What are we all doing wrong? - Page 3 - Mothering Forums

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#61 of 90 Old 05-05-2005, 01:45 PM
 
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Originally Posted by mama24-7
Yes, I'm going to yell: NURSING IS MORE THAN JUST FOOD.

Where is that diving right in smiley?

This is of course true, and I say that as a mama of a 13 m.o. constant nurser. He eats a lot of table food, but still nurses 6-8 times during the day, and 3-4 times at night (on a good night).

BUT, is it really a horrible thing to try to give our Dear Children that same comfort without giving them the breast? I don't think so, though I'm still struggling with how to do it without causing my DS to become too upset.

speaking of which, he is ready to nurse now.

Ta
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#62 of 90 Old 05-05-2005, 01:46 PM
 
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I completely agree with Julie (PP), sleep has SO much to do with temperment. For this reason, when I see my best friend's baby who is two weeks younger than my baby sleep 11 straight uninterrupted hours, yet mine will sleep no more than 2 or 3 at a time, I feel somewhat consoled. Her baby only recently rolled over (at 7 months), is happy laying on the floor for long periods of time, and is generally much more mellow. Mine, on the other hand, is a little fireball.

Also, I don't honestly think that my DH wakes thinking, "Hmmm.... where are the nurses?" I think he wakes thinking, "Argh! My teeth!! Why did I wake up?" And it's my choice to help him get back to sleep. Sometimes I try to pat his back, change his position, etc. Most times I nurse him. But he won't always have that... so sometimes I rock him. My DH is great. He says, "It's not his fault he wakes up. He's just a baby. All we can do is take care of him." And it's true. I might change how I take care of him if I can't handle certain ways anymore, but basically I will take care of my little fireball, and yes, it might be harder than if I had a more mellow baby. All children have different needs -- some are extremely high-need and some are more mellow.

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#63 of 90 Old 05-05-2005, 02:15 PM
 
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Originally Posted by AugustineM

Also, I don't honestly think that my DH wakes thinking, "Hmmm.... where are the nurses?"
LOL... I'm going to assume you mean ds, lol. Well, enjoy that thought now because when they are toddlers they DO wake up thinking "where are the nursies?" Stella is 17 months and she wakes, cries, and clearly asks to nurse several times a night.

My advice to anyone considering night weaning would be to try it before their baby is old enough to be thinking "where are the nursies."

Amy: Certified Professional Midwife and mom to Max (11) and Stella (6).
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#64 of 90 Old 05-05-2005, 02:49 PM
 
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Originally Posted by mama24-7
There is a reason why the British call a pacifier a "dummy." I personally don't want my child(ren) to rely on a piece of plastic (blankie, lovey, etc.) for comfort. I want my children to grow up relying on people not things.

And for the health risks of pacifiers, refer to the article in the latest MOthering about bottle use. Pacifiers aren't much better. (DIsclaimer-I know that there are plenty of mothers who need to use bottles for expressed milk, can't BF for various reasons, etc.)

That's all for now.
Sus
Well Sus, I am glad you got it down so perfectly that you have to be critical of other mothers. Sorry, while I think there can be problems with pacifier use, used in moderation -- I do not think there is anything wrong with them at all -- emotionally or physically for a child. I've seen more children that maipulated mothers and had discipline issues due to being on moms boob all the time, than those parents who use a pacifier. I just read the Happiest Baby on The Block and I think what he describes in his book about pacifier use was right on -- and he is pro-breastfeeding, pro-cosleeping, and pro-ap parenting.
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#65 of 90 Old 05-05-2005, 02:54 PM
 
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Originally Posted by OnTheFence
I've seen more children that maipulated mothers and had discipline issues due to being on moms boob all the time, than those parents who use a pacifier.

Please elaborate...

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#66 of 90 Old 05-05-2005, 02:56 PM
 
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Originally Posted by Mama Rana
BUT, is it really a horrible thing to try to give our Dear Children that same comfort without giving them the breast? I don't think so, though I'm still struggling with how to do it without causing my DS to become too upset.

Ta

No, its not horrible. In fact I think it is good for them. Your breasts are not always going to be available, they need other comfort items other than breasts. Women should be able to leave their children in someone elses care and be able to be comforted, and even fall asleep for that matter. It will not kill them. I think a lot of NFL/AP moms and communities have gone to such extremes, and have this idea that anything other than the extreme will damage their kids. I used to feel this same way -- I've over it because I know that night weaning, pacifier use, or helping your child to fall asleep at night in your bed or their own bed is not going to "scar" them or cause them to grow up to be murderers.
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#67 of 90 Old 05-05-2005, 03:09 PM
 
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Originally Posted by Angierae
Please elaborate...
Okay, I will get to manners.

I've belonged to food coops, playgroups, and gone to LLL meetings with the crunchy moms - I was one of them, but I saw children with no discipline. When their mothers tried to talk to other moms, they would pester, interrupt, try to pull their shirts off to take the breast -- these children were not hungry, they didn't need comfort -- they just wanted to get their mother's attention so she couldn't have attention anywhere else. These children are old enough to know boundaries and what rudeness is. I would see kids be disciplined by their mothers, and the moment they would get in trouble, they would start crying for the breast. These kids didn't need to suck on a boob, they just wanted to divert attention from their wrong doing or what mom was trying to discipline them about. Toddlers aren't stupid.
I've had many of conversations with friends on the phone and my aunt, who breastfed toddlers and the moment the phone rang -- the child would begin to harass the mother to nurse until she gave in to be able to talk just five minutes. I babysat for my aunt for short periods of time when her child was a toddler( and this child weighed over 30lbs, ate full course meals, drank water and juice) and the whole time the child would "Cry" to nurse, tantrums would follow until my aunt came home -- she acted like a brat - and she was not deprived in anyway. She would also pull the same stunts when my aunt and uncle would just try to talk, snuggle on the sofa, or show any affection to one another she would demand to be nursesd.
Now I breastfed toddlers, but after seeing the above I definitely set limits -- healthy boundaries.
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#68 of 90 Old 05-05-2005, 03:58 PM
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There are plenty of times I wish I had something in my breast for my son because instinctually I know it would calm him the very best way. But, since he was sucking on an empty boob for a while and knows he won't get anything he's not interested. But I do understand the need for comforting in that way.

I have a friend, her daughter self weined at 18 months right before her baby brother was born. My friend was upset because she really wanted to tandem nurse. (I think she wanted to do it for her to say she could and did, for mom, not babe) She said she tried to get her daughter to latch on again because she knew moo-juice would be a great comfort to her. Her daughter wasn't interested. Her daughter was dealing with her emotions herself. I think that's a great lesson to learn from a babe.
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#69 of 90 Old 05-05-2005, 04:07 PM
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Originally Posted by mama24-7
I want my children to grow up relying on people not things.

They also need to rely on themsleves.

Yes, I'm going to yell: NURSING IS MORE THAN JUST FOOD.

It is, but those who can't nurse can fill those needs or voids in other ways and they are extremely valid and effective.


The real problem which a few PP's touched on was the lack of a support system in our society. I don't think we were meant to live in singl family homes, close or not to each other, w/ just our spouse & children. I think that extended families living in close proximity would help a lot of this.

Unless of course you have a horrible family you wouldn't want to live near that could do more harm then good.
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#70 of 90 Old 05-05-2005, 04:35 PM
 
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Wow... there are some pretty unfair generalizations about nursing moms in this thread... everything from our true motivations to why our children misbehave. I'm naking (dd must be bored) or I would elaborate on why it's OK to bash breastfeeders but not artifical breastmilk feeders...

Amy: Certified Professional Midwife and mom to Max (11) and Stella (6).
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#71 of 90 Old 05-05-2005, 04:54 PM
 
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Originally Posted by OnTheFence
Well Sus, I am glad you got it down so perfectly that you have to be critical of other mothers.
You're amazing! I'm so annonyed by this I can't even think of what I want to say!!! :

No, I'm not perfect and I said what I wanted for my own children and there are lots of places that you can find that the British call them dummies .

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Originally Posted by vICTORIA
Originally Posted by mama24-7
I want my children to grow up relying on people not things.

They also need to rely on themsleves.
Yes but how will they learn if they are first taught to rely on a thing? Pacifiers are not the only culprits in this arena.

No, pacifiers are not the devil. But many people rely on them for a long time so that when the doctor or dentist tells them they have to get rid of it, there has been harm done and/or the parent decides to go cold-turkey and removes it w/o replacing it w/ some kind of comforting. I've heard too mnay stories from main stream mamas who do it this way to think that they are good.

None of what I said was personal but it's amazing how some people have to guts to make it that way.

Baby the babies while they're babies so they don't need babying for a lifetime.
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#72 of 90 Old 05-05-2005, 05:02 PM
 
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Originally Posted by Sheena
Wow... there are some pretty unfair generalizations about nursing moms in this thread... everything from our true motivations to why our children misbehave. I'm naking (dd must be bored) or I would elaborate on why it's OK to bash breastfeeders but not artifical breastmilk feeders...
I am a nursing mom. I stick by my comments. I have nursed two children past a year old, and coslept with them for that matter. I didn't bash breastfeeders, I commented on how some have not set healthy boundaries or have poor discipline with their children. Someone asked me, I told.
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#73 of 90 Old 05-05-2005, 05:23 PM
 
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regardless... your claims that the LLL women's children are ill-behaved as a result of on demand nursing is not fact based, it's your opinion. Could it not be possible that the women did not have a firm grasp on positive discipline? I don't care if you are a bfer... your generalization is unfair.

Amy: Certified Professional Midwife and mom to Max (11) and Stella (6).
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#74 of 90 Old 05-05-2005, 06:41 PM
 
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Originally Posted by Sheena
regardless... your claims that the LLL women's children are ill-behaved as a result of on demand nursing is not fact based, it's your opinion. Could it not be possible that the women did not have a firm grasp on positive discipline? I don't care if you are a bfer... your generalization is unfair.
It wasn't demand nursing. These children DIDNT NEED TO NURSE -- they were using the nursing relationship to either distract from discipline, be the center of their mothers world, or/and being down right selfish. These children had no limits. Toddlers and preschoolers can understand limits. I wouldn't allow my child to interupt my conversation, much less to nurse, just because they wanted too. It wasn't like these children were infants, they were walking, talking, eating solid food, drinking from sports drink cups children. I didn't say this about all people who have breastfed, but I have found this problem to be more prevelant among those who really push the extended nursing relationships and who have this notion you should always stick a boob in a child's mouth when they want it.

On another note, I think many of these women would say they did have a firm grasp on positive discipline. But thats another story.
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#75 of 90 Old 05-05-2005, 09:17 PM
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I think everybody feels very strongly about their personal parenting choices. It's very easy to take what others say personally. Let's try to remember this is a discussion. We're not trying to rip anyone apart. We're simply trying to make our points of view known. I know I feel attacked sometimes and most likely, the person didn't mean to attack. By letting others know how we feel we allow outselves to open up even more and maybe by doing this in just small ways it will add to the universal consciousness of understanding each other and trying to work together for good.

Swissmiss, I hope you don't feel alone and some of what has been said here is helping.
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#76 of 90 Old 05-06-2005, 08:17 AM
 
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Wow. I am just enjoying soaking in all of the posts. Such great insight. I am new here and am glad that I found a forum that is this intersting. We co-sleep. I will save that post for later..... I went though this issues with my son who is now 3yo. I HAD to night wean as well b/c I was just too tired. His nursing was rediculous. I likened it to sleeping next to the fridge. If it was loaded with yummy food, wouldn't you be up all night snacking? mmmmmm chocolate icream......I was a WOH mom trying to do the best I could and the night nursing drained me emotionally and physically. The stress was unbelievable. No, there isn't much support out there in our commnunities for co-sleepers. I couldn't talk to my family or co-workers b/c they would not understand or would say "Get that baby out of your bed". i am glad this forum exists. Also The animal observations are dead on. In the wild, mothers brush off young to go on with survial activities. I think that we are so highly eveloved that we ignore some of these instincts because we are so emotionally invoved/invested with our children. There is no real need to nurse through the night, unless your child is a newbie or has special needs.If it interferes with your survival and ability to parent, perhaps it should be cut down to a minimum. I loved the post that stated the arrogance of Dr. Sears. He overlooks a lot of issues : . i think he sets mammas up for ap failure sometimes. i felt like it. One would think his wife would have leaned on him a little more as not to paint this idealic picture that does not exist with real life ap.

pam
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#77 of 90 Old 05-06-2005, 08:37 AM - Thread Starter
 
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Originally Posted by Mizelenius

Can you sleep through (most) nursing sessions? I can't...

.
Neither can I, and I'm noticing that it's the acrobatic nursing, switching sides, as well as the "belly-button jam", as I call it (with his little fingers) that really annoy me. In the end, I will survive, and the most important (and strange) thing is that DS is sleeping through all of this--seriously! He doesn't really wake up until about 4am, and then a bottle puts him back to sleep for a couple of hours (used to be longer, but...). I guess he is just one of those with an active body/mind at night (I've seen him sit up, then go back to sleep, and once he even sleep-walked) and I should be happy that he's thriving during the day.
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#78 of 90 Old 05-06-2005, 09:12 AM
 
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I really can't believe that so many Mommas on this thread are stating what other children "need" and "don't need". How is it possible for ANYONE to know what another child may "need" during the night, emotionally or physically? I really thought that MDC was a place where night nursing and co-sleeping was SUPPORTED. Wow, even the AP board on Babycenter is more supportive. This board is surprisingly mainstream.
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#79 of 90 Old 05-06-2005, 09:57 AM
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Originally Posted by APmomma
I really can't believe that so many Mommas on this thread are stating what other children "need" and "don't need". How is it possible for ANYONE to know what another child may "need" during the night, emotionally or physically? I really thought that MDC was a place where night nursing and co-sleeping was SUPPORTED. Wow, even the AP board on Babycenter is more supportive. This board is surprisingly mainstream.
It's not not MDC isn't supportive. I think it is. Unfortunately it's difficult to find a whole group of people who think exactly like you. I thought I would find that when I came to MCD but I didn't. I never realized how vast AP can be. I think the positive and the negative on this thread can be helpful to the mom who started the thread. APmomma, do what you want. I'm all for free choice. I have nothing negative to say about how your personal choices effect your life. I can share my experiences, thought and opinions and that provides healing for me and possibly other people. By listening to others to the same it all changes for me and I can grow and become a better person and mom. That is a supportive environment. If a mom is having problems with night nursing it can also be supportive to let her know she doesn't have to do it and it's OK. Or, if co-sleeping isn't working, not doing that can be OK too. AP isn't, or shouldn't be a life or death religion.
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#80 of 90 Old 05-06-2005, 10:01 AM
 
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Originally Posted by APmomma
I really can't believe that so many Mommas on this thread are stating what other children "need" and "don't need". How is it possible for ANYONE to know what another child may "need" during the night, emotionally or physically? I really thought that MDC was a place where night nursing and co-sleeping was SUPPORTED. Wow, even the AP board on Babycenter is more supportive. This board is surprisingly mainstream.
Isn't there a difference between support and then setting mom's up to be gluttant for punishment. I think Pam was right when she said that Dr. Sears sets women up to fail in many ways. It's not that hard to study child development -- really -- and while it doesn't speak to all children, I think for the most part, research on child hood behavior, development, sleep and eating patterns is pretty right on. No one on here is saying sleep train your six week old, or not to cosleep or night nurse --- I am simply saying that older babies/toddlers CAN and DO have the ability to sleep six plus hours a night once they developmentally rech a certain stage. Children can learn to self soothe without a breast in their mouth, and that many older nurslings are not nursing at night to "eat". Now if you and your child are having a wonderful arrangement -- good for you, go for it. I'm not one to stop you. But in the past nine years I have seen far too many mommas going to the extreme, hurting themselves and their children because they are a slave to an ideal.
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#81 of 90 Old 05-06-2005, 01:02 PM
 
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Originally Posted by Vicitoria
It's not not MDC isn't supportive. I think it is. Unfortunately it's difficult to find a whole group of people who think exactly like you. I thought I would find that when I came to MCD but I didn't. I never realized how vast AP can be. I think the positive and the negative on this thread can be helpful to the mom who started the thread. APmomma, do what you want. I'm all for free choice. I have nothing negative to say about how your personal choices effect your life. I can share my experiences, thought and opinions and that provides healing for me and possibly other people. By listening to others to the same it all changes for me and I can grow and become a better person and mom. That is a supportive environment. If a mom is having problems with night nursing it can also be supportive to let her know she doesn't have to do it and it's OK. Or, if co-sleeping isn't working, not doing that can be OK too. AP isn't, or shouldn't be a life or death religion.

What you described IS a supportive environment. Listening to others and learning about different opinions and situations definetly has made me a better mother and I have learned a lot. This however is not what I am seeing on this thread. There are broad generalizations and an overall attitude of "my way is better". It's the same kind of crap you read on mainstream boards, just a little tiny bit sugar-coated. Basically, this thread is saying in one way or another that older children nursing are "manipulative" don't have "manners", most come from families with "discipline issues", they have "bad sleep habits". I mean, come on. How are comments like that the kind of comments that anyone can "learn" from. There is a big difference between learning about different AP approaches (including night-weaning, etc. Believe me, I am by no means a "die hard" AP follower. We all make our own modifications. By dd is NOT always soothed by a breast. Far from it. She is disciplined, she has to cry sometimes) and just reading negetive opinions directed toward different AP practices. It's just the overall negetive tone that is disappointing to see.
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#82 of 90 Old 05-06-2005, 01:20 PM
 
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In amongst the tangle of who should and shouldn't do what I don't think anyone has said

'This too will pass'

Some parts of parenting are difficult and some things that little people do are incredibly irritating but now that my eldest is nearly 12 I realise how true those words are. For a while he was doing so many things that were driving me crazy, then those would resolve themselves and another irk would arrive. Over time I have adjusted my expectations and my tolerance of what I now consider to be minor things and am safe in the knowledge that things will change - that is the nature of life.

When I was considering night weaning I read an article (can't remember where) about children still needing/wanting (does it matter which? they are small for such a short time) the same amount of physical nurturing during any 24 hour period regardless of how much time they chose to spend rushing around doing their own thing during the day.

This resonated with me. I was slinging dd as we have not used a pushchair so we were close for long stretches of the day. I was feeding her too but her feeds were getting shorter and more efficient. She was a busy little thing and always off investgating something or playing with her brothers. She still wanted the same amount of closeness so was feeding more in the night to balance her needs.

So I'll say it again 'This too will pass'. You can choose one of 2 roads; hold out til it passes or do something about it. Such is life. I am sorry to say that I have no answers just thoughts on different perspectives and best wishes to you all. Try not to get too 'punchy' as we say here in England.
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#83 of 90 Old 05-06-2005, 01:43 PM
 
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As my DH put it in those early weeks, "it's not cosleeping if noone's sleeping!" :LOL

I tried really hard to "push" cosleeping on my family, but it just didn't work for us. DD sleeps a million times better in her mini cosleeper, which we've set up like a bassinet next to the bed. But this is not to bash cosleeping or say it doesn't work - I'm just saying it didn't work for us!

Every baby is different and has different needs - if I try to put DD down next to me she thrashes and whimpers constantly, waking up every hour or more. In her cosleeper she's like a log and gets a good 7-8 hr stretch. That's just who she is... she's a baby that likes her space - and likes her sleep. I've come to accept that even though it violates what I envisioned as my "ideal" parenting setup.

But so much of the way I would "ideally" parent has gone out the window. Becoming a parent has taught me so much humility and flexibility, and that even the youngest babies have such amazing personalities and preferences. I think the single most important thing you can do is follow your own child's cues, whatever they may be.

This is another thread entirely... but I'm suprised that the debate is always cosleeping vs. CIO. Like there is no inbetween. People talk about the family bed, but never about the family bedROOM as we have. When DD outgrows her cosleeper we'll probably get a crib... which will go in our room with us. We never ever CIO, but we don't cosleep either. I wonder if that is rare, or just somehow not part of the debate?
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#84 of 90 Old 05-06-2005, 02:13 PM
 
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I hear you! The family room can grow and change for a long time.

Our dd sleeps in a fullsize bedside cot which we call the bed extension. She spends longer on her 'side' than she used to and one day when I clear out our room a bit more I might consider moving the cot away from the bed so that I can get out more easily and use the drawers underneath that side of the bed!

Ds2 regularly snuck in with us from his bed in his brother's room until he realised his brother's bed was closer! He didn't sleep alone all night until he was about school age and I have no idea why he did.
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#85 of 90 Old 05-06-2005, 02:17 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by darwinphish

This is another thread entirely... but I'm suprised that the debate is always cosleeping vs. CIO. Like there is no inbetween. People talk about the family bed, but never about the family bedROOM as we have. When DD outgrows her cosleeper we'll probably get a crib... which will go in our room with us. We never ever CIO, but we don't cosleep either. I wonder if that is rare, or just somehow not part of the debate?
I read somewhere that co-sleeping is just having your baby sleeping in the same room with you or near you, that bed sharing was when the baby actually slept in the bed with you. In this forum, and similar ones, cosleeping is meant in the bed with you. I think a lot of parents "cosleep" meaning in the same room, while some also bed share. My husband doesnt want us to do "bed sharing" to be really specific -- while he doesnt have a problem with this with an infant, he wants Katie to be used to sleeping in a crib and be transitioned there early on. The crib will be in our room, near our bed.
There are these talks that in other cultures that there is co-sleeping but what some miss is that yes, there are some folks sharing a bed, a lot of the time when it is with older children they are just sleeping in the same room not in the same bed with the parents.
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#86 of 90 Old 05-06-2005, 02:26 PM
 
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Please don't lets go down the line of who is *really* co-sleeping and who is not.
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#87 of 90 Old 05-06-2005, 02:40 PM
 
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Originally Posted by llyra
As I've been reading this thread, I've been reminded of this article:
http://www.continuum-concept.org/rea...InControl.html
It doesn't deal specifically with co-sleeping or with weaning, but what it does deal with is the consequences of overdoing "child-centered" to the point that a parent become a martyr, and clarifies the difference between "in-arms" parenting, and "child-led" parenting.

To me, it's a very telling point. I do not believe in being "child-centered," and that makes me stand out in this neck of the woods.
Yeah! Come join our discussion (12 pp long and growing) below. You won't stick out there!

Third generation WOHM. I work by choice.
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#88 of 90 Old 05-06-2005, 02:52 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by darwinphish
People talk about the family bed, but never about the family bedROOM as we have. When DD outgrows her cosleeper we'll probably get a crib... which will go in our room with us. We never ever CIO, but we don't cosleep either. I wonder if that is rare, or just somehow not part of the debate?

I don't think it is rare! But I do think it gets looked over. To me one of the main benefits of co-sleeping is having my child right next to me so that I can respond to her. As long as we respond, I don't see why there is a problem about where the baby is laying down while asleep. My first HAD to be touching me to sleep. My second likes to be in the family bed but fusses if I touch her. She would probably do as well in a cosleeper, but there ie so much mattress that we don't really need it. If I held her all night like I did my first and she didn't like it that would be ignorning her need for space. It is silly to assume that every baby who is not in the family bed would prefer to be there. But I admit it is my first reaction. :

For me, part of the problem is the huge amount people I know using CIO. It upsets me so much that I immediately worry when I hear a child has been transitioned to a crib. I feel an irrational need to advocate for that child's right NOT to be forced to CIO. Even when the parents say he/she didn't cry!
I have to step back and realize there is A LOT of in between. Its just those darn CIOers have such loud, pushy voices. And they look at me smugly telling me how well "works" while I sit there with bags under my eyes because I chose to comfort my sick child rather than turn the monitor off and ignore her.

I think the title of this forum is significant. "Nighttime Parenting" is what we are all advocating. I feel like the mainstream CIO view is that parenting ends at 8pm and doesn't start again until 8am. SO my shout-out to everyone here is: YOU ARE DOING A GOOD JOB! If you are parenting your child at night, GOOD FOR YOU! Let's not let our disgust for the "baby ignorers" cause us to stop supporting each other. There are few enough of us as it is.

Angie, mama to Anna '01, Mia '04, and Leif '08 and angel1.gif '03  angel1.gif'07 angel1.gif'12.Expecting someone new in 7/13! pos.gif

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#89 of 90 Old 05-06-2005, 02:53 PM
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Originally Posted by APmomma
What you described IS a supportive environment. Listening to others and learning about different opinions and situations definetly has made me a better mother and I have learned a lot. This however is not what I am seeing on this thread. There are broad generalizations and an overall attitude of "my way is better". It's the same kind of crap you read on mainstream boards, just a little tiny bit sugar-coated. Basically, this thread is saying in one way or another that older children nursing are "manipulative" don't have "manners", most come from families with "discipline issues", they have "bad sleep habits". I mean, come on. How are comments like that the kind of comments that anyone can "learn" from. There is a big difference between learning about different AP approaches (including night-weaning, etc. Believe me, I am by no means a "die hard" AP follower. We all make our own modifications. By dd is NOT always soothed by a breast. Far from it. She is disciplined, she has to cry sometimes) and just reading negetive opinions directed toward different AP practices. It's just the overall negetive tone that is disappointing to see.
I think we're going to have to agree to disagree. I really don't think anybody meant to make broad statements that condemn anybody, anything or any group of people or organizations. There are simply observations made to prove a point. To show that even with the best of intentions, things can go astray. Hindsight is 20/20 and maybe someone else can learn from others past experiences.

If someone posts with an issue I assume they are looking for solutions to their issue not just someone to commisurate how awful things are and we'll all get though misery together. Sometimes warm hugs are what is needed to get through a situation, sometimes a 180 is necessary. We can only solve our own problems ourselves. For example: That particular group of LLL moms, even with their best intentions may have taken the extended breastfeeding on demand issue a little too far. Some of the group may have found it to be a negative situation but because the rest of the group was supporting something negative like it were a positive it never changed. Sometimes misery loves company. People bond in all sorts of ways. Just because something is "AP" or "LLL" doesn't make it right.

Believe me, I thought I would breastfeed for 2 years, not start solids for 6 months and co-sleep until my child walked to his own bed himself. Well, I didn't produce milk, I had a very hungry little boy (who could care less about food now) and he likes sleeping in his own space. I only found these things out through trial and error and searching EVERYWHERE for a solution. Personally, I'm glad things turned out the way they did, I think I'm a better parent for it.
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#90 of 90 Old 05-06-2005, 02:54 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ellien C
Yeah! Come join our discussion (12 pp long and growing) below. You won't stick out there!
O boy, interesting reading for later!!!
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