Parents keep child's sex secret - What do you think? - Page 7 - Mothering Forums

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Old 05-29-2011, 12:20 PM
 
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Originally Posted by scottishmommy View Post

O my goodness Leighi, your kid is too cute for words!

I would have made the same comment but now I am scared to use any words to compliment any child on this board.  If strong and beautiful are out, what about cute?  Are we allowed to say cute or not?   

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Old 05-29-2011, 12:58 PM
 
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I would have made the same comment but now I am scared to use any words to compliment any child on this board.  If strong and beautiful are out, what about cute?  Are we allowed to say cute or not?   

 

This comment makes it seem as though you're implying that people here are demanding that you not to say nice things about babies at all.

"Cute" is androgynous. It's not used to perpetuate a gender stereotype. "Strong" and "beautiful" are adjectives most often (not always) used to perpetuate gender stereotypes in children. If we tended to apply the terms "strong" and "beautiful"  to kids of all sexes equally, it would not be an issue. But we do, and that fact is not missed by our children, who are trained into genders by this kind of imbalance in the way we use language, etc.


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Old 05-29-2011, 01:02 PM
 
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Thanks for clearing that up.  I hope I don't stumble upon anyone who does take offense to the use of cute.  I use "beautiful" for all children too.  Seems from these boards I'd be in trouble for using it about 50% of the time. 

 

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"Cute" is androgynous. It's not used to perpetuate a gender stereotype. "Strong" and "beautiful" are adjectives most often (not always) used to perpetuate gender stereotypes in children.

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Old 05-29-2011, 02:02 PM
 
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Thanks for clearing that up.  I hope I don't stumble upon anyone who does take offense to the use of cute.  I use "beautiful" for all children too.  Seems from these boards I'd be in trouble for using it about 50% of the time. 

 


I know!! When I see a gorgeous child (male or female) I'm very likely to say, "What a beautiful baby!" Or "How strong!" when I see a little boy or girl who seems exceptionally... well, strong!! Now I am always going to wonder if I am insulting someone when I say their girl is beautiful ("gender stereotyping") or their boy is beautiful ("are you calling my boy a girl?") You can't win!! Oh and add in a few parents who think saying ANYTHING about looks is being superficial... yikes... I sure hope MOST parents don't feel insulted like that when I try to say something nice about their kiddos!!

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Old 05-29-2011, 02:15 PM
 
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This comment makes it seem as though you're implying that people here are demanding that you not to say nice things about babies at all.

 

I can understand why that person commented the way they did.... it is feeling like every word is being parsed as to the politically correct gender neutral wording.  I also thought the posters child was absolutely adorable, but also wasn't going to say anything either for the same reason.

 


"Cute" is androgynous. It's not used to perpetuate a gender stereotype. "Strong" and "beautiful" are adjectives most often (not always) used to perpetuate gender stereotypes in children. If we tended to apply the terms "strong" and "beautiful"  to kids of all sexes equally, it would not be an issue. But we do, and that fact is not missed by our children, who are trained into genders by this kind of imbalance in the way we use language, etc

 

So, wait, now "strong" and "beautiful" are out?  Who determines that?  

 

I have 3 boys.  I am constantly telling them how beautiful they are.  All. The. Time.  In reference to not only how they look, but in reference to who they are inside.

 

Is everyone supposed to walk around, not say anything?  Or, when they say something they are supposed to qualify it with the intent behind why they said it?

 

Is everything supposed to be taken out of common everyday language because of subjective viewpoints that might construe everything that could possibly be viewed as not gender neutral and offensive as such?

 

And, frankly, how can you train a gender anyway?  That almost suggests that you could train someone to be gay or lesbian.

 

If you look at one of the most recent stories out there with Chaz Bono...... he said that he always felt like he was in the wrong body.  Born Chastity, with frilly dresses and all.  Heck, his Mom is Cher.  And, still, he knew on the inside that the outside didn't match.  How many times did Chaz get called all sorts of adjectives that are associated typically with girls.... yet, today, he is living as a man.  

 

Maybe I'm just missing something so incredibly huge here, but why give so much power over to what other people say?

 

My kids have been bullied.  Picked on.  Teased.  I was too.

 

Does that make everything true?  Do I teach my kids to live by what other people say about them, or by what they know to be true about themselves?  

 

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Old 05-29-2011, 02:34 PM
 
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Originally Posted by APToddlerMama View Post



I would have made the same comment but now I am scared to use any words to compliment any child on this board.  If strong and beautiful are out, what about cute?  Are we allowed to say cute or not?   



smile.gif I take no offence with any compliment.  Ds is strong, beautiful, and cute!  (smart/polite/happy are my favorite compliments, but those come more from meeting him vs a photo)

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Old 05-29-2011, 11:57 PM
 
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Interesting thread! The OP asked what people thought about keeping this child's sex a secret - and I think this situation seems odd, really. There are a number of things that feel uncomfortable about it to me -

First, that the older children are being asked to keep it a secret. I agree with another poster who said that when something is kept a secret, there is the implication that something is wrong. It seems even odder that they obviously know that their sex was disclosed, but for some reason, the youngest sibling's sex is not. Then, that it went a step further and the parents flipped a coin to decide if they would refer to the child as male or female when they were going on vacation -so that they either did lie, or were willing to lie, in front of their other kids really sends, I think, a confusing message.

Second, I don't get why the mom didn't stick up for her son in the store and buy him the pink boa. Again, it seems like a weird message to your kids to keep the siblings sex a secret in an attempt to not have the baby burdened with gender stereotypes, but then when the older child has a very real experience with gender stereotyping, the mom doesn't go to bat for him.

Really, I think that what the parents are doing doesn't, and won't, be of any real service to Storm. I think any child would benefit from parents who are mindful, sensitive and supportive to their kid regardless of what they are in to (and really stick up for them to another adult should the child decide to cross traditional gender lines) and honest.

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Old 05-30-2011, 04:10 AM
 
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Originally Posted by mamadebug View Post

First, that the older children are being asked to keep it a secret. I agree with another poster who said that when something is kept a secret, there is the implication that something is wrong. It seems even odder that they obviously know that their sex was disclosed, but for some reason, the youngest sibling's sex is not. Then, that it went a step further and the parents flipped a coin to decide if they would refer to the child as male or female when they were going on vacation -so that they either did lie, or were willing to lie, in front of their other kids really sends, I think, a confusing message.

 


Bolding mine. ITA. It must be some dirty, shameful secret that the older siblings are doing storm such a big favor protecting him/her from. Really wrong message to send. I don't think all the stereotypes out there are right, but we need another solution, and this is NOT it.
 

 

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Old 05-30-2011, 04:55 AM
 
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Probably because some of us have seen the worst of people and want to protect our kids from that.

 

Here is what I got (from members of my family mostly...but not entirely) when I was a kid:

 

You can't pick that (heavy thing) up...you're a girl.

Let me help you (with something that I was perfectly fine with on my own).  Saying "no thank you" never stopped the "help".

Keep your opinions to yourself...this is a guy conversation.

You're not allowed to have an opinion about this...you're a girl (in regards to politics and social issues)

You can't be a (insert male-dominated profession here)...you're a girl. Marry a good man so you won't have to work.

Why do you want to go to college?  Can't you meet a nice boy in high school?

Are you going to college to get your MRS.?

Girls don't hold doors open for people

Girls are not welcome to help set up risers for school concerts.  Risers are too heavy for girls (I fought this one...infamously...and won).

Why don't you ever wear dresses?  Are you gay?  Why don't you wear makeup?  Are you gay? Why do you only wear comfortable shoes?  You a lesbian?

Don't you worry your pretty little head about it.

Are you getting fat?  If you get fat nobody will want you.

Don't disagree with me.  You're young and only a girl.  What can you possibly know?

You can't possibly do (insert practically anything here) on your own.

 

And on and on and on.

 

So yeah, I am REALLY sensitive to gender stereotypes.  Because I spent a great deal of my life fighting against ignorant people who felt my value to be nothing more than pretty, vacuous arm candy.  Anything beyond that and I was a challenge to their worldview.  And yes, my family are schmucks and I moved away as soon as I could tyvm.  But the point is that people like this are out there folks.  All of these people, for example are alive and thriving right at this very minute in the greater Detroit area.  You should go visit, Canada-paradise folks...have fun!  Oh, and I have also encountered similar stuff in Oklahoma and Nebraska (oh!  and Texas..can't forget Texas).  It is out there...

 

 


You can add to that:

It's not ladylike to... (chew gum, play ball, climb trees, 5 million ohter things)

You can be so pretty when you want to be.

No man will put up with that (speaking my mind, laughing loudly, not cooking....)

Because that is a womans job! (laundry, cooking...)

You'll never find a man with that attitude (after all, finding a man is my purpose in life, because without one my life has no real meaning, purpose or value.)

No man will ever have you now (meannig a lack of virginity means I am a worthless piece of chattel)

Men don't like women who are too bright (try and be stupid you idiot)

....

 

For those of you that never heard such things, just move on and don't worry your pretty little head over it.

 



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Nothing great ever happened by everyone just sticking with the program and doing as they were told. If we want the world to be a better place, sometimes radical changes have to take place. And remember, things we think of as normal now used to be radical once. We've got to have the vision to push through and progress together. One day we won't know what someone "is" just by looking at them, and that's okay.


This is so true. For almost everything in life. Radical ideas spur growth and creativity. Of course they also spur a lot of evil. But we won't progress at all, for good or bad, if we are only sheep.

 

And just because you do agree with the group (like I do about the original issue being not the best idea for storm or the rest of the family), does not make you a sheep. No one has to have a radical opinion about all issues for their opinion to be valid.
 

 

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Old 05-31-2011, 07:56 AM
 
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pp's child is beautiful... my child is beautiful...  ALL children are beautiful.  :)

 

however, if you guys wanna see something that will REALLY mess a child up (much more than gender neutral parenting) ask some grown up children who had their entire childhood centered around their appearance.  when people praise and appear to value one for beauty alone, it's a sad thing.  some lessons early on continue throughout life:  don't ever try to do anything else, all you need is to look good.  don't worry about being a good person (you look good). look good at all costs, even starve or puke to do so.  surround yourself with people who continue to praise you.  find yourself terribly alone when your beauty doesn't exist in the same way.  spend lots of money as you age to try to cling to that image of perfection. 

this and much, much more. 

 

OT a bit, sorry. 


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Old 05-31-2011, 01:05 PM
 
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Old 05-31-2011, 05:07 PM
 
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Well, if it seems as though I'm implying that, its because I am ;).  This is the third thread I can think of in the past few weeks in which people were basically spanked for making any comments on a child's appearance period.  And while I agree that it isn't appropriate or healthy to focus heavily on an infant or child's appearance, I also think it is overkill to freak out when someone calls someone else beautiful, male or female.  Half the time when I say to a friend "your newborn is beautiful!", I am really not even meaning the child's appearance.  I am meaning many other things...more a celebration of "what a wonderful new life! how beautiful. congratulations."

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This comment makes it seem as though you're implying that people here are demanding that you not to say nice things about babies at all.
 

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Old 05-31-2011, 08:47 PM
 
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Well, if it seems as though I'm implying that, its because I am ;).  This is the third thread I can think of in the past few weeks in which people were basically spanked for making any comments on a child's appearance period.  And while I agree that it isn't appropriate or healthy to focus heavily on an infant or child's appearance, I also think it is overkill to freak out when someone calls someone else beautiful, male or female.  Half the time when I say to a friend "your newborn is beautiful!", I am really not even meaning the child's appearance.  I am meaning many other things...more a celebration of "what a wonderful new life! how beautiful. congratulations."


 

Nobody here is implying that it is a problem to call anyone beautiful - we're just marveling at the polarization of adjectives based on perceived gender.


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Old 06-01-2011, 07:41 AM
 
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I agree. They are beautiful, darn it. And I reserve the right to tell people as much as I please :)
 

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Well, if it seems as though I'm implying that, its because I am ;).  This is the third thread I can think of in the past few weeks in which people were basically spanked for making any comments on a child's appearance period.  And while I agree that it isn't appropriate or healthy to focus heavily on an infant or child's appearance, I also think it is overkill to freak out when someone calls someone else beautiful, male or female.  Half the time when I say to a friend "your newborn is beautiful!", I am really not even meaning the child's appearance.  I am meaning many other things...more a celebration of "what a wonderful new life! how beautiful. congratulations."



 


 

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Old 06-01-2011, 09:25 AM
 
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Nobody here is implying that it is a problem to call anyone beautiful - we're just marveling at the polarization of adjectives based on perceived gender.

That wasn't what I read.   

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Old 06-01-2011, 09:33 AM
 
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That wasn't what I read.   


Yeah, what you read was probably my post(s).  And I'll say it again...focusing on a child's looks bugs the crap outta me. Gender roles aside, people call my son beautiful all the time (although, again people can't always tell he is a boy because of how he is dressed).  Its pretty much a conversation killer.  So go ahead and be "nice" but you cannot expect me to get excited about it. 

 

You wouldn't walk up to an adult you didn't know well and tell them they were beautiful, right?  That would be hella rude.  Why is it ok with a kid?

 

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Old 06-01-2011, 10:04 AM
 
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Yeah, what you read was probably my post(s).  And I'll say it again...focusing on a child's looks bugs the crap outta me. Gender roles aside, people call my son beautiful all the time (although, again people can't always tell he is a boy because of how he is dressed).  Its pretty much a conversation killer.  So go ahead and be "nice" but you cannot expect me to get excited about it. 

 

You wouldn't walk up to an adult you didn't know well and tell them they were beautiful, right?  That would be hella rude.  Why is it ok with a kid?

 


You could walk up to me and tell me I'm beautiful anytime you like. It would make my day. Seriously, with all the mom frump, it really would!

Chamomile, it does sound like you endured some real bigotry and misogyny when you were growing. I was pretty appalled to read your list of things your family members had said to you over the years. I can understand how a compliment on physical beauty would not end there for you. Your mind might be adding adjectives to "beautiful" (stupid, useless, etc) that really were not intended. If I told you you or your kids that you were beautiful, it would only mean that. It would imply nothing else. Just a compliment. Full stop. No insinuations, no expectations. It honestly wouldn't occur to me that it would be considered rude or offensive to compliment someone on their appearance. I have done so in the past and likely will again. 

 

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Old 06-01-2011, 10:12 AM
 
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You could walk up to me and tell me I'm beautiful anytime you like. It would make my day. Seriously, with all the mom frump, it really would!
 


Me too!!

 

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Old 06-01-2011, 10:29 AM
 
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You wouldn't walk up to an adult you didn't know well and tell them they were beautiful, right?  That would be hella rude.  Why is it ok with a kid?

 

 

you are very correct as far as I am concerned---if an older man (complete stranger )walks up to a teen or pre-teen girl or boy and says how "beautiful" they are--most parents would freak

 

my DH would not like another male walking up to us (again complete stranger) and saying how beautiful I was

 

I get exactly what you mean and what you said

 

 

IMO- a lot of the "comments" that are so hard for some to grasp I feel have much to do with age and location (where you live)--if you haven't experienced some of that it could be for a number of reasons but yes they are very true, I have heard them, I have heard others use them and I have seen many deeply effected by them


 

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Old 06-01-2011, 10:52 AM
 
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you are very correct as far as I am concerned---if an older man (complete stranger )walks up to a teen or pre-teen girl or boy and says how "beautiful" they are--most parents would freak

 

my DH would not like another male walking up to us (again complete stranger) and saying how beautiful I was

 

I get exactly what you mean and what you said

 

 

IMO- a lot of the "comments" that are so hard for some to grasp I feel have much to do with age and location (where you live)--if you haven't experienced some of that it could be for a number of reasons but yes they are very true, I have heard them, I have heard others use them and I have seen many deeply effected by them


Doesn't this have a lot to do the intentions though? In the circumstances you describe, completely without context, many of us would assume (or at least quietly suspect) that the complimenter had ulterior inappropriate sexual intentions. Predatory intentions.  That's different than offering someone a sincere compliment. 

 

I mean, I get what you're saying. I do understand. It's just that don't like that world vision, a world in which I can't give or receive a compliment for fear of being perceived as a predator or attracting a predator. That's the same world where teachers can't hug children when they fall down and scrape their knee and need a hug (and unfortunately, we all live in that world). Too much fear for me. Too much distrust. Of course there are predators out there, but I'd like to assume that MOST people aren't, that MOST people, when they offer a compliment, are sincere. 

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Old 06-01-2011, 11:05 AM
 
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 Predatory intentions.  That's different than offering someone a sincere compliment. 

 

 

I see no difference---again, age!  it's acceptable to say it to a child/infant

 

-----is it not sincere if an old person gives it in the examples I stated?

 

what makes one correct and the other not?  both stranger----age isn't it?

 

I can give countless stories from my local paper on infants/children being abused

 

to me it is not predatory---you JUMPED to that conclusion ---nothing said it was but you jumped!

 

there are plenty of people that I found very creep that think nothing of talking to my child/infant


 

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Old 06-01-2011, 11:18 AM
 
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It's probably also from me you got the anti-beautiful thing.  I sincerely do NOT appreciate people telling my child (especially since we only get the beautiful thing when people think dd is a girl) that she is beautiful.  Because when somebody hears that over and over again, also when it is tied specifically to a sex or characteristics that people project onto girl children, it is disempowering and sends the message that appearances are the only thing of value that they own.

 

'Girl' children are told that 'beautiful' is what they should be, most of what they should aspire to.  look at the princess crap all around you, and see if that is not the main message that children get from it.  beautiful is not something my child, your child, any child has any control over.  it is not an accomplishment, nor is it a talent or a character trait.  i just don't see why physical appearance is the one thing people feel that it is appropriate to comment on.  'beautiful' is a judgment call.  you are judging my child to be worthy of your aesthetic standards. 

 

it just feels icky to me.  it seems patronizing and it also deprives a child of a sense of actual accomplishment.  that's a whole other topic but i wanted to explain.  it stings much more so because for the most part, people ONLY ever say that to the 'girl' child and not to the 'boy' child.  repeated enough times, that message becomes 'you are pretty.  you don't need to/shouldn't strive for anything else because that is all that people appreciate about you.  you only get compliments when you look pretty (and thus submit to the judgement of others).' 

 

and.  you know.  it's pretty funny to me that people are acting as though it's shocking and the 'language police' don't want them to say beautiful and yet it is perfectly ok to call someone's parenting style ridiculous.  i would much prefer you censor yourself when you are directly INSULTING someone's choices rather than pretending to be insulted or prohibited from saying something because a small minority disagree with your word choice.  if you are concerned about insulting someone, then maybe you should first listen to their preferences, then acknowledge that and agree that parents do have some sort of control over the way that you interact with their children.  if you do not agree, then fine!  if i respectfully ask that you not call me or my child something, i fail to see why that is a big stinking deal?

 


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I see no difference---again, age!  it's acceptable to say it to a child/infant

 


is it not sincere if an old person gives it in the examples I stated?

 

what makes one correct and the other not?  both stranger----age isn't it?

 

I can give countless stories from my local paper on infants/children being abused

 

to me it is not predatory---you JUMPED to that conclusion ---nothing said it was but you jumped!

 

there are plenty of people that I found very creep that think nothing of talking to my child/infant


I think it's because words like "beautiful" take on a sexual connotation at some point (I guess somewhere around puberty)... So before that point, it's considered an innocent comment -- as long as it's not said in a creepy way or something -- but after that point, it's considered more sexual. But if you set aside the appearance-based meaning of beauty, yes adults DO tell each other they are beautiful in ways that are not ill-intentioned or weird... more like an inner beauty thing... I hear this particularly from people who are really sincere, warm, open people.

But the thing is, in general we just compliment children way more than adults. I assume it's because people want to be kind and encouraging and uplifting to the most vulnerable and impressionable members of our society... and because people just don't know what to say, so try to say something kind of neutral (or at least that MOST people view as neutral/non-controversial...)

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Old 06-01-2011, 11:37 AM
 
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yes adults DO tell each other they are beautiful in ways that are not ill-intentioned or weird... 

random strangers in my city do not come up to me and say this

 

 

this is a comment that I feel is reserved for non-strangers (people you know-friends,etc.) to say to a person they know---it is far different to make a comment to a child you know as to one you do not know (the jest of this thread)---how it is perceived and or welcomed in society--to me this is not about what a friend says to another 

 

 

 

 

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i would much prefer you censor yourself when you are directly INSULTING someone's choices rather than pretending to be insulted or prohibited from saying something because a small minority disagree with your word choice

same here!


 

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Old 06-01-2011, 11:49 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by serenbat View Post

 

 

random strangers in my city do not come up to me and say this

 

 

this is a comment that I feel is reserved for non-strangers (people you know-friends,etc.) to say to a person they know---it is far different to make a comment to a child you know as to one you do not know (the jest of this thread)---how it is perceived and or welcomed in society--to me this is not about what a friend says to another 


OK I get what you're saying, though I do think strangers say things like, "I love your ____" (haircut, earrings, tattoo, shirt, whatever)... and that's kind of a round-a-bout way of saying, "You're beautiful"... In general, no, strangers don't come right out & say it.

I guess I still don't see the big deal, why compliments are such a horrible thing. I don't think that MOST people who say things like that about a child are not trying to say "only looks matter" or contribute to gender stereotypes or send unwelcome messages to your child. Most people are just trying to break the ice a bit, or fill an awkward silence, or trying to brighten your day a little, or just communicate that you are seen, you aren't in a vacuum...

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Old 06-01-2011, 12:26 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by crunchy_mommy View Post



Quote:
Originally Posted by serenbat View Post

 

 

random strangers in my city do not come up to me and say this

 

 

this is a comment that I feel is reserved for non-strangers (people you know-friends,etc.) to say to a person they know---it is far different to make a comment to a child you know as to one you do not know (the jest of this thread)---how it is perceived and or welcomed in society--to me this is not about what a friend says to another 




OK I get what you're saying, though I do think strangers say things like, "I love your ____" (haircut, earrings, tattoo, shirt, whatever)... and that's kind of a round-a-bout way of saying, "You're beautiful"... In general, no, strangers don't come right out & say it.

I guess I still don't see the big deal, why compliments are such a horrible thing. I don't think that MOST people who say things like that about a child are not trying to say "only looks matter" or contribute to gender stereotypes or send unwelcome messages to your child. Most people are just trying to break the ice a bit, or fill an awkward silence, or trying to brighten your day a little, or just communicate that you are seen, you aren't in a vacuum...

 

When I am assuming the best of people I just figure they don't know how to talk to kids so they talk about them.  Especially true when you have young kids who tend to stare at people.
 

 

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Old 06-01-2011, 12:36 PM
 
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I guess I still don't see the big deal, why compliments are such a horrible thing.

 

 

"compliments" about objects are far different (the purse, shoe, etc) -IMO

"compliments" about your appearance are different - with different meaning -IMO


 

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Old 06-01-2011, 01:18 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by serenbat View Post

 

 

 

 

I see no difference---again, age!  it's acceptable to say it to a child/infant

 

-----is it not sincere if an old person gives it in the examples I stated?

 

what makes one correct and the other not?  both stranger----age isn't it?

 

I can give countless stories from my local paper on infants/children being abused

 

to me it is not predatory---you JUMPED to that conclusion ---nothing said it was but you jumped!

 

there are plenty of people that I found very creep that think nothing of talking to my child/infant

 

I jumped there because of the examples you gave. An old man complimenting a pre-pubescent or teenage girl or boy. And your husband not appreciating other men telling you you're beautiful. In our culture, those are pretty loaded images: possible pedophile and letchy adulterer, respectively. That's what made me think that predatory behaviour was an underlying issue to be distinguished from me telling a co-worker she looks really pretty today.

 

But your post made me think: would I say the same thing to a stranger of any age? I would probably comment on cute babies...because really, what else do I know of them except what they look like, and you know, they ARE cute! But no gender distinction. I would probably say cute before beautiful, but in my mind, either is OK for either gender. There are grown men I would term beautiful too. But you're right, I wouldn't compliment a *strange* adult on their personal appearance in a general sense. I might say something like, "hey, I love your hairstyle!" (and might ask where they got it done), but I wouldn't tell a grown man or woman that they are generally, overall beautiful. 

 

So why would I say it to a baby but not an adult? Maybe because I'm trying more to connect with the mom? It's really more for her? In the same spirit that I try and offer stranger's compliments if I see an opportunity? Anyway, stuff to think about! I do enjoy these discussions, sometimes my own behaviours and beliefs are really challenged, and that's a good thing!
 

 

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Old 06-01-2011, 05:13 PM
 
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"compliments" about objects are far different (the purse, shoe, etc) -IMO

"compliments" about your appearance are different - with different meaning -IMO

 

You know, as I let this kind of swirl in my head, along with the rest of this thread, maybe part of it all for me is that given what all we are going through as a family, I would welcome anything positive said about my kids.

 

I've heard lots of things said to me, or said to my kids, from people that actually know us, that aren't nice.  That aren't about what they look like, or about a gender stereotype, but really are about something they are medically born with and can't help.    

 

Maybe, for me, I think about the fact that it is far and few between when I hear anything nice said, instead of something being held against, that I think that it seems like a luxury to be able to dismiss even a well intended compliment as something horrible.  

 

And, for me, I think, that living trying to speculate about all of the things that other people could say, do, intend, mean, etc., and make sure you cover all of the variables, with the idea that you have to cover all your bases "just in case"  years down the road because maybe it will or will not be ...... well..... I don't know how a person can really manage it.

 

I buy things because they are on sale, they are easy to clean, they are a color that doesn't stain easily, and likely I can pass it from one kid to the next.  Making sure that everything from toys to clothes that I buy are perfectly PC is just out of the realm of my capabilities as I strive to just make it through a day.  

 

I hope everything turns out well for these people and their children.  

 

I guess I will have to be forgiving of my self enough that the mistakes I make, in possibly trying to be nice, will be enough.  I kind of get the feeling that no matter what someone tries to do, however well intended, and done with the hope of not offending anyone in any way, will always be able to be found offensive by someone.  Especially if people try hard enough to find fault.

 

This whole discussion started out very interesting to me, and has just left me feeling incredibly sad.   

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Old 06-01-2011, 05:30 PM
 
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This whole discussion started out very interesting to me, and has just left me feeling incredibly sad.   



I'm sorry it has made you sad.  I think that all of us have a similar motivation...to make it through a day the best we can while protecting and raising our kids the best we know how.  But everyone comes from different shaping forces so they see different priorities in the "protecting and raising" part.  I don't see anything wrong with that.

 

And I honestly don't see striving for a gender-neutral lifestyle for my kid as looking at everything through a PC filter.  Young kids are pretty androgynous already.  I see it more as honoring that androgyny and not pushing a gender identity onto my two-year old that is more appropriate for a ten-year old.  I don't do this because I have to but because I really, really want to, so its not onerous to me.  When I buy stuff for the kid I also look for stuff that will last...and yes sometimes it is frustrating that I cannot find an affordable gender neutral option at Target.  When that happens I cripe a lot to my husband look else where smile.gif.

 

 

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