Do you buy into the gifted label? - Page 3 - Mothering Forums

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#61 of 123 Old 06-16-2008, 07:32 PM
 
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In our school district they are pushing for inclusion. So the try as often to include special needs kids in the mainstream program as much as possible. And I think that's beneficial to our society.

(From another post by same poster)

the majority of kids should be kept in the mainstream program with normal expectations
Of course. Inclusion, in most cases, is going to be the most appropriate setting (as required by IDEA's "least restrictive environment"). However, that still means that exceptional students need their specific needs met. Even in a full inclusion classroom, that is going to mean possible push-ins and modification of curriculum/delivery. You will have a "mainstream program", but, it is going to be highly differentiated if you have a moderately gifted child, a profoundly gifted child, a mildly autistic child, and a student with a visual processing disorder. The idea that every child should get the same program is insane. Even for kids who DON'T have any sort of label, there are still going to be "normal" kids (for lack of a better term) who perform at a higher or lower level in this area or that area, or who already DID that section of math in their out of state school, or didn't learn X last year for the same reason, and you need to adjust the program for that...

Mainstreaming and inclusion is great (when done appropriately), but, one of the things you need in order to do it well is a knowledge of the students you are working with, and what their strengths and weaknesses are, and what modifications will need to be made. Keeping "the majority of kids...in the mainstream program with normal expectations" is going to be a tremendous disservice to pretty much ALL of the kids in the classroom. While it sounds egalitarian, it's about as far away from that as you can get.
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#62 of 123 Old 06-16-2008, 07:48 PM
 
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I would say that if you need the school to test your kid to find out that he's gifted - then he's not highly gifted...
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This is not necessarily true. Parents are not experts on "how gifted". Even highly, exceptionally, and profoundly gifted kids act like kids most of the time. Most parents can tell "normal" from "not normal", but can't really put it on a scale like that. You can start to see differences, but your average parent can usually say "I think she's gifted..." not HOW gifted... and the testing helps. As a first time mom, I knew he was doing things other kids weren't but I had no way of knowing if it was advanced or how far advanced. If you are not well versed in what is developmentally target for each age or don't have many other kids to "compare" yours too, if your child is gifted in some areas and not others, if your child tends to display more of the "difficulties" of being gifted vs the "talents" because of their environment or their interests, the school being the first to raise the subject may be what happens. It doesn't mean the child is not gifted. It means the parents may not be savvy to it.

Also, I want to address this idea that gifted somehow means "better". That it means "life is handed on a platter, you will always be happy, always successful". Absolutely not. Honestly, it can be very, very hard with expectations, social difficulties, emotional sensitivies, etc. And kids who are not gifted have every chance as well to be happy and succesful and smart. At the very bottom of it, it is a way of learning and does not have any more emotional aspects than what people assign to it. Not better, not worse. Just different. Honestly- being gifted has a lot of challenges to the child and the family.

I totally agree that many of the programs are slanted toward priveledge and that many students can be "mainstreamed". But I also think that gifted students are unfairly punished when their mere existance is questioned. Just as you would recognize learning disabilites and special education needs of other students, gifted students have the right to learn in environments that are appropriate for them. And in all actually, the "more gifted" you are, the harder it becomes to find those services. The gifted classes may be cushy classes, but once you pass out of the first range of gifted, it becomes practically impossible to find a place in most school districts. What do you do with a 3 year old with a photographic memory who is starting to read and who is doing addition and subtraction and asks about how energy turns the earth and is already moving beyond kindergarten but is still working on the potty and naps and loves Winne the Pooh and carries a teddybear everywhere? "Gifted" is the label that helps accomdate ALL of these needs and emotional and social aspects as well as "academic". Without the support of others who can understand and appreciate children like this- the WHOLE child- kids like this would be totally lost. The label is a way to quickly assess a whole range of needs and common traits.

To the OP, I think if you stick to the bottom line of what is happening- the child is being put in a class that will hopefully give him the best opportunity to learn the way he needs- you will see that it is not better or worse, that there is no need to assign (of feelt hat others are assigning) shame or that other ways of learning are "less than". I would explain giftedness to a child like any other difference- we are all different. We all have different talents, ways of being ourselves, and learning and I would encourage my child yo be happy that their cousin is in a class that will hoepfully provide him with the opportunity for success as well as stress that you are proud of her for finding happiness and success and fulfillment in her school classroom.
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#63 of 123 Old 06-16-2008, 07:57 PM
 
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I'm thinking about 1 guy I knew who was in a public school 'gifted' program (really cool and elite program) with who really was gifted (notice no quotes this time). He was really really smart. But he didn't learn that valuable lesson.

He did great in university and found an awesome job. But then the computer game company he was working for got bought. He was unable to adapt to the new rules because he thought they were 'dumb' - and I'd agree that they were. Well - he lost his job a couple months ago. And now he and his wife and their new baby are screwed. She can't work - health issues. They need a nanny or similar to help with their baby. His mother is really sick and he's the only family so he doesn't want to move away to work in another city. They own a house that he needs a real job to pay the mortgage.

So - what would be more valuable. That he learned 'more' in school and got to learn at his own pace and wasn't constricted by having to fit into a standard classroom.... Or that he learned how to 'play the game' and still had his awesome job doing something he really loved to do?

I know what I think is more valuable.
Well guess what?

I was labelled gifted in school. In elementary school there weren't really gifted programmes and although I was generally an obdient child, I got into a lot of trouble out of boredom. This did nothing for my self-esteem nor did it help me learn how to "be bored." It merely taught me how to fake sick to get out of school, wander off, and hide in the bathroom.

Then I went to a high school that was a true gifted program and that's where I learned to work my butt off... because the material was CHALLENGING and interesting, and it required buckling down to do it. I think I missed two days for illness the whole time, because I didn't want to miss out on anything.

By your logic, kids that have to work hard to learn material are not "learning how to cope with boredom." I just don't see it. Learning hard material involves a certain amount of work.

In NONE of these places did I learn how to navigate the workplace, in any case... I did that in my first job. If a grown adult, who has all the incentives of salary, health insurance, and new baby -- as well as choice -- cannot adjust to follow the rules, that's the grown adult's problem regardless of where s/he went to school.

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#64 of 123 Old 06-16-2008, 08:25 PM
 
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I didn't ask you if my children were highly gifted. I asked you if you thought that highly gifted children should ever receive any academic accommodation? Some examples would be differentiated curricula or classrooms, accelerations, or magnet schools.

It's a yes or no question.
Quoting myself because I'm still waiting for Kessed's answer.

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#65 of 123 Old 06-16-2008, 08:41 PM
 
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I didn't ask you if my children were highly gifted. I asked you if you thought that highly gifted children should ever receive any academic accommodation? Some examples would be differentiated curricula or classrooms, accelerations, or magnet schools.

It's a yes or no question.
Quoting myself because I'm still waiting for Kessed's answer.
I already answered that. I think that extremely gifted children should be given special programing. They should have access to special classes and curriculum.

That isn't what I'm questioning.

What I question is the push to identify children who are marginally gifted by testing them over and over and pestering their teachers until they are recommended for the gifted program. One mom we met at the playground last weekend was happy that after 3 years of having her child tested - he finally qualified as gifted and it would mean that his teacher had to spend more time with him.
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#66 of 123 Old 06-16-2008, 08:42 PM
 
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As for "obedience" vs "independent thought", this is not a gifted issue. You do not have to be gifted to be an independent thinker or to make choices on how you live your live. Gifted people can follow directions too (if they want to, just like anyone else).

ALL people are capable of both choosing to follow directions or to go their own way.

The story above (of the gifted computer guy who didn't like to follow directions), more than anything it tells of our expectations for gifted people- that theY ALWAYS end up successful, at the top of their game, impervious to difficulty and that they are above "human situations". He may be gifted, but he's a person. He can succeed or fail like the rest of us. He can follow or lead, like the rest of us... Gifted is not a free ride through life. It is merely a different way of being.
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#67 of 123 Old 06-16-2008, 09:24 PM
 
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What I question is the push to identify children who are marginally gifted by testing them over and over and pestering their teachers until they are recommended for the gifted program. One mom we met at the playground last weekend was happy that after 3 years of having her child tested - he finally qualified as gifted and it would mean that his teacher had to spend more time with him.
Maybe, just maybe, if our country invested sufficient resources in education, then a child could get enough individualized attention that this mom wouldn't have do to that! But I will make darned sure that my kids' needs are met.

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But here's my question for you - what's the harm? What's the worst that happens? The kid already know the answers by sight - and quickly writes them down and moves onto something else? That doesn't sound to bad.
The harm is that my kid learns that if you're 'smart' you don't have to work very hard because it's already easy. Thus, if you hit something that's hard, it must mean that you're not smart. They don't learn to put in the effort to learn because they're marking time with the thing they already have learned!

Also, what if there isn't anything else for them to move on to? Again, this is a resource issue. But it's what happened to our son in math this year. When he finished his math packet, he got a new one. He was ready for multidigit addition and subtraction, could already do some basic multiplication in his head. Instead, he spent the whole year doing single digit addition and working with concepts up to 100. Umm.... he had that down at 3.

OK, so he won the "Outstanding Math Award" for the year. He didn't actually LEARN any new math! But he was the only 1st grader who was ready for more advanced stuff. Does he have a genius IQ? I seriously doubt it. He was ready for multidigit addition, not advanced math in 1st grade. But with your argument, he's just going to have to sit there and learn at the pace everyone else learns because he's not gifted enough. He has the potential to achieve a lot in math, not just because he's quick with his math facts but because he has a quirky, out of the box kind of thinking.

I don't want him segregated, necessarily, but I DO want him educated at the level that HE needs to be at. I'd be thrilled if he could get the kind of math instruction that he needs.

Luckily, my guy is a compliant, don't-rock-the-boat kid of kid. He doesn't act out when he's bored, he spaces out. But I want him to be a learner, not just someone who's good at worksheets.

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The gifted label doesn't mean that the kids get better or more appropriate education, actually. The onus for that is on the parents. From what I have seen, parents of "gifted" kids often have to keep on fighting to get their kids the education they need, rather than just extra busywork.
:

So, for the OP. Yes, I believe in the 'gifted' label. I know for a fact that some of my most successful university students in terms of grades/completing courses aren't necessarily the truly 'gifted' ones, they're the ones who learned to work their tails off when the going got tough. But I also know that there IS a difference among students.

Do I think that the 'gifted' label is over used? Yes. Do I know that that the label tends to be linked to socio-economic status and education level of the parent? Oh yes. But that doesn't mean that there aren't gifted kids. It just means that pushy parents get their kids more resources. Since when is that news?

I don't think by pretending that all people are the same, we solve the problem. It's like the arguments for diversity. Pretending people are all the same doesn't help diversity a bit.

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#68 of 123 Old 06-16-2008, 09:30 PM
 
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I already answered that. I think that extremely gifted children should be given special programing. They should have access to special classes and curriculum.

That isn't what I'm questioning.

What I question is the push to identify children who are marginally gifted by testing them over and over and pestering their teachers until they are recommended for the gifted program. One mom we met at the playground last weekend was happy that after 3 years of having her child tested - he finally qualified as gifted and it would mean that his teacher had to spend more time with him.
This is an indictment of the local school system - that parents feel that desperate to get their kid a reasonable education. OR - that parent is a bit too invested in her child, and if it wasn't the gifted program, it would be sports or something else.

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#69 of 123 Old 06-16-2008, 09:32 PM
 
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Big dittos to NoHiddenFees, Tigerchild and BrandiRhoades.

I hate these threads. They always go from talking about a principle - egalitarian education that provides each child with what they need (as opposed to the same for all) - to a litany of biases and one-off stories of personal experience as though that changes the principle.

I also hate them because they feel discriminatory. My son is twice-exceptional (gifted via testing and special needs), and the “deficit” aspects of his “differences” are generally met with understanding, rather than rejection or eye-rolling.

Some parents are @sses, whether it's about a gifted label or something else. That doesn't make intellectual giftedness unreal. As the parent of two statistical outliers, I too hate the term gifted because it brings out all this prejudice and misunderstanding.

I also think that parents have responsibility for teaching kids how and when to obey, how to deal with the boredom that is part of everyday life, and how to get on with life positively. I'm not going to leave the acquisition of those skills to years of torture in class.

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#70 of 123 Old 06-16-2008, 09:38 PM
 
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I already answered that. I think that extremely gifted children should be given special programing. They should have access to special classes and curriculum.
My apologies if I missed this. I recall your saying that kids under a certain IQ shouldn't be called gifted, but I can't find your thoughts on programming with respect to highly gifted kids prior to this post.

Thanks for answering in any case.
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#71 of 123 Old 06-16-2008, 09:38 PM
 
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There's another variable at play that explains why the catchment for "gifted" can be larger than the top 2% on IQ tests (or whatever identification methodology that's employed) - gathering enough kids to make a program feasible. My DD's school has 60 children per grade - it's more palatable and justifiable to plan and differentiate for a few of them than for just one. My DS's school has just 20 per grade - there is nothing for him there (thus, we're homeschooling next year).

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#72 of 123 Old 06-16-2008, 09:46 PM
 
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This is an indictment of the local school system - that parents feel that desperate to get their kid a reasonable education. OR - that parent is a bit too invested in her child, and if it wasn't the gifted program, it would be sports or something else.
And I agree with you on that.

I think that there needs to be changes made to our school system (and probably yours).

I don't think that calling a bunch of smart kids gifted and making special programs for them is the answer. It feels like the current climate is to try and get your kid classes as special needs (more resources) or gifted (more resources) hanging the 'normal' kids out to dry.

Smaller class sizes and more teacher/curriculum flexibility would be a better start to a solution.
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#73 of 123 Old 06-16-2008, 10:04 PM
 
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All other conversations aside, I don't like the term "gifted". I think it is a term that makes students who are not "gifted" feel less, and those that are termed "gifted" are set aside as higher. Perhaps "accelerated" is a better term. Everyone is born with different traits, some learn faster, some know more right off, but "gifted" implies that everyone else is lacking, and I just don't think that is true or healthy for either side.

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#74 of 123 Old 06-16-2008, 10:05 PM
 
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And I agree with you on that.

I think that there needs to be changes made to our school system (and probably yours).

I don't think that calling a bunch of smart kids gifted and making special programs for them is the answer. It feels like the current climate is to try and get your kid classes as special needs (more resources) or gifted (more resources) hanging the 'normal' kids out to dry.

Smaller class sizes and more teacher/curriculum flexibility would be a better start to a solution.
Absolutely! I regularly confuse administration because in a single conversation I can be advocating for special needs kids, typical kids who are struggling with curricula that seems to have turned a blind eye to developmental norms, AND gifted kids. I think that we could be doing so much better by ALL children than we are.

I think that this whole gifted thing is because individual parents only have the energy to advocate for their kid. If a label gets your kid what they need, of course parents pursue it. We need to look at this as a societal priority - what kind of adults, and workers, do we want to produce? Where do we want to sit in the global economy?

The other thing about the label - the school system requires it to get services. My DS is totally out there and they've been looking to label him in order to get the resources that may come with the right label. My son is a problem in the classroom, and so he was never going to be off their radar. IMO, for my son, the gifted label was much better than the ADHD or asperger's label they wanted to explore (in terms of applying the correct intervention).

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All other conversations aside, I don't like the term "gifted". I think it is a term that makes students who are not "gifted" feel less, and those that are termed "gifted" are set aside as higher. Perhaps "accelerated" is a better term. Everyone is born with different traits, some learn faster, some know more right off, but "gifted" implies that everyone else is lacking, and I just don't think that is true or healthy for either side.
Yep, hate the term gifted. In fact, I even think "g" in my head as it's just less loaded. If I ever have to refer to it (usually while advocating), I tend to use "high ability."

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#76 of 123 Old 06-16-2008, 10:12 PM
 
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The other thing about the label - the school system requires it to get services. My DS is totally out there and they've been looking to label him in order to get the resources that may come with the right label. My son is a problem in the classroom, and so he was never going to be off their radar. IMO, for my son, the gifted label was much better than the ADHD or asperger's label they wanted to explore (in terms of applying the correct intervention).
And I understand that reasoning.

I think that it's sad that parents have to go that route rather than the schools realizing that each student has different needs.
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#77 of 123 Old 06-16-2008, 10:12 PM
 
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And I agree with you on that.

I think that there needs to be changes made to our school system (and probably yours).

I don't think that calling a bunch of smart kids gifted and making special programs for them is the answer. It feels like the current climate is to try and get your kid classes as special needs (more resources) or gifted (more resources) hanging the 'normal' kids out to dry.

Smaller class sizes and more teacher/curriculum flexibility would be a better start to a solution.
I think this is the true frustration right here. It's not really about handing the gifted label out like candy, it's that the public school model doesn't work for the majority. There just aren't enough resources or flexibility in the school systems to give each child what they need. There never will be with the current model. Gifted labels and special needs classifications exists because this school model is trying to adapt to each child as best as it can with the restraints placed upon it. I believe strongly that this is why there are so many homeschooling families. I don't think these efforts are at the expense of the 'normal' kids, I feel ALL kids pay the price of standard education. Standard is ideal for very few, the rest get hung out to dry or just cope with what they've been given.

By saying that you believe there need to be changes to yours and other school systems is, I'm sure, a gross understatement. But I'm currently homeschooling, so I do have bias.
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#78 of 123 Old 06-16-2008, 10:19 PM
 
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I also think that parents have responsibility for teaching kids how and when to obey, how to deal with the boredom that is part of everyday life, and how to get on with life positively. I'm not going to leave the acquisition of those skills to years of torture in class.
Bolding is mine. My ds, who just turned 7, has a very low tolerance for boredom. Apparently this year, when he was bored with the curriculum he requested to speak with the principal. After conversations with her, the teachers adjusted his curriculum levels. I had no idea this was happening. He goes to a school that doesn't label but differentiates the curriculum for all students. Even so, it's obvious that he still felt it necessary to take things into his own hands. I can't imagine what it would be like for him in a school that didn't provide accelerated curriculum options, or that his requests would have fallen on deaf ears.

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#79 of 123 Old 06-16-2008, 10:59 PM
 
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I do agree that there are gifted children out there and their needs should be met. I do question the defention of "gifted" when it seems that every child I meet these days is gifted and they can get that label from a "teacher evaluation." I'm a teacher, and I'm not qualified to do this. So, to the OP, yes I do "buy" the gifted label, but I think that it is too widely applied especially in some districts.
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#80 of 123 Old 06-16-2008, 11:34 PM
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some people are smarter than others. true story.

i find it truly appalling that we have a school system that does not accommodate students of all levels. honestly though, i don't think the real problem is building more gifted programs. obviously many of those bright but not brilliant students are in gifted classes because they're bored in the regular ones and many of them make good grades working on advanced "for their age" material. i think what we need is more classes for students who are either not smart enough or who do not care to peruse academics beyond high school. our current strategy is to break students into three groups and then teach to the middle of each group. why aren't there classes for students who cannot or will not handle basic levels of college prep material? why can't we train people in a trade they may enjoy and give them the basic math and language skills they'll need to run or help manage the business. that would leave basic level academic classes open for students who are either comfortable or willing to work their asses off to read to kill a mocking bird in the 10th grade and allow gifted students (of which there would be very few) to have access to what they need without eating up all the resources.

i do tend to have a rather politically incorrect opinion on the education of gifted students. i think if we were less ashamed of the fact that some people are just plain smarter than most of us we might feel comfortable investing resources in their educations. perhaps if the brightest of the bright from whatever ethnic or economic background they happened to be were offered truly excellent educations though our school system we'd all have those flying cars my mother was promised in 1958. sure i've met a few ex pats in my day but most of the real live geniuses i've known still live right here in the US. investing in them IS investing in ourselves.

a more appropriate education system that allowed everyone to be challenged would, in my opinion, put an end to the epidemic of gifted infants. it's a sad day in america when a good student has to masquerade as a genius just to get a little schoolwork that doesn't put her to sleep in her books. i can hardly blame parents for begging for entry into these programs. they've been told what the standards are and MANY children easily exceed the expectations of our public education system what would any parent do when they found their child could easily be doing more than is asked of them educationally?
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#81 of 123 Old 06-16-2008, 11:50 PM
 
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A general response to the thread question- Insofar as the classification helps to address the needs of such children, yes, I "buy" into the term 'gifted'. However, the implication/assumption that being gifted is somehow better/superior is a bit daft. What could be special about having been lucky enough to hit the genetic jackpot in terms of beauty/intelligence? The ability (besides other characteristics such as kindness, integrity and the like) to shine and achieve , despite odds , is what is truly admirable. JMO!
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#82 of 123 Old 06-17-2008, 12:02 AM
 
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Originally Posted by Kessed View Post
Even though my classmates had "learned" to do it - they'd forgotten. Examples like that were all over the place.
See, I'm not going to agree w/ much of what you say because my "schooling" philosophy is that of unschooling/child-led learning.

Your classmates had learned it? They were taught it but if they didn't want to learn it yet, of course they aren't going to remember it. You can't force someone to learn.

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I don't know how it's done now, but when I was in elementary school (late 80s), I was tested for the gifted program. And was told I "just barely" didn't make it. I remember the test, it was: "If an apple is a fruit, then a carrot is _____", stuff like that.

I don't know if the "just barely" was true or just to spare my feelings, but it hurt:
  • ONE test determined whether I was gifted or not, no fair, it was orally given by a creepy guy who I didn't like.
  • To learn you aren't smart enough to hang with the 'gifted' set was a bit crushing for a 10 year old.
  • My brother was in the gifted program!!!!

So I'm not a fan of segregating kids, especially based on a single test. Maybe they don't do it that way anymore.
: x 100!!! Several of my sibs tested G&T but I didn't. I have always felt dumber because I didn't get that distinction. Yes I realize this is my thing and I'm not blaming my sibs. And it did take several years to realize that I am extremely talented in music. That's my nitch.

Mamma to 3! nurslings Emma (4) Daniel (3) and our new baby Beth! 10/10/09
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#83 of 123 Old 06-17-2008, 12:16 AM
 
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I've only gotten to pg 2 of this thread, so I hope that I am not repeating things that have already been said. I'll try to be brief !

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Originally Posted by Kessed View Post
(by grade 4 or 5 everyone was 'gifted)
I understand the sentiment here b/c our neighborhood school does much the same thing. Way, way too many kids have a gifted label and it does no good for anyone except to allow the kids in the GT program to feel superior and put down the other kids and to serve as a status symbol for the parents. However, everyone doesn't actually become gifted by grade 4 or 5 anymore than everyone becomes naturally blond when they dye their hair.

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Originally Posted by Kesses
But here's my question for you - what's the harm? What's the worst that happens? The kid already know the answers by sight - and quickly writes them down and moves onto something else? That doesn't sound to bad.
I wouldn't have realized the issue with this until we ran into it with dd and it made me realize that there really is harm. I learned to play the game, do the routine work and get by and I paid for it in college when I had no study skills b/c I had never had to put in any effort. In my older dd I started seeing the harm in 1st grade. Yes, she does need to learn to do things that bore her and deal with it. However, at age 6, she was too young to spend 7 hrs a day being bored out of her mind with a teacher who punished her for responding in her 6 y/o way -- working very, very slowly. Dd developed severe emotional problems to the point that I was very concerned b/c she was telling me she wanted to be dead. For this kiddo of mine, spending the majority of her day doing rote drills results in very slow work and extreme depression.

And, yes, I do buy into the label gifted b/c I have seen how it has affected me and my children even though no one told me what it was that was affecting me when I was younger. Having kids has been a tremendous growth opportunity to realize a lot of things about myself and I am grateful to my children for that. I don't go around touting the term gifted to their cousins, though, b/c it isn't necessary and wouldn't benefit anyone.
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#84 of 123 Old 06-17-2008, 12:23 AM
 
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I'm kinda starting to look back and see the effects of what breezing through elementary school did to my middle and high school years.

I never learned to study and to learn what was taught in class. I'd sit there drawing and spacing out because I picked it up so fast, and didn't need all the extra examples, extra practice and so forth and on that the rest of the class needed in elementary school. By the time I got to middle school, I had totally not learned the study skills and learning skills I needed to get by at all. By then, the work got harder, and I needed to actually put my mind down to it to get it, and I never learned to do that...I think I still suffer from the effects of not being able to apply my brain cells to something that I need to learn that I'm not that interested in.
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#85 of 123 Old 06-17-2008, 10:34 AM
 
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Originally Posted by ChristaN
And, yes, I do buy into the label gifted b/c I have seen how it has affected me and my children even though no one told me what it was that was affecting me when I was younger. Having kids has been a tremendous growth opportunity to realize a lot of things about myself and I am grateful to my children for that. I don't go around touting the term gifted to their cousins, though, b/c it isn't necessary and wouldn't benefit anyone.
ITA. I see just life in general through different eyes now that I have a child vs/ when I didn't. I am so much more appreciative of just the simple things and that is what being a mother has brought me.
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#86 of 123 Old 06-17-2008, 12:15 PM
 
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Yes, there are people who have a (genetic origin) set of traits that classify them as gifted.
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#87 of 123 Old 06-18-2008, 03:35 PM
 
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I find with myself whenever I am reacting strongly to how someone else is labelling themselves or others, it's a sign that I myself have something unresolved going on.
WOW. I don't have time to read this whole thread, although I will come back to it when I am not at work....

I just had to stop and say that your statement above really resonated with me. You have given me so much to reflect on this afternoon! Thank you, I think I am going to print out what I quoted from you, amazing how parenting can bring so much of our own childhood up to the surface for us, isn't it?
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#88 of 123 Old 06-19-2008, 10:28 PM
 
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When my 14 yo dd was going to school in VA, they tested her and said she was gifted. And put into the gifted program, which if i remember right was a once a week separate class. Then we moved to PA, i told them she was in gifted, they said they had to re-test her for PA standards, and afterwards i got a letter saying that she wasn't gifted and "unremarkable." : That kind of turned me off to the whole thing. And i didn't really see this amazing stuff happening in the gifted class anyway.

Sahm mom to three lovely girls, and happily married to a great, sweet guy
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#89 of 123 Old 06-20-2008, 09:02 AM
 
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I haven't read most of this post, but to reply to the OP, I don't buy into the 'gifted' label.

I think that it is a label used by schools as an excuse to not meet the needs of bored kids (and there are other, less flattering labels that are used in the same way for kids who are are having difficulty with materials).

I also think that 'gifted' is a term used by parents who want to live out their own sense of self-genius vicariously through their kids.

All kids have different abilities; labels are unhelpful.
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#90 of 123 Old 06-20-2008, 09:37 AM
 
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I also think that 'gifted' is a term used by parents who want to live out their own sense of self-genius vicariously through their kids.
And for those of us parents who *are* geniuses?

I've heard this sentiment my entire life, and to me it reads as jealousy and nothing more.

For some reason, if my child were an amazing athlete or a brilliant musician, that would be wonderful - celebrated even. If he's a math genius, though, we're somehow supposed to make him just stick it out with kids who are doing work well below his level so that it doesn't make anyone feel badly.

I think what a lot of people are reacting to is the way gifted programs play out in schools, which is an entirely different issue from intellectual distinctions. Many schools also use "gifted" as synonymous for "ambitious" or other terms rather than pure IQ. Many of the test examples people have given aren't IQ tests at all. It really helps to have this discussion with everyone on the same page in terms of what's being discussed.

It's us: DH , DS ; DD ; and me . Also there's the . And the 3 . I . Oh, and .
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