Curing Cavities with Nutrition - Page 21 - Mothering Forums

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Old 08-27-2008, 08:21 PM
 
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Originally Posted by LavenderMae View Post
Is Nordic Naturals a good brand of CLO? The one I bought doesn't have any added Vit.D or A and I thought that was good (just what was naturally occuring) but it's much lower than the amounts suggested here.
If there's very little vit D then it's not the right kind. For NN, you want Nordic Naturals Vitamin D Cod Liver Oil.

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Old 08-29-2008, 11:24 AM
 
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Only part way through, I really don't have the time to read and research everything with the twins...can someone post a link or list what we should be doing with our 1 year old girls to PREVENT decay? Would like to get their enamel off to a good start! Thanks so much!

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Old 08-29-2008, 09:32 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Only part way through, I really don't have the time to read and research everything with the twins...can someone post a link or list what we should be doing with our 1 year old girls to PREVENT decay? Would like to get their enamel off to a good start! Thanks so much!
Good question and I would say a traditional foods/WAPF style nutrient dense diet with as little processed food as possible in this modern world. Immunity to cavities was achieved by a diet 4x the minerals and water soluble vitamins and 10x the amount of fat soluble vitamins of modern diets. From food, not chemical sources in pills.

I would make sure that the food they eat is as nutrient dense as possible. WAPF recommends egg yolks and liver and bone broths as first foods, very different than our modern practice of feeding low nutrient but calorie dense processed grains.

Start high vitamin cod liver oil and a regular source of vitamin K2 (such as pastured dairy or breastmilk). I would evaluate history for possible vitamin A and D deficiency and correct if necessary by a higher than average intake for quite some time.
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Old 08-29-2008, 09:42 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Hi all,
Does anyone else have someone with a peanut allergy in your house? Do you use other nuts? We used to use a lot more nuts (made muffins with almond flour, trail mix, etc), and it helped so much to have nuts in our diet when avoiding the other stuff, like grains. Then we discovered my youngest is allergic to peanuts, so I cut out all nuts for a while, because most everything says "processed in a facility with peanuts". But lately I have been thinking about getting some peanut free nuts (like from a family member's pecan trees, or from a place that is peanut free, I think I heard of a place called Tierra Farms?). He ate other nuts before, almonds and cashews.

It just would be nice to be able to have nuts back in our diet, with trying to eat this way.

Can anyone share if they give their child with a peanut allergy other nuts?
Thanks!
DS has peanut and certain tree nut allergies. So far we have not gone back on nuts (he was consuming almonds, cashews and pecans on the SCD diet pretty regularly before) because of other circumstances. But I would go your route of a peanut free source of other nuts depending on a few things. How old is your son? Has he been tested for tree nuts and how recently?

I think Firefaery is absolutely right, be cautious b/c he is more likely to react given he is already allergic to PN.

One other thing to think of is that often with a young child it can be confusing, you can eat THIS nut but not THAT one plus the x-contamination issues. But if you are eating just food from home it is less of a concern too. I just heard the other day of a father feeding his nut allergic child the bottom piece of coffee cake which "only" had nuts on top.
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Old 08-30-2008, 10:21 AM
 
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Please. My celiac grandmother (diagnosed just this year at 83) still eats quiche. She just peels off the crust-ya know, cause she can't eat gluten I'm working on it! If nothing else reminding her that there is generally flour in the egg part too seems to help.
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Old 08-30-2008, 07:30 PM - Thread Starter
 
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I'm recalling my 93 yo grandmother telling my mom off when she questioned her eating hot dogs too frequently, "I made it this far didn't I!" Sadly they have different constitutions than subsequent generations.
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Old 09-05-2008, 06:03 PM
 
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Please. My celiac grandmother (diagnosed just this year at 83) still eats quiche. She just peels off the crust-ya know, cause she can't eat gluten I'm working on it! If nothing else reminding her that there is generally flour in the egg part too seems to help.
My gram used to make quiche with a potato crust, instead of a pie crust. It was soooo good! She would make homemade hashbrowns (or just grated potatoes) and use it as the crust. Maybe your grandmother could try that?

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Old 09-05-2008, 06:21 PM
 
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Oh, I used to make them with zucchini crusts or potato crusts...they ARE good. Unfortunately Gram isn't making them, but purchasing them...lol

Good call though. That is a wonderful way to go!
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Old 09-05-2008, 06:27 PM
 
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Geez Louise! This may be the longest thread on the internet!

I just finished all 31 pages and it took me over a week...between going to school full time and 3 kids, I don't have a lot of "spare" time.

Just a few questions.

So far, we have been blessed that our children have been cavity free. DS1 (6yo) had some soft spots on his back molar, but the DDS put a sealant on it, so it would not turn to a cavity. DH and I have absolutely horrible teeth that I would not wish on anyone, so I am so grateful that the kids' teeth are better. I personally had a ton of cavities as a child and as an adult (some of which I am hoping to reverse or halt by diet).

I just bought my copy of NT and am part way through reading it. It's as big as most of my college textbooks, so it may take me a while, between having to do school work and other responsibilities.

I have been buying grass-fed beef off and on for a while, but DH and I decided that it's the only kind we will buy from now on. I understand that Organic Valley butter is from grass-fed cows, so that would be ok? Our dairy that we buy our milk from delivers to our house. They do homogenize their milk, except for their Cream Top milk, which says it's the only one they don't homogenize. For now, I will be switching over to that, until I can get the raw milk/butter. The dairy pasture feeds as much as possible, but it is located in the Front Range of the Rockies and they only have a limited "grazing season", says the website. They get at least 90 days in the pasture, and also organic alfalfa and corn silage, when not in the pasture. Does this seem like an ok alternative, until I can find a different source?

Also, is Garden of Life cod liver oil ok to use? I found it here http://www.vitaminshoppe.com/store/e...jsp?id=GU-1027 for what seems to be a pretty good price. I currently have Carlson's cod liver Super 1000mg capsules, which is more pricey. I'm glad I looked on the Vitamin Shoppe's page, though, since it's way more expensive at our local hfs.

DS2 (2.5yo) has asthma and is a very picky eater. The one thing he is completely addicted to is his milk. I've wondered if he doesn't have a sensitivity to it, since I've read that some people get 'addicted' to things they are sensitive to. Maybe switching to raw milk will help with that?

I'm sure I'll have more questions, as I think of them and as I read NT. I also borrowed Nutrition and Physical Degeneration from the library, but it is not as easy to read as NT. I may take it back and borrow it again when I have more time to read.

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Old 09-05-2008, 08:08 PM
 
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oh, and subbing...

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Old 09-06-2008, 02:52 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Congratulations for making it through

I would try to find Organic Valley's Pasture Butter
http://www.organicvalley.coop/produc.../pasture-8-oz/
The regular Organic Valley is only marginally better than standard butter. Butter should be very dark yellow for most benefit, the most vitamin K2.

Purity Farms organic ghee is also grass fed, I wish they would do K2 testing.

There is evidence that the X Factor/K2 alleviates asthma so this might be very important for your DS. Raw milk too. Any allergy always has a gut flora component. But raw won't help if he has IgE allergies to it though, it could just be a sensitivity issue? My milk co-op is filled with people who couldn't tolerate pasteurized milk and experience great health benefits on raw.

There's a lot you can read online at the WAPF website too, some excerpts from N&PD. You know, in your spare time!
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Old 09-06-2008, 05:12 PM
 
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Thank you, Jane! I did find the OV Pasture butter a few days ago and bought 1/2 lb. We've eaten almost the entire thing since Wednesday!! My kids love it in their oatmeal and on crackers. It was a little pricey, but I may just go back and buy as many packages as I can, before it's gone, and just freeze it. I know there are sources of raw milk/butter in my area. In fact, the local WAP chapter is in the next town over, so I may contact them soon. I'm just a little worried about the cost, right now. Of course, better to pay now, than medical/dental later.

Do you think that the cream top milk that I can buy would be ok, since it is mostly pastured? I mean, for now, until I can hook up the raw? They also make their own butter.
www.morningfreshdairy.com

Thanks for your advice.

~V

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Old 09-09-2008, 12:26 PM
 
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I made it through the whole thread in only 3 days! Woohoo! LOL

I'm actually here for myself, not my kids. *sigh* I think I've got a good action plan now. I love MDC. :

Anyway, I wanted to answer the peanut-other nut question.

Quote:
Originally Posted by momofmine View Post

Can anyone share if they give their child with a peanut allergy other nuts?
Thanks!
My dd is allergic to peanuts, but thankfully not severely. She can eat things "processed in a plant that also has peanuts" or whatever, with no reaction. She LOVES almonds and pecans and macadamias, and eats them with no trouble at all.

I'm not sure where the idea started to keep peanut-allergic kids away from nuts. Just doesn't make sense. They aren't related at all, but that's what most docs say to do.

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Old 09-10-2008, 12:56 PM
 
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I
Anyway, I wanted to answer the peanut-other nut question.



My dd is allergic to peanuts, but thankfully not severely. She can eat things "processed in a plant that also has peanuts" or whatever, with no reaction. She LOVES almonds and pecans and macadamias, and eats them with no trouble at all.

I'm not sure where the idea started to keep peanut-allergic kids away from nuts. Just doesn't make sense. They aren't related at all, but that's what most docs say to do.
Thank you Junegoddess! Do you know she's not severely allergic from testing or just from experience? Did you just try eating things "processed in a plant with peanuts", etc, and it was fine?

I always suspected my DS was sensitive to peanuts, so I never gave them to him, but he definitely ate things processed in the same facility as peanuts, and ate cashew butter, almond butter, etc almost daily (the kind that says it has been processed on the same equipment as peanuts). Then one time he was accidentally given actual peanut butter, and he had an allergic reaction. He has also had some small contact reactions (twice) from touching something and then touching his face.

But, he ate cashew butter, almond butter, and other nuts before we discovered he had a true peanut allergy.
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Old 09-10-2008, 01:41 PM
 
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just chiming in here about the peanut allergy and others nuts.
my ds 5 is also allergic to peanuts...realy bad, but is o.k with almonds, almond butter, pecans, and things processed in a facility that also processes peanuts. we found that out by accident after we one day looked on the back of a package and saw that it was from the same facility as peanuts and ds was fine. since he is gf I had been grinding up almonds(almond meal) and pecans etc; and didn't even think of a connection to peanuts....
there are however, some kids who cannot even be next to someone who eats peanuts and will react to something that is processed in the same facility.
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Old 09-13-2008, 04:51 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Studies show 34-50% of peanut allergic children are also allergic to certain tree nuts. More than 50% are allergic to eggs, and more than a quarter also allergic to dairy and fish/shellfish.

RE: cross contamination, I take a harder line on this.

From my reading of fatal anaphylaxis case studies, you simply cannot make a blanket determination regarding "processed in a facility that contains xyz". You could eat the product and be fine for years... many people have according to several studies that explain someone "always" ate this or that product and "was fine". But one day they were not. What if the next package happens to have an entire ground up peanut in it, you simply have no control or knowledge about cross contamination, how well they wash the equipment, etc.

If there are any further questions, could it be continued on the allergies forum?
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Old 09-29-2008, 10:33 PM
 
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I found a Natto vitamin K2 supplement from Solgar at my local health food store today. I think Natto has more menaquinones than dairy products?

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Old 10-17-2008, 01:20 AM
 
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I found a Natto vitamin K2 supplement from Solgar at my local health food store today. I think Natto has more menaquinones than dairy products?
Fermented foods have a slightly different form of K2 than animal products. From my limited reading, it's not clear if they're used exactly the same in the body, but I've read good things related to geographical areas of Japan where natto consumption is high vs. areas where consumption is lower. Natto (the food) has incredibly high amounts of K2, nothing else comes close. And you'd need to look into dosing a bit, the dosing seems different between MK-4 (animal products) and the MK-7 (fermented foods) forms of K2. I am so not an expert on this. It seems like both animal products and fermented foods are traditional, I'm not sure what balance is best.

I'm in the camp that it's better to supplement than to do without, when getting enough through food just isn't feasible. We use Thorne's K2...and I hope I'm not jinxing things, but just a few days ago I looked at my son's front bottom teeth, the ones that form this V pointing toward his tongue, and either I am delusional, or that V is a lot less pronounced than it used to be--maybe, oh maybe, could his mouth be widening?
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Old 10-28-2008, 10:57 PM
 
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Hi everyone-
I've posted here many times, especially regarding the dental issues of my now 2.5 year old daughter. After many attempts at healing the dental problems of my little girl, we finally gave in to the dental establishment and had her rotten little teeth extracted. It was a horrendous experience and one that I wouldn't wish upon my worst enemy? Picking up my swollen and bloody-mouthed little baby as she was awaking from what amounted to major surgery, what with the GA and all, I was faced with the reality of inter-generational dietary shortcomings---and it wasn't pretty.

I don't know that I have any advice, per se, but I can say that I know there is something wrong at play. Why are our children having these dental problems? I took all the prenatal vitamins; so have my friends who have experienced similar issues with their kids. We read "What to eat when you're expecting" just like every other mom in America. I feel like preaching to all the world, know what it takes to make a healthy little baby!!! We've been duped. I know I'm preaching to the choir here, but thanks for listening!

I hope no one else has to go through this experience. It was unfortunately necessary, after all was said and done, but agonizing nonetheless.

Barb
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Old 10-29-2008, 11:09 AM
 
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to you and your lo.....

sending :to your lo....

I know the frustrating feeling of, wondering why our younger kids are getting more cavities .....especially when we have been eating well and are so concious of our health etc;
Yeah, I think we have been duped as far as nutrition goes......
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Old 11-02-2008, 09:56 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Barb, yes we've been duped in many ways by the "experts". For us it was the devastating effects of antibiotics. At least we have the internet now!! I find it funny that this thoroughly modern tool only led me back to ancient nutritional wisdom.

I wonder if vitamin D wasn't a major issue for you guys living in Oregon? Have you had blood tests? The RDA for vit D is a joke.
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Old 11-10-2008, 08:40 PM
 
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Yeah, we've definitely been keeping dosed up with cod liver oil these days---but I wonder if that's enough?
What else could we be doing?

Barb
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Old 11-17-2008, 01:39 PM
 
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I just ordered this book Cure Tooth Decay and I love it! There's a lot of free information on the website that you can use now.
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Old 12-24-2008, 05:06 PM
 
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Well, I've just ordered from dentist.net

x Dr. Collins Restore Remineralizing Toothpaste - Buy 2 - Expected ship date 2/2/09 @ $12.98 each.
1 x DrTungs hyG Ionic Toothbrush @ $15.99 each.
1 x DrTungs Ionic Toothbrush Replacement Brush Heads (Twin Pack) @ $7.95 each.
1 x Spiffies Dental Wipes - Tripack (1 Grape, 1 Apple, 1 Mango) @ $14.75 each.
1 x Spry Infant Tooth Gel With Xylitol - 2 oz Bottle - Buy 2 @ $9.58 each.
1 x Spry Sugar Free Gum 20 packs of 10 pieces - Cinnamon @ $16.95 each.
1 x Spry Sugar Free Mints 240 pieces - Raspberry @ $8.95 each.
1 x Xylosweet Maylar Bag - 1 lbs Maylar Bag @ $6.99 each.

And from https://www.greenpasture.org

BO-1000 X-FACTOR GOLD High Vitamin Butter Oil, 96 dose 1 $60.00 $60.00
F-1039 BLUE ICE Fermented Cod Liver Oil, Regular 237 dose 1 $39.00 $39.00

I sure hope that for over $200 worth of products I can actually see some difference in my poor DS's teeth. And I hope I can get him to take/use it all

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Old 12-30-2008, 02:26 AM
 
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I've been following up on this forum and thought I would share what we experienced with our son, now 13.

With his baby teeth, he had "classic" bottle mouth. That is, even though he was breast fed, his 4 front teeth (top and bottom) all developed carries. We eventually had these tiny carries filled (using mild oral sedatives). We took him to several dentists - all but one recommended total sedation and total removal of the teeth which seemed excessive and worried us. We elected to do the "less intensive method" and are very glad we did.

But, we were concerned about his new erupting teeth - how would we keep them from being just as bad as his baby teeth?

Around this time we saw an article about a British study that had school children eat a small piece of cheese (can't remember if it was colby/cheddar/swiss) every night upon retiring. Our dentist had also recommended we limit/reduce sweet drinks and encourage our kid to rinse even if he couldn't brush.

We have limited his sweet drinks to one a week (he chooses the day/drink), he brushes every night (at least), rinses with water after any sweet thing or meal, and tries to eat a 1 inch cube of colby or cheddar every night.

Not one cavity in the last 10 years!

My husband and I embraced this practice, too, and neither of us have had a cavity in 15 years, so, I highly recommend it.

Of course, if you have a cheese allergy, you might try to substitute with a probiotic to try to add in the bacteria fighting elements of the cheese, but, I would think a non-milk yogurt might be the best as it would let the bacteria play around in your mouth - I suspect swallowing pills wouldn't achieve the desired result.

If you google "cheese dental carries british study" you'll find references to a number of studies on this topic.

Camas, WA
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Old 12-30-2008, 04:16 PM
 
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I can't find the info so far. Are you eating it and then going to bed without brushing teeth again?

Melissa 38 DH 47, Emerson '06, Arrow '09 angel2.gif, and Drake Valan EDD 12/22/10.
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Old 12-30-2008, 06:15 PM
 
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This is so amazing, I'm going to risk reposting the article. Basically, the cheese alters the ph on the tooth and actually REMINERALIZES the tooth, even in the presence of sugar. (so, no brushing afterwards). Cheese prevented demineralization and enhanced remineralization of enamel and root lesions!


A Protective Effect of Dairy Foods in Oral Health
Protective Effect of Cheese Against Dental Caries

Certain cheeses help to protect against dental caries. When laboratory animals consumed diets high in fermentable carbohydrates, intake of cheese (e.g., Cheddar, mozzarella) reduced the development of dental caries (9-11). Fewer and less severe carious lesions occurred on crowns and root surfaces in desalivated animals (i.e., at high risk of caries because of lack of saliva) which consumed Cheddar- or Swiss-type cheeses with a cariogenic diet (11). This finding that cheese may reduce the risk of root caries is of importance for older adults, many of whom are at high risk of root caries (1).

Eating cheeses such as Cheddar, mozzarella, Swiss, and American helps to protect against dental caries, especially if consumed at the end of a meal or in combination with caries-promoting foods.

Human plaque acidity studies, which measure a food's cariogenic potential, also indicate a protective effect of cheese against dental caries. Cheeses such as aged Cheddar, Swiss, blue, Monterey Jack, mozzarella, Brie, Gouda, and American processed cheese have been demonstrated to prevent plaque pH from falling to a level conducive to caries, even in the presence of sucrose (12-14). Likewise, the beneficial effect of cheese on dental health is supported by demineralization/remineralization studies (14-16). In a human in situ caries model, processed cheese prevented demineralization and enhanced remineralization of enamel and root lesions (14). When subjects chewed hard cheese in situ, tooth enamel surfaces previously softened by a cola-type drink exhibited significantly increased remineralization (15).

Epidemiological and clinical investigations also indicate a protective effect of cheese against dental caries (17-19). Researchers have found that older adults who consume more cheese are at reduced risk of root caries compared to subjects whose intake of this food is low (18,19). When the relationship between diet and root caries was examined in 141 adults aged 47 to 83 years, those in the lowest quartile for root caries consumed approximately twice as much cheese as those in the highest quartile (19). Individuals who were free of root caries consumed 50% more cheese and 25% more of other dairy foods than did those who experienced the most caries (19).
http://www.nationaldairycouncil.org/...d71-1Page4.htm


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Old 12-31-2008, 08:00 PM
 
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We are new to the forum. DH first found this site after our 2.5yr twins first dentist visit. DS1 need root canals and DS2 has five small cavities. The dentist suggests full body sedation for both of them to have the work done. We are so worried about the possible side affect of sedation and root canals. Does anyone know whether root canals of baby teeth have the same dangers to health as the adult teeth root canals (evidenced by the researches of Dr. Price)?

We also are glad to learn from this forum that changing diet and taking cod liver oil and buffer oil and raw milk are so important to healthy tooth. Can any one tell us where to buy raw milk in California. We live in San Gabriel valley area.

Thanks for much.
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Old 01-01-2009, 02:56 PM
 
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I'm so sorry to hear! Which baby tooth needs a root canal? Depending on when it's going to fall out, I would go for an extraction myself. I did have a recent root canal done due to an abscess that formed after getting one of my fillings replaced. I had really no choice because it a last molar in the back, and an implant would've cost a fortune.

To find source for raw milk, look for a local WAP chapter.

http://www.westonaprice.org/localchapters/index.html#ca

~Katie
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Old 01-01-2009, 07:20 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ianryanmom View Post
Does anyone know whether root canals of baby teeth have the same dangers to health as the adult teeth root canals (evidenced by the researches of Dr. Price)?
My understanding is that the potential problem with root canals is due to low-level infection, so it seems that would be the same in both circumstances. I don't know of data on the topic (haven't needed to look into it, thank goodness) and I doubt there'd be any data from Price's time--it seems much more likely a badly infected baby tooth would just be extracted.

And welcome to MDC!
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