Can we talk about "traditional foods" diets and vegetarianism? - Mothering Forums
Forum Jump: 
Reply
 
Thread Tools
#1 of 41 Old 04-10-2012, 10:07 AM - Thread Starter
 
kismetbaby's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Nor. Cal.
Posts: 1,937
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)

I've been a vegetarian for a decade.  Mostly dairy free as well, but have always found eggs to be an important piece of our diet so never truly vegan. Lately I've been reading a lot on the Weston Price/nourishing traditions/traditional foods diet. . .and I have to admit that for the first time in a decade I'm tempted to eat meat!  

I'll back-track to say that this temptation is only about health. I've had two babies in the past 2.5 years am BFing both of them AND I had a small stroke right before the birth of my dd 3 months ago. Ever since then, I've been struggling to recover on many levels and I find myself feeling exhausted and depleted.  I have no desire to eat an animal, in fact it would break my heart to do so, but for my own health and sanity (which I need to have to raise my beautiful children) I find myself wondering if a little animal protein is necessary. I did take a fish oil supp right after the birth/stroke and I felt it helped, but that's as much as I've been able to do.

 

I've been trying to incorporate some of the traditional foods diet stuff as a veg. . .soaking & sprouting my grains and beans. I'm willing to try raw milk and butter, but my BFing babes don't tolerate dairy. . .

Any thoughts?  traditional foods vs. vegetarianism?

 

 


photosmile2.gif Me= crunchy mama to one rambunctious toddler, born on October 1, 2009. And one sweet little baby born January 19, 2012. heartbeat.gif

kismetbaby is offline  
#2 of 41 Old 04-10-2012, 10:19 AM
 
CoBabyMaker's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: The place I've tried to leave 3 times!
Posts: 1,130
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)

I'm not a lot of help as far as meat goes.  I was a vegetarian for a short period of time but find that I feel better with meat.  I'm learning and doing my best to get local, properly raised meats as much as I can. 

 

As far as the dairy goes you might try to find goat milk.  I know that some people can't handle either but my kids who can't do dairy are fine with goat milk.


Becky- Wife to DH, Mama to "Nani" (July '08) "Coco" (July '10) and expecting one very wiggly baby boy in May 2013!

CoBabyMaker is offline  
#3 of 41 Old 04-10-2012, 10:44 AM
 
fruitfulmomma's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: Between the Rockies and a Flat Place
Posts: 4,214
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 10 Post(s)

As fars as dairy, if it is not a true allergy, trying it raw and/or from a goat may improve their digestibility of it. Also cheese is better on the stomach than liquid milk.(I could only toerate goats milk formula as a baby and then seemed fine until about 8 years ago, goats milk works better for me but i lost my source, i do fine on cheese and butter and yogurt.)

 

I feel way better eating a meat heavy diet, but if you can't bring yourself to do that pastured eggs and dairy are a great start. 

 

Have you read Nina Planck? She has a book specifically for the childbearing years and is an ex veg herself.


fruitfulmomma is online now  
#4 of 41 Old 04-10-2012, 11:07 AM
 
flightgoddess's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Posts: 345
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)

I try to get the best meat I can, I've met the farmer who raises the animals, and then ration the meat. Sometimes there are meat centered meals, but mostly meat is a condiment or complement to the meal, to strech it out. A deck of cards is the right size for a serving. Bone broth would be a good place to start, it is very nourishing.

flightgoddess is offline  
#5 of 41 Old 04-10-2012, 11:21 AM
 
mumkimum's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Ohio-land
Posts: 2,884
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)

I read up a lot of TF info a few years ago, but have remained vegetarian.  For me, the helpful wisdom and changes I took from some of the TF thoughts were to incorporate more varied, high quality fats (wider range of dietary oils, kerrygold butter when I can, good eggs, vegetarian efa oils), fermented foods, eat more seasonally.  

 

Might also be interesting for you to look at cuisine/health traditions of cultures with a history of vegetarianism (buddhism, macrobiotics, indian cuisine/ayurveda) which may have other traditional but vegetarian healthful habits.

maciascl and CatsCradle like this.
mumkimum is offline  
#6 of 41 Old 04-10-2012, 06:17 PM
 
gitanamama's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: High desert or Peruvian coast
Posts: 521
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)

I started a similar thread myself awhile back pondering the same question. I've been a vegetarian for awhile but am recently feeling very depleted and just found out that my son (2) and I both have cavities--my first ever! I think breastfeeding a very active toddler and not really putting enough effort into my diet is probably to blame.  We do eat fish (I added during my pregnancy because it felt necessary to me) so I'm trying to increase the amount we eat, along with really good eggs, and hoping that helps me feel more energized and "alive!" 

 

We're sticking to our mostly veg diet for now while I continue to do more research and soul searching. I don't think there's any "right" answer or a diet that is morally superior to others (at least that's my opinion.) I think we all need to find out what foods make us feel the best and are most in line with our values. 

1love4ever likes this.

~may all beings be free from suffering~
gitanamama is offline  
#7 of 41 Old 04-10-2012, 07:46 PM
 
dovey's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2005
Posts: 520
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)

I think that in considering this step, it's very important to look at actual large scientific studies when making this decision.  I've read a lot of the Weston Price/Nourishing Traditions information, and while it seems very convincing while the book is open, if I really stop to think about what it's saying and compare it to actual nutritional research (which may be mainstream, but at least it is supported by a large amount of data), I find that the NT WAP information falls short and additionally is quite dismissive of the tradition of being a vegetarian.  There is a huge amount of anti-vegetarian fear based propaganda going around right now.  I mean the author of Nourishing Traditions attributes the feeling of enlightenment one gets while being vegetarian (please!) to a zinc deficiency.  To me, this type of propaganda is extremely annoying and offensive in addition to being absurd.

 

One thing that one might want to consider if actually attempting to consume a traditional diet, is the fact that people evolved eating lots of insects.  Not huge chunks of meat and dairy each day.  If a person is concerned with the prospect of needing animal protein and doesn't feel right about eating vertebrates or the milk of other mammals, eating insects might be a happy medium.  Insects have much less highly developed nervous systems than cows, pigs, goats and chickens.  They probably have very limited if any emotional lives.  I would imagine that they feel pain and fear less acutely.  Traditional societies still consume lots of insects - ants, grasshoppers, termites, grubs etc.  How bad could they be if they were roasted?  Eat the aphids on the organic kale.  Eat your tomato worms instead of squishing them.  Make tacos out of the grasshoppers eating your garden.     

dovey is offline  
#8 of 41 Old 04-10-2012, 08:45 PM
 
catnip's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: California
Posts: 2,658
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)

I have a friend that collects and eats her garden snails.

 

Every time this topic gets brought up in this forum, we get a huge influx of folks that are not regular posters in the veg section coming over and posting about how they just could not live without meat, yay yay grassfed happy meat. I don't really want to engage in an argument, I've done it to death.

 

I find that my personal health challenges are best addressed by a vegan diet that includes lots of fresh, local, seasonal vegetables and  fruits, whole grains, legumes (including organic soy foods), nuts, and seeds, and not a lot of oils, sugar, meat analogs, fake cheeses and the like. That said, I do take supplements - microalgae DHA, calcium citrate, B-12, D3 (non-vegan, but I actually need this and can't afford the more expensive vegan version), and a multivitamin.

CatsCradle likes this.
catnip is offline  
#9 of 41 Old 04-10-2012, 09:49 PM - Thread Starter
 
kismetbaby's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Nor. Cal.
Posts: 1,937
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)

Didn't mean to start any arguments around here. . .sorry. I guess I was thinking that all you fellow veggies would rush in and say, here's what to try to feel healthy withOUT eating meat.  

I'm going through some soul searching during this health crisis and I'm really just looking for advice from others that know something about both diets.  I'm not looking to abandon veg eating really, just try to find the balance/the diet that will nourish me best right now.

 

Maybe more importantly that veg or not or NT or not, we're going sugar and processed food free this year and I believe that will make a huge difference.


photosmile2.gif Me= crunchy mama to one rambunctious toddler, born on October 1, 2009. And one sweet little baby born January 19, 2012. heartbeat.gif

kismetbaby is offline  
#10 of 41 Old 04-12-2012, 06:10 PM
 
CStone1's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2011
Location: Eureka, CA
Posts: 35
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)

I've been vegetarian for about 17 years, mostly vegan but I do eat some cheese from time to time. I am also BFing my almost 2 year old ds. I think based on the research I've done and personal experiences I've had that it is possible to continue to be healthy on a veg diet. One major issue in all illnesses or medical issues is toxins in the body and one issue that people can have with a veg diet is that it causes the body to detoxify over time and if there are blockages in the body such as in the colon then these toxins can't get out and can enter the bloodstream causing many problems. If the person than eats meat they may notice that the issues resolve - however this is often due to the fact that eating meat stops this detoxification process and so they "feel better" but not because they needed meat. What can then be very beneficial when one has experienced health issues is to do some form of cleansing to help remove the blockages so that the toxins can exit the body. Full cleansing is not recommended during breastfeeding, however one place to start is by included a large quantity of raw foods, smoothies and freshly made vegetable juices and avoiding wheat, sugar, dairy, caffeine, etc and getting colonics (colon hydrotherapy) to help clean everything out and allow the toxins to pass out of the body. You might try finding a Naturopathic doctor who supports a veg lifestyle to help you out.

CStone1 is offline  
#11 of 41 Old 04-12-2012, 06:16 PM
 
CStone1's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2011
Location: Eureka, CA
Posts: 35
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)

Oh, to ad to my last post there is a line of vegan products mad by the company Health Force Nutritionals that I have found very helpful for keeping  my energy up and getting what I need - they are all organic and made with food-based ingredients.

 

CStone1 is offline  
#12 of 41 Old 04-13-2012, 11:37 AM
 
cristeen's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Posts: 14,791
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)

Kismet - have you tried raw milk since you discovered N's reaction?  I'm happy to pour you off some of my cow share to try it and watch for a reaction if you'd like to test it without committing to anything. 

 

Ultimately I do think you need to listen to your body, and it's telling you something isn't right here.  But I think cutting out processed foods and sugars is a great first place to start.  I'd also probably continue the fish oil if you can, and see where that takes you.  Give that a few weeks, and re-evaluate. 

 

Would you be more comfortable eating seafood or poultry over mammals?  There are lots of places around here to get sustainably harvested and safe seafood - possibly even just once a week might show you a difference if that's what you want to try.  Responsibly harvested poultry is harder to find, IME, though. 


Cristeen ~ Always remembering our stillheart.gif  warrior ~ Our rainbow1284.gif  is 3, how'd that happen?!?! 

We welcomed another rainbow1284.gifstillheart.gif  warrior in May 2012!! 

2012 Decluttering challenge - 575/2012

cristeen is offline  
#13 of 41 Old 04-13-2012, 07:18 PM
 
es1967's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Sunny South
Posts: 1,402
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)

What kind of foods does your diet consist of?  Also, one thing I have learned is that health is more than just what you eat.  Sleep,exercise,stress  and your emotional well being have alot to do with how you feel.  I've been a vegeatarian for 25 years and the majority of times I feel great.  At times I have felt tired and wondered why?  then I realized I was not sleeping the hours I need or have too much stress.  I love Dr Schulze's products.  The superfood is awesome.   I juice several times a week and use the superfood for that extra boost.  That really keeps me energized.    Also, make sure to get enough fats in your diet especially nursing 2 children.   Lately, I have started making cashew milk. So easy and  delicous.   What is your diet like? 

es1967 is offline  
#14 of 41 Old 04-13-2012, 07:38 PM
 
CatsCradle's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: New York City
Posts: 2,006
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)

Traditional  food vs. vegetarian/vegan:  there's not much of a difference for me, personally.  As a vegetarian, I cook from scratch and eat a lot foods in a traditional sense.  Not any one culture's tradition, but whole, natural foods that have been traditionally recognized throughout the ages that happen to be traditional.  I've been a vegetarian (and mostly vegan) for almost 25 years.  My growth as been a process.  It hasn't happened overnight.  One of the key things for me is leaning/finding what works for my own body.  I found that after many years of misery that I was actually gluten and lactose intolerant.    When I removed certain things from my daily diet, I felt a lot better.  We follow (in our family) a mostly Japanese vegetarian-based diet (lots of protein via raw soy, seaweed, raw veggies).  We have felt great for a long time.  The removal of grains has been a big deal for us.  It isn't traditional in the sense of Western traditional diet, but it has a long-standing tradition in other cultures.  But, that's just a base, because good food to us is a stuff from the earth and an acceptance of certain fermentation of plant-based products.  Doesn't have to be Asian, but that is the stuff we gravitate toward because it tastes so good!

 

Disclaimer:  we don't eat meat because we don't believe in eating meat.  It goes against our value system.  If "traditional" means eating meat, then I guess we don't do traditional, but to me, traditional means a whole lot more:  it means eating foods (plant-based) in the way that they are traditionally meant to be eaten.  We don't do modern processed stuff...even the stuff considered "vegan."   We love plant-based food for what they are and try to stick close to their roots (no pun intended).

 


"Lawyers, I suppose, were children once." Charles Lamb.
CatsCradle is offline  
#15 of 41 Old 04-14-2012, 05:21 PM
Dia
 
Dia's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Posts: 564
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)


Quote:
Originally Posted by CatsCradle View Post

 

Disclaimer:  we don't eat meat because we don't believe in eating meat.  It goes against our value system.  If "traditional" means eating meat, then I guess we don't do traditional, but to me, traditional means a whole lot more:  it means eating foods (plant-based) in the way that they are traditionally meant to be eaten.  We don't do modern processed stuff...even the stuff considered "vegan."   We love plant-based food for what they are and try to stick close to their roots (no pun intended).

 



I agree with what CatsCadle had to say here and I want to add that, a lot of vegans / vegetarians I see becoming ill and deciding that the veg diet does not work for them fall into the trap of eating a lot of processed foods in the place of meat and dairy foods. So, of course they feel bad.

 

I believe that eating non processed, whole, plant based foods is the healthiest way to eat. 

Of course, everyone must first of all listen to their own body and make the decision that feels best to them, uniquely. 


Mama to one amazing ecbaby2.gif
Dia is offline  
#16 of 41 Old 04-18-2012, 07:30 AM
 
LoveRealFood's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: New York
Posts: 33
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)

Kismetbaby,

 

I was never a vegetarian. But I was almost vegetarian for 15 years. I used to think it was unhealthy to eat red meat and pork. I ate fish, some eggs, and dairy and occasionally chicken, lots of whole grains, veggies and fruits. I thought I was eating the picture-perfect diet for the most part. I listened to the USDA guidelines to come up with this diet. I too then discovered the work of Price and it made a lot of sense to me. I began to eat red meat and pork, very slowly. I also began to eat more eggs and then raw dairy. For me this change in diet was very positive. Every time I would eat red meat I would literally feel high! It was awesome! Now I do eat a lot of meat and a ton of vegetables, no grains. This seems to work very well.

 

However, there are two key things to consider when talking about what to eat. 1. We are all unique 2. Observing the body is crucial

 

If you remember these two things you will come a long way in the quest for finding health. What works for me may not necessarily work for others. There is no one right way to eat. There is only the way that works for you. And I always ask my body if something is working or not. Our bodies are speaking volumes to us, we just have to listen. It does take some trial and error for sure. But once you figure it out there is a confidence that comes. Listen to your body.

 

I have a few suggestions for you. If you are not morally opposed to eating meat then I would advise you give it a try. You may want to start with bone broth (stock). This is a good way to ease into eating meat. Who knows, you may do fine on just stock. Stock is very rich in amino acids and minerals and aids in digestion. Then you may want to add some fish (the fish oil is good too!!) and see how you feel. It is ok to move slowly and just observe how you feel. You can also try small amounts of meat and if you don't like it, feel bad, or whatever, then you can back off.

 

If you look at the work of Price you will see that the cultures he studied ate different things. They weren't all major carnivores. There was great variety in what they ate. We humans are all unique. Some need more protein and fat than others. There is no denying this. How much you need, only you can tell (and your body will let you know).  

 

I am a fan of those who choose to eat a healthy, whole foods diet coming together instead of being fragmented. It doesn't matter if you eat meat or not, what matters is that you listen to your body, live consciously, and accept others. 


"Become Independently Healthy" www.bodywisefoodsmart.com
LoveRealFood is offline  
#17 of 41 Old 04-18-2012, 09:44 AM
Dia
 
Dia's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Posts: 564
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)

Great post, LoveRealFood. 


Mama to one amazing ecbaby2.gif
Dia is offline  
#18 of 41 Old 04-18-2012, 04:44 PM
 
juliet88's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Posts: 2
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)

I have been drifting in and out of the "meat eating crowd". I have found this light balance of the meats I can eat. And satisfied some dietary morals too. :) I apprenticed under a master herbalist and life coach for a while. I took these things I learned from him and combined that with some soul and body communication and found a good balance:

 

Pigs have the unique ability to store toxins and emotions and hormones in their muscles when we eat them, we are absorbing all of the toxins into our bodies

Be careful of commercially raised animals as there are hormones and steroids added that can affect our body processes

Combining other foods with meat can affect the way we digest them 

               I.E. meat and starches are hard to digest together because they require completely different digestive acidity and wind up sitting longer and heavier on the gut

                     meats and fruits or grains create fermentation in the gut when consumed together. Meat takes much longer to digest so they both end up sitting in the gut together

                     meats take the longest to digest and should be eaten alone (1 hour after fruits, grains, startches and 2-4 hours before anything else)

                     meat should be eaten in the longest cycle of digestion to allow complete digestion (middle of the day)

I found that it is hard to judge how meat will affect your body if you eat it with anything else because it has to sit so long in the gut to digest. So I started just eating it in the middle of the day alone completely with nothing else. Now I just stick to light meats like fish or chicken just because that's what my body handles the very best. 

Don't know if that helps.

 

 

juliet88 is offline  
#19 of 41 Old 04-18-2012, 05:58 PM
 
catnip's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: California
Posts: 2,658
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)

It does occur to me that you have a 3 month old? Of course you are feeling run down! Your sleep is all kinds of disrupted, you just gave birth, and you are caring for 2 kids under 3! If you want to look at a traditional foods style vegan, go check out Bonzai Aphrodite, she's not updating right now, but has tons of ideas for great. nutritionally dense plant foods.

catnip is offline  
#20 of 41 Old 04-20-2012, 01:52 PM
 
t2009's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Somewhere between here & there
Posts: 580
Mentioned: 25 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 6 Post(s)
Sorry, another "intruder" to this board, but in my defense I was a vegetarian for almost 20 years & only recently starting posting on the food-related boards...

OP, I won't pretend that I have an "answer" for you because I don't. No one can know what is right for your body except for you. But since you posted I will share my experience & thoughts.

This is where I'm coming from: after having my babe (who is now 3 y/o so not a babe anymore) I have struggled with severe iron deficiency. I felt totally run down, but chalked it up to being a new parent. My doctor finally pin-pointed (part of) the problem & got me on some iron supplements specially compounded for me. I was still vegetarian at this point, but eating all the "right" things & actually making active improvements to my diet (cutting out processed foods & concentrating on whole, fresh foods with lots of iron containing veggies). After almost 4 months of supplements, I went back to be tested & my iron had gone up one whopping point... A terrible outcome. After this & A LOT of soul searching I started to eat some meat. I don't particularly want to be eating meat, but it is what MY body needs PRESENTLY. I hope that once I get to the bottom of this I will be able to go back to eating at least mostly veg. I may have to make further changes to my diet, but for right now eating red meat provides me with the amount & type of iron I need. I think it is helping, even if marginally. And I know it will take me a long time to recover from this.

So, I am not saying "you should eat meat". I am saying that at some point it may be necessary to look at what YOUR body needs without (at least momentarily) thinking about ethics/morals. Once you figure out what your body needs THEN you can return to the ethical issues implicated & figure out what (if anything) needs to budge. It may be that your body doesn't need meat. It may be that you need it very minimally or temporarily.

Maybe you have a healthcare provider who you can talk to who won't brow-beat you over your dietary decisions? I was grateful my doc totally understood where I was coming from.

Hugs! This is not easy territory!!

Mama to my little busy bee. 

t2009 is online now  
#21 of 41 Old 04-21-2012, 01:37 PM
 
catnip's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: California
Posts: 2,658
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)

So I guess the question that we need to ask is what are you eating now? Are you eating dark green leafy veggies and orange veggies every day? Are you eating at least 5 servings of veggies? (5 of fruit and veggies combined is not enough) Are you eating whole grains and legumes every day? Do you get enough healthy fats? Are you taking a B-12 supplement? Do you live in an area where you can get enough sun to make Vitamin D, or should you be supplementing it? Are you getting enough rest, enough fluids, enough physical activity? When you eat sweets, are they high quality, soul nurturing ones that are worth the indulgence (Homemade cookies fresh out of the oven or a small piece of fine dark chocolate as opposed to Oreos or a Hershey's bar)?

 

catnip is offline  
#22 of 41 Old 04-25-2012, 07:56 PM - Thread Starter
 
kismetbaby's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Nor. Cal.
Posts: 1,937
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)

Thanks everyone. I stopped getting the notifications about updates, so sorry to miss all these replies for so long.  I appreciate the honest thoughts. I do agree that it all comes down to each person being mindful of their own body.  And yes, some of this is just normal PP stuff. . .sleep deprivation and all that.  Good news is my PP anemia has already resolved, so I know I am getting enough iron from my veg diet (I did use Floradix too).

 

I did try raw milk and I did not like the taste (too many years of almond milk?) and my baby seemed to have a negative reaction to it. But I have been using some pastured butter and we have all liked that. I started getting some really good pastured eggs and rely on those for my big protein boost in the morning.

 

Otherwise, the staples of our diet are local, organic fruit and veg, plus quinoa, brown rice, sprouted grain bread, hummus, tofu and tempeh, nut butters, beans.  I have started sprouting and soaking as much as I can in hopes of getting the most out of our veg diet.

 


photosmile2.gif Me= crunchy mama to one rambunctious toddler, born on October 1, 2009. And one sweet little baby born January 19, 2012. heartbeat.gif

kismetbaby is offline  
#23 of 41 Old 04-26-2012, 11:53 AM
Banned
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Posts: 19
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)

If any of you have questions about why you are feeling a certain way. Or have any questions at all I highly recommend this book 'Conscious Health' by Ron Garner http://www.conscioushealth.ca/book/

It honestly explains anything and everything, about your body, about nutrients, about food. about life really! He explains disease and cancer and how we do it to ourselves. He explains topics on soy, raw foods, cooked foods, health problems, medical doctors, vegans, vegetarians, immunizations, you name it. This is the best read EVER and I think $20.00 is a great price. I would charge $100 if I wrote this book! This book made me feel awesome!

MandyDugas is offline  
#24 of 41 Old 04-26-2012, 12:21 PM - Thread Starter
 
kismetbaby's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Nor. Cal.
Posts: 1,937
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by catnip View Post

So I guess the question that we need to ask is what are you eating now? Are you eating dark green leafy veggies and orange veggies every day? Are you eating at least 5 servings of veggies? (5 of fruit and veggies combined is not enough) Are you eating whole grains and legumes every day? Do you get enough healthy fats? Are you taking a B-12 supplement? Do you live in an area where you can get enough sun to make Vitamin D, or should you be supplementing it? Are you getting enough rest, enough fluids, enough physical activity? When you eat sweets, are they high quality, soul nurturing ones that are worth the indulgence (Homemade cookies fresh out of the oven or a small piece of fine dark chocolate as opposed to Oreos or a Hershey's bar)?

 

 

I eat probably 2 fruit and 4 veggie servings a day. Always trying to up my veggie content (so easy just to reach for bread instead of the veggies), but I do eat dark green and orange veggies every day (broccoli, carrot, kale, and sweet potato are my staples although I try to change it up too--the CSA box helps with this).  Yes to the whole grains and legumes daily. Yes to the healthy fats--nuts, avocado, coconut oil, olive oil and a little butter and a little flax oil. I also eat 2 pastured eggs a day.  Not currently taking a B supp. I take a prenatal vitamin still, plus Vit D, probiotic, Vit C, Magnesium, and fish oil.  
I am cutting the sweets and all processed foods out, but I do slip up still. I get major sugar cravings and have been trying to make healthy treats with raw honey or just snack on dates when that happens.

 Rest. . .well I have a toddler and a 3 month old, so no, not enough rest! But I try. Same goes for exercise and time outdoors. I try to get a 30min walk everyday. 


photosmile2.gif Me= crunchy mama to one rambunctious toddler, born on October 1, 2009. And one sweet little baby born January 19, 2012. heartbeat.gif

kismetbaby is offline  
#25 of 41 Old 04-26-2012, 08:25 PM
 
Vegan Princess's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: California
Posts: 3,355
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)

Kismet: I have been pondering the same thoughts as you. I am veggie. We have our own chickens and I eat their lovely eggs. I'm drinking a bit of milk now and putting cream on fruit slices and using pastured butter. Upping my dairy for sure lately and now making sure it comes from pastured cows - cheese included. I am 17 weeks pregnant and have been craving meat. It goes against my beliefs to eat meat. And it goes against everything I've taught my 3 yr old as well. But still I am pondering, reading, and consideirng it. And like you, for now, I am trying to incorporate ideas from traditional foods that mesh with what I feel comfortable with - going to change the flours I use, start soaking, etc. I bought already made bread from Grindstone Bakery that fits with the principles and have been eating that with pastured butter and poached eggs. I have to say - since upping the fat and protein in my diet that comes from whole, pastured dairy, I am not craving sugar and I'm not really craving the meat anymore either. 

 

I enjoyed this thread since it is so timely for what is consuming my mind these days!

 

Cindy


Mama to my veggie girl hearts.gif(1/09) and my sweet rainbow baby rainbow1284.gif (9/12). 

Vegan Princess is offline  
#26 of 41 Old 04-27-2012, 04:13 AM
 
LoveRealFood's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: New York
Posts: 33
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)

Cindy,

 

It sounds like you are listening to and respecting your body. That is always a beautiful thing.


"Become Independently Healthy" www.bodywisefoodsmart.com
LoveRealFood is offline  
#27 of 41 Old 04-28-2012, 09:45 AM
 
zubeldia's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Maine
Posts: 1,557
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)

I'm veggie/vegan for ethical as well as health reasons. Right now I'm pregnant (Hi Cindy!) and eating a tiny bit of dairy when it's contained in certain foods.

 

As for eating meat. First, I would say question the source of the information. I wouldn't consider Weston Price a neutral resource just as I wouldn't consider PETA a particularly neutral source. But looking at epidemiological studies, historical trends, and more, then it is hard not to argue, in my opinion, that a plant based diet is the most healthy for our bodies. I teach a class on epidemiology and health and the research (not tied to specific interests) is quite overwhelming.

 

But I also think that you cannot take out the ethical question, in my view.
 


jog.gif   mama to DS 7/09 and married to DH bikenew.gif

 

zubeldia is offline  
#28 of 41 Old 04-28-2012, 10:00 AM - Thread Starter
 
kismetbaby's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Nor. Cal.
Posts: 1,937
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)

Congrats Cindy! :)


photosmile2.gif Me= crunchy mama to one rambunctious toddler, born on October 1, 2009. And one sweet little baby born January 19, 2012. heartbeat.gif

kismetbaby is offline  
#29 of 41 Old 04-28-2012, 12:16 PM
 
berry987's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Posts: 710
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)

I was a vegetarian for 10 years, a vegan for 1 year. I now eat a TF style diet (kind of a primal/WAPF hybrid) and have been eating some version of that way for a year or more (of 7years of meat eating, maybe 5 were low fat, still plant heavy, the last 2 have been higher fat, low carb). I studied nutrition & epidemiology in graduate school in public health. This was 12 years ago and at the time I thought vegetarianism was the best thing for health and ethical concerns. I was extremely attentive to my health and getting important nutrients. I drank green smoothies with almond milk and flax seed oil for breakfast, ate whole wheat pita with avocado/sprouts/tomato for lunch, nuts for snacks and various ethnic vegetarian dishes for dinner most of the time (udon noodles with brussels sprouts in miso, for example). Compared with most people, I was eating exceptionally well. But the thing is, my health was horrible. I gained 75 pounds over the years. I had acne and infertility. I was exhausted constantly. I talked to doctors, saw naturopaths, etc. and everyone gave my diet a big thumbs up, so I never thought it might be the issue.

 

After the birth of my 1st child I went back to eating meat because I was anemic and figured that would be a simple way to correct the problem. My health didn't miraculously improve, mainly because I kept eating whole grains and made sure I ate lean meats, like chicken breast, so I wasn't getting much fat in my diet. But I became more obsessed with figuring out my issues and was open to just about anything at that point, so I began experimenting. I've been experimenting for over 7 years now and do finally feel like I found some answers. I feel great, my energy is high, I bounced back really fast after the birth of my 4th child this past fall, my weight is controllable now, my skin is completely clear, my hair grows fast, I sleep better....I just feel good. And for someone who struggled for many years with exhaustion and mystery ailments, it's very liberating. I just KNOW, my body runs well on a high fat, no sugar, no grain diet. I don't see my diet as focused on meat (I think that's a misconception about WAPF; in reality they just advise eating whole, traditional foods that include meat), but includes grass fed butter and meats, coconut oil, bone broths, eggs, fish and vegetables (I don't do grains at all and fruit sparingly). 

 

My point is that maybe we all are different, maybe there is not one "right" answer, so I encourage you to experiment with your diet. And go all out when you do - half measures never produced results for me. I went vegan, I went WAPF, I have been on both sides and I've found what feels good to me. 



berry987 is offline  
#30 of 41 Old 04-28-2012, 04:52 PM
 
Vegan Princess's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: California
Posts: 3,355
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)

Kismet: Thanks! :-)

 

Zub: Hi! What an interesting class you teach! And yes, I can't seem to get past the moral aspect of it. 

 

Berry: I enjoyed your tale. It's so interesting to me to read of others experience - be it good or bad, introducing meat.

 

Not sure if I said this before, but I was veggie for 6 yrs from age 15-21. I started eating meat again at 21 and ate it for the next 5 yrs. Always a fairly healthy eater, but nothing overly so during that time. I really never cooked meat for myself but would eat fish, etc while out. I never noticed much of a difference when I started eating meat again in the way I felt. People kept asking if I felt better or stronger and I just didn't. I can't say as I feel sickly now either - I just feel like my body is telling me it wants meat. I was vegan when I conceived my daughter and started obsessing about eating eggs until I finally did. I felt like my body was demanding it. And now I am craving meat. So I wonder if my body is telling me it needs it. 

 

That said, I just came from a bbq birthday party. I'd been craving chicken skin all week! I spent most of the 2 hours I was there pondering eating the bbq'd chicken. I wanted to, but I didn't want to and was afraid to. I just wish I could come to a decision either way already and just do it or accept that I'm not going to and stop thinking about it so much!

 

Cindy


Mama to my veggie girl hearts.gif(1/09) and my sweet rainbow baby rainbow1284.gif (9/12). 

Vegan Princess is offline  
Reply

Tags
Vegetarian

Quick Reply
Message:
Drag and Drop File Upload
Drag files here to attach!
Upload Progress: 0
Options

Register Now

In order to be able to post messages on the Mothering Forums forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.
User Name:
If you do not want to register, fill this field only and the name will be used as user name for your post.
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.
Password:
Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.
Email Address:

Log-in

Human Verification

In order to verify that you are a human and not a spam bot, please enter the answer into the following box below based on the instructions contained in the graphic.



User Tag List

Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page


Forum Jump: 

Posting Rules  
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are Off