Six reasons not to be scared of vaccines - Mothering Forums
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#1 of 9 Old 04-16-2013, 11:49 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Thought this made some good points and had some good links to vaccine safety studies.

http://www.mamamia.com.au/news/anti-vaccination-rhetoric-what-to-say/
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#2 of 9 Old 05-19-2013, 09:40 PM
 
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Thank you for sharing.

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#3 of 9 Old 05-19-2013, 09:54 PM
 
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I am happy not to be paranoid about every VPD around me.

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#4 of 9 Old 05-27-2013, 02:12 PM
 
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'Vaccination is more than a personal choice, it’s a social responsibility. Like not driving drunk or not smoking around people who don’t want to breathe in your nicotine.'

 

 

I will have to remember that statement.
 

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#5 of 9 Old 05-29-2013, 08:51 AM
 
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Originally Posted by Alenushka View Post

I am happy not to be paranoid about every VPD around me.

me too

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If the people let government decide what foods they eat and what medicines they take, their bodies will soon be in as sorry a state as are the souls of those who live under tyranny." Thomas Jefferson.

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#6 of 9 Old 05-29-2013, 07:46 PM
 
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Originally Posted by Minerva23 View Post

'Vaccination is more than a personal choice, it’s a social responsibility. Like not driving drunk or not smoking around people who don’t want to breathe in your nicotine.'

 

 

I will have to remember that statement.
 

 

I tried not to choke on my coffee when I read that. Drink driving rates are staggering here in Australia (18% of all fatal crashes in NSW involve alcohol) and seeing as the article is from an Australian site, I thought it was a bit rich to make that statement. This country has an attitude to alcohol (the more access the better) that makes a lot of new migrants shake their heads in disbelief. So, for a more effective argument about the merits of social responsibility, I'd have picked something besides alcohol consumption and drink driving considering the so-called normal, average people I've seen bringing wine to kids' concerts in the park, packing booze in brown bags for a beach BBQ, or guys having three or four pints at 4pm after work and driving home. That analogy just falls flat here and I had to roll my eyes at it. But perhaps for many Aussies, it's a select social responsibility, I suppose.


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#7 of 9 Old 05-30-2013, 12:52 AM
 
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I tried not to choke on my coffee when I read that. Drink driving rates are staggering here in Australia (18% of all fatal crashes in NSW involve alcohol) and seeing as the article is from an Australian site, I thought it was a bit rich to make that statement. This country has an attitude to alcohol (the more access the better) that makes a lot of new migrants shake their heads in disbelief. So, for a more effective argument about the merits of social responsibility, I'd have picked something besides alcohol consumption and drink driving considering the so-called normal, average people I've seen bringing wine to kids' concerts in the park, packing booze in brown bags for a beach BBQ, or guys having three or four pints at 4pm after work and driving home. That analogy just falls flat here and I had to roll my eyes at it. But perhaps for many Aussies, it's a select social responsibility, I suppose.

 

I agree. It's extremely rich. A lot of people here almost spend their entire weekend getting blind or smashed just for the hell of it. Boredom perhaps? Who knows. Whether you're in the western suburbs or the upper north shore, it's no different. If it's not the outright obvious weekend bus stop drunks in the low socioeconomic areas, it's the more acceptable north shore social drunks who have 2-3 glasses of wine with their lunch or dinner. Of course I'm generalizing, but I think my point is clear - Drinking is almost a second occupation here.

 

People also have no hesitation in getting behind the wheel after a few drinks despite so much social awareness. There are government campaigns aimed at curbing this behaviour.

 

Rachel Dunlop says that vaccination is a social responsibility like not deliberately (or even unknowingly) drink driving. Fine, I can appreciate that NOT drink driving is a social responsibility. I agree wholeheartedly.

 

However, considering how many people actually do drink until they are drunk and then drive, it's really an inefficient way to start her argument.

 

Also, this opens up a can of worms over how the government should police all of these social responsibilities, including drink-driving.

 

Does this mean that they should start forcing people at the pub/bar/club to hand over their car keys upon entry, with collection once you are sober? After all, people who drink have a social responsibility to fulfil and they aren't fulfilling it by intending to still drive themselves home after a night of drinking. They could potentially kill someone through their selfishness. A blanket rule to cover all drinkers (regardless of personal circumstances and ethics) should be initiated.

 

Shouldn't I, as a responsible human being, also advocate fiercely to put a stop to drink driving by forcing drinkers to choose otherwise?

In order to achieve this goal, I should be banding together with other responsible people concerned about drink driving. Together, we can work towards changing the laws regarding alcohol consumption, the sale of alcohol and the current repercussions of being a foolish member of society. We can work towards this goal until we can ensure that no one will ever drink and drive again.

In my plight to raise awareness of the dangers of drink driving, I should also encourage others to ostracize these selfish drinkers. After all, people who drink have no regard for the wellbeing of my family or for the general public. Their irresponsible actions could easily effect any one of us. Even if drinkers state that they only have one standard drink per occasion and are quite responsible in their approach to this, it doesn't matter*. The same enforcements should still take place regardless of personal approaches towards drinking. I mean, you could potentially have more drinks and thwart public health and safety measures. That should not be allowed to happen.

 

Other initiatives could be.. Only issuing driver's licenses to those who do not drink at all (affidavit a prerequisite). Also, restricting the sales of alcohol to only one per person, per night (and I.D must be provided for every purchase)?

 

Sound unfair? Perhaps it even sounds like an infringement of your basic rights to decide what is right and wrong for your own personal circumstances. That's how forced vaccination** sounds to someone who chooses not to vaccinate, even if it is under the guise of social responsiblity.

 

*Even if you are unvaccinated, but in superb health, are rarely ill and know the basics of common courtesy when it comes to being ill, it doesn't matter. You could potentially catch the most deadly disease and will most certainly cough all over everyone and kill all of mankind. Even if you're currently well, you are still considered to be a vile, disease carrying being - a hinderance to public health and safety. That should not be allowed to happen.

 

**Forced vaccination comes about through ostracizing of the non vaxxing community to the point of vitriol and more recently in Australia, making Family Tax Benefits and childcare unavailable to children who are unvaccinated.


 

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#8 of 9 Old 06-13-2013, 08:50 PM
 
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But isn't drunk driving already illegal? So... what's your point?

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#9 of 9 Old 06-14-2013, 10:27 AM
 
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What does it being illegal have to do with anything? Rachel was talking about social responsibilities and one of her examples was refraining from drink driving. She likened the social responsibility of vaccination to the social responsibility of only driving when sober.

 

My point was that yes, driving when sober is a social responsibility; but where does enforcing that social responsiblity start and end? We know drink driving is illegal and that is a fantastic start, but it still doesn't stop people from having a drink and getting behind that wheel. Do we start stripping people of the "right" to even purchase alcohol? It seems like a plausible way to approach the issue. After all, the less drunk people we have floating around in general, the less likely we will encounter a drunk person behind the wheel. Now liken what I've said about drink driving, to vaccination and herd immunity. The more vaccinated people we have, the less likely we will have people who are ill, floating around spreading disease throughout the community. With both scenarios, the more people that comply with said social responsibility, the safer we will all be, correct?

 

How do we ensure that the social responsibility is actually fulfilled in both scenarios, without infringing on people's basic rights to decide what is right and wrong for their own circumstances? Drink driving is illegal, but alcohol is still readily available, so we are still leaving people to decide on how much alcohol they want to consume at any one time and in any circumstance, irrespective of the fact that such decisions could directly impact another person's life. Why isn't the same consideration given to vaccination? There seems to be a slow but steady move to "force" (for lack of better wording) people to vaccinate. The right to decide on which and how many vaccines a person wishes to sign themselves up for, is slowly being eroded. Why is it okay to have wiggle room with the social responsibility of not drink driving, but not with other social responsibilities such as vaccination?

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