Help! I Just Found Out That My Friend Locks Her Toddlers In Their Rooms At Night And For Naps!!!!!! - Page 7 - Mothering Forums

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#181 of 236 Old 11-26-2008, 11:27 PM
 
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Exactly.

I have to wonder what CPS would think about people buying an adult-sized fetish-crib to make their preschooler sleep in, though.
Yea.

:scary.

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#182 of 236 Old 11-26-2008, 11:31 PM
 
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You know, I promise, I am not in a bad mood(though cat clawing me to death while i t y pe doesnt help), but it really gets my goat how people throw the word abuse around like a piece of yesterdays bread.

Parents have hard enough jobs without worrying about being judged "abusive" at every twist and turn by the public eye. Having a bad day, going shopping with your 4 kids and scream at them, maybe this is the third time you have ever screamed in 8 years but someone sees you and deems you the A word(not ass) before you can say martha stewart...

It makes me so frustrated. I know the REAL abuse that exists, and there isnt even a fine line.

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#183 of 236 Old 11-26-2008, 11:36 PM
 
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Originally Posted by 1littlebit View Post
it seems to me that everyone on this thread who locks their child in their room does so in order to be a good parent and meet the needs of your child.

the difference is appears to be pretty obvious.
True - we got a bit off-topic... And while I jumped in to defend locking doors in certain situations, actually I totally disagree with the OP's friends tactics. Didn't mean to imply that I thought it was okay. Just saw so many comments saying that basically anything but cosleeping is baby torture, and that made me defensive.

About it being illegal - is that actually true? I poked around a bit on the internet and have found conflicting information. There seem to have been some cases against parents, but those were instances in which they were literally padlocking teenagers in their room as punishment, not sleep-training a toddler or containing a sleepwalker.
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#184 of 236 Old 11-26-2008, 11:41 PM
 
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There seem to have been some cases against parents, but those were instances in which they were literally padlocking teenagers in their room as punishment, not sleep-training a toddler or containing a sleepwalker.
padlocking their teenagers into their rooms? some people are nuts. completely nuts.
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#185 of 236 Old 11-26-2008, 11:45 PM
 
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padlocking their teenagers into their rooms? some people are nuts. completely nuts.
Some of those "Wayward Youth Christian Rehab" programs from the 80's and 90's used to have that as part of the protocol.
Scary stuff.
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#186 of 236 Old 11-26-2008, 11:48 PM
 
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Some of those "Wayward Youth Christian Rehab" programs from the 80's and 90's used to have that as part of the protocol.
Scary stuff.
yeah they are.. it wasnt just the christian ones either! we covered them in my juvenile justice class... in the 'oops bad idea' chapter. there is a good book out now.. its fiction but its reality based.. about being in one of those.. scary crazy stuff.. a lot of the kids came out wayyy more screwed up then when they started.
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#187 of 236 Old 11-26-2008, 11:53 PM - Thread Starter
 
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That is hilarious "I've never seen anything like this, where did you get it?"

"Oh, just babyapparels.com, the best site for Adult Baby Furniture on the web!"


Can I please ask you to think carefully before you to think carefully before you mock things you don't understand? I think that is fair. i understand why you do it because it is strange. But allow me to explain, please...

I really want to be sincere in saying this, and I'm not putting you down in any way, but I'd really like to help you understand. Adult babies are not the only people who purchase these cribs. I learned about the site being involved in the special needs community. Institutions and schools also purchase cribs from here. I never heard about these cribs or even knew that they existed until I was set away to my special needs residential school and was exposed to all types of special needs up close and personal.

I went to a residential school where all types of special needs children went, and this was my portle to understanding the world of the mentally challenged and how to deal with them. I'd only heard about them before but never been up close and personal. Being at that school taught me so much. It taught me how sheltered I really was. If it weren't for being there, I'd never have had the compassion or insight that I do, nor would I have known anything about this stuff. My eyes would not have been opened, and I woudl not have known any creative ways of doing things. I have the knowledge that I do because of those experiences. I'm thankful for them and would not trade them for the world. But when I was sent away, I saw it up close and personal every day. It was frightening at first, and like you, I made a mockery of things I did not understand, which is why I'm not at all upset with you because I did it, too. Looking back, I feel bad, but I then came to my senses once I understood.

In my late teens, I began caring for the mentally challenged for community service hours. The school allowed me. Then, I helped out friends with mentally challenged relatives, and I cared for them out of the goodness of my heart. I still do it from time to time. I help with them so their families ca get a break and won't get worn out and end up putting them in an institution, which is the worse thing to do. (i've seen so many things happen in those places that I have nightmares. I learned about it through my exposure to the mentally challenged. I also had to report bad staff members for doing horrible things to those students. My school was considered to be an institution. It was under that category. I can't speak of some of the things I saw staff do, but if I' not mistaken, I did talk about some things on my blog.) I love what I do so much that I started a blog about caring for loved one and keeping them home. It is found at www.keepthemhome.blogspot.com It is interesting if you'd like to read it. Should you decide to read it, I hope you find it interesting. Take care of yourself.

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#188 of 236 Old 11-26-2008, 11:57 PM
 
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Originally Posted by 1littlebit View Post
yeah they are.. it wasnt just the christian ones either! we covered them in my juvenile justice class... in the 'oops bad idea' chapter. there is a good book out now.. its fiction but its reality based.. about being in one of those.. scary crazy stuff.. a lot of the kids came out wayyy more screwed up then when they started.
Yeah, I knew some kids who got sent to one around here after being caught smoking cigarettes and other fairly "not totally out of control" stuff like that, and they're all either addicted to meth or dead from heroin now.

Those places were marketed so well as the be-all-end-all answer, too. Like, if you love your kid, you'll send them here and trust us.
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#189 of 236 Old 11-27-2008, 12:01 AM
 
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Deer Hunter- i'm confused about that. maybe its different everywhere but i have worked in an institution .. more then one actually. we did not have adult cribs. we would never have had adult cribs. putting adults in cribs would have been a degrading and humiliating experience for most if not all of our patients and that was the exact opposite of what we wanted to achieve. and yes we had people who were severely severely disabled.
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#190 of 236 Old 11-27-2008, 12:08 AM
 
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Can I please ask you to think carefully before you to think carefully before you mock things you don't understand? I think that is fair. i understand why you do it because it is strange. But allow me to explain, please...

I really want to be sincere in saying this, and I'm not putting you down in any way, but I'd really like to help you understand. Adult babies are not the only people who purchase these cribs. I learned about the site being involved in the special needs community. Institutions and schools also purchase cribs from here. I never heard about these cribs or even knew that they existed until I was set away to my special needs residential school and was exposed to all types of special needs up close and personal.

I went to a residential school where all types of special needs children went, and this was my portle to understanding the world of the mentally challenged and how to deal with them. I'd only heard about them before but never been up close and personal. Being at that school taught me so much. It taught me how sheltered I really was. If it weren't for being there, I'd never have had the compassion or insight that I do, nor would I have known anything about this stuff. My eyes would not have been opened, and I woudl not have known any creative ways of doing things. I have the knowledge that I do because of those experiences. I'm thankful for them and would not trade them for the world. But when I was sent away, I saw it up close and personal every day. It was frightening at first, and like you, I made a mockery of things I did not understand, which is why I'm not at all upset with you because I did it, too. Looking back, I feel bad, but I then came to my senses once I understood.

In my late teens, I began caring for the mentally challenged for community service hours. The school allowed me. Then, I helped out friends with mentally challenged relatives, and I cared for them out of the goodness of my heart. I still do it from time to time. I help with them so their families ca get a break and won't get worn out and end up putting them in an institution, which is the worse thing to do. (i've seen so many things happen in those places that I have nightmares. I learned about it through my exposure to the mentally challenged. I also had to report bad staff members for doing horrible things to those students. My school was considered to be an institution. It was under that category. I can't speak of some of the things I saw staff do, but if I' not mistaken, I did talk about some things on my blog.) I love what I do so much that I started a blog about caring for loved one and keeping them home. It is found at www.keepthemhome.blogspot.com It is interesting if you'd like to read it. Should you decide to read it, I hope you find it interesting. Take care of yourself.
Thanks for point this out. I've worked in home health care- and I've seen adults in cribs. Sometimes it is the most comfortable thing for them, and I don't really understand why that is funny.

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#191 of 236 Old 11-27-2008, 12:15 AM
 
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Thanks for point this out. I've worked in home health care- and I've seen adults in cribs. Sometimes it is the most comfortable thing for them, and I don't really understand why that is funny
It's not.
What's funny is the idea of putting a normal preschooler in an adult crib made for adult baby fetishists in order to not be "abusive" by CPS standards by locking the door.
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#192 of 236 Old 11-27-2008, 02:33 AM
 
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I read all 10 pages. whew.

IMHO, the issue in the OP is not the locked door. the issue is the CIO. A locked door, just like a crib, playpen, stroller, or carseat is a child containment device that can be a lifesaving, protective tool or an instrument of neglect and bad parenting. It is all down to how it is used.

Also, "locked door" conjures up images of padlocks and chains, but no one posting on this thread has used the term in that way. When we moved my oldest to his own room, he didn't have the manual dexterity to open his bedroom door. He slept on a mattress on the floor and we kept the door closed while he slept. To me this "counts" as a locked door, equally to a door gate, latch, or child door handle cover - or a crib, playpen, etc etc - i.e. the child is unable to leave a specific safe space without direct adult supervision.

In the scenario that I think most posters are telling, adults (and older children) can open the door/enter the room as needed to attend to the child's needs. The only person prevented from opening the door is the child in question - presumably because the child must be supervised by an adult whenever leaving the room.

Again, I think the issue is not the locked door, but entirely the use of the locked door. The OP's friend is using the bedrooms as essentially toddler-sized cribs to CIO. And that is deeply problematic, of course.

My 2 cents.

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#193 of 236 Old 11-27-2008, 02:48 AM
 
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Originally Posted by siobhang View Post
I read all 10 pages. whew.

IMHO, the issue in the OP is not the locked door. the issue is the CIO. A locked door, just like a crib, playpen, stroller, or carseat is a child containment device that can be a lifesaving, protective tool or an instrument of neglect and bad parenting. It is all down to how it is used.

Also, "locked door" conjures up images of padlocks and chains, but no one posting on this thread has used the term in that way. When we moved my oldest to his own room, he didn't have the manual dexterity to open his bedroom door. He slept on a mattress on the floor and we kept the door closed while he slept. To me this "counts" as a locked door, equally to a door gate, latch, or child door handle cover - or a crib, playpen, etc etc - i.e. the child is unable to leave a specific safe space without direct adult supervision.

In the scenario that I think most posters are telling, adults (and older children) can open the door/enter the room as needed to attend to the child's needs. The only person prevented from opening the door is the child in question - presumably because the child must be supervised by an adult whenever leaving the room.

Again, I think the issue is not the locked door, but entirely the use of the locked door. The OP's friend is using the bedrooms as essentially toddler-sized cribs to CIO. And that is deeply problematic, of course.

My 2 cents.
Yep.
Just like, you can use a crib and not do CIO (and that might even be "the best thing" for some babies/toddlers) a locked (unopenable to the kid) door might be the best option for some.

Ignoring the baby or child's needs is the thing that's wrong in any situation. I'll not go so far as to call CIO "abuse", but I do think it's definitely "wrong" as a general rule according to my own (and our collective) moral/parenting standards.
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#194 of 236 Old 11-27-2008, 06:44 AM
 
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I just noticed this:

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Originally Posted by Deer Hunter
What if they got sick? She said that they would be okay and that she'd come ot them if they cried in the night. But to me, i is not okay. NOt in the least bit!
So it's not like the OP's friend is being unusually terrible.
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#195 of 236 Old 11-27-2008, 01:44 PM
 
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Yep.
Ignoring the baby or child's needs is the thing that's wrong in any situation. I'll not go so far as to call CIO "abuse", but I do think it's definitely "wrong" as a general rule according to my own (and our collective) moral/parenting standards.
I totally agree. While I don't CIO and wish that no one else would either, I don't understand the urging to call CPS in these instances. To report something that is (1) legal, (2) well within the range of normal parenting in this country, and (3) quite possibly recommended by the child's doctor seems like a poor use of the system. (the advice in the link is similar to what my ped gives out, and is very typical of ped advice here locally - I just ignore it of course!).

I think in these instances when a friend is doing something you find objectionable but is not actually illegal, or unusual, or against standard medical advice, you have to decide: is this so bad imo that I can no longer be friends with this person? If so, that's your perogative. I can think of a number of parenting issues that would cause me to end a friendship. CIO isn't one of them for me, but if it is for you, that's certainly your perogative.

Otherwise, if you decide to remain friends, I see the best option as leading by example. Threatening to call CPS (or actually calling), or other aggressive behavior will not get your point across. I would not remain friends with someone who say, threatened to call CPS because I am continuing to breastfeed my 18-month-old, and the threat would do nothing to change my mind about the benefits of full-term breastfeeding. I'm sure people will say "but that's not the same" - yet, I'm absolutely SURE that many of my friends not only have chosen to wean earlier or not BF at all b/c they didn't feel it was right for them - but also feel that I'm harming my child psychologically by BF at this age. We can continue our friendship because we keep our opinions about what the other is doing wrong to ourselves. They all know that I don't CIO, and that my child is a great, great sleeper - better than most of theirs, actually. Hopefully this has planted the seed in their minds that there is another alternative, and maybe they'll make a different decision with future kids. Certainly if they ever decide to explore other options they know I'm here to help.
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#197 of 236 Old 11-29-2008, 12:39 AM
 
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I like the gate idea and keeping all the doors open. I'd do this so long as my children were okay with sleeping without me. That is an idea.
Maybe suggest this to your friend.

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#198 of 236 Old 11-29-2008, 01:59 AM - Thread Starter
 
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Deer Hunter- i'm confused about that. maybe its different everywhere but i have worked in an institution .. more then one actually. we did not have adult cribs. we would never have had adult cribs. putting adults in cribs would have been a degrading and humiliating experience for most if not all of our patients and that was the exact opposite of what we wanted to achieve. and yes we had people who were severely severely disabled.



Yes, it is definitely different everywhere. There are places where I've personally seen them tie their patients up, which is a practice I deffinitely abhor and think is inhumane. So, to answer your qestions, I've seen so many different things done, and some really broke my heart.

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#199 of 236 Old 11-29-2008, 02:07 AM
 
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Yes, it is definitely different everywhere. There are places where I've personally seen them tie their patients up, which is a practice I deffinitely abhor and think is inhumane. So, to answer your qestions, I've seen so many different things done, and some really broke my heart.
it's also illegal and no reputable facility would tie their patients up. if it were necessary for their protection they have restraint systems
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#200 of 236 Old 11-29-2008, 03:26 AM - Thread Starter
 
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it's also illegal and no reputable facility would tie their patients up. if it were necessary for their protection they have restraint systems


Yes, and it would trouble me greatly when people suggested doing it as a solution to keep them from wondering. I'd ask them, "How would you like that done to you? It isn't comfortable, nor is it nice. That person has feelings just as you do, and you have no reason to treat them like that." This is the reason I addressed humane ways in keeping a mentally challenged loved one safe. Cribs are actually popular from my experiences, and I'm not the only one who has seen the method done that way. What techniques did they use where you worked?

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#201 of 236 Old 11-29-2008, 03:30 AM - Thread Starter
 
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Yeah, I knew some kids who got sent to one around here after being caught smoking cigarettes and other fairly "not totally out of control" stuff like that, and they're all either addicted to meth or dead from heroin now.

Those places were marketed so well as the be-all-end-all answer, too. Like, if you love your kid, you'll send them here and trust us.


Wow! How horrific! I did not even know these places existed. I also did not even know that teens were padlocked in their rooms! OMG OMG OMG! WTH! People really ARE nuts! I think a check up from the neck is an order.

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#202 of 236 Old 11-29-2008, 03:35 AM
 
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You know, I promise, I am not in a bad mood(though cat clawing me to death while i t y pe doesnt help), but it really gets my goat how people throw the word abuse around like a piece of yesterdays bread.

Parents have hard enough jobs without worrying about being judged "abusive" at every twist and turn by the public eye. Having a bad day, going shopping with your 4 kids and scream at them, maybe this is the third time you have ever screamed in 8 years but someone sees you and deems you the A word(not ass) before you can say martha stewart...

It makes me so frustrated. I know the REAL abuse that exists, and there isnt even a fine line.

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#203 of 236 Old 11-29-2008, 05:55 AM
 
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Whew - I am late to this thread - but I read most of it...

Well, I had an immediate bad reaction to the OP because my DH was locked in his room by his mom until a very late age, like 7 or 8 years old, and would scream to get out to pee, but Mom would ignore him. He ended up having to pee in the heating vent because she wouldn't let him out. Yeah, he's not a big fan of his Mom.

My earliest memory is having a nightmare and crying and crying but no one ever came to comfort me. That stuff stays with you I guess.

After reading this though, I can totally understand that there's a big difference between that (CIO, basically) and the act of locking your kid in a room for safety reasons. My LO is still in a cosleeper, though she'll soon move to a crib; for safety reasons. At some point after that, she'll move to her own room. And then when she gets big enough to climb out of the crib, to a bed. If at that point she starts going on middle-of-the-night adventures, I could totally see locking the room she's in, but NEVER ignoring her. Luckily, her future room has both a door to the hallway as well as a door directly into our room, so we could probably just lock the one to the hallway and she could come bug us directly
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#204 of 236 Old 11-29-2008, 02:26 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Whew - I am late to this thread - but I read most of it...

Well, I had an immediate bad reaction to the OP because my DH was locked in his room by his mom until a very late age, like 7 or 8 years old, and would scream to get out to pee, but Mom would ignore him. He ended up having to pee in the heating vent because she wouldn't let him out. Yeah, he's not a big fan of his Mom.

My earliest memory is having a nightmare and crying and crying but no one ever came to comfort me. That stuff stays with you I guess.

After reading this though, I can totally understand that there's a big difference between that (CIO, basically) and the act of locking your kid in a room for safety reasons. My LO is still in a cosleeper, though she'll soon move to a crib; for safety reasons. At some point after that, she'll move to her own room. And then when she gets big enough to climb out of the crib, to a bed. If at that point she starts going on middle-of-the-night adventures, I could totally see locking the room she's in, but NEVER ignoring her. Luckily, her future room has both a door to the hallway as well as a door directly into our room, so we could probably just lock the one to the hallway and she could come bug us directly


Here goes and I'm going to be blunt. Your DH mom is nuts. I mean, who DOES that to their kids? So sad and horrifying. I swear, there should be licenses to have children because some parents should not have them.

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#205 of 236 Old 11-29-2008, 03:22 PM
 
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You know, this post reminds me of something....
I totally remember wishing that I could put those doors up on my son's room that I've seen in church nurseries and things. they are kinda like a barn door...the bottom can stay closed while the top stays open. Wouldn't that be a nice compromise? I never investigated it though, but I bet they're terribly expensive.

Julie, wife and mother. I love my little ones: DS ::Corbin Randall---6/06 and DD :Morgan Reese 12/08.
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#206 of 236 Old 11-29-2008, 03:27 PM
 
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Wow. I don't even know what to say!
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#207 of 236 Old 11-29-2008, 03:51 PM
 
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Oh my heart goes out to those poor children. They are going to have some serious issues when they grow up. Not to mention, my first instinct, was fire or other emergency. These poor children.

Is this woman a good friend of yours? I would consider calling in CP also. This is a tough situation, but my goodness, think of the children!
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#208 of 236 Old 11-29-2008, 03:55 PM
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Sure you handled that right. Who would want someone as a friend who did that? Maybe, you could convince her not to because of the dangers of fire, etc. Also, does she have bedpans? I would imagine that her children would interpret that as neglect; nothing is worse for a child's development than neglect, it's even worse than abuse. I doubt that you can change her because she sounds set in her ways. My question is whether or not you should call CPS.
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#209 of 236 Old 11-29-2008, 04:03 PM
 
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umm deer hunter If some crazy psych ward is tying people down so they don't wander around they need to be reported. seriously. thats wrong on so many levels and there are numerous places to report
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#210 of 236 Old 11-29-2008, 07:54 PM - Thread Starter
 
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I did report the people that were abusive, but I did not know that the tying up was illegal, as they made it seem that it was supposed to be done. i always felt it to be sickening inhumane and knew i'd never do it, hence the reason for blogging about it to bring awareness that it was horrific. They'd tie these people to their beds at night. How horrible! Gosh! Certain people just do not need to work with such volunerable people.

I am married to my soul mate and best friend, and I am truly blessed.

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