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#1 of 20 Old 12-29-2011, 10:31 PM - Thread Starter
 
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So I feel a little stupid asking this at this point, but I feel like I haven't been able to establish a bedtime routine.  DD is almost 7 months and has gone through many different nighttime phases, none of which have lasted more than a couple of weeks.  Once asleep, I feel like things go well.  We are down to one feeding overnight, between 1 and 3am usually, and no overnight diaper change (and I finally figured out how to prevent leakage).  She's up for a feeding between 0630 and 0730 and then will sleep again until about 0830 - 0930.

 

The problem is that she never falls asleep before 10pm and sometimes is up (and I mean chatting/playing kind of up) until midnight. And that's usually in the arms of DH or myself.  Only 5 or 6 times has she fallen asleep on her own (and that was during her daytime naps if I recall).

 

I really don't want to (or think I could anyway) do CIO sleep training.  And this is probably late coming but I guess I'm going to try to really get repetitious with a nighttime routine starting around 8pm.  But I'm just not really sure what that consists of.  Now, I change her diaper and put on her jammies and stay away from others in the house.  I turn off the big light and I grab my toothbrush and give her one as well to chew on while I brush my teeth.    Every once in a while I'll read a book, but she's a serious wiggler and holding her still is a challenge and the more she squirms the more she wakes up.

 

But beyond that,what other things do you do?  What does your evening routine consist of?

 

 


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#2 of 20 Old 12-30-2011, 11:08 AM
 
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Just listening in as our situation sounds just like yours...but my guy is only 3 mos! regardless of when his last nap ends, he has been falling asleep for the night between 10:30 and 11:30 for the past 10 days and although it may be a phase that passes, it's not something I want to stick with. I don't do an extensive bedtime routine either mostly because when he starts to get tired, he wants to nurse NOW.

 

I'm also curious to know what your nighttime diapering solution is - since it's off topic please feel free to message me if you have a moment. thanks so much!

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#3 of 20 Old 12-30-2011, 02:50 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Yeah, we've never had a real solid bedtime routine.  I will say that I learned early not to worry too much about sleep patterns when she was 3 months because it became apparent that no pattern lasted more than a couple of weeks.  Twice I fooled myself into thinking we had an overnight schedule and then it changed.   There have been some big changes in her nursing habits from 3 months to now too.  Anyway, I'll keep you posted on our progress.

 

On the diaper front...I'm just starting to figure out what works.  I will follow up on that in a bit when we're not trying to get out the door for some errands.


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#4 of 20 Old 12-31-2011, 12:08 PM
 
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DS did the same thing. We have only been able to have a consistent routine since he turned two a couple of months ago. Before that, we switched it up a lot. Between 1-4 months he nursed to sleep. 5-6 months he fell alseep laying down and being sung to (usually nursing as well) 6-8 months he liked to be rocked and sung to or have music played to. After that it just kind of repeats in varying degrees of consistency. Now, we have a bit of a routine that goes like this: bath at 630 or 700, which last about half an hour because he likes them, then lotion, pajamas, teeth brushing, snuggling with daddy. Then he and I lay down in the bed (usually willingly but not always) and I will read him a chapter book (not a picture book) and we will drink water until he falls asleep. If he is unhappy to be in the bed (ie, crying when I read, trying to leave the bed) I ask if he'd rather read or turn the light out. He will pick always pick reading. I don't try to make him lay down- he will do it when he gets tired- but I don't let him have any toys in the bed. This has worked great for us.

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#5 of 20 Old 01-01-2012, 09:25 AM
 
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DD didn't really have a consistent nighttime routine until about 7-8mo old, but it really seemed to help her understand that this wasn't just another nap, that it was time for bed for the night. We do solid food dinner (usually a pureed fruit and veg, plus some of whatever DP and I are having for dinner too) then bath time, PJ's and goodnights to everyone, then we rock to sleep while she nurses. Occasionally she'll unlatch herself and just cuddle with me till she falls asleep but that's rare.

 

I don't think that what you do in your routine or what exact time you do it are as important as having the same things in the same order each night. Like when X, Y, and Z happen bedtime is what comes next.


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#6 of 20 Old 01-01-2012, 08:11 PM
 
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We're pretty scheduled in our house so we always had a bedtime routine since 2 months or so (now we're 9 months) and our routine is really simple so it's hard to not do these exact two things every night in the same order before bed.  It's evolved and we've taken things out and added things in.  Right now, we're working on making new sleep positive sleep associations to stop the hourly waking so we've just slightly modified our routine (moved bedtime back an hour and going to sleep a bit more independently).

 

DW takes the baby for a bath sometime around 7:30 pm which lasts about 20 minutes.  We initially put bathtime in the nighttime routine as a time to wind down, but she loves it and it's like the final energy rush of the evening. It's anything but calming, but it doesn't disrupt sleep, so we keep it as is. DW then puts her in her nighttime diaper and jammies (for the person who asked earlier cause we don't do nighttime diaper changes it's an AIO with a soaker or a fitted with a soaker and wool cover).  I then take her to nurse in our room where I leave the nightlight and bedside light on and turn on the fan.  When she's done nursing, I turn off the bedside light and now take her to her pack n' play, lay her on her side, give her the soother and sing a lullaby to her until she falls asleep (that's usually the mockingbird song twice).  I may pat her back, but she usually likes to play with my fingers as she fades away.  This takes less than 10 minutes.


DW and I are moms to two teens (DD 17 and DS 15) adopted through CAS in 2007 and a toddler (DD 2) born at home in March 2011.

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#7 of 20 Old 01-02-2012, 01:48 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Quick poll:  does everyone do a bath every night? (I thought that we weren't supposed to bath her everyday)


New mom who left a life at sea for my DH, my "firstborn", 10-month old puppy Betsy - Lab/Border Collie mix - and my DD Amelia, born June 2 and growing like a weed .

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#8 of 20 Old 01-02-2012, 04:12 PM
 
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Originally Posted by schoonersam View Post

Yeah, we've never had a real solid bedtime routine.  I will say that I learned early not to worry too much about sleep patterns when she was 3 months because it became apparent that no pattern lasted more than a couple of weeks.  Twice I fooled myself into thinking we had an overnight schedule and then it changed.   There have been some big changes in her nursing habits from 3 months to now too.  Anyway, I'll keep you posted on our progress.

 



This gives me hope :)

 


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#9 of 20 Old 01-02-2012, 04:36 PM - Thread Starter
 
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This gives me hope :)

 



Well, don't get too comfy...as Gilda Radner said, "it's always something!". You can't stress about how things are "supposed to be" according to all the books, etc., and letting go of that is REALLY helpful for your healthy state of mind.  But it doesn't get the baby to fall asleep any earlier ;).


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#10 of 20 Old 01-02-2012, 04:45 PM - Thread Starter
 
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And now an update mamas...so DD was up sooo late last night.  Here is our schedule today, can I get some thoughts on this?

She was WIDE awake at midnight and finally fell asleep around 0130.

Slept on and off this morning until 0930.

Up in the house and walking the dog, fell asleep for nap in mei tai around noon for a little over an hour.

Up and alternating between happy and fussy until about 1645.

Was just about to say that she is still asleep and ask if I should wake her, but DH just checked and she's got her eyes open.

But does this timing mean I'm looking at another late night? Cause OMG.


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#11 of 20 Old 01-02-2012, 06:19 PM
 
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Originally Posted by schoonersam View Post

Quick poll:  does everyone do a bath every night? (I thought that we weren't supposed to bath her everyday)


I think in the early weeks they recommend not bathing the baby every day because the baby doesn't need it (they're not dirty) and the natural oils in their skin keep them nice and soft.  We added a bath to our bedtime routine somewhere in the 4-6 week time period because the baby was so fussy in the evenings.  It turned out a warm bath was the only thing that got the gas to break up in her tummy, it was the only 30 minutes she didn't cry/scream in the evening fussy period, and she just loved it, so it became part of our routine.  Now at 9 months we keep bath time every evening cause it's right after dinner time and that's when I'll give her messy solids to play with.  Bath time was one of the first words she recognized and she squeals with delight each night when we tell her that's where we're going. 

 



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And now an update mamas...so DD was up sooo late last night.  Here is our schedule today, can I get some thoughts on this?

She was WIDE awake at midnight and finally fell asleep around 0130.

Slept on and off this morning until 0930.

Up in the house and walking the dog, fell asleep for nap in mei tai around noon for a little over an hour.

Up and alternating between happy and fussy until about 1645.

Was just about to say that she is still asleep and ask if I should wake her, but DH just checked and she's got her eyes open.

But does this timing mean I'm looking at another late night? Cause OMG.

 

Big hugs, mama!  That sounds rough. hug2.gif

 

I think your DD is about 3 months younger than my DD.  Looking at the amount of sleep she's getting (was this a typical day?), I'd say she's not getting enough!  I know there's a bit of variation in what is the ideal amount of sleep, but here's a suggestion from Pantley.  My DD was always a short napper (20-40 minutes at a time 3+ times a day at that age), but she's down for 12 hours at night (frequently waking, however, for minutes and then easily back to bed).  I think she may be overtired and that's just getting her less sleep.  So maybe you might want to consider trying to get her down for more naps if possible during the day, and working towards getting her on a bedtime schedule that works for you. If today was typical and you work on shifting it back, it's probably more manageable for you?

 

If I remember at 6 months (give or take 30 minutes either way), we were up around 8 am, napped around 10 am, 12 pm, 2 pm, 4 pm and 6 pm and down around 9 pm for the night.  A friend with a baby the same age who is a good napper had him down at 10 am for an hour and 2 pm for 1-2 hours at that age.  I wasn't that lucky ;)
 

 


DW and I are moms to two teens (DD 17 and DS 15) adopted through CAS in 2007 and a toddler (DD 2) born at home in March 2011.

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#12 of 20 Old 01-02-2012, 07:49 PM - Thread Starter
 
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If I remember at 6 months (give or take 30 minutes either way), we were up around 8 am, napped around 10 am, 12 pm, 2 pm, 4 pm and 6 pm and down around 9 pm for the night.  A friend with a baby the same age who is a good napper had him down at 10 am for an hour and 2 pm for 1-2 hours at that age.

 

Yeah, we had a week here & there that resembled this and the last couple weeks have gone to the dogs.  She's also gotten super clingy.  She did have her first two teeth come in during this time... could that explain anything?

Gonna check out that link after I get her down tonight. Gonna try bath now...

Thanks for the help!


New mom who left a life at sea for my DH, my "firstborn", 10-month old puppy Betsy - Lab/Border Collie mix - and my DD Amelia, born June 2 and growing like a weed .

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#13 of 20 Old 01-03-2012, 12:21 PM
 
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Originally Posted by schoonersam View Post

Quick poll:  does everyone do a bath every night? (I thought that we weren't supposed to bath her everyday)


I do no because DS is old enough to ask for it, and he enjoys it. I certainly don't wash him (with soap) every night. Up until a couple of months ago he only took a bath 1-2 times per week. He is 2 years 2 months now

 

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#14 of 20 Old 01-03-2012, 08:04 PM
 
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Bug gets a bath every night...wth soap. 1) because that hair causes him to sweat like crazy and by the end of the day he smells BAD, and 2) THE BREASTMILK GETS everywhere!!! It's a really messy process and contributes (along with the hain and sweat and fat rolls) to a VERY smelly baby come evening.

 

I use the California Baby soap on him, it doesn't dry him out or anything, and smells awesome!


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#15 of 20 Old 01-03-2012, 08:55 PM
 
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Laughing at the fat rolls - yes, you'd be amazed what you find in fat rolls in the bath.

 

I am more comfortable with habits and lucky me, daughter is too.  She's been on a baby-led schedule since she was 2 months old (3.5 mos. now).  She was struggling to fall asleep without me - so for a while I just let her sleep on me, and then near me, and now she is in her co-sleeper without me.  Some nights she still calls for me though, and I answer and calm her... mainly by helping her find her thumb.

 

Our routine starts at 7:30pm, with last awake feeding at 7pm.  I give her a bath and play with her in the tub - she LOVES to splash, already.  Then I lotion her up, put her jammies on and read her a story.  (She doesn't always pay attention to the story, haha.)  All this takes us until 8pm.  At this point when she was still very much needing me I just wrapped her up and she slept on me while I vegged for a hour or three before bed myself.  Now that I can put her down I put her in her co-sleeper awake after the story, tell her I love her and leave.  It's working!!  It may not work tomorrow...  but the routine remains.

 

It's a nice simple routine, has all the elements I wanted for her and she seems to enjoy each and every one.  After that last feeding she does get very, very cranky if she's not put in her bath in short order.  She knows her schedule, and I think that has helped her understand what happens after feeding-bath-story...  sleep!

 


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#16 of 20 Old 01-04-2012, 12:11 PM
 
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MrsGregory you have given me a lot to think about! I have been trying to decipher what his 'schedule' is, and it just changes so often, I wonder if me being a bit more consistent would help...

So far we've been very, go with the flow about when we get up, go to bed, eat, I mean, it's all usually within a couple of hours of the night before. Also, his dad doesn't get home some nights until 9 and he's always so bummed when he doesn't get to see baby all day. Of course, I go back to work next week and I'm expecting we will be FORCED into a schedule :)

 

I'm beginning to think I am the one with a sleeping problem, I absolulty cannot let him sleep alone. I don't know if this is the result of some sleep trauma I had (I'm sure my parents let me CIO at least a few times), but I'm just terrified to leave him alone, also because he wakes up screaming in terror if someone isn't within arms reach...also likely him feeding off my fear.

 

Not sure what that's about.

 

Your routine sounds so relaxing, I might steal it :)


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#17 of 20 Old 01-04-2012, 12:34 PM
 
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We got SUPER strict about nap times in our house--because if DS was overtired he just could not sleep.  i found the Weisbluth (Healthy Sleep, Happy Child) to be great about the science of sleep (mostly timing) even tho' we didn't use all of his stuff (we don't CIO).  I think at 7 months DS could not tolerate more than two hours awake in the morning.  So, if he woke up at 6, nap at 8.  If 7, nap at 9 (if he made it that long).  Then he usually slept 1-2 hours and then was awake for usually about 3 hours, then another nap of 2-3 hours, then up for 4 hours and then bed.  So, up at 6:30, nap at 8:30, up at 10:00, nap at 1, up at 4, bed at 8pm.  Our rigidity around naps was hard for me...but he needed the sleep!  Of course, he didn't STTN until 14 months when we night weaned...but he did always go to bed easily at "bedtime" and would wake up ONLY to nurse (of course, he wanted to nurse every 2-3 hours!).  Good luck!  Oh, our routine has been the same since about 6/7 months, 6:30pm bath, lotion and jammies, three stories and then nursing.  In bed, awake most of the time, with a night night and turn on of star projector.  Then I leave.  

 

ETA--we don't change diapers at night (unless poop of course!)  but we use a pocket diaper stuffed with a prefold AND an insert for overnight.  


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#18 of 20 Old 01-04-2012, 05:36 PM
 
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Mama2ChicknLil:  (Is that him in your avatar, btw?  Too cute!)  Steal away - I stole bits and pieces from here and there and cobbled together something that worked.  I understand the concerns about giving his father some quality time.  My husband leaves for his primary job at 7:30am and returns home at about 5:30am.  He goes back to a second job at 7:30pm and comes home at midnight.  The only time she gets to see her father Monday-Friday is between 5:30pm and 7:30pm - so I have her fed between 4:30pm-5:00pm, that feeding follows a nap which begins no later than 3pm, and I change her diaper when she goes down and wakes up - so when her father is at home there is nothing that interferes with his bonding time.  Not feeding, not nap.  She'd rather eat a little earlier, I think, but I distract and draaaagged it out until she accepted that time frame.  I also relate to how you feel about co-sleeping...  when we shopped for a bassinet Mr. was looking at models that, in our bedroom, would have been on an opposite wall.  I admit I was hormonal, but I teared up at the idea of her being so far away (and cold, and lonely!), and we got the Dr. Sears co-sleeper, which is an awesome place to store her books and blankets while she sleeps in my arms.  (I do use it for naps.)  I know I was left alone at night, because I both remember and have been told that I had terrible night terrors and had to be strapped into bed.  I do remember being strapped into bed.  I had (and still have) nightmares and night terrors.  I was never allowed into my parents' room, nevermind their bed, and I was not joined in the bedroom by an adult for any longer than it took for a parent to wake me from my nightmare or terror, inform me that my fear was unfounded and be instructed to go back to sleep.  I will probably cry with her when she has her first bad dream.  But I'm ready to respond differently.  Hubs is OK with her being in the bed-  and he's comfortable telling me when I've crossed that line between responding appropriately to *her* and giving *her* what she needs, including, in the future, the tools to sleep independently and simply trying to heal my own childhood by keeping her in my bed.  Right now she's in my bed with me, or her co-sleeper strapped to my side of the bed, and will be until she's old enough for an adult bed... that's the plan.  We're OK.  You're doing a hard job, keep it up!  Best of luck going back to work;  I think it will be very hard, but I'm here to pep talk to you if you need or want it!  :-)

 

As an aside, on the diaper changing mentioned by wishin'&hopin' - so, aside from poopy diapers overnight (a rare event for mine, knock on wood she's a morning pooper don'tknowhowtheheckIgotthatlucky), are we supposed to change diapers overnight?  I slap an overnight on her and don't touch it again until morning - dragging her butt out into the cold air doesn't seem conducive to sleep, and Mama likes her sleep which mean Baby needs to stay asleep.  Is this up for discussion?  Am I doing a questionable thing by letting her marinate in her own juices from 8pm until 7am?  I do wash her every day... 


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#19 of 20 Old 01-04-2012, 09:35 PM
 
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Mama2ChicknLil:  (Is that him in your avatar, btw?  Too cute!)  Steal away - I stole bits and pieces from here and there and cobbled together something that worked.  I understand the concerns about giving his father some quality time.  My husband leaves for his primary job at 7:30am and returns home at about 5:30am.  He goes back to a second job at 7:30pm and comes home at midnight.  The only time she gets to see her father Monday-Friday is between 5:30pm and 7:30pm - so I have her fed between 4:30pm-5:00pm, that feeding follows a nap which begins no later than 3pm, and I change her diaper when she goes down and wakes up - so when her father is at home there is nothing that interferes with his bonding time.  Not feeding, not nap.  She'd rather eat a little earlier, I think, but I distract and draaaagged it out until she accepted that time frame.  I also relate to how you feel about co-sleeping...  when we shopped for a bassinet Mr. was looking at models that, in our bedroom, would have been on an opposite wall.  I admit I was hormonal, but I teared up at the idea of her being so far away (and cold, and lonely!), and we got the Dr. Sears co-sleeper, which is an awesome place to store her books and blankets while she sleeps in my arms.  (I do use it for naps.)  I know I was left alone at night, because I both remember and have been told that I had terrible night terrors and had to be strapped into bed.  I do remember being strapped into bed.  I had (and still have) nightmares and night terrors.  I was never allowed into my parents' room, nevermind their bed, and I was not joined in the bedroom by an adult for any longer than it took for a parent to wake me from my nightmare or terror, inform me that my fear was unfounded and be instructed to go back to sleep.  I will probably cry with her when she has her first bad dream.  But I'm ready to respond differently.  Hubs is OK with her being in the bed-  and he's comfortable telling me when I've crossed that line between responding appropriately to *her* and giving *her* what she needs, including, in the future, the tools to sleep independently and simply trying to heal my own childhood by keeping her in my bed.  Right now she's in my bed with me, or her co-sleeper strapped to my side of the bed, and will be until she's old enough for an adult bed... that's the plan.  We're OK.  You're doing a hard job, keep it up!  Best of luck going back to work;  I think it will be very hard, but I'm here to pep talk to you if you need or want it!  :-)

 

As an aside, on the diaper changing mentioned by wishin'&hopin' - so, aside from poopy diapers overnight (a rare event for mine, knock on wood she's a morning pooper don'tknowhowtheheckIgotthatlucky), are we supposed to change diapers overnight?  I slap an overnight on her and don't touch it again until morning - dragging her butt out into the cold air doesn't seem conducive to sleep, and Mama likes her sleep which mean Baby needs to stay asleep.  Is this up for discussion?  Am I doing a questionable thing by letting her marinate in her own juices from 8pm until 7am?  I do wash her every day... 



Yup, thats bug :) Thanks...we think he's pretty cute!! Your DH works crazy hours!!! It is sad though when I get the "how's my baby I miss him" call every afternoon :( Must  be tough for you too though, being on baby duty all.the.time!!!!!

 

You have some serious sleep trauma...I'm glad DH is threr to help ground you. I'm sorry you went through that, hugs!!!

 

I will take you up on the offer for a pep talk :) Right now bug falls asleep in arms, either nursing or being bounced, and then in transfered to his swing. If he stops moving and I'm not next to \him he loses it...naps are few and far between around here though.

 

 

 

I say let her marinate!! We use non-talc powder in Kais diaper right before bed to help keep him dry but we almost never change him at night...thats a death wish :)

 

nak

 


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#20 of 20 Old 01-05-2012, 07:25 PM
 
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I'm here to pep talk!  I have also used a swing.  I started her schedule forming by putting her in the swing awake and letting her go to sleep.  The swing is still a method of last resort.  We've been taking a few steps backwards lately...  there have been some changes that I know she's perceived in some way, and she's been getting up earlier because I have been getting up earlier.  So far I'm "staying the course" - but I bought the Dr. Sears books on AP, discipline and sleep (used, from Amazon) and the one piece of advice I really took to heart was to go ahead and quit any failed experiments. 

You can do it!  You can get your little bug (love that nickname!) to sleep independently if he needs to.  You're smart, he's yours, and you'll figure it out!  I'd jump, like a cheerleader, but - ya'know, not quite 4 mos. postpartum, still not on board with the jumping. 

Our babes are about the same age - 09/2011.  Hang in there!  I hear it gets easier...  :-/

 

 


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