My 5yo must get the MMR to enter school, but will he need the 2nd shot?What about leaky gut? - Mothering Forums
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#1 of 25 Old 07-20-2013, 02:38 PM - Thread Starter
 
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My 5yo never received the MMR at 12mths.  Now his school requires it for him to enter  in September. Ill get him the shot, but will he need the 2nd shot that most 5yo's get at that point?

I'd rather not get him the shot at all, as  he has all the symptoms of leaky gut.  I cant imagine  shots are a good idea in that situation, but the ped doesnt seem to think it matters....

 

Thanks for any useful advice-those skeptical of vaccination are more welcome....

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#2 of 25 Old 07-20-2013, 02:48 PM
 
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The NHS (UK health service) recommends a second dose on the catch-up schedule, but is unspecific (online) about the recommended spacing. That seems like a question for your doctor. 9/10 children are fully protected by the first dose of MMR - the second catches 9/10 of those for whom the single dose was not enough. Many people on these boards recommend titers before the second dose - since 90% of children technically don't need it (although it's not expected to have any significant side effects). 

 

I don't know anything about leaky gut. Most children get the MMR vaccine just fine (my son just had his second dose with nothing more than a slight raised red bump) - and measles or mumps are not diseases to be trifled with in my opinion.

 

 If you can get your doctor to talk you through this a bit more I think that would be a good idea. You will hear from others here (I suspect) that you should not get the MMR - in my opinion the benefits outweight the risks for almost all children, and you should push your doctor to take the time to reassure you that it's OK for your son (or consider your concerns more seriously). 

 

Good luck making your decision. 


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#3 of 25 Old 07-20-2013, 05:20 PM
 
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You're his mother--it's up to you to do what you think is best for him. If you don't think it's a good idea for him to get the MMR, don't let him get it! You can get an exemption for the school vaccine requirements. Depending on your state, you can get one for personal beliefs or religious beliefs. If your state only allows religious exemptions, it doesn't matter what church you belong to, if any. Anyone can have their own religious beliefs against vaccines.

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#4 of 25 Old 07-21-2013, 04:02 AM
 
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You should delay until you figure out if you want to take a chance with it after some research, or if you want to do an exemption for now...what state are you in?  No one can force you to vaccinate, altho a couple states like west virginia, and mississippi, do not have religious or philsophical exemptions, and a medical exemption is either of those states are hard to obtain.  

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#5 of 25 Old 07-21-2013, 01:44 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Thankyou everyone.

Well, in my state (NYC) a religious exemption would be required,  but since he has already had his other shots, i  dont think i would get one. The other issue- its a Jewish day school. I dont think Judaism has philosophical objections to vaccination.... Maybe it doesnt matter that its a Jewish day school.

 

I am required to have this form filled out by a doctor otherwise they will not let him start school.

 http://www.nyc.gov/html/doh/downloads/pdf/hcp/hcp-ch205.pdf

 

 As for the MMR and leaky gut, its hard to come to a conclusion about it. Dr Natasha Campbell

 MacBride argues in her book 'Gut and Psychology Syndrome' that compromised gut health could lead to adverse reactions to vaccines.  Doctors dont seem to know much about this stuff. My son is clearly intolerant of gluten and  some other foods. I dont know if he is celiac.   I asked the doc  whether or not it was safe  for celiacs to receive vaccinations and she had no hesitation in the matter-yes, it was. 

 

Im not 100% convinced.

 

I believe ds requires the vax to start school, but i may be able to procrastinate about it.  For eg, the form requires the vaxes to be listed, but if one is missing, can the parent say that he is 'scheduled' to have his shot?  Or does he need  all shots. That has not been made clear to me.

 

I wondered if others have been there done that.  Thanks in advance.

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#6 of 25 Old 07-21-2013, 01:49 PM
 
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You said he already had other shots - any reactions there? Is there any reason to worry MMR vaccine will be more reactive?

Mother of two living in UK. Daughter (2007) born in USA, son (2010) born here. I'm pro natural birth, midwife care, breastfeeding, co-sleeping, baby wearing and a keen advocate of cloth diapering. I'm a full time working research scientist (physical sciences) and I'm pro-vaccine.

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#7 of 25 Old 07-21-2013, 02:00 PM - Thread Starter
 
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At the time, i wasnt aware of these issues since he was just a baby. He didnt react badly to any of the  vaccines, but i cant be sure what their role is in causing his leaky gut/adverse reactions to foods/adhd type behaviors, in the first place.  That is something i will never know, but makes me all the more cautious.

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#8 of 25 Old 07-21-2013, 02:15 PM
 
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I would see if you can get a titer drawn. If he's already immune from the first shot you could probably get out of the second shot that way and then you don't have to worry about the exemption at all. If he's not immune then you can figure out what you're going to do. 


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#9 of 25 Old 07-21-2013, 02:20 PM - Thread Starter
 
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He never had the first shot....

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#10 of 25 Old 07-21-2013, 02:33 PM
 
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Sorry, missed that part.


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#11 of 25 Old 07-21-2013, 04:25 PM
 
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You may want to get a titer drawn anyway. It's not likely that he'd be immune, but it IS possible, especially if he's spent a lot of time around other infants/children, who may have been contagious for a couple of weeks after getting their shot.
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#12 of 25 Old 07-21-2013, 06:16 PM - Thread Starter
 
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That would be really cool ...i think i will probably try it. I presume that applies to measles, mumps , rubella and chicken pox? 

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#13 of 25 Old 07-22-2013, 07:32 AM
 
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If he has any friends who have just had the MMR arrange a playdate a few days before the blood draw! Dog owners who run titers know to take their dogs to the dog park prior to testing for a little boost!


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#14 of 25 Old 07-22-2013, 08:48 AM
 
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MMR only requires one dose to establish immunity after age 4, but most states do not awknowledge that. I would still get one dose & then run titers for the next 'dose'.

MMR is live, so it has a different reaction profile than the majority of other vaccines.

IDK where I stand on it's reactivity really, but I do know they have found the live viruses in recipients many years later . . .
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#15 of 25 Old 07-22-2013, 08:50 AM
 
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Another unique thing about MMR is that there are not as many brands to choose from as say DTaP: as far as *I* know it is just Merck.
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#16 of 25 Old 07-22-2013, 09:06 AM
 
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Correction: apparently a few other companies (Sanofi) have versions of MMR. I would be curious to know if they are available in the US.
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#17 of 25 Old 07-22-2013, 04:35 PM
 
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Originally Posted by dinahx View Post

Correction: apparently a few other companies (Sanofi) have versions of MMR. I would be curious to know if they are available in the US.

Merck's MMR is the only one available in the U.S.

http://www.fda.gov/BiologicsBloodVaccines/Vaccines/ApprovedProducts/ucm093833.htm

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#18 of 25 Old 07-22-2013, 04:38 PM
 
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Some people give high dose vitamin A for 2 days right before the MMR. So that's something you might want to research.

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#19 of 25 Old 07-23-2013, 06:57 AM - Thread Starter
 
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Thankyou. I will keep that in mind. There are also homeoapthic remedies out there that help to process vaccines to minimize toxicity. I will look into that as well....

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#20 of 25 Old 07-26-2013, 03:44 AM
 
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Overall it's likely do be immune after one dose. I'd supplement with multis, cod liver oil and vitamin d. A is super important, but my cod liver oil had it. For two weeks following the vaccine my kids got a ton of cod liver oil. Ds is nearly 5 and dd 2.4 years old. She had a fever, rash and swollen lymph nodes in her groin. Well draw titers for both in September.
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#21 of 25 Old 07-27-2013, 09:38 AM - Thread Starter
 
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Thats great advice, thankyou.

 

Ive read about an MMR homeopathic remedy, but cant seem to find it. Also, its unclear whether this remedy is intended to take before and after the actual shot (as myhomeopath suggested while ago) or in place of the shot. Cant find anything on the internet... 

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#22 of 25 Old 07-29-2013, 08:04 PM
 
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For an almost 5 year old, your child would need 2 MMR doses separated by 4 weeks to be considered immunized.  Some states will recognize titers for MMR, some will only recognize titers if the child comes from a foreign county or the entire vax record has been lost.  I do not know the policy in NYC.

 

That being said, I vaxed both of mine for MMR before age 2, but had titers drawn at age 4.  Both were immune, our ped recommend we redraw titers at ages 9 and 15 to be sure that immunity was sustained


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#23 of 25 Old 07-29-2013, 08:16 PM
 
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Originally Posted by anj_rn View Post

Some states will recognize titers for MMR, some will only recognize titers if the child comes from a foreign county or the entire vax record has been lost.  

 

Every state recognizes titers for MMR.

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#24 of 25 Old 07-29-2013, 11:51 PM
 
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Originally Posted by ma2two View Post

Every state recognizes titers for MMR.

Yup.
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#25 of 25 Old 07-30-2013, 12:08 AM
 
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You only need one dose after 4.

 

Mumps can lead to infertility in boys.  Measles is also not as benighn a people think it is.

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