Including kids in your normal life - Page 4 - Mothering Forums
Forum Jump: 
Reply
 
Thread Tools
#91 of 105 Old 11-04-2005, 12:12 PM
 
sunnysideup's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Posts: 3,483
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pandora114
ETA: that's why there are things that are dubbed "Adult" things. Not because they are diliberately made to exclude children, but they are just not AGE APPROPRIATE activities to expect young children to put up with, but Adults ENJOY. It isn't fair to the kid to drag them with, and it isn't fair to the ADULT either to give it up totally. Hence why a babysitter is a good idea.
Right. I don't think anyone is advocating dragging children anywhere against their will. My problem is with the "not everyone should have to put up with children" attitude.
sunnysideup is offline  
#92 of 105 Old 11-04-2005, 12:14 PM
 
Quindin's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Posts: 5,761
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
:
Quindin is offline  
#93 of 105 Old 11-04-2005, 12:19 PM
Banned
 
Pandora114's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Shamelessly using "devices"
Posts: 7,100
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
You have a point. It is a crappy attitude. But the onus is on the parents for forcing the kids to be in an age UN-Appropriate situation. That's where I would acctually go up and say something.

seriously. If I pay out the nose for an Andrew Lloydd Webber musical ticket, and someone brings a rowdy toddler to the show, I would get upset and probably grumble. It isn't fair to the child, and it isn't fair to the other people who paid out the freeking nose for the tickets to have their show disrupted.

Common courtosey. That's all it's really called.
Pandora114 is offline  
#94 of 105 Old 11-04-2005, 12:20 PM
 
HappyHSer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Posts: 296
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Pandora, I agree almost totally with your sensible post.

Except for this:
Quote:
but because LOTR IS NOT AGE APPROPRIATE for anyone under the age of 10 IMO. It's violent, scary..and no kid can grasp something like that...I bet those poor bubs were having night terrors about the ringwraiths for months....
2 of my 3 saw the LOTR movies under the age of 10. I trust my ability to judge their readiness. And also assist them with preparation, processing and context.

I don't disagree that they can be inappropriate for some children. I just disagree with the across the board age 10 designation.
HappyHSer is offline  
#95 of 105 Old 11-04-2005, 12:24 PM
Banned
 
Pandora114's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Shamelessly using "devices"
Posts: 7,100
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Well I'm talking about toddlers. I saw kids under the age of 4 being dragged into seeing LOTR with their parents. Now that's a bit too young don't you think? and as I said that the 10 was an IMO * O standing for Opinion, not Ovulation* statement. Some kids can grasp it before then some kids can't.
Pandora114 is offline  
#96 of 105 Old 11-04-2005, 12:40 PM
 
The4OfUs's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Upstate NY
Posts: 5,102
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
OK, here's my 2 cents on the topic.

I don't care if you're 5 or 50, it irks me to no end when people are disruptive and inconsiderate of others out in public. Common courtesy and respect for others seems to be a rare commodity. Honestly, I never find fault with kids that are wild out in public (and I'm not talking about normal tantrums, or feisty behaviors, I'm talking about seriously aggressive and/or disruptive behavior), I am upset with the parents for not caring enough to teach their children how their actions affect others.

Adults who are rowdy and inconsiderate in public irritate me. Children who are rowdy and inconsiderate in public make me wish their parents would teach them a little bit about respect for themselves and others.

I just hate that so many adults don't give a fig about other people or their desire to enjoy public outings, and don't try to teach their children to respect themselves and others, so their kids are as inconsiderate as they are.

For me, it doesn't come down to whether or not kids "should" be out in public at place x or place y....it's about the parents being considerate of the other people wherever they are so that if their child is having an off day, or is dirsupting the atmosphere, that they care enough about the other people out and about trying to enjoy themselves that they will leave....I have left restaurants a couple times with my DS in tow when he just wasn't up for being out, because to me it's not fair for the other patrons to have to handle his unhappiness...but I have enjoyed restaurant outings with him as well, when he's up to it, and nearby patrons have delighted in him. I have taken DS to secluded corners of stores to work through a tantrum because to me it's not fair for the other shoppers to have to listen to it....but I have had many, many more wonderful trips with him where he flirts with anyone in sight and we have a great time. I am not angry about the times I leave or go to a more private area to let DS work through a tantrum, or about DS being unhappy or tantruming - I support him expressing his emotions and am teaching him appropriate ways to do so as he grows and learns. For me it's just part of being considerate of the other people I am around when we're out in public...until DS is old enough to have self control and understand that there is a time and place for everything, including times and places to be calm and courteous, I will be considerate for him, and considerate of others around me who are just out trying to have a good time.

Unfortunately, I don't think that is a prevailing attitude in the US (I am NOT suggesting this about anyone in particular on this thread, it's just a general statement). It seems that the prevailing attitude is that you should do whatever you want, whenever and wherever you want, and that just really bothers me...it bothers me that people don't care enough about other people to see if others are uncomfortable.

I'm not looking for a Stepford society (believe me, I can be as goofy and silly as the next guy, play hide and seek with shopping carts and sing silly songs with DS out in public, so I'm not prissy or anything), just a little common courtesy if someone is disrupting the enjoyment of others (whether adult or child) ...I have no problem with tantrums or meltdowns, or kids being silly, inquisitive and spunky, I just have a problem with aggressive and disruptive behavior, from children OR from adults...but I never "blame" the child, I feel sad for the child and upset with the parent.

To me, the issue when a child is disruptive in public is not with the child, but that the parents is not teaching or modeling to their children the value of commnity, respect for themselves, responsibility, and caring for others.

OK, so maybe that was more like my 2 dollars' worth I know some will disagree with me, but that's the beauty of an opinion. Everyone has one!!

Heather, WAHM to DS (01/04)DD (06/06). Wed to DH(09/97)
The4OfUs is offline  
#97 of 105 Old 11-04-2005, 12:44 PM
 
HappyHSer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Posts: 296
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
I have no problem with tantrums or meltdowns, or kids being silly, inquisitive and spunky, I just have a problem with aggressive and disruptive behavior, from children OR from adults...but I never "blame" the child, I feel sad for the child and upset with the parent.
Great post. I agree with you. I'll add that I find allowing even a newborn or infant to cry unresponded to is rude. Yes, I expect babies to be out and about. And, yes, I expect them to cry.

But allowing them to cry without responding to them might be a parenting philosophy - it's also a rude decision on the part of the parents.

If a parent believes in some form of CIO, I think they need to confine that to private situations.
HappyHSer is offline  
#98 of 105 Old 11-04-2005, 12:45 PM
 
Greenie's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: San Antonio
Posts: 2,365
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by momoffour
Not everyone should have to put up with crabby old people when they are paying good money to eat in an expensive restaurant, or watch a movie, or have a girl's night out. Those are really the only places that I don't think the elderly should go, and in those situations, they're probably bored, anyway.
I don't think you are understanding what I'm saying. I've explained what I mean, you're taking it the wrong way. I'm speaking as someone who isn't a parent yet. I thought that since most of the members are Mothers, it might be nice to get a different point of view. I'm not age discriminating. I'm not saying that children are something to be put up with.

BUT, in these situations, where the mom was at dinner and got pasta thrown at her, that's a situation where you are putting up with unacceptable behavior. Bringing a nursing baby to an event that was known to be 'NO ONE UNDER 12' is unacceptable. If I'm going to pay $40 for my dinner, and it's later in the evening, and it's not a restaurant geared torwards children (I mean, doesn't even have a comprehensive Children's Menu), I don't want to hear loud misbehaving children.

If the kids are cool, and acting appropriate for the situation (I.E. Enjoying their dinner, playing quietly and coloring in their notebook) I have NO PROBLEM!

My problem is with parents who drag their cranky baby out at night when the child obviously wants to be in the safety and quiet of their own home. Children are people, and should not be 'seen and not heard'. I work in a toy store, for crying out loud!

The ONLY point that I was trying to make, was that there are certain situations where leaving your children at home is preferable.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pandora114
That's why there are things that are dubbed "Adult" things. Not because they are diliberately made to exclude children, but they are just not AGE APPROPRIATE activities to expect young children to put up with, but Adults ENJOY. It isn't fair to the kid to drag them with, and it isn't fair to the ADULT either to give it up totally. Hence why a babysitter is a good idea.
This is all that I was trying to say.
Greenie is offline  
#99 of 105 Old 11-04-2005, 12:51 PM
 
Greenie's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: San Antonio
Posts: 2,365
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by QueenOfThePride
:
Thanks!! I like it too!

Quote:
Originally Posted by HappyHSer
Please call the company in question and register a report. Her behavior, comments and demeanor were unprofessional and her expectations unrealistic.
I agree here!! You need to let the company know. Loraxc, you shouldn't have to put up with this kind of behavior. Maybe they can give you a break on your bill or something.
Greenie is offline  
#100 of 105 Old 11-04-2005, 12:57 PM
 
Greenie's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: San Antonio
Posts: 2,365
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by donosmommy04
For me, it doesn't come down to whether or not kids "should" be out in public at place x or place y....it's about the parents being considerate of the other people wherever they are so that if their child is having an off day, or is dirsupting the atmosphere, that they care enough about the other people out and about trying to enjoy themselves that they will leave....I have left restaurants a couple times with my DS in tow when he just wasn't up for being out, because to me it's not fair for the other patrons to have to handle his unhappiness...but I have enjoyed restaurant outings with him as well, when he's up to it, and nearby patrons have delighted in him. I have taken DS to secluded corners of stores to work through a tantrum because to me it's not fair for the other shoppers to have to listen to it....but I have had many, many more wonderful trips with him where he flirts with anyone in sight and we have a great time. I am not angry about the times I leave or go to a more private area to let DS work through a tantrum, or about DS being unhappy or tantruming - I support him expressing his emotions and am teaching him appropriate ways to do so as he grows and learns. For me it's just part of being considerate of the other people I am around when we're out in public...until DS is old enough to have self control and understand that there is a time and place for everything, including times and places to be calm and courteous, I will be considerate for him, and considerate of others around me who are just out trying to have a good time.
:
Greenie is offline  
#101 of 105 Old 11-04-2005, 03:14 PM
 
loraxc's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: In the Truffula Trees
Posts: 4,500
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
I actually thought about calling, but believe it or not, my husband knows this woman (they both work for the city) and they have friends in common, so I'm unwilling to make waves. Anyway, she didn't really SAY anything (except the dog comment, which you COULD consider a "joke"). It was just her attitude and body language.

As to not responding to a crying child in public...of course I wouldn't have done this with my little baby, but now that I have a toddler we sometimes do find that the best course of action with tantrums is to sit by quietly rather than fussing around hysterically trying to "fix" it. If she does this in a public place, I certainly take her aside as much as I can, but sometimes there isn't a deserted spot.

As for taking cranky babies out at night...well, you never know. We just flew recently, and our flights were horribly delayed, and poor DD was crying and fussing on the shuttle to the airport parking lot. An older woman looked at us and said to her husband, "It's too late for a child that age to be out!" Well...I AGREE...but I didn't have any choice!

grateful mother to DD, 1/04, and DS, 2/08

loraxc is offline  
#102 of 105 Old 11-04-2005, 04:08 PM
 
Greenie's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: San Antonio
Posts: 2,365
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Loraxc, I just can't beleive that she would come into your house and act that way. Did she know who your husband is? What a meanie!!

I understand that not every situation has an 'easy out' with small children, and I really applaud that any parent who actively tries. I just remember that lady in the gorcery store IGNORING this child for close to 20 minutes. The girl was probably between 2 and 3, and screaming her little head off, and the lady with her just didn't do ANYTHING. I'm sure she could have taken her outside for a moment, or something.

There are always going to be situations that are unavoidable. I feel bad for anyone travlening with a little one. There's a HUGE difference between a must situation (delayed flights) and an optional one (nice dinner out).

Oh, well, though. I'll probably change my tune once little guy makes his debut!
Greenie is offline  
#103 of 105 Old 11-04-2005, 04:42 PM
 
The4OfUs's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Upstate NY
Posts: 5,102
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by loraxc
As for taking cranky babies out at night...well, you never know. We just flew recently, and our flights were horribly delayed, and poor DD was crying and fussing on the shuttle to the airport parking lot. An older woman looked at us and said to her husband, "It's too late for a child that age to be out!" Well...I AGREE...but I didn't have any choice!
Hey loraxc, regarding your earlier experience in your house, I would have to place that woman from the utility company in the rude and inconsiderate category....she was in YOUR house....ugh. Anyway....on to your other part,m quoted above.

I am sure you were trying to make the best of a lousy situation that was out of your control, and that you were comforting your DD as much as you could in the given situation.....I'm not talking about lousy situations that are out of our control, where all you can do is make the best of it....you can pretty well tell when things like that are going on, and again, that lady who commented is a dolt. My comments were more directed to the day to day things I see happening in various situations where people just don't seem to care if their child (or they themselves) are acting in a way that is disruptive to everyone else around, and they don't seem to care about it at all.

Heather, WAHM to DS (01/04)DD (06/06). Wed to DH(09/97)
The4OfUs is offline  
#104 of 105 Old 11-04-2005, 04:54 PM
 
jayayenay's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Posts: 1,612
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
.
jayayenay is offline  
#105 of 105 Old 11-04-2005, 05:00 PM
 
johub's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Posts: 2,270
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by HappyHSer
Pandora, I agree almost totally with your sensible post.

Except for this:


2 of my 3 saw the LOTR movies under the age of 10. I trust my ability to judge their readiness. And also assist them with preparation, processing and context.

I don't disagree that they can be inappropriate for some children. I just disagree with the across the board age 10 designation.

My 3 year old loves LOTR. But it is true he didnt like it when he was 5 months old and I brought him to the theater in his sling. (too loud).
johub is offline  
Reply

Quick Reply
Message:
Drag and Drop File Upload
Drag files here to attach!
Upload Progress: 0
Options

Register Now

In order to be able to post messages on the Mothering Forums forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.
User Name:
If you do not want to register, fill this field only and the name will be used as user name for your post.
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.
Password:
Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.
Email Address:

Log-in

Human Verification

In order to verify that you are a human and not a spam bot, please enter the answer into the following box below based on the instructions contained in the graphic.



User Tag List

Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page


Forum Jump: 

Posting Rules  
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are Off