Would you leave your child in a hotel room? - Page 5 - Mothering Forums
Forum Jump: 
Reply
 
Thread Tools
#121 of 262 Old 05-14-2007, 12:20 PM
 
*LoveBugMama*'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Norway
Posts: 1,602
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by ThreeBeans View Post
I think it's been established that this is not an accepted cultural practice. Even if it were, it doesn't make it smart.

It's accepted cultural practice to circumcise in the US. Still inexcusable.
Well, here in Norway it is considered ok, normal and safe to leave babies in their strollers outside small shops and cafè`s. So it is most definitely an accepted cultural practice here.

*Single, attached Norwegian mama to my LoveBug, 2001*
 
*LoveBugMama* is offline  
#122 of 262 Old 05-14-2007, 12:23 PM
 
*LoveBugMama*'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Norway
Posts: 1,602
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by DoctorGirlfriend View Post
Um, why? Why wouldn't you blame someone for making a bad decision?

It's an awful thing, of course, and they must be going through hell. But I blame them.
Why?

Because I have done bad things myself. I have made bad decisions. Plenty of them. And I have lucked out. Nothing bad has happened to my child. Thank God.

IF something terrible had happened to my child because I made a wrong judgement, then I pray people would focus on helping me, support me and stand by me. Not judge me for being human.

*Single, attached Norwegian mama to my LoveBug, 2001*
 
*LoveBugMama* is offline  
#123 of 262 Old 05-14-2007, 12:45 PM
 
*LoveBugMama*'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Norway
Posts: 1,602
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by DariusMom View Post
I totally agree.

Really . . . the responses on this thread have shocked and saddened me. The self-righteous condemnation of a family who are living every parent's worst nightmare *every single moment* is deeply upsetting.

At this moment, Maddy's parents are imagining that their daughter is being raped, sodomized, tortured, and abused in any way imaginable if she's even still alive. They don't know where she is, they didn't celebrate her 4th birthday with her, and they don't know if they'll ever see her alive. In fact, they don't know if they'll ever have a body to bury. They might even hope that she's dead to spare her whatever pain she might have been suffering. Can you people stop your torrent of criticisim for one moment and imagine -- really imagine -- what it must be like to be her parents?

I live in continental Europe and I can assure you that, at many resorts and hotel/apartment complexes, it is entirely normal that there are baby phone and "phone up" systems (where you call and can hear what is going on in the room) for parents who are staying there, all of which means that it *is* the norm for parents to leave their kids and dine nearby within the hotel or resort complex. Whether you would do it , especially now that this has happened, is another question, but the fact remains that I've seen these services for parents many times.

We're all going to go to bed with our children safely beside us (or in the same house). Maddy's parents aren't. Let's count our blessings, pray, if you do pray, for Maddy and her parents, and offer compassion and sympathy rather than invective.

Peace.

Thank you, thank you, thank you.


I so, so wholeheartedly agree with everything in this post. Being a Norwegian, living in Norway, I know for a fact that things are very different here than it seems to be in USA. An example:EVERYONE leaves their babies asleep in the stroller in their yard/outside their house. Everyone. It is just the way things are. And it is safe.

*Single, attached Norwegian mama to my LoveBug, 2001*
 
*LoveBugMama* is offline  
#124 of 262 Old 05-14-2007, 01:51 PM
 
DoctorGirlfriend's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Colorado
Posts: 331
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by CrunchyTamara View Post
Why?

Because I have done bad things myself. I have made bad decisions. Plenty of them. And I have lucked out. Nothing bad has happened to my child. Thank God.

IF something terrible had happened to my child because I made a wrong judgement, then I pray people would focus on helping me, support me and stand by me. Not judge me for being human.
Right, but, here's the thing: I can say, "Man, dumb decision" and still feel sympathy/compassion for someone. The two don't cancel each other out.

DS born 4 May 2013.
DoctorGirlfriend is offline  
#125 of 262 Old 05-14-2007, 02:13 PM
 
Calidris's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Liming in sweet T&T
Posts: 4,170
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
yeah but there is a big difference between saying dumb decision, and saying the parents have no one to blame but themselves (as someone actually said somewhere in this thread)

nothing more to say I guess :
Calidris is offline  
#126 of 262 Old 05-14-2007, 02:14 PM
 
riverscout's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: back where I belong
Posts: 2,434
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Okay I said earlier I was out, but WTH, I'm back to make a quick point.

According to Merriam Webster online, blame is defined as:

1 : to find fault with : CENSURE

(and censure is defined as:
1 : a judgment involving condemnation
2 archaic : OPINION, JUDGMENT
3 : the act of blaming or condemning sternly
4 : an official reprimand)

2 a : to hold responsible b : to place responsibility for

IMO, there is a distinct difference between saying you think someone made a mistake or used poor judgement than saying you blame someone.

coolshine.gif

riverscout is offline  
#127 of 262 Old 05-14-2007, 02:42 PM
 
mammal_mama's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Urban Midwestern USA
Posts: 6,772
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by CrunchyTamara View Post
Being a Norwegian, living in Norway, I know for a fact that things are very different here than it seems to be in USA. An example:EVERYONE leaves their babies asleep in the stroller in their yard/outside their house. Everyone. It is just the way things are. And it is safe.
That is just so completely different from my frame of reference, I can't even fathom it. My babies pretty much take their naps right ON me, or next to me, 'til they're about one. My oldest would wake right up if I tried to lay her down, as a smaller baby. My youngest, at 2, still stays latched on to my breast for most or all of her nap.

That said, they have sometimes had their naps outdoors, but I've been out there with them. Maybe the U.S. has a much higher crime rate than most European countries ... it's just mind-boggling for me to imagine feeling safe being in the house with my sleeping baby alone in the yard. But I'm sure there are things about U.S. culture that are shocking to Norwegians.

Susan -- married unschoolin' WAHMomma to two lovely girls (born 2000 and 2005).
mammal_mama is offline  
#128 of 262 Old 05-14-2007, 02:58 PM
 
artgoddess's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Suburban hell
Posts: 13,774
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
I wouldn't do it, but I live in the USA and have a different frame of reference. Reading some of the posts on this thread has made me feel very sad. Someone said that many of those blaming the parents might need to do so as sort of a defense mechanism, the "Things this awful wouldn't happen if the parents hadn't XYZ" need to believe that we can protect our children 100% of the time if we just make the right choices. I hope they are right, because really some of the posts pointing fingers at the parents are just so mean.
artgoddess is offline  
#129 of 262 Old 05-14-2007, 02:58 PM
 
sunnmama's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: surrounded by love
Posts: 6,447
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by CrunchyTamara View Post
Here in Norway it`s ¨pretty normal to see sleeping babies (in strollers) outside cafè`s when the parents are inside. They usually sit very close to the door and/or thw window, though.
I have never done this, but it`s considered both pretty normal and safe here.
Just curious, but do cafes in Norway not have outdoor seating? We just ate out with ds this weekend, and found it really convenient for him to sit in his stroller while we ate (too young for a high chair)....so we chose to sit outdoors and pull up the stroller. I am just wondering why anyone would choose to eat indoors and leave the baby in the stroller outside.....why not just eat outdoors?
sunnmama is offline  
#130 of 262 Old 05-14-2007, 03:02 PM
 
sunnmama's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: surrounded by love
Posts: 6,447
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Electra375 View Post
Having grown up out side the US, I know this exist. I know it too well. In Latin America healthy babies and children are abducted for their organs! .

God help us all
sunnmama is offline  
#131 of 262 Old 05-14-2007, 03:23 PM
 
DoctorGirlfriend's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Colorado
Posts: 331
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Calidris View Post
yeah but there is a big difference between saying dumb decision, and saying the parents have no one to blame but themselves (as someone actually said somewhere in this thread)
I missed that, then.

DS born 4 May 2013.
DoctorGirlfriend is offline  
#132 of 262 Old 05-14-2007, 03:58 PM
 
Quindin's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Posts: 5,761
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by sunnmama View Post
Just curious, but do cafes in Norway not have outdoor seating? We just ate out with ds this weekend, and found it really convenient for him to sit in his stroller while we ate (too young for a high chair)....so we chose to sit outdoors and pull up the stroller. I am just wondering why anyone would choose to eat indoors and leave the baby in the stroller outside.....why not just eat outdoors?
I had my 2 oldest in Denmark. There moms have their babies sleeping outside because they sleep better out in the open - even in daycare centers, you will often see babies being put in outside areas in their big prams to sleep. It is also practical in the winter because they are very well packed in cozy woolen bags, and it would be stupid to unwrap the babies all up wake them if they are sleeping so well as it is.
Yes, in the summer people do sit outside, but most of the year you will see parents sitting indoors in front of the big cafe windows with their babies parked right outside. And no, there is no danger for the babies to fall out: they wear some specially made harnesses attatched to the pram, and the prams pass safety controls to make sure they will never tip (even with a 2yo toddler inside)
Quindin is offline  
#133 of 262 Old 05-14-2007, 04:01 PM
 
*LoveBugMama*'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Norway
Posts: 1,602
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by sunnmama View Post
Just curious, but do cafes in Norway not have outdoor seating? We just ate out with ds this weekend, and found it really convenient for him to sit in his stroller while we ate (too young for a high chair)....so we chose to sit outdoors and pull up the stroller. I am just wondering why anyone would choose to eat indoors and leave the baby in the stroller outside.....why not just eat outdoors?

Because this is Norway!

The weather is not at all warm enough to eat outside all year. Not even half the year. And, yes, today many cafes have outdoor seating. (after our "no smoking in puplic indoorplaces at all" law came a few years ago, almost every cafe has outdoor seating. ) But as I said, the weather here is only warm enough for outdoor eating a few months every year. May, June, July and August at the most.



Here`s a link to a page with a picture of the kind of pram we use here: Pram

*Single, attached Norwegian mama to my LoveBug, 2001*
 
*LoveBugMama* is offline  
#134 of 262 Old 05-14-2007, 04:02 PM
 
*LoveBugMama*'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Norway
Posts: 1,602
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by polihaupt View Post
I had my 2 oldest in Denmark. There moms have their babies sleeping outside because they sleep better out in the open - even in daycare centers, you will often see babies being put in outside areas in their big prams to sleep. It is also practical in the winter because they are very well packed in cozy woolen bags, and it would be stupid to unwrap the babies all up wake them if they are sleeping so well as it is.
Yes, in the summer people do sit outside, but most of the year you will see parents sitting indoors in front of the big cafe windows with their babies parked right outside. And no, there is no danger for the babies to fall out: they wear some specially made harnesses attatched to the pram, and the prams pass safety controls to make sure they will never tip (even with a 2yo toddler inside)


You said it much better.

*Single, attached Norwegian mama to my LoveBug, 2001*
 
*LoveBugMama* is offline  
#135 of 262 Old 05-14-2007, 04:06 PM
 
*LoveBugMama*'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Norway
Posts: 1,602
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by mammal_mama View Post
That said, they have sometimes had their naps outdoors, but I've been out there with them. Maybe the U.S. has a much higher crime rate than most European countries ... it's just mind-boggling for me to imagine feeling safe being in the house with my sleeping baby alone in the yard. But I'm sure there are things about U.S. culture that are shocking to Norwegians.
Personally, I slept with my son when he needed daytime naps. But that`s me. Most others here don`t. When I didn`t wanna sleep when he needed to, I took him out for a walk in his "stroller". (Pram, is that the right word?)

About safety: I can`t remember having heard of a baby being kidnapped/hurt when sleeping outside in the yard in years and years. Maybe not ever. Ofcourse, it happens that Norwegian children gets hurt/kidnapped. But this is very, very rare. Very. Not even 1 child per year, I would guess. In all of Norway.

*Single, attached Norwegian mama to my LoveBug, 2001*
 
*LoveBugMama* is offline  
#136 of 262 Old 05-14-2007, 04:06 PM
 
thebee321's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Posts: 227
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by MelanieMC View Post
I have a friend who went to las vegas with her husband and two children (ages 10 mons. and 2 1/2 at the time) and left them up in the room to go gamble down in the hotels casino. They were on the 18th floor, so it would take them at least 5 min. to get from the ground floor up to their floor (seeing as how it's a busy casino and the elevator stops frequently). They didn't even have a monitor, they just laid them in the center of the bed and left. She told me that they did go and check in about every hour or so, and they were down there from 9pm to around 3 in the morning. :
This is a long thread, and I haven't gotten all the way through, but I just have to say - That is SOOO WRONG!!!! Hotel rooms are broken into all the time. And think of every hotel employee who can just get into every room with their key. Do they trust every hotel employee?
thebee321 is offline  
#137 of 262 Old 05-14-2007, 04:10 PM
 
*LoveBugMama*'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Norway
Posts: 1,602
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by DoctorGirlfriend View Post
Right, but, here's the thing: I can say, "Man, dumb decision" and still feel sympathy/compassion for someone. The two don't cancel each other out.
Ok.

I personally wouldn`t feel comfortable AT ALL saying that. It would feel like I was putting stone to their already extremely heavy burden. And I know that it would make me very sad to know that other mothers around the world judged me when I was having the most difficult, desperately painful time of my life. So I don`t do that to others either.

*Single, attached Norwegian mama to my LoveBug, 2001*
 
*LoveBugMama* is offline  
#138 of 262 Old 05-14-2007, 06:16 PM
 
sunnmama's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: surrounded by love
Posts: 6,447
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by CrunchyTamara View Post
Because this is Norway!

The weather is not at all warm enough to eat outside all year. Not even half the year.
Well, I actually considered that before I asked.....but i am having a difficult time reconciling "too cold for adults to eat outside" and "leave baby outside"
i'll take your word for it that the babies sleep better that way!
sunnmama is offline  
#139 of 262 Old 05-14-2007, 06:37 PM
 
Quindin's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Posts: 5,761
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by sunnmama View Post
Well, I actually considered that before I asked.....but i am having a difficult time reconciling "too cold for adults to eat outside" and "leave baby outside"
i'll take your word for it that the babies sleep better that way!
I was actually JUST about to hit "POST" on a reply I had to her comment, because I have often heard people who don't live in Scandinavia say "how come it is too cold for adults to sit out and not too cold for babies?"

Well, here is a very widely used baby sleeping bag in Norway, Denmark and Sweden. It is 100% thick inner core and therefore insulates the warmth perfectly! The baby sleeps in there absolutely warm and cozy. I am Brazilian and was therefore suspicious at first, so I was amazed everytime I took DD out at how warm and cozy she felt!

I guess people in Scandinavia just know how to dress better than anyone! I mean, my nephew goes to a "Outdoors Preschool" - they don't even own a building and meet everyday at parks, the beach, the woods ALL YEAR AROUND, rain, snow or sun! The children LOVE it and are always warm enough - they are just appropriately dressed for every occasion
Well, enough "off topic" I just wanted show that what sometimes may seem like inconsiderate and crazy parenting behaviour, may not always be.
Quindin is offline  
#140 of 262 Old 05-14-2007, 06:39 PM
 
*LoveBugMama*'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Norway
Posts: 1,602
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by sunnmama View Post
Well, I actually considered that before I asked.....but i am having a difficult time reconciling "too cold for adults to eat outside" and "leave baby outside"
i'll take your word for it that the babies sleep better that way!


I assure you, our babies are not cold. They are in big prams, with lots of clothes and in warm woolen bags. The pram sheilds them from wind, snow and cold weather. They are not at all cold. But to sit outside, eating, midwinter in snow, that`s not very cozy.


Think about it this way: Don`t you ever go outside on cold winterdays? Can you see that there is a difference in going outside for a walk, with baby lying warm in his/her pram, and sitting outside, completely still, eating dinner in the same cold weather?

To be honest, this conversation is making me smile. I wish you could come here and see what I am talking about. See how there is a big, big difference in being an adult with a wintercoat, sittng outside in the cold and being a sleeping baby, protected by your clothes, a woolen bag and a big, warm pram.

*Single, attached Norwegian mama to my LoveBug, 2001*
 
*LoveBugMama* is offline  
#141 of 262 Old 05-14-2007, 10:12 PM
 
sunnmama's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: surrounded by love
Posts: 6,447
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by CrunchyTamara View Post
Think about it this way: Don`t you ever go outside on cold winterdays?

Haha, I've been living in south Florida for the past 11 years....the coldest it gets is about the 40s, and no.....I don't enjoy going outside in that weather

I was raised in Pennsylvania, with cold winters....but I was *always* cold. I've never been a fan of cold weather!

I'm not criticizing the Scandinavian practice at all--simply curious! The babies sound very cozy and happy in their snugglies and their prams
sunnmama is offline  
#142 of 262 Old 05-14-2007, 10:28 PM
 
Hazelnut's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Posts: 3,349
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
No, I would not. Not even with a baby monitor in a smaller hotel- I remember reading in a blog about someone doing this, and it surprised me. Too many flights up (usually), too many people with access to keys, too unfamiliar for the child.
I'm not perfect, but I just wouldn't.
Although, thinking...I don't travel much. I could see how, maaayyybe if the kid were out and you thought you were close, how it could maybe be tempting if you could see the room or something. But I still think that's wrong- I hope I wouldn't do it (certainly wouldn't now). Still seems unfair to a child should they wake up alone. It's still not your house- too many other people, noises, distractions.
Hazelnut is offline  
#143 of 262 Old 05-15-2007, 02:09 AM
 
EdnaMarie's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Posts: 6,148
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
I have one thing to say about Scandanavian babies and prams. I lived in Russia, near Scandanavia (in Karelia) for two years. They also occasionally leave babies outside to sleep in prams. The reason is otherwise the baby will get HOT in all those clothes, and they don't think it's good for the baby to keep waking him or her to dress/undress. Times have changed in Russia and unfortunately the practice was getting more dangerous because of the social disruption following the end of communism, but climate-wise, it was the same deal.

I always worried about DD in the cold winter we had: we'd be out in the cold, she'd be all bundled in the carrier, then I'd go inside and I couldn't take her out of the wrap and undress her in every single store. Besides waking her and making her VERY cranky, that is. But I think she did get very hot in some stores. I tried not to stay very long. I appreciate the fact that I should do everything for my baby but... Occasionally shopping does not seem to me like such a horrible thing to do, parenting-wise.

It's not that the stay-at-home-parent gets to stay home with the kids. The kids get to stay home with a parent. Lucky Mom to DD1 (4 y) and DD2 (18 mo), Wife to Mercenary Dad
EdnaMarie is offline  
#144 of 262 Old 05-15-2007, 06:12 AM - Thread Starter
 
RomanGoddess's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Across the pond
Posts: 2,051
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
What about the other risks that we all take every day? When does taking precautions get to the point where we are being overprotective? At what point does being lax lull us into a false sense of security and cause us to make unwise decisions? We will be going to a Club Med this summer and have signed up our DD (who will be 3) for the "Mini-Club", which I am hoping she will love. Will she be safe there? The child-adult ratio will be within the legal requirements but what if the adults are preoccopied with other children for a couple of minutes and a stranger takes my DD, or she runs into the pool?? Another example, the grocery store. DD likes to sit in the cart for a while but then she wants to get out and walk. Periodically, I have to look at the shelves to pick the food that I want to buy so of course, my eyes are not always on DD. Should I keep her in "shopping cart prison" the whole time? Or is it better to teach her to stick by me, at the risk of losing her a couple of times in the store or even something worse?

Regarding people who have keys to the hotel room, note that the McCann's case was a real break-in through the window. It was not the case of an employee with a key to the room. But of course there is also that risk. I am thinking that the real risk factor in the McCann case, however, was that the room was on the main floor and anyone could get access through the window. I keep thinking about those poor parents and that poor little girl. I sure hope they find her.

Roman Goddess, mom to J (August 2004) and J (April 2009).    h20homebirth.gif signcirc1.gif
RomanGoddess is offline  
#145 of 262 Old 05-15-2007, 11:45 AM
 
limabean's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Posts: 9,590
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 9 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by cmlp View Post
What about the other risks that we all take every day? When does taking precautions get to the point where we are being overprotective? At what point does being lax lull us into a false sense of security and cause us to make unwise decisions?
Good points. I guess each parent has to assess *their perceived* potential risk of each situation and determine their course of action based on that. For me, I can't imagine a situation in which leaving my child unattended in a hotel room would seem like a reasonable risk to take, and I certainly can't imagine referring to the refusal to do so as overprotective.

I, too, am very sad for the McCann family, and FWIW I'd never walk up to them and say, "Nice job letting your daughter get kidnapped," -- I wouldn't offer them anything but the most sincere compassion and kindness -- but since this is a discussion board, I guess I'm talking more conceptually and generally about the scenario rather than literally pointing a finger at that father and that mother.

[Thanks to the pps who explained about why babies are left outside stores in some countries -- for some reason I hadn't thought of the overheating factor! I looooved using my BundleMe when DS was tiny because he could be all snug when we were outside and then I could open it up to give him some ventilation when we were inside. But I'm in Southern California, so I do admit that my experience with extreme temperatures is rather limited! ]

DH+Me 1994 heartbeat.gif DS 2004 heartbeat.gif DD 2008 heartbeat.gif DDog 2014
limabean is online now  
#146 of 262 Old 05-17-2007, 03:24 AM
 
RockStarMom's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: California
Posts: 1,277
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by limabean View Post
Good points. I guess each parent has to assess *their perceived* potential risk of each situation and determine their course of action based on that. For me, I can't imagine a situation in which leaving my child unattended in a hotel room would seem like a reasonable risk to take, and I certainly can't imagine referring to the refusal to do so as overprotective.

I, too, am very sad for the McCann family, and FWIW I'd never walk up to them and say, "Nice job letting your daughter get kidnapped," -- I wouldn't offer them anything but the most sincere compassion and kindness -- but since this is a discussion board, I guess I'm talking more conceptually and generally about the scenario rather than literally pointing a finger at that father and that mother.
Very, very well said. I find it criminal to leave 3 toddlers alone in a hotel room for half an hour. At least with my own toddler, that would simply be asking for something horrific to happen. And I can't help but wonder if it's because the parents are two rich white doctors that they aren't being called out by the media for what they did.
This story has just been haunting me and I feel such deep sorrow for Madeleine. I hope they find her.
RockStarMom is offline  
#147 of 262 Old 05-17-2007, 03:34 AM
 
wwisdomskr's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: west of there, east of here
Posts: 1,890
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Nope...haven't done it and wouldn't do it. No matter how inconvenient it may be. When truly necessary, we pick our sleeping tots up and pop them into a sling...and hope they go back to sleep. Otherwise, we just wait with them until they wake up. Great opportunity to take a nice bath in the tub, watch a grown-up movie, read, splurge on room service, etc...

I wouldn't feel comfortable hiring a stranger to watch my kids, either. Maybe I just haven't been in enough of a pinch... I don't know.

We've talked about paying to bring along a trusted babysitter from home and will probably try that out someday. Or just cajole the grandparents into coming...
wwisdomskr is offline  
#148 of 262 Old 05-17-2007, 01:00 PM
 
Quindin's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Posts: 5,761
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by RockStarMom View Post
And I can't help but wonder if it's because the parents are two rich white doctors that they aren't being called out by the media for what they did.
No, it is because people in the UK are aware of the circumstances of how it happened (that the parents did so under a false sense of security - MANY parents were doing the same in the resort) and know that the price these parents are paying is already high enough. Also we all feel like something so horrible can happen to anyone, even to those of us who would never leave their children alone

As I said earlier, I always found it amazing at how little compassion Americans seem to demonstrate to stories they hear in the news: it is like anger is the automatic reaction. I remember that in the 5 years I lived there, whenever there were news of a child dying, they ALWAYS had a comment like: "police is considering to press charges against the parents" There were no tragedies, no freak accidents - somebody HAS to pay :

And yes, you can throw your tomatoes : I am just fed up of reading horrible things about Madeleine's family in American websites (generally) while for the most part, only finding compassion and support in European ones
Quindin is offline  
#149 of 262 Old 05-17-2007, 02:23 PM
 
thebee321's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Posts: 227
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by cmlp View Post
Regarding people who have keys to the hotel room, note that the McCann's case was a real break-in through the window. It was not the case of an employee with a key to the room. But of course there is also that risk. I am thinking that the real risk factor in the McCann case, however, was that the room was on the main floor and anyone could get access through the window.

That may be my post you are referring to, and I was referring to someone who shared a story about people doing the same thing, but from 9pm to 3am, not checking on the child, in Las Vegas. I'm seriously doubting there is a high level of background checks on every hotel employee in Las Vegas. I would personally never sleep in a room in any hotel without the extra, can only be opened from the inside latches/locks, so I would never leave a child there without those in place.

It sounds like the resort in Portugal is really nice and probably had good background checks on employees.

But Vegas is a little too wild of a place for me to be trusting anyone.
thebee321 is offline  
#150 of 262 Old 05-17-2007, 02:54 PM
 
MtBikeLover's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Chicago Burbs
Posts: 1,644
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Nope - I would never leave my kids alone in a hotel room. We travel a lot and stay in many hotels and it has never crossed my mind to leave them even for a second.
MtBikeLover is offline  
Reply

Quick Reply
Message:
Drag and Drop File Upload
Drag files here to attach!
Upload Progress: 0
Options

Register Now

In order to be able to post messages on the Mothering Forums forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.
User Name:
If you do not want to register, fill this field only and the name will be used as user name for your post.
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.
Password:
Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.
Email Address:

Log-in

Human Verification

In order to verify that you are a human and not a spam bot, please enter the answer into the following box below based on the instructions contained in the graphic.



User Tag List

Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page


Forum Jump: 

Posting Rules  
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are Off