9 yr daughter crying all night!! WHAT THE HECK TO DO?? - Page 5 - Mothering Forums

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Old 08-02-2004, 04:14 PM
 
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Originally Posted by DreamerMama
LDSmomma, I am going to try and say this nicely; but hon, you need some parenting classes asap.
Good gravy, why did you have a ton of kids if you just wanted them to SHUT UP!?

UCK : posts like this are really making me feel sick..and to be honest your comments are not at all helping LDSmama, Out of curiosity just when did you become so all knowing and self righteous...

I guess I will bow down to you then , you must be the uber mom if you have never been sleep deprived or raised your voice at one of your kids..

UCK UCK!!!!!!
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Old 08-02-2004, 04:16 PM
 
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Sometimes it is hard to listen without judgement when a thread hits close to home. I find it very interesting that some of the snarkiest replies have come from people who later admit that similar things happened to them when they were young. Some felt neglected in large families, some felt needs were not met emotionally. I don't see how it is constructive to read your own autobiography into ldsmama's situation. This is apparent by the fact that people are assuming intentions and even quoting her as saying things that she never said. It is called projecting and it is harmful. That is an issue to take up in your own therapy session.

90% of the board doesn't seem to be critical of LDS mama. They seem to be trying to cushion the blow of the 10% who are trying to get back at lds mama for things their parents did to them.

In case it isn't painfully clear to all, she came asking for advise. She wouldn't have done so if she didn't think there was a possibility that her thinking wasn't clear.

Some have said that no one was overly judgemental!!! I believe she has been called cold, heartless, acused of having too many children...the list goes on.

Some have suggested therapy for her and her child. I hope a professional would be able to listen without judgement, avoid name calling, and offer some helpful advise. It's a shame that someone should have to pay for services that they should expect from their friends.

Thanks to all moms that offered support.

LDS mama...There is really some awesome advise here, once you sift through the negativity.
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Old 08-02-2004, 04:17 PM
 
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The first thing I thought after reading the OP was that bedtime rules might need to be relaxed right now. Then I read the post that said your daughter had fallen asleep on the couch while you were gone. That really led me to believe that the routine needs to change. Here are my thoughts.

I have a really hard time getting my brain to turn off when I need to go to sleep. I was this way when I was 9 and I’m still this way today.

The only way I can ever get to sleep is to distract myself. Generally this is either reading or watching tv. Sometimes I listen to the radio, but it has to be something with a thread to follow, not just music. I have to give my brain something to focus on other than my own thoughts. The best thing my parents did was just accept that this was true for me. At 9 I was allowed to have the radio on low or read as late I wanted. Sometimes I read until 2 or 3 in the morning, but most of the time I’d read for an hour and then fall asleep. My parents didn’t have to stay with me while I did this but that is what fit my personality.

Clearly something is bothering your daughter. The previous posters have given lots of suggestions on how to get to the root of the problem. Regardless, placing less focus on actually having to fall asleep might help your whole family get the rest they need.

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Old 08-02-2004, 04:21 PM
 
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wow, so many things to say about this thread...

but I'll restrain myself...

OK, on to the substance.

First off, I agree with the posters who say that this is something serious and that you need to figure out the cause. Sleeytime tea, etc. is all fine and dandy, but it is a band-aid at best for a serious issue.

that said, here are my thoughts:

1) Do you live in Utah? If so, has she been hearing news/ following the story about the Lori Hacking kidnapping/murder? (She was reported missing exactly two weeks ago today)

Have you been talking about it as a family? Are cousins/other kids/friends talking about it? The kidnapping/murder would be very, very scary for a kid. Either way. If she thinks that the woman was kidnapped, that's scary. If she thinks the woman was murdered by her husband...very scary. If I were 9 and I were thinking about it -- I'd be very scared. [ETA -- looks like the news just reported that they arrested Mark Hacking -- I guess the "kidnapping" story he told was untrue]

2) ITA with folks about the timing with the cousins' visit. You need to look into that.

3) the daily timing should be looked at too -- its bedtime when this happens. Either she is scared to sleep because she is having nightmares, or she is scared to sleep because she is afraid of what might happen while she is asleep (either to her or to others).

I know you probably know this already, but I really think it is important to not ignore this, and to not punish her for her feelings. something's wrong.

Sorry you are both going through this.

I hope this came across as it was intended (caring advice) and nothing else...
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Old 08-02-2004, 04:27 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Marsupialmuma
UCK : posts like this are really making me feel sick..and to be honest your comments are not at all helping LDSmama, Out of curiosity just when did you become so all knowing and self righteous...

I guess I will bow down to you then , you must be the uber mom if you have never been sleep deprived or raised your voice at one of your kids..

UCK UCK!!!!!!

It might do you some good to read the rest of my posts in this thread where I clarify and recant some of my remarks.
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Old 08-02-2004, 04:45 PM
 
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Originally Posted by chemigogo
But i urge you to ask God to help you lay down your resentment, and get wisdom from him on how best to help your child, who really does need you.
Thank you chemigogo, that post was so beautifully written, this part especially.
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Old 08-02-2004, 04:47 PM
 
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The one thing that jumped out at me.... She's 9 years old...is it possible that she just started her first period? I know that when I started (I was 11), I was afraid to tell anyone about it...I was upset and cried.

Also, there was the mention of a visit with the cousins. DEFINTELY investigate this.

What about school....maybe something happened there with a boy, or a friend, or a teacher...

Does she watch the news? The news nowadays is enough to scare the crud out of anyone...

Your daughter is scared...is there a favorite aunt or friend she can talk to?

~Brandon Michael (11/23/03), Jocelyn Lily Nữ (2/4/07, adopted 5/28/07 from Vietnam), Amelia Rylie (1/14/09), & Ryland Josef William (9/7/05-9/7/05 @ 41 wks). 
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Old 08-02-2004, 04:50 PM
 
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I just got off the phone with my SIL, my neice started her period at 8, (i thought she was 9).

Weeks before it happened, she lost her appetite, and didn't sleep well. Definatley some thing to look into.

She also said that her oldest step-dd went through a stage similar to what lds is speaking of with her dd, and they later found out it was caused by symptoms of IBS. Irritable bowel syndrom (sp?)

Geez, there is so much to think on here....just trying to shoot some more ideas on the thread.

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Old 08-02-2004, 04:50 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DreamerMama
Why do you feel need to quote me? I NEVER said what you are implying. Btw, it might do you some good to read the rest of my posts in this thread where I clarify and recant some of my remarks.

I quoted exactley what YOU wrote!!! please don't deny your own words.

I have read the WHOLE thread and was one of the first few posters on it last night when it started!!!!! thats why I am again following the thread today, this mom needs help not critisicm, and wholier than thou comments!

What lds needs to hear is that we are here, to listen to her and to help her bounce ideas around ..I thought the purpose of this forum was to lend an ear, and a place to vent outside of the real judgmental harsh world we all live in ..that is very often not alternative living or AP friendly.

I digress, but its important I think to step back and not cast stones when you have not walked a mile in her shoes..

I come to MDC because its supposed to be a safe haven really...or so I thought I vibrant community of eclectic thoughts..If I wanted to read and participate in common flaming/troll threads geez I could sit around at all other other online parenting forums.

Back to LDS mom!

I agree that rescue remedy is a fabulous idea! I have used this with much success on my preteen, in addition we go through times where she has a tummy ache..or a back ache or just plain insomnia...all of these are of course stemming from the reason that she just does not want to sleep! I have also seen her "melt down" at night..if she has had alot go on during the day she can just start to cry for seemingly no reason.

Its never an absolute..often its more of a shot in the dark this can be a very interesting age with young womyn!! I am also really agreeing with alot of the posters who felt it might be something related to hormones..they can do weird things to us you know! LOL

In the end I would trust your instinct and gut more than any outside advice you get..only YOU know your child..and this may well be a variation of normal preteen behaviour! if you sense its more than that..then follow that, but dont make anybody here make you feel like less of a mom because of whats going on, and dont make anyone here pressure you into seeking outside assistance if you really truly are not into that sort of thing.

I really do wish you well..parenting is such an interesting journey! and having 8 kiddos myself I know FULL well the trials and tribulations of the large family.
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Old 08-02-2004, 04:56 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DreamerMama
It might do you some good to read the rest of my posts in this thread where I clarify and recant some of my remarks.

Hmm why did you edit this post after my post quoting what was originally in here?

*shaking head*
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Old 08-02-2004, 04:58 PM
 
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edited. I don't want to have this inane conversation with someone who can't bother to read an apology.
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Old 08-02-2004, 04:59 PM
 
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*
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Old 08-02-2004, 05:00 PM
 
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I am sorry to hear that your daughter has been crying for awhile already. I hope you can find out why , so it can help you both sleep. Good Luck
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Old 08-02-2004, 05:03 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DreamerMama
Now, pissoff.
Wow! how articulate of you

I have one better! but I wont give you the pleasure of telling you what you probably already know you are

Have a great one!
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Old 08-02-2004, 05:04 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Marsupialmuma
Hmm why did you edit this post after my post quoting what was originally in here?

*shaking head*
Ok, I'm going to play nice. There is a little thing called time delay. I edited because it didn't say what I meant it to say. Good enough?
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Old 08-02-2004, 05:06 PM
 
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Originally Posted by DreamerMama
Ok, I'm going to play nice. There is a little thing called time delay. I edited because it didn't say what I meant it to say. Good enough?
No further comments needed.

This is getting away from the support and help LDS mama really needs right now
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Old 08-02-2004, 05:07 PM
 
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Old 08-02-2004, 05:08 PM
 
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Ok LDS....I made a comment up there...a really nice one with some possibilities. It is going to get lost in the snarkiness, I'm sure. I'm sorry if any of my comments were repeats...I chose not to read pages 2- 6 because it was snark after snark and I really just wanted to offer support. So, please go up a couple posts and my ideas are up there.

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Old 08-02-2004, 05:09 PM
 
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Come on, for Goodness sake, get off of her thread. If all you can do is try to have a pissing contest, go somewhere else. DreamerMama, you obviously are angered and upset. Don't take it out on the OP and hijack her thread. She has a real issue and she's turned here for support. IF you can't be constructive and respectful, then leave it alone.
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Old 08-02-2004, 05:10 PM
 
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If she is anything like I was at that age, she just doesn't know *what* is wrong, but the whole world is just wrong. I cried myself to sleep almost every night for a couple of years as a pre-teen. I was suicidal many times and my mom, as irritated and hard as it was for her sat by my side, rubbing my back, and told me over and over again how important I was to her, how much she loved me, and things along those lines. Even as an adult when I feel overwhelmed I can close my eyes and hear those words. Those are the kind of words you want her to hear in your head the rest of her life.

It is likely she is pre-mentral or mentral, and much like peri-menopause, the hormones are out of balance and cause feelings and emotions she has no experience handling.

If she has a stomach ache, it could be cramps, post-nasal drip (sometimes my allergies are mild enough they don't really bother me during the day, but when I lay down I feel like throwing up), or any number of diseases that cause discomfort. If she has physical symptoms, take her to a dr. and keep taking her until you get somebody that takes her seriously. My mom, in her late 50s now, is still angry that nobody took her pain seriously when she was a child. When I had pain, she literally kept taking me to drs. until somebody listened. The positive effect of her taking me seriously extends far beyond just helping me with my pain and helps me to know I am worth taking care of. (btw...I was dx with endo at 13yo)

I would recommend that you take her to a dr. and make sure there isn't something wrong. Sit down with her and make a plan...get a pm yoga tape, relaxing music, warm bath, visualization, sleepytime tea, or just rubbing her back or singing to her, or holding her hand while she cries...anything is going to be an improvement at this point. These are the last precious years where she is still a kid, she might just need to know that you are still there for her and love her as much as the little kids that I suspect require more immediate attention. Insecurity is such a large part of being a pre-teen and since they are so close to being independent, I think it is hard to remember that they are still kids.

I do feel for the sleep deprivation though...it really screws with your emotions, especially if it hits you at the wrong time of the month.

As hard as this is for you, and it is hard, it is a thousand times worse for your daughter because she simply doesn't have the insight and coping skills that come with age.

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Old 08-02-2004, 05:13 PM
 
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These are the last precious years where she is still a kid, she might just need to know that you are still there for her and love her as much as the little kids that I suspect require more immediate attention.
So true!

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Old 08-02-2004, 05:20 PM
 
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I think it's pretty nasty of everyone to have picked apart DreamerMama's first post to this thread based on one emotional sentence when everyone is defending controversial statements made by ldsmomm6 in emotion. So what, she said something snarky and then apologized for it. Since then everyone has been antagonizing her. No wonder she said pissoff.

I don't think I have a place to judge here, but the OP was very troublesome for me. I too read that ldsmomma was only worried about getting sleep and basically getting her kid to shut up when I think there is a serious problem. I was a very sleep disordered child and I needed my mom in with me sometimes all night and I know she didnt' get sleep.

I realize you have 6 kids ldsmomma. I know it's hard, I can only imagine. Every one of your children needs the love and attention an only child gets. Can you ask a family member to help out while you get extra sleep to make up for your nights? I think something is seriously, seriously wrong for your dd. Try to put aside your frustration and feel compassion for her. She is a little girl and she can't process things the way you can. I'm sure sleep deprivation is affecting everyone, but this also includes her and compounds her scary situation. I think a counselor would be a big help here. I hope things improve for you.
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Old 08-02-2004, 05:24 PM
 
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LDSMomma- Have you had any progress in finding out why DD is so scared?

I am sorry that your thread turned into this. There are lots of mammas who offered some good advice if you can bare to read through all of this.
I hope that you and your family get through this.
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Old 08-02-2004, 05:25 PM
 
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One thing that strikes me.. she will sleep on the couch... Maybe something in the room is frightening. Or maybe one of the siblings she shares a bed with is scaring her. Maybe she is ready for her own bed...
Rescue rememdy is good.
I'd consult an ND or homeopath before giving anything you aren't familiar with ... and bedtime tea rocks.

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Old 08-02-2004, 05:32 PM
 
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Bedtime tea may be a good response for the immediate future, but I think there is something big going on and it needs to be addressed right away. If thinking homeopathically, this tea will mask symptoms (screaming, lack of sleep,) and then the true cause will be overlooked. That would be a fear for me.
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Old 08-02-2004, 05:43 PM
 
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OK, I feel like I must have missed something, maybe that was edited out? But here is what I would do:

Ask her what she is afraid of. Ask her what I could do to help out with this fear. Do not assume there is nothing to be afraid of - usually people are afraid because something scary is happening to them, even if it's not scary to other people.

If she could not tell me, I'd ask her if she could think of anyone she could tell, or if she would like me to help her find someone to talk to.

If she wanted to look into some kind of temporary sleep medicine, I'd consider it after talking to her ped, but only if the child actually wanted it. I'd never suggest it myself, or sneak it into her food or whatever.

If a kid is acting in a way to get attention, I believe it is because they are not getting enough attention. I'd give her the attention she needs, not ignore her in an attempt to teach her not to ask for attention.

That poor kid. Being scared sucks.
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Old 08-02-2004, 05:45 PM
 
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ITA. I think that in the short term, getting some sleep will help the whole family deal with this rationally. So maybe some resuce rememdy, or bedtime tea, while the true cause of the upset is found out. If you're not sleeping, you can't heal.

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Old 08-02-2004, 06:00 PM
 
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LDS - I am sorry you are going through this. IF you have a church you frequent, is there someone close there she can talk to? What about a close Aunt? I know my oldest Niece bounces her ideas off of me!

I also agree about having her write the problem down and either having a balloon take it away, OR burn it outside.

HTH
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Old 08-02-2004, 06:14 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Ok, I am almost crying at some of the rude comments made about this, but I guess I deserve it because I have been rude more than once before to people.

Let me clarify something though, and I should have said it at the very beginning. She has been crying/whinning for almost 2 weeks at bedtime. Most of the time she goes right to sleep. It's when she wakes up during the night, that she will cry and whine and say she is scared. Last night was the worse I have seen since this all started, before bedtime. She will stand over me in my bedroom or stand in the hallway and just whine. Last night she never woke back up, and she slept the whole night on the couch. I seriously don't think any sexual abuse is going on like someone suggested. We have talked about if something is going on like that. I talked with her this morning about being scared, and asked her to tell me what is wrong. She says she is just scared. I asked if it was something a cousin said, or a friend said, or something she has seen on TV. No, no, no. I asked her if she felt like she needed to go see Dr. ** and talk about it there. No she said. DH did say though that I need to probably take her in anyways.

I do remember being scared when I was about 10. I went to a friends' house and her dad was watching Dracula on Showtime (back in 1980). It freaked me out!! Almost 3 years I prayed every night that Dracula wouldn't come through my window to get me. Maybe she did see something on TV that freaked her out. I know she has seen that new movie commercials "The Village". Heck, that has freaked me out!! We have told her about real and non-real, and how this movie is not real, etc... Who knows!! We don't watch alot of TV, but sometimes DH will watch it before kids go to bed, and just some of the commercials are scary. I know that oldest DS was scared to death of Jurastic Park. Got us up a few times to make us assure him that dinosaurs were not going to come get him. Whatever she is a scared of, she isn't telling. I do like the idea that someone suggested about her drawing what she is scared of. I've seen it done on Law & Order.

As for me having children to yell at? Give me a break!! I love my children. I would do anything for them. And if it means to take her to the doctor then I will, as you suggested and DH suggested. I also told her since she did so well sleeping on the couch last night, then she could do it again tonight, but in her bed. But, if she wants the couch, then fine. I will let her sleep there. As to yelling...I was yelled at as a kid. I have posted about that before. My mom was a yeller. I remember how mean she was to us. I am so not like her, and how I yelled last night was nothing with what my mom used do and say to us. I was always called "you little sh*t." I have never said that word out loud ever to my children. Ask my children, ask my DH. Only swear word I ever say is da**it, and since posting about the whole soap issue awhile back, I have been trying very very very very hard not to swear, and I have been doing a good job. My children are happy, my children are sweet, my children are the joy of my life.

I hope this is going to end soon. When 2 yr old had her tonsils out back in May, she was so miserable, and would only sleep on the couch. But, then it became a habit, but she eventually went back to her comfortable bed. I hope my 9 yr old will do. I have already apologized to her for yelling her last night, and she said she is going to not cry tonight before bed. Oh, and she did sleep the whole night without crying one time on Saturday night, so I thought we had overcome it, but then last night...

Thank you for all your nice replies. I love coming here to get great advice. You have helped me in the past, and offered great advice when I was to give up breastfeeding #6 because of the awful infection I had on my right side for almost 4 months. But, today, Lindsey is 6 months old, and I haven't had to express milk for about a month, and she is nursing great on that side, and it's not hurting anymore. I will always be greatful for you nice momma's who love to help. And again, I am sorry for offending anyone in the past. I am trying to be better.
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Old 08-02-2004, 06:16 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jessica36
LDS - What about a close Aunt? I know my oldest Niece bounces her ideas off of me!
My sister lives close by, and she is going to help her too at night.
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