Would you ask for financial help? - Page 2 - Mothering Forums

Forum Jump: 
Reply
 
Thread Tools
#31 of 50 Old 09-13-2012, 05:55 AM
 
sarafi's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Posts: 468
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by annaknitsspock View Post

 

 

I do wonder, though, is it really right for DH to say, "Well, this is just none of my business," when his parents give financial aid to three out of four siblings? To me it seems like obvious favoritism. He's mentioned before that he would feel better if they would at least acknowledge that he has been financially responsible. It makes me feel sad for him.

 

 

In their own way, I think they are acknowledging his success, when they share what they are giving to the other siblings.

 

We have a very similar dynamic in out family. DH's sister has needed and taken thousands of dollars from her parents for various things. Last I was told they were at $60,000.

 

We could use some help at this time, but just don't want to invite the in-laws into our lives as much as SIL has had to due to the money and all the free baby-sitting they provide.

 

It's frustrating that we can't ask for help. A $5,000 loan for about six months would change my world.  (We have had close to $20,000 in unexpected medical debt this year alone). But as it stands, DH told his parents to write him out of the will over all the crazy money drama. I did have to relay the will thing to MIL, as DH can't even stand to talk about it at this point. Money is a crazy thing, and if there is any jealousy or weird feelings surrounding you would be much richer from avoiding the scenario.

sarafi is offline  
#32 of 50 Old 09-13-2012, 07:24 AM
 
tonttu's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Posts: 489
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by annaknitsspock View Post


 

I just had a moment of weakness and stress where I thought, "Why I am I struggling here if they would happily help us?" But I'm calmer now, and would prefer to stay true to the standard of financial independence I have always imposed on us. 

Just to put in my 5 cents , my wonderful Mother has been helping me out and she actually has paid some ( desperately necessary ) repairs to my house , but even though , she doesn´t expect it and she would never , ever take it , if I tried to pay her back .

But it always makes me feel very guilty and there have been many situations , when I would have needed money and didn´t ask her , just scraped by , until the next pay check , so I can totally understand , where you are coming from !

In the long run , it does make one feel better about themselves , if you can look back at your achievements and can say " I did this by myself "

( That however does not include absolute emergencies of course , just every day life )


vbac.gifafter 3 cs fambedsingle1.gifbfinfant.gifHappily single Momteapot2.GIFknit.gif

tonttu is offline  
#33 of 50 Old 09-13-2012, 08:53 AM
 
Delaney21's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Posts: 95
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)

Have you tried talking to the student loan company to have your payment modified?  Every time they raise my payment amount I call them and tell them I can't afford it and they drop it back down to next to nothing.  As long as you keep paying, they seem to be happy.  My interest rate is super low, so I don't have a priority of paying it off early and in your situation paying off a student loan would be far from my mind as well.  

Delaney21 is offline  
#34 of 50 Old 09-13-2012, 09:07 AM - Thread Starter
 
annaknitsspock's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Posts: 110
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:

Originally Posted by sarafi View Post

 

It's frustrating that we can't ask for help. A $5,000 loan for about six months would change my world.  (We have had close to $20,000 in unexpected medical debt this year alone). But as it stands, DH told his parents to write him out of the will over all the crazy money drama. I did have to relay the will thing to MIL, as DH can't even stand to talk about it at this point. Money is a crazy thing, and if there is any jealousy or weird feelings surrounding you would be much richer from avoiding the scenario.

 

I'm sorry you have to deal with that and that your DH is so stressed over it. You're right that money drama creates such unpleasantness in one's life, and we'd all be richer without it. 

 


Quote:
Originally Posted by tonttu View Post

Just to put in my 5 cents , my wonderful Mother has been helping me out and she actually has paid some ( desperately necessary ) repairs to my house , but even though , she doesn´t expect it and she would never , ever take it , if I tried to pay her back .

 

Thanks for the alternate perspective, tonttu. Your mom sounds awesome. My mom would be like that, too, if her finances weren't worse than mine. It's so nice to have a supportive mom (even if it's just emotional support).

 

 


Quote:
Originally Posted by Delaney21 View Post

Have you tried talking to the student loan company to have your payment modified?  

 

Over and over and over again, for years, with absolutely no success. I have Sallie Mae loans, and they really just don't seem to offer another option. The interest-only payment I mentioned is my lowest possible payment. It's more than $500 dollars a month (this is just my private loan--I have federal loans, too) and I'm not even paying it down. It's so frustrating, but again--I have to take responsibility for this. It was my own stupidity that led to me take out a six-figure loan. I honestly think DH regrets marrying me because of these loans. We got married so young that I don't think he really understood how much they were going to effect his life. It's maddening, because these loans put me through a really good school, which (eventually) got me my really good job, but the loan is so big we're still struggling. Ugh, sorry for the rant--I spend altogether too much time thinking about these loans!


Breastfeeding, cloth diapering, vegetarian, working mama treehugger.gif to DD shamrocksmile.gif (10/2010) and wife to a wonderful, opinionated DH Cuss.gif. We loveteapot2.GIF knit.gifreading.gif  trekkie.gif and ourdog2.gif.

annaknitsspock is offline  
#35 of 50 Old 09-13-2012, 09:15 AM
 
APToddlerMama's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Posts: 2,173
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
We deal with blatant favoritism with my in-laws too and it really irritates me to see them spend SO much more on their daughters than on my husband. We've never gotten a dime of help even when we were in a situation (through no fault of our own) in which we could have realllly used the help of just a loan. And my in laws are loaded. But, in the end, I realize we have no right to anything from them and if they choose to spend their money a certain way, that is their business, not ours. Honestly it's the emotional piece that stings the most as none of the siblings need the help at all and it comes in the form of big gifts....leather furniture, incredibly expensive weddings, multiple expensive vacations. Its a slap in the face for sure, but I'm proud we've always been financially independent and I'm glad in a lot of ways that we never allowed them (or had the opportunity) to take that away from us.
APToddlerMama is offline  
#36 of 50 Old 09-13-2012, 09:26 AM - Thread Starter
 
annaknitsspock's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Posts: 110
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)

Thanks for the shared experience, APToddlerMama. It's SO similar to ours, especially the big, luxurious gifts. You're so right that being financially independent in this situation can be a great source of pride. How do you deal with the emotional piece? Does it bother your DH? It just kills me to see my DH get so stressed about money and then watch his face fall when he hears about the money being thrown at his siblings. Have you guys found a way to be at peace with it?


Breastfeeding, cloth diapering, vegetarian, working mama treehugger.gif to DD shamrocksmile.gif (10/2010) and wife to a wonderful, opinionated DH Cuss.gif. We loveteapot2.GIF knit.gifreading.gif  trekkie.gif and ourdog2.gif.

annaknitsspock is offline  
#37 of 50 Old 09-13-2012, 09:29 AM
 
EmsMom's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Posts: 1,383
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 8 Post(s)

Regarding the favoritism of parents.  It really isn't all that unusual for parents to attempt to control their children by keeping them financially dependent, either for every day necessities or for luxury items.  It is kind of a two edge sword -- they are telling their children that they aren't quite competent enough to be independent and the parent also usually gets to control where the money is being spent, using their own taste and beliefs (where you live, what you study at school, your decor).  Financially independent children can be a threat to these kind of parents - they can't be controlled or manipulated.  I guess I am kind of suggesting that financial help from parents doesn't always come with no strings.  Sometimes the manipulation goes the other way with the adult child manipulating the parent, but really the situation is often hopelessly messed up on the whole.  My mother tends to use my siblings financial difficulties as a way to keep them more or less enslaved to serving her emotional (and now physical) needs.  I don't need her so I can't be manipulated.  End of story.  It isn't always completely obvious, but this is something to really keep in mind when you hear or stories or look at your story of being financially independent while other sibs rake in the golden goose.  Just saying ; )
 

EmsMom is online now  
#38 of 50 Old 09-13-2012, 09:44 AM - Thread Starter
 
annaknitsspock's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Posts: 110
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)

Ugh, I'm sorry your mom is so messed up. That must be really stressful. I appreciate the perspective, and I do try to remind myself of the downsides of their situations, but they aren't being manipulated or controlled. They do whatever they want with cash that goes their way and anything they can't buy with it, someone buys it for them. Very few strings. It's just the dynamic in DH's family. The aunt that often gives money can be condescending and loves to tell her niece and nephews how to live their life, so that might be a negative side-effect of the help, but unfortunately we get our fair share of that without the financial help, lol! You're right, though--maybe the endless advice giving is a string they have to deal with, and that's probably stressful, but they're not forced to take that advice. So instead I'm trying on to focus on what's good in my life, and just not worry about theirs. 


Breastfeeding, cloth diapering, vegetarian, working mama treehugger.gif to DD shamrocksmile.gif (10/2010) and wife to a wonderful, opinionated DH Cuss.gif. We loveteapot2.GIF knit.gifreading.gif  trekkie.gif and ourdog2.gif.

annaknitsspock is offline  
#39 of 50 Old 09-13-2012, 11:22 AM
 
EmsMom's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Posts: 1,383
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 8 Post(s)

Used to be stressful, but it doesn't affect me so much any more.  But there are definitely advantages to being financially independent.  That kind of condescending tone you refer to can be shockingly damaging to people and the damage can really impact an individuals ability to pursue their own passions.  If we can't pursue our own passions and interests, then it is sooo easy to succumb to buying into the mainstream.  Pretty soon, we are caving in on our principles, or worse yet, never developing them in the first place.   And not believing in our own abilities, even when they may be amazing!  I removed myself from my tribe years ago and it was about the best thing possible.   I still will take care of my family when they have legitimate needs and I communicate with them all regularly, but the freedom is truly a blessing in all ways. 
 

EmsMom is online now  
#40 of 50 Old 09-13-2012, 05:38 PM
 
justmama's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: beginning anew
Posts: 5,816
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 12 Post(s)

*hugs*  That sounds hard to take.  I kind of understand because my parents just paid for my sister's wedding, my grandparents gave her $1500 for her wedding gift, she's making enough to be financially comfortable and have savings, they built their home on several acres just a few years ago, etc.  I'm a single mom with 3 kids juggling shut-off notices and accepting food stamps.  I'm jealous in one little corner of my mind, but not enough to take from my sister to give to myself if that makes sense.  I did ask my mom for a very small loan($80) in July and promptly paid her back 2 weeks later, several days prior to when I said I would.  My sister regularly borrows or takes several hundred at a time.  It was extremely uncomfortable for me to ask for money but there was no other choices available and I hope to never have to do it again.  I tried to sell things first but it wasn't happening quickly enough.  I don't think I would ask for money unless it was a necessity.....like paying a termination notice or an emergency car repair to get to work or whatever.  My kids and I went through an extremely tough several years where we were eating pancakes 2 meals per day and parking the car up the street so the loan company wouldn't repo it before I could afford to pay the bill.  I wouldn't wish those years on anyone.  But the debts are finally all paid off and my hard work was worth it.  We still struggle but we live in a much nicer area finally in a house with no mold and have an older car that runs and are in a better spot than we were back then.  The hard work was worth it.  And I can take pride in the fact that I did it all by myself without any help.


treehugger.gifjog.gifgreenthumb.gifknit.gifnamaste.gif

justmama is online now  
#41 of 50 Old 09-13-2012, 05:40 PM
 
justmama's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: beginning anew
Posts: 5,816
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 12 Post(s)

By the way, I totally understand cost of living.  Boston and the metro area is crazy expensive.  I'm just south of Providence so I feel your pain.  We aren't much better here.


treehugger.gifjog.gifgreenthumb.gifknit.gifnamaste.gif

justmama is online now  
#42 of 50 Old 09-13-2012, 11:06 PM
 
pek64's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Posts: 2,502
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Regarding th student loans. A credit counselor *may* know of a way to lower the interest rate. Maybe not. Sometimes credit counselors know who to call or what words to say to get a particular action taken by the loan holders. At the very least, you can find out how long to expect to have to deal with it. Sometimes that helps.
pek64 is offline  
#43 of 50 Old 09-15-2012, 06:58 AM
 
my2girlz's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Twin Cities
Posts: 2,458
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by SunRise View Post

When I read your post, I see it as life. You just graduated and have been in the work force for three years. You own a condo / have a mortgage, and you have 143/week for food and clothes. This kind of sounds normal to me. Working your way up. Starting off your adult life. It may not be easy and its a bit tight, but it should get better. If not by your current jobs and income, then eventually experience and bigger and better paying jobs if that is your desire.   Mind you I am 45 and come from a time where one finishing college didnt end up with big paying jobs nor big houses. One did things gradually, basement apartment, starting out jobs, work your way up. 

 

Find time to enjoy yourselves, find room in your budget to free up some extra cash, or save 50 bucks a month for a weekend vacation. Bike rides, fun easy stuff. If your jobs are not right for you, then continue to look and apply for other work. Perhaps your furniture making husband needs to look outside of your current location? Perhaps a big move is in order? Or maybe he can make some furniture on the side for sale, start his own furniture making business.

 

It is tough to see the help flow else where and maybe they dont need it either...I have a sister who endlessly needs financial help, feels entitled, repo'ed cars, trying to live a certain way, beyond her means, etc. Argh, I guess I am just glad that is not me.

I completely agree with this. Most of us have started down at the bottom where you are. It's just part of life. My brother and sister apparently haven't learned this and feel like they should start where my parents are. Not how it works. I think where you are is just fine. We started out living in a junky trailer and furniture that my parents gave us as they upgraded their own. Just keep swimming and work your way up.


SAHM to the munchkins (14.5, 11.5, 9.5, 3, and almost 2)
my2girlz is offline  
#44 of 50 Old 09-15-2012, 07:46 AM
 
loveandgarbage's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Posts: 1,620
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)

OP, I can commiserate with you. My family is currently in a similar position-- we technically have money left over after bills but it's very hard to live on that amount, and there's just not another expense we can cut out. Our financial situation changed recently and we have a surprise baby on the way, so things are tighter than ever. I recently broke down and asked my folks for money (haven't done that since being independent at 18) and it was hard for a number of reasons. But it sounds like in your situation, if your inlaws would give you money with no strings attached/judgment, I would do it and ask for a lump sum. Figure out how much you need to cover late bills, with a little extra for a cushion, and ask for that amount. And then burn the hottest fire under your husband's butt to change his money intake situation because it seems like that's your only option.

 

That said, I understand what it's like to have a partner who doesn't have a good work situation but hasn't done anything about it. It's very, very, very frustrating. You can't force someone to do anything. You have more than my sympathies on that front. But if his situation doesn't change, you might have to downgrade your living situation. Does he realize that?

 

And yes, Boston is stupidly expensive. I went to college there for two years and it was hard to make ends meet even on a student budget!

 

The one thing that stands out to me as to your budget is your twice monthly date nights. Obviously you can't really afford those (and I'm sure you know that!) but what a difficult thing to cut out. DH and I cherish our dates so I understand. We can't afford our sitter anymore (and believe in paying people decently for watching our children, so paying her less, even though she would accept, isn't something we would do or feel good about) so we now rely on childcare swaps with friends. Do you know a family in a similar situation to yours who you could swap date nights with?


Jean, feminist mama raising three boys: W (7), E (5) and L (2.15.13)

loveandgarbage is offline  
#45 of 50 Old 09-17-2012, 07:53 AM
 
Buzzbuzz's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Posts: 317
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)

A lot of the responses are focused on the "whether to request assistance" question.  However, I feel like a lot of them are not addressing the underlying favoritism issue, which is an important one.

 

I do think parents (even of grown children) have a responsiblity to avoid favoritism as it is SO destructive to relationships.  It harms the relationships between siblings, between parents and child and between grandparents and grandchildren. 

 

Maybe I missed it in your posts, OP, but is this part of a long-standing pattern? 

 

I think it is completely legitimate for your husband to have a discussion with his parents that he is feeling hurt by a perceived favoritism of one child over the other.  Only after that discussion and hearing the rationale of his parents to their actions can you really decide as to what extent and on what terms should your family's relationship with his parents proceed.

pattimomma likes this.

I support homebirth that meets the qualifications set forth in the AAP's 2013 policy on homebirth.

Buzzbuzz is offline  
#46 of 50 Old 09-17-2012, 10:58 AM
 
tonttu's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Posts: 489
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Buzzbuzz View Post

A lot of the responses are focused on the "whether to request assistance" question.  However, I feel like a lot of them are not addressing the underlying favoritism issue, which is an important one.

 

I do think parents (even of grown children) have a responsiblity to avoid favoritism as it is SO destructive to relationships.  It harms the relationships between siblings, between parents and child and between grandparents and grandchildren. 

 

Maybe I missed it in your posts, OP, but is this part of a long-standing pattern? 

 

I think it is completely legitimate for your husband to have a discussion with his parents that he is feeling hurt by a perceived favoritism of one child over the other.  Only after that discussion and hearing the rationale of his parents to their actions can you really decide as to what extent and on what terms should your family's relationship with his parents proceed.


THAT !


vbac.gifafter 3 cs fambedsingle1.gifbfinfant.gifHappily single Momteapot2.GIFknit.gif

tonttu is offline  
#47 of 50 Old 09-17-2012, 01:29 PM - Thread Starter
 
annaknitsspock's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Posts: 110
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)

Thanks so much to everyone for responding and sharing your similar stories. Everyone has been really kind and your responses are all so thoughtful. I really, really appreciate it. As of right now we are going to try to make it without help and see how far we get. We had to take a forbearance on my loans, but hopefully that will give us a little time to recover and get back on our feet. Thank you for reminding me how important my financial independence is to me, and I'm sorry to everyone who has had to deal with really negative situations with family and/or finances.

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by loveandgarbage View Post
Do you know a family in a similar situation to yours who you could swap date nights with?

Thanks for your sympathy, loveandgarbage. Yes, my husband knows how bad what he's doing is, he's just paralyzed by stress, I think. I'll keep encouraging him and hopefully one day it will stick. As to the question above, we are actually super lucky with this issue: my dad is always really happy to babysit for dates because he gets to spend very little time with our DD, who he adores (he works long hours). So it's just the cost of the actual date, and we keep it reasonable. We've definitely been going out less lately, or finding free things to do like biking together; as long as we get some of that one-on-one time or I think we'd go crazy!

 

Buzzbuzz and tonttu, thank you so, so much for your perspective. It really validates how I feel about this situation after watching my husband's reaction to it. It's a pattern that has been building since BIL and SIL had their first DD eight years ago, and that has come into really sharp contrast since we've had a child. I really do feel like it's hurtful to DH, so thanks for agreeing with me there.

 

Thanks again, everyone!  


Breastfeeding, cloth diapering, vegetarian, working mama treehugger.gif to DD shamrocksmile.gif (10/2010) and wife to a wonderful, opinionated DH Cuss.gif. We loveteapot2.GIF knit.gifreading.gif  trekkie.gif and ourdog2.gif.

annaknitsspock is offline  
#48 of 50 Old 09-18-2012, 01:19 PM
 
loveandgarbage's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Posts: 1,620
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)

We are experts at cheap dates, too! Besides child swaps, my mom is in the process of moving to our town, so she's in a couple of times a month, and we take full advantage of that! And she's happy as a clam to watch our boys so it works out. It's really wonderful that your dad is able to do the same :).

 

My husband is also paralyzed by stress. It's a tough spiral to get yourself out of. I'm an optimist so I believe our situation will improve and yours will too. So I wish you peace in the meantime. hug2.gif.


Jean, feminist mama raising three boys: W (7), E (5) and L (2.15.13)

loveandgarbage is offline  
#49 of 50 Old 09-20-2012, 03:48 PM
 
AngieB's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Northern California
Posts: 1,555
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
When I read your first post I was strongly on the side of don't ask for any money, but the more I read I'm leaning the other way. It sounds like your dh's family wants to help you but feel like they can't offer and are waiting for dh to ask. Your dh's feelings are hurt because his family gives the other siblings money and not him but they probably ask and you don't. I wouldn't ask for money to pay down your loans but if there is another way they can help why not ask. If it ends up being a problem you'll know to never do it again.

I have friends who get help from their families and I must admit it would be nice to have that option of asking for help when things get hard.
AngieB is offline  
#50 of 50 Old 09-22-2012, 01:38 PM
 
tonttu's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Posts: 489
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by AngieB View Post

When I read your first post I was strongly on the side of don't ask for any money, but the more I read I'm leaning the other way. It sounds like your dh's family wants to help you but feel like they can't offer and are waiting for dh to ask. Your dh's feelings are hurt because his family gives the other siblings money and not him but they probably ask and you don't. I wouldn't ask for money to pay down your loans but if there is another way they can help why not ask. If it ends up being a problem you'll know to never do it again.
I have friends who get help from their families and I must admit it would be nice to have that option of asking for help when things get hard.

 



That is SO true ! Didn´t think of seeing it from that angle , but Angie is right ! If your family is willing to give , use your money to pay off your loans and what they are volunteering to make your live and that of your kids easier ! It doesn´t sound like they will put a guilt trip on you for it , so why not !


vbac.gifafter 3 cs fambedsingle1.gifbfinfant.gifHappily single Momteapot2.GIFknit.gif

tonttu is offline  
Reply

Tags
Finances , Frugality

Quick Reply
Message:
Drag and Drop File Upload
Drag files here to attach!
Upload Progress: 0
Options

Register Now

In order to be able to post messages on the Mothering Forums forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.
User Name:
If you do not want to register, fill this field only and the name will be used as user name for your post.
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.
Password:
Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.
Email Address:

Log-in

Human Verification

In order to verify that you are a human and not a spam bot, please enter the answer into the following box below based on the instructions contained in the graphic.



User Tag List

Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page


Forum Jump: 

Posting Rules  
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are Off