Do you ever feel like you chose the wrong "pill"? - Mothering Forums

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#1 of 67 Old 11-29-2008, 05:50 PM - Thread Starter
 
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(reference to The Matrix where Neo chooses to take the pill of knowledge that reveals humans' terrible condition, instead of the pill that would launch him back into the blissful dream of ignorance.) I mean seriously. This whole TF/WAP business is such important information, right? We had fun on the thread talking about people's faces and palates. But I really feel like I have the weight of the world on my shoulders trying to get DD (and myself) to eat healthy foods, and shielding her from the "foods of modern commerce" that are all around us, including the stuff brought into our house by my DH.

I wanted to come post here to ask who is a TF "evangelist" and how you get the word out, what you say to people, how you feel about this important knowledge re: preventing miscarriage, birth defects, disease, you name it. I want to go out and spread the word on how to have healthy babies, but I have such a hard time within my own family that I feel like it would be so much easier to be blissfully ignorant and go on eating like everyone else. Does anyone else feel this way?

BTW, check out the book in my siggy. I want to tell everyone about it!! But then I kind of feel like a hypocrite acting all "high and mighty" about doing things the way nature intended...who am I to preach about this stuff?? It is pretty controversial, and touchy. You have to tread very lightly. Makes me want to just give up and crawl into a box of cookies.

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#2 of 67 Old 11-29-2008, 07:03 PM
 
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Ugh. I totally know what you're talking about. I was raised health conscious and, while it definitely has made me interested and passionate about bodies and biological diet, it has also made me very focused on food and prone to food obsession. I hate it (the food obsession part). It's really, really hard, and sometimes just looking at someone who's more or less healthy, of good weight, and seems to have been raised in a French Women Don't Get Fat sort of way, and continue to maintain it, I can't help but be jealous of their lack of care in regards to food. kwim? Someday I know I will heal my physical ailments, help my dcs be strong and healthy, achieve a strong, healthy body, feel like I'm bouncy and too energized for my own good, and I'll look back and know that the path was worth it. But in the meantime, I can't help but cast jealous glances at those folks who seem to feel good, look good, and put horrible things in their bodies.

ETA: just looked at the book in your sig, and lol, I have it, too. Haven't read it yet, but skimmed here and there, and it's fantastic!

Sarah, wife to dh, mama to dd 1/07/03 and ds 3/30/05
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#3 of 67 Old 11-29-2008, 07:42 PM
 
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Absolutely. I feel so helpless when trying to tell people the truth too because I think they all think I am a loon. Ignorance is truly bliss.

<>< Alison
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#4 of 67 Old 11-29-2008, 09:22 PM
 
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Absolutely. I feel so helpless when trying to tell people the truth too because I think they all think I am a loon. Ignorance is truly bliss.
I know how you feel. TF has made such a huge difference in my life. When people I know talk about their health and problems associated with them they'll often ask me what I think. For example, a veg*n from work kept complaining of digestive stress so I suggested soaking her grains and limiting soy, which she thought was too much work. I find people generally listen until I mention the benefits of saturated fat and then they immediately tune out.

So, now I just direct my energy to my blog on TF.

I blog traditional foods and Weston A Price at Nourished Kitchen. See my healthy recipes.
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#5 of 67 Old 11-29-2008, 09:44 PM
 
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To be honest I feel this way about everything! Not just TF, but I feel like I wish I was 20 again and (I was stupid lol but) didn't care about food, health, economics, politics, religion etc.

I wish life was simpler but the older I get the harder it gets lol.
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#6 of 67 Old 11-29-2008, 10:34 PM
 
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To continue your Matrix comparison, most people aren't ready to see the truth. People don't really want to know about diet of cows, or about phytates, or about most of this stuff.

I'm not a TF evangelist. People think I'm weird enough as it is. But when they note certain things about our health and all that, I mention things about our diet. Sometimes people are interested. Rarely are they interested enough to try it but never know.
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#7 of 67 Old 11-29-2008, 10:42 PM
 
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To be honest I feel this way about everything! Not just TF, but I feel like I wish I was 20 again and (I was stupid lol but) didn't care about food, health, economics, politics, religion etc.

I wish life was simpler but the older I get the harder it gets lol.
Haha, I'm 20.
Home birth, traditional foods. etc
I tell DH all the time sometimes I wish I never learned any of this!!

Mama to Belly(5), homesteading in the desert with our chickens and sheep. Fish nerd, really into my reef tank. Baby due Sep 3rd!

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#8 of 67 Old 11-30-2008, 12:06 AM
 
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I'm not a TF evangelist, per se - but I am a sustainable local-foods evangelist, which generally works out to the same thing, in practise - but it's easier to go this route and be socially acceptable, somehow. Like it's ok to be evangelistic about the environment and food security, but not what people are feeding themselves.

Whatever. I try to promote my way of eating by focusing on the positives, not the negatives. I SUPPORT local farms and local businesses, my food TASTES FANTASTIC, I SAVE MONEY and I SAVE THE ENVIRONMENT. So far I have partially converted my nextdoor neighbour, in that I buy local organic veg, meats and nuts for her, and when I buy whole chickens I cut hers up and make broth from the carcass and she gets half. I got other friends into my cow share, and I have another friend eagerly awaiting my copy of "Real Food" which is loaned to yet ANOTHER friend at the moment. I am also demonstrably very healthy and have the least pickiest kid around, so that helps. And, once in a while, I slip in a tidbit of info like "you can't get dietary calcium without dietary fat at the same time" and explain why the push for low-fat dairy was instituted by the dairy industry, not Health Canada, and nobody seems to ostracize me for that.

I never, ever tell anyone that what they eat is BAD. Except I accidentally said something pretty much that about breakfast cereal, which sent one of my friends - the one who is waiting for "Real Food" - into a paroxysm of "OMG it's all I feed my kid for breakfast, OMG I'm poisoning her" so I don't do that any more, it's not nice.

Postpartum doula & certified breastfeeding educator, mama to an amazing girl (11/05) and a wee little boy (3/13).

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#9 of 67 Old 11-30-2008, 12:16 AM
 
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spughy, i do the same thing.

I have been on a food journey for such a long time. Veggie to vegan to raw to everything and now very happily landing in tf and local foods.
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#10 of 67 Old 11-30-2008, 01:01 AM - Thread Starter
 
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ETA: just looked at the book in your sig, and lol, I have it, too. Haven't read it yet, but skimmed here and there, and it's fantastic!
Cool, thanks for letting me know!

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#11 of 67 Old 11-30-2008, 01:39 AM
 
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I'm just doing the best I can, trying to improve my own diet first, then my kids' a little less directly, and I don't even worry about the rest of the world. I don't have the energy to deal with that- I'm not about to argue with an MD that her 9yo DD should be drinking whole milk in spite of her high cholesterol, YK? (who on earth tests a 9yos cholesterol anyway?) I'll offer guests the food we have in the house (and this poor child who's been raised on skim milk only may accept or decline the whole milk we keep in the house- I can also offer her juice, water, tea, etc.)

Ruth, single mommy to Leah, 19 (in Israel for another school year), Hannah, 18 (commuting to college), and Jack, 12(homeschooled)
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#12 of 67 Old 11-30-2008, 02:22 AM
 
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Yes, I definitely feel this way and unfortunately I am angry about it a lot of the time.

I am frustrated that the generations before me didn't have this pressure, either because eating this way was their default or because they were blissfully ignorant. I am mad that I am, once again, the woman who is undoing crap that has happened in my family, like getting therapy to deal with problems that really should have been dealt with even before I was born.

I am secretly jealous of people who don't know, parents who heat up a mac and cheese dinner in the microwave, grab some conventionally grown baby carrots from a bag, dump 4 cups of white sugar into some water with a Kool-aid packet and are done with dinner. Plus they get to feel good about it because they mac and cheese is fortified, the carrots are healthy, and the Kool-aid has Vitamin C so it's just like fresh juice, right?
But the worst part, the very worst part, is the feeling that I have to fight major capitalistic forces to make any progress. I feel like I am fighting "the man" in order to eat this way and live this way. I am battling billions of dollars of marketing dollars from powers like agri-business, the pharmaceutical industry, the US government, just about every entity that is the most powerful and wealthy in the world. And as a somewhat extensive traveler, seeing them move into untouched, pristine places in my lifetime. I am angry that thousands of years of knowledge have been lost in a few generations, through systematic and deliberate obliteration of knowledge in the name of expediency and greed.

I am angry that it's not supported by society to eat the TF way and that it's not difficult, expensive and time-consuming to find and eat junk.

I feel ashamed to think that if I had decided not to have children I probably would have given in by now and simply decided to be the last in our line of people with malformed facial structures and other nutritional failings, victims of aforementioned greed, to be looked back upon by future generations as one who was a victim of the dark ages of nutritional knowledge.

Whew! Umm, yeah, I guess I do know what you're talking about.

The children keep me going. The hand that rocks the cradle and all that. Plus,a secret feeling of "sticking it to the man" when I drink raw milk or get some eggs from the local kids' chickens.

As for telling people, I am lucky enough to be an alternative medical practitioner so I have some credibility and an opening for discussion with clients. (Although that facet leaves me with a similar ball of wax about the current state of the medical field!) With friends it's more difficult, and with family except kids and DH, forget it.
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#13 of 67 Old 11-30-2008, 03:13 AM
 
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But the worst part, the very worst part, is the feeling that I have to fight major capitalistic forces to make any progress. I feel like I am fighting "the man" in order to eat this way and live this way. I am battling billions of dollars of marketing dollars from powers like agri-business, the pharmaceutical industry, the US government, just about every entity that is the most powerful and wealthy in the world. And as a somewhat extensive traveler, seeing them move into untouched, pristine places in my lifetime. I am angry that thousands of years of knowledge have been lost in a few generations, through systematic and deliberate obliteration of knowledge in the name of expediency and greed.
Oh yeah. That part SUCKS. BTW, if you want a good read, check out "Kitchen Literacy" by Ann Vileisis. It does a fantastic job of showing how social and economic forces shaped today's food preferences and assumptions. It will be largely preaching to the choir for you, but still worthwhile.

A good portion of my food is borderline illegal. I have an awful lot of meat with an awful lot of "NOT GOVERNMENT INSPECTED. NOT FOR RESALE." stamps all over it in my freezer.

Postpartum doula & certified breastfeeding educator, mama to an amazing girl (11/05) and a wee little boy (3/13).

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#14 of 67 Old 11-30-2008, 03:52 AM
 
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I feel this way sometimes. At first it was easy being TF because eating so much butter was so delicious. Now that I am on an elimination diet with no diary and have to face that dairy might be one the things I need to cut out of my diet long term....it isn't so novel without butter hehe.

Also, people ARE starting to ask me alot of questions now. Without reading books and articles, they seem so confused and wide eyed ("what, soy and organic boxed cereal are bad for you??"). Rather than hardcore preaching TF to them, I encourage them to eat whole foods..basically stay away from anything packaged...and give them a 2 minute primer on fats. They are overwhelmed with that as it is, so I start small.

Its so hard watching people eat sometimes, the things they give their kids! I wish I didn't know so much so I wouldn't freak out and judge them so much on that (I never verbalize it, I just scream "noooo!" in my mind haha).

For myself, I sometimes wish we would have stuck with out former diet. It consisted of all Trader Joe's food, so nothing too horrible (but lots of white flour pasta and stuff) and cost almost half of what we pay now. It also was alot of packaged/prepped TJ stuff so saved lots of time. *Sigh*.

But now that I am dealing with food sensitivities, I am so thankful to have found TF and this forum. Otherwise I might be going to an MD and taking drugs, when all I needed to do is an elimination diet and replace whatever food culprit with other whole foods.

Happily married to DH for 6 years, in process to foster-adopt 3 children DD4, DS3 and DS2. We may be bringing half brother age 9 one day as well! We are not infertile, we just have decided that since there are precious children who need homes there is no need for us to have biological children.

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#15 of 67 Old 11-30-2008, 10:14 AM
 
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I'm just doing the best I can, trying to improve my own diet first, then my kids' a little less directly, and I don't even worry about the rest of the world. I don't have the energy to deal with that- I'm not about to argue with an MD that her 9yo DD should be drinking whole milk in spite of her high cholesterol, YK? (who on earth tests a 9yos cholesterol anyway?) I'll offer guests the food we have in the house (and this poor child who's been raised on skim milk only may accept or decline the whole milk we keep in the house- I can also offer her juice, water, tea, etc.)
: We do the best we can and try not to worry about anything else. It is not that I don't care, but I cannot get my stress level up worrying about things I cannot control. I feel strongly about a lot of things, but have found being a crazy evangelist doesn't help anything. I try to be a good example, but as always there are places to improve. I am sure as it is now they think that since my kids are on a limited diet to to intolerances etc that I am horribly, horribly ruining them and it must be my fault for feeding them health food. My cousin actually thinks my kids are kind of picky as I won't let them eat junk and they cannot eat gluten,dairy, preservatives, colors etc etc . She really doesn't get it.

Happily Married to my : 11 yrs- Mama to wild-eyed monkey boy 7-04, fiery little girl 4-07, and the happy smiley baby that sleeps 11-09!
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#16 of 67 Old 11-30-2008, 02:04 PM
 
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A good portion of my food is borderline illegal. I have an awful lot of meat with an awful lot of "NOT GOVERNMENT INSPECTED. NOT FOR RESALE." stamps all over it in my freezer.
You! you.. rebel!

(I'm along with you, we just got our 1/8 cow and our freezer is the same way. )
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#17 of 67 Old 11-30-2008, 03:48 PM
 
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BTW, if you want a good read, check out "Kitchen Literacy" by Ann Vileisis.
Thanks, added it to my wish list. Will also check the library.

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A good portion of my food is borderline illegal. I have an awful lot of meat with an awful lot of "NOT GOVERNMENT INSPECTED. NOT FOR RESALE." stamps all over it in my freezer.
Yes, or "Pet Food Only" is another one.
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#18 of 67 Old 11-30-2008, 03:56 PM
 
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Rather than hardcore preaching TF to them, I encourage them to eat whole foods..basically stay away from anything packaged...and give them a 2 minute primer on fats. They are overwhelmed with that as it is, so I start small.
That's great. It's also what's scary, that we've been so brainwashed (e.g., "fats are bad") that it is overwhelming to acquire even this knowledge we once had innately.

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Its so hard watching people eat sometimes, the things they give their kids! I wish I didn't know so much so I wouldn't freak out and judge them so much on that (I never verbalize it, I just scream "noooo!" in my mind haha).
It can be hard to watch, but I've moved my judgment from the people to the powers that have taught them to think this way. It's been systematic and deliberate and these companies prey on our natural instincts, giving us fake creaminess instead of real fat, and soda which attracts us due to our natural instinct to prefer slightly carbonated (fermented) foods and beverages.
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#19 of 67 Old 11-30-2008, 05:28 PM
 
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Yes, we eat "Pet Food" also, but don't tell DH!
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#20 of 67 Old 12-01-2008, 12:22 AM
 
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I feel that way sometimes. Mostly, it's a sense of deep deep guilt that I ate SAD probably when pg with DD. I knew better but I was so sick through the pregnancy that I told myself it's all I could eat. I should have tried harder, I should have made myself. DD is fine- beautiful, brilliant and incredible, but still.

And heck, I do sometimes envy people that can just go into a grocery store and shop! My trips turn into hour long ingredient reading expeditions where I can only end up eating like 10% of what is on the shelves.

mom to one glorious sweetpea born 10/18/2007.

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#21 of 67 Old 12-01-2008, 12:49 AM
 
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He that increaseth knowledge increaseth sorrow.
Ecclesiastes, 1. 18

Not to offend, that's just what went through my mind......

Oh, the grocery machinery, money money money.
My friends in Kenya ask me, why are we having so many miscarriages now? Why are we getting cancer? Why are we getting diabetes? I'm pretty new to TF, but I think I know now.
I went shopping lately at a store I don't usually go to, a little cheaper one than the one next to my neighborhood. I was amazed that their packaging now reads, "All Natural" on almost everything. But when I read the ingredients list, I'm like, mmmm, no. Or, "no trans fat." And everyone buying these things thinks they're getting a good, healthy product. I posted a week or so ago even how at Costco I picked up the cheese and it had fricking artificial color in it. Or the ads for HFCS.
And have you all seen this one? First page ad in Fortune this month----cholesterol lowering milk! http://www.pura.com.au/pura_brands_heartactive.aspx
My son's friends come over and won't have dinner with us unless its mac and cheeze, pizza rolls from a box, or premade peanut butter and jelly sandwiches. (so they never eat with us, and that makes him so sad.) Honestly, they don't even KNOW HOW to eat unprocessed food. And that saddens me.....
We have a long way to go at our house, I'll be the first to admit, but we're getting there. Baby steps.

Oh, and what else is frustrating is if I was to get into a conversation with someone about, saturarated fats for instance, I can only imagine the voices in their head...."Yeah, she LOVES her butter, that's obvious. I'll stick to my SmartBalanceLite and keep my size 6 jeans, thankyouverymuch." So I'm not the greatest poster child for an unconventional style of eating. I was talking to another mom about how her husband has such bad GI issues after eating grains, about soaking them. Some of the other moms heard us, and you could just see the wheels turning: "Us, take dietary advise from you? Yeah right! "

Ahhh, so anyway, I'm rambling.
Wrong pill, maybe, but then I'm getting more and more used to being outside the norm.
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#22 of 67 Old 12-01-2008, 12:52 AM
 
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yes, yes and YES

I feel so much weight on my shoulders to get dd healthy - and even dh has trouble seeing any of her 'symptoms' as problems (how do we know mushy poop isn't normal for a 2yo?) And then there's the problem that we're not seeing any obvious progress, so I just feel kinda like a lunatic...

What am I doing about it? Telling my friends how xxx is good for you because it has yyy, every chance I get without sounding like a broken record. And I'm about to start a program to get a M.S. in nutrition and I'm thinking about becoming an IBCLC - so I can be a professional expert on food sensitivities in nursing babies and tell new mothers what foods are important when it's so critical to know *and* I have their full attention.

allergy-nutrition mama, dh, 4yo dd, and March ds
Eating shouldn't be stressful!
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#23 of 67 Old 12-01-2008, 12:56 AM
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That's the irritating thing about knowledge, you can't make it go away (short of brain injury, I guess), even if it becomes uncomfortable. I don't think I have the one and only true path to nutritional nirvana, but I feel sad and sick thinking about so many millions of kids growing up on, and adults subsisting on, almost totally vacant calories. But I'm not a nutritional evangelist. I only occasionally offer a comment if others bring the subject up, and otherwise just try to be an example. I'm not apologetic about the way I eat and feed my family, but I try not to come across as judgmental of others' food choices, even if I'm thinking it, and especially when I know they haven't made a conscious choice but are only doing what they do out of habit and familiarity. Some people feel judged just because someone else is doing something different (same as with vaccine choices, birth choices, etc.), but I can't control that. It can be incredibly frustrating, but I can't imagine choosing the pill of ignorance.

There is no secret ingredient.
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#24 of 67 Old 12-01-2008, 01:10 AM
 
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Oh Mamas!

I am at best a part time, moderate TFoodie... is there such a thing?
But whether I am eating traditional or post-industrial-modern () that particular moment, I refuse to digest guilt and shame and anger.

We do the best we can with what we have.
My husband's Taiji Master grew up during the revolution and famine in China. There were many months where all he had to eat was sweet potato. He is one of the healthiest, most peaceful, most elegant and cheerful men we know. I think the human body is a mystery and feeds on energy as much as physical nutrition.

The angst and guilt around food we are all discussing here is as much a modern phenomenon as transfats, IMHO.
So big hugs and wishes for peaceful meals to everyone here.

Grace Comes.

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#25 of 67 Old 12-01-2008, 01:18 AM
 
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Oh Mamas!

I am at best a part time, moderate TFoodie... is there such a thing?
But whether I am eating traditional or post-industrial-modern () that particular moment, I refuse to digest guilt and shame and anger.

We do the best we can with what we have.
My husband's Taiji Master grew up during the revolution and famine in China. There were many months where all he had to eat was sweet potato. He is one of the healthiest, most peaceful, most elegant and cheerful men we know. I think the human body is a mystery and feeds on energy as much as physical nutrition.

The angst and guilt around food we are all discussing here is as much a modern phenomenon as transfats, IMHO.
So big hugs and wishes for peaceful meals to everyone here.
Yes, this! There are so many conflicting ideas about what is 'healthy'. To be honest, humans are omnivores, and, depending on genetic background, certain diets will be 'healthier' to them than others. So while I may do better without grains or dairy, another person does best on an almost all dairy diet (like the Masai). I try not to worry about others' diets, unless they mention certain issues cropping up. Of course, the super processed modern diet is horrible, no doubt about that. If my grandmother wouldn't recognize it as food, then it ain't food! lol

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Wife to dh, Mommy to my heavenly angel, J (06), and my earthly angels, S (07) and E (10)

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#26 of 67 Old 12-01-2008, 03:57 AM
 
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Well this is timely. I think about this often, though I truely *hate* the preachy type. I try (and I'm pretty sure I don't come off as) to not sound know-it-all and snobbish about food, but really I just try to make sure my kids understand about good food and shelter them as much as I can .

They are 2.5 and 4.5 so I know I cannot do it forever. It's funny because I just came down to check the computer for the last time since putting my 4.5 year old to bed. Before he fell asleep he said, "mommy, tomorrow for lunch I want chicken noodle soup, I loooooove that stuff." (we are going to the local good grocery with really nice lunch food and to get more cod liver oil. It made me happy and I almost fell asleep and couldn't get back up. I've had a long week with thanksgiving and crappy eating and kool-aid with my sister and her body building boyfriend (who strangely enough is the koolaid addict.) DS asked him if it had food coloring in it because food coloring makes him act crazy (true, no lie)

I am not a preach about my good food and why everyone else should eat this way. But I *DO* cook well, very tasty food an I have non-picky happy and healthy kids. Chubby by these days definition, but healthy and happy. Soemtimes I get in to a rut and wonder "why the hell do I go through so much trouble to make handheld potpies with thanksgiving leftoveres?" when I can just buy the 2 for a buck type things? Well, when my kids says he wants to eat my freakin chicken soup because it's sooooo good. I must have done something right; because he gets his share of crap on saturdays at grammas (and by crap I just mean packaged bread and ice cream).
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#27 of 67 Old 12-01-2008, 04:14 AM
 
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I agree there's no one standard diet everyone should follow, once a person moves into the realm of natural and whole foods. I think it's easier to articulate what people should not eat (artificial trans fats, HFCS, etc) than what they should eat.
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#28 of 67 Old 12-01-2008, 07:36 AM
 
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I totally feel the same thing -- immense pressure to feed my children well, and yes, it stresses me out. And it's so hard when you are constantly "fighting" the food culture all around you. DS first tried white bread at around age 3, at someone's house. Now whenever he sees it he clamours for it. What am I supposed to do? We had two birthday parties on the weekend, and again, I don't want to be a spoilsport, but handing a bag of candy to each kid as they walk in the door? Can't the cake be enough? People are so unaware.

Plus there's the whole issue of knowing what is good for you, like raw milk, but not having access to it. We live in Nigeria, and raw milk can give you TB, so no way. It's extremely frustrating for me to not be able to give raw milk to my kids.

But ... I am still so grateful that I found this forum two years ago. Our diet is much better than it would have been. I'm so happy every time I give broth to my family. ANd CLO/BO. And pastured chickens -- I get them from the local market. If I hadn't known about TF, I would have been buying them at the supermarket like any other expat. So I am trying to remind myself that I am doing my best and trying to feel grateful. And DS isn't so awful -- he eats brown rice every day, loves fish and miso soup. And my whole family loves my chicken noodle soup.

Globetrotting mama to DS (9) and DD (6)
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#29 of 67 Old 12-01-2008, 11:47 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Watching our kids eat homemade chicken noodle soup! That's about as close to nutritional nirvana as it gets!

***
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#30 of 67 Old 12-02-2008, 03:18 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by avent View Post
I am secretly jealous of people who don't know, parents who heat up a mac and cheese dinner in the microwave, grab some conventionally grown baby carrots from a bag, dump 4 cups of white sugar into some water with a Kool-aid packet and are done with dinner. Plus they get to feel good about it because they mac and cheese is fortified, the carrots are healthy, and the Kool-aid has Vitamin C so it's just like fresh juice, right?
Wait, how do you know my mother-in-law? Oh no, you're not talking about her, she doesn't do baby carrots she does can of corn.
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