So what does CPS look for? Can they inestigate over any concerned call from someone? I'm in Canada. - Page 3 - Mothering Forums
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#61 of 143 Old 06-01-2011, 03:02 PM
 
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Originally Posted by LROM View Post

 

Re: the mom who had had 12 reports, again, unless the reporter can say "This is what mom is doing and this is how it's hurting her kids", even with 12 reports it's hard for CPS to legally respond.  As you said kathymuggle, it took mom doing something really erratic for police to come and then when she resisted arrest, that triggered everything.  In a way, as sucky as it is to have to live with a mentally ill mom, unless someone can explain how her mental issues are hurting her kids in a tangible way, it's very hard for CPS to intervene.  It comes up a lot with alcohol and pot - ok, it would be an ideal world if no one used either while parenting... but one is legal and the other is very very common even if illegal.  CPS has increasingly started examining not just what is the parent doing that seems like a bad idea, but what is the impact - if any - on the kids?  Some parents can drink and still parent fantastically... others alcohol makes them neglectful or abusive and their kids' needs are not met.  CPS should only get involved in the 2nd situation, even though both parents are using the same substance (alcohol).  So if there werent details about how the mom's mental illness was having a negative impact on her kids, what could CPS do?  Even if there was evidence mom was wacky, if the kids were fed, clothed, doing ok in school and seemed socially and emotionally ok, should CPS intervene further than assessing the situation (which is the only way to find out the kids are fed, clothed and emotionally ok)? 



These ones are so complicated. You and I have talked before, LROM, so you know I'm not the biggest fan of CPS, in many ways. This kind of scenario is part of the reason why - but I also realize that it must be incredibly frustrating to deal with, and very hard to know the best way to deal with it. I'm familiar with several cases of mental illness making for less than wonderful parenting, but overall situations that really aren't abusive, yk? If CPS gets a call on those people, then the "what should we do?" question is really complicated, and probably also very frustrating.

 

Magali: It's always a good idea to take a good look at the threads. I find that many of them say "CPS", but if you look inside, you'll find Canadian specific content. I just use "CPS" myself. Most posters here know what I'm talking about, and I can never remember what it's called here, anyway. I'm pretty sure the name has changed at least twice since my teens...the great Canadian (or at least British Columbian) game of "change the name, but leave the substance alone" gets played pretty hard here.


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#62 of 143 Old 06-01-2011, 07:11 PM
 
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I was looking forward to a discussion pertaining to Canadian laws.  Thanks to all the Canadian info because often here on MDC there are CPS threads, but I don't see CAS. 



I am Canadian (like the beer commercial, lol).  I often call CAS "CPS" so Americans will understand what I am talking about.  I figure most Canadians on this board know what CPS is, but I am not sure most Americans know what CAS is.

 

Interestingly, there are even regional differences in the CAS thing.  It is not called CAS in Quebec, but something like child youth protective services (not quite sure)

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#63 of 143 Old 06-02-2011, 04:04 AM
 
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I am Canadian (like the beer commercial, lol).  I often call CAS "CPS" so Americans will understand what I am talking about.  I figure most Canadians on this board know what CPS is, but I am not sure most Americans know what CAS is.

 

Right, and honestly I never even knew what to call it here in Canada until this thread.  But what I was getting at is that while discussions about US CPS are interesting and raise topics on a general level, the law bits are irrelevant to me,  just like laws in Australia or the UK would be. 


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#64 of 143 Old 06-02-2011, 12:55 PM
 
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Interestingly, there are even regional differences in the CAS thing.  It is not called CAS in Quebec, but something like child youth protective services (not quite sure)

 

I just googled it out of curiousity when I read this. It looks as though what we have here is actually called Child Protection Services, so it really is CPS!  They operate under the umbrella of the Ministry of Children and Family Development. Most people I've known who have had any involvement with them simply say "The Ministry".
 

 


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#65 of 143 Old 12-16-2011, 02:35 PM
 
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CPS does, in fact, need a warrant to enter your home. Even if there are police with them, they must have a valid warrant to enter your house. -Walsh vs. Erie County Department of Job and Family Services, Case No.3:01CV7588. This basically states that the Fourth Amendment aplies to social workers. There is NO social worker exception to the strictures of the Fourth Amendment. Hope this clears things up a little.

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#66 of 143 Old 12-18-2011, 06:07 PM
 
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CPS does, in fact, need a warrant to enter your home. Even if there are police with them, they must have a valid warrant to enter your house. -Walsh vs. Erie County Department of Job and Family Services, Case No.3:01CV7588. This basically states that the Fourth Amendment aplies to social workers. There is NO social worker exception to the strictures of the Fourth Amendment. Hope this clears things up a little.


The OP is in Canada, and Canadians do not have the same rights that U.S. citizens do, as they do not have the same Constitution that we do.

 

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#67 of 143 Old 12-18-2011, 09:34 PM
 
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The OP is in Canada, and Canadians do not have the same rights that U.S. citizens do, as they do not have the same Constitution that we do.

 



You do know we have the charter of rights, right?? A lot of our basic rights are pretty much the same as the US, we even have a few extra (like the right to basic health care) Police do still need a warrant or reasonable suspicion to enter a home. CAS is not run through the police though.

 

I have had CAS called on me. My daughter has an extremely rare congenital defect that can make it appear as if her right leg is covered in bruises. We've had no less 8 calls about the same leg. Apparently people though we were beating her (but only the one leg you see winky.gif) They no longer come when they get a call because its been marked on the file.

 

CAS does everything they can to try keeping families together, and reuniting those who have been separated. They don't go in with the intention of taking kids away from their family.

 

Sure you can refuse them entry, that is your right, but its counter productive to you. Better to let them in and show you have nothing to hide. By refusing them entry it set off alarm bells for them.

 


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#68 of 143 Old 12-18-2011, 09:54 PM
 
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You do know we have the charter of rights, right?? A lot of our basic rights are pretty much the same as the US, we even have a few extra (like the right to basic health care) Police do still need a warrant or reasonable suspicion to enter a home. CAS is not run through the police though.

 

She didn't say we don't have any rights. She said we don't have the same rights. That's the simple truth.

 



 


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#69 of 143 Old 12-20-2011, 06:28 AM
 
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The rights we have through our charter of rights is the same as those covered by your constitution. Thats all I was meaning. I don't believe Warrents are related to either.


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#70 of 143 Old 12-20-2011, 08:39 AM
 
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The rights we have through our charter of rights is the same as those covered by your constitution. Thats all I was meaning. I don't believe Warrents are related to either.



The countries are similar in many ways - but not the same.  I would caution anyone to look up Canadian laws and not assume American ones apply - as they might not.

 

As stated earlier in this thread, different provinces may operate in different ways, look up yours.  

 

I see you are In Ontario.  A brief google search seemed to indicate CAs and police could enter your home without a warrant if they felt there was "just cause."  Here is a link to police info, look at pages 10-12

 

http://www.cleo.on.ca/english/pub/onpub/PDF/criminal/polpower.pdf

 

 

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#71 of 143 Old 03-13-2012, 11:08 PM
 
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I'm in Indiana and I had a CPS worker show up at my door the other day because my brothers ex-girlfriend called and reported me saying all kinds of stuff. Of coarse it wasn't true but it still freaked me out having someone like that standing at my door. I let her right in and took her through to show her the kids room, and the kitchen and all because I didn't want her to think I had something to hide. I just felt like it would be better to just let her in and do her investigation so they'll get out of my life as soon as possible. Even though I didn't really wanna let her in my house was a mess. We had been gone out of town all weekend and hadn't got to clean up or anything but I figured she seen much much worse than my house. I just had toys everywhere. Now I have to wait 30days for them to finish their investigation and its nerve racking. Even though I know I have nothing to hide and I'm a wonderful mother you still just never know what could come of this!

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I'm in Indiana and I had a CPS worker show up at my door the other day because my brothers ex-girlfriend called and reported me saying all kinds of stuff. Of coarse it wasn't true but it still freaked me out having someone like that standing at my door. I let her right in and took her through to show her the kids room, and the kitchen and all because I didn't want her to think I had something to hide. I just felt like it would be better to just let her in and do her investigation so they'll get out of my life as soon as possible. Even though I didn't really wanna let her in my house was a mess. We had been gone out of town all weekend and hadn't got to clean up or anything but I figured she seen much much worse than my house. I just had toys everywhere. Now I have to wait 30days for them to finish their investigation and its nerve racking. Even though I know I have nothing to hide and I'm a wonderful mother you still just never know what could come of this!


I think most of them can probably tell the difference between a vacation or someone is sick mess and a we-never-clean mess... at least the difference is apparent to me. Plus, I think who the call comes form makes a difference... they came and had a look around after I called the police on my ex, but they didn't even call when his parents reported on me (they bought the house back for ex, and that was the first time they saw holes in the wall, etc... of course their precious boy couldn't have done that) The only reason I knew about that call was because I called myself looking for support for DS, who was having behaviour issues.

 


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#73 of 143 Old 03-14-2012, 08:04 PM
 
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I haven't read all the posts, so bear with me with this has already been covered.  

 

I have worked for CPS in the US, in the state of Georgia.

 

Every state and county has slightly different ways of doing things....

 

But CPS workers do NOT have the right to enter a home unless they come with a police or sheriff who has cause to enter, or they have a signed order from a judge.

 

This will only happen in very serious circumstances.  

 

In the county I worked in, about 70% of calls with allegations were ever investigated (rest did not have real reason to respond to call), most of initial visits were quickly closed for lack of evidence.

 

Even if CPS brings a case to court, a judge or law enforcement are the ones who bring criminal charges.

 

It is the goal of CPS first to protect children, and second, to keep families together.  

 

I know that as CPS workers, we are given a bad rap, and many see us as the enemy.  In my experience, the county I worked in had a legal system that greatly favored the rights of parents over children.  This sometimes resulted in children staying in homes and being given back to unfit parents that later resulted in their coming to harm.

 

From my experience, it is much harder to prove to a judge that a child is in danger and keep them safe, than it is for parents to get a good lawyer and get their children back.  

 

If you are a good parent, and I believe most are, you have nothing to fear.

 

For those of us in normal families, I think it's hard to imagine sometimes what things look like when kids are being abused and neglected, and we'd prefer to think that it doesn't happen.  But it does, and those kids do need a system to protect them.  

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#74 of 143 Old 03-26-2012, 01:07 AM
 
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A judge will NOT grant a warrent by the end of the day, do not listen to that people. Not unless you have done something so terrible And there is physical evidence of such in which case they should be there and you should be held accountable. They WILL lie to you along with the police and tell you they will take your child, or that they are just here to help there is nothing to worry about, or that they are going to arrest you. Please do not listen to this. These are tactics, and the police go along right with them. ANYTHING that you say will be twisted taken out of context and used to begin the process to take you to family court and maybe criminal court. NOW... Being smart with them does not help either, as both the CPS worker and POLICE officer there to intimidate you at 7 or 8 am are trained specifically and they believe for some reason that being defensive means you are guilty of whatever accusation. They forget about the fact you are a parent, defending the life of your child. I am sorry to say if your in that position where they are on your front lawn, your being investigated. If you allow them into your home, they will take pictures, notes, and use anything less than perfect against your family. Its very hard, but its best to just be polite and bring your children outside for them to see record the conversation if you can with your cell phone anything. THEY are there to take your child away, its serious it wont go away. Tell them to please give you a card so that you can set up a time they can come back in the near future with your attorney there. They will squeal, lie, threaten you its their job. More cases = more funding. Once a child is taken into foster care they make the services so impossible, drag them out for years for you to not get your child back. Once they children are in custody they get FUNDING. When a child goes from foster care to ADOPTION, there is MORE funding. It is a BUSINESS. This is one of the most grossly hidden tragedys in our country. The media is not allowed to talk about it, if you google information on it there is nothing other than websites that warn you of it. It is creepy, and its is wrong. CPS makes it out to be that people who discuss this are radical, nutty, but this really happens and mostly in POOR communities where it is alot easier such as WALWORTH COUNTY, WI. I do not know anyone I met in that county in over 2 years who does not know of or someone from their family who had to deal with CPS and the police who go along with them. As my pastor told me in a counseling session, this has been going on a long long time here and its just getting worse. Its never ending. My family and I fought, we lost everything, but we are together and we got out. CPS is in no way there to help your family, or give you suggestions of where to get resources. It they were, they would give you a simple phone call, not be on your front lawn unannounced with a police officer. CPS in some counties across the country is completely out of control, they should be investigated and re structured so that attention to the children who really need their help is given. Too many families are being torn apart, lose their dignity, are finacially ruined over accusations from a bad divorce or a disgruntled family member or past friend/acquaintance. Its an American tragedy happening in living rooms on a daily basis. A child should only be taken away from his/her family for severe situations with clear cut physical evidence, not accusations. I can only tell you the emotional pain from a parent who basically lost their childs infancy due to fighting these people for years over false accusations. God bless the families who are just poor and learning as a family. God bless the children who really do need help also.

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#75 of 143 Old 04-24-2012, 02:06 PM
 
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<snip> RANT WALWORTH COUNTY, WI.

 

 

You come across like someone with a serious axe to grind, perhaps while also looking for their space bar? Sarcasm aside - this is the exact kind of reactionary drabble that doesn't do either side any good. Villifying CPS doesn't help, (and of course there are CPS workers who abuse their power, just like there are crappy managers, teachers who pick on your kid, nurses who have lousy bedside manners, and waiters who spit in your food.) but neither does shrieking at us about the unpunctuated evils happening, apparently, all around you. You say we should help the kids who need it, but I don't see you advocating for an alternative, or even making a coherent point. Perhaps you could tell us what you think the states/provinces/whatever should do instead?

 

Before anyone says I don't have perspective - I work for the state I live in, in children's psychiatry. We see the kids who weren't reached by CPS in time. Abused, neglected, beaten, starved, burnt, sexually molested, exposed to drugs, exposed to alcohol, chained to various household items, left outside, locked in rooms, you name it. Imagine the worst of the worst, and then take it ten steps farther. CPS is a necessary evil in a world full of evils far worse than someone on your porch asking to see your kids. Yes, they DO receive all sorts of false complaints and allegations, and the good workers can sift through that. The bad workers, not so much - and I truly, truly feel for ANY family who has to deal with an overzealous CPS agent who is actively trying to upset their homelife. There isn't a happy medium to be had, unfortunately, and I can see it from both sides. I'd be horrified if a CPS worker came to my door. I can't honestly say I would know what to do, or if I would freeze in the moment.  I can tell you, though, that if I had truly done nothing wrong and the worker was able to agree with me and clear the allegation - I wouldn't fault the worker or the system for showing up at my door. That shows the system works, even if it's inconvenient at times. Until there's a better alternative, this is what we have. And this isn't even close to foolproof.


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#76 of 143 Old 04-24-2012, 06:15 PM
 
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CPS is not a business. How much do they get in grants for each child that is adopted? I can pretty well guarantee you that they spend far more that whatever number that is to successfully get a TPR granted.

It costs a lot of money, and takes a lot of time to get a TPR. Not to mention experts, they have to pay the foster parent stipend, pay all medical care for the child (obviously these come out of different funds in some cases, but medicaid is not free, even if the beneficiary isn't paying), therapies, supervisors for supervised visits, attorneys for the parents, the state, and the child. Not to mention the judge, social workers (who are over worked and underpaid), all the others in the state agency who are involved in the case, etc.

All of that is extremely costly for the state. Extremely.
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#77 of 143 Old 04-30-2012, 08:06 AM
 
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I've probably already posted in this thread but im too lazy to scroll up and see.

 

All i can say is that i have three adopted children. The one who spent the MOST time in her mother's care, who got sent back TWICE from foster care is the child of mine who has the most emotional issues. None of the three came into care for no reason, the reasons were clearly documented.

 

Yes, states get "bonuses" here is more info about that : http://www.acf.hhs.gov/programs/cb/pubs/congress/overview.htm#Incentive In my state, agencies get the MOST money for placing a child who is listed on the state photolisting and who is with a different agency...thus encouraging the placement of children who have been waiting the longest. Obviously, there may be certain agencies and counties who have some secret agenda to steal children away from healthy families so they can adopt them out and get bonuses....but as a broad, country-wide agenda? Frankly, there is so much disorganization and dropping-of-the-ball and passing-the-buck and total lack of communication between different "arms" of the child welfare system that i can't see them working together for some covert operation like that. In my state CPS is totally separate from the private agencies who place children. Then of course there is the prosecutor who decides whether to pursue TPR, and then the judge who decides. Its one big conspiracy? if so, then why was my daughter sent back to her bmom when she was a tiny six month old baby, rather than being easily adopted out? Why sent back as a cute little five year old? Why did they wait until she was 8 yrs old with significant emotional problems to FINALLY tpr and then adopt out? It doesnt make logical sense.

 

 


 


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#78 of 143 Old 04-30-2012, 08:15 AM
 
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From queenjane's link:

 

Quote:
Michigan, for instance, is using a performance-based incentive system designed to encourage and reward the timely adoption of children from the foster care system. The State of Michigan makes extensive use of private agencies for adoption placement services. Under the State's adoption incentive, private agencies are rewarded for placing children more quickly, receiving an enhanced rate of $5,600 for placing a child within eight months. If an agency takes longer than 8 months to place a child in an adoptive home, it receives the standard rate of $3,500. Furthermore, private agencies are paid a premium rate of $8,600 for placing a child who is not in the care of that private agency, but who is included in the State's photolisting book of children who are hard to place.

 

These incentives are probably helpful to agencies, but are hardly worth the trouble (and cost, since this does NOT reimburse the agency or state for the cost of seeking TPR!) of removing children from healthy families solely to get them.

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#79 of 143 Old 05-01-2012, 08:30 AM
 
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Exactly. The "standard rate" an agency gets is $3,500, and that is supposed to cover the homestudy, training, home visits, etc etc. They get a little bit more for putting extra effort in placing kids who wait longer (we have kids on the MI photolisting who have been waiting years and years!) And the highest rate (placing a child who is with another agency) encourages agencies to allow their families to adopt kids who arent with their own agency, otherwise many workes might feel its too much trouble or feel too "possessive" of their families/kids and want to keep it all in-house.

 

Frankly i bet there is more of a "profit" to be had in keeping kids in foster care, because once that adoption is finalized the agency might get a bonus but then they receive no more money from that case. Sadly though, there is no shortage of kids coming into care so that isnt too much of a worry for the agencies.


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#80 of 143 Old 05-03-2012, 09:00 AM
 
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your full of shit my mom went through it. don't miss lead people to think cps are nice good  people i grew up in a nice clean house and went to school faithfully and cps was still knocking at our door, all because my mom wasn't a "traditional" home maker and you don't have to let them in your home without warranted cause i had healthy families of America tell me that one. where I'm from cps work with healthy families. 

 

Calm down. Your experience is different than MY experience. That doesnt make ANYONE "full of shit"...i've been contacted by CPS twice with my oldest son when he was little based on allegations people made, and also during my stint as a foster parent. All three times turned out fine in the end, but believe me, i know that all it takes is one crazy sw to ruin your life. Those things happen...they SHOULDNT but they do. But that doesnt mean that CPS wants to steal your children *so that they can adopt them out for supposed big bucks from the govt*...i have my experience, you have your experience and that may color how we view CPS (my adopted children's lives were probably saved by CPS intervention) but can't we keep the discussion respectful?


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#81 of 143 Old 05-03-2012, 09:25 AM
 
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My mother in law called CPS on me numerous times because I was going to move away with my daughter and she didn't like it.  I refused to let the social worker in and they came back within an hour with police and a warrant.  My daughter was removed that same day because I was "uncooperative" and therefore "they couldn't ensure my dd's safety".  So they threw her in a van and drove off with her.  I've never seen such a look of terror on a child's face before. 

 

I was a good crunchy mom.  We lived in a huge, clean house.  My daughter was well fed, home schooled and involved in lots of activities, had friends, etc.  There was no abuse of any kind (I have never once hit her or anything like it).  Certainly no neglect.  No drugs or alcohol.  But they took her anyways.

 

At first they said they took her because I was uncooperative.  Then it was because I have bi-polar and that means that there is potential for abuse or neglect.  Then by the time trial happened there was so much made up stuff (with no proof) that it is still unbelievable to me.  Supposedly I cut myself in front of my daughter, was on the internet threatening to kill her, etc.  All completely made up things!  They never did accuse me of any physical abuse though, which I guess was "kind" of them.

 

The kicker was that CPS gave my daughter to the same MIL who lied and started all this to begin with.  My daughter HATES my MIL and was miserable living with her for months.  There were plenty of other people jumping at the chance to take my dd in.  But my MIL had CPS wrapped around her finger for some reason (I never have figured it out).

 

I played the game.  Drove the 50 miles each way for my one hour visit a week.  Attended every hearing.  Took pointless parenting classes that taught me nothing after years of being on MDC.  Continued to see my doctors and psychiatrists (like I always had been anyways).

 

It's been a year and a half now and my daughter lives with me full time again.  However, CPS is still in control of our lives.  I am not allowed to home school.  I'm not allowed to move.  I can't go anywhere or do anything with out the social worker calling and talking to someone (you know how embarrassing that can get after a while? this includes my jobs, etc).  And we live in constant fear of doing (or not doing) something wrong and them removing her yet again.  Everything is supposed to be dismissed in Oct...but I won't believe it until it happens.

 

So I don't really care one bit what the social workers here on MDC have to say about CPS.  Corruption sure as hell does happen.  It happened to me and because of that I believe it is happening to a lot of people.  There is no way that my case is just a very random, unlucky situation.  No abuse, no neglect, no drugs, living conditions were perfect...and they still took her.  It sickens me really.


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#82 of 143 Old 05-03-2012, 09:27 AM
 
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Oh and they did use all of my MDC posts from years past against me during the trial.  So I always warn people here to be careful what they say online.  Because I have seen it come back to bite you when it comes to CPS.


Melaya (29) - Mom to Z (9) and soon to be I (due Nov 2013) stork-boy.gif

Birth mom to M (7), O (5), & C (2). winner.jpgnovaxnoIRC.giftriadadopt.jpg

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#83 of 143 Old 05-03-2012, 09:49 AM
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Viki Bowser, I see you are a new member. Please appreciate that we do not allow personal attacks of member. If you cannot discuss something politely and with respect for others please refrain from posting. 


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#84 of 143 Old 05-03-2012, 10:13 AM
 
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Originally Posted by queenjane View Post
 But that doesnt mean that CPS wants to steal your children *so that they can adopt them out for supposed big bucks from the govt*...i have my experience, you have your experience and that may color how we view CPS (my adopted children's lives were probably saved by CPS intervention) but can't we keep the discussion respectful?

 

 

Warning: Possible Triggers

 

 

 

Here is a recent news story about a baby that CPS failed to save. CPS made the call to return a child to its birth parents, and 2 weeks later, the child was dead. http://www.kvoa.com/news/foster-parents-of-dead-baby-speak-out/

 

Part of the problem with CPS is that their mandate is to predict human behavior, which is impossible. They try to sort out which reports are made by people simply to mess with the parent, and which calls are made in an attempt to protect children. They try to guess which parents can care for their children, even imperfectly, and which parents are a danger to their children.

 

But CPS employees are just human beings, without any special powers. They cannot predict the future.


but everything has pros and cons  shrug.gif

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#85 of 143 Old 05-09-2012, 07:23 PM
 
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I would have to disagree there's a reason why the Bill of rights is law we are by law in all states allowed to refuse cps entry even law enforcement if there is no warrant or court order then they have no right to threaten,coerce,intimidate or force there way in people's home can be a mess at time's when you have kids an can be a mess when your doing a deep cleaning an a cps worker could careless if you've been cleaning or not thet'll use it as a reason to remove your kids i know cause its been done to me.

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#86 of 143 Old 05-10-2012, 06:24 PM
 
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@Single mom 35: You sure you're not Viki Bowser in disguise? This thread is doing a great job at dragging out the people with an axe to grind. CPS is fallible. They make the wrong calls in returning kids. They make the wrong calls in removing kids. At the end of they day, that CPS worker is a fallible human being. Who has personal family concerns, bills to pay, dinners to make, headaches, colds, take-out pizza. They are Just People. They can't look into a crystal ball, there's no computer that generates odds and likely outcomes. Thus, there's going to be times that the wrong decision is made. Should it EVER happen? No. It can ruin lives, often it does. But it does, because it's a system run by people, trying to anticipate the behavior of other people. Sorry. No good answer.
 


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#87 of 143 Old 05-23-2012, 07:31 AM
 
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This is not necessairly the case. Im actually dealing with them here in Utah over a situation and yes, they can enter your house take pictures and look around.  Inspect everything...how much food, how clean, is there bad food around? re the kids rooms clean? Do they have clean beds? Do they even have beds? Are the kids clean and well taken care of? Is the house clean? Are there are any drugs or dangerous things around? Do the parents have previous cases with the CPS? These are just some of the things that come to issue with them...Down here, they are especially critical of cleanliness. My house is somewhat cluttered and a little messy...but not at all bad.  People have called CPS (Child Protective Service) for false allegations. I do not abuse or neglect or hurt my kids even though someone said my son was neglected. For some reason, Utah CPS is totally hung up on cleanliness rather than the real issues of what is and does go on. There are people out there who deal and use drugs (not me) and are highly abusive and horrible to kids...and people who have just horrible places to live in with their kids...I have seen houses broken to pieces and beyond trashed and bad in  almost all kind of ways. These are the people who CPS needs to deal with.  Leave others including me alone...There is a boy down the street from us..he and his brother are being raised by his grand parents and they would come and walk to school with my daughter...my daughter is 7 and he is 10. Anyway this kid and his younger brother constantly smelled like strong cigerrete smoke...all on their clothes  and their hair. Nasty. Just smelling that made me not only feel sick but was quite offending...and while i dont know the exact situation of these kids, I believe it to be dysfunctional. However, for parents or grandparents to smoke heavily around young kids in my mind is abuse and they should be talked to.  In fact, i can agree that kids should not at all be living in a smoke filled enviornment...its a health concern..why dont cps step in on that? The fact that i am dealing with the CPS on my own situations which i think their actions is not warranted there are people who do so much worse and get away with it.at any rate, yes they can come into your home. And no you dont  have to let them in, however, they can then go and get a court order demanding to see your house. If you dont comply then you get into further problems which could unfortunately  result in a temporary removal which is what i am facing...you can certainly fight them but the judges here in this pathetic state will always from what i have heard side with the cps.  Social workers can and often do show up unannounced. They do this deliberately and they can go to the childs school without you as a parent even knowing they did and talk to your child and get them to tell them things that they never told you. And worse, use it against you. When they come to your home they can talk to your kids in like manner in private asking about abuse and how well mom and dad treats them and use that too against you...they look for anything and everything. Like a debt collector..anything the kids say or you tell them can and could be used against you. They love people who are informers because then they have that as a weapon.. The CPS are vultures. If you have been calling them, then please stop at once! They are the government and the governmet can be a dangerous entity to deal with on this...In fact, many people are really ignorant of the fact that when they call the cps of something they feel is wrong with a kid, they have NO clue of just how much damage they can really cause someone even of they are calling innocently. i have seen several otherwise good descent hard working families be literally ruined by the so called CPS for things didnt warrant it...they pray on people..they never seem to go away once they have a victim in their clutches. its like a cancer..it just keeps growing and getting worse the more they come around. If more and more Americans and others knew this, the less power the CPS and Social Services would have over the general public...They have NO clue how much damage they cause to the lives of not just the kids but parents and families etc. These people who call feel they are justified  and somehow have a high sense of entitlement just because they either dont like something or have some kind of revenge against a person..to  essentially but into other peoples affairs and business and have no idea of the real problem, situation or just what is happening in the shoes of the kids or others..they should learn to mind their own business...and if more people just looked the other way and never deal with the CPS (people learn as a family unit and society to handle their own problems like in other nations) society would be better and happier..these people who make calls to them are NOT helping problems they are more often than not creating them. I think laws should be made on what truly constitutes a call to them and people who call should be made to think twice before doing so...there should be proof of abuse or neglect before someone calls. If it is a false allegation, the caller should be heavily fined of not charged..like 911 does for wasting their time or placing a false call..  Im for sure not at all the only person who feels this way and agrees to it...I refuse to deal with the cps after i am cleared of all this mess ever....even if  i see a parent is being abusive to a kid...because i have no right ruin someones life like they have mine.  I just will not ever...i dont want anything like this to happen to someone else..thats how much i care. I mind my business. Sad others dont. I would not call them or deal with them if i  were you in the future. Look the other way please.  America has the social service programs and CPS because American society is made up of a large amount of babies and immature people who cannot resolve their own problems amongst themselves and once again, as in other culturally close family knit nations...thats a shame. The CPS should be completely abolished and if i were in power or president that and  the social services would be the very first thing to abolish and get rid of. And maybe the people who work for them imprisoned and criminally charged as much of what they do is in a sense..boarder line criminal as rights violations. They use the law to hide behind to just if their actions and get away with it.. Many other countries dont have this nor do they need it...thats what culture lifestyle and families with close knit cultural ties are for. The government is simply too big, getting bigger and has too much power and they think they can just walk into your home and tell you how to live and raise and parent your kids...etc. Well, ill be honest: that is wrong. Sadly, if you are in America, you will see much more of it because America is losing freedoms and becoming socialist and by socialism the government can do a lot of things that before it couldnt including violation of rights you once had....Im not on a rant here, Im providing education to  people on this site, yourself included about what you and many others might not have ever known about the CPS. Stop dealing with them...dont give them any help..believe me they dont need any help from you or anyone else...they are vultures and will clamp down on someone and never let go...they dont need you to help in their evil to find their victims...

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#88 of 143 Old 05-23-2012, 01:38 PM
 
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I am absolutely baffled as to why this site has so many threads with posters afraid the authorities will take away their children.  I've never seen threads like this on other parenting boards.   Honestly, it makes me wonder.   

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#89 of 143 Old 05-23-2012, 01:59 PM
 
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I am absolutely baffled as to why this site has so many threads with posters afraid the authorities will take away their children.  I've never seen threads like this on other parenting boards.   Honestly, it makes me wonder.   

 

FWIW, I'm not at all concerned that my kids will be taken away. Unless I get one of the scary, power-tripping social workers (and, yes - they are out there - I've met them - but I don't believe they're the majority, by any means), there's no reason for that to happen. But, they do have that power, and that's terrifying. I've already had some well-meaning (maybe - if it's who I think it was, it wasn't well intentioned at all) person sic them on me for an attempted homebirth...and having them show up while I was in labour caused my labour to stall. I ended up losing that baby, through a complicated chain of events. I take ultimate responsibility for that chain, but having a government agency show up at my door while i was naked in the birth pool was one of the links in the chain. I've seen probably well-meaning attempts to help end up making things worse for the kids in question too many times to be anything but nervous about CPS.

 

I also once had a former school friend, who was a social worker, mishear something I said while we were all out for a reunion party. I'd made a comment to one of our other old friends about the days when we used to smoke pot at lunch break, and my "friend" heard something about drugs, and thought I was currently smoking them, with a baby in the house.  (This was many years ago, as the "baby" is now 19.) She proceeded to say, "hey - watch that talking about drugs - I could take your baby away. I am a social worker, you know", followed by a cheerful laugh. I don't think people who think it's acceptable to "amusingly" threaten to take someone's child from them are appropriate people to have that power. But, she still had it. If she'd decided to pursue some old high school vendetta against someone, it would have been her word against theirs, and I could see her doing it.

 

The fact that people say "I'm here to help", "trust me" and "I can take your child away from you" doesn't mean I have to trust them. If they ever get involved with my life, I may have to accommodate their prejudices (eg. the hangup some of them seem to have about pristine homes), but I don't have to trust them.  Having any involvement with them would simply increase my stress levels, which would not be beneficial to me or my family.

 

OTOH, if my crazy neighbour did call them last summer, they seem to have laughed off the "OMG - her two year old wasn't wearing shoes!!" complaint, as least.


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#90 of 143 Old 05-25-2012, 06:41 PM
 
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Petronella-

I've removed your post.  Please keep away from personal attacks. 


 
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