9 yr daughter crying all night!! WHAT THE HECK TO DO?? - Page 3 - Mothering Forums

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Old 08-02-2004, 04:01 AM
 
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welllll, the OP was a bit, um, worrisome, but ummm, sleep deprivation is such a nasty thing. I am at my worst when I am sleep deprived.

I think the crying is worrisome. I'm trying to remember being 9 years old, and yea, 9 year olds can be dramatic but this does seem extreme.

As others have said, i'd say making it clar that you are concerned, not angry, and doing what it takes to make space for her to express what she's afraid of should help. I really hope you're able to get to the bottom of it, both for you, for her, and the rest of the family.
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Old 08-02-2004, 04:38 AM
 
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(QUOTE) But I wouldnt doubt she is yelling at the child since it's very obvious that she is frustrated with the whole situation. Any parent would be if they were constantly woke up.

***Who here can say they have never yelled at their children? Geez..... I'm frustrated with my children quite a bit and I sometimes say things *to other adults* about how annoyed I am that I wouldn't say to my child! Seems like you're taking things from her post that weren't there.

But instead of *ignoring* the issue dont you think she should at least address it...maybe just maybe she would get some decent sleep if she did. Just my thought.[/QUOTE]
***Hello! She's not ignoring it. She's asking for help!

I haven't read all the posts here yet but all these "new members" with their critical posts is really irritating me.

LDSmomma, I'm sending positive thoughts your way. I don't really have any answers for you. My 9 year old has been crying a lot lately and seems very emotional but not at night. Good luck to you!

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Christie

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Old 08-02-2004, 05:33 AM
 
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When I was around 7-8, I started having terrible anxiety attacks about school, and I was afraid to talk to my mother about it because I thought she would be disappointed in me. We had a great relationship, but I was just unable to express those feelings verbally at that age.

Obviously something is weighing heavily on your daughter's heart. I would be very diligent in trying to think of who she has been in the presence of lately. If you can't think of anything that might have affected her personally, try to think of what might be going on in her circle of friends. Could she be worried about a friend in trouble or needing help?

I always found it easist to talk to my mother when we were alone in the car. Maybe you could ask some open-ended questions letting her know you will still love her no matter what...

In the meantime, have you tried letting her sleep on a pallet on the floor in your room? Maybe the change of scenery would help.

I hope both of you find some peace soon...
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Old 08-02-2004, 05:39 AM
 
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ldsmomma, the whole situation sounds awful. I think that an outside opinion is warranted (especially if you have talked to your DD about the issue and have tried relaxation methods, herbal teas etc without any improvements). Homeopathy can be really good for tackling the emotional aspects of a lack of 'balance' as well as any physical problems.


As an aside, I am an infrequent poster but regular lurker, and I was amazed to see so many new posters being so negative and unsupportive (is that a word? it looks wrong!). It wasn't at all what I have come to expect from mdc.
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Old 08-02-2004, 05:51 AM
 
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I would be totally concerned about her personal safety. Sometimes it's nothing, like a scary movie, etc. Other times it could be more serious.

I have a good friend who still has night issues because she was sexually abused at night by her father. I'm not saying that's what is going on here, but the magnitude could be as much.

I know that you'll listen to her. Just don't assume that she's doing this TO YOU. She needs you.
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Old 08-02-2004, 06:27 AM
 
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I have a 10 year old dd and lately there have been times when she comes into our room in the middle of the night crying. Sometimes she says she's lonely but usually she says she doesn't know why she's crying. I've chalked it up to puberty and on nights like that I let her climb in bed with us. She's usually comforted by that and fine the next day.
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Old 08-02-2004, 10:27 AM
 
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I started to read all the posts but they were getting pretty heated, so I skipped the rest. So my answers may be repeats...

My thoughts are:

she is hormonal - she is getting to the point in her life where her period could start - maybe her body is preparing and she is experiencing hormones and feeling she never has before

perhaps she has recently heard a brutal story or seen pictures or a movie - when I was young I had night after night of recurring AWFUL dreams that were triggered by things I had seen on tv or heard in the news. They may seem trivial to a parent, but as a young girl - I was mortified. My parents said that I would actually revert back to a small baby and that I would suck my thumb and curl up into a ball and rock while they tried to comfort my crying.

maybe she is being teased or bullied at school

maybe someone is abusing her
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Old 08-02-2004, 10:30 AM
 
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A friend's dd, my little sister, and dh all went through something like this between 7 and 9. My sister was so terrified that she wouldn't be able to fall asleep that she would keep herself up all night worrying about it. Dh thought that he would forget to breathe and would lay there monitoring his own every breath. It passed in all 3 cases but I don't think that the parents had anything to do w/ it. I don't have a 9yo yet - just know some people who used to be 9 - but maybe some kind of calming bedtime routine, the sleepytime tea was a good suggestion.
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Old 08-02-2004, 11:05 AM
 
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I'm sorry, I thought this was Mothering Dot Com, not Only-For-Perfect-Parents Dot Com. I think one or two of you are in the wrong place!

LDSmama, here are my thoughts...

I have an extremely emotionally sensitive 9 year old. If something hurts her feelings, she will oftentimes let it snowball to a two hour crying jag at night. She simply can't help it. This happens especially if she gets overly tired. She says she starts thinking of all the bad things that has ever happened to her, and she just gets so sad she can't do anything but cry. No amount of comfort, in any form, helps. If we try to comfort her by telling her all the good things that have happened to her, all the wonderful things we love about her, she just gets more upset. We can't physically lay down with her, as she has the top bunk and we would exceed the weight limit...

Oftentimes the only thing that works is to completely forget about bedtime (which is hard, since she shares a room with her younger sister, who will of course howl about how unfair it is the older one gets to get back up...). We give her papaya enzymes and acidophilus for her tummy (because if she cries so long, she always gets a stomach ache), and tummy mint or sleepy time tea. We tell her to go lay down in our bed, and depending upon what she wants, either one of us lays down with her, or we watch a movie with her. Sometimes she wants to take a bath with lavendar bath salts, so I will draw the bath, and then while she is in there (reading, usually) I will make her some sort of tea. Usually she calms down pretty quickly and goes to sleep then.

With our dd, it is totally hormonal/emotional. She can't even really articulate why she is freaking out. She herself oftentimes says she doesn't know why she is sad or scared or worried, and usually she has no idea what triggered it (other than being overly tired). She just is. It is extremely frustrating at times, and I can't imagine how completely frustrating it would be every night for two weeks in a row!

I second the idea of bringing someone else in. Why don't you sit down with her during the day, and ask her if she woudl like to talk to someone else about her night fears? Would she like to see the doctor; but don't make it out as if she is sick; rather tel her that alot of people go to the doctor to talk about their concerns and fears, and that doctors can be really good listeners. Then call the doc ahead of time and let them know what is going on, and that you expect the doc to be a good listener! If you have a ped who sucks at listening, though, I wouldn't even go this route.

Come up with some ideas about how to help her, and present them to her. Would a new sleeping arrangement help? Would a light help? Our kids have their own little battery operated lanterns in each bed; they don't shed light all over the room, but sort of emit a warm, contained glow. So if one girl has her light on, the other isn't disturbed by it. Would painting the room a different color help? Putting a lock on the closet door? Sleeping with the door open? Going to sleep in your bed, then being moved to her own bed? Sleeping with a sister, in the same bed? Sleeping in a sleeping bag on the floor of your room? Hanging a dream catcher near her bed? Having someone come and bless her room and her bed?

Good luck. I hope you can get to the bottom of this soon. In the mean time, I second the idea that you must get some sleep! Have a friend or grandma come over and watch the kids, put some ear plugs in, and get some sleep!

Let us know how it's going! Keep up the good work!

Lori
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Old 08-02-2004, 11:13 AM
 
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And, excuse me, but I can't find the trolly smilie. I find it interesting that Olive, Kenkenkay, and Whodatbe all are new members, who have nothing about them in their profile, who have only posted on this thread.

Jeez, just ignore them.
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Old 08-02-2004, 11:29 AM - Thread Starter
 
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First of all, I can't believe this has gone to 4 pages, and I haven't read them all. I was so stressed last night for not sleeping well again...that is why I posted. Maybe get the anger out in here??

She is scared. Period. If something else is wrong she won't tell me, or her dad or anyone else. I have a night light in her room, her door stays open, and she has a flashlight. She sleeps in the same bed with her 2 sisters (queen-size), and has never ever had a problem before. We talk during the day, and before bedtime about how there is nothing to be scared about, and we would never allow anything to happen to her, etc...

I do give my kids Dimetapp when my kids are sick with a cold. She knows it sometimes makes them tired and sleep better at night. BUT I HAVE NEVER given anything to them to help them sleep to just help them sleep. Where she has come up with something to help her sleep is beyond me, but since she is smart, maybe she thinks that if I gave her some, it would make her sleep? Maybe it would have calmed her down? Sure, I give it, but then she wants something the next time, and the next time... Maybe she saw the commercial on TV for Ambian (sleep medicine) that they are showing more and more on Nick, Jr. station even.

My children are happy children. We don't watch scary movies, we don't scary TV shows. Heck, she hates the Scoobie Doo scary movies. All I can think of is when she was with her cousins a few weeks ago, one of them said something scary or frightening to her.

I haven't even thought of taking her to a doctor. What type? Her pedi? I have never had this problem before.

I will admit, and I am typing this even though I know I will get bashed, I yelled at her last night after posting. I did. I was so upset. I had all the kids in bed, and she is crying louder and louder telling me she wants the medicine to help her sleep and she woke up Lindsey (6 months) and 2 yr old sister. It was close to 11pm. I was so upset. I yelled at her and told her to SHUT UP, AND STOP THE CRYING!!

I then got dressed. Got a crying Lindsey. And we both went to Walmart where I sat in the closed McD's where it was dark, and nursed Lindsey while I calmed down. Before I left, DH was like Where are you going?? I said I had to leave before I lost it.

I got home at midnight, and DD was asleep on the couch. 2 yr old was back to sleep, and I went back to bed nursing Lindsey for a few more minutes before she was out.

I feel so ashamed for yelling at her last night.
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Old 08-02-2004, 11:31 AM
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when i was 10, i had a very specific nightmare every night. in retrospect (and i still remember the nightmare in detail) it seems so silly, but it terrified me. and every night i left my bedroom in the basement of our house and went to my parents crying because i was so frightened. and i can still remember how frightened i was. they would tuck me in to a substitute bed on the couch in the living room by their bedroom and i would go back to sleep. i had a sister and i assume that i woke the entire family. i don't know why i had the nightmares; they had nothing to do with anything i had seen on television. here's how simple the nightmare was -- i would be looking out of my bedroom window up the hill in our backyard at dusk and there was a boy or man with curly hair waiting for me at the top of the hill and i was supposed to marry him. now how benign does that sound? but it terrified me. it still makes me nauseous thinking about it.

so i guess i'm saying that, for me, the reason didn't matter -- maybe it was hormones or night terrors or puberty -- it was just so so so scary that i remember it clearly after 30 years. my parents were there for me and they were loving, despite the fact that it happenned every night for a long, long time. sabrina's suggestion about the pallet in your room for her to sleep by you might help. i started sleeping through the night after my parents moved my sister closer to me (obviously, since your girls are already in the same room, this won't help - sorry).

all of this said, i'm still waiting anxiously for my 1 1/2 year old to sleep through the night. not sleeping is also really hard on the entire family.

good luck.
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Old 08-02-2004, 11:48 AM
 
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No bashing on my part, moms tend to be hard on themselves - as if perfection was a reality


You said she was asleep on the couch when you came back - so she CAN sleep - does your dh can tell you what she did before crashing ont the couch, how did she managed to fall asleep? This can give you some input as what to do as bedtime routine.

It's hard when we don't have a clue about our children's motivations... it can drives one crazy! I hope your family get rest soon!

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Old 08-02-2004, 11:52 AM
 
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LDSmomma6 - I'm sorry that this is happening to your dd. It is evidently hard for all of you. I hope whatever is disturbing your dd is resolved soon. It must be very hard for her...

When Amber goes to bed I put a cassette tape on for her after I read her a story. She used to complain about being afraid of the dark or of the shadows, but since I have started putting the story tapes on for her she hasn't said anything about being scared.

Perhaps what you could try is a change of routine at bedtime. Could she not fall asleep in your bed? Would the tape idea work for you too? Can she read in bed until she falls asleep? With 6 children I can imagine that changing routines can be hard.

Someone else mentioned a support system ... is there anyway that someone could help you with the kids during the day so you could get some rest?

Please dont beat yourself up - its pretty obvious that you are trying hard to get this problem solved. I hope you manage to find a solution soon. We are here for you if you need to vent mama!
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Old 08-02-2004, 11:58 AM
 
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all i can think of is that something is bothering her, and that is why she is not sleeping. in turn you can't sleep. so it is hard to parent with love and patience when you are tired. i can only tell you what i would do. i would talk to her pediatrician and then go from there. did she see a scary movie? if it were my kid i'd give her a dose of codein. that is the god's truth. so flame me but i'm a royal bitch when i can't sleep.
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Old 08-02-2004, 12:12 PM
 
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I remember when I was about that age, Michael Jackson's Thriller had just come out. I slept with the radio on, and some genious at the radio station thought it was a good idea to play it EVERY night at midnight. I would have the worst nightmares, and wake up terrified, and it took us weeks to figure out why. (the song was usually over by the time I woke up good)

Have you asked her specifically what goes through her head when she is scared? Is she scared of burgulars, monsters, people watching her, fire, etc..., or is it a general anxiety-type fear. I think it could very well be hormones. A weird thing I've noticed is that I am more prone to irrational fear when I am pregnant...go figure.

I would consider allowing her to talk to a counselor or even close adult friend that isn't in her immediate family. Does she keep a journal/diary?

I'm sure what you and her are going through is awful. We all have meltdowns with our kids, and this is an extremely frustrating situation for you. PM me if you want to, or if there is anything I can do to help. I will be praying for you.
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Old 08-02-2004, 12:15 PM
 
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LDSmamma, thank you for elaborating. It sounds like you've tried everything you can--now it's time to consider a dr. or a counselor. If this seems to have no obvious cause, she's begging for medicine to fall asleep, and it's disrupting your family, then it's serious enough to take to the next level.

There could be something going on physically or emotionally that she cannot articulate, and if so, she's trapped in a double horror--the fear she feels at night, and the horror of not knowing how to make it stop. As her parents, you and your DH need to find a way for her to resolve this--that's why so many have suggested a dr. or counselor. Because it's the next rational step.

I don't understand the bashing of the new members. None of them were overly judgmental or critical--they gave advice based on concern for the CHILD. LDSmamma's OP sounded harsh, and I think that new and long-time members came in with posts that addressed concern for the girl. Why dismiss new member advice that is EXACTLY the same as long-time member advice? Because it's new? We were all new once.
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Old 08-02-2004, 12:38 PM
 
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Mama I am so sorry! I know that has got to be one of the most frustrating events as a parent to deal with.... when a child of yours doesn't sleep and is unreasonable. I think all of us have been there at one point or another. Vent away, thats what we're here for.

I don't know whats going on with your dd but have you thought of giving her some rescue rememdy? or valarien root tea? or calms homeopathic? If shes asking for some 'sleep medicine' maybe giving her some of this will be like a placebo and help her?

I hope you/she figures out whats wrong. You both need a good night sleep and I hope you get that soon.
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Old 08-02-2004, 01:09 PM
 
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Hmmm.... Our thoughts create our reality....

It really sounds like she's trying to release some fear and can't figure out how to talk about it and/or how to let it go. I'd say work on ways to help her to talk about her feelings-all her feelings throughout the day and help her find words (and/or other ways) to identify/name her fears. So, I might try...

Maybe do some physical letting go ritual together - like writing down her worries (if she can name them) on a balloon or a piece of paper and then letting it go or burning it. If she can't name them right away, just have her write SCARED or draw a picture that shows how she feels. If that doesn't work, ask her to really "get into it" at some other time during the day. Ask her to scream, shout, cry, stomp/beat on a pillow, etc. and then talk about letting go and reassure her that all her feelings are acceptable and perfectly OK-they're just energy & feelings can't hurt her at all. They have no power except for what we choose to give them. Let her know it's actions that matter and have consequences - not feelings.

I would suspect she has to know what she's feeling before she's going to be able to let it go.

Maybe also try a warm bath followed by a relaxing Mommy massage - a calm reassuring touch might help her release the tension and might help her identify what she's feeling. Then practice letting go and follow up with some positive visualization - ask her to see herself relaxed, breathing calmly, letting go of any negative thoughts, help her develop some positive relaxing words that will help her to let go of her fears. Maybe develop a short mantra she can say quietly to help her fall asleep - maybe like "I am safe and strong."

That's how I see it (1) she's gotta figure out a way to express what she's feeling - whether it's with words or pictures or touch or something. (2) she's gotta figure out a way to let go of the negative energy that builds up inside and way to help herself feel safe enough to fall asleep.

HTH!! Good luck!
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Old 08-02-2004, 01:50 PM
 
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LDSMama Sleep deprivation can really take its toll. My worst moments are the result of a lack of sleep.

I don't know if you homeschool, but if not, perhaps she has some major anxiety about returning to school? I routinely missed the first day of school as a kid because I would get terrible migraines, even though I loved school.

I hope you get some answers.
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Old 08-02-2004, 01:54 PM
 
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When I was maybe a couple of years older than your dd, we were shown photographs of the Holocaust in school. I was horrified and scared. Our family Dr. gave me a very mild sleep sedative because I was afraid to go to sleep. I was ashamed to tell my parents what I was afraid of (not sure why). I only used a few of the pills, then I was able to sleep on my own.

Perhaps your dd is afraid to go to sleep. I agree with the poster who suggested asking her sisters. Maybe she has confided in them.

I would definately consider seeing a therapist who specializes in children, if things don't improve. Your dd sounds terrified.


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Old 08-02-2004, 02:22 PM
 
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She may need to talk to a counselor specializing in children- someone neutral who is not a parent or relative. There may be something that is bothering her and being nine she is uncomfortable talking to you about it.

I understand your frustration. Also, though this child needs someone in her corner who is not sleep deprived and can listen to her without judgement. I remember being 9/10/11- very tumultuous time and not able to talk to my mom.

There could also be something that happened that is more serious and she is ashamed about, seeing a counselor could help rule that out.

Good luck.

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Old 08-02-2004, 02:32 PM
 
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LDSmomma, I am going to try and say this nicely; but hon, you need some parenting classes asap.

When I was nine I had a mental breakdown and cried for weeks because I had/was being molested. My mother was compassionate and let me sleep with religious music playing. She never yelled at me to SHUT UP, she held me and talked to me. I STILL didn't ever tell her what went on and I eventually stopped crying.

I have a nine year old and if she cries over a stubbed toe I would hold her until the crying stopped. I would seek medical care if she didn't stop. That is my suggestion to you, to seek medical help.

Good gravy, why did you have a ton of kids if you just wanted them to SHUT UP!?
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Old 08-02-2004, 02:38 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DreamerMama
LDSmomma, I am going to try and say this nicely; but hon, you need some parenting classes asap.

When I was nine I had a mental breakdown and cried for weeks because I had/was being molested. My mother was compassionate and let me sleep with religious music playing. She never yelled at me to SHUT UP, she held me and talked to me. I STILL didn't ever tell her what went on and I eventually stopped crying.

I have a nine year old and if she cries over a stubbed toe I would hold her until the crying stopped. I would seek medical care if she didn't stop. That is my suggestion to you, to seek medical help.

Good gravy, why did you have a ton of kids if you just wanted them to SHUT UP!?
wow, it must be nice to have never lost your temper with your child. :

ugh.

c'mon, sleep deprivation makes people very cranky! don't be so nasty. it's one thing to lose your temper and yell at a child, it would be very different if she locked her in a closet or called her horrible names or hit her.

cut this mama some slack. I agree there is something really big going on with this girl, but you don't need to be so vicious.
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Old 08-02-2004, 02:45 PM
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can't get past page two

whether these members are 'trolls' are not they are right. The child needs help.
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Old 08-02-2004, 02:46 PM
 
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Quote:
I don't understand the bashing of the new members. None of them were overly judgmental or critical--they gave advice based on concern for the CHILD. LDSmamma's OP sounded harsh, and I think that new and long-time members came in with posts that addressed concern for the girl. Why dismiss new member advice that is EXACTLY the same as long-time member advice? Because it's new? We were all new once.
Yeah, well some of them where saying things that the OP never said.


Quote:
Good gravy, why did you have a ton of kids if you just wanted them to SHUT UP!?
That was plain rude! : I've yelled before, and I have 4 kids. Just because of this incident lately with her dd, that is causing her and the family lack of sleep, which can impair your judgment and make you grumpy, you are telling her she needs parenting classes and are questioning her reason for breeding?

Please, let me know when the perfect parenting classes start, I can't wait to join.

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Old 08-02-2004, 02:46 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LDSmomma6
... She is crying for no reason...
Children't don't cry every night for two weeks for no reason. If this were a nursing baby, would you still think she was crying for no reason? That you can't solve this by nursing her doesn't mean it's for "no reason." But I think you know that because then you wrote...

Quote:
Originally Posted by LDSmomma6
... Will not sleep. Says she is scared. Scared of what??...
She's scared and you don't know of what yet. That's not the same as "for no reason." In fact, it's the opposite of no reason.

I started having anxiety at night around 10 years old. Sometimes my parents tried to help me and other times I got told to just go back to bed, they didn't yell but they did speak sharply to me. I remember being so scared I couldn't sleep (&, yes, I was sleeping in with my sister) and I couldn't even articultate why.

If this were my child, I would not hesitate to take her to a child psychologist. Sometimes just one or two sessions with a compassionate, trained professional can be all the help a child needs.

I wish so much my parents had done that for me, I'm not exagerating when I say I think it could have changed my life (I still deal with periodic, unexplainable anxiety)
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Old 08-02-2004, 02:46 PM
 
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Yep, sleep deprivation does funny things to you...I have four kids so I guess I would know. I have yelled at my kids...I don't even pretend to be perfect. OTOH, I wouldn't let my child cry for two hours, let alone cry for two efing weeks! This is an AP site, right? We are supposed to be striving for an attachement to our child...any other person would get flamed to hell and back for posting something like this.

Mama needs slack???!!!! WTF!!??? Uh...I think the kid needs some slack. Who is going to stand up for this kid?
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Old 08-02-2004, 02:48 PM
 
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Yes dreamermama, but what are you going to accomplish in helping this mama help her dd by posting some thing as you did?

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Old 08-02-2004, 02:48 PM
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what's viscious? Sometimes when I am making questionable parenting choices I feel like a good honest talking to is a good thing. Honestly, did she post for hugs and support or advice? No one is being mean here. Just honest.

If a child is showing signs of being that disturbed, it's not beneficial for the mother to act like she's being a drama queen and disrupting the family.

I thought this was a sight for attachment parenting? AP goes beyond the ones in diapers. Sometimes it's a good idea for us to remind each other of that.
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