Thinking about Hib.... - Mothering Forums
Selective & Delayed Vaccination > Thinking about Hib....
MommatoGray's Avatar MommatoGray 10:24 AM 11-04-2013

I hope this is the right place to post....I also posted in INV because at the moment DS is not vaccinated.


My DS will be three in Jan. He is still nursing, eats fairly well, is at home with me and since I am a home body we do not go out a whole lot. I thought we would start vaxing at 2 but somehow he is almost three! I kind of thought we would always start with one shot of ActHib. I am working on tracking some down, right now our health unit only has Hiberix. But if I decide to move forward I will keep up with the phone calls to try and find ActHib.


The usual arguments against Hib don't do a whole lot to make me feel better. Examples. We didn't have it and we are fine. You are breastfeeding and that shows a lot of protection. He is not in group care so risk is low. I understand the risk is low. For some reason this has always been the vax that has weighed heavily on my shoulders. And after 2+ years of research I still feel sick to my stomach to not do it and sick if I don't.


The things I know. Risk drops after 2, peaks at 6/7 months. But there have been deaths in 3 and over, obviously I don't know about breastfeeding status but I know that the children in Minnesota were not in group care. Breastfeeding offers a protective effect, I have read the studies and they are very convincing.


A few questions:


1. I am wondering if you did chose this vaccine what made you come to this conclusion?


2. If you did not chose this vaccine what made you come to this conclusion?


3. If you vaccinated for Hib did you also vaccinate with Prevnar?


4. What age did your child receive Hib? 


Why am I still unsure?


1. If pre-vaccine children were mostly colonized with Hib by age 5 and now Hib is virtually non-existent, than how is my child going to be colonized by age 5. I was looking at a study (and now of course I cannot find it) but it was saying that Hib is now being found in children aged 10-14?? Anyone have any thoughts on any of this?


2. The link to type 1 diabetes. It seems like a causal link and the study I read was not overly convincing. I would really like more info on this as diabetes type 2 is in our family. On my Mom and Dad’s side.


3. The ingredients I read included ammonium sulfate, anyone know more about this. I could not find much except that it is used as a commercial fertilizer.


4. I have read quite a bit on here about serotype replacement. And I do have a few questions regarding that. I guess I am thinking that if I give him ActHib than he will be covered against strain B. Of course that is the only one. I guess where I am confused is are we actually saying that if he was covered for B that the chance of the other strains actually increases? I guess the way I was looking at it was that at least he would be covered for B. If the other strains do not increase in likelihood than at least he is covered for that one? KWIM??


5. The issue with giving Hib and then increasing pneumococcal bacteria? Is this a concern??


6. I have to say I am also having a difficult time understanding the testing they did. Plus on the inserts it continually seems to state that the vaccine is meant for children up to 18 months of age, although the catch up schedule indicates that un-vaccinated children 5 and under need to have a minimum of one dose???


I hope someone can help me. I am driving myself crazy. Having a hard time sleeping. We have a new baby coming in April and I am feeling like I need to make a choice about all of this before than. The first year with my son have a lot of added stress because of vaccine research. Thank you in advance for your replies. I so appreciate these forums.

MommatoGray's Avatar MommatoGray 03:41 PM 11-09-2013

I would love some input :joy

japonica's Avatar japonica 04:04 PM 11-10-2013

Hi there. 


I can't speak for anyone else but I think maybe the crickets here is that you outlined all of the issues so well that there's not much more to add than it's a personal decision, your call, from this point on. 


Personally, we did not do Hib vaccine. I looked at all of the risk factors associated with reported cases of the clinical disease from the studies…lack of breastfeeding, childcare attendance, older siblings (so it wasn't as much of an issue for DD), smoking in the home, socio-economic status, ethnic heritage, and decided that we could forego it. There was also a thread on here that broke down the risk of the invasive disease and that it was not a constant one from age 1-5, but dropped dramatically after the 2nd birthday. Both of my kids were extended breastfeeders, until over age 3, and I was a SAHM, so that influenced our decision as well. Someone with different risk factors and circumstances might feel that the Hib vaccine is a reasonable option. 


Both of my kids are over 5 years old now so they no longer require it. Interesting about the 10-14 age group you mentioned. I'd not heard anything about it. Was it clinical disease or just colonised?


Good luck with whatever you decide. I think you outlined the pros and cons pretty well. You have to make the final call.

MommatoGray's Avatar MommatoGray 04:43 PM 11-13-2013

Thanks japonica! I really appreciate your point of view. Maybe I am stuck because I feel like so many of these really important choices are on my shoulders. I will find the link about the 10-14 age group and come back and share it. Thanks again!!


What is your view on prevnar??

MommatoGray's Avatar MommatoGray 04:46 PM 11-13-2013


In addition to the proportional increase in cases of non-type b Haemophilus influenzae disease in the post-H. influenzae type b vaccine era, the incidence of invasive H. influenzae disease was found to be approaching the rates of H. influenzae type b disease that were documented in the prevaccine period. Fifty-six percent of invasive disease now occurs in individuals aged >10 years.

japonica's Avatar japonica 05:18 PM 11-13-2013

Yeah, I just noticed that link the other day, thanks for posting it here though. Serotype replacement and epidemiological shift. Yikes. 


Even with the shift of non-Hib strains to the higher age groups, as the study documented, there's nothing to be done about it anyway as there's no vaccine for anything but Hib. 


The other thing that struck me when I was reading the study was that it was done in Manitoba using isolates from Manitoba, Northwestern Ontario, and Nunavut. The authors then make the observation that the study, "may reflect the epidemiology of H. influenzae disease in Canada as a whole," yet the big red flag for me is the ethnic background and socio-economic study of their cases. The majority of people in northwestern Ontario and Nunavut are Native Canadian. Even the capital of Manitoba, Winnipeg, has a rate of 10% of the population is Indigenous. Associated with this population group is 1) smoking 2) poverty and overcrowding, including abysmal housing conditions 3) poor diet 4) high chronic disease burden. So, it strikes me to say that it "might be representative" of the country as a whole is a pretty big leap.


We did not do prevnar either. There was a lot of discussion about it, when the kids were younger, about how the serotype shift had been relatively quick and quite obvious. Indeed, by the time DS came along, they'd gone from Prevnar 7 to 13. Mine are both too old for it now anyway. 

Tags: Selective Vaccination , Delayed Vaccination