Has anyone done Dr. Jay Gordon's nightweaning plan? - Page 3 - Mothering Forums

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#61 of 193 Old 02-24-2008, 03:50 PM
 
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: congrats!! Glad you are finally seeing some real improvement!! My DD had such a bad night last night, including some in the middle of the night arguing between me and DH (always the best time to have a discussion). She was up every hour after midnight, sometimes less. These molars are killing us!!!!!!!!!! As much as I want to make a change for my sake, I know she is in alot of pain and needs comfort now and nighttime breastfeeding is where she gets it and wants it. So, I am going to commit myself to nightweaning as soon as they two break through. I think that even when the rest come in, if I had some good sleep in between, maybe I'd be ready to handle it better, and more calmly. I don't like being a grumpy bear to her at night (or during the next day for that matter!).
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#62 of 193 Old 02-24-2008, 06:41 PM
 
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Hi Happy2bamama,
My DD is the same age as your LO. Having not an easy and good sleeper,I remember having read your threads to this forum in the past.
Thank you for posting this and congrats for your success!
One of my concerns regarding this plan is decreasing my milk supply.Like you, I demand feed and I have no plans of stopping yet.If we can do it,I want her to self wean.Did you speak about this with J.Gordon?Does night weaning cause decrease in supply?
Another concern is that DD isn't very much into solids.Some days she'll have some and some days she won't.Usually she likes to eat something after her morning nap and in the afternoon, rarely at dinner.
Btw, I envy your long streches DD wakes up hourly.
Thanks for taking your time.
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#63 of 193 Old 02-25-2008, 12:24 AM - Thread Starter
 
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Hi Happy2bamama,
My DD is the same age as your LO. Having not an easy and good sleeper,I remember having read your threads to this forum in the past.
Thank you for posting this and congrats for your success!
One of my concerns regarding this plan is decreasing my milk supply.Like you, I demand feed and I have no plans of stopping yet.If we can do it,I want her to self wean.Did you speak about this with J.Gordon?Does night weaning cause decrease in supply?
Another concern is that DD isn't very much into solids.Some days she'll have some and some days she won't.Usually she likes to eat something after her morning nap and in the afternoon, rarely at dinner.
Btw, I envy your long streches DD wakes up hourly.
Thanks for taking your time.
You aren't kidding - our LOs are the EXACT same age - born on the same day! What time was yours? DS was at 12:57am.

So, about the milk supply - I think I remember Dr. Gordon saying that my DS would make up for it during the day, so my milk supply won't necessarily decrease, but just shift. And, before night-weaning, when DS woke up for good in the AM, he wouldn't nurse - he'd be up and ready to play. But now, he nurses a lot in the AM, so it does seem like the nursing is shifting, not really decreasing. And actually, I notice that he does nurse a bit more during the day. Except for days like this when he was out having fun with his dad for most of the day and I am about ready to burst waiting for them to come home! And, DS doesn't really eat all that much in terms of solids - sometimes (most times) there is no real dinner to speak of. I do think milk supply decrease could be an issue for moms who aren't able to be around during the day (and who night-wean). I guess night-weaning IS some kind of step towards total weaning in a way - just like everyday they get older is a step towards weaning, KWIM? I think if you "protect" your milk supply and make a point to offer it a lot during the day - even when your LO isn't asking for it - you won't have any issues (IMO). HTH and hopefully you'll get some sleep soon
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#64 of 193 Old 02-25-2008, 01:21 AM - Thread Starter
 
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Originally Posted by Keirasmommy View Post
: congrats!! Glad you are finally seeing some real improvement!! My DD had such a bad night last night, including some in the middle of the night arguing between me and DH (always the best time to have a discussion). She was up every hour after midnight, sometimes less. These molars are killing us!!!!!!!!!! As much as I want to make a change for my sake, I know she is in alot of pain and needs comfort now and nighttime breastfeeding is where she gets it and wants it. So, I am going to commit myself to nightweaning as soon as they two break through. I think that even when the rest come in, if I had some good sleep in between, maybe I'd be ready to handle it better, and more calmly. I don't like being a grumpy bear to her at night (or during the next day for that matter!).
I'm sorry you had such a rough night last night. Middle of the night arguing - we've all been there! Even though we are having success right now, I know that once more teeth and especially molars hit, he will be waking a lot again. I just think of right now as refueling and building up my sleep reserve for when that happens That's great that you're listening to your gut about continuing to nurse at night while DD is having a tough time and needs extra comfort. Keep up the good work and hopefully you'll get some relief (and your DD will too) soon!
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#65 of 193 Old 02-25-2008, 07:15 AM
 
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You aren't kidding - our LOs are the EXACT same age - born on the same day! What time was yours? DS was at 12:57am.
Oh dear,I wasn't aware of that. DD was born at 8:02pm.

Thanks for replying my questions.I am a SAHM,so I can nurse her lots during the day which would be an advantage.
The next few days I will think about this subject and see if we are ready to do this.I began to take note of the time she wakes up. Normally I'd never look at the time and count how many times she woke up.She woke up 4 times after I went to bed last night and gave me a 3 hour strech which was lovely
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#66 of 193 Old 02-25-2008, 10:44 AM
 
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I've been reading this thread with great interest. I'm on the verge of nightweaning my 14 month old ds. He's always been a horrible sleeper. I'm talking waking up every 30 minutes-1 hr for his entire life. I just can't take much more.

He was starting on his own to stretch out his nightwaking to every 2 and sometimes even 3 hours. Let me tell you, that felt like heaven. But now he's getting all 4 of his molars at once! So, I'm waiting it out and once they're through, I'm going to do Dr. Gordon's method.

My dd slept the same way until I nightweaned her at 18 months. We still have some issues with her, but she's much better. So I have hope that once I do this, ds will sleep better, too.

Keep posting about your journey.
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#67 of 193 Old 02-25-2008, 02:56 PM - Thread Starter
 
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NIGHT TEN!! DS is definitely sleeping harder and longer. The wakings have not completely stopped, but it is SO much better. Since we're modifying Dr. Gordon's plan, I think it might take a bit longer for us. Also, I don't think that all waking can be eliminated at ALL times. I don't think this plan is a magic pill or anything, but it sure has made our life more pleasant! And - I feel like DS is sleeping better too.

Last night, DS woke up around 10:20pm (he gave us a nice 3.5 hour stretch there) and I nursed him both sides. He woke up around 1am, but fell back asleep within two minutes. He woke up around 4am again and had a hard time falling back to sleep - just tossing and turning. I think it probably took about an hour. I considered nursing him, but it felt too early still. 4am still seems like night to me! He woke up again around 5:20am and I nursed him. Then he woke up for good around 7:30am, which was later than usual and fabulous! Even though DS woke up a few times, I felt really rested this morning - enough to get up with DS and let DH sleep a bit.
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#68 of 193 Old 02-25-2008, 03:31 PM
 
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wow, sounds like its getting better and better for you. I don't know what night exactly we're on, but somewhere around 15 or 16 I think...Um, the last few nights have been rough on everyone because of molars and lots of waking. BUT, last night, ds slept from 9 to 6:15 and didn't wake at all. WHOA! WHAT? yeah, I know. Are the blessings finally coming? Dh and ds sleep in a separate room with mattress on floor for either one, depending on where ds chooses usually. Dh said that last night ds rolled from the bed onto the floor (where dh was) and then dh moved onto the bed and they stayed that way until morning. Ds came into "my" room and threw open the door which scared the crap out of me and walked over to the bed and put his arms up. I picked him up and nursed him for about ten minutes on each side(his demand) and then we played in bed for a little. Went downstairs and changed, did breakfast, played, etc. until dh woke up at 8:30 (he's laid off right now) and came down like..."whoa, when did he get up? I never knew he left the room?" It was the first time in a long time that dh and me both felt rested (probably also because I went to sleep at a decent time - 10, instead of pushing it like I normally do, craving some time to myself).

And we also both noticed that since I have been getting straight sleep for a couple weeks now, my appetite has returned and I am eating a lot more and better. Weird coincidence? I am thinking not. I have always struggled to get enough to eat because I rarely get very hungry. And when I do, I don't feel like making anything great to eat, ykwim? So, I am generally pretty happy with the benefits I am seeing so far in nightweaning the way we are doing it. I even gained a few pounds, and trust me - this is a problem I have really been battling with ever since I had my son. I don't even share with many other moms, usually, because I know other moms have the opposite problem with their weight. But, I wanted to say it here because I think it also says something about some of the "consequences" of training our LO to nurse back to sleep whenever they want through the night due to co-sleeping. I loved co-sleeping because of the benefits to ds emotionally and the ease of nursing at night when he was littler, but oh boy - I learned as well how many problems it caused our family as well. It feels good to have a balanced thought process now, too. I was so set on doing the right thing for him that I really neglected my and dh's needs which effected my emotional and physical health as well as my ability to parent...I am feeling more normal everyday...and it really felt great to hear that from my wonderful husband this morning also, yk? We have a lot going on in our house/family right now, but this is one of the good things for sure!

Thanks to Dr. Jay Gordon's plan, we were able to make it work our own way and feel empowered finally! Hooray!

Already!?!?! cold.gif  ~ Lori, doula, childbirth educator, wife to Jermaine 6/04, and mom to two happy and energetic boys - Tatum 6/06 and Keegan 3/09

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#69 of 193 Old 02-25-2008, 07:44 PM
 
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NIGHT TEN!! DS is definitely sleeping harder and longer. The wakings have not completely stopped, but it is SO much better. Since we're modifying Dr. Gordon's plan, I think it might take a bit longer for us. Also, I don't think that all waking can be eliminated at ALL times. I don't think this plan is a magic pill or anything, but it sure has made our life more pleasant! And - I feel like DS is sleeping better too.

Last night, DS woke up around 10:20pm (he gave us a nice 3.5 hour stretch there) and I nursed him both sides. He woke up around 1am, but fell back asleep within two minutes. He woke up around 4am again and had a hard time falling back to sleep - just tossing and turning. I think it probably took about an hour. I considered nursing him, but it felt too early still. 4am still seems like night to me! He woke up again around 5:20am and I nursed him. Then he woke up for good around 7:30am, which was later than usual and fabulous! Even though DS woke up a few times, I felt really rested this morning - enough to get up with DS and let DH sleep a bit.
I have said it once, but I will say it again - you are such an inspiration! Not because of your success, necessarily, but simply because you are forgeing the way for many of us other mommas AND you are doing it with such honesty. All the while, being very true to who you are as a parent and the things you believe in (yes, I am getting ALL of this from just your posts). Anyway, thanks for sharing.

As I have mentioned, we are going to be starting our own version of this plan soon. I had sort of started in on Friday night, but BooBaby has come down with the flu and is just miserable, so we are going to wait until she is feeling better. I am hoping Wed or Thurs. I will try to do my best to share my experience as well.

Thanks for starting this thread and to all the other mommas for keeping it going!
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#70 of 193 Old 02-25-2008, 09:18 PM - Thread Starter
 
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wow, sounds like its getting better and better for you. I don't know what night exactly we're on, but somewhere around 15 or 16 I think...Um, the last few nights have been rough on everyone because of molars and lots of waking. BUT, last night, ds slept from 9 to 6:15 and didn't wake at all. WHOA! WHAT? yeah, I know. Are the blessings finally coming? Dh and ds sleep in a separate room with mattress on floor for either one, depending on where ds chooses usually. Dh said that last night ds rolled from the bed onto the floor (where dh was) and then dh moved onto the bed and they stayed that way until morning. Ds came into "my" room and threw open the door which scared the crap out of me and walked over to the bed and put his arms up. I picked him up and nursed him for about ten minutes on each side(his demand) and then we played in bed for a little. Went downstairs and changed, did breakfast, played, etc. until dh woke up at 8:30 (he's laid off right now) and came down like..."whoa, when did he get up? I never knew he left the room?" It was the first time in a long time that dh and me both felt rested (probably also because I went to sleep at a decent time - 10, instead of pushing it like I normally do, craving some time to myself).

And we also both noticed that since I have been getting straight sleep for a couple weeks now, my appetite has returned and I am eating a lot more and better. Weird coincidence? I am thinking not. I have always struggled to get enough to eat because I rarely get very hungry. And when I do, I don't feel like making anything great to eat, ykwim? So, I am generally pretty happy with the benefits I am seeing so far in nightweaning the way we are doing it. I even gained a few pounds, and trust me - this is a problem I have really been battling with ever since I had my son. I don't even share with many other moms, usually, because I know other moms have the opposite problem with their weight. But, I wanted to say it here because I think it also says something about some of the "consequences" of training our LO to nurse back to sleep whenever they want through the night due to co-sleeping. I loved co-sleeping because of the benefits to ds emotionally and the ease of nursing at night when he was littler, but oh boy - I learned as well how many problems it caused our family as well. It feels good to have a balanced thought process now, too. I was so set on doing the right thing for him that I really neglected my and dh's needs which effected my emotional and physical health as well as my ability to parent...I am feeling more normal everyday...and it really felt great to hear that from my wonderful husband this morning also, yk? We have a lot going on in our house/family right now, but this is one of the good things for sure!

Thanks to Dr. Jay Gordon's plan, we were able to make it work our own way and feel empowered finally! Hooray!
Thanks for the post! It's an interesting point you bring up about being so set on doing the right thing for your DS that you felt like you neglected yourself and DH. I don't know if you're like this, but because I'm so against a lot of mainstream parenting and birth, I have done everything I can to NOT be the typical kind of checked out parents that I see. But, there is a balance (like most things in life) in which the baby is getting their needs met and so are we, as parents. And it all effects everything else. If I am a zombie, then how can I be the best mom for DS? Which is better - continuing to nurse at night and me being half asleep and impatient during the day or stopping nursing at night and me being alert and energetic during the day? That's the thing - there is no way to measure which is "better," just which is more important to us (which is different for every mama and baby). But it is so easy to get into the "but the baby NEEDS X, Y and Z" and completely forget about yourself. And, there's such a huge difference between us parents simply wanting some sleep at night after a year (or more) vs. wanting to just go play golf or tennis or any other cliche parent sport I can think of!! Sleep is a necessity, not a luxury (although I'm sure some would argue that golf and tennis are a necessity - maybe just no one here at MDC)!

Oh and about your eating and finally gaining weight since your appetite has returned... I am sort of in the same boat. My appetite hasn't gone, but I weigh less than I did pre-pregnancy because nursing and daily maintenance of a very active baby leaves barely any time for me to really sit and eat and I am physically going all day. It is amazing how much sleep deprivation can effect other things. They don't use sleep deprivation as a torture method for nothing, I guess

I'm glad to hear that even though you've had some rocky nights with molars, that you've at least got to have a few good, long stretches of sleep. 9pm to 6:15am is AWESOME!! Way to go! It sounds like you guys felt human again! Keep up the good work and please, keep checking in and letting me know how it's going

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Originally Posted by terpgirl23 View Post
I have said it once, but I will say it again - you are such an inspiration! Not because of your success, necessarily, but simply because you are forgeing the way for many of us other mommas AND you are doing it with such honesty. All the while, being very true to who you are as a parent and the things you believe in (yes, I am getting ALL of this from just your posts). Anyway, thanks for sharing.

As I have mentioned, we are going to be starting our own version of this plan soon. I had sort of started in on Friday night, but BooBaby has come down with the flu and is just miserable, so we are going to wait until she is feeling better. I am hoping Wed or Thurs. I will try to do my best to share my experience as well.

Thanks for starting this thread and to all the other mommas for keeping it going!
Thank you so much for your kind words! I'm happy you are getting all those wonderful things out of this thread because sometimes it feels like it's basically a blog entitled "How my son slept last night!" Not the most entertaining reading. But, I am a born analyzer, and it sounds like my "analysis" or thoughts or whatever are coming through too, which is my intention

I'm sorry your LO has the flu. That stinks. I'd love to know how things go when (and if) you try the night-weaning. Good luck to you!

BTW - in the spirit of being "honest," I just have to say that getting some sleep back - and not to mention that DH was Mr. Mom this weekend and gave me some "me" time - has made me feel like a real person again and I went shopping on Sunday with a friend who forced me to get some cute stuff that wasn't just comfortable, bland, nursing-friendly "mom-wear" and I have to say, sleep + a new pair of form-fitting jeans and some halfway stylish shoes can do a lot for a lady!!
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#71 of 193 Old 02-25-2008, 11:34 PM
 
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Thanks for the post! It's an interesting point you bring up about being so set on doing the right thing for your DS that you felt like you neglected yourself and DH. I don't know if you're like this, but because I'm so against a lot of mainstream parenting and birth, I have done everything I can to NOT be the typical kind of checked out parents that I see. But, there is a balance (like most things in life) in which the baby is getting their needs met and so are we, as parents. And it all effects everything else. If I am a zombie, then how can I be the best mom for DS? Which is better - continuing to nurse at night and me being half asleep and impatient during the day or stopping nursing at night and me being alert and energetic during the day? That's the thing - there is no way to measure which is "better," just which is more important to us (which is different for every mama and baby). But it is so easy to get into the "but the baby NEEDS X, Y and Z" and completely forget about yourself. And, there's such a huge difference between us parents simply wanting some sleep at night after a year (or more) vs. wanting to just go play golf or tennis or any other cliche parent sport I can think of!! Sleep is a necessity, not a luxury (although I'm sure some would argue that golf and tennis are a necessity - maybe just no one here at MDC)!

Oh and about your eating and finally gaining weight since your appetite has returned... I am sort of in the same boat. My appetite hasn't gone, but I weigh less than I did pre-pregnancy because nursing and daily maintenance of a very active baby leaves barely any time for me to really sit and eat and I am physically going all day. It is amazing how much sleep deprivation can effect other things. They don't use sleep deprivation as a torture method for nothing, I guess

I'm glad to hear that even though you've had some rocky nights with molars, that you've at least got to have a few good, long stretches of sleep. 9pm to 6:15am is AWESOME!! Way to go! It sounds like you guys felt human again! Keep up the good work and please, keep checking in and letting me know how it's going

BTW - in the spirit of being "honest," I just have to say that getting some sleep back - and not to mention that DH was Mr. Mom this weekend and gave me some "me" time - has made me feel like a real person again and I went shopping on Sunday with a friend who forced me to get some cute stuff that wasn't just comfortable, bland, nursing-friendly "mom-wear" and I have to say, sleep + a new pair of form-fitting jeans and some halfway stylish shoes can do a lot for a lady!!

I will keep checking in for sure...and I agree with basically everything you said here...again. And, way to go with the jeans and shoes! I did that like two months ago - from the second hand store actually (which around here is called Plato's closet and its pretty hip along with cheap). Anyway, I got tons of stuff for like a hundred bucks and wow, what a new wardrobe has done for my confidence. I needed clothes badly and it really helped me. I recommend that to everyone when you have a little bit of money to spend on yourself.

Already!?!?! cold.gif  ~ Lori, doula, childbirth educator, wife to Jermaine 6/04, and mom to two happy and energetic boys - Tatum 6/06 and Keegan 3/09

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#72 of 193 Old 02-26-2008, 10:14 AM
 
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I know I might be a little late joining this thread but I just wanted to say that last night was our fifth night of using Dr. Jay's night weaning plan and our second night of sleeping through the night!! The last two nights have been the best sleep of my life.
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#73 of 193 Old 02-26-2008, 12:40 PM
 
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excellent thread! i did a modified jay gordon nightweaning with my first and it worked but it was kind of painful.

ds2 co-sleeps and it's no longer working for us -- for him, me, or dp. we had planned on the boys sharing a room but ds2 isn't into the crib so we don't do that. i'm thinking that we'll put a double futon on the floor in there and gate the door (it's right next to our room). i was thinking that he'd have to be in his big bed first, then i'd nightwean but now i'm wondering if i should try nightweaning first.

how do you mamas *remember* not to put your little ones on the boob in the night? i'm so out of it that i just put him on and don't even remember. this morning dp and i had a conversation about how i had asked him to hold the baby whilst i got up and got a nappy for him but instead i just fell asleep. dp was holding the baby for an hour! i had no idea.

anyway, thanks again so much for the thread, it's inspirational!
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#74 of 193 Old 02-26-2008, 01:22 PM
 
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I'm a little late too but we did a modified version of the plan and I tell you we couldn't be happier. Last Thursday night dd2 slet 8.5hours straight and after a little rocking and patting went back to sleep till her wake up time. We have had a few nights everu other day or so were she wakes up some during the night, but I have really been amazed at her ability to get back to sleep on her own.

I started with nursing for two minutes before laying her down when she would wake up til I was down to 30sec then I moved to the next phase again starting at 2min. We really seemed to have not needed the last phase. I also made it a point to nurse sitting up.

Ayana
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#75 of 193 Old 02-28-2008, 02:46 AM - Thread Starter
 
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Okay, I've lost count of nights! And, I'm not going to keep posting here every day about how DS sleeps (again, the "How my DS slept last night" blog which no ones wants to read!), but I plan to post when something of interest happens.

Not that this is of interest, but since I'm here, I might as well...

Things are still going well, for the most part. DS slept from 10:30pm to 4am last night, although I was tossing and turning for some reason. And, since DS has been sleeping harder, I've had to wake him up the past two nights when DH and I go to bed so I can nurse DS so I know he's had a good feed. But, I am so torn about it because isn't waking a sleeping baby the opposite of what I'm trying to accomplish here?! One of these nights, I'm just gonna have to bite the bullet and not feed him when I go to bed and see how he does. I wonder if he'd stay asleep the whole time? I'm just so worried about him waking up at 2 or 3am and actually being really hungry.

Also, DS seems to be waking consistently at 4am every morning. At this time, it's hard for him to fully get back to sleep and I'm not sure why - probably that he's hungry? And he fusses a little more at this time too. The bad news for me is that he wakes at 4am, I wake up and rub his back and he sort of falls asleep and then he tosses and turns until 5am or so and I'm awake the entire time wondering if I can roll over without making him wake up again and then DS wakes for good around 6am and then we nurse for about 30 minutes, so I'm basically not sleeping from 4-6am. All in all, it's better than before because I am getting a way longer stretch at the beginning and middle of the night, but needless to say, I feel super tired when first getting up because I've been up for about two hours already. I'm really hoping that this 4am waking stops. Maybe it's just going to take longer to phase it out for some reason.

And, for the other co-sleepers out there - does it ever happen to you when you have a situation like I do with your LO waking and having a hard time fully getting back to sleep and so you can't even roll over or they'll stir even at the littlest movement and you've been laying in the same, uncomfortable position for 30 minutes or more just so you don't wake them and your back is aching but you'd rather have an achy back then an awake baby at 5:30am and then DH, unknowingly rolls over or moves the sheets or some other "needless" (in my mind!) movement and the baby wakes up??!! Man that gets me.
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#76 of 193 Old 02-28-2008, 03:56 PM - Thread Starter
 
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So, I know I said I wasn't going to post DS's sleep patterns every night, but I'm sort of at a loss and wanted any thoughts or feedback...

Last night DS woke up around 9:15pm and I nursed him on one side. Then, when DH and I went to bed around 10:30pm, I didn't wake him to nurse b/c i wanted to see how it would go (and he ate solids pretty well yesterday, so I knew he wasn't starving). DS woke up around 1am and went back to sleep within a minute. But then, he woke up at 4am (again) and it was the same thing as usual, a bit more fussy, hard to get him to fall asleep deeply, tossing and turning until 5:15am when he woke up and I nursed him both sides. He barfed again this time And, he didn't fall back asleep like usual, he snuggled for a bit (which was so yummy) but then he wanted to be up for good at 6am.

Here's where I'm a bit confused... I'm wondering if that 1am (and sometimes 12 or 2am) waking is just taking its sweet time to be phased out. Has anyone BTDT and have a similar situation? Also, like I said in my previous post, the 4am waking is killing me because I'm basically in and out of sleep for two hours. Again, anyone BTDT with a similar situation? I just remembered that yesterday DSs' nap got cut short, so maybe that had something to do with the 1am waking?? (insert sound of me grasping at straws)

I'm thinking that it's just going to take more time since we're doing a more gentle approach and still giving him comfort when he wakes, but I just wanted to hear thoughts from some veterans. How long did it take with your LO?

TIA!
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#77 of 193 Old 02-28-2008, 04:55 PM
 
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I don't have any advice, but I wanted to let you know that the hours from 3:30-6:30 are crappy here to. Once he wakes at 3:30 or 4, he nurses forever even if he just nursed an hour before (we haven't started nightweaning yet). Then it takes him a long time to fall back to sleep. Then he's up 20 minutes later, tossing and turning. At this point he ends up sleeping on top of me, usually on my neck. This morning I had his butt in my face, but I dared not move b/c it would wake him up. So yeah, I'm basically up from 3:30 or 4 every day.
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#78 of 193 Old 02-28-2008, 06:43 PM - Thread Starter
 
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I don't have any advice, but I wanted to let you know that the hours from 3:30-6:30 are crappy here to. Once he wakes at 3:30 or 4, he nurses forever even if he just nursed an hour before (we haven't started nightweaning yet). Then it takes him a long time to fall back to sleep. Then he's up 20 minutes later, tossing and turning. At this point he ends up sleeping on top of me, usually on my neck. This morning I had his butt in my face, but I dared not move b/c it would wake him up. So yeah, I'm basically up from 3:30 or 4 every day.
I had to laugh at the butt in the face! That happens here too and I'm just happy it's not a foot (which kicks very hard sometimes when waking). Maybe there's just something about that time in the am with the waking b/c DS was like that pre-night-weaning too - getting hungry, almost time to wake up... I'm wondering if I should just nurse him when he wakes at 4am because maybe it would give both of us more sleep (that's IF he fell asleep good after nursing - and that's a big IF), but I'm hesitant because it doesn't really fall within the whole night weaning thing and if it's just a matter of him gradually phasing out that waking at 4am, then I don't want to "give in" instead of being patient and it paying off in the long run.
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#79 of 193 Old 03-01-2008, 04:20 AM - Thread Starter
 
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We did this recently with our 17 month old. I wasn't sleeping well nursing all night long and would wakeup with a backache in the morning. And it went very easily, actually. When i nursed him and unlatched him before he was in a deep sleep, he was unhappy. I scooted him to his daddy for snuggles, he cried for a minute and fell asleep. He wasn't willing to give up his 4 or 5 a.m. nursing, so he nurses from 4/5 until we get up at 6:30 or 7. It was a good compromise though. He is now sleeping peacefully between us from 10 or 11 until 4 or 5. So much better!
I remembered that you posted about compromising with that 4/5am feed... Before you decided to nurse him for that feed, was your DS tossing and turning like my DS? I'm wondering if nursing him at that time will make the rest of our morning easier (from 4-6 or 7am). Has your DS ever phased out that 4/5am waking or do you still do it? I think tonight I am going to nurse him if (or should I say, when) he wakes at 4/5am just to see what happens and if it helps. I'm a little scared about it messing up our night weaning, but I don't think one feed at 4/5am will mess up how solid he's been sleeping at the beginning part of the night. Where's a crystal ball when I need it?
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#80 of 193 Old 03-03-2008, 04:09 AM - Thread Starter
 
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Just wanted to post this in case it helps anyone...

Two nights ago, I fed DS before bed (10:30pm) and he woke up at 1pm, but fell asleep within 30 seconds or so. Then, as a test to see what would happen, I decided to nurse him when he woke and was restless at 4:30am. He nursed forever - so much that I took him off the boob because my back was killing me. He fussed for about 3 seconds and then we patted him to sleep and he fell asleep again in about 30 seconds and then woke up for good around 6:20am.

I called Dr. Gordon because I was at a loss about what to do about this 4-ish am waking. I've been feeling like we were getting somewhere and then it started to feel like a regression, so I wanted to ask him if that was normal or what the deal was.

First, he said, "By now you see that this isn't a science." He's right, but then I sort of feel like his plan should not be called "10 Long Nights" because even though I knew this could take more or less time than 10 nights, I still sort of had that timeframe in my head because of the name of the plan. That's neither here nor there, though. But, it made me realize that we're not out of the trees yet.

Dr. Gordon said that my DS would drop that 1-2am-ish waking probably in a week or two. And, even last night, DS tossed and turned during that time, but didn't ever actually wake up. So, I feel like that's him transitioning into not waking (possibly wishful thinking on my part, though).

Regarding the 4am waking, Dr. Gordon said that I should do what I felt would work best for us - that I ultimately know better than he does. But he did also say that DS will continue to wake to nurse at that time if I continue to nurse him then (which makes sense, obviously). He basically said something like, "You will see results sooner if you don't nurse him then." And then it got me thinking that yeah, by nursing him, I'm prolonging the whole thing. Also, I feel like by sometimes nursing him at 4am and sometimes not, it could be confusing for him, so I've decided to keep on with NOT nursing him at that time, unless he's really upset and needs it. Last night, when I didn't nurse him at 4am, he actually went back to sleep smoother than he had been, so I'm really seeing that it's all about giving it time.

Dr. Gordon also told me that it was completely normal to have these regressions and feel like you're coming really far and then be set back a bit. That made me feel better, like at least we weren't doing something wrong!

The other thing that's been happening to me is that the past few nights, I haven't been able to sleep very well even when DS is asleep. I feel like I'm waiting to see when he's going to wake up. I'm hoping that stops soon. Has anyone else been doing that? There's nothing more annoying than having the time to sleep, but not being able to! :

That's all - just wanted to post about my conversation with Dr. Gordon. I feel this duty to report his advice on the subject!

BTW - DS is 14 months old and I haven't had my period yet, but I'm starting to feel like it's about to come. I'm thinking that its return is probably due to the night weaning even though DS still nurses a TON during the day.
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#81 of 193 Old 03-03-2008, 03:16 PM
 
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The other thing that's been happening to me is that the past few nights, I haven't been able to sleep very well even when DS is asleep. I feel like I'm waiting to see when he's going to wake up. I'm hoping that stops soon. Has anyone else been doing that? There's nothing more annoying than having the time to sleep, but not being able to! :

That's all - just wanted to post about my conversation with Dr. Gordon. I feel this duty to report his advice on the subject!

BTW - DS is 14 months old and I haven't had my period yet, but I'm starting to feel like it's about to come. I'm thinking that its return is probably due to the night weaning even though DS still nurses a TON during the day.
Well, thanks for posting all that. Makes perfect sense what he said. About the not being able to sleep even now when he IS sleeping...OMG do I know that feeling. Exactly what happened to me, too, and I agree its for the same reason you mention. Although, the good news is that it did stop after about three nights for me. But, I am not sleeping with ds anymore, so I don't know if it stopped because I was able to release my feelings and fears and worries and hand over nighttime responsibilities to dh instead? But either way, I am SURE you will get over it as time goes on and things go smoother especially when he isn't waking you up AT ALL anymore.

And the period thing makes sense. My ds slept through the night when he was 0-4 mos old because we stupidly swaddled him (IMO) and my period returned at about 3 or 4 mos PP. So, this might do it for ya.

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#82 of 193 Old 03-03-2008, 03:51 PM
 
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happy2bamama -
Just wanted to let you know that my DH and I talked and 2 nights ago decided to do a scaled back version of Dr. Gordon's plan. I decided I'm ok with her still nightnursing just not as often as she was. So I picked from 12-4 am to cut out feeds. And I have to say, so far so good. I really do think she must have been ready for this, b/c when we tried this for her at 13 months, it was not a pretty sight. So, I think she is in a much better place. She only woke 2x during the block the 1st night and last night it was only once!! Plus, overall, her other blocks of sleeping beyond that time have stretched longer including her nap yesterday. So, I know it's still early, but I'm encouraged. And who knows, maybe if she continues to do well, we'll try extending the time by an hour on each side.
Good Luck with your DS and let me know how continuing to refuse that 4 am feed goes. My DD is also restless at that time and usually nurses alot between that time and her actual wake-up.
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#83 of 193 Old 03-03-2008, 04:05 PM - Thread Starter
 
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happy2bamama -
Just wanted to let you know that my DH and I talked and 2 nights ago decided to do a scaled back version of Dr. Gordon's plan. I decided I'm ok with her still nightnursing just not as often as she was. So I picked from 12-4 am to cut out feeds. And I have to say, so far so good. I really do think she must have been ready for this, b/c when we tried this for her at 13 months, it was not a pretty sight. So, I think she is in a much better place. She only woke 2x during the block the 1st night and last night it was only once!! Plus, overall, her other blocks of sleeping beyond that time have stretched longer including her nap yesterday. So, I know it's still early, but I'm encouraged. And who knows, maybe if she continues to do well, we'll try extending the time by an hour on each side.
Good Luck with your DS and let me know how continuing to refuse that 4 am feed goes. My DD is also restless at that time and usually nurses alot between that time and her actual wake-up.
I'm so glad things are going well for you guys! I think the way you are going about it is excellent. And yeah, I think that once your LO isn't waking at all during that 12-4 window, it will probably extend before and after in a few months (or so). I bet that sounds exciting!!

I sort of can't remember last night - I actually slept instead of waiting up for DS to wake! But, what I do remember is that DS woke up around 2:45am and I barely had to do anything to get him back to sleep again. I don't even think he really woke up. And then I can't remember if he woke up around 4am and went back to sleep or just woke up at 5:45am and we nursed, but either way, it wasn't eventful enough for me to remember, so that means it was smooth and no tossing and turning - yay! When DS did nurse (just one side), he barfed again. I really don't know what is up with that. I know my boobs are super full and my milk comes out really fast, so maybe once my milk regulates a bit more and isn't SO full in the am he won't barf anymore. Things seem to be looking up though, in general!

Thanks for the post!
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#84 of 193 Old 03-04-2008, 08:26 PM
 
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I totally know what you mean - it feels so strange to NOT just offer the boob immediately, but then it feels so awesome and empowering (IMO) to be able to soothe DS without it. I'm so happy that your DD is able to go back to sleep without the breast and without much crying. I think that's a prime situation.
This really resonated with me. Last night was really the first time since he was 4 months old that I was able to get my guy (11 months) back to sleep with anything other than nursing. I just held him in bed, and he fell asleep (there was one time while he was teething that he did not fall asleep while nursing, but that was NOT a peaceful experience!).

It was so...I don't know..different, wonderful to have him just fall asleep in my arms. I have been thinking of it all day, the way his head felt snuggled in my neck as he fell asleep.

It is an awesome feeling...
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#85 of 193 Old 03-04-2008, 09:53 PM - Thread Starter
 
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This really resonated with me. Last night was really the first time since he was 4 months old that I was able to get my guy (11 months) back to sleep with anything other than nursing. I just held him in bed, and he fell asleep (there was one time while he was teething that he did not fall asleep while nursing, but that was NOT a peaceful experience!).

It was so...I don't know..different, wonderful to have him just fall asleep in my arms. I have been thinking of it all day, the way his head felt snuggled in my neck as he fell asleep.

It is an awesome feeling...
Awww... that sounds so sweet. I think it's so wonderful to know that WE can soothe them and not just our boob (even though it's still us) KWIM? Although, I'm not knocking the awesomeness of the boob, it's still magical!

I've also found that ever since we've been nightweaning, my anxiety level is so much lower. Not that it was super high before, but now, when I leave DS with DH for a few hours, I don't worry about DS freaking out because he wants to nurse because I know that DS knows how to deal without it for a bit. And if DS falls asleep with DH (in the car), I don't worry as much about him waking up and wanting to nurse immediately either.

I have to say, overall, I feel so much happier with everything about motherhood. I don't know if night weaning was the total reason (or maybe was it the new jeans and shoes?), but I notice that I have sooooo much more patience and (sorry to be cliche), zest for life! And, naps have been going amazingly. Again, don't know if it's due to the night weaning or something else, but DH and I have driven DS for almost all of his naps for the past four months and the past two weeks, I think we've done it once. DS has been nursing to sleep in bed like the old days without a lot of struggle. What a relief - I actually get a big chunk of time everyday to nap with DS or to do what needs to be done (or eat). And, he's been napping for a lot longer too. He did almost 3 hours yesterday and is has been down for 2.5 hours today.

BTW - last night DS slept straight from 8pm to 3:45am - almost 8 hours!!! It made me think, "Shoot! Why didn't I go to bed at 8pm instead of 11pm?!" He was in and out of sleep from 4-6am again, but it's getting better gradually.

How's everyone else doing with it?
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#86 of 193 Old 03-04-2008, 11:16 PM
 
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We are doing great. Life is better overall because of this. For us, we needed it for SOOO many reasons. I thoroughly enjoy sleeping straight through from 10-5 or so. Our only bump (like your 4 am waking) is that when ds wakes at 5 -6 ish he begs dh to nurse (and thats fine) so he brings him to me and I do - but he never can get himself to settle back down to sleep again after that. I think its because he needs to nurse so much at that point, he nurses for like 30 min. or more usually and that seems to actually wake him up more than anything. So, we just keep hoping he'll work that out because it seems once in a while, like today, he DID fall back to sleep until 9 - and thats even nicer!

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#87 of 193 Old 03-05-2008, 02:16 PM
 
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Since I posted a few times on this thread, I thought I would update on our progress. Basically, I got really sick (bronchitis/pneumonia like). I could tell by pumping that my milk supply was dropping so I resumed night nursing. I can't afford a drop in milk supply since DD is nearly 11 months and barely has an interest in solids. I couldn't risk reduced night nursing and illness would cause problems. But I am looking forward to resuming this when we are all better and she is eating more. So probably some time in the early summer.

Great thread..
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#88 of 193 Old 03-05-2008, 03:59 PM
 
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sounds like you made the right decision...good luck in the future with it!

Already!?!?! cold.gif  ~ Lori, doula, childbirth educator, wife to Jermaine 6/04, and mom to two happy and energetic boys - Tatum 6/06 and Keegan 3/09

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#89 of 193 Old 03-05-2008, 04:02 PM
 
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Last night was night 4 and it was ok. I think DD's molars were making her a grump, that and the only 1/2 hr nap she took that day. Plus DH got home from being out of town - lots of excitement.
All in all, she was up alot at the beginning of the night. I finally nursed her at 9:45 and she slept till 12:15. This is in our window, so I told her nursies were sleeping and she protested of course, but she went back to sleep on her own, just by snuggling with me. And it didn't take that long either! She woke at 3:30 again and snuggled again to sleep. Then woke at 4:15 and I finally nursed her since it was past our 12-4 am window. She was very happy. And then slept til 6:40. So, not bad considering her teeth were really bugging her. Hoping her nap today is better!
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#90 of 193 Old 03-09-2008, 10:48 PM
 
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So we are working on this now, and overall, not so bad. He starts the night on an air mattress on the floor, and does great for the first wake up. I pick him up when he wakes, and he is right back out.

When I move him to bed is when the fun starts. He was not happy...but it was not nearly as awful as I thought. So far, we have been lucky in that he has only woken up twice, instead of his usual every hour!

My question, and I think it was addressed a little earlier, just wanted to get thoughts and experience.

I have chosen 9-4 a.m. He sleeps so restlessly in the early a.m., I afraid that he will be up for the day if I do not feed. Plus, I would like to get it to where he sleeps through the early evening before I come to bed, so we get an hour or so to ourselves Not too hopeful on that front, but I have noticed that the back to sleep has gotten easier WITHOUT the nursing--holding him, he falls back asleep so much quicker, so that is progress.

Ok, I digressed and forgot to get to the question. Will feeding him at 4 a.m., and then again at 5:30, as opposed to having his last feeding at 11:00 p.m. and the next right before he wakes up, screw up the rest of the night? Will it confuse him too much do y'all think?

I ask because we are only on night two of the no feeding at all part, so I am not sure what to expect!

Hope all is going well for the rest of you!

Thanks--
Meg
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