when to start with manners? - Mothering Forums

Forum Jump: 
 
Thread Tools
Old 12-06-2005, 09:48 PM - Thread Starter
 
Veronique's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Canada
Posts: 183
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
My son is still quite young to learn about manners etc. but I'd still like some advice on teaching him 'thank-you, good morning," etc.
My SIL seems to always be telling her kids (ages 5 and 9) to say please and thank-you, but they never do!
They come to my house, don't greet me, open the fridge, take a drink of pop from the bottle and sit down on the sofa. They find the remote control, flick on the TV, eat their bag of chips they've brought in and when they're done with their snack, the bag goes on the floor and the hands are wiped on my cushions. :
Anyways, all the while this is going on, their mom is reminding them: "Say hello to your Aunt Vero....Ask for permission if you want a drink.....put your feet down....saying thank-you....put the bag in the garbage....wash your hands...."
Her kids are not bad kids, but they just don't get how to act in someone's house. It seems as though my SIL is trying to teach them proper manners, but they just simply ignore her.
I really don't want my DS to act like this! How do I instill these values and when do I start?
Veronique is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Old 12-06-2005, 10:56 PM
 
luckylady's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: on a little speck in the universe
Posts: 1,796
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
start when they are babies and the secret is really quite simple - treat them as you want them to treat others. When they hand you something, say thank you. When you ask them something, say please. If they are playing and you need to interrupt, say "excuse me, may I interrupt you?"

Also, children will do what is expected of them - meaning when DD was a baby after we played with something we played the clean up game - and now Ihave a 3-1/2 year old who cleans her room without being asked to every night before bed - well, most of the time.

At least it's worked for us! People are constantly complimenting my DD on her good manners.
luckylady is offline  
Old 12-06-2005, 11:05 PM
 
Evan&Anna's_Mom's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: So. CA
Posts: 4,388
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
First and foremost I think you model the behaviour you want and you start that about the time they can recognize you as "mom". That's what, about 30 seconds out of the womb? Seriously, I think that modeling is the most important thing you can do and you do that from the very beginning.

Beyond that, my nearly 3 YO is good about saying please and such. I don't think I consiously taught this much before about 2. Now I will wait quietly until she asks nicely rather than demanding something, but I don't nag. I quietly coach proper manners when we are visiting someone. And respect for all of God's creation (including people, yourself and your environment) is THE big value in our family and we talk about it constantly.

I suspect your SIL's children ignore her about things other than manners. Sounds like she has one of those parenting styles that I call "all flutter, no substance." At the point that a child of mine was so rude, I would be standing in front of them, turning off the TV and taking away the snacks and drinks until I got their attention. Then we would probably go home.

If you are effective at teaching respect for others, then manners are a snap.
Evan&Anna's_Mom is offline  
Old 12-06-2005, 11:16 PM
 
aira's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: missing the Grandmother Lodge
Posts: 2,959
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Didn't read all replies, but I think there is no "start" to this. Children always treat others how they have been treated - not how they have been nagged to behave.

It never fails. They have this nifty little survival mechanism that makes them immitate the behavior of adults and older children around them. It sounds like your nieces and nephews are subject to so much nagging and harrassment that they are fully tuned out at this point. I'm very sorry you have to have them ransack your house.

Just consistently treat your child respectfully and there will be no issues.
aira is offline  
Old 12-06-2005, 11:24 PM
 
aira's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: missing the Grandmother Lodge
Posts: 2,959
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Just thought of a funny example:

The other day we told DS (almost 2) about Santa Clause and when he retold the story back to us about how Santa will bring him a present he added, "And I'w tell him 'Thank You' for pwesent, Santa! Want tell Santa 'Thank You'."

I've never once told him to say anything. I think it's obnoxious - I don't like anyone telling me what I have to say. I just thank him for things he does that are helpful, kind, or thoughtful.
aira is offline  
Old 12-06-2005, 11:32 PM
 
lilyka's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2001
Location: Sioux Falls, SD
Posts: 17,896
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
we start when they are babies. If they are old enough to talk they are old enuogh to say thank you and please and excuse me. If they can sit up they can sit nicely at teh table. and most importantly we are consistant. I bet your sister doesn't make them act all polite at home and that is why they have no idea how to act when they come to your home. her remiinders are feeble attepts to say "we're working on it" but chances are when they are at someones house it is the only time they are working on it.

So start working on it now and start at home. If you don't wan't your child eating on someones coush with greesy hands start with everyone eating at teh table at your home. they will see you doing it. i t iwil be normal. they will be expected to do it at home. it will be normal. when they go to someones home it won't even be a question. Say thank youto them. remind them to say it. then when it comes up in public it won't be an issue because it will be normal.

The truest answer to violence is love. The truest answer to death is life. The only prevention for violence is for the heart to have no violence within it.  We cannot prevent evil through any system devised by mankind. But we can grapple with evil and defeat it, but only with love—real love.

lilyka is offline  
Old 12-06-2005, 11:44 PM
 
jenmk's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: with lots of boys and a girl
Posts: 977
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
:

Jen, mom of R (9), T (7), C (5), and E (2) ... my stillheart.gifs

jenmk is offline  
Old 12-07-2005, 12:06 AM
Banned
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: raising the revolution
Posts: 4,315
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
I agree with the pp's too about modeling. That is SO important (imo) and of course, no one is perfect so your children are not going to behave like angels all the time-- but I feel that if you are consistent in your modeling of the behavior you want to see and very positive when they model it back (not talking praise really, just maybe something like ... "I heard you say thank you when Johnny handed you the ball, I thought that was nice of you" --- or whatever)...it will be something that comes naturally to them in *most* normal situations.


Also, I don't intend to sweat the small stuff in the manners area. I mean, I think intention, wording, and tone of voice go a long way too without me having to hear the "right" words. This was discussed in another thread...for example, sometimes I don't say please to my husband (and vice versa), but rather something like "sweetie, while you are up would you mind getting me some water?" ...my husband knows I am being kind and asking nicely, he doesn't have to hear the "magic" word...

Manners are important in many situations, as to most people it is a sign of respect and the polite thing to do -- and while we plan on modeling the "right" words...it is much more important (to us) that the intention, tone of voice, and kindness is there -- even if they forget the "right" words or decide to say something else in their place to express themselves.
captain crunchy is offline  
Old 12-07-2005, 12:52 AM - Thread Starter
 
Veronique's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Canada
Posts: 183
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Captain Crunchy- I agree that one doesn't necessarily have to say 'the magic words' if the intent is there../ex.."sweetie, can you pass the salt..."

I just see some of my friends' kids who act really disrespectful towards others...like grabbing my DS's head, when they are told--nicely---to be careful with the baby. I mean, I consider these *good parents* and want to teach my son basic respect of other people's property etc.

Great advice from everyone! Thank-you...

BTW: what does 'crunchy' mean? I've seen it used as 'crunchy' mom...etc.
Veronique is offline  
Old 12-07-2005, 01:22 AM
 
sessy's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2005
Posts: 48
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
I have to agree that this isn't really something that is taught so much as modelled. My dd is only 20 months, so I don't have much experience with this yet. She does say please and thank you a lot, not always in the right context (sometimes she says thank you when she wants to give me something) but often she's right on. Coincidentally, as I type this, she dropped her book and said "Mommy get it please" and then "thank you" after I handed it back to her! She also says excuse me when she wants to get past someone, says it to the dog and cats too! We've never told her to say thank you or please, she's just picked it up as it is part of the way we speak to and treat each other. I hope that by simply being respectful and polite to her and to each other and the people we interact with every day, she will understand that this is how to treat others and it will carry into childhood.
sessy is offline  
Old 12-07-2005, 08:29 PM
Banned
 
katallen's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Posts: 843
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
I think modeling is the best way to do this and making it fun, not a chore and definitely not a power battle. If you make it a power battle then the child wins because you can devise whatever punishment you want but if they don't use the manners they still win. From what I have read though even the mainstream magazines don't expect kids to begin using their manners until they are closer to 5 and I have never read something that talks about when they should have near perfect manners. Maybe instead of badgering the kids to not do things asking them to do something like get a napkin to wipe their hands with or taking their shoes off so their feet can go wherever would be a better solution. It may be that they have great manners at friends houses but consider you to be family and think they should be able to feel at home in your house.
katallen is offline  
Old 12-08-2005, 08:05 AM
 
DanAbimytwomiracle's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: New Jersey
Posts: 357
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Modelign is the key. I also found that when you expect your kids to respect you that they will respect others. And obviously treating them with respect in terms of saying please, thank you, and not grabbing things out of their hands unless they're dangerous.
I interrupt my kids as needed, but nicely - I'll wait until they finish singing, or say ""scuse me, darlin', but mama needs to vaccuum the floor."

Christine, mama to Daniel & Abby, 9 and Patrick, 4. Wife to a rockin' train engineer. Gluten and nightshade-free. Multiple kiddie food sensitivities.

DanAbimytwomiracle is offline  
Old 12-08-2005, 09:41 AM
 
TinkerBelle's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Posts: 3,282
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Start when they are babies. And it is not going to cause harm, when they are older and "forget" as children sometimes do, to nicely remind them. Nicely "reminding" is not the same as constantly "nagging".
TinkerBelle is offline  
Old 12-08-2005, 12:45 PM
 
aira's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: missing the Grandmother Lodge
Posts: 2,959
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
And it is not going to cause harm, when they are older and "forget" as children sometimes do, to nicely remind them. Nicely "reminding" is not the same as constantly "nagging".
I disagree. Calling attention to a child's lapse is calling attention to a child's lapse. I think it's rude no matter how nicely worded. Just b/c it's subtle doesn't mean that the child won't feel embarrased. And embarrassing a child over not wording something how you want is manipulation.

Just let it go if they "forget". If you keep modelling, in time they will say things politely of their own volition.

Just as I was typing this, my not-even-2yo-yet DS walked up to me and asked, "Please, help me find Thomas." I've never coerced or manipulated "polite" words out of him even once. I know it works.
aira is offline  
Old 12-08-2005, 01:05 PM
 
annab's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: IN
Posts: 773
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
One thing that helps us was that we do sign language. When we teach the word for food, it is followed by the sign for please. When babies are in the phase where they want to hand everything to you, we sign and say "Thank you." I think the visual helps reinforce.

That said, I think the fact that you recognize that this is something that you want for your kids indicates that it won't be a problem.
annab is offline  
Old 12-08-2005, 02:40 PM
 
OneCatholicMommy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Illinois
Posts: 215
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by aira
Didn't read all replies, but I think there is no "start" to this. Children always treat others how they have been treated - not how they have been nagged to behave.

It never fails. They have this nifty little survival mechanism that makes them immitate the behavior of adults and older children around them. It sounds like your nieces and nephews are subject to so much nagging and harrassment that they are fully tuned out at this point. I'm very sorry you have to have them ransack your house.

Just consistently treat your child respectfully and there will be no issues.
I just want you to know that this is not always true.
We have modeled gratefulness/good manners and our boys still have to be reminded.
OneCatholicMommy is offline  
Old 12-08-2005, 04:09 PM
 
Ellien C's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: in the middle ages
Posts: 5,496
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
I agree that manners are the sort of thing that are modelled, not nagged or coerced. My 2 yo has pretty good manners, but that's the sort of thing that's modelled in our home. DH and I thank whoever made dinner that night quite sincerely and now I see DD doing it as well. She uses the same words as us, too. "tank you, I 'preciate that."

If my 2 yo forgets to say Thank you, I do the same with her as I would with my husband. I either say if for her, on behalf of our family or I quietly remind her when we have a private moment.

We are now at that age where she walks up to us and starts talking or asking questions without saying excuse. I vividly remember my parents admonishing me "Don't interrupt" when I did that. Sometimes that still erupts from my mouth, but I see now that *I* need to say excuse me to her when she is playing or talking with her friends instead of barging in with "It's time to go..." Children are such good teachers.

Third generation WOHM. I work by choice.
Ellien C is offline  
Old 12-08-2005, 06:10 PM
 
aira's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: missing the Grandmother Lodge
Posts: 2,959
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by OneCatholicMommy
I just want you to know that this is not always true.
We have modeled gratefulness/good manners and our boys still have to be reminded.
IMO the idea of "have to" is a value judgement on your part.

So what if they don't say "please" everytime? Are they in danger? The only reason you "have to" remind them is that you are trying to force compliance.

Letting those "slips" go without "reminders" but with continued modelling will result in children who genuinely respect people and want to communicate that by speaking politely. Because they genuinely feel respected too, it's a language they will understand fundamentally.
aira is offline  
Old 12-08-2005, 06:40 PM
 
OneCatholicMommy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Illinois
Posts: 215
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by aira
IMO the idea of "have to" is a value judgement on your part.

So what if they don't say "please" everytime? Are they in danger? The only reason you "have to" remind them is that you are trying to force compliance.

Letting those "slips" go without "reminders" but with continued modelling will result in children who genuinely respect people and want to communicate that by speaking politely. Because they genuinely feel respected too, it's a language they will understand fundamentally.
Yer darn right it's a value judgment! Sometimes we have to be polite when we don't feel like it. Gentle reminders can work wonders.
OneCatholicMommy is offline  
Old 12-08-2005, 09:53 PM
 
aira's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: missing the Grandmother Lodge
Posts: 2,959
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Well, good luck to ya. The irony is that you cannot show politeness if you are embarrassing the child (putting him on the spot) - even if it's in a "nice" voice. So you can't have it both ways. You either model or you coerce.

I just won't be doing that to my kids.
aira is offline  
Old 12-08-2005, 11:09 PM
 
MelKnee's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Upstate California
Posts: 1,169
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by luckylady
start when they are babies and the secret is really quite simple - treat them as you want them to treat others. When they hand you something, say thank you. When you ask them something, say please. If they are playing and you need to interrupt, say "excuse me, may I interrupt you?"
:

Momma to three fine children, one that lives in my heart and two that live in my arms.
Circumcision is wrong, regardless of gender
MelKnee is offline  
Old 12-08-2005, 11:45 PM
 
IncaMama's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Posts: 4,306
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
i didn't read any of the replies, so i'm probably repeating everybody else but i have never once in Rowan's life asked him to say please, thank you, you're welcome, or sorry. never once. but he says all of them every single time it's appropriate. it is ALL modeling in our case. please was the longest one to get, mostly because i'm the worst at saying that to DH. i never remember to. LOL i always said it to DS, but never DH and i think DS picked up on that. but now, at 2y9mo he says please all the time now too.

i really do think that modeling is the BEST way to teach it, because it comes from within them rather than because you're sitting there telling them what to do.

i must say i think i have one of the most well-mannered kids on the planet, and i never have to say a word. but i could be biased.
IncaMama is offline  
Old 12-09-2005, 01:28 PM
 
OneCatholicMommy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Illinois
Posts: 215
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by aira
Well, good luck to ya. The irony is that you cannot show politeness if you are embarrassing the child (putting him on the spot) - even if it's in a "nice" voice. So you can't have it both ways. You either model or you coerce.

I just won't be doing that to my kids.
May I ask why you think reminders are embarrassing?
OneCatholicMommy is offline  
Old 12-09-2005, 01:49 PM
 
Yooper's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Posts: 3,473
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
There is just about nothing that grates my nerves more than having some well-meaning person "Remind" dd to say thank you or please. I usually tell them to leave her alone.....which is probably rude. But it would be incredibly rude for someone to remind ME to say something like that and it would be very embarrassing for me. Why do people think it is any less embarrassing for a child?

My parents never ever made me say anything that did not naturally come out of my mouth. If I was too shy or excited or forgetful to say the polite thing, my mom or dad said it for me. Guess what? I always say please, thank you, you're wecome, etc..... We have never asked my dd to say it either and she also says it naturally from modelling. This is most definately not a "have to" issue.
Yooper is offline  
Old 12-09-2005, 02:11 PM
 
loraxc's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: In the Truffula Trees
Posts: 4,388
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
You know...we really do say "please" and "thank you" around here a lot, and yet my extremely verbal 23mo only uses them sometimes. : I'm glad it's working for all of you, but I'm not convinced modeling is always enough. My DD is not much of an empathetic or sympathetic kid. She's an investigator, not a people-pleaser--I hope that doesn't sound negative, but that's just her.

So, yes, I sometimes do ask DD to ask me again "nicely." She understands what that means--modulate her voice and add a "please." I also have encouraged her to say thank you to another by saying, for instance, "Wow, Grandma, thank you for the neat book! DD, can you thank grandma?" If she does, she does; if she doesn't, we don't push it, but I still do ask. I KNOW this drives some GD people crazy, as evident here, but honestly, I do want people to understand that even though DD doesn't always use good "manners," we are working on it. Let's face it--manners are important, and people are annoyed by people who don't use these social words. Is it a huge deal to my DD to be reminded to say please? Ennh. I do think it is part of my job to teach DD social graces, even if empirically I don't myself consider them The End-all Be-all. I would also teach her, for instance, not to spit or put her hands down her pants in public, not because those things are so terribly evil, but because not doing them is part of learning to function in society.

People get a bee in their bonnets about this issue, I've noticed. I think it's hardly one of the worst GD offenses.

grateful mother to DD, 1/04, and DS, 2/08

loraxc is offline  
Old 12-09-2005, 02:16 PM
 
Yooper's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Posts: 3,473
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
23 months is very young to expect perfect manners. My dd could not even talk at 23 months...... I do think modelling works best. Is it 100% effective? No. Neither is nagging. The fact is that you cannot force anyone to do anything so how you approach it is important. I do not think most people would be at all surprised or offended if a 23 month old neglected to say thank you. I do not even expect that of 4,5,6 years olds. I do not really start to think manner-less people are "rude" until they are adults....but that in my opinion.

I am not sure why people think this is such a "little GD deal". It is about dignity which is a big deal whether we are talking about "little" things like manner or "big" things like stealing.
Yooper is offline  
Old 12-09-2005, 02:29 PM
 
TinkerBelle's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Posts: 3,282
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by yoopervegan
There is just about nothing that grates my nerves more than having some well-meaning person "Remind" dd to say thank you or please. I usually tell them to leave her alone.....which is probably rude. But it would be incredibly rude for someone to remind ME to say something like that and it would be very embarrassing for me. Why do people think it is any less embarrassing for a child?

My parents never ever made me say anything that did not naturally come out of my mouth. If I was too shy or excited or forgetful to say the polite thing, my mom or dad said it for me. Guess what? I always say please, thank you, you're wecome, etc..... We have never asked my dd to say it either and she also says it naturally from modelling. This is most definately not a "have to" issue.

Someone actually reminded YOUR child to do that? That is not right. Parents gently reminding is one thing. Other people have no right to do that IMO.
TinkerBelle is offline  
Old 12-09-2005, 02:45 PM
 
aira's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: missing the Grandmother Lodge
Posts: 2,959
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
May I ask why you think reminders are embarrassing?
Well, Yooper gave a nice explanation, but I'll add my thoughts... It's embarrassing beacuse it puts the child on the spot and call attention to their "failing".

This is all about the meaning content of words, and communication in general. I'll give a scenario. You remind a young DS to say "Thank You" to Grandma for, let's say, a very itchy sweater that she knitted him. He's not feeling all that grateful for it - b/c it hurts and she wants him to wear it all day - but is told to express gratitude anyway. He learns that "Thank You" is essentially a meaningless phrase, and that when you and dad "model" it, you're really just saying meaningless words too. Either he will resent being made to express thoughts that are not his, or he'll just do it and his ability to actually foster feelings of gratitude will be hampered. Maybe both. The point is that language usage helps form our thinking patterns, and misused language clutters and harms our ability to think a certain way - like having actual gratitude.

Another way to handle that situation would be that, when Grandma gives DS the sweater, you say "Thank you for thinking of DS. It was very kind of you. I'll keep it for him for a special snow day." That helps DS save face, gives him an out, so that he feel like you're on his side. It places no onus on DS to be grateful when he's not, but gives him the language pathways to start feeling that Grandma was actually showing kindness. Grandma gets thanked, and it's a positive interaction.

My post before is that if you are embarrassing DC (please let us know if Yooper's post didn't explain that enough...), it is essentially rude, and models rudeness instead of politeness. Your DC gets really mixed messages. Basically that politeness is phoney because it sure feels rude to them. So you can't both correct behavior and model politeness.

Hope that explains my position well enough...

ETA: I want to second everything in post #26. Yooper is spot on there too!
aira is offline  
Old 12-09-2005, 03:19 PM
 
TinkerBelle's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Posts: 3,282
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by aira
Well, Yooper gave a nice explanation, but I'll add my thoughts... It's embarrassing beacuse it puts the child on the spot and call attention to their "failing".

This is all about the meaning content of words, and communication in general. I'll give a scenario. You remind a young DS to say "Thank You" to Grandma for, let's say, a very itchy sweater that she knitted him. He's not feeling all that grateful for it - b/c it hurts and she wants him to wear it all day - but is told to express gratitude anyway. He learns that "Thank You" is essentially a meaningless phrase, and that when you and dad "model" it, you're really just saying meaningless words too. Either he will resent being made to express thoughts that are not his, or he'll just do it and his ability to actually foster feelings of gratitude will be hampered. Maybe both. The point is that language usage helps form our thinking patterns, and misused language clutters and harms our ability to think a certain way - like having actual gratitude.

Another way to handle that situation would be that, when Grandma gives DS the sweater, you say "Thank you for thinking of DS. It was very kind of you. I'll keep it for him for a special snow day." That helps DS save face, gives him an out, so that he feel like you're on his side. It places no onus on DS to be grateful when he's not, but gives him the language pathways to start feeling that Grandma was actually showing kindness. Grandma gets thanked, and it's a positive interaction.

My post before is that if you are embarrassing DC (please let us know if Yooper's post didn't explain that enough...), it is essentially rude, and models rudeness instead of politeness. Your DC gets really mixed messages. Basically that politeness is phoney because if sure feels rude to them. So you can't both correct behavior and model politeness.

Hope that explains my position well enough...

ETA: I want to second everything in post #26. Yooper is spot on there too!

I agree that modeling is best, but a gentle reminder every now and then is not harmful, IMO. When alone, you tell your child that they are not going to like everything that they are given, but to say thank you anyway, because someone thought enough to give them that sweater or whatever.

Can't a child be taught to be thankful for the gesture, if not the gift itself?
TinkerBelle is offline  
Old 12-09-2005, 03:35 PM
 
aira's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: missing the Grandmother Lodge
Posts: 2,959
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by TinkerBelle
Can't a child be taught to be thankful for the gesture, if not the gift itself?
Quote:
Originally Posted by aira
It places no onus on DS to be grateful when he's not, but gives him the language pathways to start feeling that Grandma was actually showing kindness.
Hope that helps the confusion...



Quote:
Originally Posted by TinkerBelle
(snip)...but a gentle reminder every now and then is not harmful, IMO.
Like I said in a post on the previous page, good luck if that's what you think is best. I just won't do that to my children.
aira is offline  
 
User Tag List

Thread Tools


Forum Jump: 

Posting Rules  
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are Off