Chelating mamas? - Page 5 - Mothering Forums

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Old 09-01-2006, 03:23 PM
 
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Don't do it Jennifer.

He doesn't know the facts that chelating WITH fillings in is very dangerous! It pulls more metals out of them, overwhelms your detox pathways, and more metals are dumped back into brain b/c the body cannot excrete such a large amount at a time. And a challenge test won't tell you what your body burden is. A Hair Elements test will give you this information safely.

Please get Andrew Cutler's book www.noamalgam.com and spend some time reading the files of the Yahoo group he posts in.
http://home.earthlink.net/~moriam/

Cutler does tell you how to do a Challenge test less dangerously... you space out the dosage splitting it into smaller doses taken every 3-4 hours (and I thought it was 250mg not 500mg in a standard Challenge and certainly not both, I'm confused). But says you should only do one if you absolutely need to for proving insurance or something b/c otherwise it's useless.
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Old 09-01-2006, 03:24 PM
 
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Moneca!
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Old 09-01-2006, 03:27 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Jane,
I just edited my last post to ask you about C with Lyme disease. Do you know if Levy covered that. I thought I saw it, but couldn't just find it in my book?
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Old 09-01-2006, 05:23 PM
 
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If it's not in my original list in this thread, it's not in that book: http://www.mothering.com/discussions...d.php?t=507310

but other infectious disease are and I don't think this one can be any different.

There's more here:

Lyme Disease -- Wiped Out By Vitamin C
http://www.newmediaexplorer.org/chri..._vitamin_c.htm
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Old 09-01-2006, 05:24 PM
 
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Very interesting thread :

Mama to 9 so far:Mother of Joey (20), Dominick (13), Abigail (11), Angelo (8), Mylee (6), Delainey (3), Colton (2) and Baby 8 and Baby 9 coming sometime in July 2013.   If evolution were true, mothers would have three arms!

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Old 09-01-2006, 09:47 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Nice - thanks Jane
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Old 09-02-2006, 02:48 PM
 
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Oh my!!!! THANK YOU SO MUCH MONECA AND JANE S!!! I will be researching those sites. I am not pregnant/BF or anything (I hope to be healthy enough to TTC in 1 year). I decided before reading your posts to at least hold off on the "challenge" because I don't feel like I can handle it now. I can't wait to read all the info.Thank you so much for the Lyme disease information.

I want to cry because the MDC mamas are so good to me and so intelligent. I have been in a hard place with PPD, M/C, Lyme, ect and I find so much support and generosity of time here.

Thank you from the bottom of my heart Jennifer

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Old 09-04-2006, 01:28 AM - Thread Starter
 
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Hey mamas!
I just had 8 oz (yes, once again I didn't take it easy, but dove in) from my first batch of kombucha yesterday. I got it for DH and never thought I'd like it since I HATE tea. It was delish! I knew it was a detoxer, but never thought about it working on metals until this morning. I woke at 5:30 and could not go back to sleep. I've always been a sound sleeper and this only happens when my extracellular mercury are high. I've learned this throughout my chelation process and I had this for months before starting chelation. I haven't had this in over two months and am stable and not increasing my chelators anymore. I never had a headache which would suggest redistribution to the brain. The kombucha was the only new thing. Hmmm. Now, I don't know that kombucha would cross the bbb at all. I did a bit more research and found a pretty amazing testimony (at the very bottom of the page) to the mercury chelation ability of kombucha at the WAP site here :

www.westonaprice.org/foodfeatures/kvass.htm

Just for thought. I'm not abandoning Cutler's protocol in any way.
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Old 09-05-2006, 03:11 PM
 
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Just wanted to report in...my time online has been limited lately due to end of summer harvesting and processing!

After my last couple rounds of ALA/DMSA 50/50 I have been feeling shockingly normal. Thank goodness. Better than I've felt in a long time! I'm back to my memory levels from before I took my amalgams out...possibly even better.

I finally took a good look at my bottle of ALA and guess what? It was 50 mg instead of the 25 mg that I had ordered. Someone processing my order must have screwed up. Anyway, I think this is the reason I was so nutty when I first started the ALA, since I was basing my dosages on an incorrect assumption.

I'm starting ALA/DMSA 100/100 today, so wish me luck.
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Old 09-05-2006, 08:35 PM
 
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Can someone tell me what ALA is?
Toraji-I am glad to hear you are doing well.


Thanks,
Jennifer

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Old 09-07-2006, 08:20 PM
 
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So, you may remember me expressing my fears regarding my amalgams a short while back...I'm still heavily nursing my 15 mo...I've got about 10 mercury fillings which are about 13 months old...I would like to breastfeed for years, if that's what the babe wants, and I would like to have additional healthy children...

Today I went to a new dentist who I found through the toxicteeth website. Follows all of the protocols for removal and such, has a nice office, etc. I decided to see him for my cleaning so that I could meet him and at least talk about what I'd be facing. Well, they found decay on one of the amalgamed teeth and I've got an appointment for a crown. They've suggested that I can *simply* pump up a supply of milk and get the work done even though I'm nursing. They referred me to a naturopath for details.

So, now I'm thinking "what if?" and am considering having the rest of the amalgams removed over the next year. I plan to talk to the naturopath as soon as she calls me back, but at one point Moneca invited me to seek support in this thread (and I know how knowlegable everyone here is,) so I thought I'd run it by everyone.

Has anyone tried feeding their boob-loving babe from a bottle for days on end? Do you think this will be adequate as far as protection from toxins?

I know that I shouldn't chelate at all while I have mercury fillings, so if the naturopath suggests any such thing I'll hang up on her. Are there any other key bits of information that I should/should not hear from her that might clue me in on her desire to protect me and babe? The dentist kept talking about how I should start some sort of pre-removal treatment/regime before any work was even done (hinting at chelation!?!!, maybe just supplements?), but they didn't get into details and are not able to give medical advice...

I very much appreciate any opinions or feedback on any of this. I've come to value this thread and dental forum immensely over the last couple of months, on a million different levels.

Sara ~ one dh + one 5yo boy + baby in 2011
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Old 09-29-2006, 05:16 PM
 
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Is it safe to chelate while you still have amalgram fillings in your mouth?

How do you figure out if mercury poisoning is causing your health problems?

Ruth, single mommy to Leah, 19, Hannah, 18 (commuting to college), and Jack, 13(homeschooled)
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Old 09-30-2006, 01:07 AM - Thread Starter
 
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Originally Posted by maybeknott View Post
So, you may remember me expressing my fears regarding my amalgams a short while back...I'm still heavily nursing my 15 mo...I've got about 10 mercury fillings which are about 13 months old...I would like to breastfeed for years, if that's what the babe wants, and I would like to have additional healthy children...

Today I went to a new dentist who I found through the toxicteeth website. Follows all of the protocols for removal and such, has a nice office, etc. I decided to see him for my cleaning so that I could meet him and at least talk about what I'd be facing. Well, they found decay on one of the amalgamed teeth and I've got an appointment for a crown. They've suggested that I can *simply* pump up a supply of milk and get the work done even though I'm nursing. They referred me to a naturopath for details.

So, now I'm thinking "what if?" and am considering having the rest of the amalgams removed over the next year. I plan to talk to the naturopath as soon as she calls me back, but at one point Moneca invited me to seek support in this thread (and I know how knowlegable everyone here is,) so I thought I'd run it by everyone.

Has anyone tried feeding their boob-loving babe from a bottle for days on end? Do you think this will be adequate as far as protection from toxins?

I know that I shouldn't chelate at all while I have mercury fillings, so if the naturopath suggests any such thing I'll hang up on her. Are there any other key bits of information that I should/should not hear from her that might clue me in on her desire to protect me and babe? The dentist kept talking about how I should start some sort of pre-removal treatment/regime before any work was even done (hinting at chelation!?!!, maybe just supplements?), but they didn't get into details and are not able to give medical advice...

I very much appreciate any opinions or feedback on any of this. I've come to value this thread and dental forum immensely over the last couple of months, on a million different levels.
I'm sorry that you didn't get any other advice. I've seen how dangerous mercury has been for me and how well chelation mobilizes it. I would not chelate if ttc, prego, or bf if it were me.
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Old 09-30-2006, 01:11 AM
 
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Curious about your thoughts on this productas a chelating agent.

My homeopath recommended it to me today. She wants me to take it and then let it pass through my b'milk to dd.

It supposedly is safe to use w/amalgams. (I still have 4 left.)

Have more reading to do on it . . .
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Old 09-30-2006, 01:17 AM - Thread Starter
 
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Originally Posted by Ruthla View Post
Is it safe to chelate while you still have amalgram fillings in your mouth?

How do you figure out if mercury poisoning is causing your health problems?
Everything I've read indicates that you should not chelate mercury until the amalgams have been removed.
The most reliable test is a hair analysis, but you can't take this at face value. You could be very mercury toxic, but be storing all your mercury in your organs and have no apparent signs of toxicity on a hair, urine, or stool test. Mercury toxicity causes mineral derangement and there are counting rules discussed at @ www.noamalgam.com to determine toxicity from this. You can have a DDI hair analysis through www.directlabs.com without a doctors order for under $100.00. You can come back here and we can help you with counting rules.
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Old 09-30-2006, 02:28 AM - Thread Starter
 
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Originally Posted by Annikate View Post
Curious about your thoughts on this productas a chelating agent.

My homeopath recommended it to me today. She wants me to take it and then let it pass through my b'milk to dd.

It supposedly is safe to use w/amalgams. (I still have 4 left.)

Have more reading to do on it . . .
Well, right off the bat two ingredients stood out. Chlorella is the only known substance other than alpha lipoic acid (also an ingredient in this product) that crosses the bbb to remove mercury from the brain. The problem with this product is that is can release the mercury before it is excreted from your body. Alapha lipoic acid is a chelator that removes mercury from the brain and organs. To be used safely ALA should be taken "low and slow" and on the Cutler protocol is given every three hours to assure that blood levels remain stable and mercury is removed as safely as possible. DMSA is also used with ALA to lessen the subjective feelings of sickness associated with reintroducing mercury into the system during chelation. The dosing for this product is twice per day which to me is not a safe schedule with the ALA. ALA actually is a two way street as far as the bbb. If there is higher plasma mercury than mercury in the brain it will allow it to go INTO the brain instead of out. For this reason Cutler protocol uses DMSA for several months to lessen plasma mercury levels before ALA is used. See www.noamalgam.com for more details. I also couldn't determine a dose on the ALA from the ingredient list and I would never start with more than 25 mg.
Personally, I would never go back to any practicioner that told me to chelate mercury with amalgams or while bf (esp. if they tried to tell me that the chelator would pass to dd and chelate her also). She sounds very dangerous and to me.
As I said in a previous post, I would NEVER chelate mercury with ANY product while ttc, pregnant, or bf. There is a VERY real danger that more of your mercury will be passed to the child as it is mobilized. Mercury toxicity in babes ususally isn't detectable in infants until they are a bit further in their developmental stages so you don't know the damage that could be taking place.
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Old 09-30-2006, 11:48 PM
 
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moneca,
yep, kinda my thinking on it too. I'm a little : because I tried to explain this to her and she brushed it off. I know that she knows literally nothing about breastfeeding and certainly not much about chelating (except for chelating herself.)

I also told her that this went against the advice my dentist (an awesome homeopathic dentist who discussed w/me at length dd's issues.)

I knew of dd's mercury toxicity before I even had her first hair test done. I can see the mercury rear its ugly head too and it's not pretty. Diet has helped her tremendously as have certain supplements and craniosacral therapy but now I'm at the point where I'm ready to do something *serious* to chelate her. It's so scary to me because she's so young. (I know, there are benefits to this too.)

Guess I'll wait and see what the DAN docs advice is. I'm not ready to go it alone. If it were myself that'd be a whole different story yk?
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Old 10-01-2006, 01:03 AM - Thread Starter
 
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moneca,
yep, kinda my thinking on it too. I'm a little : because I tried to explain this to her and she brushed it off. I know that she knows literally nothing about breastfeeding and certainly not much about chelating (except for chelating herself.)

I also told her that this went against the advice my dentist (an awesome homeopathic dentist who discussed w/me at length dd's issues.)

I knew of dd's mercury toxicity before I even had her first hair test done. I can see the mercury rear its ugly head too and it's not pretty. Diet has helped her tremendously as have certain supplements and craniosacral therapy but now I'm at the point where I'm ready to do something *serious* to chelate her. It's so scary to me because she's so young. (I know, there are benefits to this too.)

Guess I'll wait and see what the DAN docs advice is. I'm not ready to go it alone. If it were myself that'd be a whole different story yk?
I would never try to chelate my child on my own. The younger the child the less they could communicate to you about what is going on in their body. I know from my own experience that chelation can hurt you neurologically if advanced to quickly. Too quickly for one person may be fine for another. I'd find a DAN chelation practicioner who was willing to consult with Cutler and then I'd be sure to request kidney and liver function tests before we did anything. I'd want regular testing for blood chemistry as well as organ function. Chelation can be dangerous even when you try and do everything "low and slow". There isn't anything pleasant about pulling toxins back out through your body, but the benefits for me have been worth the tough spots.
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Old 10-02-2006, 05:28 PM
 
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I mentioned on the curing cavities on nutrition thread that the ND recommended this chelation protocol which supposedly takes two years and can be done while BF. I put in a call to her today to clarify what I'm taking that actually does any chelating-as what she has me taking seems kind of benign. It is Seacure-a hydrolyzed whitefish protein
http://www.propernutrition.com/products.html
and three Unda homeopathic remedies for digestion.
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Old 10-02-2006, 10:39 PM - Thread Starter
 
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I mentioned on the curing cavities on nutrition thread that the ND recommended this chelation protocol which supposedly takes two years and can be done while BF. I put in a call to her today to clarify what I'm taking that actually does any chelating-as what she has me taking seems kind of benign. It is Seacure-a hydrolyzed whitefish protein
http://www.propernutrition.com/products.html
and three Unda homeopathic remedies for digestion.
Oh Sarah, I hope that the Seacure is better for you than it was for us. Our ND (Dr. Schmid with the Weston Price Foundation) placed Sierra on this saying that it would help her stomach motility. It made no sense to me how it could do this, but as he was our 14th practicioner I was desperate to help dd. I always take everything she takes even though my stomach works just to get an idea of what she is tasting and how she is affected. She couldn't take the capsules and that was the nastiest tasting stuff I have ever taken. Worse than that it gave us both shooting liquid diarrhea starting the day after we first took the Seacure for a week while taking it. Dr. Schmid refused to believe it was the fault of his product, but the diarrhea stopped for both of us the day after it was discontinued. Neither of us had previous problems with diarrhea and none since. Further searching found many disgruntled individuals on www.healingcrow.com who considered the product to be expensive rancid fish powder. If I remember 3 people had responded to my inquiry from that site.
I don't know anything about the homeopathic remedies. Sierra tried one for mercury removal with our old ND, but I never saw any difference. I have yet to find an ND that knows very much about chelation or has a "safe" protocol. Cutler talks about the "witch doctor" protocols that many NDs (many can actually be harmful) use in his book. Please let me know if you see any improvements with the Seacure. I'd love to hear something positive about the product. I loved everything else about the ND that gave it to me, but that experience left a bad taste in my mouth in more ways than one.
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Old 10-02-2006, 11:01 PM
 
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I am amazed at all the different supposed chelating products out there now! There was even an ad in Mothering for a new one with a citrus based something or another. How can that chelate?

Moneca, the chapter in AC's book about the witch doctors: Is that in AMalgam Illness Diagnosis and Treatment or in another of his books?
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Old 10-03-2006, 04:08 PM - Thread Starter
 
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I am amazed at all the different supposed chelating products out there now! There was even an ad in Mothering for a new one with a citrus based something or another. How can that chelate?

Moneca, the chapter in AC's book about the witch doctors: Is that in AMalgam Illness Diagnosis and Treatment or in another of his books?
Yes, it would be one thing if all these different chelators only wasted money, but some can be harmful, esp. to more toxic individuals. You will see previous posts by myself and Toraji that attest to neurological consequences of starting with too much chelator.
The witch doctor reference is made toward the protocols used by some NDs. The section starts on p. 131 and continues to 132 titled "what will happen - prognosis". This is found in Amalgam Illness.
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Old 10-04-2006, 05:07 PM
 
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You may remember me saying that I was going to talk to a naturopath re:removal of mercury filling in decayed tooth right away, and general treatment plan for mercury removal someday in the future.

Well, I just got back from her office, and I was hoping to run her treatment plan by you mama's to see what you think. She seemed to be fully aware that I shouldn't be trying to mobilize the mercury. She said that what I WOULD want to do is bind the mercury with other *things* so that it doesn't cross the brain barrier and so that it can be filtered through the liver and out the bowel. She said that her treatment plan would help ensure that the mercury that is going to be released would come out the bowel rather than go into the blood, where my breastfeeding babe could get it.

So, this is what she wants me to start the day before the removal, and to continue for a week in most instances:

A LOT of cilantro

Whey protein powder, 1 Tb a day

A LOT of garlic, beans, broccoli, brussel sprouts, broccoli sprouts, kale

A LOT of fiber, even psillium powder if necessary

Vit C, 1 gram 5x per day

Dandelion and Burdode root tea, everyday

10 glasses of water a day, at least

Green teas

High quality multivitamin: MAXXUM 3 by Karuna (Vits and Mins -Iron) 6caps/day

NAC (N-acetylcysteine) 600 mg/day

Modifilan-pure brown seaweed extract (Laminaria japonica extract) 1500mg and then 3000mg per day

One epson salt bath per day

Does this look reasonable to you? It's mostly foods/natural stuff so I'm less worried about it than I normally would be. She said that none of these things acts as a chelator...

What do you think?

Sara ~ one dh + one 5yo boy + baby in 2011
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Old 10-04-2006, 05:55 PM
 
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FWIW, my holistic dentist said to be very very careful w/cilantro. I am not yet ready to chelate myself (still b'feeding) so I don't know what he *would* recommend.

Interested in hearing others' responses.
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Old 10-07-2006, 12:08 AM - Thread Starter
 
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You may remember me saying that I was going to talk to a naturopath re:removal of mercury filling in decayed tooth right away, and general treatment plan for mercury removal someday in the future.

Well, I just got back from her office, and I was hoping to run her treatment plan by you mama's to see what you think. She seemed to be fully aware that I shouldn't be trying to mobilize the mercury. She said that what I WOULD want to do is bind the mercury with other *things* so that it doesn't cross the brain barrier and so that it can be filtered through the liver and out the bowel. She said that her treatment plan would help ensure that the mercury that is going to be released would come out the bowel rather than go into the blood, where my breastfeeding babe could get it.

So, this is what she wants me to start the day before the removal, and to continue for a week in most instances:

A LOT of cilantro

Whey protein powder, 1 Tb a day

A LOT of garlic, beans, broccoli, brussel sprouts, broccoli sprouts, kale

A LOT of fiber, even psillium powder if necessary

Vit C, 1 gram 5x per day

Dandelion and Burdode root tea, everyday

10 glasses of water a day, at least

Green teas

High quality multivitamin: MAXXUM 3 by Karuna (Vits and Mins -Iron) 6caps/day

NAC (N-acetylcysteine) 600 mg/day

Modifilan-pure brown seaweed extract (Laminaria japonica extract) 1500mg and then 3000mg per day

One epson salt bath per day

Does this look reasonable to you? It's mostly foods/natural stuff so I'm less worried about it than I normally would be. She said that none of these things acts as a chelator...

What do you think?
This sounds like what an old ND tried to tell me on a smaller scale. I can only tell you what I know and that is that mercury is a very dangerous element to take chances with esp. if you're prego or bf. I personally don't buy that her suggestions would not allow the mercury to be mobilized and not pass through to your breastmilk. You're trusing her with a lot. I don't have a clue what some of these things would do. Some are just antioxidants and mild detoxers. I know that Cutler advises against chlorella and (I think) cilantro because they often drop mercury before it exits the body and goes back into circulation. If you're serious about following this protocol I'd at least research every supplement and food item she lists above and find its mechanism of action in protecting your body or binding to the mercury. I personally wouldn't mess with mercury in any way (even having my amalgams cleaned) until my babe had weaned.
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Old 10-07-2006, 09:44 PM
 
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I just got the results of my hair test. Not mercury toxic, according to AC's counting method.

After amalgam removal (3 months ago), the ND I was seeing at the time, asked me to do a urine challenge test and I did it according to AC's more safe method. These results showed I was excreting a lot of mercury and lead (but this test is useless, right? Not a reliable method of determining mercury toxicity?).

I thought I was mercury toxic because: I had a *mouthful* of fillings (3 huge/deep fillings, 5-6 medium-sized ones and 2-3 small surfac-ey ones), have Graves Disease/thyroid issues, etc. I am putting off TTC because I thought I was mercury toxic (ss has autism).

I'm on my second round of DMSA/ALA (12.5/12.5mg) and the side effects of mild headaches are easily handled with supplements and chiropractic adjustments.

Should I continue chelating? What am I missing? What else do I need to consider to make this decision?

Thanks for your help!

Chris
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Old 10-08-2006, 12:28 AM - Thread Starter
 
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Originally Posted by PingPong'sMom View Post
I just got the results of my hair test. Not mercury toxic, according to AC's counting method.

After amalgam removal (3 months ago), the ND I was seeing at the time, asked me to do a urine challenge test and I did it according to AC's more safe method. These results showed I was excreting a lot of mercury and lead (but this test is useless, right? Not a reliable method of determining mercury toxicity?).

I thought I was mercury toxic because: I had a *mouthful* of fillings (3 huge/deep fillings, 5-6 medium-sized ones and 2-3 small surfac-ey ones), have Graves Disease/thyroid issues, etc. I am putting off TTC because I thought I was mercury toxic (ss has autism).

I'm on my second round of DMSA/ALA (12.5/12.5mg) and the side effects of mild headaches are easily handled with supplements and chiropractic adjustments.

Should I continue chelating? What am I missing? What else do I need to consider to make this decision?

Thanks for your help!

Chris
Hmmm. I have to ask you some further questions. Did you use DDI for your hair analysis? Were you breastfeeding at the time of hair analysis?
The headaches are generally thought of as mercury redistribution when chelating and I had them too when I started chelating.
I had some pretty bad signs of toxicity, but I still did the DDI hair analysis to confirm that I was toxic and I met two counting rules - one just barely. That made me decide to chelate and I'm glad I did because I have a list of about 15 things that have totally resolved or improved since I began the ALA portion. I need to list all those things here and just haven't gotten to it. If your answers to my above questions are both "no" then I'm not sure what to tell you. Hair tests while bf are not reliable and Andy only suggests using DDI so I'm not sure about the accuracy of other tests.
I believe the degree of mercury toxicity of an individual has a lot to do with the condition of that person's natural detox pathways. Mine are trash which I attribute to the horrible number of vaxes I received as a child and in ursing school/nursing jobs. Your detox pathways might be much better even though you had QUITE a number of fillings. Have you noticed any improvements even though you just started on ALA?
Anything else I would tell you would be a guess. I would suggest you go to :

http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group...ose-chelation/

Most of the people in this yahoo group are VERY toxic and have been chelating for years. I've found TK's advice to be sound. Andy visits the group occasionally and the folks there know a lot more than I do. Please let me know what they tell you as I will be curious.
Oh, one additional point. Jane S is here frequently. She had 11 (I think) amalgams that were removed by a holistic dentist. I don't know the surface area or depth of her amalgams. Her hair test by DDI showed that she did not meet any counting rules, but she did this while bf. I don't think she has repeated the test yet. Maybe she'll show up soon.
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Old 10-08-2006, 02:06 AM
 
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[QUOTE=moneca;6223258]Hmmm. I have to ask you some further questions. Did you use DDI for your hair analysis? Were you breastfeeding at the time of hair analysis?
The headaches are generally thought of as mercury redistribution when chelating and I had them too when I started chelating.

I did use DDI for the hair analysis.
I am not breastfeeding now or ever (Was preparing for first pregnancy when ss was diagnosed with autism; did my research and found link to amalgam fillings; am delaying TTC to replace fillings and chelate).

Headaches: yeah, that's what I thought. Before I got the hair test results, I felt kinda good that though they were mild, the headaches indicated that I had some mercury to move.

Now, I'm not sure what to think.

Thanks for the reply Moneca. And yes, I've posted on the yahoo group before and am interesting in what JaneS has to say here (no pressure, Jane!).
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Old 10-08-2006, 04:15 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Chris,
Sorry, I don't have any other thoughts on this. I would be really interested to hear what folks at the yahoo group say.
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Old 10-09-2006, 12:13 PM
 
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subbing

I am going to search also but in case it hasn't come up yet - is it a good idea to chelate while breastfeeding?
Thanks!
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