

*I know that I have generalised, so if there are mamas whose opinions do not fit perfectly into the generalisation, please don't be offended- my opinion doesn't fit my generalisation perfectly either; I thought it was necessary to clarify the ends of the spectrum, however, since some have come to the thread misunderstanding the core issues involved in the discussion.

Wannabe, it does seem odd to me that you have chosen from the perspective of advocating for registration, a platform of freedom of choice, given that in registering a child, you have made a rather significant choice for him/her already (to ease their life in terms of employment and receipt of gov't benefits- you didn't ask the child if he/she wanted those did you? You assumed that dc would, based upon your own perspective, which is what you have opposed in those who choose not to register). Those who choose not register are not making that choice for their children; thereby, their dc's choices have not been limited until dc are old enough to make the decision on their own anyway- I'm sure you do not advocate child labour or operation of motor vehicles.

I hope this clears some things up.

It doesn't look like this runaway train is going to make it to another track, does it?
: Activism thread??? Who will start it? Is it necessary any longer? This one is so long it's taking forever to load up on my low-speed connection
 
#188 ·
I thought I should add that the debate is probably largely relevant to Americans moreso than at least Canada.

In Canada, the individual does not have any inherent or innate freedoms- they are all granted through legislation with a cursory and polite wave to the Universal Declaration of Human Rights, but no real recourse for the individual except through the courts and thereby, legislation. Canadians rights and freedoms as recorded in our Charter are determined by court-enforcement and subject to the presiding judge's opinion. There is no precedent in Charter cases, so if you want the same right as someone else has already shown to be granted by the Charter, you must go through the whole process yourself and you will not necessarily be granted that same right, even if you have the same documentation and case. Cases are determined individually.

Dh asked me to consider moving to the United States...
 
#189 ·
Fascinating thread. Thank you! For those of you interested in learning more about where some of these ladies are coming from, there is a film you should see. It's called Freedom to Fascism. The director is Aaron Russo. His website is http://www.freedomtofascism.com . It's a really good introduction to some of the things that are inherently wrong about our current government. It covers a ton of very interesting topics and is a really enjoyable (albeit very scary) documentary to watch. As far as I can tell, it is reputable and the information is accurate.

As far as the mass vaccination threat goes, read the Patriot Act and the Homeland Security Act/Bill . The legislation is already in place.....
 
#190 ·
Thanks for summing it up PreggieUBA2C. I think you did a really good job.
And I think it is a nice end to a long and multifaceted discussion. That brings me to what's been in the air for a while now...

Taking the topic elsewhere... I asked a mod in the Tribal area, and got no response. I considered Activism, but after browsing there I don't know that it fits there. I want to take it elsewhere, and would be more than happy to be the author of the thread, but I am kind of stumped.

I thought of putting a thread up in the Tribal area anyway, but I'm not quite sure what to call it so that others could understand the purpose. Moms of Undocumented or Unregistered Children? Plain and simple, but damn it sounds awful.
There's almost nothing you can state forthright that wouldn't imply that parents who don't choose that avenue are doing something less... Moms of Unrestricted Children, Children with Full Choice. I'm not trying to ruffle any feathers, that's not my intention. But if I were to title a thread in a completely honest yet descriptive way, I'd piss off even more people that I already have.

Taking into account that I AM DONE ARGUING WITH THOSE WHO DON'T CARE, and the fact that quite a few others expressed interest in having a new thread, THIS TOPIC WILL BE MOVING. What I'd like to see is some more suggestions from interested mamas as to where to go and what to call it. Those of you who have no intention of saying anything supportive, I'd ask that you please keep any more comments you might have to yourself. Thanks.
 
#191 ·
Quote:

Originally Posted by Usually Curious View Post
We actually are a very short way from requiring a SS # to work, it's in the immigration bill that they are trying to shove down our throats right now.
No, they are going to require evidence of eligibility to work. You can be eligible to work and ineligible for an SSN. You can have an SSN and be ineligible to work.

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Any parent who trusts themselves over others to teach their OWN children is trying to warp and control them?
yes, you're scared that if you let someone else teach your child they'll teach them something you don't want them to know.

If your child's ability to make their own choices is paramount, then why not give them the most information they possibly can get in order to make the best choices for them. Instead of keeping them seeing only one way of life, and effectively limiting their options to those you think are acceptible.

Quote:
FREEDOM IS MY TOP PRIORITY.
So why not move to a part of the world where anarchy reigns, rather than living off the benefits of everyone else making compromises to live in a safe, comfortable society. Because if you want absolute freedom, you want anarchy, not the rule of law.

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Again, a bazillion and one technicalities to show that it cannot be done. *sigh* Have fun with that. If you can't get out of the mode that things can ONLY work the way the government says they will, then I don't know what more to say to you.
Yes, I know you've said many times that you don't believe in following laws. However, most of the rest of the world DOES, and your child is going to have to comply with those laws at some point or risk jail.
 
#192 ·
As I find every person's freedom to be a very important thing, and I don't want ANYONE to live a life without knowing what if due to them, I'd like to recommend some reading for the people who think that today's government is where it ought to be, and that those who disagree with it are out of line.

First... The DECLARATION OF INDEPENDENCE.

Second... THE UNITED STATES CONSTITUTION.

Do some research on the views of our founding fathers. Do some research on the American Revolution. Then do some research on American history. Heck... Just do some research.

From this point forward, I would like supportive comments only.

If anyone else should stumble across this who might have opposing views, why not start your own thread discussing the merits of having your family included in the system? It would be a much more constructive and positive thing to do, than to come and belittle those that believe differently.
 
#193 ·
Strongbeliever, in your very first post you said:

Quote:
I'm open to anyone's insight and opinions here. Thanks.
Perhaps you ought to start a support only thread and let those of us who are interested in the discussion here continue it. I think after 10 pages declaring that those of us that think not registering is, at best, silly, are not welcome in the thread is fairly rude. And, quite frankly, I don't care for the implication that those of us who disagree with you haven't done our research or aren't smart enough to understand your point. I would call that belittling those of us who disagree with you.
 
#194 ·
Quote:

Originally Posted by dis View Post
Strongbeliever, in your very first post you said:

Perhaps you ought to start a support only thread and let those of us who are interested in the discussion here continue it. I think after 10 pages declaring that those of us that think not registering is, at best, silly, are not welcome in the thread is fairly rude. And, quite frankly, I don't care for the implication that those of us who disagree with you haven't done our research or aren't smart enough to understand your point. I would call that belittling those of us who disagree with you.
Uh, yeah. Well said.
 
#195 ·
Point taken ladies, based on your perception of what was said. But I would also like to clarify that I never invited scornful or demeaning comments. Looking back through the post, you'll see that I have given every opportunity for those who don't agree to make their voices heard. In light of recent destructive comments being made after myself and some others asked that people keep their comments within the bounds of assisting the conversation, I don't think it is at all out of line at this point to clearly state that I would prefer "support only posts". This is in respect to the people who really would like to know more, but who may feel unwilling to participate due to the accusatory tone of the opposition.

I'd like to further clarify that I didn't mean to imply that EVERYONE who disagreed with my view was amiss... I was speaking directly to the poster who had so blatantly skewed what I wrote. In defense of my stance, I felt the need to let that poster know in no uncertain terms what I thought.

I feel that both choices, to register and to not register, have their redeeming qualities and their faults. My choice is right FOR ME, and I don't expect anyone to agree. But I did expect those who oppose to do so intelligently and respectfully when they address that opposition here, as anyone would expect when trying to gather opinions from both sides(as I was trying to do). After not receiving that respect after the first attempt of asking for it, I find it necessary now to ask only for supporting comments.

Those of us interested are taking our conversation elsewhere. I see this as the closing of this particular thread as it was intended to find HELP for those PURSUING this avenue. It only makes sense that anything further posted here should apply only to those who wish to come along, right? If someone with an opposing opinion wishes to further discuss their point, then it makes sense that they ought to do so with like-minded people, rather than coming here to be argumentative. I would think that starting a new thread would be more beneficial to you if you want to continue, rather than to point fingers at people who have moved on... But if you wish to stay here and squabble amongst yourselves, I'm not one to stop you. I, for one, choose to argue no longer.
 
#196 ·
Quote:

Originally Posted by wannabe View Post
yes, you're scared that if you let someone else teach your child they'll teach them something you don't want them to know.

If your child's ability to make their own choices is paramount, then why not give them the most information they possibly can get in order to make the best choices for them. Instead of keeping them seeing only one way of life, and effectively limiting their options to those you think are acceptible.

I'm curious, do you feel this way about all homeschooling parents? I mean, you could say the same thing about the teachers teaching a child in the school system. The information given to children in today's public schools are by no means the most information they can gain. For example, American history - there are two sides to every story and I only learned one side and ya'll can probably guess which side that was. Sometimes I feel like sending children to public schools are limiting their options, imo.

I really appreciated hearing all the sides of views but it just seemed to turn into a feeling of animosity towards the end. I think it's a fair question to ask about questioning whether or not to get a bc - what's wrong with considering it and conversing about it? Why the attitude??
 
#198 ·
this is the part I responded to initially--

" if there is anyone out there that could share their experiences, I'd love to hear! How did it effect your lives? Did it make finding health care(I'm one to stick to "alternative health care" anyway) hard? Has there been times that not having a BC for your child has impeded anything serious?

I'm open to anyone's insight and opinions here. Thanks."

since I understand why and even some ins and outs of how people do it, I only have experiences that have lead me to insuring documentation for my family.
As a midwife I have also had experiences where people have made this choice, to go without BC or other papers and what I will say is that it is fitting for the UC forum because UC and midwives who are unlicensed are the only way to pull this off- it is a law for providers to file a BC - and when a mw does not have a legal standing to support your late claims- what are the ways you can file? In the last 5 years I have been contacted by 4-5 young adults looking for a midwife in our area who is gone and has been gone for a long time... because they want to get a BC- so something to consider is to look at the laws as they exist now and try to have/save the necessary info that would be needed to file a delayed BC or if you need to go to court what proofs are acceptable- including notarized statements and any records that could date pregnancy , date of birth and residence of the mother at the time of birth( save an old driver's license and/or letter or bill that had your address and has a clear postmark-
I even had a copy of my son's record when I took him to a naturopath and supporting letters from a CNM and a doctor I knew and it still took me 4 years to get the BC- also at that time I was told (now I thought that we lived in the US) that I could have a baptismal record but not from one of those "weird religions" - flat out told that by more than one state employee --
Right now I know of a gal who was born in an ambulance and the hospital refused to do the BC and the ambulance didn't file one-- her parents weren't trying for the no bc thing it just happened to them and she is 12 and it is still not settled and they have paid 2 different lawyers on this case as well----
so this is not all my experiences but wanted to recommend that in order to keep some options open it may take a bit of forethought on your part.
 
#199 ·
Strongbeliever, you find it very difficult to be disagreed with, don't you? Why on earth would any of us want to sit around with only people who agree with us. Would make life very very boring and you'd never learn anything. But then, that confirms my observation about wishing to resrict your children's exposure to POV which are different from your own.

But that's OK, take your bat and ball and go home.

Quote:
I'm curious, do you feel this way about all homeschooling parents?
No, I'm sure it does apply to plenty of homeschoolers, but I can imagine several very good reasons to homeschool. I've considered it myself. And like every parent I've struggled with letting my child grow up and away from me (even though she's only 2). makes it easier to see it in others, y'know?
 
#200 ·
Quote:

Originally Posted by cfiddlinmama View Post
Fascinating thread. Thank you! For those of you interested in learning more about where some of these ladies are coming from, there is a film you should see. It's called Freedom to Fascism. The director is Aaron Russo. His website is http://www.freedomtofascism.com . It's a really good introduction to some of the things that are inherently wrong about our current government. It covers a ton of very interesting topics and is a really enjoyable (albeit very scary) documentary to watch. As far as I can tell, it is reputable and the information is accurate.

As far as the mass vaccination threat goes, read the Patriot Act and the Homeland Security Act/Bill . The legislation is already in place.....
OMG!!!!! I was trying to remember the name of that Documentary...I watched this with my husband and some of our friends like 8mo ago and WHOA!! It really opened my eyes to alot of what's going on behind the scenes..of course, my mom has always been more in tune with this stuff so I hear tid bits from her so when I watched this doc, it really comfirmed what I have heard.

I would recommend you all to watch this film!!! It is truely amazing and yes, scary to watch!!!
 
#202 ·
Thankyou Mwherbs, for sharing your information and experience. It is that kind of information which may go a long way in helping someone make a level headed and informed decision. Your understanding and thoughtfulness throughout this thread is greatly appreciated.

Tessie... My partner is supportive. We are working together to get more information, and to educate each other. He had the same questions as many of you have had at first, but doing the research has been very beneficial for both of us. He has gained a new outlook, and I have learned more than I knew. He s on board with the decision not to register this child, nor any of the children we may have in the future.

You find it very hard not pick fights, don't you Wannabe? Wanting an environment of support, free from spiteful attacks on character based upon unwarranted and petty assumptions... Yeah, I'm guilty of that.
 
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