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#1 of 28 Old 02-19-2011, 10:31 PM - Thread Starter
 
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I understand it's not my place to tell my ex how to spend his money but really there is a line.  He whines all the time about how he's broke and until he had to start paying for DD his incoming equaled his outgoing and they lived well and her child support is too high and he can't afford her health insurance.  Her premiums would be $300 a month and he's had a court order for medical support out for over a year.  He pays $558 a month in support.  He also has a nice townhome, two cars, an entire houseful of brand new furniture, appliances, etc, a big screen tv, just bought a new PS3, and keeps the gf supplied in designer clothes/bags/shoes etc.  He also has a huge dish package, two new computers, and excessive internet speed.  He's constantly taking time off work and going on costly trips to pay in Magic tournaments or just because.  They go out to eat at least once a week (and we're talking high dollar nice restaurants) and provides NOTHING for our daughter when she goes to his house.  I am expected to provide EVERYTHING down to her food and drink because they won't buy what she medically is able to eat and drink.  This bugs me because we have the SLOWEST internet speed (SO needs it for work), NO tv of any sort that we are required to pay for (and the screen we watch it on is small),ONE car, and a small apartment.  We've sold everything of any value INCLUDING OUR FURNITURE pretty much to make ends meet.  Then our one car (that we were 8 months from paying off) had the transmission go out.  It was not something we could afford and in our area, carless isn't an option.  After thoroughly looking through all the options, our only choice was to trade it in and get a "new" car.  It wasn't what we wanted but we had no choice so we went ahead.  We scrimped and pinched and took a really crappy deal to get the money to pay the sales tax so we could have a working vehicle.  Less than a week later ex is now trading in both his PERFECTLY FINE cars to get one vehicle with a ticket of $30,000 + interest!!!!!!  The big thing is that one of the cars is the one we bought during our marriage (that he's three months from paying off) in a community property state so I'm entitled to part of it's value.  WTF?!  He "can't afford" to pay for his daughter's child support or provide her health insurance (so we're stuck on medicaid) but he can do all that sh!t?  Sure sounds like he's got a lot of disposable income to me and can pay it just fine!  I'm just LIVID because we've been stuck with crappy doctor after crappy doctor and get treated like worthless sh!t pretty much everywhere we go and have to fight to get the specialists and treatments she needs because he can't afford her insurance and now he pulls this bs?!  There are just no words for how angry I am.  Thank goodness he doesn't have visitation again until Saturday so I have time to chill before I have to see him because I honestly don't think I could bite my tongue anymore.  :(

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#2 of 28 Old 02-20-2011, 01:18 PM
 
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That sounds really horrible.  My ex had two children when we got together.  We always had money to go to the bar or go out to eat but when it came to him buying them christmas presents or birthday presents or anything at it would be really skimpy.  He said he paid child support (which, by the way, he very rarely actually paid) and he shouldnt have to.  I felt horrible about that, on top of being monetarily selfish he was also cold and emotionally detached from them.  They would come to our house and tell us they hated us and wanted to go home everyday they were there.  What he did was wrong but he had some really pent up feelings about his children reguarding their behavior.  Their mother would bad mouth him  (The mother was very emotionally abusive to the kids), it was all around a very bad situation for the girls and i was always there for them telling them they were good kids in a tough situation....and I still have a good relationship with them to this day.  Anyway, I come from the opposite point of view, but not very many woman would feel like me.  Many of them would want their man to ignore the kids(because they felt threatened) and would love to have all the money spent on them.  Ugh is all I can say.

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#3 of 28 Old 02-20-2011, 02:14 PM - Thread Starter
 
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That's fabulous that you still have a relationship with them!  His GF now all of a sudden wants a baby.  We've been friends for a long time and it was always, "I never want to have kids and I don't understand how any would."  Sounds to me like someone is trying to steal the attention back.

 

ETA: We were friends for a long time until she started sleeping with my husband and stealing from us - understandably at which point the friendship ended.

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#4 of 28 Old 02-22-2011, 09:58 AM
 
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Im surprised the state would provide her with medicaid if her father is financially able to support her. 


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#5 of 28 Old 02-22-2011, 10:59 AM - Thread Starter
 
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Our state only goes after the father if you get cash benefits.  Plus, I had medicaid while pregnant because I lost my job so by default she had it after birth.  It tooks 7 months for the medical order to go out after she was born and she's been on it ever since as well.  We had to recertify around her birthday and I let them know about the order and they said there was nothing they could do until CSE enforced it.  :(  Really crappy situation.  Hopefully the mediator will have at it when we go to make him see what his priorities should be (DD first, then him, then gf, then dog).

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#6 of 28 Old 02-24-2011, 02:54 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Ugh, I passed his house on the way home today and they didn't trade in both cars - just the one that was ours and I have rights to the value.  Can't afford to do what you're supposed to my  a**!  He now has TWO cars to pay for and insure one of which is $30,000 + about $20,000 in interest!!!  BS, come on mediation, my terms just got a lot tougher!

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#7 of 28 Old 02-24-2011, 03:34 PM
 
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You are right to go into mediation with a tough mindset and a basic awareness of major things like a new car purchase. You are right to insist, relentlessly, that mandated support be fully paid. 

 

Everything else is just a waste of your energy. It's not your business how he spends money. It's actually not your business what your mutual child eats at his house - although given her young age and allergies, I see why you get sucked into providing food. Every second you spend being mad about the new gf's fancy accessories is a second that you did NOT spend taking good care of yourself and your family. 

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#8 of 28 Old 02-25-2011, 07:54 AM
 
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Can you apply for cash benefits so cse will go after him? Even if you only qualify for $5 a  month, they will try to get it out of him.


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#9 of 28 Old 02-25-2011, 09:04 AM - Thread Starter
 
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That is a thought.  We've applied before but didn't qualify because I got $800 a month in unemployment.  I don't get that anymore so maybe we would qualify...Food for thought.  :)

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#10 of 28 Old 02-25-2011, 12:14 PM
 
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Definitely a good idea to reapply, if TPR is off the table as it unfortunately seems to be. 

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#11 of 28 Old 02-26-2011, 09:22 AM
 
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That is a thought.  We've applied before but didn't qualify because I got $800 a month in unemployment.  I don't get that anymore so maybe we would qualify...Food for thought.  :)



Don't re-apply.  States that go after the dad for child support when the mother gets cash benefits, KEEP the support.  So, if you qualify for $5, the state will keep all $300 (or whatever - thats just a random number) that your ex pays, even though it shoudl be yours.  Don't ask me why, I don't know.  I just know that has happened to people, and so if you do reapply, you need to ask, 100 times, how much of the cs they will keep, and how much you will get.  And then, you need to pull your application if the state will keep everything.

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#12 of 28 Old 02-26-2011, 02:32 PM
 
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... all this assuming that what you WANT is the money. What the OP may in fact want is for her ex to get hit as hard as possible in the wallet by an entity he can't bully or avoid or disregard, in the hopes of securing an eventual voluntary TPR. 

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#13 of 28 Old 02-26-2011, 03:29 PM
 
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... all this assuming that what you WANT is the money. What the OP may in fact want is for her ex to get hit as hard as possible in the wallet by an entity he can't bully or avoid or disregard, in the hopes of securing an eventual voluntary TPR. 


 

I'm in a similar situation... my kids haven't seen their birth dad in over two years, and he's $3000. in arrears. I've posed the adoption question to him, and the response I got was "I have no comment at this time. I need to consult legal advice when I am able." The way I see it, it's win-win for the kids.... 

 

If XH wants to retain his rights, that's fine by me, but I'll be holding him to his financial obligation... I pieced together details from a court application he mailed (not filed/served, so there was no court date) and an email he sent, and figured out where he's working. I can't rely on support for our monthly expenses because it's intermittent, but I can tuck whatever I get away in the kids' education savings plan, or use it for clothes or activities for the kids. More money = more security (sort of? It gets put to good use, anyway) If having to pay the support the kids deserve is a motivating factor for him to give up his rights, then...

 

SO would happily take them! He considers them his own kids, refers to them as his son/daughter and is proud of them. He considers it a privilege to be a part of their lives/ We've consulted with a lawyer ourselves and down the line, he may try to adopt them even without XH's consent (we are the kind of case where it's sometimes possible) the lawyer informed us that even if I died, the kids could stay with SO. An adoption would save them from the inevitable court battle that XH's parents (not XH.. though he'd do whatever Mumsie told him to) Other things would be a lot easier, too... I don't have passports for the kids because XH won't sign them (and won't give a reason why not) and I'm not sure how SO would be treated if he ever has to take one of the kids to the doctor/emergency if I'm out of town or something... I worry that they wouldn't let him visit/comfort them like they would a 'real' parent. Would they put the cast on/stitch the kid up and give them back to him, or would they only release them to a legal guardian? It's a whole bunch of stupid shit that he, as their DAD, shouldn't have to think about. The security we'd have is obviously well worth doing without child support!!


~Teresa, raising DS (Jan. 02) and DD1 (Jun. 04) and DD2 (Dec. 11) with DH.

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#14 of 28 Old 02-26-2011, 03:39 PM
 
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I'm not sure how SO would be treated if he ever has to take one of the kids to the doctor/emergency if I'm out of town or something... I worry that they wouldn't let him visit/comfort them like they would a 'real' parent. Would they put the cast on/stitch the kid up and give them back to him, or would they only release them to a legal guardian? It's a whole bunch of stupid shit that he, as their DAD, shouldn't have to think about. The security we'd have is obviously well worth doing without child support!!

 

This is something worth asking a lawyer about.  I'm sure that you could, every time you left town or went away for business, or whatever, sign a medical "permission" slip of sorts to sort it out.  But, yeah, talk to a lawyer.  Thats not a good thing to worry about when you're out of town!!

 

Sorry OP for the derailment!
 

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#15 of 28 Old 02-26-2011, 03:45 PM
 
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... all this assuming that what you WANT is the money. What the OP may in fact want is for her ex to get hit as hard as possible in the wallet by an entity he can't bully or avoid or disregard, in the hopes of securing an eventual voluntary TPR. 



And that's all fine and well, but the OP was MARRIED to that man when she got pregnant - he is her child's father.  Trying to bully someone into TPR just makes my stomach turn and twist into knots.

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#16 of 28 Old 02-26-2011, 04:24 PM
 
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A dad who cares about his kids wouldn't need government intervention to 'bully' him into paying child support, he'd pay it willingly! If he can't take the pressure of being held responsible for his kids, too bad! 

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~Teresa, raising DS (Jan. 02) and DD1 (Jun. 04) and DD2 (Dec. 11) with DH.

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#17 of 28 Old 02-26-2011, 04:28 PM
 
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A dad who cares about his kids wouldn't need government intervention to 'bully' him into paying child support, he'd pay it willingly! If he can't take the pressure of being held responsible for his kids, too bad! 


True.  That doesn't mean that the OP, or the government, should be bullying him into TPR though.

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#18 of 28 Old 02-26-2011, 06:29 PM - Thread Starter
 
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EXACTLY!!!  We were actually just in this situation because DD was in the hospital.

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I'm in a similar situation... my kids haven't seen their birth dad in over two years, and he's $3000. in arrears. I've posed the adoption question to him, and the response I got was "I have no comment at this time. I need to consult legal advice when I am able." The way I see it, it's win-win for the kids.... 

 

If XH wants to retain his rights, that's fine by me, but I'll be holding him to his financial obligation... I pieced together details from a court application he mailed (not filed/served, so there was no court date) and an email he sent, and figured out where he's working. I can't rely on support for our monthly expenses because it's intermittent, but I can tuck whatever I get away in the kids' education savings plan, or use it for clothes or activities for the kids. More money = more security (sort of? It gets put to good use, anyway) If having to pay the support the kids deserve is a motivating factor for him to give up his rights, then...

 

SO would happily take them! He considers them his own kids, refers to them as his son/daughter and is proud of them. He considers it a privilege to be a part of their lives/ We've consulted with a lawyer ourselves and down the line, he may try to adopt them even without XH's consent (we are the kind of case where it's sometimes possible) the lawyer informed us that even if I died, the kids could stay with SO. An adoption would save them from the inevitable court battle that XH's parents (not XH.. though he'd do whatever Mumsie told him to) Other things would be a lot easier, too... I don't have passports for the kids because XH won't sign them (and won't give a reason why not) and I'm not sure how SO would be treated if he ever has to take one of the kids to the doctor/emergency if I'm out of town or something... I worry that they wouldn't let him visit/comfort them like they would a 'real' parent. Would they put the cast on/stitch the kid up and give them back to him, or would they only release them to a legal guardian? It's a whole bunch of stupid shit that he, as their DAD, shouldn't have to think about. The security we'd have is obviously well worth doing without child support!!



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#19 of 28 Old 02-26-2011, 06:29 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Oops, double post.

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#20 of 28 Old 02-26-2011, 06:33 PM - Thread Starter
 
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For the record, I'm not trying to bully him into anything.  I'm trying to get him to do what's best for our daughter which is to have the man who's been her father (since bio decided to opt out for 16 of her 19 months), whom she calls dad, and who has been there since before birth have the legal rights to protect her as he should.  If bio will stop his bs crap and ACTUALLY put DD's needs ahead of his (which, honestly, will NEVER happen.  It's just who he is as a person.) I have no problem with him being a part of her life.  Instead, for him, she is a show piece and a way to upset me.  He won't sign off his rights because that's what I want but he doesn't want to pay up either.
 

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True.  That doesn't mean that the OP, or the government, should be bullying him into TPR though.



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#21 of 28 Old 02-26-2011, 07:03 PM
 
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Don't re-apply.  States that go after the dad for child support when the mother gets cash benefits, KEEP the support.  So, if you qualify for $5, the state will keep all $300 (or whatever - thats just a random number) that your ex pays, even though it shoudl be yours.  Don't ask me why, I don't know.  I just know that has happened to people, and so if you do reapply, you need to ask, 100 times, how much of the cs they will keep, and how much you will get.  And then, you need to pull your application if the state will keep everything.


This is true, but could it get him into their system? In my state, if you get food stamps, medical or anything at all from the state, any court ordered child support goes through cse automatically. Maybe you could do it long enough to get them garnishing his wages, then drop the cash benefits?


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#22 of 28 Old 02-26-2011, 07:44 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Support is not the issue - it's already autodrafted from his check and sent through CSE.  It's the medical order that he's not honoring which is in turn cheating her out of a) good insurance or b) another $300 in support a month.

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#23 of 28 Old 02-27-2011, 05:51 AM
 
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"Trying to bully someone into TPR just makes my stomach turn and twist into knots."

 

I can think of some things that would qualify as "bullying into TPR" - making false allegations, getting the kids to lobby for the TPR, etc. I'm not on board with that kind of behavior.  Signing up for government aid is a way different thing. 

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#24 of 28 Old 02-27-2011, 07:50 AM
 
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For the record, I'm not trying to bully him into anything.  I'm trying to get him to do what's best for our daughter which is to have the man who's been her father (since bio decided to opt out for 16 of her 19 months), whom she calls dad, and who has been there since before birth have the legal rights to protect her as he should.  If bio will stop his bs crap and ACTUALLY put DD's needs ahead of his (which, honestly, will NEVER happen.  It's just who he is as a person.) I have no problem with him being a part of her life.  Instead, for him, she is a show piece and a way to upset me.  He won't sign off his rights because that's what I want but he doesn't want to pay up either.
 

 

I totally get that he has been absent for most of her life, that your current SO is an awesome step-father, and that you don't think your ex is ever going to change. 16 out of 18 months is a LOT of her life right now. But 5, 10, 15 years from now it is a tiny fraction of her life that SHE won't even remember. And as much as you think there is no possible way he will ever change, there are many, many people who have turned their lives around after some pretty horrific past behavior. I can't count how many people I know that say becoming a parent has changed them, and if he's only been back in her life for a couple months, he has just recently started parenting. 

 

I totally get that you think the worst of your ex's behavior and motivations. I spent a LOT of time assuming the worst of my husband's ex. From our perspective, she was using her daughter to get what she wanted and to punish my husband for things he did that she didn't like. I absolutely believed that those were the things motivating her to do the things she was doing. And I know there is NO WAY that she was at home thinking "I know this is bad for my daughter, but I don't really care. I come first and she is simply a means to an end." She loved her daughter and thought she was doing what was best for her, even when I thought her behavior was accomplishing exactly the opposite.

 

TPR is DRASTIC and PERMANENT. Can you even IMAGINE giving up any and all rights you have to parent your daughter? I definitely can't imagine voluntarily giving up access to my kids, even if I had made some mistakes in my past... even if I wasn't ready to parent them right now... there's no way I would possibly agree that I shouldn't be part of their lives EVER, or that I should forgo any involvement for their entire childhood, adolescence, and teen years because I hadn't been much of a parent to them the first year and a half of their lives.

 

I totally get that from your perspective life would become a heck of a lot easier if you could just cut all ties with a person you can't stand and who clearly makes you miserable. I absolutely daydream about being able to live our lives without any input or involvement from my step-daughter's mother. To have control of our own money, to be able to schedule our lives how we choose to, to be able to take advantage of opportunities without needing the okay from someone who couldn't care less about our life... Unfortunately, that's just not the way my world works, and I have to make a lot of sacrifices because our lives are tied permanently to someone else's. There's no easy fix for that, and I know that as much as I would love for her mother to just disappear, ultimately that would leave a hole in my step-daughter's life that she might never, ever come to terms with. 
 


Parenting four little monkeys (11, 8, 6, and 4) with the love of my life. Making it up as I go.
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#25 of 28 Old 02-27-2011, 08:07 AM
 
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For the record, I'm not trying to bully him into anything.  I'm trying to get him to do what's best for our daughter which is to have the man who's been her father (since bio decided to opt out for 16 of her 19 months), whom she calls dad, and who has been there since before birth have the legal rights to protect her as he should.  If bio will stop his bs crap and ACTUALLY put DD's needs ahead of his (which, honestly, will NEVER happen.  It's just who he is as a person.) I have no problem with him being a part of her life.  Instead, for him, she is a show piece and a way to upset me.  He won't sign off his rights because that's what I want but he doesn't want to pay up either.
 


I think you BOTH need to own up to your own parts of this. You are certainly not an entirely 100% innocent party here either yk?  You and this guy split up, basically right after you got pregnant (If I remember correctly), then you started dating your current SO when you were 2 months along?  And then you raised your dd to call him dad, even though you weren't even divorced yet.  Then stbx came back, and was probably FURIOUS that his child is calling someone else the very important title of Dad, and now is trying to get back into her life.  You shouldn't have had her calling her step-dad "dad" (she honestly never would have known the difference - kids don't just start calling people "mom" and "dad" - those are names that are taught to them by us, their parents).

 

I get that this guy hurt you - I understand that.  You need to keep his hurting you COMPLETELY separate from his relationship with yours, and HIS, dd.  They are 2 different relationships.

 

Thats not to say that he is justified in not paying up for the medical expenses - in some states it is possible to give medical to the child support enforcement people to be garnished from wages along with the child support.  You need to find out if this is possible, and take him to court for contempt for not holding up his end of the bargain.

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#26 of 28 Old 02-28-2011, 04:19 AM
 
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I'll just throw this in there:

 

My parents got divorced when I was less than 2 years old. Soon after my dad moved several states away. Except for occasional events that he came up for (state gymnastics meet, graduation, a play I was in, etc), most years I saw him for 6 weeks in the summer and 2 weeks every other Christmas. That's it. My mom got remarried to a family friend we'd known all our lives, someone we chose to call Daddy (my other dad was "Papa").

 

From what I've pieced together from my mom (who has never and will never say anything bad about my dad, but who gave me little tidbits from her own experience when I was going through my own divorce as an adult) my dad absolutely loved us but didn't have much of an idea how to put other people's needs ahead of his own on a regular basis, and a big part of their divorce was their different ideas of what it meant to be a parent and to raise children together. We always had enough money growing up, but not a lot extra... my dad had plenty of money, came from a rich family, had a big house in one state and a beautiful summer place in another, had a stay-at-home wife, and retired young. When we were with him we took expensive vacations.

 

We lived with my step-father. My step-father took us to doctor's appointments, picked us up from school when we were sick, signed permission forms, enforced the rules, paid for our expenses and our extra-curriculars, helped us with homework, tucked us in at night... He was the everyday dad who did all the things one expects dads to do. He's the father who did the actual parenting every single day.

 

Despite her personal feelings for my dad, her doubts about his abilities as a parent, and some pretty extreme disagreement with some of the things we were allowed to do during his parenting time,  she was supportive of our relationship with him, encouraged him to take extra time with us if he ever had it, encouraged us to call him every night, and gave us long stretches of uniterrupted time with him where she didn't expect so much as a phone call or postcard from us. 

 

And throughout my life, I have been EXTREMELY close to my dad. Still now I talk to him most days on the phone. When I see something interesting or funny, he's the one I text or call. I chose to go to college near him. When I got remarried at city hall, he was the only person we invited to fly across the country to witness the ceremony. He is my DAD, and regardless of who stepped in and did the everyday parenting in his absence, regardless of who I called "dad," what my mother thought of him, how little I saw him, or how little he was involved in my day-to-day life he IS and always will be my DAD. 

 

I will always be grateful to my mom for putting her own stuff aside and letting us develop our own relationship with him. I give her so much credit for her part in building that relationship. I've had some conversations with her about blended families and step-parenting, and she said she NEVER saw it as an either/or... She always saw how lucky we were to have so many adults to love us, each in their own ways. I love my step-father and have a close relationship with him, completely separate from my relationship with my dad. Just as my mom had enough room in her heart to love each one of her children, she knew that we had enough room in our hearts to love ALL the adults in our lives, and she respected our right to develop our own relationships with each of them. She is our model for good co-parenting... my husband, when he is in conflict with his ex, often things about what my mom would do. As I parent my own children, I hope I can be just like her.


Parenting four little monkeys (11, 8, 6, and 4) with the love of my life. Making it up as I go.
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#27 of 28 Old 02-28-2011, 06:55 AM - Thread Starter
 
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That's wonderful and it really does give me hope that one day something like that may work for us.  In our particular situation, it is obvious which one is Dad and which one is the playmate to DD and I honor her wishes and don't force anything.  She's allowed to develop a relationship with bio and chooses to treat SO as her dad.  Bio is the proverbial "bad-ex" - tells the whole world I never let him see her but when I offer more time he won't take it, is always late, brings her home early, or doesn't show at all.  Doesn't put DD first, treats her like a showpiece or accessory to his own woes, and doesn't "parent".  To him, DD is just a pawn in our divorce.  Since we're forced to have a relationship with him, I really wish he would grow up and treat DD properly so it would be something good for her rather than the current damaging one.  :(


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#28 of 28 Old 02-28-2011, 08:20 PM
 
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Aricha, I love how you were able to craft a meaningful relationship with your father over the years! I saw my dad on a similar schedule, but I wasn't able to be so close to him. My mom NEVER said a cross word about him; I thought they were great friends, growing up. She allowed him to take me to Spain for the summer when I was six, before I even knew what a father was- I called him by his first name, and learned what a dad was and that he was mine on that trip. I feel certain that my dad could have spent any amount of time that he wanted to spend with us, and also had an open door to go ahead and pay the child support he was supposed to pay- but he didn't. It took maturity for me to place the little bit of sadness I felt around him all my life, but eventually I came to the realization that my brother and I just don't figure for much in his life. I can't say what he feels inside, whether he "truly" loves us in some way, but for me, not being involved is akin to telling someone, especially a kid, that you don't care about them. What practical difference would it make if he did care, but continued to stay away? It takes two to have a relationship! I don't know what makes the difference in your story- maybe it was that you got to talk on the phone a lot. Either way, he had to have made some gestures where he reached out to you. I hope Sling Mama's ex will get it together to make the same kind of effort!


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