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#1 of 31 Old 09-29-2009, 06:31 AM - Thread Starter
 
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So, I just started watching this new show called "The Biggest Loser," it's a reality-type TV show where some very overweight people go to a ranch and try to lose a bunch of weight. Thankfully, this is something that I've never had to struggle with, but it's a really inspiring show to watch.
In addition to lots of working out, they talk a lot about nutrition. Of course, they are very into non-stick, no-fat, kind of things. But it got me thinking, should someone who is so overweight (the heaviest person is over 400lbs) be eating butter and cream? From a TF perspective, what gets a person to be so overweight, and what's the best way to get the weight down?
There were definitely a few heavy soda drinkers on there; I'm sure that sugar has a lot to do with the problem of obesity.
And does anyone here work out? I sure don't.

I saw a couple of episodes and I started to wonder about this stuff, and wanted to run it by the MDC TFers!
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#2 of 31 Old 09-29-2009, 11:14 AM
 
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Carbs. Look at all the books/research supporting TF and it is carbs, most especially refined carbs of course. Soda, bread, cookies, crackers, pasta, dairy (sorry, I lean hard on the Paleo side of things), sugar, ugh. Yes, I think someone trying to lose weight should definitely be eating fat. It is what signals satiety.
And I do not "work out". I work hard.

Emily, cooking allergen free, knitting, reading, gardening Mom to 1 beautiful girl, born in the water on July 1, 2006 Wife to 1 handsome man since September 10, 2005
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#3 of 31 Old 09-29-2009, 01:58 PM
 
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My beautiful husband is 300+ and we've been eating TF for almost a year. He has been losing weight gradually and steadily (he's ready to get a tattoo of his heaviest weight on his arm as a reminder he will never go back there).

So yea, what pp said, its about the carbs...once you cut down on the carbs and such, the weight will follow.

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#4 of 31 Old 09-29-2009, 02:31 PM
 
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For some folks, problematic foods seem to cause inflammation and weight gain. I lost 40 lbs effortlessly when I went gluten and dairy free. I ate til I was full and wasn't low carb, I did some of the cheat GF substitutes, and I was definitely high fat and not exercising. Those foods were just plain problematic for me. Other folks would have different combinations of what they need, of what's going on with their bodies, but that's part of it for some of us.
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#5 of 31 Old 09-29-2009, 02:34 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Awesome, Brown Lioness! Thanks for the replies. So, too many carbs are not good.
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#6 of 31 Old 09-29-2009, 03:38 PM
 
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I lost 40 lbs effortlessly when I went gluten and dairy free. I ate til I was full and wasn't low carb, I did some of the cheat GF substitutes, and I was definitely high fat and not exercising.
This happened w/ me--I lost 50 lbs (quickly) cutting out gluten, dairy, soy, and corn (and eggs, but I don't think they were part of it. I eat them again now and that has made no difference in my weight.) A major cause of my weight loss IMO was going from eating highly (factory) processed foods (things w/ HFCS, etc.) to cooking from scratch w/ whole foods, and then making the switch towards a TF lifestyle. I was also a carb/grain-heavy vegetarian and started eating all sorts of meat after switching to TF, and I think that has played a role as well.

I now find that if I eat too many (non-gluten) grains--in a manner out of balance w/ the rest of what I eat--I will start to feel bloated. (I try to eat 1 part grain or fruit or starchy veggie to 1 part animal protein to 1 part green or non-starchy veggie at each meal, with lots of good fats and fermented foods added in--this 'balance' feels best to *me*.) If I start feeling like my pants are a little tighter, I go grain free for a few days and I immediately fit back into my pants and feel much better. (I'm actually grain free right now, and really thinking of sticking w/ it b/c of how good it makes *me* feel.)

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Originally Posted by sunshinestar
But it got me thinking, should someone who is so overweight (the heaviest person is over 400lbs) be eating butter and cream?
I don't know that eating dairy is good for some folks (doesn't seem to be good for me, my dh, or my ds, although raw milk is something I do fantasize about ), and maybe it's not great for folks who are very overweight either. (I really don't know though...I'm sure it depends on each individual person and what they are/are not sensitive to.) But eating a diet free of most processed foods and the foods my son (and probably me) is intolerant of, *with lots of good fats added*, caused me to lose lots of weight fast.

I do lots of fat (in the form of coconut oil and milk, ghee, nuts and seeds, eggs, etc.) and really believe that the LACK of (what TF circles consider) GOOD fats is a MAJOR reason for obesity (and a major reason many of us seem to overeat carbs--to help us feel full. I think b/c they are so satisfying, it is difficult to overeat (good) fats.)

And I DON'T work out, struggled w/ being overweight all of my life and am now thinner than I've EVER been (thinner than I ever thought I could be--in a healthy way), never think about weight, and I really eat all day long (and have a serious food/cooking passion/borderline obsession.) I do yoga when I can (sometimes just 1x a week for 15 minutes), because it feels sooo good, but don't think that has much to do w/ weight loss/management for me.

Lauren, wife to my dear and mama to amazing River
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#7 of 31 Old 09-29-2009, 11:21 PM
 
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I agree with all that has been said. As an Exercise physiologist and former trainer (not working right now... having babies instead I do exercise myself and I recommend a trad foods diet to all my clients and I have worked with some pretty significantly obese individuals. Looking at their food logs it is always the same things. Overly processed and overly full of sugar. Most are sugar addicts I've found (potatoes not prozac is a really interesting book on sugar sensitivity).

I cringe a little bit when I watch that show... some of it is good, but have you noticed that specific places pay them to talk up their product.... subway and cheerios, etc. But oh what I wouldn't give for that much time/influence with a client to really change their lifestyle.
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#8 of 31 Old 09-29-2009, 11:33 PM
 
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I agree that processed foods it one of the big things that contributes to being overweight. Certainly allergies and all sorts of other things contribute as well, and it varies per person, I'm sure. But processed food is definitely a contributing factor for some.

I lost the first part of 30+ (not sure how many. I think closer to 50, but I don't know. I didn't measure at my heaviest nor have I weighed myself in months) pretty quickly when I stopped eating processed food. when I started eating TF (mostly started with lots of fat), my weight continued to fall until it was what I feel like might be a tad low, but I think thats mostly because I'm used to being heavier and fattier. I think its a pretty healthy weight. Like FairyRae, I eat all day. In fact, I may slightly overeat, but my weight stays low. I also don't "exercise" at all. I hate the term. I don't mind active things like dance or krav maga (or even running, just don't call it exercise lol) though I'm not doing much other than pavement pounding in job hunting and standing all day in my part time job.

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#9 of 31 Old 09-30-2009, 12:34 AM
 
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My dh would LOVE to be a "trainer" on that show. He would place the TF diet HIGH on the list and working out low on the list and he thinks there would be some very significant weight loss, even w/o all that working out.

I once saw a show about a parent/child fat camp and their emphasis was LOW FAT everything. Don't worry about calories, just look at how much fat is in stuff and don't buy it if its above like 3 grams or something! So awful!! (As you can imagine they didn't seem to loose a lot of weight by the end of the show).

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#10 of 31 Old 09-30-2009, 12:53 AM
 
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My dh has lost 70 lbs over two years of tf high fat low carb eating. We eat meat, butter, dairy, olive oil, CO, fruits and veggies. A minimum of grains now grain free.

I've lost weight with very little effort when high (healthy) fats and protein, low (now no) carb.

I wonder how the stats for weight loss sustainability would change if people who were obese ate TF... maybe people would actually be able to keep the weight off if they didn't lose all the weight and then keep eating low/no fat everything... and fall into their old ways and gain it all back.

I am not crunchy enough for this forum. Everyday I get a little crunchier though! :
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#11 of 31 Old 09-30-2009, 03:53 AM - Thread Starter
 
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Fascinating! I really wish more people knew about TF. It would save a lot of people a lot of work!
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#12 of 31 Old 09-30-2009, 10:11 AM
 
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Carbs. Look at all the books/research supporting TF and it is carbs, most especially refined carbs of course. Soda, bread, cookies, crackers, pasta, dairy (sorry, I lean hard on the Paleo side of things), sugar, ugh. Yes, I think someone trying to lose weight should definitely be eating fat. It is what signals satiety.
And I do not "work out". I work hard.
Yeap. The overabundance of carbs, and also the easily accesibleness of carbs is a big one. Another thing that's a big one, which isn't mentioned as much in some TF literature is movement. If you look at the amount of movement/work people used to do (just in food preparation alone) you see plenty of things that people mimic in exercising: squatting to pick food out of a garden, hauling something heavy from garden to kitchen, etc. These days food preparation generally (I know this isn't true for everyone, but just in general, especially in America) requires a job that means mostly sitting at a desk all day and then driving to the store to run in and get something processed and run out. People just don't move all that much anymore. Add that to the easily accessible carbs (which are very easy to overeat as they don't really make one feel full) AND the processed foods that add tons of extra carbs into stuff (did you ever realize how much sweetener was in spaghetti sauce until you made your own?) and you have a recipe for obesity. I should know, even though I'm losing weight I'm still in the obese category. Also all the "weight loss foods" that are low-fat are usually really high in sugars of various sorts to make up for the fat difference.

For me I do work out, because I'm one of those desk monkeys. I think in this day and age, some of us folks do just have to set aside a specific time to move, so I do. Goddess knows I have "special" time set aside to sit all day, I have to balance that out.

But yes, when I'm following the eating more fat and less carbs (esp processed carbs) principles, I feel worlds better and I lose weight. When I've been lazy and haven't gotten my stuff together, guess what? I either stay the same or gain some weight.

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#13 of 31 Old 09-30-2009, 01:43 PM - Thread Starter
 
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This is making me really sad about the people on the show. But I'm glad that we know better!
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#14 of 31 Old 10-01-2009, 12:24 AM
 
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I've lost 100 pounds eating TF and so far am keeping it off. I'm not hungry. I love butter and cream! I love the skin on the chicken! I love cheese and nuts!

I dieted as they are doing on BL and lost weight, but gained it back. I've also starved myself, taken Hydroxycut and similar things, and of course gained the weight back. I can honestly say that I don't think I will this time. This isn't a "diet", it's a way of life. I've never been this thin since I was a young kid.

I do exercise. I did cardio and strength training as I lost the weight, and in June moved to only yoga. I have been doing both Hatha and Kundalini styles, but now only Kundalini for awhile. I am beginning to feel like the many other forms of "exercise" are unnatural and break the body down instead of building it up. So...

I'm TF and yoga all the way!!!

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#15 of 31 Old 10-01-2009, 01:28 AM
 
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I'm TF and yoga all the way!!!
I yoga!

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#16 of 31 Old 10-01-2009, 02:37 PM
 
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My dh has lost 70 lbs over two years of tf high fat low carb eating. We eat meat, butter, dairy, olive oil, CO, fruits and veggies. A minimum of grains now grain free.

I've lost weight with very little effort when high (healthy) fats and protein, low (now no) carb.

I wonder how the stats for weight loss sustainability would change if people who were obese ate TF... maybe people would actually be able to keep the weight off if they didn't lose all the weight and then keep eating low/no fat everything... and fall into their old ways and gain it all back.
I think that's great! I hope that when I am done bf'ing I can go back to this way of eating (I can't seem to make it work right now).

I just wanted to say that if you are eating fruits and veggies, your diet is NOT no carb. Those things contain carbs, good carbs. I know *we* know that, I just don't want someone who is browsing this thread to be mistaken.

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#17 of 31 Old 10-01-2009, 09:37 PM
 
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Everyone's replies have been really great. I wanted to add something that goes a little deeper. What happens when the body takes in too much processed food (especially processed grains - bread, etc) is that it is absorbed very quickly into our blood and our blood sugar shoots through the roof (our body/brain think we're drowning in blood sugar). Insulin is our hormone which is released to get the sugar out of the blood.

When we do this to our bodies over and over, pretty soon we become resistant to our own insulin. A majority of people who are overweight are so because they have become insulin resistant. But, when we cut out the processed stuff and start eating whole foods and good fats, the insulin insensitivity is actually reversed, and we start losing that weight!

My favorite book that discusses this is called Healthy For Life by Dr Ray Strand. He does want people to get more of what he calls the "good fats" and this is where I differ with him. He believes the good fats are unsaturated and says we only need minimal saturated. I believe saturated and unsaturated are good for us and we only need to limit processed and trans fats, but other than that, I think the book is really excellent and worth the read.

Now, exercise DOES play a role, but it's not simply trying to burn more calories than we eat. The act of exercising (or being active) actually also makes us more sensitive to our insulin, thus helping to reverse that insulin insensitivity. It doesn't have to be hours upon hours of sweat-it-out gym time. As little as 30 mins walking, 5x a week will start to help.

So yes, I think The Biggest Loser has it a bit backwards. They DO see results, but I think they are doing it the hard way ;-)

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#18 of 31 Old 10-09-2009, 07:46 AM - Thread Starter
 
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Well, I've got to say that it's really frustrating watching this show now (just watched half of the latest episode), knowing what I know. Especially since half of the show is about nutrition. These poor people are eating skinless this and fat-free that and I just feel bad for them!!
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#19 of 31 Old 10-09-2009, 09:15 AM
 
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How awesome would it be if someone did a TF weight loss reality show? Get the word out about REAL food & the truth about fat?!

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#20 of 31 Old 10-09-2009, 01:52 PM
 
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Haven't watched TBL, but I don't like the idea at all. It is not a sustainable way of eating or exercising, and I believe most contestants gain back the weight quickly.

My dh had some weight to loose-not a huge amount, but he has a very thin frame and had gained a gut over the years. He tried low-fat, vegan, just cutting back and exercising a lot, and nothing worked until he cut out all grains and sugar. I don't need to lose weight, but I eat this way too, and the bloating and blood sugar swings are gone. We eat meat, eggs, lots of fat (coconut oil, butter, olive oil, bacon fat (yum!) )nuts, mostly leafy green veggies, limited fruit, occasional dairy. He has lost weight steadily and easily. The gut is nearly gone.

For exercise, we do a high-intensity strength training workout once a week, sometimes every 2 weeks, that takes about 10 minutes (see "Body by Science), and otherwise stay active with walking, biking, gardening, etc. We don't do "cardio" machines or running. The idea is that building lean muscle mass raises metabolism and makes us stronger, and bone and muscle strength are crucial to longevity and optimum health. We believe (based on lots of research) that maintaining a healthy weight is 80% diet and 20% exercise. I don't believe that those hours-long cardio workouts that these poor people are subjected to are ultimately good for us. On TBL, the idea is to create a calorie deficit that is not ultimately good for the body, nor sustainable.

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#21 of 31 Old 10-10-2009, 01:39 PM
 
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Lemme know if this is too off topic for this thread, but I was wondering about the people who eat soooo poorly, yet are thin. I have two friends who are both sooo into fast food 2x a day and ALL packaged food and that is literally all they eat, yet they are quite thin and even fit (w/o much or any exercise). I also must say that they are 20 years old, so don't know if that plays a part. But, just wondering how that fits into the whole eating well with exercising to lose weight thing.
(this may bother me a little because I eat totally TF and am pregnant, and she eats totally fast food/walmart food and is also pregnant, yet people comment on how lean she is staying and how she will drop the weight so quickly, but how my hips and butt have definitely gotten bigger and how I definitely won't be wearing my prepreg clothes for a while, but she will go home in them )
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#22 of 31 Old 10-10-2009, 01:45 PM
 
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Lemme know if this is too off topic for this thread, but I was wondering about the people who eat soooo poorly, yet are thin. I have two friends who are both sooo into fast food 2x a day and ALL packaged food and that is literally all they eat, yet they are quite thin and even fit (w/o much or any exercise). I also must say that they are 20 years old, so don't know if that plays a part. But, just wondering how that fits into the whole eating well with exercising to lose weight thing.
This might not be the answer you're looking for, but here goes:

Just because these people are thin despite eating a crappy diet, doesn't mean they're healthy. The fact that they're both 20 years old also means that they could very well end up with thyroid and/or adrenal dysfunction or diabetes, among other things & then they might pack on the weight. IME, it often takes a while to hit, usually in the childbearing years because the stress on the body of carrying a baby often results in health decline if proper nourishment isn't there.

I'm one of those people who's never weighed over 125 in my non-pregnant life, no matter how much or what I ate (pre or post TF.) Clearly, I wasn't healthy because after my third child, my adrenals just up and waved the white flag.

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#23 of 31 Old 10-10-2009, 03:07 PM
 
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Yeah, that is true. They aren't the picture of health. She has had a lot of urinary tract infections and the like through her pregnancy. But it is just frustrating because they see shows like TBL and they see that health means thinness and not necessarily healthfulness (if that makes sense) and so it is hard to convince them that their other health concerns could actuually be food related. They are thin and that's all food helps with, so food must not be the problem. And for me to be "bigger" (I am not overweight that I know of... I am in my third trimester of pregnancy and 160 lbs. at 5'6") and eat TF, they see that my diet makes me "fatter"... I dunno, I guess I am just rambling here... sorry everyone!
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#24 of 31 Old 10-10-2009, 04:19 PM
 
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I totally hear you! I ate Tf while pregnant and gained 60 lbs, while my other friends ate fast food and gained much less. Although I think the 60 lbs may have had to do with my adrenals being shot and getting super sick the first four months of pregnancy and then my body reacting by packing on as much weight as it could to make up for it.
But that's just another reason to take care of yourself NOW, before you shoot your adrenals. You look good and it feels good while you're doing it ( using up your adrenals) but its sure sucks when it catches up to you!
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#25 of 31 Old 10-10-2009, 10:46 PM
 
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We believe (based on lots of research) that maintaining a healthy weight is 80% diet and 20% exercise. I don't believe that those hours-long cardio workouts that these poor people are subjected to are ultimately good for us. On TBL, the idea is to create a calorie deficit that is not ultimately good for the body, nor sustainable.
Amen! If we think of naturally thin people, how many of them spend hours in the gym if any at all? Now, think about how naturally active they are? They IME seem to be the ones with all the energy. TF has changed my life in this way. I feel blessed to have found this way of life. Though we aren't perfect do to various reasons with the TF eating, the changes we have been able to make are tremendously affecting my health. As far as exercise, for me yoga is more a spiritual practice than an exercise class, but it comes very natural to me and I will be able to maintain that.

Appalachian mountain woman, radical homemaker, homeschooler, childbirth educator, and doula loving her DH and three powerful little femmes. Deladis 8-4-05, Ivy 4-28-08, and Gweneth 7-21-12 HBA2C! hbac.gif  -  blogging.jpg ribboncesarean.gif

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#26 of 31 Old 10-10-2009, 10:54 PM
 
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I totally hear you! I ate Tf while pregnant and gained 60 lbs, while my other friends ate fast food and gained much less. Although I think the 60 lbs may have had to do with my adrenals being shot and getting super sick the first four months of pregnancy and then my body reacting by packing on as much weight as it could to make up for it.
But that's just another reason to take care of yourself NOW, before you shoot your adrenals. You look good and it feels good while you're doing it ( using up your adrenals) but its sure sucks when it catches up to you!
OT- But I completely loathe this idea that somehow gaining less weight OR more weight automatically means a healthy pregnancy. The weight gain is just a number- what is more important is the quality of food you take in! I had a friend who only gained like 20 and seemed to assume that all those that gain more must be less healthy than her- despite her less than stellar diet. Thin does not equal healthy- said by a person that is usually a loose size 4 when not pregnant. There are many markers of health and how I feel inside and out, mental and physical is all a part of that.

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#27 of 31 Old 10-11-2009, 09:20 AM
 
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Amen! If we think of naturally thin people, how many of them spend hours in the gym if any at all? Now, think about how naturally active they are? They IME seem to be the ones with all the energy. TF has changed my life in this way. I feel blessed to have found this way of life. Though we aren't perfect do to various reasons with the TF eating, the changes we have been able to make are tremendously affecting my health. As far as exercise, for me yoga is more a spiritual practice than an exercise class, but it comes very natural to me and I will be able to maintain that.
Not me. I was very low on energy due to adrenal fatigue but have always been super slim. My energy level directly correlates to my adrenal function - some days are better than others. I never exercised a day in my life until recently when I joined the Y - late this past Spring. I've found that I have more energy on the days that I work out in the mornings. There are of course other things that result in more energy for me, like staying off of caffeine, plenty of rest & avoidance of stress - because all of these things take a huge toll on the adrenals.

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#28 of 31 Old 10-11-2009, 09:21 AM
 
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Oh, and I FINALLY managed to keep some weight on only after getting gluten out of my diet. I think that my body wasn't able to absorb nutrients because of the damage that the gluten was causing. I imagine this could work in the opposite way as well.

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#29 of 31 Old 10-11-2009, 09:48 PM
 
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Originally Posted by stilllearning85 View Post
Lemme know if this is too off topic for this thread, but I was wondering about the people who eat soooo poorly, yet are thin. I have two friends who are both sooo into fast food 2x a day and ALL packaged food and that is literally all they eat, yet they are quite thin and even fit (w/o much or any exercise). I also must say that they are 20 years old, so don't know if that plays a part. But, just wondering how that fits into the whole eating well with exercising to lose weight thing.
(this may bother me a little because I eat totally TF and am pregnant, and she eats totally fast food/walmart food and is also pregnant, yet people comment on how lean she is staying and how she will drop the weight so quickly, but how my hips and butt have definitely gotten bigger and how I definitely won't be wearing my prepreg clothes for a while, but she will go home in them )
You may find that you have a much easier labor and birth, having eaten better all this time. Also, you may be more successful at breastfeeding. Certainly I would expect your baby will be healthier in the long run.
The most important thing we can do is assure our children good health!

: mama to 4 boys
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#30 of 31 Old 10-11-2009, 09:58 PM
 
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www.breadandmoney.com - Richard Morris, the owner, wrote a book called A Life Unburdened, which is about his weight loss on TF. Fallon's Thumbs Up review of it is here: http://www.westonaprice.org/bookrevi...nburdened.html

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