would you be upset? uninvited from BD party after exposure to chicken pox - Page 3 - Mothering Forums

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Old 07-08-2010, 08:36 PM
 
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Well I do know this: next time I expose my children to something, I will NOT be telling ANYONE. I only told 2 people (fellow non-vaxers) that I thought might want to expose their children as well. I will not make that mistake again, next time if someone wants to expose their children, they can come to me when and if my children actually have the illness.

If your town is really as small as you say, people will find out that you have exposed your children, because word gets around, and the other people may talk.

Unless you're doing it through the mail.

In which case you should be aware that mailing "Infectious material" without meeting certain safety criteria is against USPS regulations and may be a violation of the Patriot Act.
http://pe.usps.com/text/pub52/pub52c3_021.htm

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Old 07-08-2010, 08:55 PM
 
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You know, it doesn't really matter what anyone else thinks. I feel quite hurt about the whole situation, and that hurt only increases when someone snatches a child up and leaves when they see my kids because "his mom doesn't want him exposed to chicken pox". If it were up to me I'd go to my parents' in a different city for a week or two and leave the whole situation behind, but DH doesn't want that. At this point I would be perfectly happy not to go anywhere where I know anyone for the next couple of weeks. And I think it's just as well that I probably won't see my friend for the rest of the month...I don't think I could even look at her right now. Hopefully I'll feel better about the whole situation in a few weeks.
I am having a hard time understanding why you are hurt that someone wants to parent differently than you? Myself, being exposed to chicken pox at this time would be dreadful for me as I'm heavily pregnant and at risk for preterm labour. Why would you be hurt by me keeping my kids away from yours? I might decide to side on the err of caution, but if anything, that would be a "M'eh" moment for me. You might think you know what is going on in everyone's lives, but you don't really, no one does. Me and my friends are very close, but I don't have any expectation of knowing what goes on behind their closed doors, so for all you know, someone might have a seriously compromised immune system, they might be first trimester pregnant, they might be caring for someone. It has nothing to do with you.

I'm saying this gently. People are going to make choices all the time that are different than your own and yes sometimes those choices are going to have an impact on you, just as your choices are going to have an impact on them. In this case, they are saying "I don't want this impact" and that is fine, you shouldn't take it personally. I think if you're getting hurt by this, you need to look within to see why.

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Old 07-08-2010, 08:56 PM
 
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I agree that you would have been better off not telling anyone. But, you still KNOW your kids were exposed and are nearing that contagious window.

When anyone around us is sick, we expect them to avoid close contact with us. My inlaws were sick with a cold not long ago, and they called asking if they could still visit. We said no, wait 'til you feel better -- I'm certainly not afraid of a cold (or chicken pox or the flu) but if I have a choice, I'd rather not get it. I was shocked my inlaws would even CONSIDER visiting while sick -- we have a baby in the home! Also on DS's 1st birthday he was sick. I notified all our guests ahead of time (especially my SIL with a baby nephew) to let them know he had a cold. We went ahead with the party & everyone came but it was THEIR CHOICE, I didn't knowingly force it on them. I would have been disappointed if they didn't come, but I wouldn't blame them one bit. And that's just with a common cold!

There's a big difference between unknowingly acquiring a disease & intentionally exposing yourself to it. If you don't know you're contagious, there's obviously nothing you can do. But your responsibility when you KNOW you've been exposed is to at least inform people you'll be in close contact with & let them decide whether to risk it... I would not avoid large public places like the grocery store but I would avoid playgroups, parties, etc. until no longer potentially contagious.

I'm glad you posted this though, DH wants to intentionally expose DS (and I'm willing to when he's older & can talk well, just not yet) so this gives me a lot to think about, I probably wouldn't have planned to spend a few weeks at home if I hadn't read this thread.

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Old 07-08-2010, 09:14 PM
 
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Maybe she's upset that you knew about her party and chose to expose so close to that date?

Your friend hosting the party, could be "hurt" that one of her friends has such little respect for the other friends' and families' choices that she's invited. Its a choice to expose knowingly & people tend to get upset when other's try to control their choices. I don't get why you'd choose to be upset. If you're mad about others not believing in "the window", there's really nothing that you can do. IMO, trying to make choices for others is more rude that a short text message. As far as chicken pox, I won't be vax'ing unless my kids don't get it naturally before age 11-12ish, and would be really disappointed in someone if they exposed my kids knowingly without asking me first. Its one thing to walk into an illness accidently, but quite another if the illness is brought knowingly by a sneaky person.

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Old 07-08-2010, 09:23 PM
 
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My daughter had chicken pox after attending a Halloween party last fall. I called the school to tell them she had the chicken pox.....and the secretary told me that it was going around the ENTIRE school.


They send a notice home everytime a child has lice. But NOTHING was said about the chicken pox. NOTHING.

Anyways.....I do understand your friends reason for uninviting you. Gosh, I wouldn't want to face all the angry parents if my party kids all ended up with the chicken pox.

If you live in a small community....they may very well already be infected. BUT......if you went to the party they would blame it on you.
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Old 07-08-2010, 09:46 PM
 
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I was shocked my inlaws would even CONSIDER visiting while sick -- we have a baby in the home!
Why were you shocked? I wouldn't have any problem with someone visiting my family, including a baby, if they had a cold. It wouldn't even be on my radar. And, honestly, until I started hanging out on MDC, I don't think it would have even occurred to me to mention it if I had one.

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Old 07-08-2010, 10:00 PM
 
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Why were you shocked? I wouldn't have any problem with someone visiting my family, including a baby, if they had a cold. It wouldn't even be on my radar. And, honestly, until I started hanging out on MDC, I don't think it would have even occurred to me to mention it if I had one.
Because we don't want to be sick if we can avoid it!!

Don't get me wrong -- I know illness is a part of life. We don't use hand sanitizer & cart covers, we aren't obsessive about hand-washing, but if someone is clearly sick I would appreciate them keeping their distance. I'm actually surprised anyone would willingly expose a baby to anything -- and my DS already had a tough enough time of adjusting to this world (very high needs), I definitely don't want to add to it by needlessly subjecting him to something that would cause him to cough & vomit etc. I believe that one reason we instinctively want to stay in bed all day when we're sick is because that prevents needlessly spreading germs...

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Old 07-08-2010, 10:15 PM
 
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Because we don't want to be sick if we can avoid it!!

Don't get me wrong -- I know illness is a part of life. We don't use hand sanitizer & cart covers, we aren't obsessive about hand-washing, but if someone is clearly sick I would appreciate them keeping their distance. I'm actually surprised anyone would willingly expose a baby to anything -- and my DS already had a tough enough time of adjusting to this world (very high needs), I definitely don't want to add to it by needlessly subjecting him to something that would cause him to cough & vomit etc. I believe that one reason we instinctively want to stay in bed all day when we're sick is because that prevents needlessly spreading germs...
Okay - I get that you don't want to be exposed to it. I was asking why you're shocked that someone else (your in-laws) might have a different view.

I believe the reason we want to stay in bed all day when we're sick (and I don't think that's really "instinctive") is because we need rest to feel better more quickly. I don't think it has anything to do with spreading germs. Humans living in communal living situations, for example, aren't going to prevent germs from spreading by staying in bed.

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Old 07-08-2010, 10:18 PM
 
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It's chicken pox, not small pox, and really, would people have been acting this way 10 years ago (or however long ago it was) before the CP vaccine? I cannot imagine people simply stopped sending their children to school and doing anything socially for months out of fear of contracting CP when it was going around unless there were some extremely compelling reason like a immune suppressed individual.
Actually, as someone who grew up in the 70s and who had it in the wild - yes, people did act that way. When I had the chicken pox there were still quarantine laws in effect. I remember going to school to get checked out for scabs and I still had two so I had to stay home for several more days. I also remember some drama because I got them from a friend who was breaking out while I was there and her mother didn't send me home right away.

What's more, my sister had to stay home from school because *I* had chickenpox. And when she had whooping cough I had to stay home. I can't remember about scarlet fever but I do remember for that one we had the doctor come to the house.

Actually I had whooping cough myself about a year ago and we were asked to keep my son home from daycare for a few days. So we did.

I know you're upset and it is a shame, but I really think in this case you've missed the point a little bit - you planned the exposure and you presumably didn't know that people would care as much as they do, but now you do know. You picked to expose your kids at this time, so it's time to take that responsibility to heart.

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Old 07-08-2010, 10:25 PM
 
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Maybe the party host was afraid of her other guests being upset with her about children being at the party who are recovering from CP. Even if they are no longer contagious at that point, they'll still likely have some residual scabs healing over, and she should not have to be in the position of having to deal with angry parents possibly walking out on her kid's party.


 

 

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Old 07-08-2010, 10:53 PM
 
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Maybe the party host was afraid of her other guests being upset with her about children being at the party who are recovering from CP. Even if they are no longer contagious at that point, they'll still likely have some residual scabs healing over, and she should not have to be in the position of having to deal with angry parents possibly walking out on her kid's party.
Yes. I had CP at 22 while at college and it wasn't a big deal, I don't plan on vaxing my kids for it ever, and I wouldn't stress if they got CP. But I would be if a CP kid was *knowingly* at a party b/c like a PP wrote, I just don't want to deal w/ it if I don't have to. I'd be mad at the host for letting it happen. And the idea of not telling anyone so you don't have to deal w/ the repercussions (like missing a party)--not cool.

Wow, the more I think about this, my DH has never had it, and we're about to go on our first vacation in 4 yrs, his work schedule would be so screwed up if he had to take off now, I don't even want to think about keeping my 2 y/o from scratching...I would def keep my kids away from that party even if I thought there was the remotest possibility of our getting CP, and how fair is that to the birthday kid? Really, the friend is the one who should be upset.
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Old 07-08-2010, 11:35 PM
 
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I wouldn't be upset.

I would want to know if someone who has been exposed to an illness is intending to attend my child's party or was going to be at a party my child was also intending.

I would also uninvite someone who might be contagious, I might not care if my kids get CP but it isn't right to make that decision for others.

I would be upset if someone knowingly exposed my children to an illness without my consent. My older sister is in town soon and so we plan on visiting my family, I wouldn't be able to go if my kids had CP as my younger sister just finished cancer treatments and I cannot risk her getting shingles. I would be really upset, I haven't seen my older sister for a year.

That is just one example of why someone might not want to be exposed right then.

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Old 07-08-2010, 11:47 PM
 
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I would have expected you to uninvite yourself, honestly. There are always statistical outliers, and 6 days isn't that far from 9. It would be rare, but enough of a risk for me to say no if warranted. It may be a small community and you may know everyone who was invited, but you can't possibly know all of their family ties and connections. If I were the hostess in that situation, I would totally tell you not to come because I didn't want to expose my kids at that point, whether or not it was true. I wouldn't consider it your business that my father has rheumatoid arthritis and is currently undergoing treatment that destroys his immune system, thereby negating all his developed immunities. Or any of the other possible scenarios making it likely that a guest or loved one of mine would be compromised against their wishes, however small the risk. I'd give the polite lie and take the "blame" myself for uninviting you.

That said, I really dislike text as a means of communicating anything significant. A phone call or visit would have been more courteous.
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Old 07-09-2010, 12:35 AM
 
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Why were you shocked? I wouldn't have any problem with someone visiting my family, including a baby, if they had a cold. It wouldn't even be on my radar. And, honestly, until I started hanging out on MDC, I don't think it would have even occurred to me to mention it if I had one.
Most people I know try not to get sick. It's miserable and if you need to go to the doctor, it's expensive. People with jobs don't get a lot of sick time, kids don't get many absences from school, and people have plans - summer vacation, parties, etc. It does not make any sense to me that people would think oh hey, I'm sick. You can just deal. Even if that is how you think, you must know that most people don't. Even if you don't understand it, you must know that most people actively try to avoid being sick, having sick kids, missing work, etc.
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Old 07-09-2010, 01:08 AM
 
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It's chicken pox, not small pox, and really, would people have been acting this way 10 years ago (or however long ago it was) before the CP vaccine? I cannot imagine people simply stopped sending their children to school and doing anything socially for months out of fear of contracting CP when it was going around unless there were some extremely compelling reason like a immune suppressed individual.

When I was a kid in school 30 + years ago, people didn't have to stay home to avoid exposure, because those who were sick knew THEY were the ones who should stay home. I think it's rude to go somewhere when you're sick. Why do people think that's okay? Just asking in general, not specifically the op...
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Old 07-09-2010, 01:29 AM
 
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I would have expected you to uninvite yourself, honestly. There are always statistical outliers, and 6 days isn't that far from 9. It would be rare, but enough of a risk for me to say no if warranted.
While I generally agree, I did want to point out that this sort of argument can be used to back up "far outlier" events to unreasonable levels.

I know someone who claimed that he got a respiratory illness from a woman because within 4 hours of her arriving at his house, he was sneezing and coming down with fever. He was convinced that he had caught his illness from her, that day. You don't catch and then come down with a cold within 4 hours. Other people at his office had fever and sneezing, but he felt he had been careful not to catch it from them, so it must have been the sneezing woman who "contaminated" his home 4 hours before he got ill. (Not to mention, she had diagnosed allergies that caused her symptoms and did not have a respiratory illness.) I think his claim was silly and paranoid personally.

But, fears are fears, even when they're in no way founded. Avoiding a party on day 6 is the smart thing to do OP, such that any bizarre event doesn't get blamed on you. Kids do get breakthrough pox after the vax, fairly regularly, and should that happen, even if it's a clear 14 days from vax to pox, they're probably more likely to blame you than the vax.

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Old 07-09-2010, 01:37 AM
 
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Most people I know try not to get sick. It's miserable and if you need to go to the doctor, it's expensive. People with jobs don't get a lot of sick time, kids don't get many absences from school, and people have plans - summer vacation, parties, etc. It does not make any sense to me that people would think oh hey, I'm sick. You can just deal. Even if that is how you think, you must know that most people don't. Even if you don't understand it, you must know that most people actively try to avoid being sick, having sick kids, missing work, etc.
Actually, no - I "must" not.

I had no idea until I came to MDC that this was such a big deal to so many people. It's not even on the radar for most people I know irl. I now get that it bothers people. I get that people try to avoid it, which is why I now check and/or uninvite myself and/or my kids. I'm still surprised that anyone would be "shocked" that someone would even consider visiting someone else when they were sick. The in-laws of the poster I was replying to did call and ask. I just don't see anything even remotely shocking about it.

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Old 07-09-2010, 01:40 AM
 
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When I was a kid in school 30 + years ago, people didn't have to stay home to avoid exposure, because those who were sick knew THEY were the ones who should stay home. I think it's rude to go somewhere when you're sick. Why do people think that's okay? Just asking in general, not specifically the op...
The question here isn't whether people should stay home when they are actually sick. It's if they should stay home when they have been exposed to an illness and might, in several days, become sick. For most illnesses, you don't really know that you've been exposed, so you can't make that kind of judgement call. In rare cases, like intentional CP exposure, you can. I got pretty annoyed with people who would come into the office 2 days after watching their H1N1 diagnosed nephews, so I kind of understand it, it's just that the incubation period for CP is so long relatively speaking.

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Old 07-09-2010, 01:42 AM
 
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In my area if you bring a sick child to an event it is super rude. I would never ever take my child to a get togther,etc if they had been sick or exposed to something. It's just not fair to the other children and their families.
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Old 07-09-2010, 01:43 AM
 
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When I was a kid in school 30 + years ago, people didn't have to stay home to avoid exposure, because those who were sick knew THEY were the ones who should stay home. I think it's rude to go somewhere when you're sick. Why do people think that's okay? Just asking in general, not specifically the op...
Because in some social circles, it is okay. If I stayed home from most social events in my circle, because I was sick, people wouldn't appreciate it - they'd just be sad that I was absent (and concerned about my health, of course). My social circle (my original one...pre-MDC/local homeschooling community) is such that this is just not an issue. I never went to school with a contagious illness, because we weren't allowed (which was locking the barn door after the horse was stolen, because I usually caught it at school). I wouldn't have gone to work with chickenpox, for instance, because I probably wouldn't have been able to work, and would have been sent home, anyway. But, I just haven't ever experienced the attempts to avoid illness in my own circle.

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Old 07-09-2010, 02:41 AM
 
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I also have not vaccinated *any* of mine against the CP. And I *DO* hope they get it naturally!

I *might* go so far as to attend a CP party, but I've never had the real life opportunity.

BUT...I would have to first research the risk to my mom, who lives with us, has MS, and might end up w/shingles. If that was a high possibility, I would NOT INTENTIONALLY expose my child to CP. (it just occured to me right now that this would be a consideration actually, thanks to a comment or two I read.)

And I would not INTENTIONALLY expose my kids during the time I had a newborn in the house.

Yes, they *could* get it anyway. That's beyond my control. And no, I'm not planning to vax them for it because I don't believe it *will* prevent it. I have a friend whose 3 kids were *all* vax'ed at least one shot against the CP, I think the oldest was in school and had had the 2 recommended. They *all* got the CP and the oldest actually got it the *worst.* (she didn't live close enough or i might have gone ahead and exposed mine then )

Me, in your situation, I would have told my friend about the exposure and the chance of them being contagious at the party (next to zero apparently) in a way that gives her the option of backing out nicely like "Hey, my kids were exposed to CP, it will have been 6 days by the time of your party, they should not be contagious until at least 10 days...but are you OK with them still coming?" or something like that.

Even if I were thinking of going to a gathering with mainly non-vaxers, I know quite a few....I would still inform them if my kids had been exposed to something and let them make the decision. After all, they are the only ones who know if they're, say, going to be around a newborn or someone who has a weakened immune system. Or going to visit Grandma for Christmas next week or whatever.

And *I* as hostess of a party, would have done the same thing your friend did, though I would have said it much nicer like "*I* personally know the risk of spreading this is pretty low at this point, but this is not a good time for me to intentionally expose my kids , and I can't speak for everyone at my party, I don't know all their situations....I just can't risk even a small chance of exposing everyone."

I also would not bring my children to a gathering after they'd been exposed to CP (and I knew of the exposure) unless it was an agreed-upon intentional CP party. (or insert other "preventable by vax" disease here) I would never want to be responsible for indirectly exposing someone's immune-compromised or newborn family member, etc.

Just a responsibility I accept.

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Old 07-09-2010, 03:05 AM
 
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When I was a kid in school 30 + years ago, people didn't have to stay home to avoid exposure, because those who were sick knew THEY were the ones who should stay home. I think it's rude to go somewhere when you're sick. Why do people think that's okay? Just asking in general, not specifically the op...
This!

This winter I spoke with an acquaintance who has three children. She said her two youngest have diarrhea but it was no longer explosive so she brought them anyway. They were playing in the nursery, merrily with my three children. My middle child proceeded to get RSV which after 7 days of hell and losing five pounds, he finally got over.

I can see ACCIDENTALLY exposing other kids...or say you have no choice, but you know your kid has something contagious and you bring them around other kids anyway? Rude. **Not intended toward the OP...just mostly this woman at my church...lol** -Facepalms-

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Old 07-09-2010, 03:07 AM
 
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Originally Posted by Storm Bride View Post
Because in some social circles, it is okay. If I stayed home from most social events in my circle, because I was sick, people wouldn't appreciate it - they'd just be sad that I was absent (and concerned about my health, of course). My social circle (my original one...pre-MDC/local homeschooling community) is such that this is just not an issue.
I don't think most people would expect you to just preemptively stay home, just to call and give a heads-up and let the other attendees make the decision for themselves about whether to come into contact with you that day. My friends and I all do that, even though 99% of the time everyone says it's fine and to come anyway. In the in-laws case that sparked this side-convo, I agree with you that the ILs did the right thing by calling and asking, and I'm not shocked either that they would consider going ahead with the get-together as long as everyone else was okay with it. Quite considerate, IMO!

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Old 07-09-2010, 03:18 AM
 
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I agree with this 100%. The hostess has to take into account all of her guests and there is no way to know if any children or adults with weakened immune systems will be in attendance.
I agree as well. We suspect DD2 had CP, and were supposed to go to a function, where there was going to be a 9 month old baby. DD2 had about a dozen or two of spots on her belly. It was right in the realm of time for it to develop after an accidental exposure (someone at DS2's pre-school had it, and she was there on the same day as DD2 was..we were not vaxed against CP as the 2 yo shots came during the holidays).

We opted, because of the baby being there, to not go to the function/event to prevent exposure to the baby.
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Old 07-09-2010, 03:50 AM
 
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I would not be offended at all.

I would have uninvited my kids MYSELF. Or if the party was that important, held off on the exposure to CP. However, exposure is not particularly that impoirtant to me.
This is how I would have rolled, too.

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Old 07-09-2010, 04:52 AM
 
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I have an immunocompromised child. Something like this could kill him or land him in the ICU. Why do you get to decide you can roll the dice on someone else's child or family member when you don't know their medical history and the medical history of those they come in contact with? When you are talking about such serious consequences for other people I don't give a darn how low you think the risk is, it is completely unethical and completely selfish to force a potential exposure on others unless they are aware of the risk and agree to it. Do you know how many times my son has landed in the SICU because he was exposed to someone who supposedly wasn't contagious? I can't even go to church any more because the last time I took him someone sent a kid in that was shedding strep and landed my kid SICU. I just can't take the risk and the thought of passing a family like you in the grocery story just gives me cold chills of terror down my spine because that grocery shopping trip could turn fatal for my child. Please think about others when you make decisions like this. There are real people and real lives behind those statistics. Right this very moment I am trying to see if I can get away long enough to drive to another state for the burial of immune compromised three year old. She died of infection that would have been completely treatable in another child. Please, please don't play Germ God with other people's lives.
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Old 07-09-2010, 10:25 AM
 
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Okay - I get that you don't want to be exposed to it. I was asking why you're shocked that someone else (your in-laws) might have a different view.
These are the same in-laws who would use hand sanitizer at every chance, constantly washing hands, vax against everything, mainstream medicine, etc. They were not 'casual' about illness exposure, but they wanted to see DS... It wasn't about having a different view in this case, but about having selfish reasons for suddenly changing their view.

But I'd still be shocked if anyone else did this -- around here, people keep sick kids home from school. People don't visit a new baby if they aren't feeling well (even if it's just a tickle in their throat). Most people seem to realize no one wants to be sick if they can avoid it. I guess I don't really understand why you'd want someone to knowingly/purposefully give you or your newborn a cold?

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I believe the reason we want to stay in bed all day when we're sick (and I don't think that's really "instinctive") is because we need rest to feel better more quickly. I don't think it has anything to do with spreading germs. Humans living in communal living situations, for example, aren't going to prevent germs from spreading by staying in bed.
Those people living communally aren't going to prevent the spread of germs because they're in such close contact on a daily basis. I'm talking about not passing it to people from other families/communes.

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Old 07-09-2010, 10:33 AM
 
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Well, the OP's friends must feel good to know that they always have someplace to send their kids for a visit -- whether or not their kids might be coming down with the flu, a cold, lice, CP or any of the other goodies which kids have a tendency to share.

Or might that bother the OP a bit?
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Old 07-09-2010, 10:40 AM
 
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My brother's MIL lives with them, and is on a vent. My mother and I spell the caregiver and family regularly. We are all vigilant about staying away if one of us is ill or exposed to something where there is the remotest possibility of contagion. Because it could, frankly, kill her. This involvement isn't something most people in my circle know about, because it's really none of their business and (IMO) not something that I need them to know.

If I were invited to a party/social event, yes, I would like to know whether another guest was even remotely possibly contagious - and they knew it. It's not their choice to make for me, whether or not I'm to be exposed to whatever.

As someone above said - it's not all about you.
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Old 07-09-2010, 11:03 AM
 
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I wouldn't be offended in the least. Just as it was YOUR choice to expose your kids to CP at this time, it's HER choice not to.

I see no reason to be upset. It's simply natural consequences.
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