Please comment on Susun Weed letter titled "Candida is a helper. It is keeping you healthy!" - Page 9 - Mothering Forums

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#241 of 319 Old 10-11-2008, 04:45 PM - Thread Starter
 
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I recently saw a dowser in desperation to get this yeast in balance. Oh and what we found...
We dowsed what would be benificial for me and detrimental for this yeast battle. I eat a whole food diet, and have been trying to follow Susun Weeds advice with not much sucess. I found from the dowser that for me personally, foodsI eat were feeding the yeast, such as:
potatoes
vinegars (even raw apple cider vinegar)
egg whites (not the yolks)
lentils
kidney beans
sprouted grain bread (sourdough was fine)
raw tomatoes
all winter squash (except spaghetti squash)
soft cheeses
unfermented soy
pasturized dairy (even in cultrured form. It must be raw and only cultured)
honey
sugar
maple syrup (I can only have blackstrap mollases)
corn
oranges
bananas
raw garlic (cooked was fine)...

The list goes on. Crazy thing is I eat lots of these things. We tested the good foods, so I still can eat . I was told that my body would prefer o be healed without supplements, drugs, and must be healed through diet change. It has been almost a week since I have cut these foods out of my diet, and what do you know, I feel really good! I was secretly hoping that I wouldn't get better so I could eat some of those "bad" foods. I can't remember the last time I felt this good down there.
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#242 of 319 Old 10-12-2008, 12:19 AM
 
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Originally Posted by firefaery View Post
there are tests you can do for parasites that will detect not only current infestations, but any infestations you've ever had via antibodies.
Really? Do you have a link or other information about them? We are ready to just test for everything over here...

Also, for everyone who has had good experiences with Threelac: what do you think about reviews like this one?

Nessa, DD1 (5) DD2 (3) & expecting again in late February/early March!
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#243 of 319 Old 10-12-2008, 04:08 AM
 
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Menomena, I've already eaten that review alive, probably on this thread. But a mini version would be:
Quote:
Because these bacteria are also lactic acid producing they raise the ph of the intestine. Ph is very important because good bacteria prefer an environment that is more alkaline and the oxygen it produces
to raise the ph of something, you make it more alkaline, not more acid. And good bacteria prefer an acid environ, not an alkaline one.

I posted a good amount of info on the bacteria strain they refer to that is in Threelac, including the fact that it is found in infant GI tracts.

It is sold by multilevel marketing, I believe. Or by "distributors", and there are many with issues about that. Anticandidiasis is a big market also, and each company is slaughtering the other out there so it's hard to find good info about anything.

I'm more aghast at dirt eating, personally, which is a new fad (or an old fad gone nuts). The amount of PARASITES in our soil compared to bacteria these days is way too high to be safe. All you'd do is end up with worms and flukes with nary any bacterial benefit. One of the problems with our modern food is that our soil is deplete of good bacterial strains which are necessary for certain chemical processes, rendering our food lacking. Getting so crude isn't the answer. There are better ways.

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#244 of 319 Old 10-12-2008, 07:53 AM
 
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I guess the part about Threelac that worries me is the enterococcus faecalis.

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The New England Journal of Medicine has this to say about enterococcus faecalis. "Although Enterococcus faecalis was once regarded as nonpathogenic, this opportunistic gram-positive coccus now ranks among the most troublesome hospital pathogens. It has intrinsic resistance to many antibiotics and a remarkable capacity for developing resistance to others (x17,160)." There is a picture at the above link if you care to see it.

The Doctors Guide confirms they have linked this bacteria to mortality due to enterococcal bacteremia and is the third largest cause of hospital infections. It also causes urinary tract, abdominal, pelvic, and neonatal infections.

On the positive side if you want to call it that. The Channing Laboratory, Brigham and Women's Hospital, Harvard Medical School, Boston, MA, USA say that; "Enterococcus faecalis is part of the normal gastrointestinal flora in humans".

And according to Division of Infectious Diseases, Dept. of Medicine, University Hospital Freiburg, Hugstetter Str. 55, 79106 Freiburg, Germany. "This species does not cause infections in otherwise healthy persons. Well guess what folks? If your suffering from chronic yeast your not a healthy person".

So, the University Children's Hospital, University Hospital Schleswig-Holstein, Campus Kiel, Germany says; "Enterococcican cause serious and sometimes life-threatening systemic infections, especially in immunocompromised patients".
I guess it's like e. coli in that way, right? but i don't know if i'm going to willingly flood my wonky, yeasty gut with e. coli either. Just because it's found in a healthy gut - in balance with yeast and other bacteria - doesn't mean we should introduce it in large quantities to our gut... Is it the fact that it's found with the other two bacteria in Threelac that hack back that yeasties and then replace them with a better balance of bacteria?

I'm not being difficult, I'm honestly asking... I would love to be able to take something like Threelac with confidence (and give it to my 3.5yr old and my 16m old). We have lingering yeasty issues, even after doing BED for a few weeks (couldn't stick to it with nursing two small children). Our summer chock full of fruits and sugar hasn't helped, I'm sure.

Nessa, DD1 (5) DD2 (3) & expecting again in late February/early March!
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#245 of 319 Old 10-12-2008, 09:57 AM
 
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Originally Posted by menomena View Post
Really? Do you have a link or other information about them? We are ready to just test for everything over here...

Also, for everyone who has had good experiences with Threelac: what do you think about reviews like this one?
You would want a stool test for parasites that looks for antibodies *and* antigens. 'Round here it's on a standard panel, the doc just needs to check it. Let me know if you need more info.
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#246 of 319 Old 10-12-2008, 06:35 PM
 
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Originally Posted by menomena View Post
I guess the part about Threelac that worries me is the enterococcus faecalis.



I guess it's like e. coli in that way, right? but i don't know if i'm going to willingly flood my wonky, yeasty gut with e. coli either. Just because it's found in a healthy gut - in balance with yeast and other bacteria - doesn't mean we should introduce it in large quantities to our gut... Is it the fact that it's found with the other two bacteria in Threelac that hack back that yeasties and then replace them with a better balance of bacteria?

I'm not being difficult, I'm honestly asking... I would love to be able to take something like Threelac with confidence (and give it to my 3.5yr old and my 16m old). We have lingering yeasty issues, even after doing BED for a few weeks (couldn't stick to it with nursing two small children). Our summer chock full of fruits and sugar hasn't helped, I'm sure.
When I said:
Quote:
I posted a good amount of info on the bacteria strain they refer to that is in Threelac, including the fact that it is found in infant GI tracts.
that's what I was referring to: E. Faecalis.

The bacteria you eat on a daily basis, and breathe, would make your skin crawl and your toes curl. You eat strep for breakfast and staph for lunch and wash it all down with an E Coli dinner with a Candida breeze blowing by. And if you like fermented goods, well, it's amazing you're not dead yet.

MANY microorganisms have the potential to cause harm that are already in you. Candida is the prime example of that. The acidity of the stomach is meant to kill most of these guys, hence why low stomach acid is such an overlooked cause of infection. Then if it gets by that acid wash, all the other factors are meant to keep it in check, whatever bug it may be.

Quote:
Enterococcus faecalis is a Gram-positive , facultatively anaerobic, cocci which occurs singly, in pairs or short chains. It is a normal inhabitant of the intestinal tract and female genital tract... This bacterium lives peacefully in the human gut, but it also thrives on wounds and burns. Researchers have identified a group of genes that may contribute to the bacterium's transformation from being harmless in the gut to a menacing invader....Enterococcus faecalis is extremely hardy and can survive for weeks on environmental surfaces; cheese - 180 days; soil up to 77 days; soiled linen up to 90 days, cultures at -70 C for several years.
http://www.ebi.ac.uk/2can/genomes/ba..._faecalis.html

It is meant to be in the gut, which is where you put it when you eat it, whether that be on some cheese, in Threelac or whatever. That's not the problem. The problem is the SAME problem as Candida - opportunistic infection. This is not limited to this bacteria, nor yeast. It can happen to any number, if not all the microorganisms in our gut. Going into other places, such as the urinary tract, throat, or whatnot, is not where any of these guys are meant to be, and that's when the trouble starts.

The issue they've made of it to bag out Threelac is that it is antibiotic resistant to a large extent, causing problems in hospitals when they try to eradicate it. But this isn't due to the intentional ingestion of it, it is due to it already being there, which you cannot prevent anyway.

If it freaks you out, try nystatin instead or oil of oregano (rub on the feet of babies), or herbal stuff and just use run of the mill lacto and bifidus probiotics to fill the spaces left behind when the yeast die.

Hunger is political.  Wherever there is widespread hunger, it is because people with guns are preventing other people from bringing in food.  
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#247 of 319 Old 10-12-2008, 08:28 PM
 
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I suggest Lactobacillus Rhamnosus GG. It is the bacteria responsible for the mending of the gut specific to eczema. Here in Australia it is even sold as a probiotic called "Eczema Shield" and only contains that one bacteria. Best taken while pregnant and lactating, as it causes the breast milk to be rich in anti-inflammatory factors amongst other things. It has also shown less of a great response the older the child gets.

Be sure to get THAT strain (GG or LGG). If you research it, you will be mighty impressed with it and rush out and get some, guaranteed. It's a great little guy. It's even showing candida killing properties and it's a human strain, to boot. I have heard it isn't as easy to get in the U.S, but maybe it is becoming more so.

They have shown that 20 billion units in pregnant/nursing mothers and half that for infants is the required therapeutic dose - which is quite high. So not only do you have to find the right strain, it must be a high dose product. It is one you must take indefinitely as although it sticks to the wall of the gut, it doesn't stay. Back in the day of fermented goods and soils that were replete in bacteria, this wouldn't be an issue, but these days, we have to supplement.

Hunger is political.  Wherever there is widespread hunger, it is because people with guns are preventing other people from bringing in food.  
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#248 of 319 Old 10-12-2008, 09:07 PM
 
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Janine, Thanks so much for taking the time to answer. What you say makes sense. I just get scared when I hear abx-resistant, ya know?

We did the spit test this morning, my 3.5yr old & I. Hers was beautiful, dissolving completely into the cup. Mine was grody, however. Spindly legs; sediment; you name it. Now, she has definite food allergies with skin, gut & behavior components. We're on an extended ED, etc. She has for sure yeast spots that come & go behind her ears and in her privates. Why would her mouth come up clear then? Me, on the other hand, I don't doubt have remaining yeast issues.

Thanks for the probiotic recommendation. She does have persistent eczema and I would love to get an "eczema-specific" probiotic.

Nessa, DD1 (5) DD2 (3) & expecting again in late February/early March!
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#249 of 319 Old 10-19-2008, 02:46 PM
 
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Finally found an interesting passage this thread made me think of... as to the possible benefits of yeast in the body. From Dr. Tom Cowan's The Fourfold Path to Healing, chapter on Diabetes talking of a patient with diabetes and hypothyroidism:

Quote:
Her blood sugar still runs high and when it goes higher she tends to get yeast infections. We let these run their course because the yeast seems to "biodegrade" the sugar and after every course of yeast "infection" her blood sugar declines to normal.
Not that high blood sugar, and consequently yeast, is desirable but its interesting to me how complex these issues are and how the body attempts to deal with a high carb diet.
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#250 of 319 Old 10-19-2008, 02:57 PM
 
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Originally Posted by Calm View Post
Be sure to get THAT strain (GG or LGG). If you research it, you will be mighty impressed with it and rush out and get some, guaranteed. It's a great little guy. It's even showing candida killing properties and it's a human strain, to boot. I have heard it isn't as easy to get in the U.S, but maybe it is becoming more so.

They have shown that 20 billion units in pregnant/nursing mothers and half that for infants is the required therapeutic dose - which is quite high. So not only do you have to find the right strain, it must be a high dose product. It is one you must take indefinitely as although it sticks to the wall of the gut, it doesn't stay.
It's www.culturelle.com here in the U.S. which is very easy to get in most drugstores.

It's 10 billion/capsule. The regular version is the same as the kids version, the latter is just more expensive with a diferent package so don't fall for buying the kids. It is availabe with and without FOS. Usually I have seen the FOS free version in drugstores and the one with FOS in health food stores and online. It does have trace amounts of dairy as it is grown on whey if that is a concern.

I'm surprised at that advertising claim. My impression that the eczema studies on children were not that conclusive? I thought it only showed some benefit (eczema prevented in half) when taken by pg women before and infants after birth? My concern is that it is lactobacillus only. I wonder whether the reason for the limited benefits shown in babies are because bifidobacteria is what is supposed to be the dominant gut flora in healthy infants?

Studies are on PubMed or maybe at the Culturelle website if anyone has time or inclination to dig.

The L. Reuteri strain also has positive eczema studies (and regow intestinal villi in animals) as well if I can recall.

There are some studies being done on atopy and bifidobacteria supplements from birth but I think they are several years away from being published.
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#251 of 319 Old 10-19-2008, 10:12 PM
 
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Finally found an interesting passage this thread made me think of... as to the possible benefits of yeast in the body. From Dr. Tom Cowan's The Fourfold Path to Healing, chapter on Diabetes talking of a patient with diabetes and hypothyroidism:



Not that high blood sugar, and consequently yeast, is desirable but its interesting to me how complex these issues are and how the body attempts to deal with a high carb diet.
Dr Doug Graham says something similar. He feels that the yeast flares in an attempt to deal with blood sugar issues. He's had great success actually by having people NOT eat fat with sugar. The fat prevents the sugar from going directly into the cell and so hangs out in the bloodstream where yeast then basically freaks out trying to go to task to eliminate it. If you eat a ton of fruit with no fat that will not be the case. I dunno if you were around when I tested his theory, but he's 100% right. I just couldn't afford to eat as much as he wants you to! Plus, I don't think it's sustainable, but it did prove a point.
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#252 of 319 Old 10-25-2008, 01:55 PM
 
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No, I didn't see this earlier discussion, where is it?

I'm confused, wouldn't eating a lot of fruit raise blood sugar quickly? But you are saying eating fruit alone raises blood sugar but then it quickly leaves the bloodstream? But if there is fat it somehow stays longer by raising the fat level of the blood?
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#253 of 319 Old 10-25-2008, 02:15 PM
 
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No, I didn't see this earlier discussion, where is it?

I'm confused, wouldn't eating a lot of fruit raise blood sugar quickly? But you are saying eating fruit alone raises blood sugar but then it quickly leaves the bloodstream? But if there is fat it somehow stays longer by raising the fat level of the blood?
I am curious about this as well. I have a major yeast overgrowth and also a big issue w/ my blood sugar staying regulated. I am trying to do the yeast diet , but even w/ min carbs I am having a hard time regulating things w/o trying to balance my meals. If there is some info on this is I am interested.

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#254 of 319 Old 10-26-2008, 01:03 AM
 
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I wonder if this is why at a recent food seminar I went to they said to eat fruit alone and not with other food. Hmmm
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#255 of 319 Old 10-26-2008, 04:01 PM
 
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IF you google Doug Graham you'll get a ton of info. Yes, eating fruit with fat slows the release into the cells (prolonging the time it's in the bloodstream) and allows yeast to have more to feed on. Without fat there will be a rapid uptake into the cells and you will not experience discomfort. I did it for a few weeks (again, I don't think the diet the way he advocates it is sustainable-but I think short-term it can allow a pretty impressive shift) and was shocked as I am rather prone to blood sugar issues. I had great results. I absolutely cannot afford to do it any longer and as I said, there are things that I feel are missing if you were to follow it long term. He does design diets for professional and Olympic levels athletes and they have great results under intense physical pressure. I'm not sure how-but they do.
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#256 of 319 Old 10-27-2008, 08:40 AM
 
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Yes, eating fruit with fat slows the release into the cells (prolonging the time it's in the bloodstream) and allows yeast to have more to feed on. Without fat there will be a rapid uptake into the cells and you will not experience discomfort.
Do you eat fat at a different time from eating fruit, or is it an overall low-fat, high-fruit diet?

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It is availabe with and without FOS.
What is FOS?

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#257 of 319 Old 10-27-2008, 11:34 AM
 
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IN general it's a lowfat diet. You can eat some fat (avocados, seeds, olives, etc.) but he feels that our natural diets should be low in fat. So it's a lowfat vegan diet that is fruit based. Again, not sustainable in my mind, but it did create an interesting shift done short-term. His book is called 80/10/10 if you want to peruse it. Most every bookstore has it that I have seen. He does talk quite a bit about Candida IIRC which is what intrigued me. His info made sense on a few levels so I decided to check it out.
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#258 of 319 Old 04-04-2009, 11:39 AM
 
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Bumping.


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subbing.
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#260 of 319 Old 05-24-2009, 11:00 PM
 
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#261 of 319 Old 05-25-2009, 03:34 AM
 
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It's not about identifying ONE instance.

I still think this is missing the point. One round of antibiotics isn't enough to throw an entire system off kilter if it wasn't off to begin with. NOTHING EXISTS IN A VACUUM. It's not just about antibiotics at birth, vaccines following, birth control pills etc. etc. etc. It's just not. It's ALL the things that break down the system over time and where your vulnerabilities inherently lie. Many people have yeast, but some present in other ways. Even if you have yeast, it presents differently in each person do to their underlying constitution. All I'm saying is that it's a mistake in ANYTHING to just treat the symptoms. Everyone will react differently and everyone may require different treatment. If you have yeast and metals the treatment is far different than for simply yeast. If you have yeast and parasites, again...different treatment.

I just tend to look at the bigger picture.

I have actually advocated the use of Nystatin here and in other places before. I have also utilized ThreeLac, both personally and with my clients. I'm not needing a lecture on the behavior of yeast, all I'm saying is that it's a mistake to look only at the yeast. If you miss the bigger picture you could struggle your whole life. That's all.
Wow, I'm so glad this thread got bumped up...I didn't see it before! I have had digestive problems and weight loss for the past 6 months and just got diagnosed 2 months ago with blastocystis hominis parasite and intestinal yeast (the hospital lab test didn't say which kind). I have researched and researched and have tried a couple of things. I have consulted with a DO, naturopath and Dr Omar Amin of the Parasitology Center in Arizona.

I have been set on avoiding drugs to just treat the symptoms. I thought I was fit as a fiddle until this happened, but I should have realized something was off with my body as I have HORRIBLE teeth (between age 22-27 I had every molar composite filled, root canaled, crowned or extracted) even though I eat healthier than most people I know. So I am trying to focus on building up my system. Though I have stayed on veggie ferments I have avoided kombucha, sourdough bread and the like but think I am just going to have to try them again. Cheese I react to with diarreha 30 mins after eating or acid reflux...probably because casein is difficult for my compromised gut to digest. Yogurt gives me mild loose stools the next day and initially I thought it was a dairy sensitivity in general but I think it is just die-off and will slowly build that back up. I have a huge aversion to kefir (as good as I know it is) so I'll continue to avoid that.

What are your thoughts on the difference between treating just yeast vs yeast and parasites?

Happily married to DH for 6 years, in process to foster-adopt 3 children DD4, DS3 and DS2. We may be bringing half brother age 9 one day as well! We are not infertile, we just have decided that since there are precious children who need homes there is no need for us to have biological children.

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#262 of 319 Old 05-25-2009, 09:39 AM
 
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I have not read this thread in a while, but this caught my eye today:

Quote:
One round of antibiotics isn't enough to throw an entire system off kilter if it wasn't off to begin with...
I'm a naturopath, here's my page on fungus/yeast (ain't finished yet, but readable), just as the credentials I can muster right now. What you've written there is actually not true, at least not in my experience with many different people of all ages including newborn. One round of antibiotics, especially broad spectrum but certainly not limited to that, is quite certainly enough to throw the system out of whack, all alone, without any other thing at all in a healthy person or baby.

The reason is quite simple - if antibiotics were not effective enough to wipe out a whole colony, we would still die from bacterial infections. It's very job is to wipe out large numbers and whole species of bacteria. We take a whole course of abx to make sure we nail the whole lot of them, not just some, not just a select species but a whole swag of bacteria. Even if (and this has actually been proven many times) you live with the Hunzas or some other pure community or tribe once those bacteria are dead, the balance is thrown off allowing the pH to alter, the system to shift, the microorganisms to move around, and further bacteria to get sick. Which causes a catch 22 and takes an awesome effort and much time to correct.

Another issue is that certain species can be killed that create totally, seemingly unrelated problems. For instance, Oxalobacter formigenes (mentioned on my page) is a bacteria whose job it is to break down oxalate (oxalic acid) which is found in things like spinach. Without it, we cannot break this down and calcium oxalate builds up in the kidneys - kidney stones. Treatment with this bacteria starts breaking down oxalate again, although it doesn't help the kidneys very much by then. So, with just one dose of antibiotics you will get rid of not just a whole species of the bad guys but so many of these good guys who do little jobs like factory workers. One thing goes off and the whole system starts to malfunction from the head to the toes, and every organ is affected.

Antibiotics are man made, and that is their major problem. "Just one thing" in nature is usually not enough to throw a body out of whack, true. But just one man made chemical IS enough, if it is the right chem in the right dose. Antibiotics are largely fungal in nature. They are mycotoxins. Penicillin for example is a chemical released by fungus to fight bacteria and man harnessed this. However, they don't dose you in a natural amount, in the amount you find in nature or in the average human gut. The dose of mycotoxin delivered in an antibiotic is massive, and very unnatural.

These guys don't just start breeding again and hey, all is well. No matter how healthy you were (for example, if a person takes ABX accidentally, which has happened a lot, strangely, and become chronically ill - from ONE PILL. They don't even have to finish the course.)

However, I very much agree with when you said this:
Quote:
All I'm saying is that it's a mistake in ANYTHING to just treat the symptoms.
I get frustrated with both the allopathic doctor AND The naturopathic one as they so often fall on polar sides of this issue. The allopath will almost exclusively treat symptoms. The naturopath almost exclusively treats cause. Both of those approaches irritate the heck out of me. It isn't an either/or situation. The naturopath gets so caught up in cause they forget the suffering and how hard some of the treatments can be, and how long they can take. They then blame the client for non-compliance when they can't stick at some ridiculous diet for three months or longer.

We must consider quality of life! We must ease suffering and find treatments that don't impact a person's life too heavily. That's where my preferences come in. I believe you can do both: treat cause and symptoms. Sounds obvious but as mentioned, it really doesn't seem to be to either side of the healing coin.

By the same token, I've too often seen symptoms ease while treating cause, and vice versa although not as often. As a mother who cannot stand to see my children suffering, I go straight to the throat every time when treating them when they are sick. Not their throat of course , but the bug's throat. When they get sick, (and I do not give my children abx, EVER) I know that it is what you mentioned - an imbalance that was there waiting to happen. Maybe too much sugar gave the yeast a party, maybe a necessary bacteria moved somewhere it shouldn't be due to a food preservative... whatever it is, there is a cause. I can remove it, or whatever must be done but at the same time, I cut the legs right out from under the little bugstards with all out war. I force my children into fevers, I have potato wraps, garlic, oregano oil, tinctures, nystatin if necessary... I have it all going on but my kids are sick for hours, not days. But I also treat symptoms. Luckily, many natural treatments for cause actually have symptoms treatment built in. Ms Nature was very thorough and clever in that respect. But I'll use willow bark or whatever other symptom easer I have, and I will use creams for skin things, knowing it will do nothing for cause... I ease suffering basically. That's important, it's rule number one.

I offer this approach to others, and most take it. In fact, I can count on one hand the amount of people who have chosen to treat slowly when given the option to do it fast and nasty. Even though I explain that the healing crisis will be freaky horrible they still choose it. I think we secretly all know the body can rejuvenate fast and is limited only by our imaginations really.

Back to the issue at hand, I get what you are saying about root cause and not just treating symptoms. But I have to disagree that there is always a bigger cause than the abx itself. It is an atomic bomb on our body. It IS powerful enough to make that mess all on its own. Really. So sometimes, treating the cause is actually just treating the gut imbalance itself. Because the resulting pH imbalance, sugar cravings, metal dumping, cellular sluggishness and so on is actually a symptom of the gut imbalance in many cases, contrary to popular naturopathic wisdom. For most people however, you are correct. Because most of us these days have a measurable imbalance already going on in our bodies like a time bomb waiting to go off. When we take ABX we will not bounce back quite as readily as our healthful counterparts, we will struggle terribly, just as we will on the pill and while on steroids etc because of the underlying issues.

Hunger is political.  Wherever there is widespread hunger, it is because people with guns are preventing other people from bringing in food.  
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#263 of 319 Old 05-25-2009, 10:50 AM
 
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I'm not sure we are saying different things. We just have different perspectives. My children have never had antibiotics either, and I never allow suffering. I just treat a different way. I don't have the Descartes view of the body. I do my best to listen to what the body is saying and support it in it's reaction. HOW I support is different (slightly!) from what you do but regardless their "illnesses" (of which there are few) last a fraction of the time as anyone else's kids. I agree that most of what we see are symptoms and therefore I can offer comfort and palliate without suppression.

Never in a million years would I suggest that antibiotics are health-giving. However I tend to take a bigger picture approach here. One round, while it is enough to alter things still doesn't speak to the basic point of WHY they were necessary. That's all I'm saying. We need to look at the big picture and understand how much our bodies are struggling and support them on a journey to wellness. I think it's very easy to miss this point when we are chasing symptoms (not that Jeanine does that at all-I'm speaking generally.)

I see this all the time, not only in my practice but in those of friends and colleagues. I see them looking at conditions and naming them...chasing the invaders off and boosting immunity. Generally what I see is skewed systems that shouldn't be boosted! Then the sickness just gets worse since instead of bringing them back to Th1 function where they belong we strengthen the Th2 response. IgA levels plummet, IgG levels rise, yeast flourishes as a result and people spiral down the cascade of food allergies, blocked detox pathways, metal accumulation etc. Most of these things begin even before birth and that NEEDS to be acknowledged.

Yes, a child with a wonderful birth at home has a better chance-but they were still grown in almost all of our cases in damaged bodies. Let's say for a second that a child is born to a *relatively* healthy mother-she still generally has had vaccines, abx, medications in her life. But let's just pretend she has a fabulously strong constitution and has weathered it well. Then the baby is born with no intervention and has primary contact with mom(their inherent flora is altered by having contact with practitioners or even other people-babies are meant to be with MOM to colonize properly), no vaccines are administered, they are exclusively breastfed etc. Let's just say that this child experiences ideal circumstances, is happy, loved, well nourished and has one round of abx at some point. Is this enough to throw the system off kilter? Yes, it is. Is it enough to damage the system for life? I dont' believe it is. I believe that our bodies are constantly searching for balance and that healing is always it's goal. With a singular assault (which is almost impossible since all of us experienced two women's bodies before our own which DOES have an impact on our make up) assuming that everything else is in line the body will heal. Again, my perspective. The problem lies in the fact that NONE of us have one assault.

This is where I look to a deeper way of seeing things and why I see energy, structure and nutrition as inextricably linked in wellness. I don't believe that life should be a struggle and I don't believe that people should be on horribly restrictive diets, thousands of supplements or have to get treatments weekly. I believe that attention to the individual on all three levels will bring healing.

It also doesn't address the changes at the biochemical level that we can bring (both through energy and structural manipulation) to bring our systems back into balance. IT is quite possible to bring the body from a sympathetic response (which will allow yeast to flourish, imbalances to spiral out of control, digestive problems, adrenal issues etc.) back to the parasympathetic. Given that we have to recognize that's it's not all about nutrition and attacking imbalances. IF we can give the body the tools to function properly-it will. Nutrition, while it's the foundation for health is not the only player.

So again, I will submit that we are not saying different things. I think we may believe similar things and are discussing it on different levels. I dont' disagree with anything you said, though my path in guiding people and the one I took myself is slightly different. It also speaks to our different backgrounds. However, as I said before and will say again anyone would be lucky to have you as a practitioner. You are wonderfully committed and totally brilliant. I feel lucky to be able to converse with you!
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#264 of 319 Old 05-25-2009, 01:03 PM
 
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yes i've tried the aajonus custard with papaya but that gave my blood sugar a terrible crash, i got really shaky about 1hr later. it is a huge problem, i have raw egg smoothies, with berries, raw cream and butter but it is a bit difficult to get down sometimes! breakfast is a real problem for me and my dd who will only eat a certain gluten free pork sausage. sorry that i've gone off topic.
I want to second what someone else said about eating non-traditional foods at breakfast. I used to have a hard time with that until I lived in Japan. They have the most amazing traditional breakfasts. A typical breakfast would be salmon, with miso soup and some form of pickled vegetable (read fermented) and of course rice. But maybe you could work on something like that? Miso soup and fish? I don't know if that grosses you out in the morning. It used to for me but I didn't have much of a choice so eventually I grew to crave those super energy-supplying breakfasts. You can put anything in miso soup too. Daikon, onions, clams, fish, any veggie. If you get those little miso soup bowls and eat it with chopsticks it's pretty fun. And miso is so good for you.

Are you not on dairy? I can't remember if that was mentioned. I eat yogurt with ground flaxseeds, coral legend powder, nutritional yeast and banana every morning (and eggs).
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#265 of 319 Old 05-25-2009, 01:08 PM
 
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What Susun wrote really resonates with me.
I have been seeing a nutritionist for the past few months and she is not TF in any way. Every visit we focus on something. First it was food sensitivities, then it was candidia and other funguses. She uses bio feedback. after each session she prescribes about $200 worth of supplements to me. I also see the Chirpracter at the same institution, the wellnes center is his baby, any how he has had me on supplements as well. I can hardly see the kitchen table! it is so full of this crap.

This thread is just a confirmation of what I have been feeling. I need to get my nutrition through my foods. And yes I went ahead and recently bought nettle and oat straw. Wow I had no idea how much calcium is in nettle. I need to start brewing that up. Also the nutritionist had me off of dairy and I have to say that I really feel like I need it, I have been doing some pastured butter and I actually drank milk today ( not raw, I know that is not good but my body wants it) The nutritionist does not do dairy herself and takes calcium supplements.

I go to this dentist who is also an MD. She says don't poison yourself with supplements. She told me to make bone broth if I needed calcium.

She is very against vitamin supplements. Any how, I am rambling, I just am coming to the conclusion that I don't need to waste any more time or money on the nutritionist. I learn more here from you wise ones than the people I have been paying.

Wow, this thread really helped me make the decision. Thanks
This sort of thing really burns me up. It seems now that all "alternative" caregivers have their own supplements that they make money from. I think supplements are only an option if you have a serious condition (even then questionable). Otherwise, get it in the food. I've been to practitioner after practitioner and they all have their agenda. I immediately mistrust when they sell their own products to you. Then they operate only from that perspective. It's so frustrating because at this point, "alternative caregiver" basically means "supplement pusher". (Not all I'm sure but I have yet to find one that didn't operate like that)
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#266 of 319 Old 05-30-2009, 02:06 AM
 
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I don't know... I think sometimes you really need supplements to heal a disease state ... that it might not be possible to recover from serious deficiencies without supplements.

Which is not to say one should be taking a kitchen table full of chemicals, nor neglecting the benefits of nutrient dense food!

But we've been at this healing thing for a long time, and I keep knocking on supplement's door as the only way to correct some serious wrongs.
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#267 of 319 Old 05-30-2009, 02:13 AM
 
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What is FOS?
Sorry didn't see this... FOS is an indigestible sugar (not broken down by our digestive enzymes). It is commonly known as food for beneficial bacteria in our gut, but certain types of bad bacteria can feed on it too. It may depend on what you've got going on inside you. FOS is also well known to cause gas and bloating in many, whether it's causing bad bacteria to grow or too fast of a shift in gut flora is still debated.
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#268 of 319 Old 05-30-2009, 07:57 AM
 
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I don't know... I think sometimes you really need supplements to heal a disease state ... that it might not be possible to recover from serious deficiencies without supplements.

Which is not to say one should be taking a kitchen table full of chemicals, nor neglecting the benefits of nutrient dense food!

But we've been at this healing thing for a long time, and I keep knocking on supplement's door as the only way to correct some serious wrongs.
Ditto this. I use supplements to bring people to baseline. You'd be suprised at how many people are walking around with subclinical deficiencies. If it can be done through food, great. Sometimes and with some nutrients it can. Some that's just not enough for therapeutic doses.
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#269 of 319 Old 09-29-2009, 04:42 PM
 
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I know this is an old thread - I hope folks are still around for discussion!

I am pregnant, and I don't know WHAT'S wrong with me. I have hypoglycemic symptoms, am pretty uncomfortable. Someone suggested candida, but when I followed up on that I heard about this mercury relationship. There are a lot of suggestions here, some conflicting, and I don't know what my approach is going to be.

My questions are: what is documented about the relationship between candida and mercury? What exactly does the candida do to the mercury? It seems logical to avoid any potential chelation during pregnancy, but it also seems dangerous to have these blood sugar problems. Wouldn't we normally have some candida, and doesn't that imply that it does have some sort of job to do? I hate to try to wipe it out without really knowing what I am doing.

The bottom line is that I feel BAD and I want to feel GOOD, but I don't want to hurt the baby. If, after all nursing is done, I want to wipe out the candida, won't that leave me more vulnerable to mercury toxicity? How do you get to an optimal level of candida for mercury sequestering?
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#270 of 319 Old 09-30-2009, 07:40 AM
 
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My understanding is that, well, everyone's got some mercury in them, and everyone's got some candida, and neither is really an issue at low levels. The mercury-candida problem starts when you don't excrete mercury well, it starts throwing a lot of things out of balance, and the environment in the gut is part of that. With a lot of mercury around, candida usually does proliferate and sequester mercury, and the risks and benefits need to be balanced in terms of doing things to intentionally kill candida.

You shouldn't have to rely on candida to protect you from mercury. People should have good glutathione levels and sufficient methylation levels to excrete the heavy metals (and other stuff that's detoxified by those pathways) to basically keep up with what they're exposed to.

Once you've built up a lot of mercury (if you have, it's my issue, but it's not everyone's issue, most people deal with mercury far better than I do), it's inevitable that your detox pathways have been significantly stressed and bogged down (the process generally takes years to build up, and we felt fairly normal for most of that time), so killing candida indiscriminately would release a lot of mercury that _our_ bodies, in particular, are poorly able to deal with. You'd need nutritional supports to supply the detox pathways with the material to excrete the metals, clearly during pregnancy is not the time you'd want to increase circulating toxins.

Most of the reading I've done on mercury/candida has been from autism-mercury websites. The autism-mercury yahoo group has a Files section that may be of use, the frequent-dose-chelation yahoo group does as well (the former is more child-centric, the latter adult-centric). Some books on kids and autism and biomed would discuss candida and gut imbalances in general. I like Kenneth Bock's Healing the New Childhood Epidemics but I don't remember how much detail he goes into wrt candida. I think there are some other books out there that get fairly technical in terms of the effects of mercury and ways of dealing with the various imbalances caused by it.

I'm not knowledgeable on the other reasons for hypoglycemia, it seems like it's a common problem with a lot of causes, so I can't suggest other topics to look into to find your root cause.
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