how not to have an allergic child - Page 4 - Mothering Forums

Forum Jump: 
Reply
 
Thread Tools
#91 of 216 Old 08-14-2006, 08:56 PM
 
Wolfmeis's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Pugetopolis
Posts: 3,430
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
:



Quote:
Originally Posted by JaneS
Yes, that is my educated opinion.
But you'd have to live in a bubble for none of the other factors to be introduced. Literally. Having a pregnancy and a toddlerhood without encountering any of the big 8 would be a Herculean task, especially if you want to consider skin absorption (a factor for us). The genes can get turned on sometimes just by living this life.

After weeks of this I think I see where you are going with it, Jane.... you desperately want not to have another baby with an infancy like this one, riddled with eczema and allergy issues. (I HATE what happened to you guys in the hospital at his birth. That's awful.) There is not a doubt in my mind that your next child will be able to benefit from all that you have learned, and that whatever happens, his / her issues would be greatly reduced, not an amplification of what you have already experienced. I know from prior posts of yours that you think the susequent children get the short end of the stick as it were, but I don't think that has to be true.

My own children are actually good examples of how that can happen.... the first, I did everything right according to the medical community, but I still got a child allergic to 13 different foods, most of which caused serious reactions ranging from painful poop to anaphylaxis. After that experience, I wanted not to have an allergic child again.

Given G's issues we switched to whole foods (albeit gradually), became consistent with our supplements, bumped the nutrition, bumped the yogurts and things like that. Nicholas, I allowed to wean when he wanted to (after more than 2 years), and while he did have bad reactions to egg and corn(intro'd after a year), he has outgrown the issues he had with egg, corn and doesn't at all react to milk, to which he RAST tests positive. His eczema was almost wholly seasonal allergy related, and he hasn't had one patch since we left SC.

With number three, we've gone even further with the dietary train: always whole foods unless we're not at home, organic veggies, no hormones or abx in our milk and eggs, more yogurts than ever, etc etc etc. I'd never had a baby before this one who didn't have permanent red creases. Even now after 19 months, I catch myself caressing his ankles and elbows, feeling for the patches that need attention.

All three have the same parents. You can watch their similar genetic makeups in action by watching them grow and laugh; how similar they look and move. How their teeth come in, how they sleep. Yet with every child it's been better and better.
Wolfmeis is offline  
#92 of 216 Old 08-15-2006, 06:42 PM
 
wenat's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: oz
Posts: 612
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Well, here's my correlation with my son's RAST allergy test scores.

Peanuts -- I avoided them
He RAST tested at >100 -- the scale is 0-100, so he's over the maximum score

Almonds -- I ate a lot of almond butter instead of peanut butter in pregnancy
He RAST tested at 0

Cashews -- I ate cashews and cashew butter too
He threw up the half a cashew that I fed to him. We'll probably RAST test him for those next year.

Milk -- I drank TONS of milk while pregnant
He RAST tested at 70

Eggs -- ate them through pregnancy and BF'ing
He RAST tested at 7, which is marginal anaphylaxis

Cats -- I developed a cat allergy a year before I got pregnant, when a friend and her cats moved in with us for a year
He starts sneezing and gets wheezy after 10 minutes in a room where a cat has been. (And don't tell me that cat allergies are cured by healing the gut!)

Dustmites and mold -- he skin tested positive for those.
I've also skin tested positive for dustmites and mold.

I think that some of his allergies stem from my major allergic reactions to living with cats while I was pregnant with him. I was even diagnosed with asthma at the time, but I only get wheezy when exposed to cats. (One of my brothers is also horribly allergic to cats.)

Also, there are no food allergies in my family, but lots in DH's family. His mom and sister are allergic to eggs and I swear DH must have been allergic to dairy -- he was colicky as a baby, and formula-fed -- and he's still very sensitive to dairy if he eats more than a small serving (gets ferocious gas that sends people out of the room!).

So I do think there's a genetic predisposition to allergies. Plus I want to point out that blaming the mother for her leaky gut just adds another burden onto the shoulders of moms who already feel horribly guilty and responsible for their children's lives and problems.
wenat is offline  
#93 of 216 Old 08-15-2006, 10:22 PM
 
JaneS's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Posts: 9,114
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wolfmeis
But you'd have to live in a bubble for none of the other factors to be introduced. Literally. Having a pregnancy and a toddlerhood without encountering any of the big 8 would be a Herculean task, especially if you want to consider skin absorption (a factor for us). The genes can get turned on sometimes just by living this life.
I don't understand what you are saying here... :

I don't think the answer is avoiding the top 8 allergens. I think that "turning on genes" is nothing more than having a deficient immune system that is responding to environmental stressors.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Wolfmeis
After weeks of this I think I see where you are going with it, Jane.... you desperately want not to have another baby with an infancy like this one, riddled with eczema and allergy issues. (I HATE what happened to you guys in the hospital at his birth. That's awful.) There is not a doubt in my mind that your next child will be able to benefit from all that you have learned, and that whatever happens, his / her issues would be greatly reduced, not an amplification of what you have already experienced. I know from prior posts of yours that you think the susequent children get the short end of the stick as it were, but I don't think that has to be true.
Subsquent children have been shown to suffer in terms of nutritional deficiencies in the mother. Since my nutrition is way way better now, on a Nourishing Traditions diet. Especially high vit. A, which increases IgA that I just found out. I'm not at all concerned about that.

But yes, why I'm here and discussing it is to prevent this again (if I'm so lucky as to have a second). There is no doubt in my mind what were the primary causes of DS's issues on all fronts, regardless of genetics. And our medical history that I laid out certainly speaks volumes. Not many mamas know about these issues in these terms and exactly what they risk.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Wolfmeis
My own children are actually good examples of how that can happen.... the first, I did everything right according to the medical community, but I still got a child allergic to 13 different foods, most of which caused serious reactions ranging from painful poop to anaphylaxis. After that experience, I wanted not to have an allergic child again.
And that is exactly why I won't listen to mainstream medical advice ever again. Because the assault on the immune system comes from every direction. And the complete ignorance of nutritional causes of illness and the normal development of the infant's immune system is staggering.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Wolfmeis
All three have the same parents. You can watch their similar genetic makeups in action by watching them grow and laugh; how similar they look and move. How their teeth come in, how they sleep. Yet with every child it's been better and better.
That's very hopeful! Thank you for sharing.

While I did some things right with DS (not vaxing), I did many, many other things wrong b/c I was just not educated. My eyes are open and I'm trying to learn and share what I know.
JaneS is offline  
#94 of 216 Old 08-15-2006, 10:32 PM
 
JaneS's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Posts: 9,114
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Missy
Okay, I understand what you're saying now, but, since the (still limited)studies have shown it occurring in appr. 50% of women, until we have more information, it's best to assume that proteins do pass via breastmilk, especially when there is a history of allergies and/or asthma. Obviously, we should still make every effort to maintain a healthy gut while eliminating foods as needed.
And of course to me that begs the question as to whether an infant with a virgin gut (BF only, no vax and no antibx) will be better equipped to handle BM with milk proteins. Atopic or not. There is just so little that is known about the infant's immune system and how it develops.
JaneS is offline  
#95 of 216 Old 08-15-2006, 11:32 PM
 
Gale Force's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Nestled in the Sierras
Posts: 5,010
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by wenat
So I do think there's a genetic predisposition to allergies. Plus I want to point out that blaming the mother for her leaky gut just adds another burden onto the shoulders of moms who already feel horribly guilty and responsible for their children's lives and problems.
The whole point of this thread is to discuss prevention. One of the biggest factors moms can influence is their own health. You cannot change the world and all of its toxins to prevent allergies in your own children, you cannot change the genes that a child is going to inherit unless you choose another partner, but you can work on your own body. Everyone mom will feel guilt at many times in her life for decisions she made in regards to her children. The key is to work past the guilt and make changes for the better, whatever that means in each person's case.

Amanda Rose, author, Rebuild From Depression: A Nutrient Guide. Don't miss this opportunity to build a business telling friends about probiotic foods and grass fed meats: Beyond Organic Review.

Gale Force is offline  
#96 of 216 Old 08-16-2006, 12:25 AM
 
HappyToBe's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 215
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by JaneS

While I did some things right with DS (not vaxing), I did many, many other things wrong b/c I was just not educated. My eyes are open and I'm trying to learn and share what I know.
HappyToBe is offline  
#97 of 216 Old 08-16-2006, 12:05 PM
 
Plummeting's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Posts: 6,373
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gale Force
The whole point of this thread is to discuss prevention. One of the biggest factors moms can influence is their own health. You cannot change the world and all of its toxins to prevent allergies in your own children, you cannot change the genes that a child is going to inherit unless you choose another partner, but you can work on your own body. Everyone mom will feel guilt at many times in her life for decisions she made in regards to her children. The key is to work past the guilt and make changes for the better, whatever that means in each person's case.


It isn't about guilt, wenat. No one wants to make anyone else feel guilty,
but fear of upsetting someone is no reason to keep valuable information to yourself. I think most moms learn about this issue the hard way. For me, it wasn't serious allergies, but serious tooth decay in my DD. I argued back and forth with Jane about this. I used the *same* argument for genetics as a cause that has been used in this thread. Then I actually started looking into the issue genetics. Oops. Turns out genes aren't all that important after all, unless you're talking about a heritable genetic disease like cystic fibrosis, sickle cell anemia, etc. Things like having terrible teeth or terrible allergies might run in families, but they aren't genetically inherited. There literally must be other factors to cause them. Informing others of what those factors include and how to change them is the right thing to do.

I used to get angry at JaneS, too. I used to tell her that her message was hurtful and offensive, because our children's problems were out of our control - the SAME things said in this forum. Eventually, I came to realize that I was wrong. I realized this by discussing it with an actual researcher in the field and reading information on genetics and epigenetics. It wasn't an easy sell, but eventually I did have to eat crow. Do I agree that nutrition will prevent all cases of allergies and tooth decay? No, so I guess that's where my views differ from Jane's. However, I do believe that a majority of them would be prevented with proper nutrition and a healthy gut.

As mothers, it's our job to do everything we can to make our children healthy, even if it does mean we sometimes have to admit our mistakes and make changes. No one's perfect and no one expects anyone to be, so it's really nothing anyone's trying to make anyone else feel guilty about.
Plummeting is offline  
#98 of 216 Old 08-16-2006, 12:21 PM
 
Wolfmeis's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Pugetopolis
Posts: 3,430
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Plummeting
Do I agree that nutrition will prevent all cases of allergies and tooth decay? No, so I guess that's where my views differ from Jane's. However, I do believe that a majority of them would be prevented with proper nutrition and a healthy gut.

As mothers, it's our job to do everything we can to make our children healthy, even if it does mean we sometimes have to admit our mistakes and make changes. No one's perfect and no one expects anyone to be, so it's really nothing anyone's trying to make anyone else feel guilty about.
Holy God in Heavens, hold down the plates.

I have to : Plummeting!
Wolfmeis is offline  
#99 of 216 Old 08-16-2006, 12:23 PM
 
nikirj's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Washington
Posts: 4,952
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Jane, I don't get this

Quote:
I don't think the answer is avoiding the top 8 allergens. I think that "turning on genes" is nothing more than having a deficient immune system that is responding to environmental stressors.
The immune system is supposed to respond to environmental stressors, and it can take a while...we'd never get sick otherwise. You absorb things many ways; through the skin, through the mucous membranes in the nose and mouth and anywhere else, injestion, inhalation...and your immune system must deal with them.

The immune system of an infant is by definition immature, and so the capability to react 'incorrectly' to any given potential allergen is enhanced. Thus those who know their children have, genetically, the potential to react in the worst possible way, may try to avoid the interaction in the first place...and research is on their side.

Mama, homeschooler, midwife. DD (13yo), DS (11yo), DD (8yo), DD (3yo), somebody new coming in November 2013.

nikirj is offline  
#100 of 216 Old 08-16-2006, 12:38 PM
 
Wolfmeis's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Pugetopolis
Posts: 3,430
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Niki explained my comment very nicely. Thanks!

My bubble comment is in reference to not exposing the child to anything. You can't do that. You simply can't. Just going out the the door on her first trip outside exposes the baby to potential allergens.

You can / are going to try your best to make sure your child's immune system doesn't go wonky and mistake common substances for deadly pathogens, which is what you're talking about but one of the things you can do to help that immune system not make that mistake is to not expose is to the harshest common substances. Some people choose the big 8 to avoid. My allergist suggested avoiding eggs, shellfish, peanuts and nuts. We did, and were comfortable with that.
Wolfmeis is offline  
#101 of 216 Old 08-16-2006, 12:52 PM
 
wednesday's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: North Carolina
Posts: 5,545
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
I have read on several different threads that people use the term "allergy" inappropriately. But I'm not sure how to better describe my son's sensitivity to milk protein in a way other people can easily understand. He is not ana, and he can have trace amounts like in bread for example without a noticeable reaction. However, let him drink a few ounces of milk, or eat a slice of cheese pizza, or have a small serving of ice cream, and the next 24 hours will be sheer hell. When he first started drinking cows' milk we went through a period of a couple months where we did not know what was wrong--he was moaning and screaming absolutely non-stop and just could not be soothed at all. Our child care provider said she could no longer watch him and suggested we have him evaluated for autism. He was about 16 months old and we were just terrified at the change we had seen in our child in just a few months. Our wonderful family doc confirmed that his behavior was absolutely not normal and helped us figure out the problem was dairy. Once we took him off it he was back to his happy self...we have tried letting him have dairy now and then as a test but every time we get the old behavior back. But you know what...the average person is not interested in hearing our whole story about how we figured out DS can't have dairy. In fact the average person hearing the story thinks we are nuts and just imaginging it, to tell you the truth. So we tell people he's "allergic" even though my best guess is he actually has an inability to digest casein (http://www.greatplainslaboratory.com/glutencasein.html) as opposed to a true allergy.

I tell people I am "allergic" to bananas. I have not been tested for this. What happened was over a period of a couple years I noticed I would always get a bad stomach ache if I ate a banana. But I really like bananas, soI would still eat maybe a bite of banana now and then, until even that seemed to cause a bad stomach ache. I pretty much avoided them from that point, but once I was mashing a banana up for DS when he was little and I licked a little off my finger. In a minute or so my tounge and lips began to itch and burn. I was okay but that was a real wake-up call for me that I have become increasingly sensitive and need to watch out because I could be potentially ana to bananas. I still will cut one up for DS now and then but I am very careful to wash my hands afterwards. I was at a get-together recently and came very close to consuming banana without knowing it. I had a cracker with some spread on it halfway to my mouth while the hostess asked whether or not she should put some banana into a punch she was making. I said I'd rather she didn't as I'm allergic and she then informed me very worriedly that the spread I was about to eat had banana as an ingredient. I'm really not sure what would have happened if I had eaten a few bites of the spread. People are always shocked to hear a person could be allergic to bananas but I did some web research on it and it is not all that rare. But I hate for someone to think I am just making an excuse because I don't "like" bananas. I actually like them a lot and this whole allergy thing sucks. I believe it is truly an allergy regardless that I have not had it confirmed through clinical testing.
wednesday is offline  
#102 of 216 Old 08-16-2006, 01:06 PM
 
Wolfmeis's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Pugetopolis
Posts: 3,430
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Wednesday, there is a good thread on milk allergy and behaviour I think you would enjoy here: http://www.mothering.com/discussions...d.php?t=460679
Wolfmeis is offline  
#103 of 216 Old 08-16-2006, 01:44 PM
 
wenat's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: oz
Posts: 612
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by nikirj
Thus those who know their children have, genetically, the potential to react in the worst possible way, may try to avoid the interaction in the first place...and research is on their side.
Thanks, Niki, now I get it.

I'm dealing with a bad case of blame-the-mother -- in this case me -- for my kid's allergies. So when I read threads about how I should have avoided this or that, it really stings. And I can't help but take it personally.

But when I look back, there were no warning signs of food allergies in the family. Nobody has a peanut allergy (that's certain death with Chinese food, which is my background), and DS's mom only ever said that eggs "disagree" with her, so she avoids them. In fact, she's only now told me to watch out for the "-cillins", as his sister was horribly allergic to an antibiotic in her childhood. The denial in that family was pretty absolute, but it's starting to crack and I'm finally getting more information. (My MIL's first comment, on learning about DS's allergies: "Well, he doesn't get that from our side of the family!")

And I still think that developing a massive cat allergy and living with cats while I was pregnant had the effect of super-stressing out my immune system and thus, DS's as well. (I had no problem with cats until a few weeks after they moved in with me.)

There should be a separate thread comparing the stages of grief to the stages of dealing with a child's major allergies (denial and isolation; anger; bargaining; depression; acceptance) -- I think I'm somewhere around bargaining/depression. But here I go, taking this off topic again.
wenat is offline  
#104 of 216 Old 08-16-2006, 03:05 PM
 
Wolfmeis's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Pugetopolis
Posts: 3,430
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by wenat
Thanks, Niki, now I get it.

I'm dealing with a bad case of blame-the-mother -- in this case me -- for my kid's allergies. So when I read threads about how I should have avoided this or that, it really stings. And I can't help but take it personally.

But when I look back, there were no warning signs of food allergies in the family. Nobody has a peanut allergy (that's certain death with Chinese food, which is my background), and DS's mom only ever said that eggs "disagree" with her, so she avoids them. In fact, she's only now told me to watch out for the "-cillins", as his sister was horribly allergic to an antibiotic in her childhood. The denial in that family was pretty absolute, but it's starting to crack and I'm finally getting more information. (My MIL's first comment, on learning about DS's allergies: "Well, he doesn't get that from our side of the family!")

And I still think that developing a massive cat allergy and living with cats while I was pregnant had the effect of super-stressing out my immune system and thus, DS's as well. (I had no problem with cats until a few weeks after they moved in with me.)

There should be a separate thread comparing the stages of grief to the stages of dealing with a child's major allergies (denial and isolation; anger; bargaining; depression; acceptance) -- I think I'm somewhere around bargaining/depression. But here I go, taking this off topic again.
Hugs, dallin. I TOTALLY GET YOU.

And as has often been mentioned here, medical advice changes from pregnancy to pregnancy and child to child from everything on how to let them sleep (back? front? side? alone? co?) to when to not feed them and what to avoid eating and why when you're pregnant. It's insane.

We knew our kids would be allergic (we didn't know the phrase atopic then), but because our allergies were all environmental, we didn't think anything beyond stockign up on benadryl or something. The fact that it could and did manifest as a f&^$& DEADLY food allergy shocked us to the core. Our extended family has in some ways, still not recovered from it.
Wolfmeis is offline  
#105 of 216 Old 08-16-2006, 04:40 PM
 
Plummeting's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Posts: 6,373
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by wednesday
I have read on several different threads that people use the term "allergy" inappropriately. But I'm not sure how to better describe my son's sensitivity to milk protein in a way other people can easily understand.
I agree. My daughter and my husband both have several food intolerances, but people don't really understand what that means, so I usually say they are allergic, even though I know they aren't actual allergies. Most people who don't deal with intolerances, even if they do know a great deal about allergies, simply don't understand the first thing about them. I said "intolerance" to my MIL once, and she has latched onto that word, refusing to let it go. This has caused a great deal of confusion in DH's family, because they all now seem to think DD can eat dairy, as long as she takes a pill or drinks the lactose-free milk. Since then, unless I know someone knows what I'm talking about, I say "allergy/allergic to". I have a couple of allergies - the symptoms are nothing like DD's and DH's.
Plummeting is offline  
#106 of 216 Old 08-16-2006, 06:17 PM
 
Mrs.PhD's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Royal Oak MI
Posts: 555
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by wenat
There should be a separate thread comparing the stages of grief to the stages of dealing with a child's major allergies (denial and isolation; anger; bargaining; depression; acceptance) -- I think I'm somewhere around bargaining/depression. But here I go, taking this off topic again.
I have to agree with you. Dealing with my DD's allergies has been a life changing experience for me. It was a very difficult (but good ultimately.) In my case I accepted her allergies as my own to breast feed, and that really was the best because it forced me to deal with them 1st hand. I kind of felt stange grieving and dealing with it because while it is a "special need" it is minor compared to some. I am very lucky that she is healthy and happy and has no other heath or otherwise issues. It means I am a bit neurotic about what food we eat and reading labels. As a social worker that helped parents with kids who were Deaf, hard of hearing and or other special needs food allergy to milk and eggs (that they should outgrow) is rather minor. Still it is my situation to greave and deal with and I shouldn't discount that.
Mrs.PhD is offline  
#107 of 216 Old 08-16-2006, 07:15 PM
 
mamazig's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: National Historic Park land . . .
Posts: 218
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by wednesday
I have read on several different threads that people use the term "allergy" inappropriately. But I'm not sure how to better describe my son's sensitivity to milk protein in a way other people can easily understand. ... I believe it is truly an allergy regardless that I have not had it confirmed through clinical testing.
fwiw: our new ped gi dr. just confirmed (w/only my anecdotal evidence!) that dd has a "cow milk protein allergy", and he used that exact term like the "research" uses too. And he said there is no way test for it other than a diet challenge...which we've done...accidentally.
What is most interesting to me now is that he's ordered a RAST test for soy, eggs, wheat, nuts...why soy? why not dairy too? i thought the "soy allergy" was a protein intolerance too. i need to remember to ask him this...
immensely interesting thread --thanks, all!
mamazig is offline  
#108 of 216 Old 08-16-2006, 08:27 PM
 
Wolfmeis's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Pugetopolis
Posts: 3,430
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Yah that is strange. Did you see the exact order? When G has had bloodwork done, they generally order a panel and more has been included on the RAST results than I have expected.

Very generally speaking, allergy = reactions to protein
Wolfmeis is offline  
#109 of 216 Old 08-16-2006, 09:58 PM
 
Mrs.PhD's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Royal Oak MI
Posts: 555
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by mamazig
fwiw: our new ped gi dr. just confirmed (w/only my anecdotal evidence!) that dd has a "cow milk protein allergy", and he used that exact term like the "research" uses too. And he said there is no way test for it other than a diet challenge...which we've done...accidentally.
What is most interesting to me now is that he's ordered a RAST test for soy, eggs, wheat, nuts...why soy? why not dairy too? i thought the "soy allergy" was a protein intolerance too. i need to remember to ask him this...
immensely interesting thread --thanks, all!
That is stange. DD was tested (blood work) the 1st time (her ped ordered the test, but we went to the hopstial to draw the blood.) He said she was postive for cows milk protein and egg whites (not yokes). They also tested for soy, egg yoak, wheat. He was very excited she didn't have soy, now I understand why. She had a 3 (out of 5 I think) for milk and 2 for eggs.

When they re tested her 6 months later it was strach test, and they did peanuts then too. (neg.) She will be going back for re testing in Sept or Oct.
Mrs.PhD is offline  
#110 of 216 Old 08-16-2006, 11:35 PM
 
JaneS's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Posts: 9,114
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Pshaw... Plummeting... I don't even remember you being mad at me!
JaneS is offline  
#111 of 216 Old 08-16-2006, 11:50 PM
 
JaneS's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Posts: 9,114
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Plummeting
Do I agree that nutrition will prevent all cases of allergies and tooth decay? No, so I guess that's where my views differ from Jane's. However, I do believe that a majority of them would be prevented with proper nutrition and a healthy gut.
I'm not sure I believe this either, did I say all cases? As there are other environmental factors which damage immune system. It's hard to eat 4x the RDA in minerals and 10x the RDA in fat soluble vits from the right mix of foods as traditional societies did with incredible prevention from degenerative diseases. Expensive and time consuming and "insular" ... that type of nutrition is simply not accessable to everyone and I know it. Sure would be nice to "know" though. Wonder how many Amish kids have allergies? Maybe as many that have autism though I'd bet.
JaneS is offline  
#112 of 216 Old 08-17-2006, 12:06 PM
 
Plummeting's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Posts: 6,373
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
You never said all cases. I just thought that was what you meant. Maybe some other people did, too, so maybe that's a big part of the confusion around here???? :

You know, Jane, I would bet the Amish have fewer allergies from less exposure to environmental toxins, vaccines, etc., but their diets really aren't all that great, from what I've seen. (Not like I'm an expert on the Amish diet, but you know.) It seems like they eat a lot of sugar and white flour. I definitely think their diets are better than the SAD, but they eat so many desserts and so much white bread, that it's hard to imagine that it's much better, kwim?
Plummeting is offline  
#113 of 216 Old 08-17-2006, 12:11 PM
 
Plummeting's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Posts: 6,373
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by mamazig
fwiw: our new ped gi dr. just confirmed (w/only my anecdotal evidence!) that dd has a "cow milk protein allergy", and he used that exact term like the "research" uses too. And he said there is no way test for it other than a diet challenge...which we've done...accidentally.
What is most interesting to me now is that he's ordered a RAST test for soy, eggs, wheat, nuts...why soy? why not dairy too? i thought the "soy allergy" was a protein intolerance too. i need to remember to ask him this...
immensely interesting thread --thanks, all!
That's very strange. Perhaps he's saying that, since so many children are intolerant of dairy protein, rather than truly allergic, there's no point in testing, because a false negative would be meaningless since you already know she reacts to dairy. Who knows what doctors are thinking half the time? (That's how I feel after dealing with a few about my DD's issues when she was a baby.) The problem is that she could also be intolerant of all those other things, so could test negative for all those, but still be unable to eat them.
Plummeting is offline  
#114 of 216 Old 08-17-2006, 01:34 PM
 
Annikate's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: FL
Posts: 4,841
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Plummeting
You know, Jane, I would bet the Amish have fewer allergies from less exposure to environmental toxins, vaccines, etc., but their diets really aren't all that great, from what I've seen. (Not like I'm an expert on the Amish diet, but you know.) It seems like they eat a lot of sugar and white flour. I definitely think their diets are better than the SAD, but they eat so many desserts and so much white bread, that it's hard to imagine that it's much better, kwim?
I'm wondering how you know this. I always thought the Amish ate very NT style.
Annikate is offline  
#115 of 216 Old 08-17-2006, 01:51 PM
 
Missy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: virginia
Posts: 4,932
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Oddly, I thought it was kind of common knowledge...Amish food does tend to use white flour and white sugar. We travel to a Mennonite market to purchase much of our bulk food, but we don't buy the prepared/baked foods--it's always heavy on white flour and sugar, soy oil and corn syrup. A lot of their products are baked on site, others are from Amish businesses in PA.
Missy is offline  
#116 of 216 Old 08-17-2006, 04:39 PM
 
JaneS's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Posts: 9,114
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Plummeting
You know, Jane, I would bet the Amish have fewer allergies from less exposure to environmental toxins, vaccines, etc., but their diets really aren't all that great, from what I've seen. (Not like I'm an expert on the Amish diet, but you know.) It seems like they eat a lot of sugar and white flour. I definitely think their diets are better than the SAD, but they eat so many desserts and so much white bread, that it's hard to imagine that it's much better, kwim?
Hmmmm, I don't know on the whole. The Amish families that several WAPF groups here in MA get their products from are very NT: raw milk, porridges, sourdough, ferments, etc. One of our chapter leaders just visited, I'll have to ask her. I'm sure it must vary.

As far as the products for sale, it could also be the "Chinese Restaurant" deal ... where crappy American Chinese fried food is what you usually get in restaurants, but they eat more fresh things at home?
JaneS is offline  
#117 of 216 Old 08-17-2006, 06:39 PM
 
Wolfmeis's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Pugetopolis
Posts: 3,430
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by JaneS
As far as the products for sale, it could also be the "Chinese Restaurant" deal ... where crappy American Chinese fried food is what you usually get in restaurants, but they eat more fresh things at home?
OMG that's so funny! I bet it's true, too!
Wolfmeis is offline  
#118 of 216 Old 08-17-2006, 07:34 PM
 
Missy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: virginia
Posts: 4,932
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
In Pennsylvania Dutch Country, which is where many of the products sold in this market come from, the food tends to be very heavy, greatly influenced by German roots, and, while the food isn't heavily processed with preservatives and dyes, white sugar and flour are used pretty frequently. I think families probably use more lard than soy oil at home, and corn syrup is probably used commercially because of cost. The dairy products probably aren't as processed, but they also eat a lot of white potatoes, and sugary desserts.
Missy is offline  
#119 of 216 Old 08-17-2006, 07:47 PM
 
mamazig's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: National Historic Park land . . .
Posts: 218
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wolfmeis
Yah that is strange. Did you see the exact order? When G has had bloodwork done, they generally order a panel and more has been included on the RAST results than I have expected.

Very generally speaking, allergy = reactions to protein
Yes, actually, I have the order here. I forgot about his testing for corn too. I'll probably take her in Tuesday -- yikes, I hate the thought of her getting clood taken again -- such a yucky process for her...But I'm really anxious to see if/what she's allergic to. Oh, he's also doing an anemia test (CBC?), I think.
mamazig is offline  
#120 of 216 Old 08-18-2006, 12:14 AM
 
Plummeting's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Posts: 6,373
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Missy
In Pennsylvania Dutch Country, which is where many of the products sold in this market come from, the food tends to be very heavy, greatly influenced by German roots, and, while the food isn't heavily processed with preservatives and dyes, white sugar and flour are used pretty frequently. I think families probably use more lard than soy oil at home, and corn syrup is probably used commercially because of cost. The dairy products probably aren't as processed, but they also eat a lot of white potatoes, and sugary desserts.
That's how it is in the Iowa Amish communities I've visited.
Plummeting is offline  
Reply

Quick Reply
Message:
Drag and Drop File Upload
Drag files here to attach!
Upload Progress: 0
Options

Register Now

In order to be able to post messages on the Mothering Forums forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.
User Name:
If you do not want to register, fill this field only and the name will be used as user name for your post.
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.
Password:
Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.
Email Address:

Log-in

Human Verification

In order to verify that you are a human and not a spam bot, please enter the answer into the following box below based on the instructions contained in the graphic.



User Tag List

Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page


Forum Jump: 

Posting Rules  
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are Off