Vitamin K for newborns? - Mothering Forums

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#1 of 30 Old 04-02-2010, 10:50 AM - Thread Starter
 
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Does anyone have advice/information on vitamin K for newborns? I told my midwife I planned on refusing the vitamin k shot, and she asked if I'd be okay with the oral version. As I understand, butter oil is high in vit K, and if I've been getting plenty of that, the baby should be fine. Any thoughts?

This is from the Weston A Price website:

(http://www.westonaprice.org/Traditio...Illnesses.html)

VITAMIN K SHOT: Just say no! This is actually a vaccination that has been linked to childhood leukemia. The vitaminK is synthetic and it comes in a liquid that contains benzyl alcohol, carbolic acid, propylene glycol (which is antifreeze),acetic acid, hydrochloric acid, lecithin and castor oil—all these injected into the blood of your newborn. The rationalefor the shot is that infants don’t have vitamin K—needed for blood clotting—in their bloodstream for the first eight daysof life, so if there is bruising during delivery, or if he is in a car accident on the way home from the hospital, he mightbleed to death. But if Mom’s blood level is very high in vitamin K during pregnancy, some will go through the placentaand into the infant. Goose liver, cheese and egg yolks are excellent sources—and these are foods Mom should be eatinganyway. A cup or two of nettle tea each day starting about 36 weeks gestation is another way to build vitamin K stores.

Zoe, mama to one "rough and tough" dude (8/02/06) and one new sweet pie (4/11/10)
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#2 of 30 Old 04-02-2010, 01:20 PM
 
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I have skipped it with my last 4 babies. They have all been just fine. I think that the vit. K/leukemia thing is not a for certain link. I haven't done all the research on it, but I don't know how strong that connection is. Doesn't make me want to run out and get the shot for my babies, but still.
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#3 of 30 Old 04-02-2010, 01:40 PM
 
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My first child had it because she was a forceps delivery, I declined it for my second, and my 3rd and last child had it because I was on high doses of anticoagulants and bloodthinners during my whole pregnancy.

Heather married to my highschool sweetheart 6/7/02 :cop: Mother to Dani age 14 and Timmy age 10 Nadia 1/29 :
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#4 of 30 Old 04-02-2010, 02:00 PM
 
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Here's Dr. Mercola's very recent excellent interview with a world known Vitamin K expert: The Dark Side of the Routine Newborn Vitamin K Shot

I listened to it although Vitamin K is not given at all to newborns here in Greece.

Apparently the oral version is much more preferable and the correlation of the shot with childhood leukemia is just a myth.
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#5 of 30 Old 04-02-2010, 05:24 PM
 
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there's 2 different forms of vitamin K, and i think the one that's usually found in animal sources doesn't help with the blood clotting factor, but i could be wrong. iirc one of the ladies that posts on here (or H&H/Allergies?) said that supplementing with one type of vitamin K seemed to cause nosebleeds in her son because of a deficiency elsewhere...nettles and red raspberry leaf infusions and eating leafy greens are a good way to go, imo. i found gentlebirth.org's information on vitamin K to be very helpful in deciding what route to take when i had my second child.

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#6 of 30 Old 04-02-2010, 05:26 PM
 
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My midwife's assistant told me to take alfalfa capsules to boost my own vitamin K. I would have accepted oral vitamin K had we had a traumatic birth, but really don't think it's necessary as a matter of course.

<>< Alison
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#7 of 30 Old 04-02-2010, 05:34 PM
 
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Sorry to threadjack, but I've been wondering about this too. I would normally just make sure I was boosting my already large intake of leafy greens in the last months but now that I'm scheduled for a cesarean I'm reconsidering that. Would that qualify as traumatic? I know birth injuries are more likely so just in that instance?

I'm torn now, what would you do in this case? TIA!

Kelly, wife to J and mama to our precious A, HE'S 5! and the parasite will emerge on or before Sept 24, 2010!
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#8 of 30 Old 04-02-2010, 05:49 PM
 
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My DS was born vaginally, drug-free, at home and because of how fast the labor was and how I could not help but push before I was 10cm, he ended up with a hematoma on the top of his head (size of a silver dollar or so). I had already refused everything during my pregnancy (including sonogram) so my midwife wasn't shocked when I refused the shot (I asked her if I could read the label and I said "oh, aluminum, yeah, I'm gonna go with no". Anyway, she told me where I could get oral K and I asked my mom to pick it up. My mom made an honest mistake and got "Liqiud K" potassium. So DS never got a K supplement, but his hematoma healed in under a day--totally gone.

Just anectodal, but thought I'd share.
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#9 of 30 Old 04-02-2010, 06:05 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by desertpenguin View Post
there's 2 different forms of vitamin K, and i think the one that's usually found in animal sources doesn't help with the blood clotting factor, but i could be wrong. iirc one of the ladies that posts on here (or H&H/Allergies?) said that supplementing with one type of vitamin K seemed to cause nosebleeds in her son because of a deficiency elsewhere...nettles and red raspberry leaf infusions and eating leafy greens are a good way to go, imo. i found gentlebirth.org's information on vitamin K to be very helpful in deciding what route to take when i had my second child.
Supplementing with K2 stops my son's nosebleeds, he started getting them after I started giving him CLO--I think the EPA affects us particularly strongly in my family. Supplemental K2 stops my easy bruising as well--though of course it took me most of my life to realize that I bruise easier than other folks.

OP--check out the protocol in Japan, I think they use K2, orally, for newborns. I'm not sure, but it seems worth checking.

There's also been some discussion at wholehealthsource.blogspot.com about vit K and the difference between K1 and K2 during pregnancy and in newborns. K1 and K2 seem to transfer through the placenta differently.

http://wholehealthsource.blogspot.com/search?q=prenatal
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#10 of 30 Old 04-02-2010, 06:45 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Hmmm..thanks for all the advice. I have been drinking nettle tea, as well as alfalfa tea and rrl tea.

Zoe, mama to one "rough and tough" dude (8/02/06) and one new sweet pie (4/11/10)
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#11 of 30 Old 04-02-2010, 08:32 PM
 
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Originally Posted by TanyaLopez View Post
Supplementing with K2 stops my son's nosebleeds, he started getting them after I started giving him CLO--I think the EPA affects us particularly strongly in my family. Supplemental K2 stops my easy bruising as well--though of course it took me most of my life to realize that I bruise easier than other folks.
sorry for misremembering that info!

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#12 of 30 Old 04-02-2010, 09:54 PM
 
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Originally Posted by desertpenguin View Post
sorry for misremembering that info!
Well, I couldn't tell if you meant us, or maybe Mammo2Sammo, who _does_ have issues supplementing K2 her kids, but I don't remember exactly what her issues are. The funny thing is, we have somewhat related health issues, yet opposite (but both extreme and unusual) reactions to the same nutrient! Surely it means something, but I don't know what.
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#13 of 30 Old 04-02-2010, 09:55 PM
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I refused it for my second baby, but I did a lot of reading of studies and differing opinions to decide if I wanted to use the oral version. What I ended up doing was taking the oral stuff myself (K1, the plant form, and naturally derived), in addition to a diet high in both forms of K. I took the supplement the last 6 weeks of pregnancy. IIRC, it is mainly K1 that they say helps regulate blood clotting, and K2 is more related to mineral utilization from the blood, but that they interact and overlap somewhat.

My recollection is that the studies I read indicated high maternal blood levels of K1 through diet or supplementation do raise levels in breastmilk, but do not raise it in the newborn's blood. That indicates to me that there is a very good, natural reason newborns do not have elevated K1 in their blood even if mom's levels are high, and injecting it or giving a big oral dose to baby right after birth, in the absence of trauma, seemed wrong to me based on that. I think the study authors concluded that since high blood levels in mom don't translate to high blood levels in baby, that indicates a need to inject it into the newborn, but my interpretation is different. I think the same studies indicated blood levels in baby go up steadily over the days following birth if they are getting breastmilk from a mom with adequate blood levels or formula containing adequate levels. I decided I'd trust nature's wisdom and let my baby get it through (hopefully) optimal levels in breastmilk to build up his levels naturally. We did not have any birth trauma or blood disorders to deal with, or I may have made a different decision. I wish I still had the links to the studies, it took some digging to find them at the time but I don't seem to have the bookmarks now. Anyway, that's what felt right to me. My midwife agreed with me, but we both understood an apparently non-traumatic birth is no guarantee that baby is in the clear with regards to bleeding, she's had past clients whose babies ended up with internal bleeding with no known risks (no deaths, and only a couple of babies in over 1000 births she'd attended), but I did my own research to make an informed decision and find a comfort level, and she supported my choice.

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#14 of 30 Old 04-03-2010, 09:17 AM
 
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I tolkd my mw I would only let bub have it if there was any trauma during the birth. She was fine with that and lined up a hospy to get it from if we needed it, which we didn't.

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moving to I'm pregnant.

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Moved from I'm Pregnant.

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#17 of 30 Old 04-03-2010, 09:09 PM
 
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Didn't do it.

I think the oral would still have winning arguments over the IM shot by Merck. But then I think if you have a true reason to use it, then you should probably be using the shot anyways...

I've also been puzzling over the K1/K2 issue. And the issue of colonization, antibiotics and maternal health.

Mama to expecting Babe 2
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#18 of 30 Old 04-03-2010, 09:09 PM
 
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We skipped it with both HB babies. I would only consider it if it were a rough birth or if I were going to circumcise a boy, but since his birth was gentle and he is intact, we skipped it.

CPST & mom

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#19 of 30 Old 04-03-2010, 09:17 PM
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Skipping it.

My midwife recommends that I start taking liquid chlorophyll, chlorophyll gel caps, or alfalfa tablets at 37 weeks pregnant. Any of these should add a substantial amount of Vitamin K to your system, which should in turn get passed along to your babe.

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#20 of 30 Old 04-03-2010, 11:33 PM
 
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My midwife suggests it only if the baby comes out very bruised, or if we were planning to circ (which we aren't). I would personally trust them if they said we needed to do it, but they said it is rare they make this recc.
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#21 of 30 Old 04-04-2010, 01:24 AM
 
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My midwife suggests it only if the baby comes out very bruised, or if we were planning to circ (which we aren't). I would personally trust them if they said we needed to do it, but they said it is rare they make this recc.
Yep. This was my MW recommendation too. I also did a tea with RRl, nettles and alfalfa during the second two tri of preg, which I think was plenty.

I did wind up doing the shot, b/c he came out kinda bruised, but to be honest I wish I hadn't. I really don't think it was necessary and now that he has shown food sensitivities I am really second guessing any of the few interventions I did do (not that it's necessarily the cause). We have refused all other shots/vax since!

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#22 of 30 Old 04-04-2010, 09:57 AM
 
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I wanted to add that colostrum is rich in vitamin K, so breastfeeding should take care of it too. If you're not breastfeeding, I would probably supplement.

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#23 of 30 Old 04-04-2010, 11:04 AM
 
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We opted out also. It was another well researched decision, not one taken lightly, and we discussed it with our doctors.
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#24 of 30 Old 04-04-2010, 04:06 PM
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another "only if really necessary" mama here. My MW never ever pushed it but after a really really long hard labor and DD being quite bruised she suggested it and I said ok. Honestly if I had thought more about it I would have said no but I was so utterly exhausted I wasn't thinking to clearly.
That said DD's bruising cleared up by the next morning and i really think it was totally unnecessary and actually regret getting it...Sigh, next baby will definitely not be getting it.
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skipped it.

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#26 of 30 Old 04-05-2010, 11:38 AM
 
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we had it with all the kids, but i also had traumatic birth with #1, #2, and #4 and my son had a bleeding issue. we also had to circ my son (birth defect) and had gotten it for that before the bleeding issue showed up. after that trauma, we just decided to do the vit k shot with all future kids. the link in the op says that vit k is a vaccine?

we refused the hepb shots and the eye gunk, though.

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#27 of 30 Old 04-05-2010, 01:16 PM
 
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Didn't do it.

I read though that late-onset HDN can appear up to 6 months post birth. Peak incidence at 2-8 weeks. I was a little nervous at having to wait so long to be in the clear, but I ate lots of vit K rich foods like kale. I think I eat kale every day, lol.

I'm glad we didn't do it. We did do it with my son and I really wish we didn't.

I think the reason they say it is a vax is because the shot has preservatives and stuff in it like vaxxes.
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#28 of 30 Old 10-30-2012, 07:12 PM
 
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I know this is an old thread, but I found it because I discovered today that my DS (7 months old) was given a Vitamin K shot at the hospital after being born. Unfortunately I was not aware that it was standard practice to do this for newborns, and I became furious when I realized after requesting itemized records from the billing department (the ins EOB was very vague) that this was done. I declined the Hep B shot in the hospital for him, but cannot for the life of me understand why I was not asked for consent about the vitamin K shot?! 

 

So, my question to you ladies it this: did you already know about this before hand or where you told about it by your hospital/birth center etc? I guess there is nothing I can do about it now, and I am just trying to let it go. However, I do feel like I should at least be able to ask questions of the hospital about his policy and why I was not asked. I tried to call the medical records department today to request a copy of the info for what he received so that I can at least see what was in this concoction they so quickly injected into my son shortly after birth. :(

 

Also, I know this is not on the topic of this thread, but I feel like there are so many things I just didn't "know" before having my son and I feel guilty about not learning more before he was born. Sometimes I feel like I am playing catch-up and find myself saying, "I wish I'd known about this before" a lot. Like I wish I would have found LLL while pregnant instead of when he was 5 months, and that I'd read the Womanly Art of Breastfeeding while pregnant too! Ok, enough of my venting on that topic. 

 

Thanks!


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#29 of 30 Old 10-31-2012, 10:35 PM
 
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Most states don't ask for your consent to give the Vitamin K shot because it's state mandated.

 

I noticed that I posted on this thread two years ago saying that colostrum should cover what baby needs. I've learned more about Vitamin K recently and it seems that Vitamin K Deficiency Bleeding is the one disorder where there's a higher incidence in breastfed babies than in bottlefed babies. Bottlefed babies get lots of Vitamin K from formula, where breastfed babies have lower levels of vitamin K. A baby who doesn't get either an injection or oral vitamin K has a 1 in 5000 chance of VKDB, whereas in newborns who get extra vitamin K, there are no reported cases.


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#30 of 30 Old 11-01-2012, 05:54 AM
 
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Most states don't ask for your consent to give the Vitamin K shot because it's state mandated.

 

I noticed that I posted on this thread two years ago saying that colostrum should cover what baby needs. I've learned more about Vitamin K recently and it seems that Vitamin K Deficiency Bleeding is the one disorder where there's a higher incidence in breastfed babies than in bottlefed babies. Bottlefed babies get lots of Vitamin K from formula, where breastfed babies have lower levels of vitamin K. A baby who doesn't get either an injection or oral vitamin K has a 1 in 5000 chance of VKDB, whereas in newborns who get extra vitamin K, there are no reported cases.

Right. This is also something I've been researching more this time and I have come to the same conclusion. Personally, we will opt for the shot. I live in Kentucky, and I have to sign a consent form for it. I dont have to sign consent for the eye ointment. 

 

Also, just to clarify for anyone who is reading: Vitamin K is not a vaccine.

Vaccine: a preparation of killed microorganisms, living attenuated organisms, or living fully virulent organisms that is administered to produce or artificially increase immunity to a particular disease.


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