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non-AP mamas who want to think they're AP?

10K views 145 replies 80 participants last post by  PrennaMama 
#1 ·
That's a confusing title!


I'm just wondering because I know a few mamas who seem to feel an obligation to fall somewhere under the AP label...even though they so clearly don't parent that way. Do you think it's because of the word "attachment"? Maybe many moms feel like they won't be attached enough to their kids if they do things non-AP. Or is it just because AP is the latest buzzword? or what?

Basically, it seems just about everyone considers themselves AP even though they really aren't. Does that make sense? Or maybe I'm confusing AP with the "Mothering" community...which is rather about natural family living...which includes AP but doesn't refer to it exclusively.


One girl I know here has done everything so contrary to anything I would consider AP and yet she still refers to herself as an AP mom. I always wonder why she doesn't feel comfortable enought to just be what she is...whatever it is. It almost seems like a matter of being "politically correct" or something. Know what I mean? Is AP just becoming another phrase? It seems to be watering down pretty fast.

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#52 ·
I'm the original poster of this thread. Interesting discussion!

My point in posting wasn't to promote judging or labelling of other mothers, but was rather to take a "philosophical" look into why more and more women seem to feel compelled to see their parenting style as AP even when it clearly isn't...at least in terms of official definitions.

I wondered if it's because of increasing popularity of AP parenting...after all, it wasn't so long ago that this was pretty much unheard of. AP principles must be getting pretty mainstream if "mainstream-parenting" moms are trying to find ways to align themselves with what is inherently a pretty different style. Maybe it's a good sign? Just that they're exposed to the literature/ideas and then going with their respective choices...whatever they may be.

We already know how amazing all the MDC moms are....so we can move past any political correctness about labelling etc. Of course we don't judge our fellow mama sisters!!!
But that doesn't stop the term "attachment parenting" from existing, and being used. We are a culture of labellers...particularly on this board. Look at the signatures!!! We tag one label after another behind our names!


AP as a buzzword is pretty recent. And the mamas I know (from the beginning!) who had babies in slings and not letting them CIO and co-sleeping...were *thrilled* to have a label for what they were doing. They felt it was sort of a validation for what they were doing, and it made them feel that their instincts were normal. The AP "label" gave them something to hold onto and a way to find similar moms more easily. And now the label is a "dreaded" thing and as we see in this thread...something to be avoided. Seems like the pendulum is swinging pretty far in the other direction pretty fast, no?


Anyway, interesting topic!
 
#53 ·
Quote:
why more and more women seem to feel compelled to see their parenting style as AP even when it clearly isn't...at least in terms of official definitions.
What about their parenting isn't what you would consider AP? What do you think makes an AP parent? . Do you think that to be AP you must follow a strict code of guidelines?
 
#54 ·
Quote:

Originally Posted by Sharlla
Do you think that to be AP you must follow a strict code of guidelines?
I never said anything about a strict code of guidelines, did I? But AP IS a description of a parenting style, and in order to be described or defined there surely must be some general guidelines..
(as listed by boongirl perhaps).
In response to boongirl's comments, and back to the original post...I never said mamas *here* on MDC didn't seem AP...I said that I knew mamas here (in the flesh!) who aren't what I would consider AP but seem to feel like they want the label anyway. My initial questioning is based on 2 women I know, one is a proud spanker ("he needs to be told who's boss!"), the other keeps hers penned up in one room all day so he won't mess up the house, both don't believe in responding to crying so as not to spoil them, one took a 2 week holiday and left her 7 month old with an aunt...so she could wean him cold turkey. Now please, I know that these women love their children and they are doing what they feel like they ought to be doing. This thread wasn't meant to suggest that they have no right to mother as they choose, or that I have no right to take notice one way or another. It's just simply that I don't see this as "AP" parenting, and I wondered why these women feel the need to identify with a label/movement that doesn't really fit them. I actually had the impression they didn't really know what it meant...(or maybe that I don't know) and that attachment parenting has just somehow become synonymous with parenting in general. I find it interesting, not negative. I wondered if others have experienced anything similar...

This was meant to be a general, philosophical-level thread. No judging going on here. Why is there suddenly such a defensive tone?
 
#55 ·
I think I am seeing the OP's question clearer now. I don't think she
is trying to exclude or make a checklist for what makes an AP parent.

I think she is wondering if we have seen an upswing in people calling
themselves AP and maybe not knowing what the term means. But by
asking that question she is only wanting to discuss the popularity of
the term and not the actions of the parents.

I remember when a friend asked me a parenting question while pregnant.
This was 2 years ago. I started to talk about how I personally see my
parenting, and that I was really glad to find information on the internet
regarding AP parenting. That it helped me define my search when I
needed advise and it also helped me pick books that shared the same
philosophy with.

She asked what Attachment Parenting meant. I didn't have a clear
answer so we googled it. Now when I had my daughter I had never
heard the term AP. I was the first of my friends to have a child, I
was a single mom who wanted good advice and stumbled onto the
term. I was excited that AP described me. I felt like I belonged. I
needed that as a new mother, with no mother friends.

Now I have heard the term more and more. It excites me. Most of
my friends have asked me about breast-feeding for future knowledge.
Many have asked me about my co-sleeping. It excites me further.
Because many of these same people said I was a nut when I had my
daughter when I talked about my parenting. They are looking to have
babies in their future and are looking around for advice like I was.

So many I don't know any mothers who call them self AP yet "aren't
practicing AP" but I don't know what they do at home, and I try not
to judge others parenting at a small glance.
But I do see more and more people becoming knowledgeable of the
term. In more and more places that I wouldn't have expected to
hear the term 5 years ago. So it's gaining popularity I imagine. Which
in my book is a GREAT thing.

I say if somebody is attracted to something that is in the best interest
of their children, it doesn't matter how much they embody the term, as
long as they enjoy the journey while they grow. (did that make sense?)


So I think that OP was asking if we have noticed that AP is becoming
a buzz word.
 
#56 ·
Quote:

Originally Posted by calynde
It's just simply that I don't see this as "AP" parenting, and I wondered why these women feel the need to identify with a label/movement that doesn't really fit them.
I would say you've answered your own question: you don't see what they do as AP. They do. It's rather simple. Each of us has our own perceptions, they don't always match each other's. How you interpret what attachment parenting (or anything else) means is not the same as what I interpret it to mean. The women you see as not being AP in any significant way may in fact see themselves as meeting enough of the AP "criteria", as they've interpreted it, to be "worthy" of the label.

I also think that in general mothers are so competitive with each other, and so in need of approval, that labeling becomes more important than it need be. We could remedy this by not labeling ourselves and each other, and not comparing ourselves to each other but instead working together for our own common good and the good of our children.
 
#57 ·
Quote:

Originally Posted by calynde
I never said anything about a strict code of guidelines, did I?
I wasn't saying you did, I was asking you a quesiton. Anyway, like I said in one of the previous posts, it may have appeared to many that I was not practicing AP (with DS1) when I very much was. And the same is true for many others.
 
#58 ·
Quote:

Originally Posted by trinity6232000
I think I am seeing the OP's question clearer now. I don't think she
is trying to exclude or make a checklist for what makes an AP parent.

I think she is wondering if we have seen an upswing in people calling
themselves AP and maybe not knowing what the term means. But by
asking that question she is only wanting to discuss the popularity of
the term and not the actions of the parents. ..

So I think that OP was asking if we have noticed that AP is becoming
a buzz word.
Exactly!
 
#59 ·
I think AP is a self determined label.
And if somebody thinks of themselves or their philosophy as AP, I can only wonder what they would be doing if they did not believe in AP.
SOmetimes there is a big gap between philosophy and practice because life gets in the way. We cannot judge anothers philosophy by their actions all of the time.
There are many many good AP mamas who have resorted to CIO when at the end of their rope. (some of them couldnt go through with it, some did but hate to admit it, some will tell you they did it but it didnt work)
I was at that same point once myself. And I would have done it if my twins hadnt started sleeping longer stretches on the very first night I vowed to let them CIO a bit.
If you dont knwo the whole story, how do you know how much the action is based in the philosophy or in the realities of life which sometimes dont jive with your philosophy?
I know AP mamas who spank and who wean their children at a year. But I dont know any moms mainstream moms who claim to be AP.
How am I to know their heart?
 
#60 ·
Quote:
AP as a buzzword is pretty recent. And the mamas I know (from the beginning!) who had babies in slings and not letting them CIO and co-sleeping...were *thrilled* to have a label for what they were doing.
This is how I see "Attachment Parenting" as a description of certain parenting choices. When my first DD was born we made some choices that were directly contrary to mainstream parenting advice and our "What to Expect" book. I was afraid to let people know that she was sleeping with us and that I was bf her on demand for fear that we would be told we were doing it wrong and that we were spoiling her. When I found out that there was a parenting style that approved of our choices I was encouraged, and I felt less alone.

I do think, as the op suggested, that the AP label is becoming more desirable as a sign that one is making responsive parenting choices. Quite a change from 10 years ago. Not to judge whether those that use the label deserve to, just noting that the term seems to be associated with good parenting.

Interesting to note how labels make people defensive.
 
#61 ·
I also think that maybe some of these moms are terming themselves AP because it is a buzz word, and not because they truly know what AP is about. It could maybe open their eyes a bit if you suggested they read books by Dr. Sears or Alison Granju. Without being pushy you could say something like "I really loved The Baby Book by Dr. Sears, how about you?" and then offer to loan her a copy if she hasn't read it already. Who knows they could be doing a lot of AP things already, but no matter what some educational reading could never hurt.

It does really surprise me that any mom would say that she's AP to another mom IRL. I would never say that to anyone I know - although I do talk about sleeping with my children, breast feeding on demand and everyone knows I am very close to my children! Anyhow I'm
 
#64 ·
AP to me is not so much about a checklist. However, we had a LLL meeting this last week and this one lady was about to drive me nuts talking about how she was so crunchy and all the things she did, but has talked many times about doing the opposite- CIO, crib sleeping etc. Why lie about it? I think whatever parenting decisions one makes they should at least be confident in them (even if I personally don't agree with them) it seems that for some it is just the in thing to follow, even if they don't actually ap at all.
 
#65 ·
Quote:

Originally Posted by johub
Is Attachment Parenting a buzzword or a new fad?
Is it becoming more popular?
I had no idea that most people had even heard of AP.
I never heard of "AP" until after DS2 was born, when I found out what it was, I knew that was my parenting style. And yeah, I like that I have that label now.
 
#66 ·
I understand where the OP is coming from. I had my first experience with this not to long ago. After I had listened to a woman threaten her child with a spanking, belittle her in front of me, allow her to bawl her head off during a time out for asking a question, demand obedience (she used the word obey) in the form of a "yes, mommy" and generally be disrespectful of her child, she turned to me as said that being an AP parent was hard.

It surprised me. I will admit.

I think there is some confusion about the term, what it means, what it entails, how being attached and responsive to your child usually means not hitting them, or disregarding their feelings. I do think that it has become a buzz word - a way to embrace a popular parenting philosophy which is touted as being good for the child.

I have also met moms who said they exclusively breastfeed - when in fact that last for the first two weeks of life, and then they began supplementing with formula because their doc told them too. Again, and adoption of the term that embraces the idea, though not the actual practice in order to be seen as doing what is best for the child.

I think that the need to do what is right, or perceived as right by society at large, for your child will drive you to label yourself as something you may not entirely embrace and understand so as to fit in. Especially with moms, who are constantly barraged with new studies and new info and


Labels aren't inherently bad - they are a way of categorizing information. All humans do it. It is the way we figure out where we stand in the world.

Discriminating due to a label is bad.

I find that the same sort of adoption of what is "cool" happens with "popular" religions. Think of all the celebrities who are into Kabbalah, or Buddhism....and all the people who then do something to label themselves as such, even without knowing what the heck they are doing.

People hear a term, hear some brief descriptor that may or may not be correct, decide they like the sound of it and label themselves as such. Not always correctly, not always respectfully or wisely.

Can the mama label herself that? Sure. Does it make me
? Yep. Makes me scratch my head when someone says they are converting to Judaism, and yet have never met with a Rabbi too.
Is it a problem? Not really. The only real problem I see is if the person labeling themselves erroneously begins to teach others about this fabulous new parenting philosophy (or whatever) that is based on doing whatever you want really. Then it becomes an issue I think. I mean - AP has ideals for a reason. You can embrace the ideals, and do what works for you and your baby, even without doing a dreaded "checklist" of parenting. We all have ideals we wish to live up to - that isn't a bad thing. We all also stress out when we don't live up to them on occasion.
 
#67 ·
Quote:

Originally Posted by Danesmama

I get very tired of mothers on this board judging the "AP-ness" of other people. We do vax, and yes, my sons are circumcised (not for religious reasons), but I still consider myself AP, although many on this board would not.
How does elective circumcision fit in with Attachment Parenting?
 
#68 ·
Quote:

Originally Posted by Galatea
How does elective circumcision fit in with Attachment Parenting?
I think it has more to do with Natural Family Living which is what Mothering.com is about. I think of NFL as larger and all encompassing. I think AP is a component of NFL.
 
#69 ·
Quote:

Originally Posted by Ellien C
I think it has more to do with Natural Family Living which is what Mothering.com is about. I think of NFL as larger and all encompassing. I think AP is a component of NFL.
Well... if being AP means that you do what is right for the child and not what is easiest for the parent, then circumcision doesn't fit in that. It is wrong for the child, and may assuage some feelings the parent has. Doesn't sound very AP.
 
#71 ·
Having just moved back to the US after having my two children in Sweden, I'm so surprised by conversations like this. Why compare? Why the need to one up each other or dismiss another person's parenting/philosophy? Of course I'm going to be drawn to people with like minded views but how does it affect my life if some person I've never met wants to call herself whatever.

You don't hear people in other countries talk about AP, CIO, or any other child related acronyms. What happened to people being tolerant? I would hate for someone to compare me to someone else. I do what I think it right based on our lifestyle and children. I suppose it never occurred to me to advertise that I had a home birth or didn't circumcised my son, etc. I don't see the point. If you like me, you like me. End of story.

* hope my tone doesn't sound defensive or aggressive, I'm mostly perplexed.
 
#72 ·
Just read through these post...interesting conversation.

My hot button is being labelled non-ap because we electively circ'd. I am conflicted about that decision and will answer to my son for it eventually if it becomes an issue for him. Everyone else who feels up for judging me on that topic can take a running leap. Sorry if you think that makes me non-AP but since I am extended bfing, co-sleep, babywear, cloth diapered for a long time, gd, etc., I don't really fit into the mainsteam parenting crowd either.

Labelling is silly really, because all it does is make those of us who do not strictly adhere to one set of parenting rules or the other feel alone and unsupported. I almost stopped posting here because my son is circed and I work full time, but I find more inspiration and likemindedness here than on any other parenting board so I continue to come here for parenting inspiration and thought provoking debates like this one :)
 
#73 ·
Quote:

Originally Posted by the_lissa
I think it has way more to do with AP than NFL. I consider it a parenting decision
the_lissa was referring to the decision to electively circ.

Galetea quoted me when asking how elective circ fits in with attachment parenting. Again I have to stress how steamed this makes me that anyone would presume to judge which criteria I use to make my parenting decisions and then imply that by making these decisions that I do not fit in with AP ideals. I find this sort of judgemental attitude offensive.

Quote:

Originally Posted by dido1
Labelling is silly really, because all it does is make those of us who do not strictly adhere to one set of parenting rules or the other feel alone and unsupported.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bruden
Having just moved back to the US after having my two children in Sweden, I'm so surprised by conversations like this. Why compare? Why the need to one up each other or dismiss another person's parenting/philosophy? Of course I'm going to be drawn to people with like minded views but how does it affect my life if some person I've never met wants to call herself whatever.


My thoughts exactly to Bruden and Dido1!
 
#74 ·
Quote:

Originally Posted by dido1

My hot button is being labelled non-ap because we electively circ'd. I am conflicted about that decision and will answer to my son for it eventually if it becomes an issue for him. Everyone else who feels up for judging me on that topic can take a running leap. Sorry if you think that makes me non-AP but since I am extended bfing, co-sleep, babywear, cloth diapered for a long time, gd, etc., I don't really fit into the mainsteam parenting crowd either.

Labelling is silly really, because all it does is make those of us who do not strictly adhere to one set of parenting rules or the other feel alone and unsupported. I almost stopped posting here because my son is circed and I work full time, but I find more inspiration and likemindedness here than on any other parenting board so I continue to come here for parenting inspiration and thought provoking debates like this one :)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Danesmama
Galetea quoted me when asking how elective circ fits in with attachment parenting. Again I have to stress how steamed this makes me that anyone would presume to judge which criteria I use to make my parenting decisions and then imply that by making these decisions that I do not fit in with AP ideals. I find this sort of judgemental attitude offensive.
I find elective circ offensive. You are putting your thoughts and needs over the child's. Should we accept someone who chose to formula feed b/c she couldn't be bothered to breastfeed, and when she posts, say nothing b/c it might be judgmental? It is one thing to circ out of ignorance and then regret it, but to suggest that elective circ is an acceptable choice is the same as saying choosing to formula feed is an acceptable choice, and that is not okay here at MDC.
 
#75 ·
Quote:
Well... if being AP means that you do what is right for the child and not what is easiest for the parent, then circumcision doesn't fit in that. It is wrong for the child, and may assuage some feelings the parent has. Doesn't sound very AP.
As much as I don't like circumcision (which is a WHOLE lot), I find the above to not be the definition of AP. AP isn't always doing what is right for the child, what the hell is right anyway? I think you are confusing NFL with AP, NFL may be against elective circumcision, but AP doesn't have a word to say on the subject. Look at the various sites, Dr. Sears, API, and so forth. The two things are separate. There are things we do which we find are best for our babies, breastfeeding, cosleeping (and again I will say one doesn't have to cosleep to be AP, there are other ways), babywearing (again, not everyone can do this, and they are still AP), etc, etc. Galatea, if you pay attention the woman said she was conflicted about that decision, and many others have made that decision and then come here and found out they were uninformed. Let's not sit here and play judge and jury to every mom that comes along and decide whether she is AP enough to be here, I think that kind of attitude just pushes people away, and if we really care about children we will welcome them and use gentle ways to educate them to our way of thinking about stuff like this.
 
#76 ·
Quote:

Originally Posted by Galatea
I find elective circ offensive. You are putting your thoughts and needs over the child's. Should we accept someone who chose to formula feed b/c she couldn't be bothered to breastfeed, and when she posts, say nothing b/c it might be judgmental? It is one thing to circ out of ignorance and then regret it, but to suggest that elective circ is an acceptable choice is the same as saying choosing to formula feed is an acceptable choice, and that is not okay here at MDC.
I totally understand and appreciate that elective circ is not supported by MDC, however, I don't feel that it is appropriate to label someone "not AP" because they made that choice in the past. People like myself who see this board as a place to learn and gathering parenting ideas are often driven away because they are made to feel "unworthy" for outing themselves as parents who chose to circ, formula feed, etc in the past. I think that unless someone is coming on here blatantly saying "Do this, it's the way" about topics that are not supported by MDC, they shouldn't be made to feel as though they are lesser "AP" parents. Instead of judging, blaming and naming, why not educate, explain your perspective and share your experiences and feeling respectfully instead of labelling? That was the point I was trying to make.
 
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