One liners? ? about Spare the rod, spoil the child? - Mothering Forums

Forum Jump: 
 
Thread Tools
#1 of 17 Old 03-03-2008, 04:36 PM - Thread Starter
 
HeatherRD's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Northwest Ohio
Posts: 402
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
So many people still believe in "spare the rod, spoil the child."

In the lunch room at work, a conversation started up about discipline, and people were complaining about not being able to hit their children anymore because children's services would come take their kids away. These people are sincerely (I think) concerned that their children would not grow up to be responsible adults if they are not spanked.

I work in WIC, and parents are always threatening their misbehaving (or just scared and upset) children with punishment, as well as yelling and screaming at their children.

Now, I don't really feel comfortable (nor is it in my job description) getting into a discussion of what they are doing to their kids. Are there any one liners (or maybe 2 or 3 liners), short but sweet, that I could use in these situations to help open people's eyes to the possibility that there are other effective ways to discipline? And without getting into a debate or argument?

I have told a couple of my WIC moms that it's important to praise their children when they are behaving well, but it seems to go in one ear and out the other. But it's so hard for me to watch what they are doing. Any ideas?

Heather, Vegan Dietitian, Wife to DH since 9-04, mom to Pepper : and mom to born 10/09
HeatherRD is offline  
#2 of 17 Old 03-03-2008, 04:59 PM
 
naturegirl7's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Scorchin' FL
Posts: 952
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
"do unto others as you would have them do" - you can't teach a child to calmly express their emotions when you are hitting them everytime you get mad.

Didn't Jesus himself say "blessed are children"

I personally refer to spanking as "adult temper tantrums" to illustrate my point - but I doubt that would go over well since you are working at WIC.
But seriously - that is what they are. I can't control you, and can't handle my own emotions and frustration with this situation so WHACK. That is a tantrum to me.

"To gain respect, we need to give respect" - please and thank you go a long way. Kids like to feel respected and like they have some control over a situation.

"Violence begets violence" - screaming, hitting, etc it only teaches your child that these are appropriate ways to react and express emotions - and cause them to do so too.

"Modeling good behavior is the best way to teach your child how to act appropriately" - you want to have your child clean up toys, ask them to help you do it. show them how it is done. You want your kids to treat other children nicely (perhaps not hit/kick/bite/scream/be rude/name call) perhaps you should consider not treating them like that yourself.

"Some kids require transitions, it helps them listen and cooperate if they know exactly what is going on and what is expected of them ahead of time" My DS is like that. He gets 5, 2, and 1 minute, and even count to 10 warnings. Not warnings as in time out/bad behavior warnings - but alerts that a change is coming. Like - Ten more pushes on the swings before we leave the playground. 1 more minute and then we need to clean up. Okay its time to cleanup when I count to 10 - 1, 2, okay you want to do it now, lets do it!

"patience is a virtue we all need to practice - and this is a perfect opportunity!" DS hears that alot. LOL So does DH. Heck, I even say it about myself. It is fast becoming a family motto around here. LOL

Can you put out some literature or books regarding gentle discipline techniques? Even if only one person looks at it in the waiting room - that is one person who may chose to break the cycle of violence.

GL - I saw alot while working in preschool/day care - including parents who actually gave us permission or requested that we spank their child. :
naturegirl7 is offline  
#3 of 17 Old 03-03-2008, 05:02 PM
 
naturegirl7's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Scorchin' FL
Posts: 952
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Does WIC have any policy regarding spanking??

Perhaps you can refer to it, and ask them to refrain from hitting or threatening their child while in the office as it violates WIC policy.

Or offer info on local parenting classes/resources - many counties offer free classes to families considered at-risk (which many of those families would be in they qualify for WIC)?
naturegirl7 is offline  
#4 of 17 Old 03-03-2008, 05:04 PM
 
ABand3's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2005
Location: NC
Posts: 1,448
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
This might not work in a WIC office, but I think "Who would Jesus spank?" is thought provoking (when people are using the 'biblical' reason for spanking.)

"Children learn what they live"
ABand3 is offline  
#5 of 17 Old 03-03-2008, 05:16 PM
 
Sk8ermaiden's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Houston, TX
Posts: 1,294
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
I've already been warned in relation to spanking, so I'm going to try to post without getting in trouble. I will put a big disclaimer that what I'm about to say is not in support of spanking.

Quote:
Originally Posted by naturegirl7 View Post
I personally refer to spanking as "adult temper tantrums" to illustrate my point - but I doubt that would go over well since you are working at WIC.
But seriously - that is what they are. I can't control you, and can't handle my own emotions and frustration with this situation so WHACK. That is a tantrum to me.
This doesn't always ring true. Parents who are spanking in what I think mainstream people feel is the responsible way, do not resemble a temper tantrum in the slightest. Like my friend's parents and my DH's parents. You were sent to your room to cool down, they would call you out and explain what you did and why it was wrong, and then you would get 1, or 2 or 5 paddles - in calmness, not in anger. Again, not defending spanking, in fact, I'm sure many moms see this as much worse - I'm just saying that saying this to certain people will just make them think you don't know what you're talking about.

Now, my mom chasing me around the house with a wooden spoon while screaming her head off...that could be called an adult temper tantrum. But somehow I still love her.

And as someone who may be in your intended audience, I think these two would be the most likely to make me stop and think.

Quote:
"To gain respect, we need to give respect" - please and thank you go a long way. Kids like to feel respected and like they have some control over a situation.
Quote:
Originally Posted by ABand3 View Post
This might not work in a WIC office, but I think "Who would Jesus spank?" is thought provoking.

I'm Kellie :, married to Chris , and mom to one baby girl (7/12/09).
Sk8ermaiden is offline  
#6 of 17 Old 03-03-2008, 05:56 PM
 
ruhbehka's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Posts: 513
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
"Your DC is such a sweet kid."

"My little one gets antsy, too, when we're stuck in a waiting room for such a long time like this."

"He's actually doing really well, considering that this office is not a fun place for a kid to be."

"Oh, you know what? I see kids acting this way all the time, whether their parents hit them or just remind them to behave. They all seem to grow out of it just the same."

"Sounds like you're both having a rough day. I hope you'll go somewhere fun afterward, and rest a bit while she runs off some of this pent up energy."

"This is such a difficult age. She'll be so different next year at this time that you'll be amazed."

Pretty much anything that helps the mom realize that her child is a *good* kid at heart, that he or she is acting in an age-appropriate way, and that no one is judging her for not "keeping that kid in line."

Rebecca, mama to M (08/06) and E (04/09)
ruhbehka is offline  
#7 of 17 Old 03-03-2008, 06:35 PM
 
poppymum's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: mostly outside
Posts: 43
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
What a lot of great suggestions. It's really hard to say something about spanking if your goal is to help the kids rather than anger the parents. It's such a touchy subject. Maybe keep a box full of special things for the kids, and model some distraction techniques?
poppymum is offline  
#8 of 17 Old 03-03-2008, 06:40 PM
 
Cheshire's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: My yellow submarine
Posts: 2,183
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
For co-workers I would simply say that "spare the rod, spoil the child" doesn't have to be translated that the "rod" is a stick/spanking device. The Bible really works in a lot of metaphors and I see it as telling a parent that not disciplining a child will spoil them (discipline is separate from spanking - spanking makes a child feel bad and I do not have to make my son feel bad in order to discipline him).

Here is a site that addresses this head on:
http://aolff.com/
Cheshire is offline  
#9 of 17 Old 03-03-2008, 06:41 PM
 
dex_millie's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: MD
Posts: 1,643
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
:[/QUOTE]For co-workers I would simply say that "spare the rod, spoil the child" doesn't have to be translated that the "rod" is a stick/spanking device. ....................QUOTE]

:

Quote:
Originally Posted by ABand3 View Post
This might not work in a WIC office, but I think "Who would Jesus spank?" is thought provoking (when people are using the 'biblical' reason for spanking.)
Referring to the bolded. When I tell some of my familly that they bring up when Jesus went and made a whip and chase out the people who was selling stuff in the temple. He had a "adult temper tantrum". He didn't hit them, but he sure threaten and ran them out, and then turn up all the tables. In the Bible you can find for both sides. I find though with each generation some are turning more to the 'no spanking' method.

Sometimes I try to model or suggest a few alternative -even making it sound more like a question.

I think people sometimes spank because it is suppose to be a 'quick fix' to make the child behave. If a child is spank for every little thing though, that child start holding in their feelings and wouldn't know when it is appropate to show them.
dex_millie is offline  
#10 of 17 Old 03-03-2008, 06:58 PM
 
gcgirl's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Posts: 2,355
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
How about "I know, huh, the other day I really wanted to smack/slap/spank/hit [insert co-worker's name here], but those dang assault laws..."
gcgirl is offline  
#11 of 17 Old 03-03-2008, 07:52 PM
 
sapphire_chan's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2005
Posts: 27,769
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
"Well *my* mother taught me that only bullies hit people smaller than them."

Oh, wait, not argumentative...
"When I was young I was taught not to hit people who were smaller than me."
sapphire_chan is offline  
#12 of 17 Old 03-03-2008, 08:59 PM
 
purple_kangaroo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Posts: 555
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
"Children will treat others the way they are treated. They model what they see and experience."

"I've been learning about this approach called 'gentle discipline' that focuses more on teaching and nurturing, and on helping a child develop the tools they need to behave appropriately, rather than on punishing and controlling the child. It's really great! If you're interested in hearing more, I'd be happy to point you to some resources."

If you are in a situation where you are watching someone interact with their child, often I think it helps to try to interpret what the child might need or be trying to communicate, or to model showing empathy for the child:

"She sounds tired . . . it's so hard for little ones to (fill in behavior parent is trying to get them to do) when they're tired."

Or, "Oh, it's so disappointing for little ones when they want something that's not safe for them to play with. That stapler on the desk is SO fascinating, isn't it? Would it be all right for her to have this paper and pencil, so she can draw instead?"

Or I've suggested alternative ways for the child to be able to do whatever it is the parent is getting upset about:

"Oh, he wants to turn the light on and off? He's welcome to play with the light switch in the hallway over here, or there's a button on this toy he could push if he wants to turn something else on and off."

"There's a nice wide space over in the corner of the room over there where she could spin around as much as she wants to without bumping into anyone."

Another thing I've done is sympathize and share ideas of alternate approaches for handling the situation:

"My child (or a kid of a friend, or whatever) had an issue with hitting/biting/fill in the blank and here's what worked really well with them . . . (fill in GD approach)."

You could even use things you've seen on this board for this, without saying where you heard/read it . . ."Oh, yeah, I was just reading/hearing about a parent who was having that issue with their kid, and someone else suggested they try such-and-such that had worked with their own child."
purple_kangaroo is offline  
#13 of 17 Old 03-04-2008, 12:54 AM
 
Breeder's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Durham, NC
Posts: 1,932
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
For the WIC clients I really like the special box of small toys and modeling distraction techniques, also saying things about how their child is a good and normal kid acting in an age appropriate way is great advice.

For co-workers who say "Spare the rod, spoil the child." I usually counter with, "Do unto others as you would have them do unto you, like Jesus said, you dig?"

I used to have to say this kind of stuff alot w/the fam. Until at age five my never been spanked DS behaves like an angel while his spanked their whole lives realitives run wild and destroy the homes they are visiting.

Breeder Mama: = wife to an amazing man + mama to J-Bear (07/02) and E-Train (06/08), nanny to Little Bird (07/10).

Breeder is offline  
#14 of 17 Old 03-04-2008, 04:55 PM
 
Evan&Anna's_Mom's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: So. CA
Posts: 4,477
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Co-workers and clients get really different responses I think. For the co-workers, isn't it odd that people always talk about not being able to spank anymore but then there are polls that show the majority of parents still do? So which is it -- spanking is the problem or not-spanking is the problem?

For clients I think you've alread gotten lots of good material.
Evan&Anna's_Mom is offline  
#15 of 17 Old 03-04-2008, 05:46 PM
 
theresal's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Posts: 96
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
How funny ... this topic just came up another forum today.

Someone posted that "spare the rod, spoil the child" is misinterpreted. It is talking about a shepherd's rod, and shepherds don't hit the sheep with it, they use it only to help guide the sheep.
theresal is offline  
#16 of 17 Old 03-04-2008, 06:24 PM
 
velcromom's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: N. Ca Sierra Nevada
Posts: 5,022
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
I've heard the misinterpretation argument too.

Or you could just tell them when you are tempted to smack the kids you stop and think about the fact that they will be the ones taking care of you in your old age and you don't want them smacking you around then!
velcromom is offline  
#17 of 17 Old 03-04-2008, 08:17 PM
 
One_Girl's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Posts: 4,735
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 35 Post(s)
"Oh, and I suppose you believe that everyone should castrate their little girls too?" This illustrates the fact that just because it is a religious belief doesn't mean it is a good moral practice. Same for beating women because they don't obey their husbands.
One_Girl is offline  
Reply

Quick Reply
Message:
Drag and Drop File Upload
Drag files here to attach!
Upload Progress: 0
Options

Register Now

In order to be able to post messages on the Mothering Forums forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.
User Name:
If you do not want to register, fill this field only and the name will be used as user name for your post.
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.
Password:
Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.
Email Address:

Log-in

Human Verification

In order to verify that you are a human and not a spam bot, please enter the answer into the following box below based on the instructions contained in the graphic.



User Tag List

Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page


Forum Jump: 

Posting Rules  
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are Off