Dtap or Pediarix? - Mothering Forums
Forum Jump: 
 
Thread Tools
#1 of 24 Old 10-27-2008, 01:53 PM - Thread Starter
 
newmom0708's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Posts: 5
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Does anyone know which is safer? My daughter will be getting her 1st Dtap shot at 4 mos. in November. Her doctor has the Pediarix, which I believe is 5 in 1- Dtap, Hep B and IPV. I am not sure if I should get the Dtap alone and spread out the HepB and IPV seperately, or just get the all in one Pediarix. Her pedi said the IPV shot alone has more preservative in it so she would rather give the Pediarix. I know the Pediarix is supposed to have only trace amounts of thimerosol (sp?), but all 5 viruses at once scares me! I would appreciate hearing what you all think and what others are doing!
newmom0708 is offline  
#2 of 24 Old 10-27-2008, 02:16 PM
 
Gitti's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Ready to move on...
Posts: 14,805
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
I am probably the least helpful because we as a family have researched vaccines and we are not doing any. My two dd have decided not to vaccinate their kids. The one grandchild that did get some vaccines had a reaction, although no doctor would ever admit that, and so the other two grandchildren were not vaccinated and are much healthier for it. (ages 11, 5, 3)

No one has to inject their child with vaccines, and every state has some sort of an exemption for school. No exemption is required before a child goes to day care or school.

I wish you luck with your decision.
Gitti is offline  
#3 of 24 Old 10-27-2008, 02:18 PM
 
Gitti's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Ready to move on...
Posts: 14,805
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
I also meant to say welcome to the vaccine forum and kudos to you for researching. You owe it to your child, we all owe that much to our children since vaccines affect the immune system profoundly.
Gitti is offline  
#4 of 24 Old 10-27-2008, 02:25 PM
 
wallacesmum's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Southern Maine
Posts: 1,367
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Do you have hepatitis B?
wallacesmum is offline  
#5 of 24 Old 10-27-2008, 02:32 PM
 
alegna's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Posts: 44,408
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
I wouldn't consider any of those for a child under 2 years old.

-Angela
alegna is offline  
#6 of 24 Old 10-27-2008, 02:55 PM
 
spero's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: the back of beyond
Posts: 9,921
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by newmom0708 View Post
I know the Pediarix is supposed to have only trace amounts of thimerosol (sp?),
There is no thimerosal in Pediarix.

http://us.gsk.com/products/assets/us_pediarix.pdf

Quote:
Each 0.5-mL dose also contains 4.5 mg of NaCl and aluminum adjuvant (not more than 0.85 mg aluminum by assay). Each dose also contains ≤100 mcg of residual formaldehyde and ≤100 mcg of polysorbate 80 (Tween 80). Neomycin sulfate and polymyxin B are used in the polio vaccine manufacturing process and may be present in the final vaccine at ≤0.05 ng neomycin and ≤0.01 ng polymyxin B per dose. The procedures used to manufacture the HBsAg antigen result in a product that contains ≤5% yeast protein.
PEDIARIX is formulated without preservatives.
Thimerosal is a preservative.

Every baptized Christian is, or should be, someone with an actual (disturbing) experience, ... a close encounter, with God; someone who, as a result, becomes a disturbing presence to others. - Fr. Anthony J. Gittins, A Presence That Disturbs
spero is offline  
#7 of 24 Old 10-27-2008, 03:25 PM
 
Marnica's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Posts: 5,585
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by newmom0708 View Post
Does anyone know which is safer? My daughter will be getting her 1st Dtap shot at 4 mos. in November. Her doctor has the Pediarix, which I believe is 5 in 1- Dtap, Hep B and IPV. I am not sure if I should get the Dtap alone and spread out the HepB and IPV seperately, or just get the all in one Pediarix. Her pedi said the IPV shot alone has more preservative in it so she would rather give the Pediarix. I know the Pediarix is supposed to have only trace amounts of thimerosol (sp?), but all 5 viruses at once scares me! I would appreciate hearing what you all think and what others are doing!

I would advise you to do your research before getting the DPaT separate or combine. The DPaT is one of the most reactive vaccines given today. check out the VAERS. As for separate or combine always choose separate if you decide to do it at all. No studies have EVER been done on the safety of injecting a tiny baby (or anyone else for that matter) with 5 viruses/diseases along with all of the preservatives at one time. It's a toxic/dangerous cocktail. As for the IPV having "more" preservatives Id say your ped has no clue what he's taking about (don't worry most peds don't when it comes to vaccines...they just regurgiate info that is fed to them by vaccine manufacterers) Please go to http://www.novaccine.com/specific-va...ne.asp?v_id=10 look at the ingredients for Pediatrix. It includes the following: Aluminum hydroxide, Formaldehyde, Neomycin, Polymyxin B, Polysorbate 80, Thimerosal, Yeast, Pertussis toxin, Filamentous hemagglutinin (FHA), Pertactin, Stopper vial may contain dry latex rubber, Tetanus, Sodium chloride, Virus: polio.

As for the Thimerosol being "trace amounts" consider this: 0.5 parts per billion (ppb) mercury = Kills human neuroblastoma cells (Parran et al., Toxicol Sci 2005; 86: 132-140).
2 ppb mercury = U.S. EPA limit for drinking water http://www.epa.gov/safewater/contami...ndex.html#mcls
20 ppb mercury = Neurite membrane structure destroyed (Leong et al., Neuroreport 2001; 12: 733-37).
200 ppb mercury = level in liquid the EPA classifies as hazardous waste. http://www.epa.gov/epaoswer/hazwaste...s.htm#hazwaste

"trace amounts" in vaccines do not have to be reported by the manufacterer so you actually have NO IDEA how much is actually in there, but be sure it's more than .5ppb which is a minute amount. In fact until recently when they actually stopped lting about how bad Thimerosol was the amount in vaccines was between 25 and 50 THOUSAND ppb. http://www.*********/vaccine/quotes19.html

IPOL which is the polio vaccine by itself (IPV) has the follwoing preservatives: Formaldehyde, Neomycin, 2 - Phenoxyethanol, Polymyxin B, Streptomycin, Stopper vial may contain dry latex rubber, Bovine (cow) serum, Virus: polio.

Hep B ingredients: http://www.novaccine.com/specific-va...ne.asp?v_id=46

Just wondering why on earth you would get a Hep B vaccine for an infant?? (Unless you are Hep B +). Will your baby be getting any tatooes with dirty needles?? Will she be having unprotected sex anytime soon?? or sharing dirty needles while she shoots up? If not then it is totally uncessesary. Here is a link to the possible adverse reactions to the Hep B vaccine: http://www.novaccine.com/vaccine-ris...x.asp?sv_id=46

I have been researching vaccines for 3 years (ever since an aquiantance's baby died of "sids" 14 hrs after her 1st DPaT shot at 4 months old) and what I have learned made me 100% comfortable in not vaxing at all. I have a 6 month old unvaxed son. Whatever you decide please do not do anything until you have done the research. Don't ask your ped that is not research!! Really dig into this topic and you will find more than you ever imagined. You can always vax later if you feel that is right for your family, but you can't take then out once they are in there. You owe it to your daughter to find out the facts because she can't do it for herself. I wish you luck.

If the people let government decide what foods they eat and what medicines they take, their bodies will soon be in as sorry a state as are the souls of those who live under tyranny." Thomas Jefferson.

Marnica is offline  
#8 of 24 Old 10-27-2008, 04:24 PM
 
Emmeline II's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Posts: 8,832
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
: I no longer do any vaccines; my second babe is completely unvaxed.

I think either vaccine is risky but I would do the one with the fewest antigens and space them out w---i---d---e. Combination vaccines tend to have more/more serious reactions; the MMR vs M, M, R, and the MMR+Chicken Pox vs those two vaccines separate. A few months ago the CDC withdrew its rec for the MMR+Chicken Pox vax combo.

Have a visit here Inside Vaccines.

"It should be a rule in all prophylactic work that no harm should ever be unnecessarily inflicted on a healthy person (Sir Graham Wilson, The Hazards of Immunization, 1967)."
Emmeline II is offline  
#9 of 24 Old 10-27-2008, 04:37 PM
 
Ophelia's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: MinneSNOWta
Posts: 2,445
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
:

And I would advise against getting the Hep B. Do you know how Hep B is generally transmitted? Through sexual intercourse and illegal IV drug use. The situation would be different if you yourself had Hep B and gave birth to your daughter (not adopted). Even then some people question it.

Just wanted to throw that out there.

Also you can do a search on VAERS for the DTaP and Pediarix. This may help you decide.

DS 2006 nocirc.gif DiaperFreeBaby angel1.gif March 2010, DD 2011

Ophelia is offline  
#10 of 24 Old 10-27-2008, 04:44 PM
 
Ks Mama's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: NJ - in our perennial garden
Posts: 1,923
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Have you read the Dr. Sears Vaccine Book? It was so helpful to me when making decisions regarding which vaccines to use, which brands, and whether or not to do certain ones at all.

Its very difficult to find unbiased information about vaccines - this book seems to be a good balance.

Tweet me: @kellynaturally Working Mom to 2 Montessori-schooled kids. We're a vegetarian family! I blog at kellynaturally.com <--link in my profile!

Ks Mama is offline  
#11 of 24 Old 10-27-2008, 04:44 PM
 
Juliaw's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Posts: 26
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Hi. I have finally convinced my brother to delay vaccinating his 3 month old baby. He is listening, but would like some more information on delayed vaccinating. Does anyone have the Dr. Sears schedule for vaccinating? Thanks. I am posting this question here because I can't seem to find the new thread button to start a new thread.
Juliaw is offline  
#12 of 24 Old 10-27-2008, 04:54 PM - Thread Starter
 
newmom0708's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Posts: 5
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Thanks for your replies I appreciate them - what I didn't mention is that I am awake most nights agonizing over these shots. If it were only up to me, I would not vaccinate her at all. My husband and I are at odds over this, he is for vax's. His family vaccinated all their kids and none of them had adverse effects other than a fever. Who's to say she won't have problems though?

I don't have HepB - my daughter was born a preemie 34 weeks and more than once the doctors and nurses at the hospital told me "we just need you to sign here to give her the hepB shot to discharge her" I said ABSOLUTELY NOT - I know that's not mandatory. I have also battled her doctor over these vax's when she wanted to give her Dtap- polio-hepB at 2 months and I said not until I've researched them - she actually got angry with me about "all the false information out there". In the end told me she won't force it, but will keep on me about it. It's hard to find a doctor who doesn't feel that way.

My daughter has only had Hib and PCV so far, spaced 2 weeks apart. I want to delay the dtap as long as possible and the others I just want to do them to get her into school but then there's all that catching up to do. I hate this.
newmom0708 is offline  
#13 of 24 Old 10-27-2008, 05:02 PM
 
grisandole's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Southern California
Posts: 5,149
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
moving to the selective and delayed forum, I think you will get a good response there

"Have faith in yourself and in the direction you have chosen." Ralph Marston

grisandole is offline  
#14 of 24 Old 10-27-2008, 05:05 PM
 
alegna's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Posts: 44,408
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by newmom0708 View Post
My daughter has only had Hib and PCV so far, spaced 2 weeks apart. I want to delay the dtap as long as possible and the others I just want to do them to get her into school but then there's all that catching up to do. I hate this.
Unless you live in WV or MS you do NOT have to vax to get her in school. You can use an exemption.

-Angela
alegna is offline  
#15 of 24 Old 10-27-2008, 05:05 PM
 
wallacesmum's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Southern Maine
Posts: 1,367
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
You don't have to do them to use the government schools. There are almost always exemptions. I don't know about private schools. You don't have to deal with a doctor who doesn't respect your intelligence and decision-making ability. I know that you can find people to support or respect your decisions - believe that and pursue it!

As for your husband, how much research has he done? Saying "I had them and I'm fine" is bullshirt as an argument - why is that okay but a parent of a vaccine-damaged child is not allowed to forward her anecdote as evidence? You wouldn't compromise with someone by letting them "partially" run over your cat; if you think you shouldn't vaccinate then doing just some is NOT meeting in the middle - it's ignoring your voice.

There is plenty of time. I don't mean to suggest that you should ignore your husband, but I think it is a decision that all parties need to be comfortable with, and you are saying you are not comfortable. Keep reading, and get him to read, too!
wallacesmum is offline  
#16 of 24 Old 10-27-2008, 05:22 PM
 
spero's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: the back of beyond
Posts: 9,921
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Marnica View Post
Please go to http://www.novaccine.com/specific-va...ne.asp?v_id=10 look at the ingredients for Pediatrix. It includes the following: Aluminum hydroxide, Formaldehyde, Neomycin, Polymyxin B, Polysorbate 80, Thimerosal, Yeast, Pertussis toxin, Filamentous hemagglutinin (FHA), Pertactin, Stopper vial may contain dry latex rubber, Tetanus, Sodium chloride, Virus: polio.
The information posted at the link does not match the product insert information on GSK's page (I got it from the vaccine archives). The GSK site specifically says that Pediarix is formulated WITHOUT preservatives.

Understand that I do not endorse this or other vaccines; however, I do think that posting accurate information is of utmost importance in this forum.

Every baptized Christian is, or should be, someone with an actual (disturbing) experience, ... a close encounter, with God; someone who, as a result, becomes a disturbing presence to others. - Fr. Anthony J. Gittins, A Presence That Disturbs
spero is offline  
#17 of 24 Old 10-27-2008, 05:24 PM
 
MamaStarbird's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: New England
Posts: 115
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
My DD got the Pediarix shot at 2 mo. I'm a first-time mom and was pressured into it by DH and our ped despite my original plans to delay/selectively vax. DD had no discernible reaction to the shot--no fever, no fussiness, etc. That does NOTHING to make me feel better about the decision I was forced into making, and does not make me any more likely to keep vaxing her on the 'official' schedule. Please, listen to your instincts and advocate for your babe better than I was able to.
MamaStarbird is offline  
#18 of 24 Old 10-27-2008, 07:51 PM
 
KoalaMommy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: with a joey in the pouch
Posts: 4,395
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
I would get the least number of diseases in a shot possible.

There is no reason to get her hepB if you don't have hepB unless your baby is an IV drug user or a sex worker. Seriously, she's not going to contract this illness from the safety of your arms.

There's no reason to worry about polio right now unless you're going to be traveling to parts of India or Africa and expect your child to come into contact with fecal matter.

That leaves the question of DTaP. All of these illnesses can be acquired in the US. The most likely is pertussis. What I did is research on the CDC's website the incidences of the various diseases in the state I lived in for the most recent year, because all confirmed cases of these have to be reported. There were about 3,000 cases of pertussis (whooping cough) in a state of 9 million when I was looking, and I felt like those were decent odds she wouldn't be exposed. Plus these are all bacterial and can be treated with antibiotics.

I took all this information, and information about reaction rates to vaxes and shared/discussed with my DH and we came to an agreement that we're both comfortable with. We didn't vax our girls until they were 2 years old and then only 1 vax at a time. We still haven't decided on the MMR or HepB, and they've had chicken pox. So we did do the DTaP, and polio and HiB (which if you do after 15 months they only need 1 of).

All I'm saying is that if you know what you're talking about, and you inform your DH, you should be able to work out something you're both okay with. There are plenty of docs that advocate for a different vax schedule, my girls have only seen docs who do, and the first was accidental.

My MIL is totally pro-vax because she had polio as a child, but her son was willing to talk through the issue with me because he could see how much it was bothering me. Now I actually think he'd be willing to go totally no vax...so we'll visit that question with the next one.

BTW, my DD1 was actually exposed to pertussis in her first year, and didn't get it.

slingboy.gifTaking care of 2 girls:energy.gifblahblah.gifb& a babyboy.gif born on his mama's birthday and a few chicken3.gif
KoalaMommy is offline  
#19 of 24 Old 10-30-2008, 01:15 PM
 
diamond lil's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Toddlerville
Posts: 2,086
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Juliaw View Post
Hi. I have finally convinced my brother to delay vaccinating his 3 month old baby. He is listening, but would like some more information on delayed vaccinating. Does anyone have the Dr. Sears schedule for vaccinating? Thanks. I am posting this question here because I can't seem to find the new thread button to start a new thread.
Here is Dr. Sears schedule, directly from The Vaccine Book:

2 months: DTaP, Rotavirus
3 months: Pc, HIB
4 months: DTaP, Rotavirus
5 months: Pc, HIB
6 months: DTaP, Rotavirus
7 months: Pc, HIB
15 months: Pc, HIB
5 years: Tetnus booster
10 years: blood tests for measles, mumps, rubella, chicken pox and Hep A immunity. Consider vaccinating if not immune. Also consider a 3 dose Polio series if travel to Asia or Africa is a possibility.
11 years: HPV, 3 doses, girls only
12 years: Hep B, 3 doses
diamond lil is offline  
#20 of 24 Old 10-31-2008, 02:08 PM
 
Juliaw's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Posts: 26
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Thank you diamond lil for responding. I have since found the new thread button! Have a good weekend.
Juliaw is offline  
#21 of 24 Old 10-31-2008, 04:35 PM
 
prettypixels's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: MD
Posts: 2,835
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
I specifically chose to do Pediarix at 2, 4, and 6 months. Wonderful to have fewer shots! My daughter had no reaction at all.
prettypixels is offline  
#22 of 24 Old 10-31-2008, 05:56 PM
 
wannabe's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Posts: 3,790
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
We chose DTaP at 2,4,6, IPV starting from nine months and Hep B before school.

There is a risk of polio, but as it's much much lower and with a non-crawling baby who doesn't really touch anything outside the house and isn't flying or using public transport I'm comfortable with delaying it until they are moving and mouthing and flying.

I like combo shots, though, because you get fewer additives, plus fewer painful jabs.

Hep B is not solely transmitted through dirty needles and sex. For example, have you ever heard of a child biting another child?
wannabe is offline  
#23 of 24 Old 10-31-2008, 06:55 PM
 
alegna's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Posts: 44,408
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by wannabe View Post
For example, have you ever heard of a child biting another child?
I've heard that tossed around as a theory, do you know if there have been any cases linked to that? Or is that just speculation?

-Angela
alegna is offline  
#24 of 24 Old 10-31-2008, 09:33 PM
 
carriebft's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Posts: 6,947
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
I think the combo vaxes have positives for many families seeking less jabs, less visits to doc (less copays), and stuff like that.

For us, however, I felt that, despite the possible benefits, we would rather have one shot per visit whenever possible and create our own schedule. We do DTaP, MMR, Polio and Hib (so obviously this particular vax wouldn't be for us, but still we would not do a combo).

I like one shot per visit because it's easier to identify possible reactions. Plus, while we do feel some vaccines (like polio) are important because of travel, we feel we can put that one off a bit. So, by not doing in in combination with a vaccine we like to get earlier (like DTaP), we are able to keep a delayed and selective schedule.

In addition, sometimes you can get three separate shots and still end up with less aluminum, for example, than the combo shot.

"Parents are simply trustees; they do not own the bodies of their children"-Norm Cohen  Martial arts instructor intactlact.gifhomebirth.jpgnak.gif and mom to 4: DD1 (1/05) DS (7/06) DD2 (5/08) DD3 (2/11)
carriebft is offline  
Reply

Quick Reply
Message:
Drag and Drop File Upload
Drag files here to attach!
Upload Progress: 0
Options

Register Now

In order to be able to post messages on the Mothering Forums forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.
User Name:
If you do not want to register, fill this field only and the name will be used as user name for your post.
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.
Password:
Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.
Email Address:

Log-in

Human Verification

In order to verify that you are a human and not a spam bot, please enter the answer into the following box below based on the instructions contained in the graphic.



User Tag List

Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page


Forum Jump: 

Posting Rules  
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are Off