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Breastfeeding Challenges > IGT and second-time mamas
ILoveMyBabyBird's Avatar ILoveMyBabyBird 09:58 AM 01-08-2011


 

Quote:
Originally Posted by lyterae View Post



Quote:
Originally Posted by fnpmama View Post


 

Lyterae - your plan sounds really good.  Very similar to mine with DS2, but I didn't do alfalfa, and I only had a disposable SNS from the hospital which I was incapable of using properly.  I had such a hard time fumbling with the tubing, while trying to get him to latch and formula was pouring in me, all the while my father in law is just staring at me and my MIL was talking about how she formula fed her 8 children.  (Sorry, bad memory)  Anyway, it seems to me from what I have heard that the lact-aid might be well worth it.

 



 It looks like I will just be fumbling through with the SNS at first, I'm going to be going back to work so I figure I'll use the SNS for the first 4-6 weeks and then start using the bottle to supplement with.


 

 

oh you are trooper to deal with this and be a WOHM, I know if i had to go back to work I would probably just go with with full formula at that point with low supply!

 

sonrisa-sorry you are have a hard time, it is all so frustrating, I hope you are doing well mentally. I think that is one thing people who don't know about low supply don't realize, how not providing a full supply messes with our emotions and with a new baby, little sleep it is a bad combination. Just keep your spirits up and know that we all have limitations, and this is something you can't control and you are giving your lo all your effort.

 

I'm am 25 1/2 weeks, no leaking, and no signs of milk yet, I know my bust has grown about 2 1/2 inches total since pp, but it is not all in the size, but I am hoping that that is good news, and I am still taking alfalfa tablets, eating oatmeal everyday now that MS is gone, working on getting an electric breastpump, still undecided about renting a hospital one. I bought a bottle of goatsrue capsules, but still unsure if i will take it before delivery, I have decided if i do i will probably wait until 4-6 weeks prior to my due date.



sonrisa's Avatar sonrisa 11:14 AM 01-09-2011

Thanks for the kind words Ilovemybabybird.  I have to be honest and admit that on day 6 pp when my midwife and I discussed supplementing due to weight loss, I felt very sad and angry as I did with DD1.  This time though I had a plan, a community of support, and a 40 pound 4 year old standing in front of me, so I knew that both baby and I could pull through. I am working as hard this time as I did with DD1, but I have many more tools in my pocket this time! With DD1 we were searching for so many answers. So all in all it hurt not to have my breastfeeding dream go exactly how I dreamed but at least preparation, support, and the realization that we would make it helped a lot!

 

Also, fifth day of domperidone and i think it is working!  Let you all know more soon.

 


fnpmama's Avatar fnpmama 10:40 AM 01-10-2011

Sonrisa - glad to here the domp is helping, are you haveing any side effects?

 

lyterae - didn't mean to knock the SNS, I just struggled with it, but I am going to try to be more determined next time.  And considering the lactaid as well.

 

We still haven't conceived yet, but I was talking with a friend about my 2 experiences with BFing and IGT and both times it was in the first 2 weeks post partum where I strugggled the most, which then affected me deciding to not pump, or not supplement at the breast, which I think affected my supply.  Anyway... my friend suggested a post partum doula to help provide support during that time.  Like helping with the SNS for example...Anyone know about that how to find one.  I don't really need the labor support, but I think pp doula would be awesome.


justthinkn's Avatar justthinkn 08:48 AM 01-12-2011

Can I jump in?  I lived in this forum several years ago :)  DD is 3.5yo now, and I didn't realize we were having problems nursing until she was about 4-5 weeks old.  Everyone tells you it's normal to feel like your LO nurses 24 hours a day at first, right?  So it took a while to realize it wasn't a state of mind for us, it was reality, and yet she didn't seem to be gaining weight!  I still feel so sad looking at pictures of her at that stage now - she got so skinny!  Luckily I ended up with a great and free LC thru my HMO, and saw her weekly for months.  I did More Milk Plus and Goat's Rue, and my supply increased by 50%, so I provided maybe 2/3 of her needs, using the SNS to supplement.  I couldn't wean her off the SNS completely until she was over a year old, then we kept nursing til she was almost 3!

 

So now I'm almost 7 weeks pregnant, and I don't have a complete plan in place.  But I've started taking a half dose of More Milk Two, b/c a while ago when I was reading Making More Milk I noticed that all the recommended herbs for pregnancy breast growth are in that supplement.  I'm a little nervous about the RRL during the first tri, though, and it's also expensive - so the half dose :)  I just found a bunch of alfalfa supplements that I'd stashed and forgot about, so I'll probably add in a little more of that.  I am noticing breast changes this time that I didn't with DD - veins popping, breast tenderness, some growth on the underside where I really need it...  Here's hoping!

 

I'm not sure what my 3rd trimester/postpartum plans are yet, though I know I'll check in with my LC and plan to start working with her pretty immediately after birth.  I have an older pump, so I'm thinking I'll get one through my HMO (they may even cover it given my issues with DD) for the first few months, then try comparing the output I get between the two and decide if I need to get a better one when I go back to work part-time.


bluecandi's Avatar bluecandi 03:58 PM 01-12-2011

Hi ladies!  Im Candice from TX. Im sooo glad I found you guys!!!!  I have been researching some of the info you guys have so generously listed and I have almost every symptom of IGT. I just had DD2 4 months ago and Im not able to meet her needs....soooooo sad and depressing!!  But Im actually having an easier time with supply this time as opposed to my first DD....so thats good news!  Ive been taking more milk special blend for about 2 months and havent noticed much improvement.....more like a lack of decrease, if that makes any sense. :) I have been thinking of going for the domperidone but I wonder if I will notice any difference? What improvement did yall notice after starting dom?  Thanks ladies!!! 


ILoveMyBabyBird's Avatar ILoveMyBabyBird 01:52 PM 01-14-2011


 

Quote:
Originally Posted by lyterae View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by ILoveMyBabyBird View Post
Igt and supply issues is quickly becoming my latest research project. I went ahead and purchased "making more milk" to read. It was when ds was born too, but this i feel like i am more prepared and want to learn as much as possible before i even deliver. So for those that have hospital births are you mentioning your past problems or not? I hate to say i supplemented ds b/c then they may try to push formula,but then i would really like the support from a l/c too. I know that the first couple days babies don't need much milk anyway, but I am just wondering about how to handle that situation. I keep hoping for morning sickness! I read that it is caused a lot by progesterone and that it is needed to from the glandular tissue in pregnancy, so i am hoping for some good nausea. I had it mildly with ds. I have my first appt. with the midwife and i plan to get my blood numbers from when they tested my blood back in june when i was having headaches to see what my hormone levels were then, they said they were normal, but i am curious to see if they were high normal or low normal. i had suspected thyriod, anemia or PCOS, but they said the levels were okay so I am curious to see what okay was then, as those all are factors that could affect supply.

I will definitely be breastfeeding again, just hoping not to supplement. AT this point i am hoping that it is a singleton as I think i would have to nix the breastfeeding if there were 2 babies i don't think i could set myself up for that mentally. But i don't have reason to suspect 2. I know that if i do have to supplement my family won't think anything of it since i supplemented ds, actually most probably think i should just forget breastfeeding all together since i didn't make enough last time.
I have talked to my midwife about my problems last time because I'm planning on taking the alfalfa and goats rue during pregnancy and wanted to make sure she agreed. She has also mentioned being able to help me locate donor milk at that time. I called an IBCLC about a year ago to ask how long I could wait to start supplementation, and I think my current plan is to nurse exclusively until my milk comes in(or day 4) also pumping and tracking diapers and weighing baby and decide if I need to start supplementing using a lact-aid.

sonrisa - I went and found that study, "Markers of Lactation Insufficiency" and actually it's kind of exciting, in thier study 39% went on to have a full supply. That's hopeful for me at this point in time, especially to have a study. I've unfortunately talked to many lactation consultants who have no idea what IGT is. Based on thier breast types table can I ask what "type" you are? Mine are markedly different, I'd say one is a Type 2 and one is Type 3. I think I have at least a 2" gap...


yes what i've read says that often women with IGT still produce a normal amount of colostrum, which may explain why ds was pooping normally until about the 4 or 5th day and he never had transition poop, he just went from the black green but then on day 9 the ped forced us to feed him a 2 oz bottle of enfamil at the office with their fast flow nipple and he was choking and sputtering the whole time, but by the time we got home he had an explosive poop that was runny and yellow, that was all over his carseat. My plan is to begin supplementing if needed after the 4th day as well, if by the beginning of the 5th day i am not happy with urine and poop output then i will begin. I am really sour from all the ill advice i got from when ds was small, because deep down i knew something was wrong, but everyone i talked to and asked blew me off. And that ped office was awful, I called around the 5th day and they were like call  where you delivered, we haven't seen him as a patient yet, so they wouldn't talk to me about anything even though i had an appointment in a few days for him. Needless to say that was the first and last time we went there. The ped told me to breastfeed for 5 minutes on each said and then give him a bottle. Horrible, horrible experience. The LC's from the hospital weren't much help either, i called, told them my concerns and they laughed it off because he was a big baby and it was surely fine that he was losing because he had so much weight to spare, and they didn't act concerned at all.

 

DD will not be going to a ped, I will be taking her to the family dr. I bring ds to, and while i am not sure where his knowledge is on breastfeeding, etc, he is pretty crunchy and is okay with us not vaxing, and anytime i need to bring ds in I get to bring him in the next day which is great, so if worried, i won't have to wait to talk to someone until dd scheduled appointment.


lyterae's Avatar lyterae 02:19 PM 01-14-2011



 

Quote:
Originally Posted by justthinkn View Post

Can I jump in?  I lived in this forum several years ago :)  DD is 3.5yo now, and I didn't realize we were having problems nursing until she was about 4-5 weeks old.  Everyone tells you it's normal to feel like your LO nurses 24 hours a day at first, right?  So it took a while to realize it wasn't a state of mind for us, it was reality, and yet she didn't seem to be gaining weight!  I still feel so sad looking at pictures of her at that stage now - she got so skinny!  Luckily I ended up with a great and free LC thru my HMO, and saw her weekly for months.  I did More Milk Plus and Goat's Rue, and my supply increased by 50%, so I provided maybe 2/3 of her needs, using the SNS to supplement.  I couldn't wean her off the SNS completely until she was over a year old, then we kept nursing til she was almost 3!

 

So now I'm almost 7 weeks pregnant, and I don't have a complete plan in place.  But I've started taking a half dose of More Milk Two, b/c a while ago when I was reading Making More Milk I noticed that all the recommended herbs for pregnancy breast growth are in that supplement.  I'm a little nervous about the RRL during the first tri, though, and it's also expensive - so the half dose :)  I just found a bunch of alfalfa supplements that I'd stashed and forgot about, so I'll probably add in a little more of that.  I am noticing breast changes this time that I didn't with DD - veins popping, breast tenderness, some growth on the underside where I really need it...  Here's hoping!

 

I'm not sure what my 3rd trimester/postpartum plans are yet, though I know I'll check in with my LC and plan to start working with her pretty immediately after birth.  I have an older pump, so I'm thinking I'll get one through my HMO (they may even cover it given my issues with DD) for the first few months, then try comparing the output I get between the two and decide if I need to get a better one when I go back to work part-time.



 

 This sounds like how things went for us as well, it wasn't until she was a month old and hadn't regained birthweight that there was sudden concern. She was nursing 24/7, she had plenty of wet diapers, once we started supplementing with donor milk I realized that her poops hadn't been the right consistency and that she didn't have to eat ALL day like she had been. I just thought it was normal.

 

I saw the More Milk Two just a few weeks ago when I was "shopping", I hope that it works well for you!

 

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by ILoveMyBabyBird View Post

yes what i've read says that often women with IGT still produce a normal amount of colostrum, which may explain why ds was pooping normally until about the 4 or 5th day and he never had transition poop, he just went from the black green but then on day 9 the ped forced us to feed him a 2 oz bottle of enfamil at the office with their fast flow nipple and he was choking and sputtering the whole time, but by the time we got home he had an explosive poop that was runny and yellow, that was all over his carseat. My plan is to begin supplementing if needed after the 4th day as well, if by the beginning of the 5th day i am not happy with urine and poop output then i will begin. I am really sour from all the ill advice i got from when ds was small, because deep down i knew something was wrong, but everyone i talked to and asked blew me off. And that ped office was awful, I called around the 5th day and they were like call  where you delivered, we haven't seen him as a patient yet, so they wouldn't talk to me about anything even though i had an appointment in a few days for him. Needless to say that was the first and last time we went there. The ped told me to breastfeed for 5 minutes on each said and then give him a bottle. Horrible, horrible experience. The LC's from the hospital weren't much help either, i called, told them my concerns and they laughed it off because he was a big baby and it was surely fine that he was losing because he had so much weight to spare, and they didn't act concerned at all.

 

DD will not be going to a ped, I will be taking her to the family dr. I bring ds to, and while i am not sure where his knowledge is on breastfeeding, etc, he is pretty crunchy and is okay with us not vaxing, and anytime i need to bring ds in I get to bring him in the next day which is great, so if worried, i won't have to wait to talk to someone until dd scheduled appointment.



 Very good to know, thank you for sharing! I've called one of the local counselors and so far I'm less than impressed. If we have latch problems they should be able to help, but beyond that I'm on my own. Luckily my dh is very supportive of working for a breastfeeding relationship this time. Our baby scale came in the mail last week so that I can keep track of weight gain (or lack of it). I was blindsided last time and I don't want to have to continually drive into the doctor to weigh baby, this way I can make sure that baby is gaining steadily myself.

 

34 weeks now and I started the goats rue this week. I'm planning on calling the first week of February to rent a Symphony breast pump to have it available at home. I also need to finish ordering herbs. I'm trying to keep things as simple as possible, while still doing as much as I can...

 

Goats Rue

Marshmallow Root (to increase fat content in milk)

 

I'm still trying to decide between More Milk Plus or Adoptive Milk In Tincture... Right now I'm leaning toward the latter, but I may just alternate between the two of them and call it good.


justthinkn's Avatar justthinkn 08:34 PM 01-14-2011

Wow, 34 weeks!  Good luck as you start the Goat's Rue...  I'll be so curious to see how starting it early works for you - that's one of my questions, whether to start it before the baby is born.  If I can ask, what decided you?
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by lyterae View Post

34 weeks now and I started the goats rue this week. I'm planning on calling the first week of February to rent a Symphony breast pump to have it available at home. I also need to finish ordering herbs. I'm trying to keep things as simple as possible, while still doing as much as I can...

 

Goats Rue

Marshmallow Root (to increase fat content in milk)

 

I'm still trying to decide between More Milk Plus or Adoptive Milk In Tincture... Right now I'm leaning toward the latter, but I may just alternate between the two of them and call it good.


 


ILoveMyBabyBird's Avatar ILoveMyBabyBird 01:29 PM 02-04-2011

so nothing is set in stone yet but here is what i am leaning toward as my plan. I will use goat's rue in a tea form starting around 34-36 weeks. I will plan to use goat's rue, shavatari and saw palmetto along with all current herbs i am taking, alfalfa leaf, iodine, iron, prenatal, fish oil and vitamin d following hospital release. I am going to look into renting the ameda elite from babies r us for the 1st month. I will try to only breastfeed without supplements at nights and try to pump once or twice at night in addition to nursing. If supplements are necessary*, which i am assuming. I will make sure to not give formula supplements prior to night feedings, I will make sure those are breastmilk supplements, since formula tends to make babies sleep longer. I will either pump or breastfeed at least every 2 hours: ie, if dd doesn't want to wake, then i will pump. I will be using the sns, but try to avoid using it at night feedings(for my own sanity), but at least limit it to 1 once per night so i don't have to worry about cleaning it at night. I bought 2 shortterm ameda hygienikits, that i plan to use with the pump i rent, I also plan to get an ameda purely yours for after the 1st month that i rent the pump. In the hospital, i plan to check dd's mouth thoroughly looking for lip tie and tongue tie (ds had a lip tie that went undetected for months) Ulitmately the plan is to give my milk a chance to come in, but if i am not happy with dd's output, will be starting supplements on day 5.

 

On a side note, i am 29 1/2 weeks and still no sign of colostrum and i try to express it, i know with ds i could express it, but i didn't try to until after i took a breasteeding class, and that was around 35 ishs weeks.


lyterae's Avatar lyterae 01:38 PM 02-07-2011



 

Quote:
Originally Posted by justthinkn View Post

Wow, 34 weeks!  Good luck as you start the Goat's Rue...  I'll be so curious to see how starting it early works for you - that's one of my questions, whether to start it before the baby is born.  If I can ask, what decided you?
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by lyterae View Post

34 weeks now and I started the goats rue this week. I'm planning on calling the first week of February to rent a Symphony breast pump to have it available at home. I also need to finish ordering herbs. I'm trying to keep things as simple as possible, while still doing as much as I can...

 

Goats Rue

Marshmallow Root (to increase fat content in milk)

 

I'm still trying to decide between More Milk Plus or Adoptive Milk In Tincture... Right now I'm leaning toward the latter, but I may just alternate between the two of them and call it good.


 



 Sorry for the delay, in reading "making more milk" it's recomended to start taking Goat's Rue in the third trimester. I honestly haven't noticed any significant changes since starting to take it.

 

 Almost 38 weeks now... Still praying for a miracle and a full milk supply. :)


ILoveMyBabyBird's Avatar ILoveMyBabyBird 05:57 PM 02-07-2011


 

Quote:
Originally Posted by lyterae View Post



 

Quote:
Originally Posted by justthinkn View Post

Wow, 34 weeks!  Good luck as you start the Goat's Rue...  I'll be so curious to see how starting it early works for you - that's one of my questions, whether to start it before the baby is born.  If I can ask, what decided you?
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by lyterae View Post

34 weeks now and I started the goats rue this week. I'm planning on calling the first week of February to rent a Symphony breast pump to have it available at home. I also need to finish ordering herbs. I'm trying to keep things as simple as possible, while still doing as much as I can...

 

Goats Rue

Marshmallow Root (to increase fat content in milk)

 

I'm still trying to decide between More Milk Plus or Adoptive Milk In Tincture... Right now I'm leaning toward the latter, but I may just alternate between the two of them and call it good.


 



 Sorry for the delay, in reading "making more milk" it's recomended to start taking Goat's Rue in the third trimester. I honestly haven't noticed any significant changes since starting to take it.

 

 Almost 38 weeks now... Still praying for a miracle and a full milk supply. :)


you are getting close! Good luck!

 

dh has a co-worker with a hospital grade pump that i will probably be able to use for a few months after dd arrives, this is really good news i was debating renting one at all, so this will help us out. I got a new small sns tube so that is ready to go and now I am going to focus on getting a birthing plan written, reading some childbirth books, and getting ready for baby, i am so glad i have stopped obsessing over the IGT, but it is still in the back of my mind, i think i may go to a LLL meeting or two before my edd, just to get some extra support system going for after birth as i am probably not going to see a LC after birth.


ILoveMyBabyBird's Avatar ILoveMyBabyBird 10:05 AM 02-08-2011


Quote:
Originally Posted by ILoveMyBabyBird View Post


 


On a positive note, my breasts are definitely filling out, I was going to measure them monthly but just checked and the bust is already up 2/3" in a week so that is good news! I'm about 5 1/2 weeks preggo, so this is when most the growth occurs, hoping for more growth the next couple weeks!
 


so i haven't really been keeping track, but measured today and my bust has gone up 3 inches from 35 to 38 inches since the beginning of pregnancy. It is pretty much all growth on my left side, gah, like they aren't lopsided enough, but the left breast is up about a cup size, from 36 A to 36 B, the right I can't ever tell, it is definitely severe IGT there is some small growth but not as much as I would like. I have noticed increase sensitivity again in the past couple weeks like in the beginning of pregnancy so hoping they grow some more tissue over the next 10 weeks.


Layney82's Avatar Layney82 11:17 PM 02-23-2011

Hi everyone.  I have a 12 month old son and struggled with IGT with him.  At his 8 day check up, the doctor found that he was horribly dehydrated, and once I started pumping, it became apparent that I was making less than 10ml every 2 hours.  I went to see Dr. Jack Newman and started supplementing with a homemade lactation aid.  Between pumping and nursing constantly and taking the maximum dose of domperidone, I eventually got up to making 420 ml per day (about 14 oz), but was never able to get any more than that.  DS refused the breast after I went back to work at 3 months so I exclusively pumped.  At 7 months, I felt that the pumping time (4-5 hours in total each day) was taking away from parenting my son so I made the painful decision to stop.

 

Now, we're starting to plan for our second and last little one and I'm wondering if anyone did anything prior to pregnancy to combat IGT.  I've read that metformin can have a beneficial effect on breast tissue and that natural progesterone supplements can help prior to conception and in the first trimester.  I'm thinking about trying the progesterone, in hopes that it will also help with my super heavy cycles.  Has anyone tried Goat's rue prior to pregnancy?  We're thinking of TTC in a year or 2 and I want to do everything I can to make my next breastfeeding relationship more successful.


ILoveMyBabyBird's Avatar ILoveMyBabyBird 12:33 PM 02-27-2011


 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Layney82 View Post

Hi everyone.  I have a 12 month old son and struggled with IGT with him.  At his 8 day check up, the doctor found that he was horribly dehydrated, and once I started pumping, it became apparent that I was making less than 10ml every 2 hours.  I went to see Dr. Jack Newman and started supplementing with a homemade lactation aid.  Between pumping and nursing constantly and taking the maximum dose of domperidone, I eventually got up to making 420 ml per day (about 14 oz), but was never able to get any more than that.  DS refused the breast after I went back to work at 3 months so I exclusively pumped.  At 7 months, I felt that the pumping time (4-5 hours in total each day) was taking away from parenting my son so I made the painful decision to stop.

 

Now, we're starting to plan for our second and last little one and I'm wondering if anyone did anything prior to pregnancy to combat IGT.  I've read that metformin can have a beneficial effect on breast tissue and that natural progesterone supplements can help prior to conception and in the first trimester.  I'm thinking about trying the progesterone, in hopes that it will also help with my super heavy cycles.  Has anyone tried Goat's rue prior to pregnancy?  We're thinking of TTC in a year or 2 and I want to do everything I can to make my next breastfeeding relationship more successful.


i have read that some use goat's rue prior to concieving, not sure of the outcome or not. I would definitely say get a full work up to make sure all your hormones are in balance would definitely help. I was having some problems ttc and had blood work up done and a lot numbers that were normal were very low low normal, like some thyroid, and my iron levels were also low normal. I am now borderline anemic in this pregnancy so taking additional iron and i am also taking additional iodine to help support my thyroid levels since I did not qualify for hypothyroidism because of my low normal numbers.

 

~almost 33 weeks here, pretty much have my plan of action except for the hospital grade pump rental/borrowing, dh's friend who owns the hospital pump lent it out to another friend and their baby had surgery and has been unable to get back to the breast, so i am not sure if i will be able to borrow that pump since the other friends wife is still using it, i will wait a few more weeks and then  know more by then. After my shower i will head up to BRU and find out about their pump rental prices. I also checked out my old symphony kit and it looks like everything is still usuable except i will need to replace the tubes, which are not too costly, so that is another option as well, but i was really hoping to use the ameda since i bought extra kits to use so i don't have to wash right away every time.

 

I will start drinking goat's rue tea at 36 weeks and have one bottle of goat rue capsules that should last me the first month after birth, and i just ordered a 1 month supply of shatavari. I may also take saw palmetto as well.

 

These supplements are so costly. I am hoping that I will be able to eventually lower the dosage after the first month, i don't think i can spend so much every month on the herbs and in addition have to buy the formula supplements so i just hope i see big results or find out early on that the herbs aren't working for me...


ILoveMyBabyBird's Avatar ILoveMyBabyBird 12:39 PM 02-27-2011


 

Quote:
Originally Posted by lyterae View Post



 



 Sorry for the delay, in reading "making more milk" it's recomended to start taking Goat's Rue in the third trimester. I honestly haven't noticed any significant changes since starting to take it.

 

 Almost 38 weeks now... Still praying for a miracle and a full milk supply. :)


i imagine you have had your baby since we are nearing the end of february,  hope everything is going well for you!


lyterae's Avatar lyterae 02:02 PM 03-03-2011


 

Quote:
Originally Posted by ILoveMyBabyBird View Post


 


i imagine you have had your baby since we are nearing the end of february,  hope everything is going well for you!


nak - not sure on my supply yet. ben was born on sunday - he is a fantastic nurser and is sleeping well as well as having alert times when not eating... will start supplemting this weekend if needed - he has not started gaining weight yet, praying for a good wegh-in tomorrow. sorry for typos.  


germin8's Avatar germin8 08:40 PM 03-03-2011

I've got to write something here so that this goes to the top of my "Activity" list.

 

ILoveMyBabyBird, I remembered you are due sometime now... from back in August. I also remember thinking February/March is a long way away! But now it's here! I hope you are ready for your new arrival. Relax through the contractions... tension causes increased pain. :) *smile* Well, I am thinking of you and hoping your milk supply will be much better than the first time around. You've been doing so much! And, you inspire me to do something about my next milk supply... :) ...well, I'm not pregnant right now. But, in the future! I'm going to probably do some of the things you've been doing, but I'm also going to try a more organic living food diet or green smoothies. Well, at least that is what I would like. :) Sending you and your soon-to-be arrival *hugs*.


ILoveMyBabyBird's Avatar ILoveMyBabyBird 05:15 PM 03-08-2011


Quote:
Originally Posted by lyterae View Post


 


nak - not sure on my supply yet. ben was born on sunday - he is a fantastic nurser and is sleeping well as well as having alert times when not eating... will start supplemting this weekend if needed - he has not started gaining weight yet, praying for a good wegh-in tomorrow. sorry for typos.  



 


Congrats on you baby boy! I hope things are working well for you!

Quote:
Originally Posted by germin8 View Post

I've got to write something here so that this goes to the top of my "Activity" list.

 

ILoveMyBabyBird, I remembered you are due sometime now... from back in August. I also remember thinking February/March is a long way away! But now it's here! I hope you are ready for your new arrival. Relax through the contractions... tension causes increased pain. :) *smile* Well, I am thinking of you and hoping your milk supply will be much better than the first time around. You've been doing so much! And, you inspire me to do something about my next milk supply... :) ...well, I'm not pregnant right now. But, in the future! I'm going to probably do some of the things you've been doing, but I'm also going to try a more organic living food diet or green smoothies. Well, at least that is what I would like. :) Sending you and your soon-to-be arrival *hugs*.



Thanks, I am 34 weeks today, still have a little time to prepare. Still no leaking or any sign of colostrum, which i am surprised because i was able to express some when preggo with ds. I am still just taking alfalfa besides my other supplementation regimen. I am considering goats rue, but am very hesitant because of it's side effect of blood thinning. I am borderline low-iron right now, and I have been having nose bleeds despite taking extra iron. SO I am thinking of just taking nettle tea instead, as much as i want to grow tissue before birth, i also don't want to increase my chances of postpartum bleeding issues.  I do have shavatari and goats rue caps, (1 month supply) I will be starting once home from the hospital.

 

Ugh, but supplementing is so frustrating. I am still deciding on a formula, and I am just annoyed that i just can't pop the boobs out and feed dd, but will have to buy and use all the extra stuff. Looking at bottle/pump sterilizers, and drying racks, is just so depressing. I have the sns i will try my hardest just use it the first 4 weeks and not use bottles at all, but i only have one, which means lots of washing. After that i will introduce a bottle, I have 4 of the wide nuk orthodontic ones, and i just bought a 3 pack of the breastflow bottles. I do also have the cheaper kind, but will try not use them, will probably just use them to pump into. I also need a cream nipple cream, with ds i had horrible blisters, among other issues, but i didn't anything to put on them, so this time around i am going to have something on hand to use so hopefully i won't be in so much pain.


lyterae's Avatar lyterae 06:24 PM 03-08-2011

We started supplementing on Sunday, with no weight gain and continued weight loss (from 8.5 to 7.8) and still no bowel movements and not enough wet diapers I knew it was time... We're currently doing an extra 7-9 ounces using the SNS. I think that he might need more but I'm trying to just keep the SNS stocked when nursing to see how much he takes. He is back up to 7.13 and finally pooped twice today! Still not the traditional breastmilk stools we are looking for, but at least I know that things aren't stopped up!

 

The plan is to use the SNS for the next 2-3 weeks and then we'll start using bottles to supplement, we are currently using donor milk (for which I am so grateful!) and that makes it not as bad... Emotionally it isn't any easier than last time, but I'm more prepared to handle it this time and that is making a big difference. I don't feel myself falling into depression over it, and I'm just trying to remind myself he is still nursing! We are nursing without supplementing overnights for right now, I'm not sure if I'll be able to continue like that but for right now it's nice to just be able to nurse and go to sleep with him in the middle in the night. I do have a hospital grade pump, but honestly it is a LOT harder than I thought to have time to use it. He marathon nurses and likes nothing more than to stay connected to the breast at all times.

 

 


ILoveMyBabyBird's Avatar ILoveMyBabyBird 03:24 AM 03-10-2011


 

Quote:
Originally Posted by lyterae View Post

We started supplementing on Sunday, with no weight gain and continued weight loss (from 8.5 to 7.8) and still no bowel movements and not enough wet diapers I knew it was time... We're currently doing an extra 7-9 ounces using the SNS. I think that he might need more but I'm trying to just keep the SNS stocked when nursing to see how much he takes. He is back up to 7.13 and finally pooped twice today! Still not the traditional breastmilk stools we are looking for, but at least I know that things aren't stopped up!

 

The plan is to use the SNS for the next 2-3 weeks and then we'll start using bottles to supplement, we are currently using donor milk (for which I am so grateful!) and that makes it not as bad... Emotionally it isn't any easier than last time, but I'm more prepared to handle it this time and that is making a big difference. I don't feel myself falling into depression over it, and I'm just trying to remind myself he is still nursing! We are nursing without supplementing overnights for right now, I'm not sure if I'll be able to continue like that but for right now it's nice to just be able to nurse and go to sleep with him in the middle in the night. I do have a hospital grade pump, but honestly it is a LOT harder than I thought to have time to use it. He marathon nurses and likes nothing more than to stay connected to the breast at all times.

 

 


sorry you are having to supplement, but it sounds like you are off to a great start!  I too would try not to supplement at night, as long as your ds is doing well on the breast and not acting hungry that should be fine, with my ds I had to supplement starting at day 9, but got terrible advice and was supplementing all the time, but when he was 10 weeks got the hospital pump/sns and did stop supplementing at night, and his dr. at the time said that that was completely fine, so you may not have to supplement at night at all as long as your ds is getting the extra milk supplement during waking hours. Your plan sounds pretty much like mine, using the sns exclusively for the first 4 weeks or so, and then introducing the bottle, no overnight supplementing. Trying to fit pumping in when you can, and it sounds like you ds is great nurser which is awesome! There are so many issues that can be added on to situations like ours, and it is great to hear that you and your ds aren't having more issues on top of the IGT..

 


ILoveMyBabyBird's Avatar ILoveMyBabyBird 06:00 AM 03-10-2011

eta: after spending the whole morning researching, I have decided to use the large sns tube that were never used from ds and separate them and use them with a bottle as back sns devices. I just don't know if I will be able to wash one every time, and i don't want to resort to using a bottle. The tube is pretty short, but I should be able to manage, I will go buy some fast flow/ nipples to use with them, and as far as that is concerned i should be okay. That gives me the sns and 2 single tube/bottle feeder  back ups...I just couldn't justify spending another 50$ on another sns.

 


dollyanna's Avatar dollyanna 09:56 PM 03-22-2011

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lyterae's Avatar lyterae 10:30 AM 03-23-2011

My supply has capped at about 6 oz daily, not nearly as much as I had hoped. We switched to using bottles because I couldn't get enough milk into him via the SNS. The donor milk ran out yesterday and he had his first bottle of formula. So far his tummy seems to be okay, and I am much more okay with the bottles and formula this time around than I was last time. I still don't like it, but it's not nearly as upsetting emotionally as it was before.

 

Since starting bottles Ben suddenly started having regular bowel movements, his jaundice has cleared up, he is close to 10 lbs now, and the rest of the family can hold him now.

 

I am pumping throughout the day and and we usually nurse early in the morning. Ben isn't terribly interested in nursing anymore and will not latch at all onto the right side (that side is the more underdeveloped of the two, it has always been harder to latch onto). 

 

Not the success story I was hoping for, but hopefully the 6 oz I'm giving him will make a difference.


Megan73's Avatar Megan73 01:22 PM 03-23-2011

Lyterae, I saw your post and wondered if you've tried a Lact-Aid? It's miles better for long term supplementing than the SNS. My SIL, who is BFAR, used one for two years with her second nursling and I used it for 18 months for unexplained low supply with my first and I'm  now using it again with my six-week-old.

It will prevent the breast refusal and get Ben doing more expressive sucking at the breast,  increasing your supply.

Hang in there, mama. I know how tough this is. hug2.gif


lyterae's Avatar lyterae 08:46 AM 03-25-2011


Quote:
Originally Posted by Megan73 View Post

Lyterae, I saw your post and wondered if you've tried a Lact-Aid? It's miles better for long term supplementing than the SNS. My SIL, who is BFAR, used one for two years with her second nursling and I used it for 18 months for unexplained low supply with my first and I'm  now using it again with my six-week-old.

It will prevent the breast refusal and get Ben doing more expressive sucking at the breast,  increasing your supply.

Hang in there, mama. I know how tough this is. hug2.gif


 

  I haven't tried the lact-aid, how is it different than the SNS? The SNS was working fine except that it was impossible to get over 8 ounces of milk in him daily using it all day, and as my supply has capped at 6 ounces the 8 ounces wasn't nearly enough. Switching to bottles has enabled him to get in the amount of milk needed.

 

 Ben is back on the breast! Today is day two of successfully getting him to nurse at most feedings. We are nursing in the midst of feedings, he won't nurse first because he's too hungry, and if I give him too much supplement he won't nurse after.. So we are doing somewhere between 1-2 ounces first, nursing, and then "topping" off with whatever he requires. It varies each time... 

 

I hope that everyone else is doing well!


dollyanna's Avatar dollyanna 11:34 AM 03-27-2011

Hi everyone.  I'm pregnant with DC2 (1st trimester) and I'm definitely thinking about how I'm going to approach breastfeeding this time.  I was pretty devastated when I figured out I couldn't produce much milk last time around.  I am glad this time I know what I am getting into, but I'm also apprehensive about trying to make things work without completely losing my mind.

 

I have PCOS and IGT (I gather having both is fairly common).  One recommendation I was not able to do last time was to take metformin.  My Dr wouldn't prescribe it.  However, this time around I have a prescription now from when I was TTC and I'm hoping that my Dr will refill it even though I won't still be trying to get pregnant.  Also last time, I only tried the SNS (not the lact-aid) so I definitely want to try that this time. 

 

From reading everything here, it looks like this book "making more milk" would be a good thing to read. 

 

Do folks have recommendations for what herbs/etc. are helpful to start taking during early pregnancy?  I saw mention of alfafa leaf - are there other things?

 


ILoveMyBabyBird's Avatar ILoveMyBabyBird 01:07 PM 03-27-2011

36 w/ 5 day, so almost full term and still i cannot express colostrum, I know i could by now when pg with ds, so it is slightly worrying me. I have given up hope of getting to use dh's friends hospital pump as the other friend that is borrowing it is stuck in an EP situation due to her dd's surgery 2 days after birth and from what i gathered last night at their home, a grandma who won't put the baby down and kept putting a paci in the babies mouth...Anyway, so i am just going to chance it with my ameda purely yours, good thing is that I have the 1 hygienikit and 2 others 'temporary' ones i bought NIP off ebay, so that will give me more ease of using it without having to clean the parts right afterward.  I have decided that if for some reason the nurses at the hosipital say dd needs supplements(which they probably won't), but if so I am going to demand that she use an sns or something other than a bottle. I still haven't started taking anything besides alfalfa and occasionally drinking nettle tea when i remember. But I am thinking i will start goats rue tomorrow since i am almost full term, I have decided to try shatavari instead of goats rue once it runs out as goats rue is quite expensive and shatavari seems to be more cost efficient. I have a 1 month supply of goats rue and a 2 months supply of shatavari already.


Megan73's Avatar Megan73 04:10 PM 03-27-2011

That's great that he's back at the breast!

I found the SNS so incredibly fiddly. If it wasn't at the perfect level, supp wouldn't flow. The LA works using suction, not gravity and it's what many BFAR moms use for long-term supplementation - including my SIL who nursed her youngest for two years with very low supply due to breast reduction surgery. It's also much easier to NIP discreetly with the LA.

It's really a great product and I can't recommend it highly enough after battling back from breast refusal due to bottle supplementation and going on to nurse DS1 well into toddlerhood.
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by lyterae View Post




 

  I haven't tried the lact-aid, how is it different than the SNS? The SNS was working fine except that it was impossible to get over 8 ounces of milk in him daily using it all day, and as my supply has capped at 6 ounces the 8 ounces wasn't nearly enough. Switching to bottles has enabled him to get in the amount of milk needed.

 

 Ben is back on the breast! Today is day two of successfully getting him to nurse at most feedings. We are nursing in the midst of feedings, he won't nurse first because he's too hungry, and if I give him too much supplement he won't nurse after.. So we are doing somewhere between 1-2 ounces first, nursing, and then "topping" off with whatever he requires. It varies each time... 

 

I hope that everyone else is doing well!



 


Layney82's Avatar Layney82 11:14 AM 03-28-2011

I had really good luck just using a french feeding tube (about $1 each and free from the hospital's L.C. department).  The lact-aid and SNS were just too expensive for me, so I bought some bottles (medela to go with my pump) and stuck the feeding tube into the bottle, either through the nipple or through a cap that they gave me at the hospital.  The bottle would fit in my bra or in the pocket of my 'my breast friend' nursing pillow.  DS and I used this for 4 months with pretty good success.

 

The bottles were pretty cheap, and after we stopped nursing (I pumped) we just used them as regular bottles.  They could go straight in the dishwasher which saved time washing the little bits.

 

Another thing I found to make supplementing easier was to skip the tape.  I'm allergic to adhesive and hated taping the tube on my breast.  I also found it hard to get it positioned properly.  Instead, after he latched, I slipped the tube in through the corner of his mouth.  There is a useful video on Dr. Jack Newman's website.  This method took practice, but ultimately, it was a lot easier for us.


Layney82's Avatar Layney82 11:22 AM 03-28-2011

I've read a couple papers that suggested natural progesterone supplements in the 1st trimester resulted in increased breast tissue growth. http://jhl.sagepub.com/content/15/4/339.abstract  It might be worth considering.

 

I'm starting to think about TTC #2 and the breastfeeding issue is a big concern for me.  I topped out at 14oz/ day with DS (and only lasted 7 months) and I so want it to go better with DC2.  My problem is finding a doctor who cares.  My OB thought I should just quit so i could take the pill and my family doctor knew nothing about it.  I have IGT and suspect PCOS but my family doctor didn't really know anything about it or how to diagnose it.
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by dollyanna View Post

Hi everyone.  I'm pregnant with DC2 (1st trimester) and I'm definitely thinking about how I'm going to approach breastfeeding this time.  I was pretty devastated when I figured out I couldn't produce much milk last time around.  I am glad this time I know what I am getting into, but I'm also apprehensive about trying to make things work without completely losing my mind.

 

I have PCOS and IGT (I gather having both is fairly common).  One recommendation I was not able to do last time was to take metformin.  My Dr wouldn't prescribe it.  However, this time around I have a prescription now from when I was TTC and I'm hoping that my Dr will refill it even though I won't still be trying to get pregnant.  Also last time, I only tried the SNS (not the lact-aid) so I definitely want to try that this time. 

 

From reading everything here, it looks like this book "making more milk" would be a good thing to read. 

 

Do folks have recommendations for what herbs/etc. are helpful to start taking during early pregnancy?  I saw mention of alfafa leaf - are there other things?

 



 


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