This is unsustainable...sleep issues...arrgh! - Mothering Forums

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#1 of 10 Old 03-15-2012, 09:00 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Gosh, there are so many issues I don't know where to start,  Maybe just with tonight's most prevalent issue...DD would not fall asleep for, or be soothed by DH, even when he picked her up out of the crib (which usually makes her stop crying).  She is 9.5 months old and is a great sleeper once she's down (although the last few nights haven't been that way), and can give me up to 5 hours a night bookended by 2 or 3 hour stretches. But lately things have been all over the place.

So I'm pretty anti-CIO and he's willing to go along with that (though his family are of a different mind), and we've tried a bunch of stuff:

a regular nighttime routine

watching for her sleepy signs

trying to get 2 good naps in per day, in her crib if possible

I try not to nurse all the way to sleep (though I do cheat sometimes)

we have an ipod with the sound of waves

I carry her on my back at least an hour per day (while walking the dog)

and she has lots of active playtime during the day

 

and I'm sure there's more, but that's all I can think of now.

She's had short stretches where a pattern emerges, maybe 3 days-week, where things go great; naps happen, she goes down without a huge fuss at night, she sleeps for nice long stretches, we can easily soothe her back to sleep, etc.  But it never seems to last.

 

Anyway, this is sort of coming out like a rant, but if I had to pick one issue it would be the getting her down without hysterics ensuing. DH did a little sleep training - not CIO, but just a couple minutes of crying with him right there soothing her, but now I'm concerned that she has a negative association with being in her crib.

 

Ugh, I could just go on and on.  I would just love to hear of others' experiences and maybe some stuff that helped turn your issues around. 

Thanks.


New mom who left a life at sea for my DH, my "firstborn", 10-month old puppy Betsy - Lab/Border Collie mix - and my DD Amelia, born June 2 and growing like a weed .

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#2 of 10 Old 03-16-2012, 05:09 AM
 
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teething? growth spurt? separation anxiety?

I say keep doing what you're doing, it's (probably) just a phase... it's the same with my DS, and as more and more months go by sleep gets easier and easier - without sleep training - and it becomes clearer, in hind sight, what may have been causing the issue.

I hope you can get some good sleep soon!

(edited for punctuation)

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#3 of 10 Old 03-16-2012, 06:52 AM - Thread Starter
 
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Now in a more (ok, only slightly more) awake state of mind, I guess what we're dealing with is just that it's a battle almost every single time we try and put her down to sleep. Every once in a while she'll zonk out in the carseat or the carrier or be dozy enough off the boob to sack out with minimal fuss in her crib, but 9 times out of 10 it's a struggle and goes on for anywhere from 20 to an hour of trying different things to get her to sleep.

It sucks because we know she's tired, we see the signs - rubbing her eyes, fussiness, glossy look, etc. - and she just resists so hard. The worst part is when she's just about there, lying in her crib about to fall into proper sleep and something wakes her back up and she's wide awake again. And I mean crawling up the sides of the crib wide awake.

And I feel terrible for DH because it's worse for him - at least I can whip out a boob, and she naturally is calmer with me anyway because we spend 24-7 together.  And the worse she gets as the minutes of hysteria go by, the more shell-shocked he gets.

And all these people around just say "cry it out".

Ugh.


New mom who left a life at sea for my DH, my "firstborn", 10-month old puppy Betsy - Lab/Border Collie mix - and my DD Amelia, born June 2 and growing like a weed .

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#4 of 10 Old 03-16-2012, 08:27 AM
 
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I'm in the same situation, minus the 5 hour stretch. I'm getting a lot of pressure to nightwean and let them CIO (my mother is offering to take the girls for a few days). And it doesn't feel right. But I'm getting to the end of my rope. I am so tired. And every nap and every bed time is a huge struggle.

 

And everyone I talk to says that once you train them (in whichever manner), then naps and bedtime are easy and they just sleep.

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#5 of 10 Old 03-16-2012, 08:34 AM
 
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sounds like a developmental leap... she working on crawling or something? when ever my DS was/is like that (ie. now, he's working on walking), he's the same. he's on the cusp of sleep and it's like, "WAIT! I should practice standing/cruising RIGHT. NOW." every time he's gone through a phase like this (rolling over, sitting, babbling a new sound/"word", etc) he does this. :/

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#6 of 10 Old 03-16-2012, 08:51 AM
 
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Check out the Wonder Weeks (http://thewonderweeks.com/index.php/about-the-wonder-weeks/your-babys-10-leaps/mental-leap-6).  Basically, infant researchers in Sweden (the Netherlands?) have linked developmental leaps/milestones with fussiness/sleep changes, and both my babes have followed them almost to the day.  During these phases, sleep always crapped out and we experienced a lot of what you're describing.  There's a chart that summarizes the "stormy periods" here: http://www.thewonderweeks.com/extras/WW_info_chart.pdf

 

Your babe sounds like my daughter.....generally good once she got to sleep (with some exceptions), but took a long time to get there.  It got better once she passed some of these big developmental leaps.  I think Wehrli is probably right.

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#7 of 10 Old 03-16-2012, 06:32 PM - Thread Starter
 
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That is definitely happening.  Her crawling has gone from 0 to zombie drag to high speed chases around the house within 3 weeks.  And in that same stretch she has learned to stand up holding onto a box (or the sides of her crib) and walking with a small ottoman as a walker.

I guess I knew that sleep gets disrupted with developmental advances - as it has in the past with sitting up or making sounds or sucking her thumb - but it's never been this bad.

Thanks for the support.
 

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Originally Posted by wehrli View Post

sounds like a developmental leap... she working on crawling or something? when ever my DS was/is like that (ie. now, he's working on walking), he's the same. he's on the cusp of sleep and it's like, "WAIT! I should practice standing/cruising RIGHT. NOW." every time he's gone through a phase like this (rolling over, sitting, babbling a new sound/"word", etc) he does this. :/


 


New mom who left a life at sea for my DH, my "firstborn", 10-month old puppy Betsy - Lab/Border Collie mix - and my DD Amelia, born June 2 and growing like a weed .

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#8 of 10 Old 03-23-2012, 08:10 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rinap View Post

I'm in the same situation, minus the 5 hour stretch. I'm getting a lot of pressure to nightwean and let them CIO (my mother is offering to take the girls for a few days). And it doesn't feel right. But I'm getting to the end of my rope. I am so tired. And every nap and every bed time is a huge struggle.

 

And everyone I talk to says that once you train them (in whichever manner), then naps and bedtime are easy and they just sleep.


This.  Almost exactly this.  I'm very used to sleep-deprivation (from my pre-mom career) and it's not so much that I'm exhausted (I can function really well on not enough sleep), but it's like you said, it's a battle every time, so now I start to get tense and stressed in anticipation of each time we have to put her down. 

She has this signature move, starting from when I lay her down on her back in her crib.  It's a little barrel roll where she goes from her to her side to her belly to her other side, then up onto her butt at a 90 degree angle ending up sitting across the crib looking at me - it takes like 2 seconds.  Either that or she'll roll onto to her belly crawl to the side of the crib and stand herself up. 

And if I either leave the room (sort-of mini CIO that only lasts a couple of minutes, which I'm sure the CIO people would say is part of the problem) or pick her up to soothe her and lay her back down - she screams bloody murder.  There are times when I get so pissed, that I WANT to CIO, but I just can't.

To the moms who been through this out there...is it really like werhli said?  Will I look back in a few months when she's going to sleep easier (please, please let this happen) and realize it was her 2 top teeth coming in and learning to stand and walk and say "Papa" and dealing with separation anxiety all at the same time?

And on a side note...could a visit from my in-laws and the accompanying issues of broken routine and being held by not-quite-but-almost strangers exacerbate this issue?

 


New mom who left a life at sea for my DH, my "firstborn", 10-month old puppy Betsy - Lab/Border Collie mix - and my DD Amelia, born June 2 and growing like a weed .

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#9 of 10 Old 03-24-2012, 07:59 AM
 
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To answer the last question, YES! With babies and small children, sleep can be affected by everything. Family in town, teething, crawling, walking, rolling over, stress, busy days, vacation, the list is really endless. Honestly, it is rather worthless to try to examine and pinpoint why sleep is bad right now because once and if you figure it out (you have to remember that things affect them that are not even on our radar or we have no idea about), and it is on to the next thing. But rather you should figure out how to make this particular phase, livable. Tomorrow is always a different day, and what they did yesterday or the month before has changed and it may never be like that again or if could, maybe tomorrow or maybe in 6 months. Ahhh, the wonder of children. eyesroll.gif

 

It is the rarer child that doesn't fight sleep. What baby wants to sleep! There are things to look at, places to explore, things to get into. Sleep is boring and overrated! Well, in their minds anyway, not so much for tired parents. Children have to be parented to sleep. I think many of us have this image of lying a baby down, they roll over, close their eyes and peacefully go to sleep. It looks more like bouncing the baby, the baby foot goes into the mom's mouth, 10 minutes of bouncing and then you try something else, another 10 minutes, you try something else. Eventually after an eternity the eyes close and then the remaining parent staggers out the door feeling like they were just in a time warp of some king and possibility got their soul sucked out in the process. Or maybe that is just how it exists in my house, but after leading mom's groups for many years, I hear this same story over and over and over again. 

 

And for the record, the dirty little secret about CIO is that is often has to be redone again and again. After time changes, illnesses, vacations, all the same things that set off kids in the first places.  It isn't a one time thing. It is more a way of life. And often the families really don't count or hear the crying anymore, and can't accurately tell you about the amount of crying their kids so. Or if they don't because there are the kids that really do after CIO, just lay down and go to sleep without a peep, it is even worse. They do that because they have given up. No one will come. 

 

Yes, they do eventually sleep better. When is that day? It varies widely from child to child. often when all the teeth are in, then the sleep is better, easier. 


There is no way to happiness, happiness is the way.
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#10 of 10 Old 03-24-2012, 05:18 PM
 
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Quote:
To the moms who been through this out there...is it really like werhli said? Will I look back in a few months when she's going to sleep easier (please, please let this happen) and realize it was her 2 top teeth coming in and learning to stand and walk and say "Papa" and dealing with separation anxiety all at the same time?

yes. you will. and i had a hard time thinking it could be this way, back when i was where you are. people on here assured me this was the way it was going be, someday. and here i am, and i can't believe how fast this time came! the days really are long, and the years really are short.
Quote:
Honestly, it is rather worthless to try to examine and pinpoint why sleep is bad right now because once and if you figure it out (you have to remember that things affect them that are not even on our radar or we have no idea about), and it is on to the next thing. But rather you should figure out how to make this particular phase, livable. Tomorrow is always a different day, and what they did yesterday or the month before has changed and it may never be like that again or if could, maybe tomorrow or maybe in 6 months. Ahhh, the wonder of children.

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Quote:
And for the record, the dirty little secret about CIO is that is often has to be redone again and again. After time changes, illnesses, vacations, all the same things that set off kids in the first places. It isn't a one time thing. It is more a way of life. And often the families really don't count or hear the crying anymore, and can't accurately tell you about the amount of crying their kids so. Or if they don't because there are the kids that really do after CIO, just lay down and go to sleep without a peep, it is even worse. They do that because they have given up. No one will come.

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DS - planned h20homebirth.gif born via ribboncesarean.gif 4/4/2011
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