At what age would you allow your child to try alcohol? - Page 3 - Mothering Forums

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#61 of 90 Old 09-21-2011, 05:54 AM
 
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I grew up Catholic.  I am also in Canada.  From the time of first communion onward (age 7) we were permitted to dip the host in the wine if we liked.  I rarely did.  Dh (also Catholic) reports no one dipped it in the wine - only the priest drank it.  

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#62 of 90 Old 09-21-2011, 07:04 AM
 
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Here's a link to a state-by-state guide on underage alcohol consumption laws and exceptions (which also include religious exceptions).

 

http://drinkingage.procon.org/view.resource.php?resourceID=002591

 

This is only for the U.S.  I'm sure that laws vary country to country as they do state to state here.

 

 


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#63 of 90 Old 09-21-2011, 10:05 AM
 
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I can imagine the Catholics not pitching a total hissy if their children weren't allowed to take Communion beacuse of drinking age laws. But then, I'm not a Catholic. Any Catholics know the scoop on this one? :allears

 

(Plural marriage is not illegal, BTW. It's a constitutionally protected right of association. Registering civil marriages with more than one spouse at one time is illegal.)


I live in a state where minors can only consume alcohol for educational purposes -- not for religious etc. but I am Catholic & kids do partake in the wine here. Most kids don't (I assume just because they don't like the taste?) but some do & it's never been an issue. Plus, kids with celiac may only be able to take the Eucharist under the form of wine since they can't have the bread. I have no idea if it's technically illegal or not (sounds like it is but it's not enforced?) but it certainly would infringe on our religious freedom/rights if it were enforced.

As far as the OP, I have no problem with kids of any age (even a year old) having very very small sips of alcohol, and also no problem with small glasses of wine with dinner if it's for health reasons or cultural custom. I do feel it's inappropriate for minors to consume large amounts, hard liquor (aside from a sip or two), get drunk or even a bit tipsy, etc. I also don't agree with mixing meds with alcohol (so if the kid was on ADHD meds, that seems dangerous to me)... But I feel like the legal drinking age should be much lower and that our society's attitude toward alcohol could use some help!

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#64 of 90 Old 09-21-2011, 10:18 AM
 
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The research that I've read has always made a distinction between underage drinking associated with a religious ritual (Communion, Seder, etc.) and  underage drinking with peers. Kids who taste wine with communion are no more likely than kids who don't drink at all at a young age to become alcoholics. The kids who are at risk are the kids like this 12 year old who is drinking 'for pleasure' at well under age.


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#65 of 90 Old 09-21-2011, 01:28 PM
 
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Originally Posted by CatsCradle View Post
 

Here's a link to a state-by-state guide on underage alcohol consumption laws and exceptions (which also include religious exceptions).

 

http://drinkingage.procon.org/view.resource.php?resourceID=002591

 

This is only for the U.S. I'm sure that laws vary country to country as they do state to state here.

 

 



Thanks!  That is super interesting.  I was shocked to see 7 states allow underage consumptions WITHOUT parental permission.  Isn't that basically legal underage drinking?

 

I think it's great that three states have explicit laws that you will not get in trouble trying to get a minor medical help for drinking even if you, yourself (a minor) have been drinking.

 

 


 

 

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#66 of 90 Old 09-21-2011, 02:54 PM
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Originally Posted by Smithie View Post

I can imagine the Catholics not pitching a total hissy if their children weren't allowed to take Communion beacuse of drinking age laws. But then, I'm not a Catholic. Any Catholics know the scoop on this one? :allears

 

(Plural marriage is not illegal, BTW. It's a constitutionally protected right of association. Registering civil marriages with more than one spouse at one time is illegal.)

 

So....the law does not recognize plural marriage. You cannot be legally married to more than one person. Same thing as saying plural marriage is illegal, IMO.

 

I live in a state with a large Catholic population. I'm sure law enforcers simply look the other way with regards to Communion. Many of them are probably Catholic, themselves, and I'm sure most kids aren't chugging the wine during services.
 

 

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#67 of 90 Old 09-21-2011, 03:04 PM
 
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I wonder what the definition is of alcohol consumption (legally, I mean).

Catholic communion is generally just a small sip of wine.

I imagine many parents allow young children sips of alcoholic beverages.

Logically, it seems those things should be OK -- just like a pregnant woman having a sip of champagne during a toast certainly isn't going to harm her baby, even though the general 'rule' is to completely avoid drinking during pregnancy.

I can't imagine a judge condemning someone for allowing their child to have a small sip of something in their own home, but certainly allowing them an entire drink (or more) might be seen in a different light.

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#68 of 90 Old 09-21-2011, 04:29 PM
 
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WRT communion: Catholic churches would require the drink to be wine (wine blessed by a priest, I believe, not just any wine); not grape juice. Because they hold to transubstantiation, I guess it's considered more important that the bread and wine be "proper" bread and wine? I remember there was a furore a while back over whether the bread (wafers) had to contain gluten or not; it was decided that it did. So celiacs just drink the wine.

 

I go to a Reformed Baptist church, at which we have grape juice and gluten-free bread. The GF bread is just because we have a few celiacs in the congregation, and is probably about as dissimilar to the unleavened bread mentioned in the New Testament as Catholic wafers (ie. pretty darned dissimilar). The grape juice - in fact, I don't think it's even grape juice, I think it's Ribena! - is apparently because of the possibility of having recovering alcoholics in the congregation. Personally I'd rather have wine, because it is wine in the Bible; and I've been to a church which served both, so alcoholics or whoever didn't want wine could take grape juice instead, which seems like a better method to me. On the other hand, we don't believe in transubstantiation - we believe the bread and wine simply symbolise the body and blood of Christ; which being the case, it doesn't matter so much what the symbols are. I guess you could say that the Ribena symbolises the wine, which symbolises Christ? :p Also, I must admit, I don't like wine...

 

I'd be pretty irritated if laws didn't allow us to have wine, though. I highly doubt impressionable kids are going to flock to church in order to get roaring drunk on a tablespoonful of wine in a Communion cup, you know? And there's no evidence I know of that suggests that a tablespoonful of wine does any harm to children (not that we routinely do paedocommunion in our church anyway, so it wouldn't be much of an issue; I think a few older kids partake, but no little ones). So what would be the problem, exactly?


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#69 of 90 Old 09-21-2011, 06:13 PM
 
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 I highly doubt impressionable kids are going to flock to church in order to get roaring drunk on a tablespoonful of wine in a Communion cup, you know?

lol.gif This raised images for me of someone coming around the communion line many times just to get roaring drunk. The real danger with Catholic communion is that the priest has to drink any remaining wine. While it's watered down, there's more than one priest who's had problems with alcohol because of it.

 

I attend a Lutheran church now, and they pay lip service to transubstantiation. We do give communion to children as soon as their parents think they're ready. Some kids are as young as 2-3, some wait until they're 12-13. My kids started at 5-6, when I felt they could understand the basic significance. We offer both wine and grape juice. Kids are free to choose which one they want. Most kids choose grape juice because the wine isn't all that good (cheap, cheap, cheap). Some kids do wine. Some teenagers do wine. Some adults do grape juice. (And we have gluten free wafers for those that request it.) And we pour the remaining wine into the ground, which I guess is considered to be OK. I've never delved into the theology.

 

But, religious sips of wine are not the same as offering wine at a party. It's combined with the religious ritual and nearly everyone sees it as separate.
 

 


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#70 of 90 Old 09-21-2011, 06:37 PM
 
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So....the law does not recognize plural marriage. You cannot be legally married to more than one person. Same thing as saying plural marriage is illegal, IMO.

 


No, those two things aren't saying the same thing. As far as I know, the law does not recognize me sitting at this computer right now, but that doesn't mean it's illegal. It's just that there aren't any laws about where I am or am not allowed to sit in my house.

 

I can't think of any instance where a "spiritual" marriage is illegal (unless it involves sex with a minor or something). Even same-sex couples can have them. They're just not "official" in the eyes of the government, because the government only cares about civil marriages.

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#71 of 90 Old 09-21-2011, 06:56 PM
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I can't think of any instance where a "spiritual" marriage is illegal (unless it involves sex with a minor or something). Even same-sex couples can have them. They're just not "official" in the eyes of the government, because the government only cares about civil marriages.


I never said a spiritual marriage is illegal. But a marriage done in a church that isn't processed by civil authorities is not recognized as a legally binding marriage according to the laws of the state. Attempting to be civilly married to more than one person is illegal in every state.

 

When I said that plural marriage is illegal, I was referring to civil marriages, which should be apparent by now and I'm so so sooooo sorry I didn't specify that to begin with. It didn't occur to me that anyone would pick it apart. I happen to not know anyone who claims marital status who is not married in a civil sense....including same-sex couples.

 

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#72 of 90 Old 09-21-2011, 08:20 PM
 
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We're Eastern Orthodox, and my kids have received Communion (yes, with wine) from the time thye were baptized (~3 mos). And no - the State cannot prohibit the use of alcohol in religious ceremonies. Separation of Church and State for $500, anyone?

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#73 of 90 Old 09-21-2011, 09:48 PM
 
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I think it's pretty cool so many people have such and open view on alcohol, this thread has really made me look at the reasons alcohol and the thought of openly allowing my kids to try it bothers me so much.

DH and I both came from families who literally consumed alcohol from the sun up to sun down. And it bothers us both. I can drink periodically but DH refuses. And when I do drink I don't do it around my kids. And I'm not even sure why I choose to do it. I wish I could view it differently, I just have a hard time doing so.
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#74 of 90 Old 09-21-2011, 10:07 PM
 
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does anyone know if they have actually found an 'alcoholic' gene? or was it just conjecture?

 

we came from a no big deal social alcohol family. i never drink and my bro was only a social drinker. 


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#75 of 90 Old 09-21-2011, 10:12 PM
 
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does anyone know if they have actually found an 'alcoholic' gene? or was it just conjecture?

 

we came from a no big deal social alcohol family. i never drink and my bro was only a social drinker. 


I believe there are several genes that can cause a predisposition towards addiction, although I don't remember the names of the particular genes. I had my DNA tested this past summer, and came back positive for a few of the genes that do cause predisposition. I believe I had two alleles for most, as well. My father is a recovered alcoholic, as is his father. My mother's father was an alcoholic and only stopped when he was in a convalescent home with cirrhosis of the liver. My husband also inherited the genes. We drink occasionally at weddings, etc., but we don't normally keep alcohol in the house. I don't think I'd offer up alcohol until our children are of legal age and understand their family history.

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#76 of 90 Old 09-22-2011, 06:25 AM
 
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Maybe if they asked me about it. We do have some in the house but, it's pretty rare and when we do it's dark beer. DD1 is already uncomfortable around it because of my dad, he came two years ago. He drank our cooking wine because I had asked him not to drink while the kids were up. He thought he was being sneaky. Then two bottles in he was a total ass. It's his liquid courage apparently. He started bad mouthing DH and calling him all sorts of rotten things. He even bad mouthed his Moms and that was when DH pretty much stopped talking to my dad altogether. They used to be friends. Either way DD1 was old enough to ask questions and I told her pops drank some alcohol. I didnt realize it would leave such and impression on her. She was very uncomfortable and still is about it.
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#77 of 90 Old 09-22-2011, 07:22 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by meemee View Post

does anyone know if they have actually found an 'alcoholic' gene? or was it just conjecture?

 

we came from a no big deal social alcohol family. i never drink and my bro was only a social drinker. 


I think it's much easier to be a "no big deal social alcohol" family when their aren't a bunch of drunks in the extended family. redface.gif

 

May be it's not the relaxed attitude that helps teens moderate actions with alcohol, but rather it's the lack of addictive genes in the family that allow the parents to be relaxed. 

 

May be I've had cause and effort backwards up til now. 

 


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#78 of 90 Old 09-22-2011, 07:31 AM
 
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Imakcerka- my kids, especially the teenagers, do not like being around my father and brother, because of their drinking/behavior. My 8 year old hasn't felt uncomfortable yet, but my older ones have been refusing to go with my dad alone since about age 10 or so. Hell, I am uncomfortable around him. Not that he really cares to spend time with us, anyway, since we don't drink all the time. He spends lots of time with my alcoholic brother though! And growing up, he did not allow us around his side of the family because they were alcoholics...it's come full-circle and it's not funny. My dad and I are alot alike and would get along very well if it weren't for this. My daughter would not even invite him to her Sweet 16 (not a sweet 16 like on MTV but a home cook-out with everyone else she knows invited), no one wants him at their sports games or anything.

 

I DO UNDERSTAND how you feel on this! It took me so long to come around and realize that *some* drinking is ok and won't corrupt the kids and/or turn us into alcoholics. I can see the damage it can do, and I can see how it's ok to drink some. When people USE it, that's when I see it as a problem. If you have to have it to relax, that's a problem, imo.(like smoking, or pills, or eating...) And when you HAVE to have one upon waking up in the mornings and that's your main beverage all day, yeah that makes you an alcoholic, no matter what you say or think. When you have blood pressure and blood sugar problems, and are always drinking beer instead of eating, yeah you're an alcoholic, no matter what you say or think. When you can't afford to take your dog to the vet when a puppy is stuck halfway out of her, but you can afford your 24-pack of beer *everyday*, you have a problem.(and he called ME to come help with this poor dog...none of them made it and it scarred me for life). It's very scary!! And for years, it seemed so easy to become an alcoholic...but I have learned otherwise. We've had a bonfire out back and had friends and certain family over and drank and had fun. No one drove drunk afterwards, some spent the night, some had headaches the next morning.

 

It's funny that the only people who pressure others to drink are alcoholics...I've never been teased about not drinking(or not drinking enough) by anyone except people who can't live without drinking everyday.


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#79 of 90 Old 09-22-2011, 07:49 AM
 
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We're Eastern Orthodox, and my kids have received Communion (yes, with wine) from the time thye were baptized (~3 mos). And no - the State cannot prohibit the use of alcohol in religious ceremonies. Separation of Church and State for $500, anyone?


Well, some states do prohibit providing alcohol to minors in religious ceremonies, while most do not.  I do think it is a little more complex than simply a separation of church and state issue because I think the main issue is that alcohol use/sale/prohibition is part of most states' criminal codes because it is considered a controlled substance.  I believe that individual states can determine exceptions or they can decide whether or a law should be applied and enforced equally across the board for everyone.  Even in those states, however, that prohibit use for minors in religious ceremonies, I doubt that prohibition is actively enforced. 

 

Semi-off-topic, I keep thinking of the famous peyote case that went before the Supreme Court in which the Supreme Court held that the free exercise clause did not prohibit the state of Oregon from prohibiting sacremental use of peyote in native american religious ceremonies.  Mountains of scholarly articles, etc. have been written on this because the court abandoned the long utilized governmental interest test and instead focused on the the idea that facially neutral laws having general application to the whole population did not burden free exercise of religion (sorry, it's been a long time since I read the case).  Essentially, though, the court left it up to the states to decide, and most states have decided that otherwise illegal consumption of certain substances is permissible in a religious setting. 

 


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#80 of 90 Old 09-22-2011, 04:46 PM
 
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I really don't know.Exh is an alcoholic,and is in a horrible state at the moment,homeless,collecting cans to return in the next state for his vodka,who knows what else he is doing.Very sad.My dc know what their father does,and they know that I very rarely drink,I don't keep it in the house,I might have a mixed drink at a party or something,but I don't get drunk.I just don't like it.They also know their step grandfather is a recovering alcoholic,and his liver is failing because of it. :( I grew up watching my dad's side of the family get drunk every day,and holidays they would litteraly be falling down,and some would drive home!I would hide with my cousins or downstairs at my grandmother's.So there is a big chance that my dc could get addicted,since it runs on their dad's side,as well as my dad's side.


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#81 of 90 Old 09-22-2011, 06:49 PM
 
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I honestly don't know what to do. Alcoholism runs in both my family and my husband's. My brother and I were allowed small sips of alcohol as children. I started getting drunk with friends at age 15, and he started at 13 or 14. I have a problem with alcohol dependency, and my brother was an alcoholic. He died at the age of 25 because his body could no longer handle the amount of alcohol he was drinking.

Alcoholism is definitely hereditary, and I don't know if it would be better for my kids to wait or not. I've heard that consuming alcohol as a child makes you more likely to become an alcoholic, but I don't know if that's true.

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#82 of 90 Old 09-22-2011, 07:31 PM
 
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Alcoholism is definitely hereditary, and I don't know if it would be better for my kids to wait or not. I've heard that consuming alcohol as a child makes you more likely to become an alcoholic, but I don't know if that's true.[/quote]

I wouldn't even begin to try to debate you on that one. I'm sick of studies that help people do what they want. Whether it's true or not I can see how it can be something to consider. I think it's safe if you already know that alcohol is an issue for you or other members of your family allowing your kids to drink a little here and there isn't necessarily going to be the best thing. Maybe some kids and some parents could handle this differently due to their own personal back grounds. I just know I have a hard time with alcohol and I have an extremely addictive personality as they like to say. I don't drink but once in a blue moon and when I do I always wonder why I wanted to. I want my kids to know that in moderation it can be fine, but we don't have many real life people to look to for that. So I'll tell them the bad and try to figure out the good. If they want to try it, they'll try it. I just don't want to give them their first sip... what if that's all it takes? That was all it took for me.
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#83 of 90 Old 09-24-2011, 05:46 AM
 
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Oh, that's so annoying, just typed up & lost a huge long message... Alcoholism runs very strongly in my family but I am very moderate about my consumption. DH is also a moderate drinker even though his dad was an angry violent drunk. I honestly think we just somehow didn't get the worst sorts of alky genes, & it's little to do with how much we ever tried as kids (he never had a taste and I could have sipped beer daily if I had wanted to).

 

We now live in a society that has a big problem with public binge drinking, too. I think that it's most important to focus on fostering in DC good life-coping skills and a moderate attitude towards booze so that binge drinking has no appeal as either comfort or a lifestyle choice. I'd like being obviously drunk to look very uncool to my teenagers (that is how my teenage self saw it, tell the truth!) As for actual tastes, I let DC have tastes off my finger pretty much from toddlerhood. From 8yo they can have very diluted wine or cider (so that's like 0.5-1oz to 5 oz water) once on the weekend, with a meal. Eldest DC are now 11 & nearly 10 and they very rarely even ask for even a taste. It just doesn't matter to them. 16yo

 

Niece came home drunk, puked all over herself whilst asleep in bed that night. Waking up like that seems to have erased any desire on her part to ever get so drunk again (she's now 25, both her parents had alcoholism and mental health problems, too). I'm afraid I have that leave-em-in-their-own-puke card up my sleeve, too.


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#84 of 90 Old 09-24-2011, 08:00 PM
 
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I think a lot of it, even with a genetic disposition, has to do with how it is handled in the household. I learned a hard lesson that I shouldn't drink that much, and I never did as a result.

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#85 of 90 Old 09-28-2011, 12:40 AM
 
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We used to sneak the eggnog from the grownup bowl when I was a kid, and were allowed "tastes" of beer or wine. 

 

With my older daughter, from about the time she hit puberty I let her taste things if she wanted to, but not large quantities, not ever. It taught her very quickly that she really didn't like the taste of booze.

 

The HUGE concern about kids and teenagers having more than the tiniest big of alcohol is that alcohol has far stronger effects on rapidly dividing and growing cells than it does on mature cells that aren't dividing very often. 21 as a drinking age makes a lot of biological sense, and might be on the young side. 

 

I'm more concerned about teaching kids moderation than I am about teetotaling, but I also teach my kids to value their brains, and that means don't get drunk and wear a bike helmet, you know? The other factor is that my kids have grandparents and great grandparents with addictive tendencies on all sides of the family tree, and I want them to grow up very, very aware of that. Knowing that meant that while I did some experimenting in college, I by and large stayed far far away from anything with strong addictive potential. 


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#86 of 90 Old 09-28-2011, 05:54 AM - Thread Starter
 
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Ok, didn't realise this would get so long lol.

 

I think a lot of my concern about the original post, is this..........

 

I am an alcoholic. I could say ex-alcoholic but I don't think there is such a thing. I have reached a point now where I can allow myself a drink once a month and not suffer for it BUT I am still vulnerable at times and all I can think about is drink, I avoid alcohol at this time. Its much easier now as I have been diagnosed as borderline personality, possible bipolar and having landed my family in £20,000 worth of debt as a result, DH now looks after the money side of things, so I have no money to spend on alcohol, except for the once a month when I have a tenner to have a meal and a drink at the pub with a group of friends.

 

My mum IS an alcoholic, maybe alcohol is genetic, I think that for me it was more a combination of possibly inherited mental health issues COMBINED with learned behaviour from her.

 

I first got really drunk aged 14. I was seeing things, I got drunk to make them go away. Very drunk in fact. I used drink to self medicate. I didn't live with my mum but whenever I saw her, she would be drinking (but she appeared from the outside to be kinda normal, held down good jobs, looked good, its just that she drank whenever she could, every evening and on the weekends it started from when she got up and brunch was started).

 

I went to live with her when I was 18, I would wake up to a chilled can of stella on my bedside table, placed there thoughtfully by my mother............. I lived with her for 3 months, saw here on and off for the next few years, drink was always involved. We stopped seeing her 2005.

 

Anyway, the kids next door, the current partner of the woman drinks A LOT. Even when they have no money, he manages to get some beer somehow.

 

The kids are there at all the parties, getting drunk themselves (and this has been going on since we moved here so the boy would have been 9ish at the time).

 

While I believe in letting your kids in on the party etc, I also believe that 'some' parties should be 'adult' only. The woman binge drinks throughout pregnancy etc, the kids see this, the current partner drinks ALL the time and the kids are in on the drink as well, its just not right.

 

I think maybe, in your teens, a little alcohol here and there at christmas etc is one thing, a light shandy whatever as well as the teaching of responsible drinking is one thing, but what is going on is wrong.

 

When DH has a beer, the kids asks what it is, he doesn't let them drink it but he lets them sniff it and they always say 'eurgh, disgusting'. They kinda know what alcohol is, they might see DH occasionally have a beer, but thats it (they are only ickle though'. When they get older, I cannot imagine letting them try any alcohol until 15/16 maybe and even then, with a meal.

 

I know in the uk, it is illegal to give a child under 5 alcohol. I am unsure whether this is still the case http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/6598867.stm but this just seems weird to me. I would have thought the age would have been much higher (I wish it was, social services might just have stepped in by now). There is no reaon for any child under 12 at least to be given alcohol (although certain meds contain alcohol ofr instance oramorph and obviously, some children require this, tastes disgusting though, another reason I don't drink now, although it sounds odd because there is alcohol in oramorph, is simply, because I have to use oramorph regularly, the taste has pretty much put me off alcohol, except for the once a month beer).

 

Kids can be sneaky though, I remember when I was little, after one of my parents dinner parties, my brother and I went round the next morning drinking up the left over wine in peoples glasses, surely though, these glasses should have been put out of reach.

 

I think, put simply, hopefully without me waffling too much, that because of my experiences with alcohol, both personally and within the family,  that what goes on next door is wrong. Different people have different ideas, different cultures etc, but there is a difference between letting a child 'try' or 'experience' alcohol and letting them get plastered. Also, drugs are bad for kids period, I think sometimes people forget that alcohol is a drug, just cos its legal, doesn't make a difference. Kids shouldn't be taking drugs unless prescribed.

 

I might call social services again, thing is, this woman is constantly complaing about the son, about how bad he is, about how he treats her, yet she gives him alcohol, she shouts and swears at him all the time and she hits him. What the hell does she expect? That hes grow into some kinda angel underneath all that crap? Apparently kids with ADHD are more likely to use alcohol and other drugs later in life, shes so concerned about his ADHD yet shes plying with stuff he shouldnt be having with his ADHD anyway???

 

 

Jeez, I was happy a minute ago, the poor kid.

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#87 of 90 Old 09-28-2011, 06:25 AM
 
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It certainly does sound wrong what's going on over there. Kids should NOT be getting drunk or drinking alot every weekend or whatever. That is abusive/neglectful at the same time. It's amazing what some parents think is ok :( I can't give advice regarding CPS, maybe someone else could be helpful in that area.


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#88 of 90 Old 09-28-2011, 10:00 AM
 
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Only once with the older dd and that was a tiny sip of wine on New Year's Eve. She didn't like it. LOL

 

But I have a friend who let's her 8 yo dd drink out of her beer or wine glass and has even given her her own cup of watered down wine. For some I guess it wouldn't be a problem, but my assumption is my friend is an alcoholic so to me it just doesn't feel right to be doing this. I feel like her dd isn't seeing a responsible way of drinking alcohol. 

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#89 of 90 Old 09-28-2011, 04:42 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by purplerose View Post

It certainly does sound wrong what's going on over there. Kids should NOT be getting drunk or drinking alot every weekend or whatever. That is abusive/neglectful at the same time. It's amazing what some parents think is ok :( I can't give advice regarding CPS, maybe someone else could be helpful in that area.


I was a mandated reporter, and if you are, you would be required to report something like this. As a private citizen, it is murky water. I hate to see kids separated from their parents, I don't like CPS being involved, though sometimes it is for the best. You have to trust your gut on situations like this.

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#90 of 90 Old 10-01-2011, 02:35 PM - Thread Starter
 
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I am in the uk so its not CPS and social services just doesn't seem interested. I am going to try them again next week.

 

The thing is, what goes on next door impacts our lives, to the point where we are considering going back noto the housing register to move (I have numerous health issues as does DH so neither of us can work which makes the housing thing complicated).

 

We simply cannot use the garden because we are uncomfortable with our kids playing out there while the neighbour is screaming and swearing at her kids (and then the eldest boy tends to take it out on younger siblings). We hear it even when indoors but at least the walls mute it somewhat. My daughters are always asking why they have such a nasty mummy.......

 

Gah, it does make me feel irky in the tummy dept just thinking about it.

 

Its been 3 years, nothing has changed, nobody seems to care and there is only so much we are willing to put up with. Her kids deserve better but so do ours.

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