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#1 of 80 Old 05-18-2009, 10:52 AM - Thread Starter
 
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Please have the patience to read this... any tips would be very much appreciated.

I have two kids, the last one was born unassisted. I have dual citizenship, and my children have the right to triple citizenship - my two, plus the citizenship of the country they were born in, by birth. I am a single mother by choice.

Sometime back, I initiated the procedure for my son to obtain my other citizenship. The country in question is one that supports homebirths, but midwife assisted homebirths. I had no trouble in getting citizenship for my daughter, when she was born three years ago. However, this time - despite my son already having one citizenship - the embassy in question started doubting that my son was my son, and causing trouble over UC and not vaxxing. (For the other UC-ers here, their question "but that's impossible, who cut the cord if nobody was there" must be ridiculous ). I had a hearing today.

The embassy in question wants me to carry out a DNA analysis to prove my son is my son, which I am in the process of doing. They also want to send the LOCAL social services to go check out my apartment, to see that the conditions are fit for having children living in the house, and more specifically, for birth. The country I am dealing with has very specific rules over what conditions need to be fulfilled for a homebirth, while the local country I am living in doesn't do homebirths at all, but the conditions in their hospitals are absolutely APPALING. My house is definitely cleaner than the local hospital, at all times.

However, I am absolutely very worried. The country I live in mainly has never heard of the word "crunchy", and is very unsupportive of alternative lifestyles. My lawyer is still working on everything, but I don't want to blindly rely on him. My gut tells me NOT to let social services in to my house in any case, at all. At some point they mentioned they would send round a local police patrol unit "to confirm a birth to place in my house". WTH!? OF COURSE, I did clean up after the birth!?!?! They also want to force me to vax, which I will do if the alternative is them trying to take my children.

So, what do I do now? I have already called someone to professionally clean my house in case they get a warrant, I want everything to be absolutely sparkling clean. What else?

I'm Olivia. I blog about physiological childbirth, homebirth, and unassisted homebirth!
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#2 of 80 Old 05-18-2009, 10:56 AM
 
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The only part I am sure of if you are in the USA they cannot force you to vax at all and they cant take your kids if you refuse to do so.

The other parts I have no idea.

 
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#3 of 80 Old 05-18-2009, 10:58 AM
 
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Honey...I have NO idea what to tell you here. This is very tricky....I couldn't read and not post, so I'm here to give s

I share your gut feeling that letting social services inside your house is bad news...I just feel like that opens a can of worms. I super duper agree with your contracting a professional to come in and super clean your house, though, that makes a lot of sense to me...you never know.

I also agree that blindly following your lawyer may not be the greatest...but I think the best piece of advice that ANYONE could give you, is to make sure you are working with a lawyer who is an EXPERT when it comes to this type of law, family law, etc can be very creepy....lots of ins and outs and tricky navigation for someone who doesn't know exactly what they're doing.

Beyond that....man, I have no idea what to tell you. I'm so sorry you have to deal with this situation. Is NOT getting this citizenship for him a possibility? I mean, is it something you NEED to have for him?

GL babe....this sounds like a gigantic PIA...I'm so sorry this is happening to you.

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#4 of 80 Old 05-18-2009, 11:59 AM
 
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What country are you trying to get citizenship with? I'm not sure why my question is relevant, it just popped in my head.

I'm really confused about all the hoops you're being forced to jump through.

If I wasn't planning to live in that country, I'd say forget it. I don't need citizenship to a place that's so freaked out about how I live my private life.

I also UC'd -- trying to get ds2's birth cert was a real pain i nthe butt. We live in Texas, USA and while it was relatively pain-free, comapred to what you're delaing with, it was still an ordeal. The quesiton of who cut the cord was hilarious. EVERYONE asked that!!!

I started asking, "Dh. Who else? What is a doctor or midwife going to do that I can't do?"

I feel your pain!

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#5 of 80 Old 05-18-2009, 12:11 PM
 
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Most countries allow citizenship based on descent. So if you can prove the child is yours, then shouldnt that be sufficient to get citizenship? I know for Australia, you have a lifetime to do this. Other countries have limits, like 7 years. In any case, i'd get the dna test anyway.(the prove the child is yours-groan) Then forget the whole thing for a few years and try again.
Dont let them investigate your house. Just drop the whole thing.
If the child is yours, that is all you should need. I dont understand why you need to prove you are a fit parent, or that you even have to be the custodial parent.

So i say, forget the whole thing, and try again later. (if thats possible)
..in the meantime, get more legal advice...but still, bottom line is bottom line isnt it? Citizenship based on descent??
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#6 of 80 Old 05-18-2009, 01:14 PM
 
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why do they care what your house in another country looks like? that just seems crazy

i cant help, but just wanted to send hugs and wish you luck

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#7 of 80 Old 05-18-2009, 01:36 PM
 
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Are you trying to get citizenship for your son from the country you currently live in? Or citizenship for a different country, via the embassy where you are living now?

I'm pretty well versed in citizenship issues, and I've never heard of a country requiring a home visit to assess home suitability as a measure for citizenship eligibility. That sounds fishy to me. Whether or not your home was suitable for homebirth is a moot point now, given your son is already born. These things happen.

Any country is going to require some sort of proof that he is in fact your son. If the country you live in has no mechanism for obtaining a birth certificate if a child is born outside of a hospital, then a DNA test is a reasonable way for them to determine his status.

Are you always going to live where you are now? In most countries, it is possible to apply for citizenship months or years after a child is born. I probably would hold off on applying, unless for some reason your son's quality of life is affected.

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#8 of 80 Old 05-18-2009, 02:23 PM
 
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Way too many details not quite revealed to offer any advice, if I had any worth offering in the first place. But I am curious to see how this turns out.

Any misspellings or grammatical errors in the above statement are intentional;
they are placed there for the amusement of those who like to point them out.
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#9 of 80 Old 05-18-2009, 03:04 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Answering some questions -

I am sorry for not giving all the details, this is not so much because I want to conceal my identity on a public forum (I say way too much on here any way ), but because I think there might be some kind of problem in publicizing details of an open case. Hope you understand that.

Country A is my father's country. I already obtained the citizenship of this country for my children without much hassle. Country B is my mother's country. This is the country that is causing my trouble at the moment. Country C is the country we live in, and the country my kids were born in.

Yes, country B is threatening to send round social services and/or police of country C. The embassy officer first said she could "send round a local police patrol to check whether a birth had indeed taken place in my house", followed by saying that she would send round social services of country C to check if living conditions were acceptable, when I pointed out that a police patrol would not find anything as I had obviously cleaned up the birth mess from a birth four months ago... well, four months ago .

Re the vax issue, I actually checked country B's laws, and indeed I have no obligation to vax. However, it seemed like the officer do anything to be a total PITA, for reasons I could speculate about but that would be pointless.

I offered babe's birth cert from country A as part of the proof that he is my son. They didn't even want to look at it. Neither did they look at my one U/S, or the photos taken straight after birth. I offered they call country A's embassy to check with them, which they didn't respond to. At the end, they told me to come back when I had completed the DNA analysis. Indeed, they did complain I did not show up a few days after the birth, as is the norm in country B. However, they did accept that I had no obligation to do so, as my child had already acquired citizenship A. I completely accept that sending social services from another country might not even be in their power. My lawyer does think that it is possible they will come, even if I decide to withdraw my application for citizenship B. Country C is pretty nasty, and all I see is them trying to take my kids away... I do want citzenship B for my son, as it will allow him to travel more freely in the future, and to live in EU countries if he wants to.

I'm Olivia. I blog about physiological childbirth, homebirth, and unassisted homebirth!
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#10 of 80 Old 05-18-2009, 03:15 PM
 
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From these details, and from my totally ignorant stance on international laws and regulations, I would assume that if Country B was/is going to send police and/or social services, that withdrawing citizenship application would not stop them, and perhaps make your application later on harder.

I would seek out the laws regarding social services and vaxing in Country C. I would think that no matter what Country B does, the laws of Country C would be the ones that really matter in this issue.

Hope you get this all worked out fast. Perhaps the DNA thing is all that will actually be required.

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#11 of 80 Old 05-18-2009, 03:32 PM - Thread Starter
 
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From these details, and from my totally ignorant stance on international laws and regulations, I would assume that if Country B was/is going to send police and/or social services, that withdrawing citizenship application would not stop them, and perhaps make your application later on harder.

I would seek out the laws regarding social services and vaxing in Country C. I would think that no matter what Country B does, the laws of Country C would be the ones that really matter in this issue.

Hope you get this all worked out fast. Perhaps the DNA thing is all that will actually be required.
I am also semi-ignorant in these matters, as are all the officials confused. Three countries + UC = total confusion! Vaxes are compulsory in country C, but as far as I am able to make out the requirement is that the whole vax schedule is completed by the time the child starts school. I am willing to go with a delayed schedule if need be, but definitely not with the locally produced vaxes. I am afraid you are right re the police/SS thing. I also even think that withdrawal of the application may make them more suspicious. However, I do not know whether country C would have any authority to actually do anything about the situation, or take kids that do not have their citizenship (though they have the right to receive it) into their care. Which is, let's face it, the thing I am ultimately so concerned about.

It also occurred to me to call country A's embassy to inform them of the situation, and to ask for help, as my son is their citizen already.

I'm Olivia. I blog about physiological childbirth, homebirth, and unassisted homebirth!
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#12 of 80 Old 05-18-2009, 03:59 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Geez, is this ever confusing!

Would it be easier for you to plan a trip to Country B and get this taken care of while *in* Country B? It seems like it might just be easier to make the trip and hop over to a clerk's office and it's that living in Country C is what's causing the problem for Country B. I bet if you were in Country B, this would have been resolved already. . .
You know that I hadn't even thought of that? That sounds like the right thing to do!

I'm Olivia. I blog about physiological childbirth, homebirth, and unassisted homebirth!
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#13 of 80 Old 05-18-2009, 04:13 PM
 
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Your DS is 4 months old. Do you need to apply to country B for citizenship within 6 months, 1 year, or just anytime before your DS 18th birthday? Varies from country to country. If you can wait, skip it. You will have the genetic test. And if you come when your DS is 12 yo, whether you gave birth at a hospital, in your home, in your jacuzzi or on the planet neptune is going to look pretty irrelevant at that point. Their passports are not going to be a huge problem right now, since they travel with you. Unless you want to visit say Iran one month and Israel the next, in which case two passports becomes necessary.
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#14 of 80 Old 05-18-2009, 04:27 PM
 
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I have no idea on the citizenship issues... but... did you tell them you intentionally UC? Because people have unintentional UC sometimes and what can the law do about that, really? I mean, do people not have babies in cars on the way to the hosptail in County B? If you haven't already told them it was intentional maybe you could play up that angle...

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#15 of 80 Old 05-18-2009, 04:36 PM
 
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I've never heard of a country requiring a home visit to assess home suitability as a measure for citizenship eligibility. That sounds fishy to me. Whether or not your home was suitable for homebirth is a moot point now, given your son is already born. These things happen.

.

That was my first thought as well. What does the suitability of where you *birth( even relevent at this point. I mean for all things possible you could have been planning on going to a hospital and not made it there.

I personally wouldnt allow social services or police to *visit* my home on any grounds of doing a well check. That only opens you up to concern for the country you are currently living in, I mean as a social worker I think I would be concerned if another country asked me to do a well check on home? why? what do they fear/know? what will I see? I think your first route should be the DNA test and paperwork showing your citzenship to that country. I would think that 1) proving that indeed this child is yours 2) you have citizen ship to that country should suffice.
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#16 of 80 Old 05-18-2009, 04:56 PM - Thread Starter
 
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That was my first thought as well. What does the suitability of where you *birth( even relevent at this point. I mean for all things possible you could have been planning on going to a hospital and not made it there.

I personally wouldnt allow social services or police to *visit* my home on any grounds of doing a well check. That only opens you up to concern for the country you are currently living in, I mean as a social worker I think I would be concerned if another country asked me to do a well check on home? why? what do they fear/know? what will I see? I think your first route should be the DNA test and paperwork showing your citzenship to that country. I would think that 1) proving that indeed this child is yours 2) you have citizen ship to that country should suffice.
I agree, and I think that I will have different issues altogether in the case a social worker does come round, and I let them in. Then, my issue will no longer be just with country B, but with country C as well. I am of the opinion that social workers can always find something objectionable if they want to.

If I make a trip to country B now, that would physically eliminate the possibility of me allowing a social worker into my house in country C, kwim? Since I don't live in country B, I'd have to do it at a certain county in their capital. I have done this myself, prior to having kids. If I am there, there will be lots of people around rather than just the small number of officials in an embassy. I have a feeling that would be much easier somehow.

I did tell them I intentionally UC-ed. I told this to country A as well, and they caused no problems. I hate the fact that this is getting so complicated and I am worried sick. I do feel that UC is not something I should have to hide, though.

At some point I asked them whether I should pop in the embassy to say I am planning to UC if I ever have another baby. Whether it would be proof enough for THEM to see me pregnant. Their answer was, "we don't mind you having a homebirth but you should at least call a midwife to be present". If I could change my mind and lie about UC, I might just have done so. It is too late now though.

I'm Olivia. I blog about physiological childbirth, homebirth, and unassisted homebirth!
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#17 of 80 Old 05-18-2009, 05:02 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Your DS is 4 months old. Do you need to apply to country B for citizenship within 6 months, 1 year, or just anytime before your DS 18th birthday? Varies from country to country. If you can wait, skip it. You will have the genetic test. And if you come when your DS is 12 yo, whether you gave birth at a hospital, in your home, in your jacuzzi or on the planet neptune is going to look pretty irrelevant at that point. Their passports are not going to be a huge problem right now, since they travel with you. Unless you want to visit say Iran one month and Israel the next, in which case two passports becomes necessary.
Application can be done whenever - I acquired this citizenship in my teens. I thought having two passports was cool . But I have applied already now, and I am not sure withdrawing application would get rid of potential problems.

Telling me that the rules and laws are different than they actually are makes me so angry. It does not, in fact, matter at all where I give birth. In registering my child, I do see how they would care that it is my child they are registering . BUT... I am more certain that my son is my son than anyone giving birth in a hospital could ever be .

DNA testing is EXPENSIVE. But if it makes the whole problem go away, of course I have no problem with paying.

I'm Olivia. I blog about physiological childbirth, homebirth, and unassisted homebirth!
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#18 of 80 Old 05-18-2009, 05:21 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Honey...I have NO idea what to tell you here. This is very tricky....I couldn't read and not post, so I'm here to give s

I share your gut feeling that letting social services inside your house is bad news...I just feel like that opens a can of worms. I super duper agree with your contracting a professional to come in and super clean your house, though, that makes a lot of sense to me...you never know.

I also agree that blindly following your lawyer may not be the greatest...but I think the best piece of advice that ANYONE could give you, is to make sure you are working with a lawyer who is an EXPERT when it comes to this type of law, family law, etc can be very creepy....lots of ins and outs and tricky navigation for someone who doesn't know exactly what they're doing.

Beyond that....man, I have no idea what to tell you. I'm so sorry you have to deal with this situation. Is NOT getting this citizenship for him a possibility? I mean, is it something you NEED to have for him?

GL babe....this sounds like a gigantic PIA...I'm so sorry this is happening to you.
Thank you for your hugs and support

I'm Olivia. I blog about physiological childbirth, homebirth, and unassisted homebirth!
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#19 of 80 Old 05-18-2009, 06:39 PM
 
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Okay, I only know one of the countries involved in this but if I were you I'd certainly contact Country A's embassy to explain the situation and ask for help. As you and the kids have all got citizenship A already that seems like the best country as if anything goes wrong it will be them you will be going to for help anyway, right?

I also think going to Country B and doing this there might not be a bad idea either, though I would look into it a bit more before definitely deciding to do it. I know of Country C and think the situation there is quite similar to where I"m living at the moment, and my very strong feeling on that would be to absolutely not let their version of CPS get involved. Just the bureaucracy alone could end up making your life incredibly difficult, and as you said it's very easy for them to 'find a problem' if that's what they want to do.

This must be so stressful for you.

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#20 of 80 Old 05-18-2009, 06:50 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Okay, I only know one of the countries involved in this but if I were you I'd certainly contact Country A's embassy to explain the situation and ask for help. As you and the kids have all got citizenship A already that seems like the best country as if anything goes wrong it will be them you will be going to for help anyway, right?

I also think going to Country B and doing this there might not be a bad idea either, though I would look into it a bit more before definitely deciding to do it. I know of Country C and think the situation there is quite similar to where I"m living at the moment, and my very strong feeling on that would be to absolutely not let their version of CPS get involved. Just the bureaucracy alone could end up making your life incredibly difficult, and as you said it's very easy for them to 'find a problem' if that's what they want to do.

This must be so stressful for you.
Thanks, I also think your country of residence is very similar in its attitudes. If we all had country C's citizenship, they would almost certainly be taking the kids into care just for the sake of it. To show me that I can't life my life how I want to, but how they tell me I should. I did nothing wrong and do not want to do anything drastic, but I am pretty scared. I have hired one of the best lawyers in the country, and I think I will need him. Not only are they anti-UC, they are also anti- anything out of the mainstream, including single mothers. Generally, they are pretty misogynist. Dealing with country B's bureaucracy without the unpleasant add-ons of local CPS seems much more appealing. Unfortunately, I do think they will just come round if the embassy calls them and tells them to do so. I will not let anyone in without a warrant.

I'm Olivia. I blog about physiological childbirth, homebirth, and unassisted homebirth!
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#21 of 80 Old 05-18-2009, 07:26 PM
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I'd move myself and the kids to country A, they sound the most reasonable.
Good luck with the citizenship thing. It's a tangle of rules and regulations isn't it.
My family are all dual nationals, if we added a third it would get too confusing.
I hope they were just trying to be awkward saying they'd send CPS, and they don't do it.
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#22 of 80 Old 05-18-2009, 07:49 PM
 
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I would have the DNA test without complaint - they probably just want to ensure you aren't a baby napper taking a kidnapped baby to another country, and I'd claim the UC was unintentional. Personally.

Good luck!
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#23 of 80 Old 05-20-2009, 06:44 AM
 
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I would have the DNA test without complaint - they probably just want to ensure you aren't a baby napper taking a kidnapped baby to another country, and I'd claim the UC was unintentional. Personally.
yeah. this is where i am leaning too. i would get the DNA test done - it may be expensive but frankly i'd be throwing money at this problem by now - & hope that that stops the whole fuss in its tracks. i would consider taking the DNA results & whatever documentation is necessary direct to country B & applying for your son's citizenship there. i would strongly avoid anything that means getting country C more involved. it sounds like the country B embassy in country C, where you initially applied for son's passpo (have i got this right?!) just is taking a personal interest, kwim, since there cannot be any regulations on where a citizen can give birth outside of country B, nor, surely, can they have someone taken into care - sounds like you've raised the warning flags of someone at country B embassy & that's why they are talking about country C cps etc. give them DNA results & anything else but don't let CPS get involved if you can help it - perhaps produce a reference or something from a respectable friend - a teacher/lawyer, something like that, to verify that your son is yours, you received prenatal care, you are an attentive mother...?
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#24 of 80 Old 05-20-2009, 07:59 AM - Thread Starter
 
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yeah. this is where i am leaning too. i would get the DNA test done - it may be expensive but frankly i'd be throwing money at this problem by now - & hope that that stops the whole fuss in its tracks. i would consider taking the DNA results & whatever documentation is necessary direct to country B & applying for your son's citizenship there. i would strongly avoid anything that means getting country C more involved. it sounds like the country B embassy in country C, where you initially applied for son's passpo (have i got this right?!) just is taking a personal interest, kwim, since there cannot be any regulations on where a citizen can give birth outside of country B, nor, surely, can they have someone taken into care - sounds like you've raised the warning flags of someone at country B embassy & that's why they are talking about country C cps etc. give them DNA results & anything else but don't let CPS get involved if you can help it - perhaps produce a reference or something from a respectable friend - a teacher/lawyer, something like that, to verify that your son is yours, you received prenatal care, you are an attentive mother...?
Yes, you have got everything right. DNA test is on its way - that is, I'm waiting for the money to come into my regular account, from my savings account. Of course, I am more than willing to spend whatever it take IF that were to solve the problem. I asked them straight, whether they would give me a birth cert and put him in my passport without further hassle once I got the DNA tests. I told them I would go to wherever they tell me to get the DNA test. (They advised a certain lab for bloodwork. When I called them, it turned out that this lab does not do DNA analysis at all! I then found out about one other lab through the internet.)

Still, they said that they did not guarantee at all that they would cause no further problems after a DNA analysis, which is the major reason I have not done it already - if that said it would solve all problems, I'd have done it last century, kwim? Joe Biden is visiting the country today so nobody is working, but my lawyer is supposed to go there tomorrow to get more info as to whether or not a DNA test would definitely solve the problem, and whether the lab in question would be acceptable for them, since the one they proposed does not do the test.

In the meantime, I have done extensive reading into the laws of both country B and country C. Unless UC and non vaxing can be considered severe medical neglect, they have no business hassling me. UC, or birth choices in any shape or form (apart from abortion right for a woman) are not detailed in the law of country C. I am pretty certain that, with their attitudes, they would, in fact, argue that UC is severe medical neglect. But with no foundation, except that nobody does it here. One glance at whatever random L&D facility would be enough for any sane person - even one who is normally opposed to UC - to conclude that giving birth in a clean home, with adequate birth supplies, is MUCH more safe.

I am not going to allow local SS to search my house to see if there is anything else they can find that they don't like - which they would, of course. One thing I don't like about the law in country C, is that they always leave space for interpretation by some bureaucrat. the law lists what constitutes neglect, and then adds "and any other form of neglect that the court decides upon, not listed in this law. And how am I supposed to argue with that? So yes, I do not want to deal with country C's sexist, outdated and doctor-worshipping institutions.

But, I can't fully grasp the potential consequences of just heading to country B to solve it either. I have had other unpleasant experiences with their embassy staff at their embassy in another country before, and they are very "follow the rules". Another possibility would be to go to country A. I have just started a small business here though, and starting again would be very problematic.

I'm Olivia. I blog about physiological childbirth, homebirth, and unassisted homebirth!
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#25 of 80 Old 05-20-2009, 11:30 AM
 
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I only hear the bad stories that make the news, so this response might not be at all reasonable. I know of two EU countries that have taken custody of children with seemingly less cause than you have "against" you. Really, do look into the climate of Country B before you go. I cannot imagine... Okay, no fear mongering. Be cautious.
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#26 of 80 Old 05-20-2009, 11:50 AM - Thread Starter
 
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Originally Posted by mama_mojo View Post
I only hear the bad stories that make the news, so this response might not be at all reasonable. I know of two EU countries that have taken custody of children with seemingly less cause than you have "against" you. Really, do look into the climate of Country B before you go. I cannot imagine... Okay, no fear mongering. Be cautious.
Thanks. Can I ask you which countries? And what the allegations were?

Another thought that occurred to me is - if I have trouble while in country C, I would be entitled to seek assistance from country A, as this is the only country the whole family currently has citizenship of. If I do go to country B, I will definitely no longer be able to do that. Right?

I'm in way over my head here. If I could do it all again, I would still UC, but claim it was an oops. I have not been to country B for quite a while now. I am out of touch. I have gotten used to country C's "everything is possible" climate. I just forgot that "everything is possible" only applies to male, corrupt politicians, and not to UC-ing solo moms :.

I'm Olivia. I blog about physiological childbirth, homebirth, and unassisted homebirth!
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#27 of 80 Old 05-20-2009, 11:56 AM - Thread Starter
 
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And... let's say that I was able to find a doctor/midwife who would turn up and give a witness statement that they saw me and the baby like... the morning following birth or something like that. This would not technically be true. Would something like that solve the problem or just create more of them? (Eh... ... disclaimer: I am not thinking of doing this AT ALL, just trying to have a completely theoretical discussion here, of course, I would never do something like that, etc)

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#28 of 80 Old 05-20-2009, 01:26 PM
 
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Another thought that occurred to me is - if I have trouble while in country C, I would be entitled to seek assistance from country A, as this is the only country the whole family currently has citizenship of. If I do go to country B, I will definitely no longer be able to do that. Right?
not quite clear what you mean about this. if you were claiming asylum from trouble in country c, then yes, you have to seek asylum in the first country you come to. so, eg, if you are fleeing persecution in sierra leone, & arrive in italy, then go on to france, you cannot claim asylum in france. you should have claimed it in italy, because that offers a safe place. BUT if you are all citizens of country A, i don't see why you couldn't go there from country b. you don't need permission or need to seek asylum from a country you are entitled to enter at will.

if you mean to call in country A as back up against country B whilst residing in country B over troubles in country C i think they most certainly won't get involved.
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#29 of 80 Old 05-20-2009, 01:29 PM
 
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also, i'm not really clear what exactly country B are objecting to & on what grounds. i would get your lawyer to ascertain that asap - ie explicitly the details of the "case against you" so you know what you are working with.
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#30 of 80 Old 05-20-2009, 01:58 PM - Thread Starter
 
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if you mean to call in country A as back up against country B whilst residing in country B over troubles in country C i think they most certainly won't get involved.
Something like that. I mean that, if social services would come knocking on my door, here in country C, I could tell them - sorry, I've got nothing to do with your social services. If you have any issues, I am going to call embassy A to assist, since you can't attempt to take citizens of country A into your care. Right?

Since my lawyer isn't working today, I'm just having thousands of probably useless random thoughts like that .

I'm Olivia. I blog about physiological childbirth, homebirth, and unassisted homebirth!
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