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#1 of 16 Old 06-06-2011, 06:16 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Ok, I'm just not even sure if this is in the realm of normal.  SD is 7 1/2.  Still has the occasional pee accident at night/early morning.  And we've had to get on her ass recently for hiding it from us.  So tonight we're putting her to bed, and SO finds what appears to be smears of poop or chocolate on the pad she sleeps on (we have several of those nice cloth hospital bed pads for the times she has pee accidents).  Give it the sniff test - probably poop.  So we start asking SD about it.  Of course we get the sheepish looks, the shrugs, the "I don't know" 's...and we both start to get angry.  So finally we know it's poop, but she is still "I don't know" -ing and we can't even find out when it happened.  Her undies from the night before (she had a shower last night, put on fresh undies and would have either changed her undies tonight or in the morning before school) had poop on them....SO gets really angry and has to leave.  I stayed because I wanted answers.  I stopped yelling and sat on her bed and asked her more questions.  She asked if I was going to yell more.  I said no.  She asked if I wanted the truth - um, hello?!  YES, I said we always want the truth from her.  So I finally get it out of her that sometime last night she had an accident with poop.  She put her undies in the laundry hamper, wiped her bum with toilet paper she had in her bed for her stuffy/runny nose last week, folded over the poopy part of her pad, and went back to sleep.  She did not go into the bathroom and use the wipes we have in there to make sure she was clean, she did not even wash her hands.  She did not get either of us up to help.  She didn't say a word, and wouldn't have unless we found the evidence.  I tried my best to have a conversation with her about the health risks associated with what she did, to her, to us, to her classmates since she didn't wash hands before school (and the poop smears on her pad looked like she wiped her fingers on the pad)...I am beside myself about the dangers of the lack of clean-up after what happened.  I tried to explain all of these things, telling her how she should have cleaned up after herself, or that she should have got one of us up to help.  I told her to look at me while I talked to her, otherwise I'm going to think she isn't really listening to me.  I tried to do all this calmly.  I think I did a good job.  But she was so quick to turn her attention elsewhere and change the subject once I was done...I just don't know if she got ANY of it!  And honestly, I think 7 1/2 years is old enough to know better than to do what she did.  I don't know why she had the accident either.  It wasn't a lot of poo.  Maybe she farted and it wasn't just a fart?  I don't know.

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#2 of 16 Old 06-06-2011, 08:25 PM
 
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I don't have an answer about the poop, but both my kids (nearly 7 and 9 years old still have occasional pee accidents. Generally, it means they're having a growth spurt or they're coming down with an illness. Sometimes their bodies just need sleep so badly they can't wake themselves up. I say that to them whenever there's an accident and neither of them seems embarrassed when it happens... they just matter of factly let me know. Maybe introducing the idea of accidents being a side effect of when she's growing will make it easier for her to speak up when it happens? If she's concerned about pees, I can understand how she'd think it'd mean BIG TROUBLE to have a poop accident. What was the day before it happened like? If there was a lot of really exciting things going on, maybe she held it so she wouldn't miss out on something good?


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#3 of 16 Old 06-06-2011, 08:30 PM
 
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As to whether or not it is normal, I think that's a question for the pediatrician. 

 

Look at it from her perspective: if she TELLS you about the accident, there is a pretty good chance (in her eyes) that she will get yelled at. If she HIDES it, there is a chance you will find out and get mad, but there is a chance you will NOT find out and, therefore, you will not get mad at her. If you are faced with a choice of tell and definitely get in trouble or don't tell and possibly not get in trouble, it's not really a tough choice... why would you invite a negative reaction by telling?

 

I don't know what might be going on, but I do know that whatever it is will not be helped by getting upset about it. It is either physically or psychologically outside her control. She needs compassion and someone to be on her side helping her figure out how to stay clean and dry at night. You need information and cooperation from your step daughter to solve this one, neither one of which you will get unless she feels safe opening up about whatever is going on. Personally I would talk to the pediatrician.

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#4 of 16 Old 06-06-2011, 08:39 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Well, we have tried to tell her that if she honestly has an accident, we aren't going to be mad, but we are going to get upset if she hides it from us.  I mean, this isn't just pee this time, it's fecal matter, and I'm sorry, but I can't help but be upset that she possibly got it on her hands and didn't even wash them.  I am on her side and I am really trying to show compassion about stuff like this.  Someone mentioned maybe she held it in - she actually has some issues with going poo and it being hard and hurting, so it's possible.  She also had ice cream for desert, so maybe she had a bit of loose poop and like I said, trusted a fart that wasn't just a fart.  We don't even know what time of night it happened, and neither does she.  I guess we just have to hope it never happens again.  I'm not sure it's anything to call the Dr. about unless it does.

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#5 of 16 Old 06-07-2011, 06:25 AM
 
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Since you're having trouble getting her to tell the truth, I would make sure you aren't asking questions in a way that encourages her to lie.  You said you knew it was poop, so asking her what it was  or how it got there is silly.  You know the answer.  And really, if you pooped your pants would you want to talk about it??   She didn't need to confess, you could have ended it by saying "Poop happens :) Next time please make sure you A) wash your hands, B) get someone to help you clean it up because poop is dirty and carries germs."  

 

When ds went through a lying phase we started making sure questions were asked in a way that he couldn't lie.  "Did you take out the trash?" (When we knew he hadn't.) Changed to "I think you forgot to take out the trash."  So much easier.

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#6 of 16 Old 06-07-2011, 03:52 PM
 
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My daughter is 3.5 years old and amazingly has not peed her bed in a longgg time, but sometimes when she's having a lot of fun during the day she'll forget to go potty and just pee in her pants. When that happens, I remind her that when people forget to use the potty, they have to use diapers and that embarrasses her so she makes sure that she is using the restroom (until she forgets again). I'm just thinking here, that if using a diaper is embarrassing for a 3 year old, I'm guessing it would be embarrassing to a 7 year old and maybe you could suggest to her wearing a diaper at night until she gets the accidents under control. Then, I think it's sort of her decision and maybe she'll try harder not to pee (or poop) the bed because she won't want people to think of her as "a baby". And I think my twin sister even had accidents around 7 too and I'm pretty sure my mom had her wear a diaper whenever that happened. But then if she pees the diapers make sure she's not hiding those from you cause I think my sister did that and it drove my mom NUTS when she found an old wet diaper stuffed in some corner or something LOL!!! that was always funny to me ;) not so much now that I'm a mom of course!


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#7 of 16 Old 06-08-2011, 05:05 AM
 
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In all honesty - I think that you and Dad are causing much of the problem. First, the both of you yell at her, then Dad storms off. Then you kind of freak out on her for not doing this, that or the other. And THEN hit her with a lecture about hygiene. That's all rather intense for a 7yo, ya know?

 

Are there extra pads handy in her room? How far away is the bathroom? Is there a nightlight, or does she have to get there in the dark? Where are the wipes?

 

I would leave extra pads in her bedroom, as well as a box of wipes. Also, a laundry bin/basket and a lined trashcan. And hand sanitizer. Tell her that, if she has an accident (of either variety) at night, she can put her laundry into the bin, and use the wipes to clean herself, the hand sanitizer for her hands. In the morning, she can throw the (tied) trash bag in the household trash, and her laundry in the washer. And let her know that, if she'd like (and doesn't already know), you'll teach her how to run the wash so that she can take care of her bedding/underwear herself.

 

When things have calmed down, I'd reinforce with her why it's important to wash hands, etc. after bathroom issues, no matter where they occur. And stress that these things can happen to all of us, for any number of reasons.

 

If it continues, Mom & Dad may want to consider that there is an medical (physical or emotional) issue going on that needs to be addressed. But I'd start with ramping down the angst and drama associated with her accidents.

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#8 of 16 Old 06-08-2011, 05:35 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by blondygirl View Post

My daughter is 3.5 years old and amazingly has not peed her bed in a longgg time, but sometimes when she's having a lot of fun during the day she'll forget to go potty and just pee in her pants. When that happens, I remind her that when people forget to use the potty, they have to use diapers and that embarrasses her so she makes sure that she is using the restroom (until she forgets again). I'm just thinking here, that if using a diaper is embarrassing for a 3 year old, I'm guessing it would be embarrassing to a 7 year old and maybe you could suggest to her wearing a diaper at night until she gets the accidents under control. Then, I think it's sort of her decision and maybe she'll try harder not to pee (or poop) the bed because she won't want people to think of her as "a baby". And I think my twin sister even had accidents around 7 too and I'm pretty sure my mom had her wear a diaper whenever that happened. But then if she pees the diapers make sure she's not hiding those from you cause I think my sister did that and it drove my mom NUTS when she found an old wet diaper stuffed in some corner or something LOL!!! that was always funny to me ;) not so much now that I'm a mom of course!


I'm sorry, but that seems like a terribly demeaning way to handle it. What if this is a physical or emotional problem that she CAN'T control? All this solution does is shame her further than she apparently already has been.

 

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#9 of 16 Old 06-11-2011, 10:36 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mtiger View Post


I'm sorry, but that seems like a terribly demeaning way to handle it. What if this is a physical or emotional problem that she CAN'T control? All this solution does is shame her further than she apparently already has been.

 

Well I agree with you if it's something she CANT control... but again,I don't remember how old my twin was when she was peeing the bed but I know that I wasn't doing it so it was old enough that she shouldn't have been peeing the bed, and I remember her wearing diapers some nights. I don't think it bothered her like that, she felt like she couldn't hold it either so I think she appreciated the extra protection. I think she would use diapers occasionally until I think I made fun of her about it in front of another kid. Obviously, that was wrong of me, but we were young and that's when she decided to stop peeing the bed I'm pretty sure. I don't recall it all perfectly so I'll probably ask her when and why she decided to stop peeing the bed. I'm fairly certain it was after I teased her about it though... so just from that experience I think it was kind of in her mind that she "couldn't" control it. OR, more likely, that was her excuse to be lazy and she chose to give that up after she felt embarrassed about it.

 

So first of all though I don't want to assume that all kids are the same, but in the situation with MY TWIN SISTER, who I know better than anybody, she's got a bit of a lazy personality and I bet she'd even admit to it now that the reason she peed in her bed was because she didnt want to walk all the way to the bathroom. My mom got her diapers and my sister didn't mind them UNTIL I humiliated her... but I'm not sure that's exactly how it happened so I'll double check but that scenario seems familiar to me. Anyways, it's never a good idea when parents embarrass their kids, but siblings will do that so even if she REALLY couldn't control it, she somehow overcame it when she got embarrassed. I think sometimes that works... I dunno, just my experience... but the kid from the post could be different, so who knows... all I can pull from is my sister and my daughter so sorry if I'm demeaning but in the situations I've known it didn't seem so bad?
 

 


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#10 of 16 Old 06-11-2011, 07:53 PM
 
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Personally, I think it would behoove Dad to discuss this issue with his daughter's physician. Instead of ASSUMING that she's lazy.

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#11 of 16 Old 06-11-2011, 08:52 PM
 
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"In all honesty - I think that you and Dad are causing much of the problem. First, the both of you yell at her, then Dad storms off. Then you kind of freak out on her for not doing this, that or the other. And THEN hit her with a lecture about hygiene. That's all rather intense for a 7yo, ya know?"

I agree.

This is gross, sure, but 7-year-olds are gross little creatures sometimes. The typical before-school routine for a child this age includes going potty, brushing teeth, and washing hands, with a degree of adult supervision appropriate to the particular child. If that's not what you are currently doing, then start doing that, check her bed daily to see if she needs her sheets changed, and calm the heck down.

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#12 of 16 Old 06-12-2011, 04:05 AM
 
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What Smithie said.

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#13 of 16 Old 08-21-2011, 03:04 PM
 
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Not to be the bad one here, and I'm totally not trying to be (just being honest).....your DD likely hid the poop incident from you because you get on her so badly about the pee incidents. :-(  It can already be HIGHLY embarrassing for a child around that age to wet the bed, add on their parent, the one they can go to for anything and everything, getting ON to them for it in a harsh manner and that can really break them down. I wouldn't be so hard on her if at all possible. I agree with someone else up above, 7 year olds or kids in general, are GROSS sometimes! It's just a fact of life. Parenting can be tough, the things we have to deal with, especially things of this nature. I deal with occasional bed wetting "still" with my 9 yr old. It is what it is. She is my child though and we talk through it and I remind her no water so close to bed time and to potty each evening, my job as her mother, and if she still has an accident then I don't make her feel bad about it or threaten to hurt her for it. :-(  Her body just can't help it, she can't wake up at the time. She is a deep sleeper. Give the kid a break maybe?


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#14 of 16 Old 08-21-2011, 06:23 PM
 
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My dd is just turning 13 and has only been consistently dry at night for the last year or so. She has also had a physical problem (I don't remember the name) where poop comes out into her underwear. It may have been associated with holding it- she's one of those kids who *really* gets into what she's doing. I have gone through so much inner anguish over this, because she used to go around with poop in her underwear all day. Literally all day. She would go pee, know perfectly well the poop was there, and do nothing. I would have to discreetly ask her if she needed to clean her butt, and she would sigh and roll her eyes before stomping into the bathroom! I'm not a terribly squeamish person, and I will drink out of the milk carton or eat something I dropped on the floor. But walking around all afternoon with poop in your underwear is going way too far! So I know how you feel. It seems like the act of a crazy person to not rush in and wash away every trace when you have poop on any part of your body! I have really wondered if my dd has mental health issues, self loathing, depression, or unresolved rage. I guess this attitude is from somewhere in my own potty training process. My dd is not mentally ill, and the times I have yelled at her about it, or tried to express that her behavior scares me, didn't help at all. Xh has yelled at her and shamed her a lot over this, and if anything I think it made it worse. In the end I just kept checking her and telling her matter of factly to go clean her butt. The poop in the underwear thing has gradually gone away with the bedwetting. Now she has her period, and has no issues with changing her pad, though I have to make her shower! Hopefully she will manage that one on her own by the time she goes to college!


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#15 of 16 Old 08-25-2011, 09:08 PM
 
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DSS (now 10) had some major bathroom issues.  Without going too much into the history of it all (very long story) during his potty-training times there was a lot of upheaval.  DF's ex wife took off for 3 months, popping in now & then when he was 4 or so.  DF was pretty much solely responsible for potty training the kiddo, as his ex felt that it "wasn't her job" since kiddo is a boy. duh.gif  They lived with his ex in-laws, attitude in general was that it was too much work to enforce pottying if the kid doesn't want to. Then she kicked him out a year later, so DSS was 5.  Fast forward 3 years... he is not just having the occasional accident by this point, it is a CONSCIOUS choice on his part.  He would hold it all day at school, get off the bus, and poop the minute his feet his his grandparents' driveway.  We thought maybe it was a medical condition - right up until we found out some more information.  Technically, he did by that point have a condition called encopresis (I think), but after talking to a pediatrician they said that in his case it was due to a behavioral issue - intentionally holding for so long that he became desensitized to it.  This child was apparently choosing to hold it all day, either because his mom made him feel like it was too gross or because he was ticked off or because he didn't want to stop playing video games or watching TV (he is a serious couch potato, he doesn't even want to get out of his pj's all day - as in he whines whenever we even mention jeans or a shirt).  Pretty sure it was occasionally all of the above.  Anyway, this boy would brag about it - I'd walk in the room, smell something & ask DF if he farted... he'd say yup, then kiddo would pipe up (all proud of himself & smug-sounding) "And I pooped - but nope I don't want to change my underwear".  He would go all day with poopy underwear & actually get mad at DF if he tried to clean him up.  Tried pull-ups, made it worse - he figured there was no reason to use the toilet & told us so.  We started using a star chart, that seemed to help - he wanted the points towards legos.  Now he's 10 & it's pretty much resolved - but he will still hold it sometimes for a few days at a time, so that he pretty consistently clogs the toilet - but not sure if that is from holding it so long or from the 1/2 roll of tp he likes to use...

 

Anyway, guess I still made this pretty long - sorry about that!  In case you skimmed (I probably would have), it could be behavioral, emotional, or even just plain laziness - I only know our situation with DSS.  But like I mentioned at the end, having consistent goals to meet & a reward system worked well for us.


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#16 of 16 Old 08-25-2011, 10:05 PM
 
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maybe it happened in the middle of the night and she didn't want to disturb you guys for some reason. no doubt she was embarrassed. 

what's most important? 

* why the accident happened in the first place.

* the hygiene aspect of washing hands thoroughly whenever they touch poop.

* telling you that it happened.

if it were me, i would focus on what's MOST important. does she have the condition where a child has chronic constipation and the bowels become stretched out so much that liquid poop slips out around large hard stools? this is a medical condition that needs treatment.

you can communicate and reinforce the handwashing requirements. you can remind her over and over. but do it matter-of-factly. she is NOT the first child to fail to wash her hands after wiping, i guarantee you.

re: telling you what happened, i guarantee you that she has shame. you guys have shamed her by yelling and storming out about it, and even by the lectures. she's 7, so she already knows it's wrong to poop in her bed. your laying it on hard with the guilt is making it more likely that she will continue to hide it from you. if you had an accident in the middle of the night, would you want to wake up parents who would then get upset and want to know why this happened? (the kid doesn't know why... she has no answer.)

i like the idea upthread about setting it up for her to take care of her own cleanups overnight. since she obviously doesn't want to bother you guys. tell her exactly how to do the cleanups, maybe even write it down for her step by step, including of course washing her hands. i would think this would be a win-win for everyone -- she gets to feel grown up and responsible for doing things right, and you get things done your way without having to get upset. as a bonus you don't lose sleep either.

it's really important that she does tell you if this continues to happen, as it would be part of a larger problem that does need medical attention. 

as a by-the-way, i recall last fall when my daughter, who was 4, came down with the Norovirus suddenly one night, she puked all over her bed, her pillow pet, everything. she came to me covered in vomit, and i had the disgusting task of cleaning up this tremendous mess starting with stripping off her PJs and putting her straight in the shower to wash the puke off her body, then taking layer after layer of bedding downstairs to the washing machine, and making up the new bed for her. exhausting. SHE, TOO, WAS ASHAMED. with no need to be. heck, anyone can get sick like that. (and in fact i did, about 3 hours later. personally i think the Norovirus jumped into me from dealing with the vomit clothes and sheets). 

so, to summarize, i'd say: get to the bottom of why this is happening, but go easy on the kid. she's already ashamed (obviously). let her know that she need not be ashamed, and give her the tools to handle the situation better next time.


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