Any SAHPs who don't want a career? - Mothering Forums

Forum Jump: 
Reply
 
Thread Tools
#1 of 85 Old 02-03-2010, 09:33 PM - Thread Starter
 
Harmony08's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Posts: 782
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
At least not for a long long time.

I posted before that all my SAHM friends had gone back to work. We are in a University community so everyone around is working on a Phd in something. I have a Master's degree and used to tell people that my goal was to get a Phd someday (in child development). But now I realize when I say that I am just trying to ease my own discomfort in the typical "so you just stay home with him?" convo and it isn't authentic.

I have ALWAYS wanted to be a mom. I love it and I know I don't actually need anything else. I know someday when the kids are older or grown I may go back to teaching or go back to school but that doesn't really define me. I don't care that much about it. Being home with my kids is my dream job and my true goal. I am the ONLY person I know with this mentality.

Am I a freak or are there others out there?

I have boys! My first baby boy was born 10/08 and my second baby boy was born 7/12

Harmony08 is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
#2 of 85 Old 02-03-2010, 10:12 PM
 
mosesface's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: austin, tx
Posts: 1,593
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
I have a career -- caring for my home and children.

I actually just had that revelation the other day. THIS is my JOB and I love my job more than anyone else I know loves their job!

THIS is the work I do that provides for my family and satisfies me. It is difficult and has long hours and requires a huge amount of creativity and discipline. It challenges me and inspires me and has incredible benefits.

There will be a time, when my children are grown, that I may choose to have another career. I seriously hope that when that happens, I don't spend so much time worrying about whether it's good enough.

Rachel. Devoted wife and joyful mama to Beatrice June(2/25/08) and Leona Agnes (8/10/10).
mosesface is offline  
#3 of 85 Old 02-03-2010, 10:20 PM
 
claddaghmom's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2008
Posts: 3,823
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
I have always wanted to be a mom, too. I remember when I was young just thinking about being a mom. I feel that I had to keep quiet about it because it would be looked down on in highschool. It seems all of highschool is one big "what are you going to do?" and of course that extends to college.

I did, however, find a passion in science and biology. Tried med school and now I am at a point where I would be disgusted to say I attended med school. For the last couple years, I've been just about killing myself driving forward in school. I've told myself a Ph.d in psychology and/or neuroscience would be great. It would be fulfilling. Gosh I would probably pay to take classes in these fields!

But now I find myself wondering...why?

Mama to expecting Babe 2
claddaghmom is offline  
#4 of 85 Old 02-03-2010, 10:26 PM
 
heatherdeg's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Everywhere... thanks, technology!
Posts: 4,831
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 5 Post(s)
I already had a career. A really good one.

Now, I guess I just don't really think about it. But I still do a lot of non-mom (albeit non-paying) "stuff". When my son was special needs, the management of his care, therapies, etc. provided me with a lot of mental gymnastics. But now that my kids don't require that level of juggling or "work", I definitely seek it out elsewhere.

But I don't need it to be a "career" so to speak... ya know? It's not like I'm itching to get back to some job/career thing outside of the home the second my kids can (insert indicator that it's okay to be outside the home here). I definitely have ambitions to do things, but most of them can be done while being a SAHM... like have a farm that morphs into a CSA.

Heather - Wife , Mommy  & Health & Wellness Educator, Speaker & Consultant 
 
Dairy, soy & corn free with limited gluten... yes, really. And journeying towards peace.  Blogging about both.
 
Let me guide you to find the food and lifestyle choices...
heatherdeg is offline  
#5 of 85 Old 02-03-2010, 10:49 PM
 
PinkNFluffy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 90
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
I don't know, I'm really torn right now. Part of me LOVES being a Mother, it is like my life calling but the other part is like...that's it? You are just a Mom? My family acts like making it does not include being a SAHM but having some prestigious career, my Mom escpecially seems to just... want me to have a career. I'm at a crossroads, in my soul I want more children and soon since my son is 2, my mind tells me to concentrate on school and finding a full time job, I don't want both at the same time, I just don't. :
PinkNFluffy is offline  
#6 of 85 Old 02-04-2010, 12:24 AM
 
mommariffic's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: the rolling hills, New Jersey
Posts: 1,786
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
I've never been a "career" gal.

I'm happy staying home - I like hanging with my daughter, homeschooling, having my days to teach her/do crafts/do my house stuff. I also have a little freelance writing I do, but I do it for pleasure. If it took off on it's on great, but it's not my goal to be this all start, best selling writer...I'm just kind of a simple gal. Gimme my kids, my books, my house and some pens and I'm happy!

blogging.jpg    fambedsingle2.gif  homebirth.jpg  read.gif  happy momma to DD 8/07 and DS 6/10
mommariffic is offline  
#7 of 85 Old 02-04-2010, 12:34 AM
 
Reebekah's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: PA
Posts: 260
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
i have 2 associates degrees and a bachelors degree...i have worked in a professional environment for 15 years....i had my dream job (an incredibly easy 9-5 with great pay, great benefits, and great flexibility.....i assumed i'd be a working mother.....and then i had my first child....i realized that being a working mother was NOT what i wanted at all, but i hadnt made the proper arrangements in my life to do that, so i had to return to work until i got it all sorted out....had 2 more babies in the mean time (3 babies in 4 years).....and i just recently was able to finally leave my job to be a full time sahm. i turned down several other options, including working part time and working from home. there was NOTHING i could have been offered that would have made me continue to do anything other than be a mom. i am totally happy doing this....being at home all day with the kids...taking care of house things. not every day is perfect...but i would still rather do this than anything else. i have absolutely no desire for "something more". this is not a honeymoon phase for me just because i'm a new sahm, because i did take 4-6 months off with each of my babies, so i knew what i was getting myself into. i have no intention of doing anything outiside of my home for the next 20 years, and i feel quite happy and content with this decision....there is more than enough here to keep me busy and fulfilled. i just hope and pray that nothing happens in my life that forces me to do anything other than this.
Reebekah is offline  
#8 of 85 Old 02-04-2010, 01:53 AM
 
lifeguard's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Coyote Rock Farm
Posts: 6,541
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
I have NO interest in having a career. We tried for so long to conceive ds (6 years) & all that time I struggled with finding the "right" job. Turns out this is the right one!

Surviving sleep deprivation one day at a time with dd (Oct '11) & ds (Oct '08).

lifeguard is offline  
#9 of 85 Old 02-04-2010, 02:29 AM
 
suziek's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Posts: 758
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
I had a fairly groovy and gratifying career. Now I want to be with my kids. When my youngest is in his teens I'll be heading towards 60 so I don't plan on any radical third incarnations. I hope to just have time to read, travel and play. Sometimes I dream of living abroad again and doing the kind of development work I started doing just out of college but I don't feel like I HAVE to do anything but enjoy the fruits of my labor(s) from here on out.

If I had had kids younger, that is before my career, I don't think I would have felt compelled to go out into the world and kick a few buckets over they way I did. I think I would have said, AHA! this is what I am meant to do.

I really like raising my children the way I have been doing it. It's fun for me. I get lots of support for my decisions, too. Which is nice.

Happy mom to DS2000, DS2002, DD2004, DS2006 and DS 10/2009:
suziek is offline  
#10 of 85 Old 02-04-2010, 03:37 AM
 
ErinBird's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Posts: 1,637
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
I will be having children for some time yet and intend to home school them all. I have a degree in engineering but chose not to pursue a career in favor of motherhood. I can see myself returning to school for something entirely different when I'm in my 40s and my youngest children are less dependent on me but thats quite a ways off.

Mama to Raina (9/06) and Peter (8/09)!
ErinBird is offline  
#11 of 85 Old 02-04-2010, 10:42 AM
Banned
 
RheaSilva's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Great Falls, VA & Edisto Beach, SC
Posts: 49
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Harmony, you are just fine!

Every woman has the right to choose if she wants her career in or out of the home and you made the right choice for you! If being a SAHM is financially feasible and emotionally/intellectually satisfying for you, I say go for it!

I love my outside job and am very passionate about it so I make it work with my family. My SIL, on the other hand, loves being a SAHM and couldn't imagine going back to work. We're both very happy
RheaSilva is offline  
#12 of 85 Old 02-04-2010, 02:40 PM
 
Freedom~Mama's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Posts: 1,624
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
This was def. my way of thinking when I first got pregnant and had kids. I always knew even before I had kids that I want to be a SAHM and I have loved it. I am now going to school full time (online classes though) so I still get to be a SAHM to my 2 girls (they are 3 and 5) It is very busy but the best of both worlds I think. Being a SAHM is so valuable and awesome and I am so glad I have been able to be at home.

Student/Working Mama notes.gifgeek.gif
to DD 1dust.gif & DD 2energy.gif & engaged to DFpartners.gif

Freedom~Mama is offline  
#13 of 85 Old 02-04-2010, 03:55 PM
 
Vancouver Mommy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Vancouver, BC
Posts: 1,618
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
I have a masters degree and worked as a management consultant prior to becoming a mother. I made good money but hated the work. I love parenting and am considering homeschooling. I never want to return to 9-5 life, but would consider bidding on the occasional contract when my kids get older.

Diane, SAHM to DD (June 05) and DS (April 07).
::::
Vancouver Mommy is offline  
#14 of 85 Old 02-04-2010, 08:02 PM
 
cappuccinosmom's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: SW Pennsylvania
Posts: 5,447
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
I have no interest in anything outside my "realm" of the home. I am *so* happy being a SAHM, homeschooling, I hope to have a bunch more kids and continue in this way for a long time to come. That would be my ideal and what I dreamed of since I was a little girl.

For me, anything other than SAHM is something to think about when my kids are much, much older and independant, and then only if I'm truly bored. I get to play the part of doula for my younger sister, and if that turns out to be something that works well for me, it'll go in the box of things to consider, but not for a loooong time, and probably more along the lines of helping sisters/friend's out than a career.
cappuccinosmom is offline  
#15 of 85 Old 02-05-2010, 01:31 AM
 
newbymom05's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Posts: 2,589
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Me too. In fact, I look forward to when they're all in school so I can really sit around and eat bon bons. Ooh, in a clean and organized house! I was a high school teacher for almost 10 yrs, and I can truly say I've always felt work was overrated, lol.
newbymom05 is offline  
#16 of 85 Old 02-05-2010, 02:06 AM
 
MummyDearest's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Posts: 18
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
You're def not the only one! I used to desperately want my career and thought staying home would bore the life out of me. But now when I think of going back to school again or even if I could get my former dream career, I honestly have no desire for it. When I imagine my dream life I imagine staying home and raising my kids!

Mommy to my sweet toddler DS 2/2008
MummyDearest is offline  
#17 of 85 Old 02-05-2010, 02:17 AM
 
ledzepplon's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: San Diego, CA
Posts: 5,627
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
I'm just not cut out for the working-out-of-the-home world. I consider myself well educated and intelligent, but I just love being the homemaker, mother, and wife. I'm truly happy where I'm at. I don't believe I could be any more fulfilled because of a career outside the home.

Wife to a wonderful dh and mom to four beautiful kiddos, dd (3/04):, ds1 (1/06), ds2 (10/08), and ds3 (7/10)
ledzepplon is offline  
#18 of 85 Old 02-05-2010, 02:35 AM
 
skueppers's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Takoma Park, MD
Posts: 1,725
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
I was very happy in my previous career in the IT field. Most people I worked with were very surprised when I told them I was quitting my job to stay home with my kids.

My husband and I realized many years ago that we didn't want to have children at all unless one of us stayed home with them. It's an important value for us. When the time came, we decided I'd be the one to stay home.

For us, that's a long-term commitment. When we thought the kids would go to school, we still didn't think having me work other than very part-time would be a good idea. Now we've decided to homeschool, so that creates more demands on my time.

It's certainly possible that I might develop a full-time career again at some point in the future, but it's not something I feel any need for right now. Maybe never, who knows?

Sonja , 40, married to DH (42) since 5-29-93, DD born 11-3-2004, DS born 1-18-2007.
skueppers is offline  
#19 of 85 Old 02-05-2010, 04:11 PM - Thread Starter
 
Harmony08's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Posts: 782
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Thanks everyone! It is so nice to hear from all of you like minded mamas. I too am planning to homeschool and it excites me to no end (used to teach). I also want to have at least four little chickadees (perhaps with large age gaps as my 16 month ds is still very much in need of me). Who knows. I know one pp touched on the expectations from her mother. I feel that too. I feel like I can't admit that not only do I not plan on working or going to school, I don't even have any desire too. Once when I alluded to it my mom was all like you never know, you have plenty of time to get a phd etc. I feel like it means something to her. But it isn't her life.

I love me life. I can't believe how lucky I am. Every dream I dreamt at 16 has come true. I spend my days with my son. He is the light of my universe. There is nothing else I want to do. At night I feel so happy that tomorrow I get another day with my son. I know this is incredibly cheesy but I do mean it. I'm about to have my period any second so I am super emotional.

I have boys! My first baby boy was born 10/08 and my second baby boy was born 7/12

Harmony08 is offline  
#20 of 85 Old 02-05-2010, 06:14 PM
 
Holiztic's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: MD
Posts: 2,183
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
I don't ever think of a paying, professional career. Ever. This is very much my career. Some day when I've raised (and homeschooled) all my children (only have 1 so far), I'd like to write books, get really involved in a hobby, and do some volunteer work (well, I plan to do that when kids are a bit older).

So this is my career now, that will be my career then.

I don't believe you have to earn a paycheck in order to have a career!

I wanted to add that it really is all about perspective. I don't see myself as having given up a career or as having put a career on hold. Careers are very new in terms of world history. I don't just mean for women/moms, I mean for anyone! For most of history people just worked, i.e. did the work (labor) required for living. That is what I do (and I have fun, too, which is a bonus!)
Holiztic is offline  
#21 of 85 Old 02-05-2010, 07:07 PM
 
suziek's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Posts: 758
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Holiztic--that is such an interesting thought. Why is it that it is assumed in our culture that in order to feel fulfilled we need careers--and successful ones at that? It really is true that for millions of years people have not had that notion at all, and here it is, defining (some of) our lives.

thanks for that thought--a perspective shifter, that one.

Happy mom to DS2000, DS2002, DD2004, DS2006 and DS 10/2009:
suziek is offline  
#22 of 85 Old 02-05-2010, 07:23 PM
 
taramoon13's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Posts: 441
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
LOVE this thread!!!! when i was young and i imagined myself with children, i never even thought about working, to me that's being a part-time mom. i feel so lucky to have a dh who completely supports our family to have it that way. even as ds gets older & goes to school i imagine myself being there when he gets home from school to offer him a snack and talk. i actually get sad when i hear about other moms that are already planning to go back to work before they've even given birth. raising kids is the most important contribution we can make to our society, IMO. we are VERY tight financially because of this, but this is our top priority right now.
taramoon13 is offline  
#23 of 85 Old 02-06-2010, 02:57 AM
 
FallingLeaves's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Posts: 325
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Being at home with DD's is my dream job too. I don't need anything else. I think we have the most important and fulfilling job! I went to college and have a degree. I worked until I had DD. If the financial need arose, I could go back to teaching, but I don't need a position or another degree to feel important or successful.
FallingLeaves is offline  
#24 of 85 Old 02-06-2010, 05:04 AM
 
FelixMom's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Montreal, Quebec
Posts: 463
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
I have my university degree, and I did work briefly in a career I did enjoy. However, the only women in my field who were able to balance family and work on their terms became consultants before having children. I never did have time to achieve that level before having my 1st.

I also am incredibly inept at office politics, and am happy that I only have to deal with age-appropriate behaviour around here

So I hope to be SAHMing for at least a couple more years, though DH really wants me to contribute more financially so we can get a larger place...

Sign hanging in Albert Einstein's office at Princeton: Not everything that counts can be counted, and not everything that can be counted, counts.
FelixMom is offline  
#25 of 85 Old 02-07-2010, 02:12 AM
 
peaceful_mama's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2005
Location: #12 Grimmauld Place
Posts: 4,940
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4 Post(s)
I LOVE my kids and my life

lovin DH since 1/04, best mom for my 3 boys 10/04, 11/08, 11/10 one girlie (1/07), one 13 wk (10/13) and 5/15 just your average multigenerational living family!!
peaceful_mama is offline  
#26 of 85 Old 02-07-2010, 02:24 AM
 
Tigerchild's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Seattle Eastside
Posts: 4,737
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
I had jobs I greatly enjoyed before I had kids, but I've never been a "career" sort of person. To be really honest with you, I don't see my kids as a career either. I thought I was going to have a hard time transitioning out of having kids home 24/7 (my youngest entered 1st grade this year--first time "all day" school experience with all kids in school), but to be really honest with you? I've been having the time of my life. I get to do my house. I get to do school activities. I get to do my art. I get to take myself to lunch or to the movies. I can volunteer and do things I used to do for a job, except for (ironically) more appreciation and internal reward because I help the budget of the organization stretch further without being paid.

So I think I am just truly not a career person. SAHMing was the hardest gig for someone like me, because I had to get up and do the same thing every day for 7 years. I don't know if it was folks like me that you wanted to hear from or people who think of their kids as their careers (which I certainly do not), but I have met other people like me face to face.

In many ways, being able to claim SAHMdom has given me legitimacy in being myself, because people understand that (or think they do) and it's socially acceptible in the way "What do I do? Oh, I love to hang out with homeless folks/incarcerated folks/developmentally disabled folks and I need lots of different activities and things to do." isn't.

ETA: Hmmm, didn't read much beyond the first post, perhaps I should have. I'm sure there are those who think I'm only "part-timing" since I have my kids in school. That kind of attitude (that people who choose differently are "part timing" parenthood) really makes me sad though. Some people really enjoy the specific environments that you can only find in certain workplaces. I don't see anything wrong with that. Any more that I think it's wrong of me to be totally uninterested in that sort of thing and to prefer freedom/flexibility. Maybe that's why I've never been a "SAHM is the best" sort of person, or that there's a certain checklist you have to complete before you count as a "full time" parents--I wouldn't want to exchange freedom from a WOH situation to stuff myself into a narrow box at home, KWIM?
Tigerchild is offline  
#27 of 85 Old 02-07-2010, 02:29 AM
 
mami to 3 :)'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: WY
Posts: 27
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
I'm an Industrial Engineer, and at first I used to say that I didn't wanted to stay at home with my kids becuase I loved my job and I loved what I was doing. But I was so wrong, after Leo was born I decided to quit, now I don't know if I ever want to go back on the business.

Leo(5), Cata(4), Tiago(1/9/09), stepmama to Addie(14) wife to Alec
mami to 3 :) is offline  
#28 of 85 Old 02-07-2010, 02:34 AM
 
Join Date: May 2008
Posts: 1,933
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
My career is being at home now and being the best mom I can be.... I know what you mean though. I finished my MA with my friends and by now all of them either finished more MA's/PhDs or climb the career ladder.... While I don't really care about the career (I had a good job prior to DS, lots of money, but the job just wasn't my holy grail, and all the money cannot buy my happiness) - apparently friends do. Or ex-friends. Some people just don't get that being at home with a child is a serious job that requires a commitment beyond everything I have done before! The only thing that bothers me is that some friends/acquaintances look down on me for being a SAHM, almost pitiful like I'm too dumb to get a "real job". But that's just people with no kids, no partners and no focus on family.... So we are growing apart and it's just normal I guess.
nia82 is offline  
#29 of 85 Old 02-07-2010, 03:38 AM
 
Storm Bride's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Vancouver, BC
Posts: 25,597
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
I've never wanted a career. I had a job when I had ds1, and intended to stay home with him after my maternity leave ran out. For financial reasons, I couldn't, and I wasn't able to do so until he was 10. There's nothing short of poverty that could drag me back into the workplace. It just doesn't interest me.

Lisa, lucky mama of Kelly (3/93) ribboncesarean.gif, Emma (5/03) ribboncesarean.gif, Evan (7/05) ribboncesarean.gif, & Jenna (6/09) ribboncesarean.gif
Loving my amazing dh, James & forever missing ribbonpb.gif Aaron Ambrose ribboncesarean.gif (11/07) ribbonpb.gif

Storm Bride is offline  
#30 of 85 Old 02-07-2010, 04:24 PM
 
goobergrl6's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Lexington Park MD
Posts: 236
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Nope and I don't plan on working when my kids are gone either. I was a SAHW before kids and plan on being one after kids. This is my life and I love it!
goobergrl6 is offline  
Reply

User Tag List

Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page


Forum Jump: 

Posting Rules  
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are Off