Homemade chicken feed? *new question in post #8* - Mothering Forums

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#1 of 27 Old 04-20-2009, 06:20 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Does anyone have any suggestions for making chicken feed from...scratch? No pun intended there! : It seems silly to me that I'm paying for a machine to mash up a bunch of stuff when I could probably do it myself. Also, I can't find anything local that's soy-free, and I really, really, really do not want soy to be included in the diet of my chickens.


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#2 of 27 Old 04-20-2009, 11:41 PM
 
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If you had access to wheat, oats, unmilled barley, corn, flax and field peas your could make a decent food for them but it may not be a high enough protine for them to keep laying at a good rate.
I'm curiose though, why no soy - if it is organic (which all the grains should be) then it is GMO free. Soy adds methalonine - an important amino acid to the feed, without it the birds tend to loose feathers and over time drop in production - that is why soy is used as a protine base for many feeds. Synthetic methalonine is nasty stuff and illegal in organic feeds so small amount of soy are nessasry for a nurtritionaly balaced diet.
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#3 of 27 Old 04-21-2009, 01:03 AM - Thread Starter
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by momtoalexsarah View Post
If you had access to wheat, oats, unmilled barley, corn, flax and field peas your could make a decent food for them but it may not be a high enough protine for them to keep laying at a good rate.
I'm curiose though, why no soy - if it is organic (which all the grains should be) then it is GMO free. Soy adds methalonine - an important amino acid to the feed, without it the birds tend to loose feathers and over time drop in production - that is why soy is used as a protine base for many feeds. Synthetic methalonine is nasty stuff and illegal in organic feeds so small amount of soy are nessasry for a nurtritionaly balaced diet.
I have easy access to all of those things, except maybe field peas, but I'm sure that I could find someplace to order them from. I buy my grains whole and grind them, so if I did it every two weeks or so and froze it, it would probably have a lot more nutrients than the stuff I'm buying at the feed store anyway.

We avoid soy in our home (more links to breast cancer than I'm comfortable with), so I don't want it going into my chickens either, since we're eating the eggs. I'll have to investigate what my other methalonine options are besides synthetic methalonine and soy.

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#4 of 27 Old 04-21-2009, 03:19 AM - Thread Starter
 
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Okay, so I did some Googling on methaionine, and it seems that there are other foods besides soy that have high levels of methaionine. I guess now I just have to figure out how much of it they actually need, so that I can figure out if it will work for me to replace the soy in their diet.

Also, as far as field peas go; is there any difference between field peas and garden peas?

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#5 of 27 Old 04-21-2009, 12:39 PM
 
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field peas are like cowpeas or blackeye peas. Garden peas are green peas.

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#6 of 27 Old 04-21-2009, 12:56 PM
 
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I found a soy-free recipe from the Weston A Price Foundation. We don't want soy in our chicken's feed either due to soy allergies in our family.

Here's what I have:
7 parts wheat
2 parts whole or cracked corn
2 parts kamut
1.5 parts sesame seeds
1 part hulled barley
1 part millet
1 part oat groats
1 part quinoa
1 part sunflower seeds
1/2 part flax seeds (soaked and dried)
1/2 part kelp granules
1/4 part finely ground eggs shells (make sure they're dried/cooked first)
fraction of non-iodized salt

Hope that helps!

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#7 of 27 Old 04-21-2009, 02:56 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chicky2 View Post
field peas are like cowpeas or blackeye peas. Garden peas are green peas.
Ah, gotcha.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sihaya View Post
I found a soy-free recipe from the Weston A Price Foundation. We don't want soy in our chicken's feed either due to soy allergies in our family.

Here's what I have:
7 parts wheat
2 parts whole or cracked corn
2 parts kamut
1.5 parts sesame seeds
1 part hulled barley
1 part millet
1 part oat groats
1 part quinoa
1 part sunflower seeds
1/2 part flax seeds (soaked and dried)
1/2 part kelp granules
1/4 part finely ground eggs shells (make sure they're dried/cooked first)
fraction of non-iodized salt

Hope that helps!
Thanks, I didn't even think of checking with them! Duh!

So, is this calling for the egg shells to be dried and cooked?

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#8 of 27 Old 08-16-2009, 03:18 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sihaya View Post
I found a soy-free recipe from the Weston A Price Foundation. We don't want soy in our chicken's feed either due to soy allergies in our family.

Here's what I have:
7 parts wheat
2 parts whole or cracked corn
2 parts kamut
1.5 parts sesame seeds
1 part hulled barley
1 part millet
1 part oat groats
1 part quinoa
1 part sunflower seeds
1/2 part flax seeds (soaked and dried)
1/2 part kelp granules
1/4 part finely ground eggs shells (make sure they're dried/cooked first)
fraction of non-iodized salt

Hope that helps!
I have a really dumb question about this...I don't nee to grind any of the grains up, right?

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#9 of 27 Old 09-25-2009, 11:43 AM
 
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I was wondering that too...
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#10 of 27 Old 09-25-2009, 02:06 PM
 
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We just feed a Barley, corn and fish meal mix to our layers, along with all the vegetation they can stuff themselves with, and we get awsome eggs
It looks like its 80% barley and 20 percent cracked corn with a nice amount of fishmeal added.
We feed this ration for several reasons. Its "organic", its soy free, and its ingredients are all grown in Alaska. And best of all, you get 80 pounds for $25!

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#11 of 27 Old 09-25-2009, 02:06 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rikki Jean View Post
Ah, gotcha.



Thanks, I didn't even think of checking with them! Duh!

So, is this calling for the egg shells to be dried and cooked?
If you add egg shells, they must be roasted in the oven, and then fully crushed.

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#12 of 27 Old 09-25-2009, 02:32 PM
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I've done a fair amount of research on homemade chicken diets, but I haven't made any yet, so here is my thinking, FWIW.

Finding a source of protein is usually the tough part, and the most expensive ingredient. That's why soy is so often used, it's a cheap, plentiful vegetable protein source.

That recipe doesn't look like it will have 16% protein. The only high protein ingredients I see are the sesame, sunflower and flax seeds, but not enough of them compared to the grains. Grains generally have 12-13% protein, corn is lower at 8%, oil seeds higher, most legumes are ~20% IIRc, whole soy is 24%, oil seed meals (what left over after oil extraction) is over 30%. Don't quote me on those #s, they may not be spot on. A recipe is fairly easy to formulate given what you have available to you, calculating a proper level of protein and having a calcium source. Feeding milk is traditional because it's high in protein and calcium. Fish meal is excellent as well. But then the focus should be what easily available, affordable, with as much variety as possible.

Grinding and combining the ingredients keeps the birds from picking out what they want to eat and leaving the rest.

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#13 of 27 Old 09-25-2009, 03:45 PM
 
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So the grain needs to be ground? Could you mix it with milk for protein and kind of make a mash? My chickens are totally free ranging - aren't they getting protein from the bugs they're catching?
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#14 of 27 Old 09-26-2009, 08:34 AM
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At least cracked or crushed to the degree that all the components are relatively unrecognizable. It doesn't have to be ground into flour.

They do eat bugs and whatnot outside, but it seems only enough to naturally balance their foraging, not a huge amount that would balance a low protein grain ration. If you keep them enclosed in bad weather at all, mine are cooped for the winter, they need a complete diet.

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#15 of 27 Old 09-26-2009, 02:07 PM
 
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FYI on milk. Be very careful giving them any amount of milk. It will stop them laying.
We feed a small amount of raw kefir once in a while, and that is all.
We had friends that tried to up the protien with milk, and it took several weeks before they were all laying again.

Fish meal takes care of protein very well, and then you can keep the grain down to a simple list. Barley, wheat and oats do not need ground, but corn should be cracked.

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#16 of 27 Old 09-27-2009, 06:56 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Thanks for the info everyone. My hens haven't layed for almost two months now, and I've been wondering if they're not getting enough protein (someone told me that they may just not be laying because of the heat; someone else said that they go through cycles of laying and not laying, and that they are like human women, in that they tend to cycle together). I've also noticed that there are feathers all over the yard, but I wasn't sure if that was because they are going through their natural molting stage, or losing because of the lack of protein.

Quote:
Originally Posted by PaulaJoAnne View Post
If you add egg shells, they must be roasted in the oven, and then fully crushed.
How hot and for how long?

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#17 of 27 Old 09-29-2009, 02:54 AM
 
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interesting thread!

we have been feeding the weston price recipe to our baby chicks who are now 4 weeks old and i have been feeding scrambled eggs for protein w/ some yogurt. i have been raising meal worms and red worms and hopefully have enough and will also add these to the mix.

when they get older and are on pasture, i will give left over meat and meaty bones to them. they love meat! in addition to bugs they find. i also will not vary the grains quite as much when they are older. our chickens in the past have done really well w/ mostly wheat/corn, pasture, and leftover meat/kefir.

paula, wondering where you get your fish meal?
thanks,
lisa
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#18 of 27 Old 09-29-2009, 12:41 PM
 
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How hot and for how long?
Not sure on the temp, but you just roast them till they are browned.
The goal is to make sure there is no resemblence to an eggshell.
They will start eating their own eggs if they like the shells as is.

Quote:
paula, wondering where you get your fish meal?
OUrs comes already mixed, but we can buy it by the bicket or bagful at the feedstore.
Ours comes originally from Kodiak. Its made from whats left after the fish processors filet the salmon.
Many farmers and gardeners use it as fertilizer as well.

Paula, wife to Steve, mother hen to 38 , busy doing : TTC after 6
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#19 of 27 Old 09-30-2009, 01:37 PM
 
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Subbing to catch up---my hens will thank me--they like when I mix it up & "cook" for them....
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#20 of 27 Old 10-02-2009, 06:34 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by she View Post
I've done a fair amount of research on homemade chicken diets, but I haven't made any yet, so here is my thinking, FWIW.

Finding a source of protein is usually the tough part, and the most expensive ingredient. That's why soy is so often used, it's a cheap, plentiful vegetable protein source.

That recipe doesn't look like it will have 16% protein. The only high protein ingredients I see are the sesame, sunflower and flax seeds, but not enough of them compared to the grains. Grains generally have 12-13% protein, corn is lower at 8%, oil seeds higher, most legumes are ~20% IIRc, whole soy is 24%, oil seed meals (what left over after oil extraction) is over 30%. Don't quote me on those #s, they may not be spot on. A recipe is fairly easy to formulate given what you have available to you, calculating a proper level of protein and having a calcium source. Feeding milk is traditional because it's high in protein and calcium. Fish meal is excellent as well. But then the focus should be what easily available, affordable, with as much variety as possible.

Grinding and combining the ingredients keeps the birds from picking out what they want to eat and leaving the rest.

I just ran that recipie through my feed ration maker program and it is only comming out at 14.2% and that is not near enough to get and keep hens laying.
I would caution those of you that are useing fish meal as a protien souce. Fish meals are a concentrate of fishery leftovers - they are also very high in heavy metals, mercury,bcps and lead. Fish meal toxins when fed to animals is bioaccumulated in the fats - and in the eggs they lay. From a safety stand point I would take soy over fish. The oestrogens in the soy are not passed on through the eggs or meat and if it is organic soy - then there is no GMO.
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#21 of 27 Old 10-02-2009, 06:55 PM - Thread Starter
 
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I just ran that recipie through my feed ration maker program and it is only comming out at 14.2% and that is not near enough to get and keep hens laying.
I would caution those of you that are useing fish meal as a protien souce. Fish meals are a concentrate of fishery leftovers - they are also very high in heavy metals, mercury,bcps and lead. Fish meal toxins when fed to animals is bioaccumulated in the fats - and in the eggs they lay. From a safety stand point I would take soy over fish. The oestrogens in the soy are not passed on through the eggs or meat and if it is organic soy - then there is no GMO.
Thanks for the info on the protein count. It's really weird to me that it's so low, especially since it's supposed to be a WAP recipe. That makes no sense...

As far as the fish meal is concerned, I can see where that would be a problem. However, if it's coming from free-range salmon, like in PaulaJoAnne's case, that is generally a very low-mercury count fish. I don't know what will be available to me here in California, but I'll definitely be thinking about the mercury count when I'm looking.

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#22 of 27 Old 10-04-2009, 04:33 PM
 
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Thanks for a well informed thread and great questions!

Here is another. My hens just love the whole fresh coconut that I bought for my kids to whack and eat. The kids lost interest in it and the chickens have been pecking at it for a few days now.

I assume it is okay and maybe good to fatten them up for winter?
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#23 of 27 Old 10-06-2009, 01:26 AM
 
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i believe i saw someone advertising feeding coconuts to chickens. you may want to do a search.

i have used the weston price recipe in the past but my chickens were free range and got meat scraps and yogurt/kefir. we always had plenty of eggs. there is a weston price farmers chat group if you are interested in discussing the recipe there. i have never raised baby chicks, however, on this formula. only started it when my chickens were around 4 months old or so.

i am having a tough time now figuring out what to do about protein w/ 34 chicks. i have been giving them scrambled eggs and yogurt, but now they are getting so big and eating so much at 5 weeks old... i am raising meal worms and red worms but not sure i can get them enough right now w/ the amount of worms that i have.

i think when they are older i will try to source some meaty bones/less desirable cuts of meat from farms /grocery to feed as many chickens as i have, but since we have plenty of land, i may not need to because they will probably meet their protein requirements from bugs/worms and such.

it's a process!

lisa
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#24 of 27 Old 10-06-2009, 03:59 AM - Thread Starter
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by daisycullen2003 View Post
i believe i saw someone advertising feeding coconuts to chickens. you may want to do a search.

i have used the weston price recipe in the past but my chickens were free range and got meat scraps and yogurt/kefir. we always had plenty of eggs. there is a weston price farmers chat group if you are interested in discussing the recipe there. i have never raised baby chicks, however, on this formula. only started it when my chickens were around 4 months old or so.

i am having a tough time now figuring out what to do about protein w/ 34 chicks. i have been giving them scrambled eggs and yogurt, but now they are getting so big and eating so much at 5 weeks old... i am raising meal worms and red worms but not sure i can get them enough right now w/ the amount of worms that i have.

i think when they are older i will try to source some meaty bones/less desirable cuts of meat from farms /grocery to feed as many chickens as i have, but since we have plenty of land, i may not need to because they will probably meet their protein requirements from bugs/worms and such.

it's a process!

lisa
my girls are free roamers, but they don't get meat scraps or yogurt/kefir.

can you direct me to the wap chicken discussion group?

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#25 of 27 Old 10-07-2009, 03:08 AM
 
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sure, it's a yahoo group called WAPFarmers.
lisa
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#26 of 27 Old 06-12-2010, 04:43 AM
 
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Bumping this thread. I really need to start making my own chicken feed this month as I can not afford the organic feed anymore. The WAP recipe is just to long with to many ingredients, it shouldn't be that hard to feed chickens! I like PaulaJoAnne's reciped, but I don't have as easy access to cracked corn, can I use oats instead? The fish meal safety someone brought up does worry me too.

TIA!

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#27 of 27 Old 06-15-2010, 10:33 AM
 
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this is indeed a great thread.. thanks wise chicken mamas!

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