Do courts favor the mom? - Mothering Forums

Forum Jump: 
 
Thread Tools
#1 of 28 Old 09-15-2008, 11:39 AM - Thread Starter
 
LittleBlessings's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Canada
Posts: 1,145
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
It seems to me that when a mom violates a court order it is not taken seriously. When is it going to be enough and aren’t judges getting tired of these manipulative moms that are trying to brake up the father /child relationships.
Does a court value father and child bonding?

I am wandering if anyone else is going through this or has and what they have done when a mother withholds visits, is very demanding, and tries to control every aspect of the visit.
LittleBlessings is offline  
#2 of 28 Old 09-15-2008, 12:56 PM
 
strangeduck's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Posts: 65
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
I'm not sure that it's true. You sound pretty bitter, which I get, as I'm pretty bitter with my ex who treats his daughter shabbily to make his wife happier. According to him, I'm one of those manipulative moms you're talking about. Yet, I've never withheld visitation or communication, though communication has been withheld from me.

I think your bitterness is coloring the perceptions of all moms. I don't think you can make these blanket statements. I'm tired of hearing about this epidemic of mothers alienating their children from fathers. I think the situation is far more complex than placing blame on one parent or another.
strangeduck is offline  
#3 of 28 Old 09-15-2008, 02:14 PM
 
Kinguk's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Canada
Posts: 279
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
They don't favour either parent, but they do whatever they can to keep the child with it's mother. Agree or disagree, it is devastating for a child to be taken from it's mother -- studies show...you can blame nature.
I know some pretty aweful situations where you can't help but wonder, "why the heck are they with the mom?"
That's how it is in Canada; I don't know about other countries...
Kinguk is offline  
#4 of 28 Old 09-15-2008, 02:17 PM
 
ProtoLawyer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Posts: 2,004
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Some courts favor the mom. In some states (and I'd assume, some provinces), the laws are written specifically to favor the mother (i.e. there's a presumption Mom gets custody unless she's unfit).

In other states, there is a "primary caregiver" presumption, which in most cases is the Mom by default.

Beyond that, every judge has his or her individual biases, and those biases influence decisions in one way or another. Some judges favor Mom, some Dad, some try to be so "neutral" as to impose 50/50 where it is not warranted (or in a way it doesn't make sense).

Also, as far as enforcing court orders goes...it really depends. Judges don't want to be bothered with the little stuff..."mom signed the kids up for ballet during 'my time'" will not be looked at by most judges (unless it's part of a much bigger pattern). "Dad moved the kids to California without telling or asking me" will. When it's in between, again, responses vary.

ProtoLawyer (the now-actual lawyer, this isn't legal advice,  please don't take legal advice from some anonymous yahoo on the Internet)
Spouse (the political geek) * Stepdaughter (the artist) * and introducing...the Baby (um, he's a baby? He likes shiny things).
ProtoLawyer is offline  
#5 of 28 Old 09-15-2008, 03:36 PM - Thread Starter
 
LittleBlessings's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Canada
Posts: 1,145
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
maybe I am pretty bitter and if that is the case that is somthing I have to work on. At the moment I am just very frustrated with the situation.
LittleBlessings is offline  
#6 of 28 Old 09-15-2008, 04:17 PM
 
yoyo65's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: twin cities,MN
Posts: 410
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
from my personal experience, yes

(i have 5 stepkids, two step grandchildren and another on the way)

DH DS 1996 DS 2000 We are the Mods! We are the Mods! We are, we are, we are the Mods!
yoyo65 is offline  
#7 of 28 Old 09-15-2008, 04:34 PM
 
Oriole's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: by the ocean, lakes and mountains
Posts: 4,388
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
This is a heated question, that I tend to answer with a "yes, courts seem to favor moms". At the same time, we have to be careful saying "moms are manipulative", since I'm sure there are dads that are manipulative just as well, kwim?

If the law is written with "primary caregiver keeps the custody", then tough luck on being a dad. Women fight for equality in the workplace, but dads are fighting these days for the equality of parenthood. You will see your child eight days a month (if that) with four overnights, unless you and your ex can work out something peacefully.

Hence, that's why they have "fathers' rights" organizations. DP wanted shared physical custody of his daughter, he is by no means unstable, or unqualified parent. She didn't move in with us until she was old enough and brave enough to make a case for it with her mom and stepdad. No one cared for her wishes or the parenting style at the time of divorce, and that's a shame... Because in most cases dad will lose a house, will end up with CS, and will need permission to see his own child. I do see it changing slowly, though. As men become more and more involved parents, too many dads are not willing to silently give up their right of raising a child. As this becomes more of a norm, I see the laws changing.

Just my point of view.

New endeavor coming soon...
Raising Alice in Wonderland (DSD, 17), and in love with a Superman
Oriole is offline  
#8 of 28 Old 09-15-2008, 06:22 PM
 
aricha's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Vermont
Posts: 1,166
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
As the number of two-income families and stay-at-home fathers increases, so, too, might the perception of mom as the primary caregiver.

Our lawyer points out to us that even when/if courts treat mothers and fathers equally, as long as society believes courts favor mothers then men will be less likely to believe they have rights to fight for in court. If men believe judges will always favor mom, they will be less likely to fight what they see as the inevitable outcome.

Parenting four little monkeys (11, 8, 6, and 4) with the love of my life. Making it up as I go.
aricha is offline  
#9 of 28 Old 09-18-2008, 09:36 AM
 
Teenytoona's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Posts: 3,904
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by ProtoLawyer View Post
Some courts favor the mom. In some states (and I'd assume, some provinces), the laws are written specifically to favor the mother (i.e. there's a presumption Mom gets custody unless she's unfit).

In other states, there is a "primary caregiver" presumption, which in most cases is the Mom by default.

Beyond that, every judge has his or her individual biases, and those biases influence decisions in one way or another. Some judges favor Mom, some Dad, some try to be so "neutral" as to impose 50/50 where it is not warranted (or in a way it doesn't make sense).

Also, as far as enforcing court orders goes...it really depends. Judges don't want to be bothered with the little stuff..."mom signed the kids up for ballet during 'my time'" will not be looked at by most judges (unless it's part of a much bigger pattern). "Dad moved the kids to California without telling or asking me" will. When it's in between, again, responses vary.
The bolded part, not exactly true. School called CPS on the youngest two DSC's mom. She bailed, moved state, the day before they were to interview DSS at school and her at home, no official ok. Court's been overlooking it for a long time, and still don't seem to care that she has an alcohol problem (she was even tested RIGHT AFTER a court hearing and registered that she'd been drinking and this court seemed to not care. It's just "hearsay" that my DSC get nervous and scared when we come anywhere near the alcohol section in the grocery store.

signature currently in transition
Teenytoona is offline  
#10 of 28 Old 09-18-2008, 03:52 PM
 
ProtoLawyer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Posts: 2,004
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Teenytoona View Post
The bolded part, not exactly true. School called CPS on the youngest two DSC's mom. She bailed, moved state, the day before they were to interview DSS at school and her at home, no official ok. Court's been overlooking it for a long time, and still don't seem to care that she has an alcohol problem (she was even tested RIGHT AFTER a court hearing and registered that she'd been drinking and this court seemed to not care. It's just "hearsay" that my DSC get nervous and scared when we come anywhere near the alcohol section in the grocery store.
Yikes.

Around here, moving 150 miles from the other parent, or out of state at all, without their permission or a court order is a BIG no-no. I'm sorry you've had a different experience.

ProtoLawyer (the now-actual lawyer, this isn't legal advice,  please don't take legal advice from some anonymous yahoo on the Internet)
Spouse (the political geek) * Stepdaughter (the artist) * and introducing...the Baby (um, he's a baby? He likes shiny things).
ProtoLawyer is offline  
#11 of 28 Old 09-18-2008, 05:56 PM
 
manitobamama's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Manitoba
Posts: 640
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
IME and in our case YES YES YES
Dad gets less than 100 hours a month and has to 'ask' permission on bm's terms for more time. Currently he's being punished by bm so there is NO extra time granted!
We are in Canada and truly the courts do not recognize dad as having any more rights than everyother weekend.
manitobamama is offline  
#12 of 28 Old 09-18-2008, 10:19 PM
 
cycle's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Posts: 2,195
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
I have tried to stay away from this thread but I need to comment. Until you are the mother in the situation you have no idea how the courts are. Making general statements like "controlling and demanding moms", and implying that all moms are trying to keep their children from their fathers is insulting and simply not true in most cases. When fathers fight for custody and they have been the primary caregiver (rare) the court will give them custody. Moms are typically the primary care giver so they are given custody more often still. I can tell you that there are many districts that favor the father at any cost to the child.

Making sweeping statements about all moms being manipulative or controlling would be like me saying all fathers are deadbeats, don't pay child support, and don't bother to see their kid. Thats my reality, does that mean that applies to all dads?
cycle is offline  
#13 of 28 Old 09-18-2008, 11:18 PM
 
manitobamama's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Manitoba
Posts: 640
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
I actually have been on both sides of the fence and the courts did favor me. I never treated my children's father like my dh has been treated! I don't believe in sweeping statements either BUT the courts here in Canada do favor mom!
We have spent over $50,000 fighting bm and still she has COMPLETE control. She wants him to sign papers that she has rights to make all decisions and have all control. Dh has continually fought to make sure the school knows who he is, but as for the dr, dentist etc she will not give any info. The kids can come for a visit and say they were sick or for an appt but not once does she let dh know.
My kids are free to see their dad anytime they want to, they are now seeing on their own what kind of man their dad is!
In the end I do think the kids will see the truth or at least see that the other parent isn't evil!
manitobamama is offline  
#14 of 28 Old 09-19-2008, 09:39 AM
 
cycle's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Posts: 2,195
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by manitobamama View Post
I actually have been on both sides of the fence and the courts did favor me. I never treated my children's father like my dh has been treated! I don't believe in sweeping statements either BUT the courts here in Canada do favor mom!
We have spent over $50,000 fighting bm and still she has COMPLETE control. She wants him to sign papers that she has rights to make all decisions and have all control. Dh has continually fought to make sure the school knows who he is, but as for the dr, dentist etc she will not give any info. The kids can come for a visit and say they were sick or for an appt but not once does she let dh know.
My kids are free to see their dad anytime they want to, they are now seeing on their own what kind of man their dad is!
In the end I do think the kids will see the truth or at least see that the other parent isn't evil!
For every situation like your dh's there are many many more where unfit and uninvolved fathers want to have "rights" to their kids but don't want to be involved until they feel like it, if that ever happens, are bitter at having to pay cs and constantly use the kids to threaten and manipulate their mothers. These guys go months and years without seeing their kids, rarely or never contacting them, don't pay child support, etc. Then suddenly they get a new girlfriend and want to play house with their kid that they have pushed aside for years and their is nothing as mothers that we can do to protect our kids from this kind of pain and mistreatment. There is no timetable for how long a father can go without seeing their kids, its their "right" not their "responsibility" or "obligation". They are not required by the court to care for their kids, see them and many times even support them. Its mom who has to pick of the pieces of the broken hearted kids who daddy has forgotten about until its convienient. I think that the courts are wise to this behaviour, that it is far more common in fathers, and that is why mothers are still favored in some districts. It makes sense, judges are human, the reality is (regardless of whether people like to hear it or not), mothers are the primary caregivers most times and are the parent who is much more likely to stick around. Fathers fall off the face of the earth way more than moms do. How can the courts ignore this? Its a fact. Maybe instead of putting energy into resenting the step kids mom and blaming her for everything, people should figure out why it is so easy for so many dads to fall out of their kids lives. Trust me, most times its not moms fault, thats just a convienient and popular excuse.
cycle is offline  
#15 of 28 Old 09-19-2008, 11:30 AM
 
Oriole's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: by the ocean, lakes and mountains
Posts: 4,388
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by cycle View Post
Its mom who has to pick of the pieces of the broken hearted kids who daddy has forgotten about until its convienient. I think that the courts are wise to this behaviour, that it is far more common in fathers, and that is why mothers are still favored in some districts.
I think it's far more common in fathers because they are much less likely to get custody. It's an incredibly hard work to maintain a relationship with a child who doesn't live with you. The driving, the phone calls to the house where they are not wanted, the asking for permission to see your own kid, etc. etc. etc.

DSD's mom was a regular mom when dsd lived with her, and did all things that an average parent / mother does. Stayed home while dsd was little, took her to doctor's when needed, left most school conferences to us, but still showed interest, etc. Since DSD moved in with us, she has seen her 10 times or so (and I'm being generous here) in 7 months, and she hasn't called in 3 weeks now and counting.

I'm not suggesting that all mothers would do this, but what I am suggesting, is that it takes more work on the part of a non-custodial parent to stay involved with school, and doctors, and spending time with a child than it does on the part of a custodial parent. If dads are "seen for what they are" and are not allowed to have primary custody (as it was in our case, and the case of 2 of dp's brothers), it becomes a self-fulfulling prophecy of "dead-beat" dads, kwim?

As I mentioned before, though, I forsee changes creeping in slowly but surely. Many dads want to stay involved, and it will pay off.

New endeavor coming soon...
Raising Alice in Wonderland (DSD, 17), and in love with a Superman
Oriole is offline  
#16 of 28 Old 09-19-2008, 12:21 PM
 
Teenytoona's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Posts: 3,904
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by ProtoLawyer View Post
Yikes.

Around here, moving 150 miles from the other parent, or out of state at all, without their permission or a court order is a BIG no-no. I'm sorry you've had a different experience.
Thanks. I just wish this were the case, we were sure it would have been, but it's been ridiculous. This situation's been going on for a looong time. Still not over. Probably will never be. I mean being drunk during court and they still won't confirm her drinking problem?

IME, courts have favored the mom, but that's not always the case. The mom is not always the best person for the kids, although they many times are, so I understand from where it comes. It's just really frustrating for the situations where the dad is the far better custodial parent, because the judges don't look at the individual cases as much as you'd think they would. They all have their biases.

signature currently in transition
Teenytoona is offline  
#17 of 28 Old 09-19-2008, 12:42 PM
 
Phoenix~Mama's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Lehigh Valley, PA
Posts: 5,306
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by cycle View Post
Maybe instead of putting energy into resenting the step kids mom and blaming her for everything, people should figure out why it is so easy for so many dads to fall out of their kids lives. Trust me, most times its not moms fault, thats just a convienient and popular excuse.

If you look around and read many of the posts within this forum, they are very contradictory to the "blaming Mom is just an excuse."

I agree full heartedly with Oriole... it is much more work for the NCP to stay involved, and when you are trying to work with a CP who really doesn't care, it makes it even harder...

You can only take bending over backwards and being a doormat and doing your best to be a prescence in someone's life when the door keeps being shut in your face over and over again.

I would say DH was the primary caretaker of DSD before the divorce. He worked nights and watched her all day for a couple of years. But his lawyer told him flat out he had no chance at primary custody because he worked nights, and because he left the house, which courts see as child abandonment... where the judge wanted him to stay in the house when he came home to find another man in his bed is beyond me! :

But anyway... He has always been an involved Father, but beyond our control DSD's Mom has found ways to keep cutting our time short. We don't have money to just take her to court to enforce the custody agreement... nor from what I have read here will it likely do any good, just a waste of money.

So who should we really blame? Not Mom? I certainly don't see anyone else to blame...

ribbonpurple.gif  Proud Single Mama, Birth & Postpartum Doula

Student, Aspiring CNM 
treehugger.gif  DD ~ 1/7/09   shamrocksmile.gif  DS ~ 9/22/10

Phoenix~Mama is offline  
#18 of 28 Old 09-19-2008, 12:52 PM
 
AngelBee's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: New Brighton, MN
Posts: 20,388
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by cycle View Post
I have tried to stay away from this thread but I need to comment. Until you are the mother in the situation you have no idea how the courts are. Making general statements like "controlling and demanding moms", and implying that all moms are trying to keep their children from their fathers is insulting and simply not true in most cases. When fathers fight for custody and they have been the primary caregiver (rare) the court will give them custody. Moms are typically the primary care giver so they are given custody more often still. I can tell you that there are many districts that favor the father at any cost to the child.

Making sweeping statements about all moms being manipulative or controlling would be like me saying all fathers are deadbeats, don't pay child support, and don't bother to see their kid. Thats my reality, does that mean that applies to all dads?

Mama to 9 so far:Mother of Joey (20), Dominick (13), Abigail (11), Angelo (8), Mylee (6), Delainey (3), Colton (2) and Baby 8 and Baby 9 coming sometime in July 2013.   If evolution were true, mothers would have three arms!

AngelBee is offline  
#19 of 28 Old 09-19-2008, 03:23 PM
 
cycle's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Posts: 2,195
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by JSMa View Post
If you look around and read many of the posts within this forum, they are very contradictory to the "blaming Mom is just an excuse."

I agree full heartedly with Oriole... it is much more work for the NCP to stay involved, and when you are trying to work with a CP who really doesn't care, it makes it even harder...

You can only take bending over backwards and being a doormat and doing your best to be a prescence in someone's life when the door keeps being shut in your face over and over again.

I would say DH was the primary caretaker of DSD before the divorce. He worked nights and watched her all day for a couple of years. But his lawyer told him flat out he had no chance at primary custody because he worked nights, and because he left the house, which courts see as child abandonment... where the judge wanted him to stay in the house when he came home to find another man in his bed is beyond me! :

But anyway... He has always been an involved Father, but beyond our control DSD's Mom has found ways to keep cutting our time short. We don't have money to just take her to court to enforce the custody agreement... nor from what I have read here will it likely do any good, just a waste of money.

So who should we really blame? Not Mom? I certainly don't see anyone else to blame...
My dad blamed my mom for all his years of not being involved, my ds's sperm donor blames me for not seeing "his son" for almost three years (my son isn't yet 4). In both cases it is an excuse, its bulls**t.

My brother and his wife divorced, he was the primary caregiver of his two daugthers. He got joint (50/50 now) custody and joint legal. He fought for it, its tiring for him still, to have to deal with all the crap and all of the roadblocks that his ex puts up. She just recently switched my nieces school without telling him, they live about a mile apart. Is is frustrating for him, yep, is it a hassle to have to go to court and file a complaint, yep, but he does it, every.single.time she violates the order. Thats why he has equal custody now. He doesn't use an attorney to file the complaints, he doesn't need one, he can do it on his own.

For those fathers who are dealing with an uncooperative and difficult mother, like my brother is, I know its tiring and frustrating. But you know what, so is raising a kid on your own, so is having to explain to your kid why he doesn't know his dad. I don't care how tiring and frustrating it is for dad, ITS YOUR KID. You bend over backwards as long as you have to, you get treated like a doormat as long as you have to, ITS YOUR KID. How many moms do you see throwing in the towel because they are tired of dealing with the drama that comes with dealing with their kids father? Its few and far between. Its not impossible, I get so tired of hearing how unfair the court system is to fathers. It may take time and work, but ITS YOUR KID, you do what it takes to see them and stop blaming the mom, she does not have all the control, it may just take a little extra diligence on his part, as it my brother's case. If he had the attitude that it wasn't worth it to file complaints against his ex for violations he would rarely see his kids. It was and is worth to him but it doesn't come without a little work and diligence. Kind of like raising a child.
cycle is offline  
#20 of 28 Old 09-19-2008, 03:39 PM
 
MsChatsAlot's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Posts: 5,102
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
I don't even think we can make blanket statements about Canada either. I'm in Alberta, and the trend I see here is more euqitable time. Many parents I know are doing the one week on one week off schedule and that seems to be the trend around here. Generally, the cases I've seen go to court here are trying to be more equal if possible.

The unfortunate thing about courts is that they cannot make a parent be a parent. They do not have the time, energy or resources to ensure there each parent is doing as they are supposed to do, playing by the rules, etc. That's the myth of court, because I know many people think if they have the court ordered agreement, everything will move along like that because it's written. Written is one thing, proof is another, enforceable is often another thing too.

Divorce is hard for everyone. Discussions like this are difficult because everyone has their own emotionally charged story. That's why generalizations are so difficult too, because for every story we can tell one way, we can tell it the other way too.

I don't have any easy solutions or answers to the questions you've asked. Divorce can be difficult for everyone at different times and in different ways. I hope you can find a way to rise above what's happening and find a solution that is best for the child(ren) first of all and everyone else too.

I wish you peace & love.
MsChatsAlot is offline  
#21 of 28 Old 09-19-2008, 04:11 PM
 
Teenytoona's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Posts: 3,904
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
In my as unbiased opinion as I can possibly get, courts don't favor mom or dad. They favor themselves. Courts are too busy CYAing than anything else.

Who should courts favor? The children.

signature currently in transition
Teenytoona is offline  
#22 of 28 Old 09-19-2008, 04:29 PM
 
cycle's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Posts: 2,195
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Teenytoona View Post
In my as unbiased opinion as I can possibly get, courts don't favor mom or dad. They favor themselves. Courts are too busy CYAing than anything else.

Who should courts favor? The children.
cycle is offline  
#23 of 28 Old 09-19-2008, 05:03 PM
 
daniellebluetoo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: so-cal
Posts: 332
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2 Post(s)
I can't speak for Canada,
BUT being a single mother who went thru custody hell with a sociopath, I CAN say that it I agree with protolawyer, YES it depends on the area, the state and more importantly the JUDGE!!!!!!

I'ts also been my experience that judges have ego's bigger than the great outdoors!!! DON"T piss them off, don't come off as petty, mean, unyielding, or anything else of that sort, EVEN if your feeling it, ALWAYS take the high road. AND I MEAN ALWAYS!!!!

a little background here.... I have a 6 yr old. i've litterally been in litigation with custody from the time he was 1yr til he was almost 5. and i do mean HELL!, the underhanded crap that went on, the lies, the physical abuse of myself and my DS, the$ spent OH the $$$, that I will NEVER see again.

Anyhoo, he finally gave, left me with DS, and didn't bother to look back. I don't hear from him, I don't get CS, nothing. Just walked away.

WHY?.. because I fought the good fight. He did not. He wanted my son ONLY to hurt me, not because he wanted to father him. In the end, it was truely My willfulness that got me what I wanted, this mama bear did what ever she had to to protect her cub.

When I was younger, ( I turned 30 last month) me and my brother were also the subject of a nasty custody dispute between our parents. My mother wound up with us full time, my dad got visits sporadically.
My mother is now a family/criminal lawyer. I guess she liked winning arguements;-) She's actually pretty damn good too!

But truth be know I don't have a good relationship with my mom, but I do my dad. Could have something to do with the fact that my mom also a willful woman, didn't want to give up custody, but didn't really like children either


What have I learned from past 30yrs? (relating to custody and court battles)

Trust yourself.
Think beyond YOUR feelings/needs.
Fight the GOOD fight.
Don't be a jerk, your kids WILL remember this, and even if you have to fake being nice to your X, and then go home and smoke a bowl because doing so raised your blood pressure 100pts, it's worth it!!!!!!;-) You DO catch more flies with honey than you do with vinegar. Depending on how long you've been going at it with your X, it might take a while before he/she comes to THE honey!!!!! Give it time. I PROMISE you it IS worth it.

ALSO, if your X gets a new BF/GF, USE THIS to YOUR advantage!!!!!.....AFTER you've had a while to practise being nice :-) he/she will be singing a different tune. They will prolly WANT to give you more custody/visitations, because lets face it, having "relations" isn't easy when you've got kids around!!!

Like I said, be nice and slather on that honey! THIS mamma KNOWS!

"Be who you are and say what you feel, because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind." ~Dr. Seuss
daniellebluetoo is offline  
#24 of 28 Old 09-19-2008, 05:35 PM
 
Teenytoona's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Posts: 3,904
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by daniellebluetoo View Post
I can't speak for Canada,
BUT being a single mother who went thru custody hell with a sociopath, I CAN say that it I agree with protolawyer, YES it depends on the area, the state and more importantly the JUDGE!!!!!!

I'ts also been my experience that judges have ego's bigger than the great outdoors!!! DON"T piss them off, don't come off as petty, mean, unyielding, or anything else of that sort, EVEN if your feeling it, ALWAYS take the high road. AND I MEAN ALWAYS!!!!

a little background here.... I have a 6 yr old. i've litterally been in litigation with custody from the time he was 1yr til he was almost 5. and i do mean HELL!, the underhanded crap that went on, the lies, the physical abuse of myself and my DS, the$ spent OH the $$$, that I will NEVER see again.

Anyhoo, he finally gave, left me with DS, and didn't bother to look back. I don't hear from him, I don't get CS, nothing. Just walked away.

WHY?.. because I fought the good fight. He did not. He wanted my son ONLY to hurt me, not because he wanted to father him. In the end, it was truely My willfulness that got me what I wanted, this mama bear did what ever she had to to protect her cub.

When I was younger, ( I turned 30 last month) me and my brother were also the subject of a nasty custody dispute between our parents. My mother wound up with us full time, my dad got visits sporadically.
My mother is now a family/criminal lawyer. I guess she liked winning arguements;-) She's actually pretty damn good too!

But truth be know I don't have a good relationship with my mom, but I do my dad. Could have something to do with the fact that my mom also a willful woman, didn't want to give up custody, but didn't really like children either


What have I learned from past 30yrs? (relating to custody and court battles)

Trust yourself.
Think beyond YOUR feelings/needs.
Fight the GOOD fight.
Don't be a jerk, your kids WILL remember this, and even if you have to fake being nice to your X, and then go home and smoke a bowl because doing so raised your blood pressure 100pts, it's worth it!!!!!!;-) You DO catch more flies with honey than you do with vinegar. Depending on how long you've been going at it with your X, it might take a while before he/she comes to THE honey!!!!! Give it time. I PROMISE you it IS worth it.

ALSO, if your X gets a new BF/GF, USE THIS to YOUR advantage!!!!!.....AFTER you've had a while to practise being nice :-) he/she will be singing a different tune. They will prolly WANT to give you more custody/visitations, because lets face it, having "relations" isn't easy when you've got kids around!!!

Like I said, be nice and slather on that honey! THIS mamma KNOWS!

Sounds like you've been through the wringer! Glad to see your LO is with the parent who's the most interested in him (rather than a parent with some ulterior motive).

Fighting for years is hard. Mr Toona has been in the fight for 16 of the 17 years of DSD-17's life, and nearly all of my DSD-6's life. It's a painful, hard and costly struggle (costly meaning more than money - it's costly in terms of the upbringing of the children).

But, as the "new" woman in his life (not really, we've been together six years, but I am the not-the-momma), just wanted to let you know that not all stepmoms (or stepdads) want less time with their DSC. My DSC really actually set my life path in a different direction. I was not going to ever have kids pre-Mr Toona, but my DSC melted my heart instantly. When my DSS, who was 2 at the time, handed me his first present: a booger. I knew my heart was with these kids as much as with their poppa.

signature currently in transition
Teenytoona is offline  
#25 of 28 Old 09-19-2008, 06:41 PM
 
BabyBearsMummy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Canada
Posts: 838
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by MsChatsAlot View Post
That's the myth of court, because I know many people think if they have the court ordered agreement, everything will move along like that because it's written. Written is one thing, proof is another, enforceable is often another thing too.
This has certainly been what I have found. I have been advised that ex would likely only get a slap on the wrist for violating our court order if anything.

Quote:
Originally Posted by MsChatsAlot View Post
I don't have any easy solutions or answers to the questions you've asked. Divorce can be difficult for everyone at different times and in different ways. I hope you can find a way to rise above what's happening and find a solution that is best for the child(ren) first of all and everyone else too.

I wish you peace & love.
:



ex has claimed he wants to be more involved in DDs life. Fine with me I let him know I am open to his being more involved. I always make sure he is aware of DDs medical appointments but he has not "been able" to make it to a single one since before he left officially in March 2007 or even asks about the appointments afterwards. I used to tell him about all of her activities and welcomed him to attend but stopped because he said he did not want to be a part of our family and no longer wanted to be involved. From March 2007 until about about March 2008 I made nightly bedtime phone calls to him so he could say good night to DD. Only stopping because more calls were going unanswered then answered and it was upseting for DD to want to speak to him only to have to explain that he wasnt "home". Not to mention the fact that more phone calls I got nothing but grief and complaints from ex and went I tried to place a boundary that those bedtime calls were not to be about discussing parenting and only for DD he failed to agree to follow through. Recently Ex has made promises to DD that he will call and never does. Which is very upsetting to DD who loves to talk on the phone.
The only one getting hurt by all his games is DD. I am far beyond allowing it to hurt me and insteed have commited myself to giving DD the best life possible all on my own and not excepting ex's input at all.


LOL if non-custodials think it is hard to maintain a relationship with their children. I can certainly see how it has its challenges but they should put themselves in the custodials postion. They are the ones in "trenches" doing all the little things that two parents normally are responsible for often while being called controlling and manipulative by bitter exs who often have difficulty seing the line between old grudges and parenting in the childs best interests.

By the way I love all you step mummas and step pappa who get you are not subsitute parents and you cannot replace your step childrens parents and insteed are hands on bonus family members who love and support your partners, their children and the ex is struggle to maintain a strong family bond for the sake of the children
BabyBearsMummy is offline  
#26 of 28 Old 09-19-2008, 06:55 PM
 
BabyBearsMummy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Canada
Posts: 838
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Teenytoona View Post
Who should courts favor? The children.
: Damn straight they should to bad everyone looses sight of this. And of course what this means is different in every case.
BabyBearsMummy is offline  
#27 of 28 Old 09-19-2008, 07:18 PM
 
BabyBearsMummy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Canada
Posts: 838
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Teenytoona View Post
I was not going to ever have kids pre-Mr Toona, but my DSC melted my heart instantly. When my DSS, who was 2 at the time, handed me his first present: a booger. I knew my heart was with these kids as much as with their poppa.
Teeny this is beautiful :
BabyBearsMummy is offline  
#28 of 28 Old 09-19-2008, 09:34 PM
 
daniellebluetoo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: so-cal
Posts: 332
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2 Post(s)
toona, a booger?....AWE!..... thats too funny. I too have recieved THOSE gifts!!!!,,,lol

Yes, I've been thru the wringer, I'm sorry to heat that your mr. has been too. Too many people that divorce or separate can't see thru their own anger and such to SEE the impact that they have on their children. Your mr.s son WILL know who fought the good fight, he will, I promise.

I second what bear said about the stepparents that STEP UP!
NOthing is MORE important to a child than to know that the step parent loves them too and HAS thier back! I was more or less refering to those (like my X's gf, that HATES my son) Or are not chld friendly in general.

Don't worry mamas, I used her hatred. I used it and used it and used it until she she hated EVERYONE and pressured my X to choose between her and his first born child.

HOW did I do this? Kill em with kindness!::

blessings and DOUBLE blessings for all of you who love anothers child just because it IS the right thing to do!!!!!

"Be who you are and say what you feel, because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind." ~Dr. Seuss
daniellebluetoo is offline  
Reply

Quick Reply
Message:
Drag and Drop File Upload
Drag files here to attach!
Upload Progress: 0
Options

Register Now

In order to be able to post messages on the Mothering Forums forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.
User Name:
If you do not want to register, fill this field only and the name will be used as user name for your post.
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.
Password:
Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.
Email Address:

Log-in

Human Verification

In order to verify that you are a human and not a spam bot, please enter the answer into the following box below based on the instructions contained in the graphic.



User Tag List

Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page


Forum Jump: 

Posting Rules  
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are Off