I think perhaps the people are just being more direct than you are used to. Interrupting is rude. It is not accusation that your dd lacks manners. She is simply explaining why one should not interrupt. Because it is rude. (although I think this is over the head of an 18 month old.) I did not see in either example anyone berating or demeaning your child. They were simply giving them a reason why one should not interrupt or invade personal space. because those things are considered rude.
I just want to say that until recently I was one of the few people in my friend group that didnt have children, and I never would have said that to a kid.
The big issue with telling a child that they are rude, is the fact that I feel like they need to understand why something is considered rude. And, in the case of interrupting, it seems important that they learn not to do it not only because it is rude, but because if they interrupt during a conversation they are engaged in, they may well miss something or not hear the point. I feel like it is ridiculous to tell a 18 month old that they are being "rude".
Also, the point that the adult isnt calling the child rude, they are calling the action rude is symantics. My husband and I have argued this point with his phrase, "Stop being such a bitch", where he maintains that he's not calling me a bitch, its just that what Im doing is bitchy.
Holly and David
Adaline (3/20/10), and Charlie (1/26/12- 4/10/12) and our identical twins Callie and Wendy (01/04/13)
You know, I think we nmeed to remember that the person said what they said *after* the OP addressed her kid. So it's not like the person turned to the kid and said, "You're rude." with nothing else said to the kid. The mom asked the child to wait, and the person "backed her up". Not something I'd do, or really want another person to necessarily do after i had addressed my kid, but I wouldn't paint this person too badly either, like they're snarling at babies or something.
The truest answer to violence is love. The truest answer to death is life. The only prevention for violence is for the heart to have no violence within it. We cannot prevent evil through any system devised by mankind. But we can grapple with evil and defeat it, but only with love—real love.
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I am less tactful with young children because I don't consider tact to always be age appropriate. I am never harsh or rude, but imho being direct to young children is both more effective and kinder to the child, since they understand better what you want from them.
Ooops, I apologize, I did not see the original post...Please classify my above post as a general rant. With an 18 mo and a 3 yo, I agree it is not a good thing to be calling them "rude" when they are just being children. A 3 yo is going to take things to heart when, like brilliiantly mentioned in the above post, they are actually like little foreigners just learning their way.
I apologize for venting without reading the entire post.
I would just like to point out that saying "interrupting is rude" is entirely different than calling the child rude. "Interrupting is rude" is calling the ACTION rude, not the child...and in another 18 months or 2 years or so, it's likely exactly what you will be saying to your child.
Well, there's one potential difference in viewpoint right there. I don't think calling a certain behaviour "rude" is acribing motivation. It's rude to interrupt, and I want my kids to know that. If I point out that it's rude, I'm not saying "you're trying to be rude". I'm saying "what you're doing is rude (ie. impolite)". I don't see that as being any different than if I said, "interrupting hurts the feelings of the person talking".
This could be one difference in perspective that causes the problems. In any case, I do tell my kids that their behaviour is rude, if they're being rude. I wouldn't say it to dd2, because she'd have no clue what I was talking about, anyway - but I say it to the other kids, and it has nothing to do with their motivations. I've known several rude people (and even people who aren't generally rude usually slip up, at least occasionally), and I don't think any of them get out of bed in the morning, and think "I'm going to spend my day being rude to people", yk?
ETA: I just realized this is an old thread. I will say that the "don't be bitchy" example is more of the same. I don't think dh would ever say I was being bitchy, as he just doesn't talk that way - but I have had people tell me I was being bitchy in the past. I've also had people call me a bitch. They were meant differently, and they felt different. I don't think the issue of whether one is labelling the person or the behaviour is one of semantics. It really does make a big difference.
Lisa, lucky mama of Kelly (3/93) , Emma (5/03) , Evan (7/05) , & Jenna (6/09)
Loving my amazing dh, James & forever missing Aaron Ambrose (11/07)
Wow, OP here, what an old thread! My children are so much older and my perspective is somewhat different. I do now use the word 'rude' to my daughter when she's doing things that would bug other people, as in, 'DD, it's generally considered rude to take food off other people's plate, please stop.' Not, 'you're so rude.'). But she's 4 1/2 now, she gets the concept of 'rude.' It's a useful way to help her learn how to act around other people. It was such a different story when the events I posted about happened; she was just a toddler, absorbed in her own little world, and acting silly. She did need to be redirected and start to learn the effect of her actions on others, but the word rude meant nothing. My son is now the same age my daughter was when the first incidents I wrote about happened (2 1/2) and the contrast between 4 1/2 and 2 1/2 is enormous. My 4 1/2 DD can understand and take responsibility for her actions in a way that my 2 1/2 DS can barely comprehend.
I think the big underlying issue at the time I first posted was that the people disciplining my daughter really did not know her at all, and did not spend much time around young children. They had no basis to know what she understood about social norms and what she didn't, what was age appropriate behavior, and what kind of redirection worked for her. I've never had a problem with people who do know my children well redirecting them in an appropriate way.
Mom to DD 8 and DS 6.
I don't this would really bother me. Part of our gentle discipline is telling them things like, this is rude; people like their space and you should respect this; etc, I tell them what is wrong but don't punish it
I'd be tempted in many of these situations to say "well tha-ank you Miss Manners!" in a very belittling tone.
But that'd be a bad example for my kid.
I've never had even the people who made jokes about duct taping kids to keep them quiet before I had kids say anything remotely mean to dd. So the idea of people being bossy curmudgeons to a kid when the parent is right there is baffling. Are your friends always so abrupt and impatient?
A woman on the subway the other day was very worried that 4.5 year old DD might touch her in some way (it was a crowded train and many people were standing - yet this woman seemed to be taking up a lot of space in girth and baggage). The woman once gave me a very deadly look and I told DD: "Come on, let's move to the door, some people on here can't afford car services and taxis so they NEED to take public transportation, despite their problems. We should understand their situation and make every effort to make ourselves as small as possible." Some people were snickering beside me. :)
I was POed in a major way because in all honesty, the woman was being unreasonable in a situation that called for a little tolerance. Sometimes I have to say underhanded rude things out loud in order to get past it. I'm usually a pretty even person, but sometimes you have to dish it back. I feel your pain, OP, especially when it comes to under five children who are technically being "good" but are just being under five.
I don't think childfree children are like this per se, in fact, I know a lot of child-free people who are totally smart and reasonable and laid back. There are a limited number of people, though, who no matter what their station (child-free, older empty-nesters, unreasonable people with small kids who just don't get it, etc.) will complain and comment. Let's not cite child-free people as the problem. It's just miserable human beings who are the problem, and they come in all groups and classes.
Great point. And that's my dad. I can't say that he's a miserable person. But he does not have patience or understanding with kids and is quick to get huffy and annoyed with them. I think it's sad, because he's missing out on his grand kids. That's his prerogative, and his loss.
Someone moved my effing cheese.
I know it is an old thread - but I have to chime in!
Eh - I'm old now so I am over all the subtleties of having young kids and trying not to offend. At this point in my life - I would probably turn to junior and say....
"actually sweetheart, your auntie is the one who is being rude. See, she doesn't have children and really doesn't understand how to speak to them or what is appropriate"
Trying to do the right thing with three kids and a hubby.
ds20, dd18, ds17