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#1 of 51 Old 11-24-2009, 12:17 PM - Thread Starter
 
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H is so upset and agitated right now. After a year of trying to get his ex to agree that DSD see a counselor, after two sessions DSD's Mom stops taking her without telling us... in fact H has been asking her how it was going and she would just say fine.

Till last night at DSD's parent/teacher conference she finally said she stopped going weeks ago. She said it's because her hours were cut at work so she didn't have money for the copay. H was furious. He had already told her we'd split the copay... but besides that, she should have told him weeks ago if it was that big of an issue and we'd pay the whole thing if need be.

H has joint legal custody... what kind of recourse does he have with his ex constantly making decisions like this without him??

This is a major issue as DSD REALLY needs counseling. Her counselor said in the very first session that DSD is exhibiting far too much stress and anxiety for her age... and then last night at the parent/teacher conference her teacher said the same thing and told of how concerned she is with DSD's behavior!!!

The teacher went through all kinds of things and examples that we have been trying to tell DSD's Mom for well over a year!!! And where DSD's Mom kept telling us, "well I don't understand that because she isn't like that here, etc..."

Now... I just cannot beleive DSD's Mom is telling the truth. How can DSD be acting out everyday at school and at our house EOW, but is okay nights at Mom's?

I'm really worried about DSD...

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#2 of 51 Old 11-24-2009, 01:15 PM
 
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Maybe you and mom have different expectations of behavior. Maybe what you see as acting out is not something that mom would consider acting out.

Also, considering the stress at your house and the fact that you're constantly on the verge of leaving, you're unhappy, husband is disrespectful and there's a heavy tension in your house, I think it's highly likely that your SD is just plain happier at mom's house. Assuming that there's not marital discord, yelling and punching walls over there.

The fact that YOU can pay half of the co-pay doesn't mean that mom can. You say you'll pay her back, but she's still expected to pay it. She's expected to give up her "relaxed" parenting time with her daughter to take her to counseling to deal with the stress of YOUR house. How is this fair to your daughter and step-mother?

Considering everything you've written about your SD's mother, your husband and the general temperaments of both households, I'd say that you might want to give her mother a little more respect here. She's got her daughter's best interests at heart. Your husband is trying to control things that he shouldn't.

Have you noticed a pattern in your posts? You want to leave, then all of a sudden, SD's mother or one of your parents has wronged you and then you and dh make up and gang up on the "wrongdoer." It seems that you and your dh only get along when you have a common enemy. Bio-mom is paying the price for you and her ex to get along...and so is SD. If you want her in counseling to help her deal with what's going on in your house, then take her on your time.

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#3 of 51 Old 11-24-2009, 01:22 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Um... if you read my post you will see that her TEACHER that she spends all day long everyday with is also saying DSD is acting out.

I cannot call hitting, pinching and refusing to do schoolwork anything but acting out... how about you?


Can you honestly say that seeing a possibly tense house only 4 times a month is the only cause making DSD act out EVERYDAY at school??

I just can't buy into that.

Yes I have some internal issues with how I feel about my marriage right now, but I like to think I do put on a pretty good face on the weekends DSD is there. Especially after the last talk H and I had... we are both respecting each other's boundaries right now and living together peacefully for the kids while we each do our own counseling.

And, as to expecting Mom to give up her peaceful parenting time to take DSD to counseling? She isn't even the one that is with her daughter most nights... it's her Mom or her brother.

And we offered to add the copay costs into the child support check we give her... so no, she isn't expected to just fron the cash in hopes we pay her back... we owe her NO money whereas she actually still owes us $250, which I think we have given up on ever getting from her.

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#4 of 51 Old 11-24-2009, 01:40 PM
 
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So, it seems that SD is passed around a lot. Maybe that's the problem. Instead of counseling, how about all the parents come up with a plan to treat the problem. You can't counsel away a real situation. That's like taking drugs for a thorn in your foot...take out the thorn! Does bio-mom work at night? Is that the reason for SD staying with other people? If she's working at night, I can see it being almost impossible to do counseling. Did she like the idea of counseling? What ideas did she have? Was counseling thrust on her or was she active in the choice? Have you or your husband met the counselor? Have you gone with SD? Are you wiling to take her?

You've said a lot of good things about SD's mother. You turn to her anytime you and your dh fight, so you really should consider why she turns into an enemy when you make up. I don't say that to be mean. Sometimes other people can see our patterns that we can't see ourselves.

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#5 of 51 Old 11-24-2009, 01:49 PM - Thread Starter
 
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I think I may have said one nice thing about DSD's Mom. The fact that she is nice to my DD. And I only called her once during a fight when H yelled at DSD and I took the kids to my Mom's... that was almost 9 months ago?

DSD's Mom does not work nights... she goes out with her boyfriend, or shopping, or who knows. I just know from DSD and also from comments her Grammy and Uncle said themselves that they watch her a lot and they pick her up from school a lot.

She isn't "bounced" per se as they all live in the same apartment. DSD's Mom lives with her Mom, brother and boyfriend.

Yes, in essence counseling was forced upon her. H and I have noticed DSD being stressed out for nearly two years. We have brought it up to DSD's Mom on several occaisons... this was usually blown off as changes happening in her life, such as when H and I got married, and when the baby came... but if anything DSD's anxiety has gotten worse.

DSD's Mom had us call her peditrician to talk to him about it because she was not going to put DSD into therapy unless he said so. So H called and the doctor agreed that it definitely sounded like DSD should talk to someone. So ex finally consented to go.

We all took DSD to her first appointment. At that time the counselor told us we didn't have to go anymore as she was just going to speak to DSD one-on-one. H works nights, so is sleeping in the afternoon when the appointments would be, or he would offer to take her. But DSD's Mom is out of work at that time, and has no problem taking DSD to dance at the same time as her therapy appointments... she obviously just has a difference of opinion on how important they are... even though now she has her peditrician and her daughter's teacher all saying that DSD should be talking to someone.

I still cannot agree that all of DSD's problems stem from our house, considering she is acting out pretty much daily at school... she only sees us EOW right now... and her anxiety issues have been going on long before H and I started having any troubles.

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#6 of 51 Old 11-24-2009, 01:53 PM
 
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Not that it's any consolation, but my youngest is an absolute terror at daycare and her father's, but has zero issues here at home. The family counsellor we saw together said that (in our case) it came down to comfort level/feeling safe. Dd is absolutely zen here at home, but really gives her dad a run for his money.

As for the counselling, I have no suggestions. If that were me, I would have let exdh know right away if I was going to pull one of our children out of something we had mutually agreed upon. If it was important to him, I would tell him the onus was on him to get it done (if I didn't agree it was necessary, etc.)

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#7 of 51 Old 11-24-2009, 02:03 PM
 
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Nope, it sounds like it's not all coming from your house. It kind of depends on if the situation with mom is a helpful village or a crowded stress-filled apartment. If they all live together, then I can see them all being involved in SD's care. Also, if there is a lot of attention on her at her mothers home, that would mean that there's no reason to act up there.

But, again, if it's something your dh is insisting on, he'll probably have to be the one to make it happen.

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#8 of 51 Old 11-24-2009, 03:30 PM
 
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She definitely should have told you that she was pulling her out, and yes, if you and your dh, the ped, and dsd's teacher are telling her that dsd needs some help, then I think she should feel it was important for dsd to go as well, no matter where the problem stems from (or where she thinks it stems from).

Is there anyway you can find someone who is open on Friday evenings/weekends so that you guys can take her at least every other weekend? It doesn't seem like her mom is going to do it, period. Do you have it is writing that she agreed to take her? I'm not sure if you have any legal recourse, but at least then she couldn't try to make it look like you guys were doing it behind her back.

Good luck, this sounds like a really tough situation all around.

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#9 of 51 Old 11-24-2009, 11:06 PM
 
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Call her on it... "You said you couldn't make the copayments, so we will make them. I will call the therapist and make arrangements to start her appointments again and make the co-payments directly to them."

When she comes up with another excuse ("It's not at a good time"), ask her when would be a better time, and say you will call the therapist to switch the appointment time.

When she finds one you can't come up with an immediate solution for, ask her "What do you need me to do to make it work?"

(Note that I say "you" in all of these, but obviously your husband should probably be the one talking to her about it.... it's just easier to write it from the perspective I did... hope it's not confusing).

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#10 of 51 Old 11-25-2009, 09:28 AM
 
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You personally can't do anything, that's the reality of step-parenting. If your DH feels strongly about it he will have to make the appointments and take her either during her mother's time or during your EOW.
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#11 of 51 Old 11-27-2009, 01:27 PM
 
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He can contact the therapist and set up counseling appointments himself, since he has joint legal custody of the child. He can also let the counselor know that you have his permission to bring the child to appointments and fill the counselor in on information if he is not able to be there for the appointment.

I would then give it a few weeks of counseling and then have him set up an appointment for himself to go speak with her and see if she would be willing to make a recommendation in Court as to the counseling needs of the child and who might be more willing to accomodate those needs.

I would look at potentially filing a Motion for Change of Residential parent status to your husband.

As for paying the co-pays. I would just pay them out of pocket yourself, and then fill out the medical re-imbursement form for your county/state and submit it to her. When she fails to pay just file a contempt.
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#12 of 51 Old 11-28-2009, 02:39 PM
 
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H has joint legal custody... what kind of recourse does he have with his ex constantly making decisions like this without him??
She can't make these decisions unilaterally. With joint legal custody, the only decisions either parent can make on their own is for emergent medical care. All other decisions have to be made jointly.

I don't know how far apart your two homes are. Any chance your DH can take on the task of getting her to and from the therapist's office?

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#13 of 51 Old 11-28-2009, 03:52 PM
 
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Why don't you pay the entire coopay? I had a single mom friend and I just remember every dollar count.

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#14 of 51 Old 11-28-2009, 09:03 PM
 
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He can contact the therapist and set up counseling appointments himself, since he has joint legal custody of the child. He can also let the counselor know that you have his permission to bring the child to appointments and fill the counselor in on information if he is not able to be there for the appointment.

I would then give it a few weeks of counseling and then have him set up an appointment for himself to go speak with her and see if she would be willing to make a recommendation in Court as to the counseling needs of the child and who might be more willing to accomodate those needs.
If her mom has all these reasons why she can't take her, why don't you and your husband take her? Sure, it will cut out on your time with her, but isn't getting her the therapy she needs a little more important? Especially in the long run?

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#15 of 51 Old 11-29-2009, 12:30 PM - Thread Starter
 
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The counselor she was seeing doesn't have weekend appointments. H will be looking into trying to find a counselor that does so we can at least take her when we have her for the moment.

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#16 of 51 Old 11-29-2009, 12:50 PM
 
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Um... if you read my post you will see that her TEACHER that she spends all day long everyday with is also saying DSD is acting out.

I cannot call hitting, pinching and refusing to do schoolwork anything but acting out... how about you?


Can you honestly say that seeing a possibly tense house only 4 times a month is the only cause making DSD act out EVERYDAY at school??

I just can't buy into that.

Yes I have some internal issues with how I feel about my marriage right now, but I like to think I do put on a pretty good face on the weekends DSD is there. Especially after the last talk H and I had... we are both respecting each other's boundaries right now and living together peacefully for the kids while we each do our own counseling.

And, as to expecting Mom to give up her peaceful parenting time to take DSD to counseling? She isn't even the one that is with her daughter most nights... it's her Mom or her brother.

And we offered to add the copay costs into the child support check we give her... so no, she isn't expected to just fron the cash in hopes we pay her back... we owe her NO money whereas she actually still owes us $250, which I think we have given up on ever getting from her.
I got to go with chaoticzmom here. I fail to see how it can be put on her mom at all that SD is having trouble at school and at your house. We all know from your many posts that your home is clearly a major source of stress and pain to be in. Maybe she acts out at school from that environment and anger and at mom's house is her old peaceful happy self. Regardless, if you want the therapy you should both transport and pay for it. I would feel the same as the ex about this frankly.
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#17 of 51 Old 11-29-2009, 01:09 PM
 
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I got to go with chaoticzmom here. I fail to see how it can be put on her mom at all that SD is having trouble at school and at your house. We all know from your many posts that your home is clearly a major source of stress and pain to be in. Maybe she acts out at school from that environment and anger and at mom's house is her old peaceful happy self. Regardless, if you want the therapy you should both transport and pay for it. I would feel the same as the ex about this frankly.
Okay, but if your child was having a hard time, acting out at school, and acting out at her dad's house, wouldn't you want to get her help no matter what the reason? I know if several sources (dad, pediatrician, teacher) were telling me that dd needed help processing a problem (no matter where it stemmed from, and even if I couldn't see it) I would want to help her-that is my responsibility as her mom, even if I am not the source of the problem. Yes, I think OP and her dh should make every effort to take her to the therapy themselves, but I also have a hard time understanding why people would just say it's not the mom's problem, so she shouldn't have to deal with it. If it is the child's problem, it is BOTH of her parents' problem, IMO.

OP, is your dsd resisting going to therapy? Could that perhaps be part of the mom's issue, that is a battle to get her there? Not sure what you could do about it at this point, but just curious as to whether mom is feeling like she is dragging her there for no reason and against her will and that is why she dropped it-perhaps you could find more a "play" therapy that dsd wouldn't be opposed to going to if that is the case.

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#18 of 51 Old 11-29-2009, 01:49 PM
 
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I believe the OP"s only have DSD 4 days a month. I am not saying they should not be responsible for taking DSD to counseling but it seems that the vast amount of responsibility for taking DSD to appointments needs to fall on the mother since she has them most of the time. But of course he dad and JSMA could pay for hte appointment if they think it is important.

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#19 of 51 Old 11-29-2009, 02:26 PM
 
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Okay, but if your child was having a hard time, acting out at school, and acting out at her dad's house, wouldn't you want to get her help no matter what the reason? I know if several sources (dad, pediatrician, teacher) were telling me that dd needed help processing a problem (no matter where it stemmed from, and even if I couldn't see it) I would want to help her-that is my responsibility as her mom, even if I am not the source of the problem. Yes, I think OP and her dh should make every effort to take her to the therapy themselves, but I also have a hard time understanding why people would just say it's not the mom's problem, so she shouldn't have to deal with it. If it is the child's problem, it is BOTH of her parents' problem, IMO.

OP, is your dsd resisting going to therapy? Could that perhaps be part of the mom's issue, that is a battle to get her there? Not sure what you could do about it at this point, but just curious as to whether mom is feeling like she is dragging her there for no reason and against her will and that is why she dropped it-perhaps you could find more a "play" therapy that dsd wouldn't be opposed to going to if that is the case.
If I was a single mama, having the vast majority of the the residency of this child and the care that goes along with it, and not enough money for it and a hostile ex demanding it, then I would say that it was more than I could handle and be pretty indifferent to it. Wanting therapy and being able to have the time and money to do so are two different things. And if, as the mother claims, this is all coming from the tensions and hostility in the other parent's household, then I would not be making it a priority. And perhaps the mother does not believe therapy is the best way to handle it. How about a trial of no visitation at dad's home for a few months? If the school problems, etc. cease then everyone would be clear about where the child's issues are coming from. Hearing about JSMa's family in her many posts, I think my sympathy is with the ex and with hoping JSMa gets out of the relationship as well. The husband/exhusband seems to be a pretty big UAV.
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#20 of 51 Old 11-29-2009, 05:41 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Actually it is a play therapy... and DSD loved going. The weeks she did go we had no issues on our weekend with her. She also told us she liked going because the counselor made her happy to come spend the weekend with us.

Also, I would just like to state again... it isn't just H being adamant about DSD talking to someone... her teacher and peditrician have also put in a strong recomendation for her to do so...

As a Mom, I'd have to be very concerned that my child was so troubled that she was hitting everyday at school I'd be doing everything I possibly could to figure out and help her cope with whatever it is... wether it be stemming from my house or not... I honestly have to say that dismissing the child's feelings and her acting out because it doesn't have to do with Mom is a very surprising attitude here... I thought we are to respect our children and help them with all their problems? I'm sure our children will face many outside obstacles in their lives... should we just dismiss them and not get them help for their problems if they have nothing to do with us directly??

As for money issues with ex... I have a hard hard time beleiving she is in such dire straights when she shares a small apartment that costs less then our house with three other adults contributing to paying the bills. Not to mention I see her in brand new shoes every month and with a brand new Coach bag just last week.

But, even with all that... we still offered to pay the co-pays if it was too much for her... even though we have no one helping us with our bills and we already pay her a pretty good amount of money a month for CS that should more than cover her part of the rent at her place with a few hundred left over.

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#21 of 51 Old 11-29-2009, 07:21 PM
 
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Actually it is a play therapy... and DSD loved going. The weeks she did go we had no issues on our weekend with her. She also told us she liked going because the counselor made her happy to come spend the weekend with us.

Also, I would just like to state again... it isn't just H being adamant about DSD talking to someone... her teacher and peditrician have also put in a strong recomendation for her to do so...

As a Mom, I'd have to be very concerned that my child was so troubled that she was hitting everyday at school I'd be doing everything I possibly could to figure out and help her cope with whatever it is... wether it be stemming from my house or not... I honestly have to say that dismissing the child's feelings and her acting out because it doesn't have to do with Mom is a very surprising attitude here... I thought we are to respect our children and help them with all their problems? I'm sure our children will face many outside obstacles in their lives... should we just dismiss them and not get them help for their problems if they have nothing to do with us directly??

I agree-maybe if it was just your dh telling his ex that dsd was having problems, I could see how she could dismiss it as his problem-however, with the teacher and the pediatrician backing him up, I just can't understand how it is okay for the mom to ignore the problem simply because it isn't her fault or direct problem, especially since dsd enjoyed going and benefited from it. I wish you luck finding another therapist that you guys can take her too, and I hope it continues to help your dsd.

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#22 of 51 Old 11-29-2009, 07:25 PM
 
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Two thoughts. Any child can have need of therapy. It's not the exclusive province of children of divorce, with a father with anger management issues, poor communication between the three (four?) adults involved and any of the myriad other stuff that goes on.

Secondly, JSMa, I think last time this came up, I told you that I thought that you were expecting DSD to be a bigger girl than she is. Stuff about bedtime, responsibilities- 5 is still just a baby in so, so many ways, and often kids do have a really hard time adjusting to full time schooling. For some, they act out at school, for others, at home.

I am absolutely beside myself freaking out for your DSD over the line "H is so upset and agitated right now" because the way you've told it in the past, his way of dealing with upset is to make everyone else's life a living hell. Please stay safe.

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#23 of 51 Old 11-29-2009, 09:20 PM
 
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If I was a single mama, having the vast majority of the the residency of this child and the care that goes along with it, and not enough money for it and a hostile ex demanding it, then I would say that it was more than I could handle and be pretty indifferent to it. Wanting therapy and being able to have the time and money to do so are two different things. And if, as the mother claims, this is all coming from the tensions and hostility in the other parent's household, then I would not be making it a priority. And perhaps the mother does not believe therapy is the best way to handle it. How about a trial of no visitation at dad's home for a few months? If the school problems, etc. cease then everyone would be clear about where the child's issues are coming from. Hearing about JSMa's family in her many posts, I think my sympathy is with the ex and with hoping JSMa gets out of the relationship as well. The husband/exhusband seems to be a pretty big UAV.
Whoa. Seriously? You think she should not see her dad at all for a few months?? I can tell you, as a child of divorced parents, where there was a lot of stress at times at various houses, not seeing my dad (even if his house was the stressful one) would be very very detrimental to me and my raltionship with both parents. I'm shocked you would suggest sucha a thing. And sad too. Unless the dad is abusing the daughter I think that suggestion is way out of line.
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#24 of 51 Old 11-29-2009, 10:18 PM
 
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Originally Posted by homewithtwinsmama View Post
How about a trial of no visitation at dad's home for a few months? If the school problems, etc. cease then everyone would be clear about where the child's issues are coming from.
Following that logic, she should stop going to school for a while, too...

Parenting four little monkeys (11, 8, 6, and 4) with the love of my life. Making it up as I go.
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#25 of 51 Old 11-29-2009, 11:43 PM
 
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Originally Posted by UptownZoo View Post
She can't make these decisions unilaterally. With joint legal custody, the only decisions either parent can make on their own is for emergent medical care. All other decisions have to be made jointly.
Boy, that's a nice theory! But in practice, there is a very real catch-22:
* If the custodial parent decides to operate unilaterally and just inform the NCP of her choices after the fact (or not inform him at all), his only choice is to take her back to court.
* Depending what unilateral actions she has taken, the court may not be able to retroactively "fix" what has already been done, nor can the court force her to involve the NCP in future decision-making - it can only scold/warn her to do so.
* The very act of the parties having to return to court multiple times indicates that they're "incapable of co-parenting", which requires the court to give one parent sole custody and reduce the other to having only visitation rights. Consider this long and hard: an effective way to get yourself sole custody is to be so uncooperative with your child's other parent that the court finally throws up its hands and says, "OK, have what you want! We no longer expect you to cooperate and agree that you can call all the shots."
* Arguably, the CP's lack of cooperation COULD lead to a change in custody, but that is extremely rare. Changes of custody are considered disruptive to the child and are only supposed to occur if the child's best interest is not being served. The fact that the NCP is being treated unfairly does not, of itself, justify a modification. If the CP is making decisions that some objective person could say are good for the child...she's just not including the NCP in them like she should...that's not a reason to give the NCP custody, it's only a reason for the court to declare it fruitless to expect these two parents to cooperate with each other.

That said, certainly if your husband has custodial (not just visitation) rights, you have every right to take your SD to counseling during your parenting time, regardless whether it annoys her mother. But the only thing you can do to force Mom to take her during HER parenting time is go through the effort of convincing a judge the child NEEDS to go. Then, if Mom doesn't take her, she's not meeting what the court recognizes to be her needs. That could be grounds for a custody change. But you have to ask yourself: is that what you really want? Is that really best for this kid? Fairly recently - and more than once - you've indicated you don't even like her. You're not sure whether your marriage will be intact, down the road. And, healthy or not, fair or not, the kid seems pretty attached to and comfortable with her mom.

I agree that counseling should happen consistently and that, if objective professionals agree your SD needs counseling, then Mom's wrong to hide behind the excuse that the problems are all at your house (even if they were, does that change the fact that her kid needs counseling!?) HOWEVER, perhaps in this situation it's best to focus on what's under your control and not fight so hard to force Mom to do what you want that you could potentially end up with more responsibility for this child than you really desire.

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#26 of 51 Old 11-30-2009, 12:04 AM
 
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Originally Posted by vbactivist View Post
Unless the dad is abusing the daughter I think that suggestion (that JSMa's SD spend a few months without visiting her Dad is way out of line.
Me, too! Big time! I hate it when people view fathers as optional parts of the picture! Do you also believe that you can pick any several-month period in a child's relationship with its mother and write off that period as irrelevant and disposable? Yikes!

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#27 of 51 Old 11-30-2009, 12:37 AM
 
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I understand dad only sees his dd 4 days per month.

If he feels so strongly about this issue, can't he make the appointments during the week and take dd to them? That way mom wouldn't be able to make any excuses. He could even schedule them at the beginning or end of the school day so mom wouldn't have to make dd specifically available for them. He could sign her into or out of school on those days. *I suggested the beginning/end of the school day as opposed to the middle of the day in order to minimize the transitions for the child*
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#28 of 51 Old 11-30-2009, 03:00 PM
 
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Originally Posted by JSMa View Post
The counselor she was seeing doesn't have weekend appointments. H will be looking into trying to find a counselor that does so we can at least take her when we have her for the moment.
Not sure whether this would actually aggravate the situation or not, but could you propose the possibility of a weekly afternoon visit for the purposes of counseling? You or H would pick her up, take her, pay the co-pay and have her home in time for dinner and homework. That way all the excuses are taken away from mom. It may be a PITA for you and your H, but if she really needs counseling then I think it would be more efficient that fighting with mom to get her to cooperate. I agree that with there being joint legal custody she can't just stop the counseling, and in the end there is no judge on this planet that is not going to make accomodations for a child from a split marriage to attend counseling. If it comes down to a legal fight, I'm sure you guys will win.
FWIW, my son acts like a dream at dad's and school and saves it all for me. It's not pleasant but that's the way most kids are.

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#29 of 51 Old 11-30-2009, 03:22 PM
 
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Originally Posted by Jeannine View Post
Me, too! Big time! I hate it when people view fathers as optional parts of the picture! Do you also believe that you can pick any several-month period in a child's relationship with its mother and write off that period as irrelevant and disposable? Yikes!
But we're not talking about FATHERS here in general. We're talking about JSMa's H, who is by her own accounts ABUSIVE--to the point where she has (hopefully still is, given her posting history) considered leaving him (one of the reasons she has said she stays is to protect her SD).

That said, I think counseling is needed for SD.

No advice on how to break the stalemate, though. Because, I'm pretty sure that a conversation like this would NOT go over well with a judge:
Father: My daughter needs counseling, but my ex won't take her.
Judge: (to ex) Why do you object?
Ex: [whatever reasons, including cost and logistics]
Judge: (to F) Well, why don't you take her on your time and your dime?
F: Because I shouldn't have to pay for it and I don't want to give up any of my limited time.
Judge: So just how important is it, then?
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#30 of 51 Old 11-30-2009, 03:30 PM
 
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The thing is, the mother in this picture is no angel either. It's not like JsMa can throw up her hands and say "that's it, I'm out, I know you'll stop having visits with dsd now that I'm not here to do the caregiving and I'm GLAD because you SUCK as a father and a human being." That course of action might be (is!!) the best thing for JsMa and her dd, but it's won't make dsd safe or happy. If I were JsMa, I'd be pretty interested in keeping the counseling going, in the hope that the counselor would get the state involved if the situation in the mom's home escalates at some point in the future when JsMa has perhaps moved on.
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