What is everyone doing re:vax? - Mothering Forums

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Old 04-06-2006, 05:05 PM - Thread Starter
 
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I'm just curious what everyone else is doing...

We are at an in-between stage right now. We haven't done quite enough research to feel comfortable saying that we aren't vaxing at all, although that is the direction we are leaning, but we have done enough research to decide that we are doing some MAJOR delaying for sure.

All in all, I don't feel comfortable with the idea of vaxes in general, that is my gut feeling, not counting research at all.

It's just SUCH a hard decision, and what is strange to me is that most people don't even think about it (I know I didn't when DD was a baby!) I feel like if I just did what 'society' says I should then if something bad happens, it's not my fault, kwim? Only it would be my fault because I realise now that there is more to it than just getting them when the doc says to.

Anyway, I've babbled lol What is everyone else doing?

Dawn, mama to D (3.06) & N (9.07) C (11.09) & Still-in-shock surprise due in Aug!
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Old 04-06-2006, 09:26 PM
 
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I don't know what to do either. I bet this thread gets moved.

As I mentioned the hospital pediatrician was NOT happy that we refused Hep B. They also were annoyed because they wanted to give the baby a rubella vaccine in the hospital at birth because my titer was equivocal which I also refused.

Since then - my health insurance company (NOT my ped or the hospital) had a nurse call me personally to ask when he was getting his Hep B (I lied). And I also got this packet of information in the mail from the health insurance company with fridge magnets, pamphlets, and other things going over the dire consequences of not vaxing, and how he is a grave danger to other people, and the horrid effects of chicken pox and the like. And I got a lecture from the pediatrician. I'm feeling harrassed.
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Old 04-06-2006, 11:10 PM
 
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I don't know what to do either.

I was vaxed against mumps and still got them; and a couple of little boys from church have chicken pox even though they were vaxed. So, even if you get the shots, it isn't a guarentee. So, basically, you are putting your child at risk just getting the shot.

Then again as a teacher I know of children who weren't vaxed and ended up getting sick....so I am torn...

Ellie did get the hep b in the hospital....dh let them do it while I was drugged up. He and I really haven't discussed whether to vax or not... His boys were and there is just no reason not to in his mind...
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Old 04-06-2006, 11:50 PM
 
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Originally Posted by ellie_may12
Then again as a teacher I know of children who weren't vaxed and ended up getting sick....so I am torn...
What VPD's did these children contract? Did they die or were they permanently injured?
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Old 04-06-2006, 11:59 PM
 
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Originally Posted by ahwuko
They also were annoyed because they wanted to give the baby a rubella vaccine in the hospital at birth because my titer was equivocal which I also refused.

And I got a lecture from the pediatrician. I'm feeling harrassed.
They wouldn't have been able to vaccinate a newborn with rubella - do you mean they tried to give you the shot? Many many hospitals make it a point to "harass" mothers in the hospital with the rubella shot if there are insufficient antibodies.

The CDC recently recommended that all women receive the varicella and Tdap before they leave the hospital as well.

If anyone plans to vaccinate their children, it's very important to know your state immunization requirements for school entry and of course exemption information. Your pediatrician will vaccinate according to the CDC schedule. For instance, some states only require three (3) doses of DTaP for school entry, but peds will administer the recommended five doses. The same will polio. Most states require two doses of measles, but only one dose of rubella and mumps.

Know your laws . . . especially if you don't want to dose more than you have to. If anyone needs help locating their state immunization requirements please (please, please) post over at the vax forum.
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Old 04-07-2006, 01:32 AM
 
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We did delayed, selected vaxes with our 2 yr old and I'll do the same with the new baby. We started the DTaP series at 8 months and continued every other month, did Polio starting at 9 months and every other month, skipped Prevnar and chicken pox entirely, and did measles at 15 months, rubella at 22 months, and will do mumps at 3 years. I think I'm forgetting something, but anything else we did about 6 months late, making sure to do each new vax by itself first to check for reactions. My son hasn't ever even had a fever. If he'd reacted to any, I would have delayed the rest longer or skipped them entirely.

Mama to Peter (3/8/04), Leo (3/12/06), Timothy (7/24/10), and boy #4 due on the summer solstice 2014
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Old 04-07-2006, 04:13 AM
 
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emmy won't be vaxed at all. i am a nurse and have been in the medical field since i was 19, worked in pediatrics for a long time. when i had abby, i didn't even think twice about it. she got hep b and her 2 month shots, but at 4 months, i just couldn't take her. i freaked out, started reading about vaccines and decided not to vaccinate anymore.

so far, the new ped we have said it isn't a problem, that i will just have to sign a waiver. he didn't even ask me why i wasn't vaxing, though i did tell him i was a nurse, so maybe he figured i had done my research? who knows.
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Old 04-07-2006, 05:27 AM
 
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We don't vax either.

Mum to DS (8yrs), DD (6yrs), and DS(3.5yrs). kid.gif

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Old 04-07-2006, 05:37 AM
 
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We won't be vaxing Estella until a minimum of 6 months for anything, we may decide not to vax at all. We're hemming and hawing. With Erik we didn't really know much on the subject... and he was vaxed more or less on the recommended schedule for here in Switzerland. I would have delayed until he was at least gestational age corrected, if I had any brain at all... but, it was suggested so we did it. We did delay the MMR until last month (2.5).

It's a saving grace they don't do Hep. B (until MUCH later) or CP here. Two less battles we have to fight.
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Old 04-07-2006, 07:39 AM - Thread Starter
 
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I don't know what to do either. I bet this thread gets moved.
I don't understand why it would, we've talked about bf & cd & babywearing here and none of those were moved.

Dawn, mama to D (3.06) & N (9.07) C (11.09) & Still-in-shock surprise due in Aug!
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Old 04-07-2006, 11:13 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LongIsland
If anyone plans to vaccinate their children, it's very important to know your state immunization requirements for school entry and of course exemption information. Your pediatrician will vaccinate according to the CDC schedule. For instance, some states only require three (3) doses of DTaP for school entry, but peds will administer the recommended five doses. The same will polio. Most states require two doses of measles, but only one dose of rubella and mumps.
Thanks for posting! I didn't know this. I questioned one of our peds about separating the MMR and she said that they no longer make the seperate vaccine. Anyone know if this is accurate? Merck, she said, doesn't manufacture it any longer.

There was an aricle recently about a mumps outbreak in Iowa. If I read it correctly, something like 75% of those who got it had gotten at least one, if not two, doses of the vaccine and still got it.
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Old 04-07-2006, 11:47 AM
 
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I'd like to know what happened in Iowa too. I don't want to vax baby Brie. Every time I think about Drs sticking her and injecting her without my permission I feel physically ill. I didn't feel this way with ds I just was over protective thinking he'd be kidnapped from daycare - and he was for almost 2 wks in 2001. I don't want to sound crazy, but my instincts are telling me to not let the docs touch dd. My husband has agreed to skip cp and prevnar entirely - but I'm working on him about more. FWIW I brought my son to have his kindergarden booster (mmr) and they said according to TN he had to have Varcerilla. (I'm from LA where it's not required) I refused and told them that people vaxed against chicken pox were more likely to contract shingles later and no thanks I'd take my chances with chicken pox. They gave him his shots and I thought no more of it until I changed schools and had to get a copy of his shot records from the peds. Those a--s gave him the vax it's on his shot record right there with the MMR. Be careful and watch what the nurses are doing.
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Old 04-07-2006, 02:31 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ahwuko
Thanks for posting! I didn't know this. I questioned one of our peds about separating the MMR and she said that they no longer make the seperate vaccine. Anyone know if this is accurate? Merck, she said, doesn't manufacture it any longer.
Merck does indeed still manufacture M, M and R monovalently.

As a pediatrician (and a ped with a pharma rep), he knows exactly what vaccines Merck manufacturers. He's lying to you about the separate shots (and he's not the first) b/c he doesn't want to be bothered with the increasing number of parents who have requested the vaccines monovalently since the MMR/autism controversary exploded for a number of reasons:

Not only does stocking the separated vaccines give the impression the MMR is not "safe," but they take up more space and if they don't get used up, they cost the ped money.
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Old 04-07-2006, 02:38 PM
 
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Originally Posted by ahwuko
If I read it correctly, something like 75% of those who got it had gotten at least one, if not two, doses of the vaccine and still got it.
From the Iowa DOH:

Of the 245 patients this year, at least 66 percent had had the recommended two-shot vaccination, while 14 percent had received one dose, the Public Health Department said.
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Old 04-07-2006, 02:48 PM
 
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Originally Posted by willow659
Be careful and watch what the nurses are doing.
'

ALWAYS check the vial(s) beforehand, even if you think the nurse will look at you funny.
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Old 04-07-2006, 04:12 PM
 
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No vaxing here either. We *might* do DTaP & Polio later...much later.

Does anyone know which vaccines have more thimeresol when given alone? Our ped recommends giving DTaP rather than just tetanus because it has less thimeresol.

Homeschoolin' Mama chicken3.gifto Dd1 2/3/00, Dd2 1/13/03, Ds1 3/11/06 & Ds2 11/18/10!!
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Old 04-07-2006, 04:43 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ahwuko
Thanks for posting! I didn't know this. I questioned one of our peds about separating the MMR and she said that they no longer make the seperate vaccine. Anyone know if this is accurate? Merck, she said, doesn't manufacture it any longer.
Last year, our ped said that we'd be able to get measles and rubella, but they couldn't get mumps by itself. I know others nearby have gotten all three, so we'll just look for a different clinic to get mumps next year. My clinic has had to order measles and rubella specially for us, but they're willing to do it. I know people in other parts of the country whose peds said it was too expensive to just order the separate ones for a single patient and wouldn't do it. So, they exist, but you might have to hunt around to find someone who'll order them for you.

Mama to Peter (3/8/04), Leo (3/12/06), Timothy (7/24/10), and boy #4 due on the summer solstice 2014
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Old 04-07-2006, 04:56 PM
 
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Originally Posted by Metasequoia
Does anyone know which vaccines have more thimeresol when given alone? Our ped recommends giving DTaP rather than just tetanus because it has less thimeresol.

You wouldn't be able to get the tetanus only vaccine b/c it's indicated for children 7+ years of age. Regardless, that vaccine contains 25 micrograms of thimerosal, unless your ped orders a single dose formulation which was just recently approved.

There is a DT vaccine for children up to age 7. This vaccine contains 25 micrograms of thimerosal, unless you specifically request your ped order a single dose formulation - the single dose contains trace amounts. Many peds don't carry DT and if they did, it would likely be the multi-dose formulation containing full strength thimerosal.
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Old 04-07-2006, 04:59 PM
 
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Originally Posted by willow659
I'd like to know what happened in Iowa too.
Update on Iowa: http://www.mothering.com/discussions...d.php?t=434591

Keep in mind when reading about this outbreak that two doses of mumps is not "fully vaxed." One dose of mumps is "fully vaxed."

We all say "MMR booster," but technically the second dose is not a booster. From the CDC:

Why is a second dose of MMR necessary?
About 2%-5% of persons do not develop measles immunity after the first dose of vaccine. This occurs for a variety of reasons. The second dose is to provide another chance to develop measles immunity for persons who did not respond to the first dose. The second dose is not a "booster"; it is intended to produce immunity in the small number of persons who fail to respond to the first dose.
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Old 04-07-2006, 05:40 PM
 
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I believe in selected, delayed vaccinating. With Ian and James, we had to delay their vaccinations because of their seizures and ill health during their first year, but we had planned on delaying them anyway. I do believe, though, that some vaccines are important...when the potential damage done by the potential virus/disease is greater than the potential damage done by the vaccine, them I'm okay with giving them to my kids. That's just my position, though.

Before the boys were born, I read the book _What your Doctor May Not Tell You About Children's Vaccinations_ by Dr. Stephanie Cave. She suggests selective, "as few as possible" vaccinating, and at older ages than the CDC's suggested vac. schedule. This was the schedule she suggests for full vaccination (though she discusses each disease/vaccine in detail so parents can decide which ones they do and don't want their child to have):

-------------------------------------------------
ALL VACCINES SHOULD BE MERCURY/THIMEROSAL FREE

Four Months:
Hib -first series
IPV -first series

Five Months:
DTaP -first series

Six Months:
Hib -second series
IPV -second series

Seven Months:
DTaP -second series

Eight Months:
Hib -third series

Nine Months:
DTaP -third series

Fifteen Months:
Begin MMR, but separate the vaccine into three parts--
Measles vaccine first

Seventeen Months:
Hib -fourth series
IPV -third series

Eighteen Months:
DTaP -fourth series

Two years:
Pneumococcal (Prevnar)

Two and a half years:
Rubella vaccine

Three and a half years:
Mumps vaccine

School or Daycare age:
Varicella (varivax)

Boosters:
DT-four to five years of age (no Pertussis vaccine)
IPV- four to five years of age
MMR - four to five years of age

----------------------------------------------------

In the end, we had to delay even more than the schedule above, so our Doctor was GREAT about knowing the effectiveness of vaccines and which ones didn't need repeating.... for example, with some vaccines, the boys got it so late that they didn't need two or three doses, they just needed the one. So far, at age 4, we haven't given them Prevnar, Varicella, or Hep B vac. at all. We're waiting 'til school age for the Varicella (we'd rather they not develop Chicken Pox, due to their epilepsy) and Hep B.

Also, and I say this gently , I think we need to be careful about not villianizing doctors and nurses as if they all have the same motivations or intentions. Our ped, for example, who is not known as being any sort of liberal doc, is very sure not to use thimerosal vaccines when an alternative is available (and these days, most vaccines do have an alternative). Our boys have never had a thimerosal vaccine. He was also very willing to use a delayed vac. schedule.

With this babe, we intend to follow more closely the schedule above. We're starting the adoption process for a fourth child, and part of the homestudy is a look at the medical records. Since adopting countries are very keen on making sure their kids are going to parents who agree to vaccinate, we want to make sure to have a good record. Also, since we'll be adopting from Asia, we plan on having all our kids vaccinated for Hep B before the adopted baby arrives. Hep B is MUCH more common in Asia, and often you don't know if your adopted baby has been exposed or not.

Other info from the Dr. Cave book:

Actions parents can take:

1. Be informed, learn all the benefits/risks of the vaccine you are considering. Get information from your Dr, but also from books and internet sites devoted to vaccine safety, reactions, parent watch groups, etc. Know your state's laws about school entrance requirements and exemptions.

2. Ask for thimerosal-free vaccines

3. Illness weakens the immune system, so do not vaccinate when a child has even a mild illness. Wait til they have recovered.

4. Do not allow your child to receive vaccines for six or more organisms in a day (ex: DTaP is one shot, but three organisms)

5. Request the MMR vaccine as individual vaccines (Measles separate from Mumps, separate from Rubella)

6. Monitor your child for adverse reactions and REPORT them if they do occur.

7. Do not allow your child to receive a vaccine with ingredients they might be allergic to (some have yeast, eggs, and neomycin)

8. Consider delaying Hep B until your children are older than 4 years, unless they are in daycare.

9. Consider delaying the varicella vac. until your children are 4 or 5 if they don't have immunity to it on their own by then.

10. If possible, check the MMR vaccine titers (antibody levels) before your child is due for the MMR booster at 4 to 5 years of age. If the levels are high enough, you can go without the booster. Retest levels at 12 years.

Hope that helps!!

RedOak ~ Momma to DS (8) , DS (4) , DD (3) , & DD 9/10 ~
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Old 04-07-2006, 08:50 PM
 
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No vaxes here.

~Marie : Mom to DS(11), DS(10), DD(8), DD(4), DD(2), & Happily Married to DH 12 yrs.!
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Old 04-08-2006, 02:46 PM
 
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Thanks RedOakMomma. That gives me a place to start.
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Old 04-08-2006, 03:08 PM
 
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No vaccines here. My oldest had a really bad reaction after his first dose so we havent done anything ever since and are very glad we havent.

Phoenix
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Old 04-09-2006, 02:10 PM
 
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No shots here yet and not sure when we'll let her get any. This little one had Severe Birth Asphyxia resulting in HIE so we are not going to do anything that could even possibly cause her more problems.

treehugger.gif Alisaynovax.gif,intactlact.gifUsed to be a fly-by-nursing1.gifcd.giffamilybed2.gif, SAHM to three slinggirl.gif, all by ribboncesarean.gif, then they grew up. mecry.gif

Now I am a WOHM, college student, single mama. praying.gif to be belly.gifbfinfant.gifcd.giffamilybed1.gif, buddamomimg1.png, to a littlebabyf.gifagain someday. stillheart.gif 

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Old 04-10-2006, 09:35 PM
 
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We don't vaccinate at all. There are autoimmune diseases in my family on top of a whole slew of other health issues and I'm not comfortable with exposing my children to *more* harmful chemicals. I'm going with my gut instinct as well as my research.
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Old 04-10-2006, 09:38 PM
 
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We're vax-free and going to stay that way!
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Old 04-10-2006, 09:39 PM
 
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Oops! Didn't realize I wasn't in my DDC!!! Sorry
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Old 04-11-2006, 01:17 AM
 
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I am really scared to vax, I am still struggling with deciding what to do.
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Old 04-11-2006, 06:38 PM
 
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Originally Posted by aminah
I am really scared to vax, I am still struggling with deciding what to do.
Best thing you can do, mama is to research, research, research. If you haven't already, check out the vaccine forum here on MDC. Read all you can to become totally informed. This way you will be confident no matter which decision you make about vaccinating.
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Old 04-11-2006, 11:11 PM
 
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I wish I were feeling confident! I have a degree in microbiology, and the more I read, the less sure I am. At least our peds are open to delayed/no vax.
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