A wasting food WWYD - Page 4 - Mothering Forums

Forum Jump: 
Reply
 
Thread Tools
#91 of 104 Old 01-19-2006, 10:31 PM
 
maya44's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Posts: 2,600
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
[QUOTE=the_lissa]
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kirsten
Yes - yes, you do want him to go hungry at this point! And to not get his way 100% of the time. It is the hard job as the parent to NOT give the little darlings what they want all the time. That creates absolute monsters for us, and eventually for their teachers and then spouses.

It is not our jobs - we shouldn't even strive for it! - to provide them their every whim. The world doesn't revolve around them (well, the firstborns for a few years - I guess it does) and it does them a disservice to let them think it does. There are other people, and like you mentioned, their needs are important too.

In a Love and Logic class, we heard that dinner is prepared and put on the table for 30 minutes. Eat whatever you need to keep you satisfied til breakfast. At my house, they eat or don't eat - I don't nag or ask them to have four more bites or any such thing. Dinner is dinner. Please sit at the table during that time. Some of my kids eat up and ask for more. Some graze and chat. Some barely touch a thing. Can you guess which ones are sitting at the table first thing when breakfast is served? Hunger is a better motivator than mom begging/pleading/hand feeding one more bite each 15 minutes. That is insanity IMO. With the exception of the example given about the child with the feeding tube - I am talking about the 99.5% of kids who will learn to eat normally given a parent who won't be manipulated about food.

I think it is only fair to have at least one or two things on the table that you know each child likes. I like the kids to try each thing but I don't force it at all - as I was a picky eater and still remember throwing up that brussel sprout (I was a teenager).

Kids go through phases of growth where they eat as much as a grown man - and other phases where they eat barely enough to keep a bird alive. You know what? My kids have gone through both types of phases many times and are neither overweight nor malnourished.



I think you are WAY overthinking this. It is the power trip/control one. He does it because he can; you let him. Keep it really simple - food out, tell him it will be out for 30 minutes and to eat what he needs to be full til breakfast. You eat yours. NO comments to him about how much time left or doesn't he think he'll be hungry if he doesn't eat now or anything. NO COMMENTS. 30 minutes up, food put away. Yes, of course you will be dealing with a whiny, hungry child that night. You will both survive it. Still no mention of "if you'd only eaten" or making him something else. Be loving and sympathetic and remind him that you'll make breakfast at 7:30. It will not take more than a day or two of this for him to decide to eat or be hungry. You take your control issues out of it and he'll not be able to manipulate you anymore. He will not starve missing one dinner (which HE chose to miss - you didn't withhold food!)



I cannot go from dinner until breakfast without getting hungry. I wouldn't expect my child to.


I disagree with almost this entire post. I will not let my child go hungry. It may be what you want, but it is definitely not what I want.
You can solve this problem by having a planned set snack time after dinner. But everthing else really will solve the problems and will not result in a hungry child, unless they choose to be.
maya44 is offline  
#92 of 104 Old 01-19-2006, 10:34 PM
 
Yooper's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Posts: 3,615
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Well, I still stick by my original comment that the OP did the right thing. We are talking about 1/2 sandwich. What is that, fifty cents at the most?!?! Doling it out in tiny bites when the child has asked for the whole thing just sets you up for an argument about "how much" every time. So he misjudged. I have done it. Maybe he thought it would taste, feel, smell different. Giving him the chance to find out is fine. I very seriously doubt he would ask then rip up every sandwich for eternity. Probably not more than 3 sandwiches. I do not think it sets up a lifetime of food wasting craziness.

Having a child go hungry or forcing a child to eat something before they can have anything else is not a good idea in my book. Neither is forcing a child to sit through a meal if they are not ready. Helping them to do so, OK. My dd sits through meals. Always has from day one. It means breaking out playdough sometimes or whatever, fine. But if she still was not capable of sitting, then that is her choice. Cannot sit in a restaurant? Then we leave and do not try again until she is OK sitting through meals at home. Really not a big deal.

I have had to bite my tounge when dd asks for something then doesn't eat it. It does bother me. In the big scheme? Introducing controversy involving food is just not good IMO. She eats most of what she asks for. She has gone through phases where she doesn't. I have no idea why. But I refuse to make conflict over it. I also do not buy the "you will eat what is on the table or go hungry" plan. There are days when my favorite meal does not seem appetizing to me. Luckily I get to choose what is for dinner so usually I get what I want. Dh is also articulate enough to say "honey, I love your chili but I just don't feel like it tonight, can we have spaghetti instead?". Dd cannot do that. So if I serve what I think is a variety including things I "know" she likes and she still asks for something different? NO BIG DEAL. She is big enough to open the fridge or cabinet and get one of the many easy to grab foods that are available. I really just do not get why this is a problem for people. It is not "disrespecting" me. As long as everyone is fed and happy, I am happy.
Yooper is offline  
#93 of 104 Old 01-19-2006, 10:46 PM
 
Oh the Irony's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: grateful for truth
Posts: 3,670
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by dharmamama
Let him take responsibility for his choices. If he's hungry because he only ate a bite or two, well, you know what? That's what happens when you only eat a bite or two.

If he won't eat his sandwich before you go out the door, well, then he'll be hungry and miserable. It will be a miserable trip for you, but maybe after a few times of that, he will learn what the consequences of his actions are. It's not your responsiblity to make him eat. All you are responsible for his providing him with noursihing food.
if i only eat a little bit of my dinner and get hungry later i get something to EAT. if i get hungry while i'm out i EAT something while i'm out. if i don't like something i get up and get something else to EAT. my child gets that same option. they get to EAT when they are hungry. and i agree--it is not my responsibility to make him eat (even if i knew how). i provide nourishing food for my child when he needs to EAT.

if i'm in the middle of something it is simple. they can help themselves to anything. if i'm not busy, i'll make something.
Oh the Irony is offline  
#94 of 104 Old 01-19-2006, 10:47 PM
 
the_lissa's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Southern Ontario, Canada
Posts: 13,248
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Exactly wolfmama.

Jam 7, Peanut Butter 5, and Bread 2.

the_lissa is offline  
#95 of 104 Old 01-19-2006, 11:48 PM
 
Kirsten's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Washington state
Posts: 5,463
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
[QUOTE=the_lissa]
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kirsten
Yes - yes, you do want him to go hungry at this point! And to not get his way 100% of the time. It is the hard job as the parent to NOT give the little darlings what they want all the time. That creates absolute monsters for us, and eventually for their teachers and then spouses.

It is not our jobs - we shouldn't even strive for it! - to provide them their every whim. The world doesn't revolve around them (well, the firstborns for a few years - I guess it does) and it does them a disservice to let them think it does. There are other people, and like you mentioned, their needs are important too.

In a Love and Logic class, we heard that dinner is prepared and put on the table for 30 minutes. Eat whatever you need to keep you satisfied til breakfast. At my house, they eat or don't eat - I don't nag or ask them to have four more bites or any such thing. Dinner is dinner. Please sit at the table during that time. Some of my kids eat up and ask for more. Some graze and chat. Some barely touch a thing. Can you guess which ones are sitting at the table first thing when breakfast is served? Hunger is a better motivator than mom begging/pleading/hand feeding one more bite each 15 minutes. That is insanity IMO. With the exception of the example given about the child with the feeding tube - I am talking about the 99.5% of kids who will learn to eat normally given a parent who won't be manipulated about food.

I think it is only fair to have at least one or two things on the table that you know each child likes. I like the kids to try each thing but I don't force it at all - as I was a picky eater and still remember throwing up that brussel sprout (I was a teenager).

Kids go through phases of growth where they eat as much as a grown man - and other phases where they eat barely enough to keep a bird alive. You know what? My kids have gone through both types of phases many times and are neither overweight nor malnourished.



I think you are WAY overthinking this. It is the power trip/control one. He does it because he can; you let him. Keep it really simple - food out, tell him it will be out for 30 minutes and to eat what he needs to be full til breakfast. You eat yours. NO comments to him about how much time left or doesn't he think he'll be hungry if he doesn't eat now or anything. NO COMMENTS. 30 minutes up, food put away. Yes, of course you will be dealing with a whiny, hungry child that night. You will both survive it. Still no mention of "if you'd only eaten" or making him something else. Be loving and sympathetic and remind him that you'll make breakfast at 7:30. It will not take more than a day or two of this for him to decide to eat or be hungry. You take your control issues out of it and he'll not be able to manipulate you anymore. He will not starve missing one dinner (which HE chose to miss - you didn't withhold food!)



I cannot go from dinner until breakfast without getting hungry. I wouldn't expect my child to.


I disagree with almost this entire post. I will not let my child go hungry. It may be what you want, but it is definitely not what I want.
What exactly do you disagree with and why? I am honestly curious. You think we should give them what they want 100% of the time, regardless of anyone else's needs? You think they will starve if they aren't given every food item they ask for, even though the meals and snacks have been offered all day at the appropriate times? You think we should beg and plead with them to eat, to hand feed them bites as they run by each 15 minutes?

I know you said you have a two year old. There is a big difference between a two year old's food needs, and ability to sit through dinner - and pj's kid. I think with a two year old, there is not the manipulation that is seen in other poster's examples. A two year old is just hungry when they are hungry and that is clearly a different thing altogether. Even those of us who think that food should be put away when the meal is over aren't talking about infants and toddlers. When you have a four, five, eight year old child running (or stopping) the household due to food manipulations, that is when you get a little firmer about how far you are willing to let the kid run his/her power trip.

There have been examples on this thread of preschool age kids making the parents' and siblings' lives painfully difficult. For long periods of time. Clearly something has to change. No one is suggesting withholding food and making kids go hungry to teach them a lesson. Food is offered at least three times a day. If the child wants to try to extend the power trip by CHOOSING not to eat it, or much of it, so be it. Anyone who wants to be a short order cook - and parent, can prep for a child who has a hard time when the real world arrives.

I think that the hardest part of parenting is doing the stuff that the kids don't like or appreciate at the time but is necessary. It is not fun to be the bad guy.

Allowing one child to have that much power over whether or not others can enjoy a meal, can run errands, etc. is a problem. Pj is in for a really rotten few days as her dc figures out the power trip is over. But I honestly think that if she holds firm - lovingly firm - that life will be better for all concerned, even the dc!
Kirsten is offline  
#96 of 104 Old 01-20-2006, 12:12 AM
 
the_lissa's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Southern Ontario, Canada
Posts: 13,248
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Don't have much time, but I acknowledge there is a world of difference between a 2 year old and an older child. I have a 7 year old sister, and my mom would never let her go hungry either. I just don't think letting a child go hungry is acceptable, and that there are other ways to deal with it.

Jam 7, Peanut Butter 5, and Bread 2.

the_lissa is offline  
#97 of 104 Old 01-20-2006, 02:59 AM
 
moonshine's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: finding my way back to the Dingos
Posts: 2,152
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by pjs

As far as sensory issues around eating, I’m not inclined to think it’s a sensory thing because it seems like it is the typical thing any child does. Meat always hangs out in his mouth for awhile, which I remember doing as a child. Other times, it really seems like a procrastination or even civil disobedience, unwillingness to cooperate type of thing. It’s almost like he can’t he focus long enough to chew and swallow, he wants to be doing other things, anything other than sitting or standing at the table and eating. He doesn’t do it the majority of the time, but it is frequent enough for me to notice.
I wanted to chime in on this point to say that I DON'T think what you are describing sounds like typical child behavior. I am completely unqualified to know whether your son has any sensory issues or not (although it sounds like he could???), but I haven't experienced anything like this, from my kids or any others.

Aside from figuring out if there are indeed any other issues around food, I would also think that making dinner time (or lunch or whatever) a follow a more regimented schedule would be helpful. I would not describe either one of my kids as being highly spirited, but we have had very little problem in having them sit with us for meals. DD2 is probably doing it earlier than DD1 did, but DD2 has been easily sitting with us for meals w/o issue for the last 6 months or so. Many partly due to just the expectation that this is what we do.
moonshine is offline  
#98 of 104 Old 01-20-2006, 09:14 AM
 
dharmamama's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Bywater, West Farthing
Posts: 4,548
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by the_lissa
I just don't think letting a child go hungry is acceptable, and that there are other ways to deal with it.
I always thought that if a parent made food available and the kid decided not to eat it, the child was CHOOSING to go hungry. It's not this mom's responsibility to shoehorn food into this kid's mouth. At some point he has to take responsibility for his own hunger.

But then again, I agree with Moonshine that this kid's behavior does NOT sound like normal child behavior, which is why I suggested checking for senory issues.

Namaste!
dharmamama is offline  
#99 of 104 Old 01-20-2006, 09:51 AM
pjs
 
pjs's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Posts: 1,595
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Velochic- thanks for the support. I think my reluctance to create some boundaries in dealing with this issue has been largely due to my fear of creating food issues. I think now, as I'm suffering the consequences of inaction, the fact that I am not withholding food or using food as a reward, but simply it is what it is, food, and it is available at structured times (just like we sleep at structured times) I've been overinflating the whole food issues thing in my mind. Even when I read raising your spirited child, she said not to make them sit, to avoid creating issues later on, etc. As I reflect, I think instilling some narcissitic ideas in DS (that his needs come before everyone else's all the time when it comes to food) is probably worse than getting him acclimated to some structure around eating. I guess too I wanted DS to listen to his body for hunger cues, but clearly we have gotten to an extreme (being hungry only right after dinner is cleaned up and put away).

Kirsten- it is insanity begging/pleading/manipulating just to take another bite. I do need to let go of my control issues. It is a natural consequence, if you don't eat, you're hungry, and if you're hungry, you can finish whatever the last meal/snack was that went unfinished. I have noticed over the past 24 hours, is that I start getting worked up having to remind him to eat or to hurry and finish, or if I'm sitting at the table by myself. Just now I served breakfast and it was available for 30 minutes. I set the timer and told him breakfast is available for 30 minutes then we'll have a snack at 9. I had to stop myself from reminding him the time was going to go off. He probably ate one or two bites (although he's been demanding breakfast since he got up an hour ago) and had a sip or two of juice. This morning should be fun. One of my biggest stumbling blocks to letting him not eat breakfast, is my reluctance to have to be the one to suffer the consequences of his misery from being hungry. But I wholeheartedly agree that parenting means being doing the stuff kids don't appreciate, and I can only hope it won't be months before ds figures it out. And I do agree with you that I know ds and the rest of the family will be better for it, it has been reluctance on my part because the limits involve food, but I have had success in setting limits on other areas so food really shouldn't be any different. I am meeting his needs by providing food and that's all I can really do.

The lissa- if ds is hungry after dinner, but before bed, I have no problem giving him the dinner that he didn't eat. Things have spiralled out of control here because ds will not eat dinner (even if I gave him 50 choices of his favorite foods) and want something different. it doesn't matter what it is, as long as it is different. I'm thinking that always offering him choices has led him to always want something else when he isn't given a choice. I decide what's for dinner, so even if I put 5 foods on the table, I'm thinking he wants something different because he has not been in the driver's seat as far as determining what's for dinner (I make that decision based on a variety of factors, my energy level at that point in the day, what I have planned for the week, what our schedule is) and I feel like ds has ample opportunity to be in charge of his eating, but at some point he needs to realize he doesn't get to make all of the decisions all of the time.

yoopervegan- this isn't happening occasionally, this is happening every meal, every day. He wants cereal, the first words out of his mouth this morning were make me cereal for breakfast- now an hour later the cereal is sitting virtually untouched. Why did I have to stop what I'm doing and prepare breakfast so urgently just for it to sit uneaten? Now because he hasn't eaten (although he clearly told me he wanted breakfast) I am essentially "on-call" because he will be hungry and he'll want a snack, and knowing ds, he will be dying of starvation as soon as I sit down to nurse ds #2. So now I'll throw away his soggy cereal that he had to have but has only eaten a bite or two (and I am not interested in preparing foods in bite portions). I switched from organic cereal to cheerios, because I'm throwing it out anyway. What's the point of even preparing breakfast (and I have rotated breakfast items- bagels, waffles, pancakes, oatmeal, eggs, it doesn't matter, it all sits uneaten, until I "help" him eat it the next time he is hungry)? And this happens with the snack he wants, and then lunch, and then another snack or two, and dinner, and so on. I joined this thread because I am tired of wasting this much food and I won't do it anymore.

wolfmama- I am not withholding food from ds. But as I stated above, he said he was hungry, wanted cereal, I made cereal, and now it sits uneaten and soggy. We go through this exercise everytime he's hungry. I used to let him have access to all of the snacks, but that got to an extreme, he would not eat ANY meals, just snacks. Maybe this is my problem, but I do have a problem with him only eating snacks, because in light of his dental issues it means more work for me. I have to brush his teeth after he eats every time. He is 4 and has just had 9 fillings! He hasn't been eating candy and junk, but his dentist agrees that being a constant snacker allows his teeth to bathe in the bacteria that causes tooth decay all day.

Moonshine- I'll have to do some reading about typical child behaviors, sensory issues and eating. Ds has always been a "good" eater when he actually eats, it's just recently that he's started delaying chewing and keeping meat in his mouth. I have a friend whose DS (same age as my ds) would only eat chicken nuggets, nothing else. One day I had a peach and he wanted to try it. His mom said ok so I shared (we all thought him branching out was a good thing) and 5 minutes later he had eaten my entire peach and then he threw it right back up- I think the texture (peaches are kind of stringy) overwhelmed him. This is what I think of when I think of sensory issues with food, but I guess I'll need to do some reading to see where my ds falls on the spectrum. I agree with you in thinking that having more of a schedule/regiment will help ds. I mean, it can't be much worse than what it is already, and he definitely has a tendency to enforce rules, put things in there exact place, not deviate from the standard, etc, so maybe my laissez-faire attitude is really what's causing the problem- he doesn't function well without a lot of structure and knowing what to expect.

This discussion has been very helpful- I'll let you know how my day progresses.
pjs is offline  
#100 of 104 Old 01-20-2006, 10:52 AM
 
maya44's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Posts: 2,600
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Pj's

Have you read "How to get you kid to eat, but not too much" by Ellyn Satter?

I think you would find it very helpful!!!!!

It believes strongly in having structured meals and snacks and a division of reponisbility in feeding.

The parent is responsible for when meals and snacks are served and what foods are offered at those meals. The child is responsible for whether he eats any food and how much of it he eats.

It is well reserached and well respected in the nutrition field. I HIGHLY reccomend it.
maya44 is offline  
#101 of 104 Old 01-20-2006, 01:01 PM
 
nancy926's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: where we always need more bookcases
Posts: 2,472
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Okay...I have not read all the posts, so forgive me if I repeat something.

To answer the original question, I don't think a young child will understand about wasting food. They're just not old enough to get it yet. My DD loves to play in the kitchen sink and leave the water running full blast. She doesn't understand that she's "wasting" water. Heck, I didn't understand where water came from (or that you have to pay for it somehow, either by drilling a well or buying town/city water) or that it was of limited supply until I was in high school, probably.

I think if you push the wasting food issue now, you may wind up with a child who eats when he isn't hungry, just so he doesn't waste food. My Dh and I are both like this because we had parents who insisted we clean our plates.

Now yes, if a child asks for a snack (ie., yogurt) and then eats 1/32 of it, you could save it for later and say "You aren't getting other snacks until you eat this." But wow is that controlling. I don't tell my DH what to eat, or vice versa. If I want my DD to grow into an adult who makes wise food choices and doesn't overeat for emotional reasons, I think I need to a) leave her alone where food is concerned and b) try to model the behavior I would like to see.

I will accommodate her wishes as much as I can, and if I can't, I will explain why. She is now old enough to get her own snacks out of the refrigerator or pantry, and pour her own drinks. I let her do as much as possible on her own, even if it makes me cringe AND wastes food. (There is always composting.) I would rather have wasted food than an overweight child who feels like she "has" to eat things.

Just my 2 cents.

A writer/runner/thinker/wife with two daughters (11/02 and 8/05), one dog, three cats, seven fish, and a partridge in a pear tree... in Vermont.
nancy926 is offline  
#102 of 104 Old 01-20-2006, 01:20 PM
 
LovemyBoo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: The Beautiful Rocky Mountains
Posts: 1,696
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
So if I serve what I think is a variety including things I "know" she likes and she still asks for something different? NO BIG DEAL. She is big enough to open the fridge or cabinet and get one of the many easy to grab foods that are available. I really just do not get why this is a problem for people. It is not "disrespecting" me. As long as everyone is fed and happy, I am happy.
I don't have a problem with it. Just like I don't have a problem with unschooling, public schooling, vaxing or no vaxing. It's just not what going to happen with our family.

I don't agree with "you will eat what I've made or not eat at all until you do" nor with "you can eat whatever you want whenever you want". Like a lot of parents here I'm trying to find the middle ground that's works the best for us. I've decided on, "You always get to choose if and how much you eat and when, you don't always get to choose exactly what." I don't get why this is a problem either.
LovemyBoo is offline  
#103 of 104 Old 01-20-2006, 05:05 PM
pjs
 
pjs's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Posts: 1,595
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
maya44 thanks for the book recommendation. I'll definitely check it out.
pjs is offline  
#104 of 104 Old 01-21-2006, 03:48 AM
 
Kirsten's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Washington state
Posts: 5,463
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by pjs
Now because he hasn't eaten (although he clearly told me he wanted breakfast) I am essentially "on-call" because he will be hungry and he'll want a snack, and knowing ds, he will be dying of starvation as soon as I sit down to nurse ds #2.
This just clicked with me.... Has he always been this way about food or just since ds2 arrived? Since your time is divided? Maybe he is controlling the one thing that he can control, and smart kid that he is, has figured out that it is easier to manipulate parents when it surrounds food simply because we feel terrible if we think they're hungry.

So with his food issues, he gets a LOT of your time and attention, basically dragging it out for hours around each mealtime.

Sounds like (from other parts of your post) that you are ready to try some changes regarding meals for him. I really think you're going to see a quick change. No way will it be months! Kids are stubborn but once he sees you are being consistent and not too involved in it, he will decide to eat on his own. I'd bet a week at the very outside. Just try not to plan much this week. It will be hell but it will be done after that.

I am so curious to hear how it works out for your family! I hope it all resolves quickly and you are on to a fun new problem next month! It is always like that with parenting I think - whatever I'm stressed about right now will be fixed and something new will come along to worry about.
Kirsten is offline  
Reply

Quick Reply
Message:
Drag and Drop File Upload
Drag files here to attach!
Upload Progress: 0
Options

Register Now

In order to be able to post messages on the Mothering Forums forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.
User Name:
If you do not want to register, fill this field only and the name will be used as user name for your post.
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.
Password:
Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.
Email Address:

Log-in

Human Verification

In order to verify that you are a human and not a spam bot, please enter the answer into the following box below based on the instructions contained in the graphic.



User Tag List

Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page


Forum Jump: 

Posting Rules  
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are Off