CIO: Sure Lookin' Good Right Now! - Mothering Forums

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Old 10-19-2007, 09:22 PM - Thread Starter
 
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UPDATE..... SEE POST #51


OK, I'm a co-sleeping mama and bfing 15 month old ds. I see there are tons of posts about bf/sleep issues with babes that are also around the age that mine is (in addition to all the other challenges like pinching, crying whining, groping, etc., I can relate!)

Although philosophically and emotionally I don't subscribe to CIO and will not practice it, I still can't help but to feel envious of other families that have done it. Actually, with the exception of my close friend, everyone else I know including family and random aquaintances have done cio. That said, my fellow non-cio friend and I are the only ones who have ongoing sleep/nap issues. The cio folks do not!!!! AND when I talk to cio folks, their babies who are the same age as mine SLEEP THROUGH THE NIGHT and have been doing so since early on. Also, these cio babies/kids that I meet seem very well attached to their parents and are well-adjusted, loving good kids.

I'm not trying to promote cio here, but I'm starting to wonder what is so terrible about it. Is it really that bad to cio???

I'm well read on cio and co-sleeping, so no need to send me articles. I Just want responses that come from the heart...
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Old 10-19-2007, 09:32 PM
 
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Someone earlier today put CIO in a new perspective for me. I'm sorry I don't remember exactly who it is.

She said that if we were to do the same thing to an elderly person, it would be neglect and abuse. Remember that your child needs you to fulfill his/her needs, and as hard as it is, it will pay off! You are the most important person in her/his life, and to show your DC that you're not going to come when (s)he needs you will show up later.

Also, from experience with friends, CIO parents have the EXACT same problems you do. They just ignore them, and the children learn not to cry loudly because it gets them nowhere. Why waste the effort? It isn't that they're not having these problems or that their kids are sleeping through the night. It's that they're choosing to not acknowledge their childrens' cries for help during the night, or their children have learned that it's not worth it.

I think learning that even the people closest to you won't give you what you need at 4 or 5 months is really sad, isn't it?

Also, remember. Children at this age are just beginning to explore. Your child is at an age where he will be doing more that he's never done before and he needs to know that even when he's changing, mommy is always going to be there.

You're right by not CIO-ing. Stick to it!

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Old 10-19-2007, 09:40 PM
 
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It's just wrong to ignore someone in need. When, to that someone, we are the most important person in the world, it's extra wrong. There is no way that something damaging isn't taking place, neurologically, to an infant who learns that his mother will not respond to his cries. I don't know what it is, but I believe it in my heart. We are afraid of strangers in need in American culture, and I think so much of that stems from the mentality that someone else's need isn't our problem, and they should learn to comfort themselves.
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Old 10-19-2007, 09:44 PM
 
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It's really that terrible.

-Angela
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Old 10-19-2007, 09:52 PM
 
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I tried doing it once with my daughter when I was there. When she cried so hard she started to vomit, I decided that nothing was worth that.

I agree with the previous posters. You don't want to live through sleep deprivation, but you also don't want to live through CIO! At least not with my kid.

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Old 10-19-2007, 10:08 PM
 
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I also want to say that many people who SAY cio worked for them are, shall we say, stretching the truth?

People look at a baby's sleep as a competition - "mine slept thru the night at 3 mos" "oh well, mine slept through the night at 3 weeks".

Since people want their baby to be the best, they play a game of one-upmanship that leads to unrealistic expectations.

Anyway, keep with the non-CIOing...that's an investment in your child that will pay off in the future.

Never doubt that a small group of committed, thoughtful people can change the world. Indeed, it is the only thing that ever has. Margaret Mead
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Old 10-19-2007, 10:26 PM
 
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CIO is cruel. It is a form of mental abuse IMO. It is a blow to your child's self-esteem and self-worth. Imagine how scary it must be for a child. I always try to put myself in my child's shoes and act accordingly. Sleep deprivation does suck, especially when you have been dealing with it for over a year but it does get better. My son was sleeping peacefully through the night by age 2 and we never did CIO. He is still an awesome sleeper now at age 4.

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Old 10-19-2007, 10:31 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Originally Posted by smeisnotapirate View Post
Someone earlier today put CIO in a new perspective for me. I'm sorry I don't remember exactly who it is.

She said that if we were to do the same thing to an elderly person, it would be neglect and abuse.
That's bone-chilling... really drives the point.




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Originally Posted by smeisnotapirate View Post
Also, remember. Children at this age are just beginning to explore. Your child is at an age where he will be doing more that he's never done before and he needs to know that even when he's changing, mommy is always going to be there.

So it does get better, right? Any chance you know around when? I know, each babe is different, but a rough estimate is good...
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Old 10-19-2007, 10:33 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Originally Posted by wallacesmum View Post
It's just wrong to ignore someone in need. When, to that someone, we are the most important person in the world, it's extra wrong. There is no way that something damaging isn't taking place, neurologically, to an infant who learns that his mother will not respond to his cries.
I agree!
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Old 10-19-2007, 10:35 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Originally Posted by alegna View Post
It's really that terrible.

-Angela
short and sweet, thanks!
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Old 10-19-2007, 10:36 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Originally Posted by widemouthedfrog View Post
I tried doing it once with my daughter when I was there. When she cried so hard she started to vomit, I decided that nothing was worth that.
wow, that sounds awful!
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Old 10-19-2007, 10:38 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Originally Posted by syn_ack89 View Post
I also want to say that many people who SAY cio worked for them are, shall we say, stretching the truth?

People look at a baby's sleep as a competition - "mine slept thru the night at 3 mos" "oh well, mine slept through the night at 3 weeks".

Since people want their baby to be the best, they play a game of one-upmanship that leads to unrealistic expectations.

Anyway, keep with the non-CIOing...that's an investment in your child that will pay off in the future.
I hate sleep competition! and I hate when people ask me how ds sleeps!
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Old 10-19-2007, 10:39 PM - Thread Starter
 
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My son was sleeping peacefully through the night by age 2 and we never did CIO. He is still an awesome sleeper now at age 4.
This is exactly what I needed to hear!!!!!!
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Old 10-19-2007, 10:40 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Thanks for all of your replies! I need to figure out the multiquote function

your support is wonderful!!!
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Old 10-19-2007, 10:49 PM
 
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Out of desperation I gave in to many advisers to get sleep training/CIO, although I didnt leave his side it still broke my heart to see him upset and cry and I will never ever try it again. Id rather have a happy loving baby. Some of my friends say "Oh poor you, still not getting any sleep" and I just tell them Im enjoying it while it lasts!
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Old 10-19-2007, 10:49 PM
 
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That's bone-chilling... really drives the point.
I thought so, too.

I'm not a mommy yet (soon, soon, soon!), but I can honestly say, let your son determine the schedule. I look at it like weaning: I'm sure he'll be fine by college!

My only advice is to try to look at your sleepless nights as some extra time to spend with your DS. The childhood years go so quickly that even though you need the sleep and it's frustrating, one of the coolest things in the world is enjoying what little time you have with your baby when he's still a baby. Maybe a change of perspective will help.

Good luck, and tonight when you have trouble, make sure to look your baby in the eye and tell him you love him and you're happy he's not growing up too fast.

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Old 10-19-2007, 10:59 PM
 
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Hang in there. On the really bad nights my DH and I used to joke that CIO meant that WE would go in the other room and cry it out.

It does get better.
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Old 10-19-2007, 11:14 PM
 
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My older son, who is now 8, woke up every 2 hours for many many many months....! I remember nights being in tears and cringing when I heard his first whimpers as he woke up yet again! All of my dear friends did CIO and thought I was insane as I stumbled through my days. But some things I've learned, having survived those days.

*Families who do CIO often have to do it MANY times. For my friends, they probably averaged letting their kids CIO 3-4 times throughout the course of their childrens' infancies/toddlerhoods--every time the family traveled, or their child hit a new milestone, or the child got new teeth, or new babies joined the families, etc...they had to do it all over again. So, it's really not a long term solution...and just seems like a lot of pain for such a temporary "reward".

*A huge plus of the family bed or nursing/rocking/whatever to sleep is that bedtime in our house, even with 2 boys who are well beyond nursing to sleep now!, has never, ever, ever been a battle. It's a restful peaceful wonderful time of day. That, as they say, truly is priceless.

*If, however, the bedtime, nighttime routine isn't working for you right now....don't hesitate to try to change it. We tried it all...waiting 5-7 min to see if my baby would fuss himself back to sleep (never a full on cry, of course), having Dad try to pat his back or rock him back to sleep before I'd nurse, starting out in a crib and then bringing him to bed, making bedtime earlier, etc...etc... I would wait a few days to see if the new routine was helping...if it was, great...if not, I'd go back to the old standbys. Trust yourself and your instincts and watch your babe for clues. Both my sons were so different in the sleep department that I learned to just trust myself and trust them. Each phase has its challenges but each phase does pass.

*These rough nights really do pass way faster than you can ever imagine. I look at my oldest with his gangly body, all elbows and knees and bruises and scrapes and stinky feet from sports, and wonder where that small baby went....the one who snuggled with me all night. Both of my boys go to sleep on their own after stories and spend most of the night in their own beds---although my husband and I love it when they crawl into our bed with us. The sleepless nights from their infancies are a distant, fuzzy memory. So, as painful as the sleepless nights are, take snapshots in your mind of how your child looks sleeping next to you or in your arms. There truly is nothing more precious than a small child asleep with you. Try to remember how it feels to have their small warm bodies nestled up to yours. Hold your babies' hands and nuzzle their soft head because someday soon, you, too, will have forgotten how tired you are today.

Best of luck!
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Old 10-19-2007, 11:21 PM
 
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i understand your point! i too feel envious when i hear about all these 'sleeping through the night babies' BUT i think many times people exagerate. i also read (i think in one of sears's books) about a family who were so thrilled that their cio baby slept through the night. when their ap friends spent the night, they realized the baby was crying but the parents just didn't hear it anymore because they no longer had that sensitivity to their child. the bottom line is who knows what really goes on in anyone else's home at night?

during the first year, your baby is forming his understanding of the world around him. since you are not letting him cry it out, he is learning that he matters, that we should help those who are in pain and that the world is just generally a place where things will be ok and others care. those lessons will serve him well as he gets older, maybe the differences in perspective between your children and your cio friends' children will become apparent over time (how they react to middle school cliques, for example).

i also think all babies are different. yours needs a little (or a lot)more help to get to sleep right now(as does mine, btw). good for you for meeting that need. needs that are not met do not disappear, they just reappear later-- better a sleepless baby than an angry teen.

i agree with the poster who said to put yourself in his shoes. you really are doing a great thing for your baby. in a blink he will be all grown up and you'll be glad for the time you spent rocking or nursing or laying together or whatever instead of wishing you had been holding him when he was crying all alone.
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Old 10-19-2007, 11:36 PM
 
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I did CIO w/ DS1 .... only once and I refused to do it w/ DD or DS2....My baby was SAD the next day, he really was. It broke my heart. He is now a great sleeper, as is DD. Every once in a while I think the same as you pondered in your OP...DS2 is a crappy sleeper...but I could just not do that to him ... I dont think letting them fuss for 5 min is all that bad - and by fuss I dont mean wailing. But full on CIO - never again.
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Old 10-19-2007, 11:42 PM
 
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The benefits really pay off in the long run. Do you want your child/teen to trust you? Do you want them to be able to come to you with problems? Do you want them to be able to talk to you about anything and everything...

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Old 10-19-2007, 11:48 PM
 
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Your friends are lucky. Most of the people I know who CIO'd still have night time issues. They just choose to ignore them instead of responding to the cries.
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Old 10-19-2007, 11:52 PM
 
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I am in the same boat. I would never let ds CIO . Dh actually wanted to because his friend s said ds was old enough and it was not that bad. I told dh I would divorce him before ds cries it out. He has never mentioned it again. I never let ds cry. The two times he has cried because I could not get to him (stuck in traffic on a highway) he vommitted. It killed me. So as rough as it gets up every two hours still. No I will never subscribe to torturing my ds.

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Old 10-19-2007, 11:56 PM
 
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we've never done CIO..never will. My 4 yo started sleeping through the night when he nightweaned around 19 months. My 20 mo son is now starting to sleep through the night and he is weaned completely. I really think nursing has a lot to do with nightwakings...
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Old 10-20-2007, 12:54 AM - Thread Starter
 
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we've never done CIO..never will. My 4 yo started sleeping through the night when he nightweaned around 19 months. My 20 mo son is now starting to sleep through the night and he is weaned completely. I really think nursing has a lot to do with nightwakings...
wow, this is great to hear. would you mind sharing whether they self-weaned or if you initiated it. AND if you initiated, how did you do it???
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Old 10-20-2007, 01:30 AM
 
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I am in the same boat. I would never let ds CIO . Dh actually wanted to because his friend s said ds was old enough and it was not that bad. I told dh I would divorce him before ds cries it out. He has never mentioned it again. I never let ds cry. The two times he has cried because I could not get to him (stuck in traffic on a highway) he vommitted. It killed me. So as rough as it gets up every two hours still. No I will never subscribe to torturing my ds.
Okay, me too. But, does your dh help? Dp isn't much help with getting dd to sleep. He usually is smart enough not to tell me to let her cio, but it's not like he's the one rocking her to sleep. There are different levels of support.
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Old 10-20-2007, 03:46 AM
 
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it's hard enough to see other people crying, so i cannot fathom how it's possible to steel one's heart to a baby/child's crying! can't believe there's no harm resulting from a plea for comfort being ignored. it's possible that the child will eventually get used to the scenario, but, really, at what cost?

that being said, when you read here about the extremely difficult sleep situations (total lack of sleep for extended periods of time) some families are experiencing, you wonder how best to cope with it. but, we are all they have, and their happiness is all that matters to us.
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Old 10-20-2007, 04:06 AM
 
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Originally Posted by aprilv View Post
i also read (i think in one of sears's books) about a family who were so thrilled that their cio baby slept through the night. when their ap friends spent the night, they realized the baby was crying but the parents just didn't hear it anymore because they no longer had that sensitivity to their child.
That just breaks my heart. :

Quote:
Imagine how scary it must be for a child.
:

*hugs* It does get better. I remember my aunt and uncle being worn out around this same sort of time for both their children, but they never let their kids CIO, and now their kids sleep really well. There were some very bad times - I remember staying there one night; their older child had a meltdown for two hours (waking up the younger child in the process), and then a few hours later (at 2am!), after we had all gone to bed (again) their younger child woke up ready to party . However, it took time and patience (and the occasional parental moment of doubt) but they made it.
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Old 10-20-2007, 04:10 AM
 
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i understand your point! i too feel envious when i hear about all these 'sleeping through the night babies' BUT i think many times people exagerate. i also read (i think in one of sears's books) about a family who were so thrilled that their cio baby slept through the night. when their ap friends spent the night, they realized the baby was crying but the parents just didn't hear it anymore because they no longer had that sensitivity to their child.
Yeah, that. CIO is so backassward in terms of logic I find it surprising that anyone would buy into it. You wouldn't leave anyone else alone to cry for any reason unless they specifically asked, so why the heck would you leave an someone who can't express his feelings to scream wondering where the hell you went and why he is not important enough for you to answer his call?

I think sometimes people forget that babies are people too.
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Old 10-20-2007, 05:31 AM
 
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Originally Posted by SuenCA View Post
The sleepless nights from their infancies are a distant, fuzzy memory. So, as painful as the sleepless nights are, take snapshots in your mind of how your child looks sleeping next to you or in your arms. There truly is nothing more precious than a small child asleep with you. Try to remember how it feels to have their small warm bodies nestled up to yours. Hold your babies' hands and nuzzle their soft head because someday soon, you, too, will have forgotten how tired you are today.
That's so sweet. I'm all teared up now.
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