Logical consequences for... Interrupting? Peeing on the furniture? - Mothering Forums
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#1 of 12 Old 10-07-2011, 12:04 PM - Thread Starter
 
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I am having a hard time figuring out some kind of appropriate undesirable consequence for some of my 2 y/o's behaviors.

 

1) Refusing to let me talk to another adult?  When I'm on the phone or trying to have a conversation with DH she will yell, "Don't talk!  Don't talk!"  How can I let her know this is not OK?  The only thing I can think of is taking the conversation in another room and closing the door but I don't think DH would be on board with that, and I'd be worried about leaving her unsupervised during a long phone conversation.

 

2) Peeing on the furniture?  She is daytime potty trained, she very obviously did this intentionally to see what would happen.  (She wouldn't let me wash her in the morning after I took off her overnight diaper, instead she ran into the master bedroom and started rolling around on the bed.  DH told her not to roll on his bed with a dirty bottom, she could get pee on her own bed if she wanted.  So she went on her own bed, announced "I pee!" and sat there giggling while she whizzed.  Luckily her bed has a plastic sheet on it.  She loves helping me change the sheets so that isn't any kind of deterrent.) 

 

3) Refusing to get dressed to go to day care?  *I* need her to go because I have to work, but *she* doesn't have a lot of motivation to get ready on time if she doesn't feel like it.

 

4) Screaming and banging on the door when DH is trying to attend a meeting (he attends work meetings remotely at odd times due to international coworkers)?

 

TIA!


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#2 of 12 Old 10-07-2011, 12:35 PM
 
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2's are still so young...all 3 of the things you mention are pretty typical 2 yr old phases in my experience.

For the 1st one if you're talking to a friend perhaps you could ask your friend if they'd be willing to say hello to DD over the phone. Maybe DD just wants to be on the conversation too? If you're talking to someone other than a friend I would excuse yourself from the convo for a moment and address DD's needs. Explain to her that you need to finish the convo w/o her interrupting. Give her 2 options of things to do while you finish up. You may do X or Y while I'm on the phone. If she still interrupts you could either choose that she must stay in her room playing while you finish or you hang up and call back later while she's sleeping or otherwise completely engaged in an activity.

For 2 if peeing on the furniture is a regular occurrence insisting that she keep a diaper on at all times would be my strategy. If it was a one time pee on her bed for kicks and she helped strip the bed and put new sheets on that would be complete for me. I know it's irritating and you want her to get the message that it's not appropriate, but anything more than the consequence of helping rectify the situation would be punishment as far as I can think and that's not the way you want to go. You can tell her things like remember pee only belongs in diapers and the potty not on your bed.

For 3 if she struggles and throws a fit or just plain refuses to get dressed you can give her different options depending on the scenario. Perhaps it's because she doesn't like the clothes you've picked out. You could ask her if she'd like to help pick out her outfit (the night before) or give her 2 choices this outfit or this one. If she doesn't like those 2 options stand your ground. Offering a 2 yr old too many choices usually ends up no where good. If it's not about the clothes and she just doesn't want to get dressed you could give her a time limit and maybe set a timer (maybe make it a race) and tell her you have 5 minutes to get dressed, when the timer goes off I'll come back. If you're not dressed I'll dress you myself and then follow through no matter what. If she's pitching a royal fit name the feelings she's expressing-your angry that I'm dressing you, etc. Stay calm and gentle but keep dressing. OR you can ask would you like to dress yourself or would you like mommy to do it? Even though you know she can do it herself she may just want that one on one time w/you in the morn even if it's just a few minutes of connection.

Good luck! I hope these help a little :)

 


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#3 of 12 Old 10-07-2011, 06:11 PM
 
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Originally Posted by mambera View Post

 

2) Peeing on the furniture?  She is daytime potty trained, she very obviously did this intentionally to see what would happen.  (She wouldn't let me wash her in the morning after I took off her overnight diaper, instead she ran into the master bedroom and started rolling around on the bed.  DH told her not to roll on his bed with a dirty bottom, she could get pee on her own bed if she wanted.  So she went on her own bed, announced "I pee!" and sat there giggling while she whizzed.  Luckily her bed has a plastic sheet on it.  She loves helping me change the sheets so that isn't any kind of deterrent.) 

 

 


Was the peeing on the bed just a one-off thing? TBH you don't really have a leg to stand on here because she did just what your DH told her to do. She didn't pee on his bed, she went and did it on her own. 

 

If it's a regular occurrence then, as the PP said, she probably needs to have a nappy on all the time.

 


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#4 of 12 Old 10-07-2011, 06:27 PM
 
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I would *not* make a big deal out of the peeing on the bed because all the attention could cause her to want to do it again (ah the joys of the 2yr old mind).  I'd just let it go completely... don't bring it up again... and if you're lucky it was a one-off.  If it does happen again then I'd probably go the pp's route of saying pee pee needs to go in the potty or a diaper.  If you don't choose to put it in the potty then you need to wear a diaper.

 

Re. the adult conversations.  Um.. well...  When they're this little you just aren't likely to get a lot of meaningful and/or long conversations in.  Whenever you're obviously and actively *not* engaging with them is when they suddenly most desire your attention.  I'd save phone chats (except for quickies) for when she's already engaged in something else (deep into her pretend play or maybe watching a show if you guys do tv), or when someone else (dh) is there to be with her.  You can also try setting her up with something exciting (playdough, playing with water in the sink, whatever) and then make your call.  And/or do as much as you can via email.

 

It's great to start the process of getting her to respect your convos but don't expect overnight miracles.  Start her off by teaching her to say "excuse me", then tell her that you need to finish your thought and then it'll be "her turn".  Then finish your thought quickly and respond to her.  Teach her that her polite "excuse me" and waiting quietly (even though for only a short time to begin with) will be met by you "keeping up your end of the bargain" and responding to what she had to say.  In time she will learn to wait patiently a bit longer, but it will take a while before she gets there.

 

Regarding getting dressed and out the door I'd start making getting dressed the first thing you do when you get up.  Even on days when she doesn't go to daycare.  Just make it a simple fact of existence that we a) get up and then b) get dressed.  Having it done long before you need to head out the door really takes the stress off, and having it built into the everyday routine helps kids accept it better.  Another thing we have done in the past with dd is have her sleep in her clothes for the next day.  Kid's play clothes don't show that they've been slept in - no one will know.  ;)


Kate, mom to 7 year old Djuna and 4 yr old Alden. Missing our good friend Hal the cat who died June 2, 2010

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#5 of 12 Old 10-08-2011, 01:07 PM
 
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Since some other suggestions were already offered for the others i'll just suggest that while your dh is having a meeting to take her out of the house.  2 is still quite young to understand the things that adults feel are important, she's just worried about what she wants;)


Cathy mom to 13 y/o DD, 10 y/o DD, 7 y/o DS

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#6 of 12 Old 10-09-2011, 02:56 AM - Thread Starter
 
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Thanks for the suggestions everyone.

 

Re the peeing thing, I'm hoping it is limited experimentation but she did do something similar again the next day - but took the initiative to place a PUL-backed change pad between her bum and the couch.  She managed to keep every drop on the change pad.  I was more amused than anything since all I had to do was drop the change pad in the wash but I am a bit worried this may become a 'phase.'

 

So if I did want to insist that if this continues she wear diapers in the daytime, how would I enforce that?  She is just going to take the diaper off if she doesn't want to wear it?  It's the same problem as the getting-dressed - I used to just dress her myself if she didn't want to get dressed but at this point when I try that everything is off again ten seconds after I let her go.  (Also I am due to deliver soon, she is pretty strong and I'm really reaching the point where I am not physically able to hold her down and dress her anymore.)

 

Re overnight miracles - don't worry, my expectations are pretty low as far as not getting interrupted by a 2 y/o, it's more that I don't want to end up with a 5 y/o who still wants to swing from my neck and yell MommyMommyMommy every time I try to talk to someone else.  That's why I'd like to be able to come up with some kind of motivation for her *not* to do that.  I like the suggestion for 'excuse me' rewarded by attention, thanks! - that is so much better than eventually giving her attention because I am so irritated (which is just reinforcing the irritating behavior).

 

Re taking her out of the house for DH's meetings: Believe me I am trying my darndest (see #3 in my OP) but I can't take her to day care with no clothes on.  (These are usually morning meetings and they make the am routine much harder because DD just wants to get in the room and play with DH, she sees him as a great alternative to getting dressed and going to school.)


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#7 of 12 Old 10-09-2011, 08:48 AM
 
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Have you seen G diapers? They fasten in the back so they're more difficult to remove. Of course they're designed to be worn backwards but perhaps even a regular disposable and surely any prefold cloth dipe would work backwards. If she refuses to wear a dipe and she insists on peeing anywhere but the potty can you babygate her into a room that's easy to clean, as in one w/minimal cloth furniture and carpet like the kitchen or dining room? And tell her this is the only space you're allowed to be in if you won't wear a diaper. Pee doesn't clean up well from furniture and carpets...

 

Ah I see your challenge now w/getting her dressed...being almost due w/#2 would put a crimp in things for sure. Another couple ideas...I hate reward systems, but perhaps some external motivation for a short time might be in order. You could institute a sticker chart for everyday that she gets dressed or that you dress her and she doesn't fuss and leaves her clothes on. At the end of the week w/stickers everyday or stickers 5 days in a row so you include weekends maybe she gets a treat or special activity that you decided ahead of time. OR what if you talk to her teachers at school about the problem and see if they're willing to dress her at school and you take her to school in her pj's?

Keep us posted!


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#8 of 12 Old 10-09-2011, 09:02 AM
 
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Is it that she wants to be naked?  Or wants to stay in her pjs?  If it's not that she wants to be naked, but just doesn't want to have to change clothes, then I'd totally do the get-her-dressed-the-night-before thing.  Do it after her bath (if you do one before bed).  She'll be clean, the clothes will be clean, and they won't get dirty before morning.

 

Another thing you can try is a routine chart.  Sit down together one day (at a neutral time - not during a "we have to get dressed and get out of the house" argument) and talk about what needs to be done every morning before leaving the house.  Draw pictures to show each step.  Have her help to make the chart by colouring the pictures or decorating with stickers or what-have-you.  Then every morning put her "in charge".  Get her to point to each picture and "tell you" what each step is, one-by-one. 


Kate, mom to 7 year old Djuna and 4 yr old Alden. Missing our good friend Hal the cat who died June 2, 2010

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#9 of 12 Old 10-10-2011, 10:53 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mambera View Post
DH told her not to roll on his bed with a dirty bottom, she could get pee on her own bed if she wanted.  So she went on her own bed, announced "I pee!" and sat there giggling while she whizzed.  Luckily her bed has a plastic sheet on it.  She loves helping me change the sheets so that isn't any kind of deterrent.) 

 

 



Two year olds are very literal.  He did say she could do that.   LOL... think it's a little funny.  

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#10 of 12 Old 10-10-2011, 12:55 PM - Thread Starter
 
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So the peeing thing has not happened again, luckily.  It's been a few days.  I'm hoping it's over.

The confining-her-to-one-room idea is interesting, only the way things are here it wouldn't really be logical, more punitive - we have wood floors everywhere and when she decided to start using the potty we just pulled up all the rugs and let her run around naked from the waist down.  Very easy cleanup and it worked great.  Of course that is now her preferred state of (un)dress, which is contributing to the getting-dressed problem.  But I think it would be doable to say that she can't come on the couches, beds, etc. unless she consistently keeps it in the potty or wears a diaper.  Anyways I don't think it's going to be necessary, thank goodness.

 

Re the morning routine, she does already go to bed in a clean shirt which, if it survives breakfast unscathed, will be worn to school.  But she wears a diaper to bed, and in the morning she needs a wash and at least one, usually two potty trips.  It's getting her into her underwear, pants, socks, and shoes after that that poses the problem.

 

I could try the sticker thing.  I don't think she has the executive functioning to handle a chart but an instant reward for getting dressed (although that's not really the precedent I was hoping to set) might be effective.  DH does a lot with bribes/blackmail.  I don't like it much but it does work.  'Putting her in charge' doesn't really work unless she is already predisposed to the desired behavior anyway.  She'll just shout the correct answer ("Time to put socks on!") over her shoulder while running off to engage in her preferred activity.


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#11 of 12 Old 10-10-2011, 05:02 PM
 
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I could try the sticker thing.  I don't think she has the executive functioning to handle a chart but an instant reward for getting dressed (although that's not really the precedent I was hoping to set) might be effective.  DH does a lot with bribes/blackmail.  I don't like it much but it does work.  'Putting her in charge' doesn't really work unless she is already predisposed to the desired behavior anyway.  She'll just shout the correct answer ("Time to put socks on!") over her shoulder while running off to engage in her preferred activity.



I didn't actually mean a sticker chart.  Just a chart to make together and then follow along each morning.  Sometimes if you get them involved it makes them more amenable to going along with things (like the kid who will eat salad... only because she picked the veggies from her own garden and helped wash and chop them, etc).  But I hear what you're saying about that not being such a great idea with her personality.  It would have worked with my ds, but not with my dd who sounds a lot like yours!

 

If you are interested in doing minor sticker bribery and think it would work with her then it might be a good short-term, get-her-on-track-with-the-routine solution.  :)  I also use minor bribery/distraction like a yummy snack to eat in the stroller/car or even while dressing (!) to get things moving along sometimes.

 


Kate, mom to 7 year old Djuna and 4 yr old Alden. Missing our good friend Hal the cat who died June 2, 2010

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#12 of 12 Old 11-01-2011, 02:21 PM
 
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It's not bribes.  

 

My mother always told me-  We can all be bought, we're just haggling over the price.

 

She has a price, too.  And since she's 2, I can promise you it's a really really cheap price.

 

My firstborn was great at letting me talk on the phone.  It was his sucker time.  $4 bag of dum dums, no more problem.  Look, talking on the phone is a treat for me, so why not give her a treat too?  When the act of eating the dum dum is not that interesting, strip her to her undies and put a spray bottle of water on the tray.  Then let her spray water, then "paint" with the dum dum.  Wipe her down or toss her in the bath when you're done. In fact, the bath gave me an extra 15 minutes of talk time.

 

1)  let her dress a doll for school.  Paper dolls are easier than real dolls- they make magnetic ones now.

2)  make a paper chart with magnet backs, get creative with all the publishing software we have available now and actually print HER picture and some of HER favorite clothes and make a chart where she can put the magnet clothes on her magnet paper doll of herself on the chart, as you dress her, then they can celebrate together (paper her and real her) that they are dressed and ready to go.

3)  make sure you have a full length mirror at her level so she can see herself dressed and ready to go.

4)  I kept a stash of cookies in the car that were ONLY for eating if we were fully dressed and buckled into our car seats.  

 

Make life FUN and something she WANTS to be a part of!   And then have an expectation that she WANTS to be a part of the JOY!  

 

Look, I just went on a trip to Target with my FOUR youngest kids-  12, 10, 7 and 5.  OH there was a continuous chorus of "Ohhhhhh!" and "pretty" and even 100 "Can I have's" but all I had to say is "That's not what we came for, we came for socks and undies and to check the Halloween clearance aisle."  I just lather, rinse, repeat... and then "Last call for socks and undies, we're on the home stretch making a beeline right for the cash register! Last call!"  We saw kids on every aisle crying and screaming for what they wanted, but I had a troupe of kids who sighed and said "I wish...well, it's not what we came for."  And then a sibling replied "Can you IMAGINE cleaning up your room if you bought EVERYTHING you asked for!!!"

 

 

Tossing in a couple more ideas--   hang a quilt on a track on the wall in the room DH makes his calls.  When he gets a call, pull the quilt across the door for extra sound proofing.

--  Put a sign on the door that says SSHHHHHHH!!!!  Daddy's working!"  With a picture of HER making the SHHHHH gesture with Daddy over her shoulder on a mock phone call for the photo op.

-- 1 spoonful of pb + 1 spoonful of jelly + one zipper baggy + one piece of tape over the zipper thing =  "finger painting" with no mess.  Plus, after the PB&J have been kneaded and mushed together, you can snip the corner and squeeze it out onto crackers or bread and spread.  Gives you a nice quiet activity for phone calls.

-- Do the same, but use some instant pudding and then make a parfait to eat when you're off the phone.

-- Magna doodle.

 

I made her a sticker book with colorful papers from the scrapbooking department, covered with clear contact paper. I sewed mine with rainbow thread, but you could staple.  Mine collected her stickers in her very own book-- the front page of which said "E's Sticker Book!" and had a photo of HER on the front.

 

 

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