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Old 04-05-2009, 02:07 PM
 
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I used Bausch and Lomb contact lens solution with thimerosal for several years in the 80's not sure when they discontinued it. I know several people who used Mercurochrome antiseptic http://www.straightdope.com/columns/...-mercurochrome.
Jane, you know too many yucky pieces of research. (I used the same contact lens solution! for years...)





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Old 04-05-2009, 02:09 PM
 
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I know several people who used Mercurochrome antiseptic http://www.straightdope.com/columns/...-mercurochrome.
I missed this on the first reading!! I forgot how mom ALWAYS used Mercurochrome on our open wounds as a child. :


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Old 04-07-2009, 02:25 PM - Thread Starter
 
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I think it's definitely the lentils that are causing reflux issues as opposed to the copper. I've been fine the past week with no lentils, but a couple days of lots of chicken liver. Yesterday I did lentils again out of desperation, and instant problems. Copper/zinc wouldn't change that quickly, and the liver is high in copper as well.

Next experiment: try the french green lentils again. It might just be these brown ones causing problems (or maybe just the skins on them?)

This is actually really exciting... Lentils I can do regularly. Chicken liver on the other hand is quite a commitment.

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Old 04-07-2009, 03:05 PM
 
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That's so funny. I think as long as I have chicken livers in the house, I can always have a bowl of pate in the fridge.

The lentils were getting sort of, I don't know, gaggy after a few days of lentils every day for lunch. (We were following your lead and trying to get lots of food folate.) Legumes in general are just proving to be bad for me. Lots of heartburn, be it peanuts, lentils, chickpeas or black beans. Peas seem to be okay, but I'm just eating a bit here and there, in the form of frozen peas.

We're trying to go paleo-ish (but with kefir and ferments still), so legumes are out anyway...

Today I made buffalo livers. They are just extra-buffalo meat tasting to me. I did end up cooking them with onions and basalmic vinegar and olive oil, adding chili spices and buzzing in the food processor. I spread it on romaine lettuce with avocado slices and scooped it up as a dip with carrot sticks.

Being grain free with yummy dips in the house kind of stinks.

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Old 04-07-2009, 05:21 PM - Thread Starter
 
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That's so funny. I think as long as I have chicken livers in the house, I can always have a bowl of pate in the fridge.
Hehe. I bought more chicken liver yesterday. I'll try making your pate tonight and see if I can convince myself

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Old 04-07-2009, 05:24 PM
 
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if you're doing grains, rice crackers (the sesmark brown rice) are reallly, really good with the pate. As are potato chips.

Nessa, DD1 (5) DD2 (3) & expecting again in late February/early March!
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Old 04-07-2009, 05:30 PM - Thread Starter
 
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if you're doing grains, rice crackers (the sesmark brown rice) are reallly, really good with the pate. As are potato chips.
We can do those crackers, but they don't last long cause I eat the whole package. And then feel sick : But you're doing a fantastic job of psyching me up for this

Unfortunately, potatoes are out for us

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Old 04-07-2009, 05:37 PM
 
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I will jazz you up for pate, yet!!

Okay, so how about sweet potato chips? Terra chips?

Yeah, we would only buy one package of those crackers per week. And then the kids and I would eat them all in one sitting. It claims there are only 3 servings per container, anyway, right?

We're really, really close to paleo right now (just finishing up our last dosa batter) and it's treating us well. Aside from my rxn to brazil nuts.

Also that B6 you were pushing is like valium to me. I am so freaking calm it's fabulous. Lily is even sick and wigging out over EV.ER.Y.THING and I'm all zen mama. yay!

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Old 04-07-2009, 05:48 PM - Thread Starter
 
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I will jazz you up for pate, yet!!

Okay, so how about sweet potato chips? Terra chips?

Also that B6 you were pushing is like valium to me. I am so freaking calm it's fabulous. Lily is even sick and wigging out over EV.ER.Y.THING and I'm all zen mama. yay!
The chips are supposedly safe, but the same all-in-one-sitting thing happens with them, too. And then I feel awful, and seemingly react - it's been awile. I should see if it was just the starch/lack of biotin. This is just asking for trouble...:

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Old 04-07-2009, 05:54 PM
 
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Okay, well, how about carrot sticks? celery sticks? raw peppers? cucumbers? lettuce/spinach/cabbage/other greens roll-ups? with guacamole? what veggies am i missing? lol

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Old 04-08-2009, 05:26 PM - Thread Starter
 
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I'm making the pate. It's closer to the original recipe than yours, cause we're out of the chili spices (now I have an excuse to try another batch if I don't like this one). It's cooling now.

I told dd I was going to cook some pate. She told me "No, Mommy, don't cook pate! I like cold pate!" Hopefully she's a fan - we'll see

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Old 04-09-2009, 01:43 PM
 
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Few days ago I started using Grape seed extract and besides other poistive effects it has really improved my digestion. I really need to understand why GSE is helping my digestion. Any comments????
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Old 04-09-2009, 01:43 PM
 
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Few days ago I started using Grape seed extract and besides other poistive effects it has really improved my digestion. I really need to understand why GSE is helping my digestion. Any comments????
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Old 04-09-2009, 02:49 PM
 
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I missed this on the first reading!! I forgot how mom ALWAYS used Mercurochrome on our open wounds as a child. :


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Old 04-09-2009, 02:50 PM
 
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Few days ago I started using Grape seed extract and besides other poistive effects it has really improved my digestion. I really need to understand why GSE is helping my digestion. Any comments????
Do you mean grapefruit seed extract?
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Old 04-09-2009, 02:54 PM
 
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The chips are supposedly safe, but the same all-in-one-sitting thing happens with them, too. And then I feel awful, and seemingly react - it's been awile. I should see if it was just the starch/lack of biotin. This is just asking for trouble...:
It could be the acrylamides created when foods are fried at high heat. Also fried foods are hard to digest anyways 'cause of the fat coating that needs to be broken down first before the starch.

Also is the Solgar Metafolin just as good as the Folapro? the Solgar is easier to get.
(forgive me if you talked about it before, I'm really behind in my reading here again!)
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Old 04-09-2009, 03:10 PM
 
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I'll hop on the folate question bandwagon. I found a brand of folate (not folic acid) at my co-op. What is best about folapro? would other stuff be useless?

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Old 04-09-2009, 05:55 PM
 
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Do you mean grapefruit seed extract?
Noo... I really mean grape seed extract; therefore, I am looking into WHY is it helping with digestion?
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Old 04-09-2009, 06:10 PM
 
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Noo... I really mean grape seed extract; therefore, I am looking into WHY is it helping with digestion?
The only thing I can figure at this point is because it induces Phase II enzymes to be produced?

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Old 04-09-2009, 06:23 PM
 
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Few days ago I started using Grape seed extract and besides other poistive effects it has really improved my digestion. I really need to understand why GSE is helping my digestion. Any comments????
Grape seed extract can be helpful in reducing inflammation, and also on wound healing, so maybe if your gut is inflamed, it helps in that way?
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Old 04-09-2009, 06:45 PM
 
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they could exert their antioxidant activity within the digestive tract to protect lipids, proteins and carbohydrates from oxidative damage during digestion, and spare absorbable antioxidants such as vitamins E, C and beta-carotene.
??
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Old 04-09-2009, 06:58 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Few days ago I started using Grape seed extract and besides other poistive effects it has really improved my digestion. I really need to understand why GSE is helping my digestion. Any comments????
Sorry, I don't know anything about GSE.

Re folate:

sonnambula said that different mixes of each of the forms work for different people (depending on their MTHFR gene?).

From my reading, food forms are 5-MTHF and folinic acid. From the biochem I've read, 5-MTHF is the form that's used for everything. It's hard to make from the other forms with the 677 mutation, so it doesn't seem like anything else would be particularly helpful. With the 1298 mutation, you can make 5-MTHF no problem, but you have a hard time converting it into the other forms. The idea is to load up on 5-MTHF to create a gradient to encourage that conversion. I suppose other forms would help create the 5-MTHF, but the wouldn't do much for the gradient.

Maybe part of the preference for different forms has to do with what issue you're trying to address? I'm wanting to increase BH4, so I'm not too worried about the other forms (though pure 5-MTHF makes me nervous, since that's not what's in foods). Maybe if you were mostly worried about purine synthesis, the folinic forms would be more helpful?

So I'm looking for the 5-MTHF form to help with methylation and BH4. I don't think anything folinic would have the same results. 5-MTHF is aka 5-methyl folate or active folate, but is NOT the same as 5,10 methyl folate or folinic acid. 5-MTHF is what's in folapro, and I *thought* metagenics had exclusive rights to Merck's patented 5-MTHF formula. But Jacqueline seems to have a Thorne vitamin with the same form. And I don't know what form the food-based vitamins have. I *do* know that the word 'folate' isn't enough to guarantee you're looking at the same thing.

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Old 04-09-2009, 07:00 PM - Thread Starter
 
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btw, the pate is FAR better than the chopped liver, but I still can't quite call it yummy. I'll have to try the southwestern version.

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Old 04-09-2009, 07:19 PM
 
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whoMe, update on clenched fists--D was seriously clenching his right fist today (strange, cause he was scribbling with it earlier, but if I had to guess I'd say he's left-handed), and I don't know what was up. I gave him a B12 as soon as we got home, and sometime later this changed, but overall strange. I am getting fed up and a big wigged out at the moment. Hoping things are better with you.
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Old 04-09-2009, 07:29 PM - Thread Starter
 
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whoMe, update on clenched fists--Diego was seriously clenching his right fist today (strange, cause he was scribbling with it earlier, but if I had to guess I'd say he's left-handed), and I don't know what was up. I gave him a B12 as soon as we got home, and sometime later this changed, but overall strange. I am getting fed up and a big wigged out at the moment. Hoping things are better with you.
Cool, in a really messed up my fist theory was right sort of way
So my take on the tiptoeing is that sure, it's a sign that vitamin D is working, but it's also a sign that calcium isn't doing everything that it should be. I'm actually avoiding the sun and calcium right now because I'm scared of what it's doing to us. The days after aren't too fun.

I'm checking the mail now for my folapro, and I'm hoping that consistent therapeutic use will bring down the glutamate, which will close the calcium ion channels, which will make us not so sensitive to calcium status. In the mean time, mag and taurine supplements might be in order. I'm hoping we don't need to go there (just cause I don't want to think about it)

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Old 04-09-2009, 08:09 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Hehe, I RAN back from the mailbox (we're in a complex) - lab test results AND folapro AND zinc sulfate.

All tests are normal - zinc and copper levels are actually CLOSER to the middle of the range than they were a year and a half ago when copper was at the high end and zinc was at the low end. I'll try the zinc sulfate and see if it agrees That's actually reassuring, that lentils won't change my levels that quickly. But it means I'm just reacting to the lentils. I think I do the same thing to brown rice (but not white). I wonder if it's a fiber/husk thing?

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Old 04-09-2009, 08:16 PM
 
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Wait, what testing have you had done? I am starting to learn about testing for later this year, so I am very curious.

Yay on improvement, would love to hear about the zinc sulfate. Though there's a wide range--hopefully you never got as depleted as I was, I thought it was funny a while back that I'd supplemented a lot of zinc (on my own) and when I later went searching for a HCP, one had me taste the zinc sulfate and it was like water, and I'd symptomatically improved, and yet I was still grossly deficient. Strange.

And yeah, it is interesting about the clenched fists--I wasn't sure I'd ever seen it before, but today, very very clear. What the heck, I have a plan, my HCP suggested a few months of rounds with DMSA, and although I had hesitation, I think it is the best course forward. Hopefully that will relieve some stress and help his body self-regulate better.

And I am torn on the vitamin D thing too. On the one hand, I really think he's deficient, and I think it's related to him getting sick so often, but excess calcium floating around isn't great either. But then again--if this is a transient thing, and it looks like it is for us--it seems to subside within a couple days, and the amt of D he's been generating has often been in the 4000 IU range, which is way more than he's using in a day, and so he's making progress on the deficiency--then maybe the transient issues (and presumably high calcium) are worth it in the long-run. And I'll read all those links tonight in the Calcium thread, see if there's anything I can/should do in the meantime.

And I'll see if upping his magnesium does anything (after I read the threads--they're going to bed early tonight, so I should have thinking time).
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Old 04-09-2009, 09:23 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Wait, what testing have you had done? I am starting to learn about testing for later this year, so I am very curious.

Yay on improvement, would love to hear about the zinc sulfate.
I did a urinalysis in hopes of confirming my kidney theory, and need to schedule an ultrasound. Came back normal, save the perpetual slightly elevated RBC. And one ketone. I still think I'm on the right track.

Serum zinc is normal, but the zinc sulfate tastes like water. Dd liked it too. The instructions say to hold 10mL in your mouth for at least 10 sec. I didn't do that much, or that long, but was definitely not the slightest bit metallic. Dd liked it too. And I've been doing 30mg zinc every morning for a couple of weeks now. I'm thinking of upping the vit C in conjunction to try and flush out (assumed) high copper keeping the zinc from doing much.

serum copper is normal

Ser/Plas mag is slightly high (2.5 normal: 1.8-2.4). I wonder if that could be reflecting the calcium ion channel thing?

Ser/Plas calcium is firmly normal, actually down slightly from last month, despite the vit D (9.8 instead of 9.9 normal: 8.5-10.5)

vit D is 38

i'm not sure how helpful these tests actually are, but they're covered by insurance and I don't mind blood tests, so

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Old 04-09-2009, 09:28 PM
 
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Has it occurred to either of you that perhaps the "excess" calcium isn't "excess" at all? That maybe your body is starting to repair damage which has occurred to bone tissue over the years? I'd be making sure that all the key nutrients (magnesium and vitamin K... I might be missing one) for bone growth/strengthening are in place and perhaps try getting some weight lifting in to assist the process.
Just a thought.

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Old 04-09-2009, 09:36 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Has it occurred to either of you that perhaps the "excess" calcium isn't "excess" at all? That maybe your body is starting to repair damage which has occurred to bone tissue over the years? I'd be making sure that all the key nutrients (magnesium and vitamin K... I might be missing one) for bone growth/strengthening are in place and perhaps try getting some weight lifting in to assist the process.
Just a thought.
My current theory is (and lab tests say) that it's not high calcium at all, it's the calcium ion channels being too open because of glutamate, making us extra sensitive to calcium fluctuations. With 8oz kerrygold butter a day, I think I'm A-OK on K2

Weight lifting is a good idea, though, and I've been trying to make sure we're getting plenty of phosphorus. Oh right. No need to lift weights - dd weighs 35+lbs and wants to be carried all.the.time We don't have a stroller.

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